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[WAR] Oh yeah. Slob those Knobs.

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Posts

  • XzeanXzean Registered User regular
    edited December 2008
    Iblis wrote: »
    Xzean wrote: »
    Iblis wrote: »
    Xzean wrote: »
    Iblis wrote: »
    so, will the magus still be ass with the patch? I love mine to death, but fun as she is, I can't play her in good conscience knowing that she is nothing but a gimped sorc. at least it's probably the best PvE grinding class in the game... -_-

    When I played a templated level 35 Magus (specced Havoc) I felt I was contributing reasonably well. Perhaps not as well as a Sorceress, but well enough that I felt like I was not wasting a space.

    Unfortunately they have done little to make the road to said level tolerable and they have not really fixed many of the bugs, so the fundamental problems are essentially still there. That's for Havoc anyway. I've essentially lost interest in Changing/Daemonology myself.

    You, uh, do know they increased Magus DoT co-ificients by 200% or more as well as upping their base damage.

    To like, basically every DoT.

    Seriously.

    I specifically said I was talking about the Havoc branch. Havoc's only DoT until level 30 is Baleful Transmogrification. Aside from that it has Flickering Red Fire and Surging Violet Fire which are rather lackluster nukes.

    Yeah sorry Ib I wasn't too clear there, I ment that you should take a look back into Changing and Daemon lines because of the changes.

    Ah. Though wasn't Daemonology actually overall nerfed by the changes because Infernal Blast and the Blue Horror actually scale worse now?

    If so, that really just leaves Changing. I'm specced Changing at the moment, but I do not really find it that particularly enjoyable. Perhaps after the patch I'll give it a shot though.

    Damn this quote tree is long. Anyway Daemon still gets buffed as a spec because you have to secondary into a tree, and that tree is usually changing. I know this seems like bad logic because it doesn't buff just daemon, but it does help out every spec of the Magus except Havoc (And hey, don't try to tell me you don't use the non Havoc dots as Havoc, cuse you should be if your not IMO)

    Xzean on
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  • DarkPrimusDarkPrimus Registered User regular
    edited December 2008
    Sat in queue for Reikland for over and hour and a half, several times in a row (crashing occassionally) and so now with the servers going down I am ONE CHICKEN AND TWO PIE THROWS AWAY from having my Blackguard a week early.

    God.

    Fucking.

    Damn it.

    DarkPrimus on
  • SaerisSaeris Borb Enthusiast flapflapflapflapRegistered User regular
    edited December 2008
    I spent over twenty hours queued for T1 Reikland Factory over the course of the last week, four of those on a Saturday afternoon, and I did not see one pop of the scenario. Blackguard? Feh, I wanted that cloak.

    Saeris on
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  • jkylefultonjkylefulton Squid...or Kid? NNID - majpellRegistered User regular
    edited December 2008
    The T4 dungeons are surprisingly easy, FYI, and only take like thirty to sixty minutes each to complete.

    I never tried Gunbad.

    jkylefulton on
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  • LawndartLawndart Registered User regular
    edited December 2008
    Morskittar wrote: »
    Also, I have a confession to make; I love Tor Anroc and I love Bright Wizards. If you stay at the back of the lines, the IBs aren't too thick, and BWs allow you to accumulate kills pretty fast. The best is when the Ironbreakers split up and two run back to get you, allowing the rest of the line to push forward.

    Good fun.

    Oh, don't get me wrong, I enjoy nothing more than killing the fuck out of Bright Wizards (oh, Elixir of the Cauldron, how I want to have your little evil elf babies).

    I only like Ironbreakers when that annoying lavapunt AoE is on cooldown and they're so intent on killing some Chosen or Black Orc that they let me stand behind them and shower them with armor-ignoring stabbity goodness.

    Lawndart on
  • Gnome-InterruptusGnome-Interruptus Registered User regular
    edited December 2008
    I think I would actually prefer a Havoc primary or seconday Magus to any of the others. Especially in T4 when no one wants to attack the healers in the back.

    Just have them throw PotW on all the AM, BW, and RP :D

    Gnome-Interruptus on
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  • TyberiusTyberius Registered User regular
    edited December 2008
    The T4 dungeons are surprisingly easy, FYI, and only take like thirty to sixty minutes each to complete.

    I never tried Gunbad.

