One thing that drives me nuts is attempts when we don't have heroism. "Hey, we'll just do it for practice." No, what you're actually saying is "hey, lets get raped by a second group of whelps."
We actually don't bloodlust until Shadron lands, whether or not you get a second set of whelps is DPS failing and a large amount of RNG, because he doesn't necessarily spawn them as soon as he CAN spawn them.
We actually don't bloodlust until Shadron lands, whether or not you get a second set of whelps is DPS failing and a large amount of RNG, because he doesn't necessarily spawn them as soon as he CAN spawn them.
Mmmm, you just totally gave me an "I told you so." Thanks riz!
They were popping it on Tenebron to burn him before a second set of whelps spawned, part of that was probably lack of DPS on the Shaman's part. (which I can't entirely fault him for, it's his off spec. He's a zillion times better since the last time we tried like 2 weeks ago) But yeah, Shadron is not even close to dead by the time Vesparon lands, and the Shad/Vesp phase can't last that long or, yay! No healer mana.
Enraged flame dooders really are a pain in the butt. I hope your add tank is at least actively trying to keep them from being hit by flame walls, in-between add wipes. We've always run with a Hunter though, so I don't know how active his job is at keeping them tranqed. Never been something I've actively paid attention to.
I'd ask what role your Paladin plays in healing that encounter, and how much raw healing he's doing. If you're using 2 healers with a "Hybrid" Elem Shaman, then that Paladin has to have some big brass ones. I'd like to see how that works with a Priest as the other healer, since I've only ever done it with a Druid, and well, that's a pain in my ass.
Edit: We've always burned BL either right as the second drake is called, or right after the first flame wall. Dunno. I've only seen a second set of whelps show up once, so I guess that's a DPS thing. That's one fight where I'm only paying attention to one aspect. Green bars stay full.
Pally basically heals the MT and bacons the add tank, the drake tank is always taking predictable damage so he's not much to worry about. I heal everything else. We're not really having many issues healing-wise aside from the fight lasting way to long. Enraged blazes can just destroy the add tank when twilight torment is up though.
They were popping it on Tenebron to burn him before a second set of whelps spawned, part of that was probably lack of DPS on the Shaman's part. (which I can't entirely fault him for, it's his off spec. He's a zillion times better since the last time we tried like 2 weeks ago) But yeah, Shadron is not even close to dead by the time Vesparon lands, and the Shad/Vesp phase can't last that long or, yay! No healer mana.
It now occurs to me that I've been saying Shadron when I meant Vesperon, I KNEW I should have looked that up to check. It may not be exactly when Vesperon lands but I know our bloodlust generally happens sometime while the second two drakes are in action. As I recall Shadron isn't close to dead when Vesperon lands for us either, but yeah, THAT is the time when shit gets crazy so bloodlust then makes it less likely for something to go wrong.
Tell your Paladin to man up and heal more people in the raid. The absolute worst that can happen to the Sarth tank(outside Breaths during Torment), is getting knocked to around 50% HP by a Breath. Your Paladin should have no issues bringing the MT back to full health. The Sarth tank should be in no danger at all, until you throw Torment into the mix. Our Elem Shaman can still keep 3k DPS going through-out the fight. The only time extra heals are needed is for Torment.
Overall though, it doesn't sound like a healer issue. Sounds like a pewpew issue. That encounter is where you should be picking people apart for DPS failings. Healing in that fight is a challenge, so they need to step up and get their healers out of the "stress zone" as fast as possible.
Edit: You're crazy for trying to remember their names, Riz. Them bishes get numbers, and all I care about is remembering that when #3 lands, it's time for all hell to break loose.
"Vesperon! The clutch is in danger! Assist me!" is code for, "Ish needs to get the hell to the MT area while looking for Vamp Embrace (Twilight Torment icon) and the fire breathy cast bar while dodging flame walls and void zones to smash the first GS macro."
That's the only reason I know the name.
Edit: Unless I'm on MT healing, then my role is stupidly easy because I have to move all of 2 steps to avoid either of those things. And I zone out. And have to go back through the chat log to figure out what drake is down...
Haha. "OMG BLOODLUST" is code for "stop healing the OT and start healing the ranged while the shaman stops healing the raid and starts chain healing the OT, oh and watch for that Flame Breath cast bar, hope a lava wave isn't coming when it's your turn to GS Charus..."
