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[WIP] Critique me!

IllifarIllifar Registered User new member
edited September 2008 in Artist's Corner
Okay so I'm drawing a picture for my girlfriend, for our anniversary. I'll have to link to imageshack since the image is 11x17 and I'd rather not hurt peoples eyes with screwed up dimensions. Anyway, I just started taking art classes so my drawing skills aren't all that great.

watertestingcopyzr5.jpg

Like the titles suggests, its a work in progress. I'm using photoshop, illustrator, and my wacom tablet. I'm looking for advice on particular things. What I'm not so worried about are things like perspective. I'm more interested in tips on how I can achieve particular textures with photoshop. For example, the dirt path going from the dock to the house is kind of flat, bland, boring etc. How can I make it look a little nicer, more realstic?

Also, anyone have ideas for the ground? Right now it's just plain green. I'm not sure what to do or how to do it, but something to add more depth and make it a little more interesting than just green. Some kind of light grassiness, or dirt speckled ground(its actually set in the forest). Anyone have ideas?

A few things that may help:
1) Nevermind the pumpkin ninja, he's supposed to be hiding in trees that aren't there yet.

2) Pretty much everywhere it's plain green will be spotted with trees. They will get larger up front, much larger than the ones in the background.

3) The cabin isn't shaded yet, obviously.

Any feedback/advice/etc. would be much appreciated.

Illifar on
«1

Posts

  • r-jasperr-jasper Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    if you're after critiques post some art. otherwise it's just considered as site-whoring.

    r-jasper on
  • MustangMustang Arbiter of Unpopular Opinions Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    What I'm not so worried about are things like perspective.

    Why the hell not? In a landscape drawing/painting cartoony or otherwise it should be your number 1 concern. I honestly can't critique this if your deliberatly going to ignore basic technique, there are no shortcuts to good art, no matter the style.

    Mustang on
  • bombardierbombardier Moderator mod
    edited September 2008
    I think he's got bigger things to worry about than perspective.

    Also get a different image host that you can post inline images with like imageshack or photobucket.

    bombardier on
  • IllifarIllifar Registered User new member
    edited September 2008
    bombardier wrote: »
    I think he's got bigger things to worry about than perspective.

    Also get a different image host that you can post inline images with like imageshack or photobucket.

    Exactly. Imageshack wasn't working an hour ago, but heres the image.

    watertestingcopyzr5.jpg

    Back to why I'm not as concerned with perspective. Like I said in the OP, I'm new to drawing. I don't know enough about drawing landscapes to do everything perfectly. I never said I was ignoring perspective, you just came to that conclusion.

    This is one of the first real landscape drawings I've ever actually done. If you have something valuable to say about the perspective and proportions, please say it. I was merely pointing out that it's not my highest priority. Sorry?

    Edit: Updated with a more recent version.

    Illifar on
  • NakedZerglingNakedZergling A more apocalyptic post apocalypse Portland OregonRegistered User regular
    edited September 2008
    um...if you're not interested in things like perspective then my advice to you is quit drawing. It's like wanting to be a guitarists but not know chords.

    your light source is wrong
    all your trees are identical and in the same place
    all your colors are saturated
    your mountains are all triangles
    everything has black outlines

    is that enough for now?

    NakedZergling on
  • NakedZerglingNakedZergling A more apocalyptic post apocalypse Portland OregonRegistered User regular
    edited September 2008
    oh this isn't really a drawing....it's images of lines and shapes in painter? i think?
    you should really break out the pencil and paper.

    NakedZergling on
  • thorkillthorkill Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    I think it's cool none the less

    thorkill on
  • IllifarIllifar Registered User new member
    edited September 2008
    um...if you're not interested in things like perspective then my advice to you is quit drawing. It's like wanting to be a guitarists but not know chords.

    Again, that's not what I meant. I'm plenty interested in perspective, it's just not what I'm focusing on with this picture. I'm mostly looking for ways to manipulate photoshop and achieve unique textures, more accurate shading, new ideas, etc. When did I say I was an amazing artist and that I don't care for perspective because it is below my masterpiece artwork? I didn't.
    your light source is wrong
    all your trees are identical and in the same place
    all your colors are saturated
    your mountains are all triangles
    everything has black outlines

    A lot of that has more to do with style than anything. I'm not going for photo-realism, or semi realism. Or any sort of realism. Half of this was done in illustrator. There are walking peanuts and a ninja pumpkin. The trees are mostly filler and backdrop, I wasn't going to spend hours hand drawing each tree. This drawing isn't near done.