    Bloodwrought and Bilerot are a couple of T4 instances that gave me trouble last night. In BW our tank disconnected at 10% of the left wing boss and couldn't reenter the instance since we were able to kill him during his downtime thus locking him out of our run. Bilerot 2nd boss is practically 90% luck with 10% skill required, so ridiculous.

    Tyberius on
  • Lucky CynicLucky Cynic Registered User regular
    edited December 2008
    Hey guys, have you seen the video of us Mouths in action?


    http://www.warhammer-videos.com/play.php?vid=234

    Lucky Cynic on
  • DogDog Registered User, Administrator, Vanilla Staff admin
    edited December 2008
    Gunbad is pretty much a waste of time.

    Unknown User on
  • Gnome-InterruptusGnome-Interruptus Registered User regular
    edited December 2008
    Patchnotes are up on the Herald:
    Highlights
    New Careers Released! - With this version we are happy to announce the release of the Empire’s Knight of the Blazing Sun, and the Dark Elf’s Black Guard! These new careers are available early for players who have successfully completed the Heavy Metal Event!

    Mastery Point Refunds – Due to a number of significant changes to many of our careers, we are providing a full Mastery Point refund to certain careers. Players who belong to one of the careers below will need to speak with a Trainer to retrain their Career Mastery:
    Bright Wizard
    Chosen
    Engineer
    Ironbreaker
    Magus
    Shadow Warrior
    Sorcerer
    Squig Herder
    Swordmaster

    Morale Responsiveness - Morale abilities will now be much more responsive. These abilities will now fire immediately when activated by the player on the first attempt, and will display their cooldowns correctly at all times.

    Root Responsiveness - We have made a number of adjustments to root spells to ensure that they break properly and feel more responsive to players. Changes include a chance to break on ANY damage including DoT damage, as well as a 5 second immunity to being rooted again after the current root effect breaks.

    Auto-Attack Animations - Improvements have been made to auto-attack animations. Players will now see smoother, more consistent weapon swaps when players change from ranged to melee auto-attacks, and vice versa.

    Ability Activation Responsiveness - The responsiveness of ability activations has been improved. Players will now see less of a delay between the activation of an ability and the corresponding animation.

    Guild Promotion/Demotion - Fixes have been made to issues which were causing guild promotion and demotion to not work properly.
    Combat&Careers:
    General

    We've fixed an issue that was causing the buff icon on various marketing rewards to display incorrectly.

    We fixed an issue that was causing weapons and armor to not display their proc effects in the item display.

    Opponents may no longer right-click item effects to remove them from themselves, and the Boost, Blades, Barrier, and Barricade effects will now proc far more reliably.

    Tactics gained from Tome Unlocks have been renamed.

    Damage over Time abilities: The amount that stats contribute to the damage of these abilities has been made consistent across the board. This generally resulted in an increase in damage, but some abilities have also been brought down. Individual abilities are noted in the specific careers’ sections below.

    All Unstoppable tooltips will now mention Knockdown.

    Root effects, with the exception of Morale Roots, will now grant a 5 second Freedom effect to the victim when they break, and will no longer stack with other roots.

    Root effects will now properly have a chance to break on ANY damage event. This includes individual tics of Damage over Time spells.

    Fixed assorted issues where certain movement reductions/increases would stack, slowing or speeding targets more than intended. This also addresses cases where snared players would find themselves essentially rooted when in lava.

    All Tactics now give their bonus when the character that has them slotted is stealthed, mounted, or has a Standard out.

    Racial Tactics

    Centuries of Training (Elves): The tooltip for this Tactic has been changed to be more clear.

    Sigmar’s Favor (Empire): This Tactic will now be triggered only by direct heals.

    Stoutness of Stone (Dwarfs): This Tactic will once again reduce the effectiveness of Stuns and Knockdowns.

    Tzeentch’s Warding (Chaos): This Tactic will now get the bonus when the character is mounted.

    Archetype Abilities

    Alter Fate: This ability’s tooltip now displays the correct values.

    Champion's Challenge: Neither the player nor the player’s enemy may be knocked back while this Morale is in effect.

    Divine Protection: This ability now lists the amount of damage absorbed in the tooltip.

    Force of Will: This ability will now display a visual effect when used.

    Frenzied Slaughter: This ability will now display a visual effect when used.

    Juggernaut: This ability will only fire when the player is rooted, snared, silenced, or disarmed.

