[WoW] Chataclysm

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  • meowmix_2000meowmix_2000 Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    Are the itemization and lower dps issues all that bad as they say they are for elemental shamans? It's either finish my shaman or finish my 65 warlock. The only thing I like about the lock is the high dps. A bunch of other stuff about the shaman appeals to me more. I don't even see myself raiding with anything besides the resto druid I have. It would be for 5mans and maybe 10 mans.

    meowmix_2000 on
  • SerpicoSerpico Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    Our elemental shamans do pretty well, not on the level of rogues/locks/mages, but consistently top 10.

    Serpico on
  • Undead ScottsmanUndead Scottsman Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    Didn't know that there was a revised edition, so i'm going to assume I have the original core book.

    Around halfway through D&D's third edition, they released a 3.5 edition, which had a bunch of rule revisions. The original Warcraft RPG was designed to work with this old version, so future products existed in a kind of limbo inbetween the two version until they just decided to say fuck it and release a new version and they just called "World of Warcraft RPG" to boot. This version is also notable as it's standalone, while the original one needed the core D&D books. (Or at least the System Reference Document.)

    EDIT: Of course, if there ever was a red-headed step-child of Warcraft canon, it'd be the RPG books. I remember when they said Arthas was the most powerful being to ever walk Azeroth, and later try and cover the mistake by saying "Well, the Titans fly..."

    Undead Scottsman on
  • EuphoriacEuphoriac Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    Henroid wrote: »

    But yeah, they'd have to write in Garrosh suddenly having a change of heart and changing his ways. Which... now that I think about it, may be done because Christ Metzen is a putz.

    I still can't get my head around his excuse for the Draenei retcon.

    How can you design a race you know already has a history, tack stuff on, make a backstory, make models, a city, many villages and 2 whole starting zones without checking to see what the original backstory says!

    He 'forgot' about the previous history lore of the Draenei eh? Bullshit.

    But this is another convo entirely and it's been done to death so i won't say any more.

    But shit, considering his previous track record above; we WILL be seeing something this stupid again some time, i just hope not too soon...

    Euphoriac on
  • Undead ScottsmanUndead Scottsman Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    Euphoriac wrote: »
    Henroid wrote: »

    But yeah, they'd have to write in Garrosh suddenly having a change of heart and changing his ways. Which... now that I think about it, may be done because Christ Metzen is a putz.

    I still can't get my head around his excuse for the Draenei retcon.

    How can you design a race you know already has a history, tack stuff on, make a backstory, make models, a city, many villages and 2 whole starting zones without checking to see what the original backstory says!

    He 'forgot' about the previous history lore of the Draenei eh? Bullshit.

    But this is another convo entirely and it's been done to death so i won't say any more.

    But shit, considering his previous track record above; we WILL be seeing something this stupid again some time, i just hope not too soon...

    Actually it wasn't an issue with the Draenei lore (of which, the only major thing was that they were extinct, which got retconed by the time of the Frozen Throne anyway) it was an issue with the Eredar lore. (That they were evil long before they met Sargeras and Sargeras fell after meeting them and the Dreadlords, which got retconned into Sargeras showing up already evil and corrupting the otherwise good race.)

    'course I'm picking nits so small I need a microscope.

    Undead Scottsman on
  • StericaSterica Yes Registered User, Moderator mod
    edited August 2009
    Fyi, the pre-retcon story is STILL ON THE MAINSITE. The draenei are just sloppiness all around.

    Sterica on
    YL9WnCY.png
  • WassermeloneWassermelone Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    Euphoriac wrote: »
    Yes it's all a possibly, but none of the story advancements proffered in these last few pages makes sense. Thrall would never abandon the Horde and hand it over to a guy he CONSTANTLY has to reign in. It just wouldn't happen.

    I think you are mixing up people on this board's speculation, and the supposedly leaked info posted on MMO-Champion.