I'm still confused about the cooldown rotations that people talk about. Maybe it's for the people not running a DK tank. /shrug. I put Blessing of Sacrifice on our DK once. Everything else is stuff he handles on his own. That's 10 and 25 man Sarth 3D.
" 'Lust" means it's time to pop Divine Illumination and bomb Holy Lights for god and country. Beacon of Light goes on the Sarth MT, and everyone and their fuckin' brother gets a Holy Light bomb on them. Doesn't matter if they're at 90% HP or 9% HP.
We use a Druid MT so he only has one real "get out of jail free" breath... We just have a plethora of Priests to put up GS, and [the druid] saves his cooldowns in case we can't get there in time.
Yeah, I think DKs have more than one "save" of their own, right? Our druid tank pops his cooldowns, then two more cooldowns need to be used before the breaths are non-lethal again. Usually this is me with GS and then a paladin, though last week they had a hunter pet do the second one.
Oooo, okay. That makes sense then. We use our Druid for Drakes, while our GM runs around like a chicken with his head cut off on his Warrior picking up adds.
Edit: Yeah, DKs have a crap-ton of buttons. Anti-Magic shield, IBF, Lichborne, AoTD, and probably some other crap I can't think of atm. Oh yeah, they can Runeforge for something too.
reVerseAttack and Dethrone GodRegistered Userregular
edited March 2009
Annoying: Doing Nexus on my DK, and for some reason during the Keritrasza fight our Druid decides to go into bearform and start taunting her.
Happy: I taunted her back a few times, but then on the third time when the Druid taunted her I didn't bother with a taunt, the Druid (probably not noticing that I didn't taunt) went back into catform and died.
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silence1186Character shields down!As a wingmanRegistered Userregular
edited March 2009
Someone actually put forth a very nice treatise on resist mechanics in LK on elitistjerks. What I got from it is if I put my Sarth 10 MT in ~334-340 Fire resist, we can last in the shadron + vesperon phase indefinitely. Now, we 3 heal the fight, and just brought 4 of the most highly synergized DPS possible (Mage with imp scorch, Aff warlock, Elem shaman, shadow priest). We also Heroism for Tenebron, though we usually don't need it, simply because we can last forever after Tenebron.
Flabbergasted: Just finished tanking a H CoS where our warlock DC'd after the first boss, and we ended up 4 manning it, except it may as well have been 3 manning:
So #3 there was gone most of the run, and #4 was NOT the healer or the tank. That's a ret paladin, doing 400 DPS in STRAT of all places. Consecrate and holy wrath were his top damage abilities. He was specced to avoid Judgements of the Wise (replenishment? 15% mana on judgements? who needs these things?). My head nearly exploded.
Happy: I got the 4 stone keeper shards I needed out of that run, so my baby mage gets some shoulders when we get WG back.
Someone actually put forth a very nice treatise on resist mechanics in LK on elitistjerks. What I got from it is if I put my Sarth 10 MT in ~334-340 Fire resist, we can last in the shadron + vesperon phase indefinitely. Now, we 3 heal the fight, and just brought 4 of the most highly synergized DPS possible (Mage with imp scorch, Aff warlock, Elem shaman, shadow priest). We also Heroism for Tenebron, though we usually don't need it, simply because we can last forever after Tenebron.
Wish they did the resist change in TBC when I was tanking leo (or Illidan, but one time after 3.0 I did it with only one piece of resist gear on accident... fortunately he only hit demon form once)
Incidentally, is this with the TBC resist gear? Or random greens? We haven't tried putting someone with resist gear on it since we have a DK tank, and it's a lot harder for non-druids to maintain defense and do resist gear.
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I wish that someway, somehow, that I could save every one of us
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silence1186Character shields down!As a wingmanRegistered Userregular
edited March 2009
The set up I used is listed here, as well as a bunch of other useful info:
Happy: Glory of the Raider! Plagued Proto-Drake get! Much like my Glory of the Hero, I had already done all the hard ones and just needed to pick up a few easy ones this week: 8-man Malygos, Shocking, and the one that got me the Drake was Just Can't Get Enough.
Also, somehow I managed to place 3rd on overall damage for the run despite tanking on about half the fights and most of the trash (though a lot of our dps and one of our healers were alts, second alts, or friends of other people in the run).
Hate: Almost every boss dropped leather healing gear, plate healing gear, or conqueror tokens. It was ridiculous. I got a ring off Sapphiron, and the quest item which I can't turn in until at least next week since I'm already saved to Malygos10.