    Misdirection: This ability will now display an effect on the caster while the ability is active, and place a brief effect on anyone damaged by the effect.

    Point Blank: This ability will now correctly ignore Knockback and Knockdown immunity, as well as not trigger it.

    Rampaging Siphon: This Morale ability will no longer be affected by points spent in Career Mastery. Additionally, this ability now heals the group for each target hit, instead of only once.

    Raze: This channeled ability will no longer be interrupted while on the move.

    Relentless Assault: This ability will now display n visual effect when used. Additionally, the ability will no longer remove snares and roots.

    Restorative Burst: This tactic’s tooltip now correctly states the number of Action Points gained from triggering it.
    General Changes & Bug Fixes:
    Fixed an issue that caused summoning a mount to impact client performance.
    Items:
    Warrior Priest Books have been updated to make them significantly more attractive to players. All offhand books will now add passive Righteous Fury regeneration. The amount regenerated per second varies based on the rarity of the item.

    Disciple Chalices have been updated to make them significantly more attractive to players. All offhand chalices will now add passive Soul Essence regeneration. The amount regenerated per second varies based on the rarity of the item.

    An issue has been fixed that was causing the buff icon on various marketing rewards not to display correctly.

    Book of Boom: You can no longer be knocked back while under the effects of the Book of Boom.

    Numerous issues have been corrected relating to Weapon and Armor effect procs. These should now display correctly and fire more reliably.

    Opponents may no longer right click item effects to remove them from themselves, and the Boost, Blades, Barrier, and Barricade effects will now proc far more reliably.

    Fixed an issue that was causing Weapons and Armor to not properly display their proc effects in the item display.

    Numerous issues have been corrected relating to Weapon and Armor effect procs. These will now display correctly and fire more reliably.

    Opponents can no longer right-click unfriendly item effects to remove them from themselves, and the Boost, Blades, Barrier, and Barricade effects will now proc far more reliably.

    Image-Changing Rewards: A player’s illusion will now break upon using an ability in addition to breaking on damage.

    All Dwarf spanner items in the game are now set to be useable by Engineers only.

    All Dwarf great hammer items in the game are now set to be useable by Ironbreakers only.

    All Empire rapier items in the game are now set to be useable by Witch Hunters only.

    Tooltips on armor set pieces will now display information relevant to that set's bonuses.

    Standards: All references to banners should now be removed. All text now refers to Standards.
    Realm vs Realm
    Fixed an issue which was causing the Martyr's Square battlefield objective to not issue Renown properly.

    Fixed an issue with the postern door of the Ghrond's Sacristy keep which was preventing players from entering the keep through the door.

    A time delay has been added to the preliminary spawns of flags and murderballs in several scenarios. This change was made in order to ensure that both sides have a chance to run to the spawn location of the flag or murderball at the start of the match, and battle for control of the area even before the object has spawned. The affected scenarios include the following:
    Mourkain Temple
    Stone Troll Crossing
    Tor Anroc
    Howling Gorge
    Talabec Dam
    Serpent's Passage

    The interact timers for planting the bomb in the Howling Gorge and Talabec Dam scenarios have been lowered to 2 seconds.

    Various improvements have been made to reduce the frequency in which the Realm War maps will incorrectly report contested zones in Tier 4. This means that zones displayed as locked when they actually aren’t should occur far less frequently, if at all.

    Tier 3 Battering Ram: This siege weapon has had its health increased.

    Boiling Oil: This siege weapon has had its health increased to better withstand enemy assaults in all tiers.

    Based on player feedback we have made some additional changes to Tier 4 Victory Point contribution. The following changes will reduce the amount of time necessary to capture a Tier 4 zone as well as place more emphasis on open field RvR:

    Battlefield Objectives and Keep contributions have been increased.
    PvE contribution has been decreased.
    Prior Zone control contribution has been decreased.
    The amount of Scenario Victory Points to take a zone has been decreased.
    User Interface:
    The "Ability Not Ready" message will no longer display when the remaining cooldown on an ability is less than or equal to the full global cooldown.
    Corrected an issue with the cooldown timers on the action bar buttons that was causing them to count down improperly. The timers will now count down in half-second increments beginning at 3 seconds remaining.

    Characters will no longer have all of their currently-active cooldown timers reset when they are granted new abilities.

    Morale abilities will now display their cooldowns correctly at all times.