    Wassermelone on
  • I needed anime to post.I needed anime to post. boom Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    Euphoriac wrote: »
    Yes it's all a possibly, but none of the story advancements proffered in these last few pages makes sense. Thrall would never abandon the Horde and hand it over to a guy he CONSTANTLY has to reign in. It just wouldn't happen.

    I think you are mixing up people on this board's speculation, and the supposedly leaked info posted on MMO-Champion.

    They're one and the same now, actually.

    I needed anime to post. on
    liEt3nH.png
  • HenroidHenroid Mexican kicked from Immigration Thread Centrism is Racism :3Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    I just went to MMO Champion to see the post where they put up the SA thing. It's hilarious that they don't do anything to the text about how none of this is official, but they BOLD RED the spoiler part.

    Edit -
    Update - Another update from the Something Awful forums (which are sadly private). I cannot confirm this for the moment but the part about Cairne Bloodhoof does make a lot of sense.
    "I can't confirm my opinion of Cairne Bloodhoof's stuff making sense, but it does make sense!" WHAT

    Henroid on
  • StericaSterica Yes Registered User, Moderator mod
    edited August 2009
    Henroid wrote: »
    I just went to MMO Champion to see the post where they put up the SA thing. It's hilarious that they don't do anything to the text about how none of this is official, but they BOLD RED the spoiler part.

    Edit -
    Update - Another update from the Something Awful forums (which are sadly private). I cannot confirm this for the moment but the part about Cairne Bloodhoof does make a lot of sense.
    "I can't confirm my opinion of Cairne Bloodhoof's stuff making sense, but it does make sense!" WHAT
    Scroll down and you later read that Cairne's son has been removed from the game and another NPC has the quests he gave. This would make sense as the new leader of Thunderbluff wouldn't be sitting around in Bloodhoof village.

    You should read a tad more before blowing up on the dude.

    Sterica on
    YL9WnCY.png
  • HenroidHenroid Mexican kicked from Immigration Thread Centrism is Racism :3Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    The way he writes his posts is so bothersome to me.

    Henroid on
  • reVersereVerse Attack and Dethrone God Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    I bet you hate puppies, shoes and carrots, too.

    reVerse on
  • pollofacepolloface Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    Rorus Raz wrote: »
    Henroid wrote: »
    I just went to MMO Champion to see the post where they put up the SA thing. It's hilarious that they don't do anything to the text about how none of this is official, but they BOLD RED the spoiler part.

    Edit -
    Update - Another update from the Something Awful forums (which are sadly private). I cannot confirm this for the moment but the part about Cairne Bloodhoof does make a lot of sense.
    "I can't confirm my opinion of Cairne Bloodhoof's stuff making sense, but it does make sense!" WHAT
    Scroll down and you later read that Cairne's son has been removed from the game and another NPC has the quests he gave. This would make sense as the new leader of Thunderbluff wouldn't be sitting around in Bloodhoof village.

    You should read a tad more before blowing up on the dude.

    I read some of the end of this Harry Potter book and it said that Snape killed Dumbledore. Now why the heck would one of Dumbledores most trusted professors kill him, Im still on the book before this, so it doesnt make too much sense.

    Truthfully, lets just be nerds and let the thoughts of this cool shit brew in our heads till we find out the real stuff next week,

    polloface on
  • PoketpixiePoketpixie Siege Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    Euphoriac wrote: »
    Henroid wrote: »

    But yeah, they'd have to write in Garrosh suddenly having a change of heart and changing his ways. Which... now that I think about it, may be done because Christ Metzen is a putz.

    I still can't get my head around his excuse for the Draenei retcon.

    How can you design a race you know already has a history, tack stuff on, make a backstory, make models, a city, many villages and 2 whole starting zones without checking to see what the original backstory says!

    He 'forgot' about the previous history lore of the Draenei eh? Bullshit.

    But this is another convo entirely and it's been done to death so i won't say any more.