A hate
I really want to go to Naxx or do Halls of Lighting but because I work nights and sleep during the day {or try to} every sets up raids like right now when I am getting ready for work sigh
It's getting to be quite annoying that people want to to link the achievement if you want to do a certain instance/raid I can understand if you are doing the +2 drakes or more ones but heroic Nexus? Or wanting people with tier 7/7.5 in order to Molten Core is getting old
Also the death knights starting old world raids for the achievement are stupid. I am gong to bwl for a certain quest and some quest items not the gear the same goes for Aq40!
I really want to Tempest Keep/ SSC for the tier 5 rogue set since I really wanted it in TBC and still want it now
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SenshiBALLING OUT OF CONTROLWavefrontRegistered Userregular
edited March 2009
Happy: Greed dropped of Mal'Ganis, and I Needed it for patch 3.1 (because assassination rogues are gonna get fucked). I think I can get a good off-hander, too--so it certainly feels like I've got fairly decent entry-level weapons!
A hate
I really want to go to Naxx or do Halls of Lighting but because I work nights and sleep during the day {or try to} every sets up raids like right now when I am getting ready for work sigh
It's getting to be quite annoying that people want to to link the achievement if you want to do a certain instance/raid I can understand if you are doing the +2 drakes or more ones but heroic Nexus? Or wanting people with tier 7/7.5 in order to Molten Core is getting old
Also the death knights starting old world raids for the achievement are stupid. I am gong to bwl for a certain quest and some quest items not the gear the same goes for Aq40!
I really want to Tempest Keep/ SSC for the tier 5 rogue set since I really wanted it in TBC and still want it now
Back in my day we did MC in blues. And we were happy to have them. Even though they were covered in spirit. And our buffs were only five mins back then. You kids today with your fancy tier gear with decent itemization and your fancy half hour buffs. All of you are soft. Now get off my lawn.
Hate: 2 Naxx 10 groups formed tonight. One of them was getting Shocking and other risky achievements, so I didn't go. The other one was a joint of 2 guilds, they took the other resto shammy in our guild, and got Undying. I really wouldn't mind this, but I'm not going to be able to play for 2 weeks, which makes me worried about getting the Plagued Proto Drake. For gods sakes, people have alts with it, but I still don't have it on my main.
Hope, someone can link the macro that allows me to auto choose flying vs. ground mounts and also takes into account dalaran (not landing though) and wintergrasp.
Apologies if this is of no interest to anyone, but i have to share:
Holy shit!: An old guild friend from my pre-tbc raiding group linked me to THIS unbelievable piece of old nostalgia. I can't believe it's still up after all these years...
For reference, that was our first-ever kill of Nefarian. Not a sinlge person in our guild had ever done the fight before, and it took us less than 3 weeks of 2-night tries to master the fight, most of that spent trying to learn the damn split-door tactic.
I can't see myself much, just a few blink-and-you-miss-it appearences, such as during the first view of the melee dps. I tanked the adds in phase 3, but you can't see me for obvious reasons...You can't see me tanking the door because the PoV is on the other door. I guess non-MT tanks don't get time in the spotlight. Oh well, it was a great night.
Christ i miss those people. I've never had as much fun since.
Edit: At 2 points (4:04 and 4:35 to 5:00) you can see my OEB for a second or two, i'm buried under rogues. That was the only epic dps item i had. The guy swinging TUB kept taking all the dps plate etc (it hardly dropped, like ever and he was the arms warrior, so go figure).
EDIT2: That sword the PoV had? I took the first one because no-one seemed to realise how great it was 'till later. He was the only other person who ever got one. I used mine for tanking right up until TBC. Great stuff.
If I hadn't been iceblocked... chainhax goooooooooo
The rest of the run was top-notch, though
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Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
edited March 2009
Next time, I am going to sit my butt on top of steve.
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Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
Happy: finally got fucking 3d sarth25 down. I think we could have done it weeks ago if our RL hadn't had real life stuff keeping him from our raid days. Before we'd done an hour of two of attempts, killed a drake and gone to maly/naxx. Tonight he was actually around and put his foot down and said that we weren't leaving until it was dead. and then ninja'd the drake
We'd known this was coming for weeks and were ok with it
Unfortunately I really need to finish sarth10 with 3 drakes and do the 6 minute maly 10 since theres no fucking way my raid is getting some of the achievements that require people to pay a modicum of attention or not be pants-on-head retarded.