    Fixed the tooltip display for the first custom guild rank slot.

    Kicking a player from a guild now properly deactivates the guild and alliance tabs for that player.

    Guild members may now be promoted to the first customized guild rank slot.

    Fixed an issue in which guild and alliance roster sub-tabs appeared on the screen if the player joined a new guild after having left a guild with the Guild Roster tab as the last Guild Window viewed.

    Guild titles will now sort by rank rather than alphabetically.

    Players who have not been given permission to kick members from their guild will no longer be presented with the option to do so.

    Fixed an issue in which the guild roster was not updating properly when 'Hide Offline' was checked.

    Guild Leaders, Officers, and anyone else with appropriate permissions can once again use the guild window context menus to promote and demote members.

    Locking the chat window will now persist upon logging out.

    Fixed an issue with the targeting system that could be used by players to gain an unfair advantage. Targeting of friendly players will now work in the same way as using abilities. Players must either use a keyboard key or click with the mouse to acquire a friendly target. To target a monster or NPC, players must click on the target in the world or /assist a friendly player. Players using our default user interface should see no change as a result of this fix.

    Individual career changes can be found:
    Page 1
    Page 2

    Gnome-Interruptus on
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  • Gnome-InterruptusGnome-Interruptus Registered User regular
    edited December 2008
    Some of the big changes that I noticed was increasing the BFO / Keep contributions, and reducing everything else.
    Also, adding a Soul Essence / Rightous Fury regen stat to Chalice / Book items for DoK & WP.

    Oh, they also increased the HP on the Oil in Keeps.

    Gnome-Interruptus on
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  • FireflashFireflash Montreal, QCRegistered User regular
    edited December 2008
    Zomg, they kept the "all ballistic from items is converted to strength when in assault stance" for Shadow Warriors. I'm going to be so much more powerful now.

    Fireflash on
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    Battle.net: Fireflash#1425
    Steam Friend code: 45386507
  • LednehLedneh shinesquawk Registered User regular
    edited December 2008
    So are Maguses actually going to be powerful now, or at least powerful enough to not be a waste of a slot? I'd resubscribe to try out a non-gimp Magus :)

    (edit) welp
    |
    |
    V

    Ledneh on
  • AccualtAccualt Registered User regular
    edited December 2008
    robothero wrote: »
    Mythic is not very good when it comes to class balance shit, but they are good at everything else.

    WAR is the single most balanced MMO I've played at launch.

    As long as you aren't playing a Magus.

    Accualt on
  • DogDog Registered User, Administrator, Vanilla Staff admin
    edited December 2008
    Accualt wrote: »
    robothero wrote: »
    Mythic is not very good when it comes to class balance shit, but they are good at everything else.

    WAR is the single most balanced MMO I've played at launch.

    As long as you aren't playing a Magus.

    or a Bright Wizard


    or an Ironbreaker


    or a Witch Elf



    but otherwise sure

    Unknown User on
  • AccualtAccualt Registered User regular
    edited December 2008
    BW's and WE's are slightly over powered.

    IB's don't do dick for damage but their CC and unkillableness makes up for it. BALANCED!
    Hey guys, have you seen the video of us Mouths in action?


    http://www.warhammer-videos.com/play.php?vid=234
    The Six Mouths crew rolling over Order in SP... all with the help of great healing, brutal black hole use, and a furry tank.

    I loath you.

    Accualt on
  • ZzuluZzulu Registered User regular
    edited December 2008
    What exactly makes the WE so much better than the WH? I can't touch a WH with my sorc at 40. They undo me. So fast. Even if they are not completely up to snuff to some mirror, they're still pretty fantastic, at least judging from my view

    and how can you call the IB overpowered? Its mirror isn't even released yet

    Zzulu on
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  • DogDog Registered User, Administrator, Vanilla Staff admin
    edited December 2008
    I don't think the WH is bad at all and if help is more than 30ish seconds away from me I am dead (I am slowly closing in on 900 wounds heh), I just think the WE is vastly superior. And this is what I hear constantly from the other side of the fence.

    Unknown User on
  • starmanbrandstarmanbrand Registered User regular
    edited December 2008
    My girlfriend had fun last night in Phoenix Gate. It pops, to her going "UGH I hate phoenix gate!" and she is only a couple thousand exp away from leveling so I tell her to just level from killing mans and then leave. She also hates stonetroll crossing and it was late so who knew when the next queue would pop.