    But shit, considering his previous track record above; we WILL be seeing something this stupid again some time, i just hope not too soon...

    Actually it wasn't an issue with the Draenei lore (of which, the only major thing was that they were extinct, which got retconed by the time of the Frozen Throne anyway) it was an issue with the Eredar lore. (That they were evil long before they met Sargeras and Sargeras fell after meeting them and the Dreadlords, which got retconned into Sargeras showing up already evil and corrupting the otherwise good race.)

    'course I'm picking nits so small I need a microscope.


    Far as I'm concerned....Sargeras rewrote history. He can't have people thinking he's a wuss so in his version of events he corrupted the Eredar, not the other way around. Also as far as I'm concerned...the Draenei are a splinter faction of the Eredar who broke away from their evil cousins in order to follow the Light. Maybe the Naaru had a hand in it thinking they could be redeemed. The Eredar pursue them with a singular vengeance because no one leaves the family. No one.

    Those little raisin men wandering around the swamp of sorrows....who knows that kind of mutant hybrid failed experiment those are. Neither the Eredar nor the Draenei like to acknowledge these illegitimate bastard children.

    Poketpixie on
  • -SPI--SPI- Osaka, JapanRegistered User regular
    edited August 2009
    If this stuff turns out to be real the only part that would annoy me is having to reroll to take advantage of the new race class combinations.

    -SPI- on
  • Der Waffle MousDer Waffle Mous Blame this on the misfortune of your birth. New Yark, New Yark.Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    Wait.

    Wasn't one of the minor plot points in the Frozen Throne something about if Illidan succeeded in destroying Icecrown, it would do some horrific damage to the world?


    What if this is the end result of killing Arthas?

    Der Waffle Mous on
    Steam PSN: DerWaffleMous Origin: DerWaffleMous Bnet: DerWaffle#1682
  • HenroidHenroid Mexican kicked from Immigration Thread Centrism is Racism :3Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    reVerse wrote: »
    I bet you hate puppies, shoes and carrots, too.

    I actually don't like carrots a whole hell of a lot. Wanna fight about it?!

    Henroid on
  • Kai_SanKai_San Commonly known as Klineshrike! Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    I will admit, the thought of the old world not only completely changing due to a major event but the adding in tons of plot to leveling from 1 on kind of makes WoW sound exciting again. I am a character leveling nut anyway - i finally decided leveling things is the one thing about this game I love. Second to that is a decent story to go with it (and my definition of decent is lower than most, just as long as it is well presented) so if all this ends up being true I will be extremely happy.

    I just hope the classes get updated nearly as heavilly as they did for wrath - part of what brought me back for wrath was that most classes were updated so much it was a new experience. That would be the icing on the cake and I would be doing that shit from level 1 so hard and loving it.

    Kai_San on
  • HenroidHenroid Mexican kicked from Immigration Thread Centrism is Racism :3Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    Wait.

    Wasn't one of the minor plot points in the Frozen Throne something about if Illidan succeeded in destroying Icecrown, it would do some horrific damage to the world?


    What if this is the end result of killing Arthas?

    Illidan was trying to destroy the entire goddamn glacial cap, in order to destroy the Lich King (prior to him merging with Arthas).

    So unless Blizzard makes it so the only way Arthas can be destroyed is to destroy Ice Crown itself, that's not going to be happening. Sorry, your Cataclysm theory is dead.

    Henroid on
  • ArrathArrath Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    Wait.

    Wasn't one of the minor plot points in the Frozen Throne something about if Illidan succeeded in destroying Icecrown, it would do some horrific damage to the world?


    What if this is the end result of killing Arthas?

    ..That is actually a good question. I had forgotten about that.

    Edit: Oh well fine henroid, shit all over the ideas. :P

    Arrath on
  • PoketpixiePoketpixie Siege Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    -SPI- wrote: »
    If this stuff turns out to be real the only part that would annoy me is having to reroll to take advantage of the new race class combinations.