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Dhalphirdon't you open that trapdooryou're a fool if you dareRegistered Userregular
edited March 2009
Twilight Drake is a bad drake model anyway. Besides Protos, the way I see it there are only two good looking drake models ingame...the Nightfall one, and the Azure one.
A lot of people did. I dropped to 700 and still had a dot. Hooray Iceblock.
And Happy: I finally replaced my damn Mantle of the Tribunal with a Miasma Mantle. Now I pretty much can't upgrade from anything in 10man other than Kel's wand.
Hate: I hate.. Heroic Occulus as the daily.
Not because it's hard. It's actually really very easy. I hate the fucking retards I get lumped in with that can't follow simple instructions.
Gaaah.
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reVerseAttack and Dethrone GodRegistered Userregular
edited March 2009
The Oculus would be one of the easiest heroics in the game if it weren't for the -80 IQ modifier that seems to be in effect there.
Posts
Mmmm, you just totally gave me an "I told you so." Thanks riz!
I'd ask what role your Paladin plays in healing that encounter, and how much raw healing he's doing. If you're using 2 healers with a "Hybrid" Elem Shaman, then that Paladin has to have some big brass ones. I'd like to see how that works with a Priest as the other healer, since I've only ever done it with a Druid, and well, that's a pain in my ass.
Edit: We've always burned BL either right as the second drake is called, or right after the first flame wall. Dunno. I've only seen a second set of whelps show up once, so I guess that's a DPS thing. That's one fight where I'm only paying attention to one aspect. Green bars stay full.
First Blood 85 Priest 80 Mage 85 Paladin 83 Druid 80 DK 85 Huntard 85 Shaman
"Tardo Wan" sounds like a Jedi that required 436 years to train and then killed himself by looking into his lightsaber while turning it on."
It now occurs to me that I've been saying Shadron when I meant Vesperon, I KNEW I should have looked that up to check. It may not be exactly when Vesperon lands but I know our bloodlust generally happens sometime while the second two drakes are in action. As I recall Shadron isn't close to dead when Vesperon lands for us either, but yeah, THAT is the time when shit gets crazy so bloodlust then makes it less likely for something to go wrong.
Overall though, it doesn't sound like a healer issue. Sounds like a pewpew issue. That encounter is where you should be picking people apart for DPS failings. Healing in that fight is a challenge, so they need to step up and get their healers out of the "stress zone" as fast as possible.
Edit: You're crazy for trying to remember their names, Riz. Them bishes get numbers, and all I care about is remembering that when #3 lands, it's time for all hell to break loose.
First Blood 85 Priest 80 Mage 85 Paladin 83 Druid 80 DK 85 Huntard 85 Shaman
"Tardo Wan" sounds like a Jedi that required 436 years to train and then killed himself by looking into his lightsaber while turning it on."
That's the only reason I know the name.
Edit: Unless I'm on MT healing, then my role is stupidly easy because I have to move all of 2 steps to avoid either of those things. And I zone out. And have to go back through the chat log to figure out what drake is down...
Stupid fight is stupid.
" 'Lust" means it's time to pop Divine Illumination and bomb Holy Lights for god and country. Beacon of Light goes on the Sarth MT, and everyone and their fuckin' brother gets a Holy Light bomb on them. Doesn't matter if they're at 90% HP or 9% HP.
First Blood 85 Priest 80 Mage 85 Paladin 83 Druid 80 DK 85 Huntard 85 Shaman
"Tardo Wan" sounds like a Jedi that required 436 years to train and then killed himself by looking into his lightsaber while turning it on."
Edit: Yeah, DKs have a crap-ton of buttons. Anti-Magic shield, IBF, Lichborne, AoTD, and probably some other crap I can't think of atm. Oh yeah, they can Runeforge for something too.
First Blood 85 Priest 80 Mage 85 Paladin 83 Druid 80 DK 85 Huntard 85 Shaman
"Tardo Wan" sounds like a Jedi that required 436 years to train and then killed himself by looking into his lightsaber while turning it on."
Happy: I taunted her back a few times, but then on the third time when the Druid taunted her I didn't bother with a taunt, the Druid (probably not noticing that I didn't taunt) went back into catform and died.