    She gets in, kills a few people and gets her level. The score is like 6-10 after three or four minutes so she decides to leave. After she runs through the red exit gate, she is teleported to a few yards away from the order flag. She freaks out for a second, grabs the flag, and runs back to cap it. She is then so bound by honor to these other players i nthe SC, she plays the remaining 10 minutes of the SC just so she can bask in her personally winning an sc.

    starmanbrand on
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  • BloodsheedBloodsheed Registered User regular
    edited December 2008
    My girlfriend had fun last night in Phoenix Gate. It pops, to her going "UGH I hate phoenix gate!" and she is only a couple thousand exp away from leveling so I tell her to just level from killing mans and then leave. She also hates stonetroll crossing and it was late so who knew when the next queue would pop.

    She gets in, kills a few people and gets her level. The score is like 6-10 after three or four minutes so she decides to leave. After she runs through the red exit gate, she is teleported to a few yards away from the order flag. She freaks out for a second, grabs the flag, and runs back to cap it. She is then so bound by honor to these other players i nthe SC, she plays the remaining 10 minutes of the SC just so she can bask in her personally winning an sc.

    Those red exit gates do very, very odd things.

    The one in Factory once ported me to the rafters of the Steamtank Factory, directly above the enemy Healers.

    Bloodsheed on
    Xbox Live, Steam, PSN: Eclibull
  • Gnome-InterruptusGnome-Interruptus Registered User regular
    edited December 2008
    the WE is vastly superior against armored targets due to their armor debuffs, and against healers due to their heal debuff. Both of those were slightly nerfed with this patch.

    Magus was buffed pretty signifigantly if changing, slightly with havoc, and slightly nerfed with daemonology (both Rift, and their Pet, and their shotgun DoT).

    Oh, and read about an interesting if true exploit on VN... have a group of 6 standard bearers trade standards with an opposing realm guild of 6 standard bearers...
    (500 RP / standard * 6 group members) / 15s capture refresh = 12,000 RP per minute

    Gnome-Interruptus on
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  • FireflashFireflash Montreal, QCRegistered User regular
    edited December 2008
    Isn't the standard unuseable for a while when in gets captured?

    Fireflash on
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  • AccualtAccualt Registered User regular
    edited December 2008
    Warrior Priest Books have been updated to make them significantly more attractive to players. All offhand books will now add passive Righteous Fury regeneration. The amount regenerated per second varies based on the rarity of the item.

    Disciple Chalices have been updated to make them significantly more attractive to players. All offhand chalices will now add passive Soul Essence regeneration. The amount regenerated per second varies based on the rarity of the item.

    Anyone toy with this on test? Does it make a more backline/skirmish healing focused DoK/WP realistic at all? I like the idea of a WP/DoK hanging with the ranged groups to provide protection against the inevitable stealther/mdps attacks.

    Accualt on
  • ZzuluZzulu Registered User regular
    edited December 2008
    I thought both the WH and WE got two healing debuffs? Looking at Wardb, it seems to hold true. The difference is that the WH gets the spell later in the levels

    Zzulu on
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  • AccualtAccualt Registered User regular
    edited December 2008
    With 1.0.6 WH's now get their anti-heal Bullet at level 9, same time as WEs. Wardb just hasn't updated yet.

    Accualt on
  • starmanbrandstarmanbrand Registered User regular
    edited December 2008
    So...I didn't notice any mention of a fix to Daemonic Infestation for the magus. That is the little fat baby that explodes and knocks bitches down.

    Although in all my seven levels of having it and using it a lot in PvP and PvE, I Don't think I've ever seen it knock someone down. http://wardb.com/spell.aspx?id=8541 This bothers me because I know I've been knocked down by Engi landmines before.

    starmanbrand on
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  • LawndartLawndart Registered User regular
    edited December 2008
    Zzulu wrote: »
    What exactly makes the WE so much better than the WH? I can't touch a WH with my sorc at 40. They undo me. So fast. Even if they are not completely up to snuff to some mirror, they're still pretty fantastic, at least judging from my view

    and how can you call the IB overpowered? Its mirror isn't even released yet

    The one that makes the most sense to me is that WE's get a tactic that boosts crit damage by 50%, and WH's don't.