    Yep. I wish they'd let us revisit the character creation screen to change race/gender/face/skin tone, etc(I'd be ok with not changing class or faction). It'll never happen but it would be nice.

    Poketpixie on
  • Munkus BeaverMunkus Beaver You don't have to attend every argument you are invited to. Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPA regular
    edited August 2009
    I find it hilarious that the MMO champ guy is dropping the "I haven't been wrong before" card like it's going out of style (and it will soon when he's wrong).

    You see I'm actually Ghostcrawler.

    Munkus Beaver on
    Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
  • Der Waffle MousDer Waffle Mous Blame this on the misfortune of your birth. New Yark, New Yark.Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    Henroid wrote: »
    Wait.

    Wasn't one of the minor plot points in the Frozen Throne something about if Illidan succeeded in destroying Icecrown, it would do some horrific damage to the world?


    What if this is the end result of killing Arthas?

    Illidan was trying to destroy the entire goddamn glacial cap, in order to destroy the Lich King (prior to him merging with Arthas).

    So unless Blizzard makes it so the only way Arthas can be destroyed is to destroy Ice Crown itself, that's not going to be happening. Sorry, your Cataclysm theory is dead.
    This is Blizzard we're talking about here.

    Der Waffle Mous on
    Steam PSN: DerWaffleMous Origin: DerWaffleMous Bnet: DerWaffle#1682
  • Munkus BeaverMunkus Beaver You don't have to attend every argument you are invited to. Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPA regular
    edited August 2009
    You kill the lich king with a heating lamp and enough gigawatts to send you back to 1955

    Munkus Beaver on
    Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
  • BloodshedBloodshed I smoke my friends Down to the FilterRegistered User regular
    edited August 2009
    As much as I hated to add to this conversation, you really have to consider a second Cataclysm/Sundering as a possibility.

    One of the things many Lore-Nerds have worried about in WoW is the rapid approach to the "end" of the current, known Lore.

    A Cataclysm gives Blizz a great "reset" point to start creating new plot and story, a chance to revamp their virtual world, and essentially a way to keep people playing their game for another 5+ years.

    WoW makes an obscene amount of money from it's monthly subscriptions, I have a hard time believing they may let the game die, even with a theoretical WoW 2 on the board, that would hardly be a reason to stop creating content for WoW 1.

    Personally, it would take tearing Azeroth apart for me to go back to playing Vanilla WoW :winky:

    Bloodshed on
  • HenroidHenroid Mexican kicked from Immigration Thread Centrism is Racism :3Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    I find it hilarious that the MMO champ guy is dropping the "I haven't been wrong before" card like it's going out of style (and it will soon when he's wrong).

    You see I'm actually Ghostcrawler.

    I wonder how much Ghostcrawler was laughing when the MMOchamp guy was like, "Icecrown will have 31 bosses!"

    Henroid on
  • Munkus BeaverMunkus Beaver You don't have to attend every argument you are invited to. Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPA regular
    edited August 2009
    Henroid wrote: »
    I find it hilarious that the MMO champ guy is dropping the "I haven't been wrong before" card like it's going out of style (and it will soon when he's wrong).

    You see I'm actually Ghostcrawler.

    I wonder how much Ghostcrawler was laughing when the MMOchamp guy was like, "Icecrown will have 31 bosses!"

    "Apparently I was not ostentatious enough with my ridiculous number to make people believe I was joking."

    Munkus Beaver on
    Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
  • HenroidHenroid Mexican kicked from Immigration Thread Centrism is Racism :3Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    Bloodshed wrote: »
    As much as I hated to add to this conversation, you really have to consider a second Cataclysm/Sundering as a possibility.

    One of the things many Lore-Nerds have worried about in WoW is the rapid approach to the "end" of the current, known Lore.

    A Cataclysm gives Blizz a great "reset" point to start creating new plot and story, a chance to revamp their virtual world, and essentially a way to keep people playing their game for another 5+ years.