So #3 there was gone most of the run, and #4 was NOT the healer or the tank. That's a ret paladin, doing 400 DPS in STRAT of all places. Consecrate and holy wrath were his top damage abilities. He was specced to avoid Judgements of the Wise (replenishment? 15% mana on judgements? who needs these things?). My head nearly exploded.
Happy: I got the 4 stone keeper shards I needed out of that run, so my baby mage gets some shoulders when we get WG back.
Wish they did the resist change in TBC when I was tanking leo (or Illidan, but one time after 3.0 I did it with only one piece of resist gear on accident... fortunately he only hit demon form once)
Incidentally, is this with the TBC resist gear? Or random greens? We haven't tried putting someone with resist gear on it since we have a DK tank, and it's a lot harder for non-druids to maintain defense and do resist gear.
http://elitistjerks.com/f73/t42241-sartharion_3d_druid_mt_tips/p7/
Also, somehow I managed to place 3rd on overall damage for the run despite tanking on about half the fights and most of the trash (though a lot of our dps and one of our healers were alts, second alts, or friends of other people in the run).
Hate: Almost every boss dropped leather healing gear, plate healing gear, or conqueror tokens. It was ridiculous. I got a ring off Sapphiron, and the quest item which I can't turn in until at least next week since I'm already saved to Malygos10.
I really want to go to Naxx or do Halls of Lighting but because I work nights and sleep during the day {or try to} every sets up raids like right now when I am getting ready for work sigh
It's getting to be quite annoying that people want to to link the achievement if you want to do a certain instance/raid I can understand if you are doing the +2 drakes or more ones but heroic Nexus? Or wanting people with tier 7/7.5 in order to Molten Core is getting old
Also the death knights starting old world raids for the achievement are stupid. I am gong to bwl for a certain quest and some quest items not the gear the same goes for Aq40!
I really want to Tempest Keep/ SSC for the tier 5 rogue set since I really wanted it in TBC and still want it now
Hate: Patch 3.1
This makes my head hurt a lot.
Why did you even keep him?
Back in my day we did MC in blues. And we were happy to have them. Even though they were covered in spirit. And our buffs were only five mins back then. You kids today with your fancy tier gear with decent itemization and your fancy half hour buffs. All of you are soft. Now get off my lawn.
Steam: pazython
Please Please Please!
Less-Happy-but-still-not-upset: Proto-Drake whelp. Nearly...
Apologies if this is of no interest to anyone, but i have to share:
Holy shit!: An old guild friend from my pre-tbc raiding group linked me to THIS unbelievable piece of old nostalgia. I can't believe it's still up after all these years...
For reference, that was our first-ever kill of Nefarian. Not a sinlge person in our guild had ever done the fight before, and it took us less than 3 weeks of 2-night tries to master the fight, most of that spent trying to learn the damn split-door tactic.
I can't see myself much, just a few blink-and-you-miss-it appearences, such as during the first view of the melee dps. I tanked the adds in phase 3, but you can't see me for obvious reasons...You can't see me tanking the door because the PoV is on the other door. I guess non-MT tanks don't get time in the spotlight. Oh well, it was a great night.
Christ i miss those people. I've never had as much fun since.
Edit: At 2 points (4:04 and 4:35 to 5:00) you can see my OEB for a second or two, i'm buried under rogues. That was the only epic dps item i had. The guy swinging TUB kept taking all the dps plate etc (it hardly dropped, like ever and he was the arms warrior, so go figure).
EDIT2: That sword the PoV had? I took the first one because no-one seemed to realise how great it was 'till later. He was the only other person who ever got one. I used mine for tanking right up until TBC. Great stuff.
ON KEL OF ALL THINGS
EVEN AFTER THAT BULLSHIT WITH HEIGAN
RAAAAR
I totally got that NS-HT off gruagrasukrgsakjrgsajkgrsajkgraskj.
The rest of the run was top-notch, though
Unfortunately I really need to finish sarth10 with 3 drakes and do the 6 minute maly 10 since theres no fucking way my raid is getting some of the achievements that require people to pay a modicum of attention or not be pants-on-head retarded.
Aside from those times you fell to like 0.1% during Heiga.
Happy: Got Black Ice on my Druid, finally an epic DPS weapon.
And Happy: I finally replaced my damn Mantle of the Tribunal with a Miasma Mantle. Now I pretty much can't upgrade from anything in 10man other than Kel's wand.
Not because it's hard. It's actually really very easy. I hate the fucking retards I get lumped in with that can't follow simple instructions.
Gaaah.