    Instead of just saying whats wrong, could you give an opinionated view? What would you change about it? Don't just insult me for being new to drawing.

    Edit: Just saw your second post. Yeah, I did this in illustrator and photoshop. I'm not aiming for realism, just getting used to my tablet since I usually draw with pencil/paper. Another thing I'm focused on is using interesting colors that aren't bland, which ended up in a saturated look.

    Illifar on
  • Forbe!Forbe! Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Quit being defensive. You asked for a critique, and you got a critique. You can't pick or choose what people say about your work. I don't understand what you want us to say about your picture here. If you want to get a hug and high-five, go to deviant art. If you want to genuinely become a better artist, then listen to what people are saying, because they probably know better than you.

    There is way too much going on here to address, because picking at things in the image isn't going to help you improve it. The image lacks unification, because you do not understand how to properly draw from life. Style is still based on something concrete that we perceive. You cannot stylize forms and make them look unified without understanding the form in real space first. Right now you're just drawing symbols of what you think things look like.

    Forbe! on
    bv2ylq8pac8s.png
  • IllifarIllifar Registered User new member
    edited September 2008
    There we go. Thankyou for adding that second part of your post. It's helpful.

    Illifar on
  • MustangMustang Arbiter of Unpopular Opinions Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Right now you're just drawing symbols of what you think things look like.

    That's some good crit right there.

    To be honest you're biting off way more than you can chew, try to use more references and you'll see where your faults lie. Example.
    arizona_forest_stewardship_committee.jpg

    This is why knowing at utlising perspective is so important, it will guide you how to lay out your image. Realism or not, it has to look believable, as it stands what you have looks like a bad pop-up book. Going through and pointing out all the faults here is going to be a long and arduous process and to be perfectly honest your not going to take it all in. Even though you're not aiming for realism, it has to be a believable image, light has to fall the right way, the perspective needs to make sense and the colours need to react correctly to light you're utilising. Perspective isn't a difficult concept to grasp, a single vanshing point is all you need here.

    Mustang on
  • lyriumlyrium Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Clearly you've already gotten input regarding how to better work on a piece in the future. I think that if you want to help this particular picture, something that would really help is just making it more consistent. Elmost every element is done in a different way right now. The mountains and trees are like paper cut-outs, but they are even shaded differently (with the trees being completely flat and the mountains having the blocky shadows). Then you have the sky, wood, and pumpkin all with a gradient sort of thing going on, and then random hand drawn portions thrown in (peanut field, etc). If you want to salvage the picture, I would pick one of those styles and do every element in that way. At least get rid of the gradient parts and neaten up the hand drawn parts. If you're going to have lighting, the scene needs to be lit consistently.

    Also I want to add that just using a reference and drawing or trying to make things more consistent (even if that means making it simpler) are going to make this image look a lot better than filters or fancy photoshop add ons. You don't need to be thinking about shortcuts right now; if you focus on the choices you are making when you draw and do the best that you can, the process of making the picture will be much more helpful to you and much more rewarding in the end.

    Also I want to add :)Welcome! :)

    lyrium on
  • ProjeckProjeck Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    um...if you're not interested in things like perspective then my advice to you is quit drawing. It's like wanting to be a guitarists but not know chords.

    your light source is wrong
    all your trees are identical and in the same place
    all your colors are saturated
    your mountains are all triangles
    everything has black outlines

    is that enough for now?

    now, thats not exactly fair, knowing perspective isnt essential to being a good artist

    Projeck on
  • MustangMustang Arbiter of Unpopular Opinions Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Projeck wrote: »
    um...if you're not interested in things like perspective then my advice to you is quit drawing. It's like wanting to be a guitarists but not know chords.

    your light source is wrong
    all your trees are identical and in the same place
    all your colors are saturated
    your mountains are all triangles
    everything has black outlines

    is that enough for now?

    now, thats not exactly fair, knowing perspective isnt essential to being a good artist

    I don't know why there is all this hubub about knowing how to use vanishing points, it's a piece of fucking piss, it's one of the easiest things to learn and utilise. I was taught perspective in primary school art class over 20 years ago and I'm as thick as pig shit.