    WoW makes an obscene amount of money from it's monthly subscriptions, I have a hard time believing they may let the game die, even with a theoretical WoW 2 on the board, that would hardly be a reason to stop creating content for WoW 1.

    Personally, it would take tearing Azeroth apart for me to go back to playing Vanilla WoW :winky:

    Okay, but here's the thing - if you do a Cataclysm that changes the game, why not make WoW 2? The amount of changes to the entire game world would be too much. And you couldn't just change a zone here and there, or else it wouldn't be much of a Cataclysm (let alone second sundering). On top of changing the old world, they'd have to change Northrend as well.

    The amount of work that'd have to go into it would equate to making a new game.

    Now, perhaps they are using this as a lead-in to the next Warcraft, be it an RTS or MMO. And by that I mean that by the end of this Cataclysm expansion, a cataclysm does occur - thus ending World of Warcraft.

    That's the only way I see an event coming into the game as people apparently want.

    Henroid on
  • BloodshedBloodshed I smoke my friends Down to the FilterRegistered User regular
    edited August 2009
    Maybe the problem is the expectation that a next-gen WoW has to be...next-gen.
    They're killing all the competition with cartoon-like graphics because they have the best engine and mechanics in the business.

    Who says it WON'T be WoW 2, just minus the flashy new graphics? They said they wanted to make a new expansion every year.
    The graphics from Vanilla to WotLK are greatly improved, perhaps they'll continue on the same vent.

    It's all speculation anyways, amiright?

    Bloodshed on
  • Munkus BeaverMunkus Beaver You don't have to attend every argument you are invited to. Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPA regular
    edited August 2009
    It is not specualtion it is Dredd and Dredd is Law

    Munkus Beaver on
    Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
  • Minerva_SCMinerva_SC Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    Henroid wrote: »
    Bloodshed wrote: »
    As much as I hated to add to this conversation, you really have to consider a second Cataclysm/Sundering as a possibility.

    One of the things many Lore-Nerds have worried about in WoW is the rapid approach to the "end" of the current, known Lore.

    A Cataclysm gives Blizz a great "reset" point to start creating new plot and story, a chance to revamp their virtual world, and essentially a way to keep people playing their game for another 5+ years.

    WoW makes an obscene amount of money from it's monthly subscriptions, I have a hard time believing they may let the game die, even with a theoretical WoW 2 on the board, that would hardly be a reason to stop creating content for WoW 1.

    Personally, it would take tearing Azeroth apart for me to go back to playing Vanilla WoW :winky:

    Okay, but here's the thing - if you do a Cataclysm that changes the game, why not make WoW 2? The amount of changes to the entire game world would be too much. And you couldn't just change a zone here and there, or else it wouldn't be much of a Cataclysm (let alone second sundering). On top of changing the old world, they'd have to change Northrend as well.

    The amount of work that'd have to go into it would equate to making a new game.

    Now, perhaps they are using this as a lead-in to the next Warcraft, be it an RTS or MMO. And by that I mean that by the end of this Cataclysm expansion, a cataclysm does occur - thus ending World of Warcraft.

    That's the only way I see an event coming into the game as people apparently want.

    Because to make a new game blizzard would need to make new classes, not to mention a shit ton of new EVERYTHING, which, knowing blizzard, would take many many years. A new expansion is a much more reasonable solution.

    Minerva_SC on
    "If a cherry pie filled cape is wrong, I don't want to be right.
    I'm dead serious."
  • reVersereVerse Attack and Dethrone God Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    Henroid wrote: »
    why not make WoW 2?

    11 million active subscribers.

    reVerse on
  • HenroidHenroid Mexican kicked from Immigration Thread Centrism is Racism :3Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    I never said anything about next-gen necessarily. How do you change the current old-world content without fucking it up entirely for current old-world characters?

    If they wanted to, I guess they could introduce a shitton of phasing. But areas that have phasing enabled tend to be more of a drag on system resources.