    Other WH complaints include how the WH Bullet mechanic doesn't proc nearly as often as WE Kisses do (although those complaints ignore the advantages of Bullets) and how WH's have to stack both Strength and Ballistic skill to pump up their damage.

    I do think WH's need a slight buff, but a lot of the WH doomsayers ignore the advantages that WH's have, such as ranged finishers, a self-heal tactic, a higher-damage AoE tactic, and an on-demand parry buff.

    Lawndart on
  • PejPej Registered User regular
    edited December 2008
    robothero wrote: »
    Accualt wrote: »
    robothero wrote: »
    Mythic is not very good when it comes to class balance shit, but they are good at everything else.
    WAR is the single most balanced MMO I've played at launch.

    As long as you aren't playing a Magus.
    or a Bright Wizard

    or an Ironbreaker

    or a Witch Elf

    but otherwise sure
    After scouring various class dedicated boards it seems like a significant percentage of every class of player seems to think their class sucks, is broken, etc... Now that's what I call balance! ;-)

    I'll dissent by saying that my White Lion should hit 40 next time I play him and I still love the class.

    Pej on
    This cave leads to the inhospitable surface of the planet. There is nothing for you to see there.
  • DogDog Registered User, Administrator, Vanilla Staff admin
    edited December 2008
    I actually think Shaman is fine if not a bit overpowered.

    Unknown User on
  • Gnome-InterruptusGnome-Interruptus Registered User regular
    edited December 2008
    So...I didn't notice any mention of a fix to Daemonic Infestation for the magus. That is the little fat baby that explodes and knocks bitches down.

    Although in all my seven levels of having it and using it a lot in PvP and PvE, I Don't think I've ever seen it knock someone down. http://wardb.com/spell.aspx?id=8541 This bothers me because I know I've been knocked down by Engi landmines before.

    Yeah, the Daemonic Infestation is buggy as all hell, but apparently works 100% of the time if you cast it on a player thats inside the range of it, then it will work. But if you ground summon it, then all bets are off.

    Gnome-Interruptus on
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  • starmanbrandstarmanbrand Registered User regular
    edited December 2008
    So...I didn't notice any mention of a fix to Daemonic Infestation for the magus. That is the little fat baby that explodes and knocks bitches down.

    Although in all my seven levels of having it and using it a lot in PvP and PvE, I Don't think I've ever seen it knock someone down. http://wardb.com/spell.aspx?id=8541 This bothers me because I know I've been knocked down by Engi landmines before.

    Yeah, the Daemonic Infestation is buggy as all hell, but apparently works 100% of the time if you cast it on a player thats inside the range of it, then it will work. But if you ground summon it, then all bets are off.

    Hmm..I've always thought of the "out of range" message I got with it was annoying. But now that I know this information... To the field of battle! Thank you.

    starmanbrand on
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  • MalkorMalkor Registered User regular
    edited December 2008
    I don't think WEs or BWs are all that OP, but at least on Destruction if more than two of those Ginger bastards show up to a scen, people just quit. Or at the very least proclaim our imminent loss.

    Malkor on
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  • ArdorArdor Registered User regular
    edited December 2008
    Looks like they made our word of pain spell 100% more useless? Still debuffs willpower with a recast timer. Did they increase the damage?

    Ardor on
  • ZzuluZzulu Registered User regular
    edited December 2008
    well they made it into a single application, so you no longer have to spam it 3 times at least

    but yeah, pretty silly that they refused the debuff change yet are ok with BW's having the thing instead

    Zzulu on
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  • rehtonAesoohCrehtonAesoohC Registered User regular
    edited December 2008
    It's only 1 cast and it doesn't stack anymore. They essentially made it as powerful as the 3-cast version (or close) with one cast.

    rehtonAesoohC on
    Was wowed by Rift so I'm trying that now.
  • KiTAKiTA Registered User regular
    edited December 2008
    Did BW's bugs about roots never breaking and dots double tapping get fixed?

    KiTA on
  • ZzuluZzulu Registered User regular
    edited December 2008
    supposedly

    Zzulu on
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  • SaammielSaammiel Registered User regular
    edited December 2008
    Lawndart wrote: »
    Zzulu wrote: »
    What exactly makes the WE so much better than the WH? I can't touch a WH with my sorc at 40. They undo me. So fast. Even if they are not completely up to snuff to some mirror, they're still pretty fantastic, at least judging from my view

    and how can you call the IB overpowered? Its mirror isn't even released yet

    The one that makes the most sense to me is that WE's get a tactic that boosts crit damage by 50%, and WH's don't.