    Mustang on
  • TamTam Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Projeck wrote: »
    um...if you're not interested in things like perspective then my advice to you is quit drawing. It's like wanting to be a guitarists but not know chords.

    your light source is wrong
    all your trees are identical and in the same place
    all your colors are saturated
    your mountains are all triangles
    everything has black outlines

    is that enough for now?

    now, thats not exactly fair, knowing perspective isnt essential to being a good artist

    explain.

    Tam on
  • ProjeckProjeck Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Tam wrote: »
    Projeck wrote: »
    um...if you're not interested in things like perspective then my advice to you is quit drawing. It's like wanting to be a guitarists but not know chords.

    your light source is wrong
    all your trees are identical and in the same place
    all your colors are saturated
    your mountains are all triangles
    everything has black outlines

    is that enough for now?

    now, thats not exactly fair, knowing perspective isnt essential to being a good artist

    explain.

    I like a lot of pre-renaissance art!

    Projeck on
  • TamTam Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Projeck wrote: »
    Tam wrote: »
    Projeck wrote: »
    um...if you're not interested in things like perspective then my advice to you is quit drawing. It's like wanting to be a guitarists but not know chords.

    your light source is wrong
    all your trees are identical and in the same place
    all your colors are saturated
    your mountains are all triangles
    everything has black outlines

    is that enough for now?

    now, thats not exactly fair, knowing perspective isnt essential to being a good artist

    explain.

    I like a lot of pre-renaissance art!

    Ok, so calculus isn't essential to being a good engineer then.

    The standard of realism for illustrative artists has been raised since the dark ages.

    I thought you were going to say abstract/modern artists and the like. Even then, most of those guys- especially Picasso- did a lot of study before going on to their wild n' crazy styles. In most cases, good artists learn the rules so they can break them better.

    Tam on
  • Forbe!Forbe! Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    It could be argued that realism wasn't essentially the goal of medieval art, it was simply a style choice. There is a slow transition to this shown beginning with art from the collapse of the Roman Empire.

    Forbe! on
    bv2ylq8pac8s.png
  • TamTam Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Forbe! wrote: »
    It could be argued that realism wasn't essentially the goal of medieval art, it was simply a style choice. There is a slow transition to this shown beginning with art from the collapse of the Roman Empire.

    Oh right. fuck it I'm dumb. forget it.

    OR

    wait

    hold on...

    or was it because the Church tried to suppress all that knowledge. Churches do those sorts of things, you know.

    I cede the point, but maintain that today, you'll probably want to know perspective if you're going to be most types of artist.

    Tam on
  • winter_combat_knightwinter_combat_knight Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Even if your perspective skills at the moment suck, you will improve so much by applying them to your work. If you had have considered perspective in this piece (even if it ended up being totally wrong) i think it would have turned out much better.
    Get a pencil or pen, and draw stuff on your desk. Post them up and people will give advice. Good luck.

    BTW i laughed at the pumpkin and peanuts. They look funny!

    winter_combat_knight on
  • Castle_BuilderCastle_Builder regular
    edited September 2008
    The stairs on the house are wrong.

    The chimney is wrong.

    The trees are wrong although more so the tree trunks.

    The shadow on the pier is wrong.

    The trail leading to the pier and part way to the field makes no sense.

    The snow on the mountains look like nipples and again make no sense.

    The shadows on the mountains are wrong.

    The orange blob is not recognizable as a pumpkin orange tangerine or anything.

    Whether the peanuts are dancing and have arms and legs or are just peanuts is not clear.

    The legs of the pier are huge and do not match the depth of the river bank.

    There are no transitions between objects and their surroundings, its like paper cut outs just being laid on top of one another.

    The sand box is a box and does not make sense.

    The best part of the picture is the attempt to make the river look like it has movment and reflection.

    ~~~~~~~~~~

    The problem here is once again it appears like an amature is more interested on getting colors and lines onto the page and you are not thinking about how they relate to one another. Each object in this picture has a natural relation to the other pieces.

    There are AMAZING artists out there that accomplish this cut and paste, paper cut out, overlaping look ... the problem is all these artists understand the more complex fundementals of what they are doing and even though their works may appear amature they are in fact more complex then most people imagine.

    Thats the trick of anyone thats great at something. Making the complex appear not complex.

    Thus for the people arguing about perspective and its use or lack there of in modern or ancient well accepted forms, stop confusing a lack of something for a lack of understanding that something.