    Henroid on
  • Munkus BeaverMunkus Beaver You don't have to attend every argument you are invited to. Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPA regular
    edited August 2009
    We already know that blizzard is working on a new next-gen MMO as we speak.

    I honestly don't think they plan on doing WoW 2.

    Munkus Beaver on
    Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
  • StericaSterica Yes Registered User, Moderator mod
    edited August 2009
    Point to me where Boubouille has specifically stated he has never been wrong before. He says full up that nothing posted is confirmed but that the sources have been reliable in the past. If the information is wrong, then his list of reliable sources is that much shorter.

    You two seem a tad bitter that he dare posts a bit of rumor-mongering.

    Sterica on
    YL9WnCY.png
  • BloodshedBloodshed I smoke my friends Down to the FilterRegistered User regular
    edited August 2009
    Henroid wrote: »
    I never said anything about next-gen necessarily. How do you change the current old-world content without fucking it up entirely for current old-world characters?

    If they wanted to, I guess they could introduce a shitton of phasing. But areas that have phasing enabled tend to be more of a drag on system resources.

    That's kind of the point, isn't it? Re-Vamp old area's....physically change the surface of Azeroth.

    Besides, consider the fucking badass Live Event they could have.....

    Bloodshed on
  • Munkus BeaverMunkus Beaver You don't have to attend every argument you are invited to. Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPA regular
    edited August 2009
    Rorus Raz wrote: »
    Point to me where Boubouille has specifically stated he has never been wrong before.

    When he 'confirmed' that the Worgen and Goblins were the new races in the expansion. You can go searching the dregs of that site for the specific post.

    Munkus Beaver on
    Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
  • HenroidHenroid Mexican kicked from Immigration Thread Centrism is Racism :3Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    Bloodshed wrote: »
    Henroid wrote: »
    I never said anything about next-gen necessarily. How do you change the current old-world content without fucking it up entirely for current old-world characters?

    If they wanted to, I guess they could introduce a shitton of phasing. But areas that have phasing enabled tend to be more of a drag on system resources.

    That's kind of the point, isn't it? Re-Vamp old area's....physically change the surface of Azeroth.

    Besides, consider the fucking badass Live Event they could have.....

    So you're in favor of them destroying already-existing content in the game which took them years to make?

    Henroid on
  • reVersereVerse Attack and Dethrone God Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    Henroid wrote: »
    Bloodshed wrote: »
    Henroid wrote: »
    I never said anything about next-gen necessarily. How do you change the current old-world content without fucking it up entirely for current old-world characters?

    If they wanted to, I guess they could introduce a shitton of phasing. But areas that have phasing enabled tend to be more of a drag on system resources.

    That's kind of the point, isn't it? Re-Vamp old area's....physically change the surface of Azeroth.

    Besides, consider the fucking badass Live Event they could have.....

    So you're in favor of them destroying already-existing content in the game which took them years to make?

    They're not destroying it, they're changing it.

    reVerse on
  • Der Waffle MousDer Waffle Mous Blame this on the misfortune of your birth. New Yark, New Yark.Registered User regular
    edited August 2009
    Henroid wrote: »
    Bloodshed wrote: »
    Henroid wrote: »
    I never said anything about next-gen necessarily. How do you change the current old-world content without fucking it up entirely for current old-world characters?

    If they wanted to, I guess they could introduce a shitton of phasing. But areas that have phasing enabled tend to be more of a drag on system resources.

    That's kind of the point, isn't it? Re-Vamp old area's....physically change the surface of Azeroth.

    Besides, consider the fucking badass Live Event they could have.....

    So you're in favor of them destroying already-existing content in the game which took them years to make?
    God forbid they revamp the content to be closer to the high-level stuff quality-wise.

    Der Waffle Mous on
    Steam PSN: DerWaffleMous Origin: DerWaffleMous Bnet: DerWaffle#1682
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