    Other WH complaints include how the WH Bullet mechanic doesn't proc nearly as often as WE Kisses do (although those complaints ignore the advantages of Bullets) and how WH's have to stack both Strength and Ballistic skill to pump up their damage.

    I do think WH's need a slight buff, but a lot of the WH doomsayers ignore the advantages that WH's have, such as ranged finishers, a self-heal tactic, a higher-damage AoE tactic, and an on-demand parry buff.

    I'd rather they just bring WEs down to WH level personally. I feel like my WH does things about right. I can kill casters and I die to melee.

    I think I've rehashed this a few times now, but what the hell, once more won't hurt. WEs have an edge over WHs in that their core mechanic and surrounding tactics are better. Kisses can proc up to 50% of the time off any attack, auto or ability. Combined with dual wielding that means that the actual damage put out by kisses far surpasses that put out by bullets. In turn you need to re-apply kisses more frequently, but its not that onerous IMO. They also used to proc kisses off of weapon procs too, but I don't know if that has been fixed in the past couple weeks or not, so it might be a moot point now. So a Kiss lasts 2mins and has a 25% chance to proc off any attack (50% with a tactic). Bullets proc ONLY on executions, which somewhat rely on building up combo points basically. There is a way to sort of get around it (abso spam) but it will still be worse than the WE mechanic.

    In addition, WEs don't have to split their stat points across ballistics and strength. WHs get a boosted BAL skill to try and account for this, but in practice it fails. Tactics like Brute Strength just don't work as well for a WH as they do for a WE. In addition, when you take gearing into effect, you end up with less damage ability increases than a WE generally does from what I understand, though of course its somewhat hard to compare.

    Some of the tactics are off too. WEs get access to more armor cuts, get a bit more AP regen though I don't think in practice that matters a ton, and have a couple of tactics that universally improve crits whereas the WH version increases only the chance on one ability (Absolution).

    Finally, WEs get more knockdowns, including an AE, which sort of doesn't seem like much, but oh it is. I'd sell my own mother for an AE knockdown tied to an execution.

    The healing bullets ability was nerfed and from what I understand is more or less useless. What higher damage AE tactic are you talking about btw? Sweeping Razor? Dragon Gun (not a tactic)? Sweeping Razor is sort of cute but it has god awful range.

    So, the primary WH advantage then is ranged finishers, which are nice especially with Trial by Pain not being crap, but not really the bees knees since they still only have a range of 30ft. We also do more damage with our anytime ranged snare I believe, since it's damage is tied to ballistics for both (might be wrong on that).

    Some of our tactics are nice, but are IMO inferior to the WEs. We get the auto-attack increase on a crit and a 35% damage increase when we disrupt. However I'd rather have a universal crit increase over an auto-attack increase and disrupts are sufficiently unreliable that I'm still not sold on the other tactic.

    We also get a 30s Melee Attack that gives us 5s of 100% parry deep in one of our mastery lines. It's cute, and allows us to dominate a 1v1 fight with a stupid WE, but it is really pretty gimmicky. Against a true tank riposte does f-all damage and there is a fairly non-trivial chance your Repel will be blocked/parried anyhow. And it does effectively nothing for stopping casters.

    A lot of the complaints are exaggerations, but in bulk I think the WEs are a fair amount better than their mirror. The primary advantage is due to their Kiss mechanic.

    Saammiel on
  • Hiryu02Hiryu02 Registered User regular
    edited December 2008
    Hey guys, have you seen the video of us Mouths in action?


    http://www.warhammer-videos.com/play.php?vid=234

    Nice! What are your system specs?

    Hiryu02 on
    Sev: Your gameplay is the most heavily yomi based around. Usually you look for characters that allow you to force guessing situations for big dmg. Even if the guess is mathematically nowhere near in your favor lol. You're happiest when you have either a 50/50, 33/33/33 or even a 75/25 situation to go crazy with. And you will take big risks to force those situations to come up.
  • ZzuluZzulu Registered User regular
    edited December 2008
    I never get into TSM groups in scenarios :(

    I guess most of you guys play too late for me to join

    Zzulu on
    t5qfc9.jpg
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