    Perspective may not be ncessary for certain styles, but understanding it is.

    Just as a good cartoonist has a strong understanding of anatomy.

    Castle_Builder on
  • NappuccinoNappuccino Surveyor of Things and Stuff Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    I can't add much that hasn't been covered. However, if you're going for comedy "Free Range Nuts" is much funnier than what you have on the sign.

    Double entendre's are awesome.

    Nappuccino on
    Like to write? Want to get e-published? Give us a look-see at http://wednesdaynightwrites.com/
    Rorus Raz wrote: »
    There's also the possibility you just can't really grow a bear like other guys.

    Not even BEAR vaginas can defeat me!
    cakemikz wrote: »
    And then I rub actual cake on myself.
    Loomdun wrote: »
    thats why you have chest helmets
  • beavotronbeavotron Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Projeck wrote: »
    Tam wrote: »
    Projeck wrote: »
    um...if you're not interested in things like perspective then my advice to you is quit drawing. It's like wanting to be a guitarists but not know chords.

    your light source is wrong
    all your trees are identical and in the same place
    all your colors are saturated
    your mountains are all triangles
    everything has black outlines

    is that enough for now?

    now, thats not exactly fair, knowing perspective isnt essential to being a good artist

    explain.

    I like a lot of pre-renaissance art!

    if you're comparing this to pre-renaissance quality work i am going to punch you right in the lips, projeck

    I redlined the stuff that needs to be fixed in your image:

    attitude.jpg

    seriously have you lurked around here at all?
    Coming in here with a landscape drawing and telling us you don't care to learn perspective because you're new at this is absolutely one of the most absurd things i've ever heard
    so you're new at drawing, alright go have a look at any successful thread posted by a new artist in this forum. The only ones who ever show any improvement while they're posting here are the ones who heed the advice given to them and work to remedy the problems they are having

    it's a landscape drawing, but it doesn't even matter, even the simplest of drawings need to follow the rules of perspective. and don't throw the whole stylization thing at me, i'm probably one of the most heavily stylized artists on this forum, so I'm just going to shoot you dirty looks if you misuse the term "stylization" again.

    You want to make it look better? lay down some guidelines, take the advice already given to you
    you don't care? then why the hell are you posting here? Give it to her as is, she's your girlfriend, she's probably not an artist herself, she'll probably love it no matter what it is.
    the name of this forum needs to be changed to "aspiring artists who want to improve"

    I'm not going to give specific crits because they've been given already but i will say i think the biggest improvement would be from erasing all but one of the trees and hand drawing the rest of them instead of copy>pasting.

    beavotron on
  • kevin_kevin_ Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    You want me to critique this? Are you joking me?

    kevin_ on
  • GrifterGrifter BermudaModerator mod
    edited September 2008
    *Sigh* I remember when I made my first valentine's card for the cute girl in first grade who sat two rows over from me. Unfortunately, 15 other dudes made her a valentine and they were all better at art than I was back then. The moral of the story? I learned to art better so I could get in girls' knickers.

    Grifter on
  • beavotronbeavotron Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Grifter wrote: »
    *Sigh* I remember when I made my first valentine's card for the cute girl in first grade who sat two rows over from me. Unfortunately, 15 other dudes made her a valentine and they were all better at art than I was back then. The moral of the story? I learned to art better so I could get in girls' knickers.

    that's okay, i did it because this girl in my class was prettier than me and better at everything i did. she used to draw tigger and winnie the pooh all the time and everyone was like "you're such an artist, you're so good at everything" that day i was like "you know what? no, i'm going to best erin, i am going to become a fucking artist"

    that was the 7th grade, i'm now almost 24 and i refuse to let up until she admits i'm better than her at drawing
    which she never did, when i started drawing my own characters instead of winnie the pooh she'd be like "all you can draw are dogs and cats and dragons and people and houses and ...." and i was like "well, all you can draw is the hundred acre wood...so... yeah"

    beavotron on
  • MustangMustang Arbiter of Unpopular Opinions Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Oh you know Erin? She's so great, at everything!

    Mustang on
  • JohnTWMJohnTWM Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Look, what this guy asked for were ways to improve this image. Obviously this is never going to be a piece of work up to your standards, so some simple suggestions for improving it would have been much more helpful than the steaming pile of crap you spewed at him. I mean really, go read the post about constructive critiscism again. If you want to say, well fix this and that, but really you need to go back to basics and learn this and that, thats a fine post. But to take what he says out of context (repeatedly, even after he clearly explains what he meant), and then insult him is hardly constructive.

    Now to be helpful, for this particular image, I would say lighten up the sky some, since the way you have it now makes it look like the is setting behind them (which means the mountain shadows are going the wrong way), and the chimney and stairs are drawn backwards or at a funny angle.

    Personally I think the mountain/trees part of this is the best, they have a coherent style that works (if you stop worrying to much about realism, its ok for them to just imply mountains rather than actually look like them, i mean, we all knew what they were right?) I would fix the things I mentioned above, then rework the pumpkin/sky so that they fit better with the aesthetic of the mountains. As for texturing the ground, I don't know, I don't use PS much so I'm not the one to ask.

    Oh one more thing.. the way the trees suddenly change colors is weird, it looks like the ones closer are in shadow, and the others are in the light.. but there is nothing that we can make out that should be overshadowing them.

    JohnTWM on
  • ScosglenScosglen Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    JohnTWM wrote: »
    Look, what this guy asked for were ways to improve this image. Obviously this is never going to be a piece of work up to your standards, so some simple suggestions for improving it would have been much more helpful than the steaming pile of crap you spewed at him. I mean really, go read the post about constructive critiscism again. If you want to say, well fix this and that, but really you need to go back to basics and learn this and that, thats a fine post. But to take what he says out of context (repeatedly, even after he clearly explains what he meant), and then insult him is hardly constructive.

    It would have been incredibly disingenuous for people to look at the OP's post in a vacuum and simply offer faint suggestions for how to pepper this turd up. The problems with the image go far beyond the scope of its borders. The OP needs to learn how to draw, and he needs an attitude shift to go with it. People expressed that sentiment either directly or by listing a litany of basic drawing errors to make it clear.

    Also, the fact you think that the advice given in this thread was a steaming pile of crap and that the OP has been insulted says a lot more about yourself than it does the other posters.

    Scosglen on
  • GrifterGrifter BermudaModerator mod
    edited September 2008
    Mustang wrote: »
    Oh you know Erin? She's so great, at everything!

    I know! I love the way that she draws tigger!

    Grifter on
  • ProjeckProjeck Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    beavotron wrote: »
    Projeck wrote: »
    Tam wrote: »
    Projeck wrote: »
    um...if you're not interested in things like perspective then my advice to you is quit drawing. It's like wanting to be a guitarists but not know chords.

    your light source is wrong
    all your trees are identical and in the same place
    all your colors are saturated
    your mountains are all triangles
    everything has black outlines

    is that enough for now?

    now, thats not exactly fair, knowing perspective isnt essential to being a good artist

    explain.

    I like a lot of pre-renaissance art!

    if you're comparing this to pre-renaissance quality work i am going to punch you right in the lips, projeck
    .
    oh hell no

    im just saying

    Projeck on
  • GrennGrenn Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Grifter wrote: »
    Mustang wrote: »
    Oh you know Erin? She's so great, at everything!

    I know! I love the way that she draws tigger!

    I'm in the queue for a custom commissioned tigger playing poosticks with piglet!!!111 I can't wait!! :shock::!!:

    Grenn on
  • winter_combat_knightwinter_combat_knight Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    kevin_ wrote: »
    You want me to critique this? Are you joking me?

    Thats a useless comment. If you're not going to offer any advice or crits then f-off.

    winter_combat_knight on
  • beavotronbeavotron Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    Scosglen wrote: »
    JohnTWM wrote: »
    Look, what this guy asked for were ways to improve this image. Obviously this is never going to be a piece of work up to your standards, so some simple suggestions for improving it would have been much more helpful than the steaming pile of crap you spewed at him. I mean really, go read the post about constructive critiscism again. If you want to say, well fix this and that, but really you need to go back to basics and learn this and that, thats a fine post. But to take what he says out of context (repeatedly, even after he clearly explains what he meant), and then insult him is hardly constructive.

    It would have been incredibly disingenuous for people to look at the OP's post in a vacuum and simply offer faint suggestions for how to pepper this turd up. The problems with the image go far beyond the scope of its borders. The OP needs to learn how to draw, and he needs an attitude shift to go with it. People expressed that sentiment either directly or by listing a litany of basic drawing errors to make it clear.

    Also, the fact you think that the advice given in this thread was a steaming pile of crap and that the OP has been insulted says a lot more about yourself than it does the other posters.

    oh scos, you takes my words right outta my mouth and says em with such pizazz

    the rest of you: erin erin erin! marsha! marsha! marsha!

    beavotron on
  • JohnTWMJohnTWM Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    beavotron wrote: »
    Scosglen wrote: »
    JohnTWM wrote: »
    Look, what this guy asked for were ways to improve this image. Obviously this is never going to be a piece of work up to your standards, so some simple suggestions for improving it would have been much more helpful than the steaming pile of crap you spewed at him. I mean really, go read the post about constructive critiscism again. If you want to say, well fix this and that, but really you need to go back to basics and learn this and that, thats a fine post. But to take what he says out of context (repeatedly, even after he clearly explains what he meant), and then insult him is hardly constructive.

    It would have been incredibly disingenuous for people to look at the OP's post in a vacuum and simply offer faint suggestions for how to pepper this turd up. The problems with the image go far beyond the scope of its borders. The OP needs to learn how to draw, and he needs an attitude shift to go with it. People expressed that sentiment either directly or by listing a litany of basic drawing errors to make it clear.

    Also, the fact you think that the advice given in this thread was a steaming pile of crap and that the OP has been insulted says a lot more about yourself than it does the other posters.

    oh scos, you takes my words right outta my mouth and says em with such pizazz

    the rest of you: erin erin erin! marsha! marsha! marsha!
    "pepper this turd up". Was that necessary? It amazes me that you can (supposedly) read a comment, quote it, and still not seem to grasp the basic elements of it. Does he have alot to learn about drawing? Yes, and like I said it's fine to say as much, but you don't need to use words like "turd" to blatantly insult the work he has done so far, that's just being an a**hole. Giving people what they asked for in addition to other things YOU think they need would be much more helpful.

    JohnTWM on
  • JohnTWMJohnTWM Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    lyrium wrote: »
    Clearly you've already gotten input regarding how to better work on a piece in the future. I think that if you want to help this particular picture, something that would really help is just making it more consistent. Elmost every element is done in a different way right now. The mountains and trees are like paper cut-outs, but they are even shaded differently (with the trees being completely flat and the mountains having the blocky shadows). Then you have the sky, wood, and pumpkin all with a gradient sort of thing going on, and then random hand drawn portions thrown in (peanut field, etc). If you want to salvage the picture, I would pick one of those styles and do every element in that way. At least get rid of the gradient parts and neaten up the hand drawn parts. If you're going to have lighting, the scene needs to be lit consistently.

    Also I want to add that just using a reference and drawing or trying to make things more consistent (even if that means making it simpler) are going to make this image look a lot better than filters or fancy photoshop add ons. You don't need to be thinking about shortcuts right now; if you focus on the choices you are making when you draw and do the best that you can, the process of making the picture will be much more helpful to you and much more rewarding in the end.

    Also I want to add :)Welcome! :)
    Here is a perfect example of an awesome response.

    JohnTWM on
  • NappuccinoNappuccino Surveyor of Things and Stuff Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    kevin_ wrote: »
    You want me to critique this? Are you joking me?

    Thats a useless comment. If you're not going to offer any advice or crits then f-off.

    I'd have said the same thing about that comment if I hadn't read the OP's replies to anything remotely constructive.

    Nappuccino on
    Like to write? Want to get e-published? Give us a look-see at http://wednesdaynightwrites.com/
    Rorus Raz wrote: »
    There's also the possibility you just can't really grow a bear like other guys.

    Not even BEAR vaginas can defeat me!
    cakemikz wrote: »
    And then I rub actual cake on myself.
    Loomdun wrote: »
    thats why you have chest helmets
  • beavotronbeavotron Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    JohnTWM wrote: »
    beavotron wrote: »
    Scosglen wrote: »
    JohnTWM wrote: »
    Look, what this guy asked for were ways to improve this image. Obviously this is never going to be a piece of work up to your standards, so some simple suggestions for improving it would have been much more helpful than the steaming pile of crap you spewed at him. I mean really, go read the post about constructive critiscism again. If you want to say, well fix this and that, but really you need to go back to basics and learn this and that, thats a fine post. But to take what he says out of context (repeatedly, even after he clearly explains what he meant), and then insult him is hardly constructive.

    It would have been incredibly disingenuous for people to look at the OP's post in a vacuum and simply offer faint suggestions for how to pepper this turd up. The problems with the image go far beyond the scope of its borders. The OP needs to learn how to draw, and he needs an attitude shift to go with it. People expressed that sentiment either directly or by listing a litany of basic drawing errors to make it clear.

    Also, the fact you think that the advice given in this thread was a steaming pile of crap and that the OP has been insulted says a lot more about yourself than it does the other posters.

    oh scos, you takes my words right outta my mouth and says em with such pizazz

    the rest of you: erin erin erin! marsha! marsha! marsha!
    "pepper this turd up". Was that necessary? It amazes me that you can (supposedly) read a comment, quote it, and still not seem to grasp the basic elements of it. Does he have alot to learn about drawing? Yes, and like I said it's fine to say as much, but you don't need to use words like "turd" to blatantly insult the work he has done so far, that's just being an a**hole. Giving people what they asked for in addition to other things YOU think they need would be much more helpful.

    i and most people on here have given him completely constructive crits and that was to change his attitude
    and then explained why he should change his attitude vs. why if he doesn't want to change his attitude this is not the place for him but there are many other places out there that are

    then i even added as an afterthought a crit amongst the thousands that would be needed to make the piece better
    but why pick one out of the hundreds of things that could be said that need to change in this image?
    I think castlebuilder made that point as he started to list off just a handful of the many. That is counter intuitive to what we're trying to do here, which is try to make artists better overall, not to make individual pieces of their work a little better when they have clearly shown us that they do not grasp the basic fundamentals and show no signs of wanting to learn
    EVERYTHING has to be changed to be completely honest, i see nothing INCLUDING composition that works, no matter how stylized you want to get. The best way to tell him that is to tell him to change his "whatever i'm new at this" attitude because THAT's the only thing standing in his way.

    sometimes people are harsh about it
    but ONLY when they give attitude like this
    you don't come into a place asking for help then give the people trying to help you attitude when they don't say "oh hey, looks great, love the cut and paste trees and lack of perspective"
    if you want that, there's the door:
    door.jpg

    oh and i forgot, since you asked me to go re-read the constructive criticism thread, okay then:
    Blinky wrote:
    The first thing you need to do in order to receive criticism is to abandon you excuses. Excuses are worthless by their very nature, otherwise they'd be called reasons. Statements like "I could do better but I drew this all with a mouse in MSPaint while blindfolded and being spanked by a fat shemale dominatrix" don't help anyone. Listen to the criticism and try to understand what people are saying about your work so that you can apply it to future work or even to the current art. The idea here is not to ignore it, reject it or even just to weather it but to use it as a tool to improve as an artist
    Blinky wrote:
    I like to think that around here we start with people and chip away erything that isn't part of a great artist. Through comments and criticism we attempt to remove things that are holding people back while encouraging the things that will help them improve.

    the only thing that maybe has not been done so much is the whole being like "this is what i like about your work"
    but i've said it a thousand times, no one buttered me up before inserting their hard crits and I daresay it has worked wonders for me, so I refuse to do it to anyone else unless the compliment is truly warranted.

    beavotron on
  • Forbe!Forbe! Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    JohnTWM, if you read, most of us offered help, but he said he essentially said he didn't want to learn how to draw. So we met him with the same attitude.

    Forbe! on
    bv2ylq8pac8s.png
  • JohnTWMJohnTWM Registered User regular
    edited September 2008
    I didn't mean my comment to be directed at everyone Forbes, sorry if it came off that way. I really meant to direct it at people who were being explicitly rude with their comments. Also, while I understand what beavetron is saying about making him a better artist and tearing down excuses, it doesn't mean that when someone posts with a *specific* problem (even if it's with a piece that isn't really going anywhere) then it is OK to give advice on that problem.
    I also think that everyone misunderstood what the OP was trying to say with his responses. Everyone took it as "I don't care about perspective or your opinions give me asspats". But what he really said was "I know that this piece doesn't follow perspective, but I would still like some help improving it (not just my drawing in general)". Now if you want to point out that this isn't the place for that kind of help, this is the place for really working on your art in general, then by all means point that out to the guy. But there is simply no call for being rude to someone, even if it is the Internet and you don't know them IRL. There is a polite way to say anything that's worth being said in civil conversation.

    JohnTWM on
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