To be fair jailbreaking isn't necessarily pirating, since the government's stance is that it'll allow you to download stuff that hasn't been approved by Apple. And Apple's notoriously ham-handed when it comes to turning down apps.
Then again, jailbreaking also makes it easier to download stuff that has been approved by Apple without paying for it.
Yup. I just didn't want to write all that out 8-)
The majority of people who are jailbreaking their phones are going to pirate software, just like every other platform that has been broken.
Mmm, I think you could make a stronger case that people are jailbreaking for non-pirate reasons on the iPhone than on the consoles/handhelds, since there's loads of annoyance at AT&T and some people do want to use the phone internationally.
Then again I'm sure the majority of jailbreakers pick up some "free" stuff while they're at it.
cloudeagle, Jaffe seems to come out of that post looking better than you...
How? He's long since proven himself to be an ass, so the name isn't exactly unfair. Not to mention that veiled slam on his ex-wife.
Well, why'd you spend most of the post complaining about extra concepts he showed off that didn't even make it into a real game?
Because the extra concepts were lame and derivative. The Twisted Metal games have always skirted the line of apocalypse, and everyone takes "inspiration" from Grand Theft Auto.
cloudeagle, Jaffe seems to come out of that post looking better than you...
How? He's long since proven himself to be an ass, so the name isn't exactly unfair. Not to mention that veiled slam on his ex-wife.
Well, why'd you spend most of the post complaining about extra concepts he showed off that didn't even make it into a real game?
Because the extra concepts were lame and derivative. The Twisted Metal games have always skirted the line of apocalypse, and everyone takes "inspiration" from Grand Theft Auto.
What concepts don't sound 'lame and derivative' when you have to describe them in a couple of sentences? And why you felt the need to bring up GTA when he'd already mentioned Midnight Club (you know, an actual racing game), I'm not sure.
Nothing in that article apart from the very last line warranted any sort of snarky comment and even then, he was pretty obviously joking.
cloudeagle, Jaffe seems to come out of that post looking better than you...
How? He's long since proven himself to be an ass, so the name isn't exactly unfair. Not to mention that veiled slam on his ex-wife.
Well, why'd you spend most of the post complaining about extra concepts he showed off that didn't even make it into a real game?
Because the extra concepts were lame and derivative. The Twisted Metal games have always skirted the line of apocalypse, and everyone takes "inspiration" from Grand Theft Auto.
What concepts don't sound 'lame and derivative' when you have to describe them in a couple of sentences? And why you felt the need to bring up GTA when he'd already mentioned Midnight Club (you know, an actual racing game), I'm not sure.
Nothing in that article apart from the very last line warranted any sort of snarky comment and even then, he was pretty obviously joking.
And the fact that he's all excited about delving into the mommy issues of all the characters AGAIN after doing the same thing in the PS2 version isn't worthy of snark because...?
Also Midnight Club doesn't involve the Yakuza and other gangs near as I can tell. GTA does.
To be fair jailbreaking isn't necessarily pirating, since the government's stance is that it'll allow you to download stuff that hasn't been approved by Apple. And Apple's notoriously ham-handed when it comes to turning down apps.
Then again, jailbreaking also makes it easier to download stuff that has been approved by Apple without paying for it.
Yup. I just didn't want to write all that out 8-)
The majority of people who are jailbreaking their phones are going to pirate software, just like every other platform that has been broken.
The majority of people running a noncommercial Bittorrent client probably use it for piracy, but I don't think the government should make it illegal to install the clients, and I don't consider their failure to do so a stamp of approval for illegal file sharing.
The usual defense against this kind of thing is that it's ridiculous to make it illegal to have a P2P program, to jailbreak your phone, or anything else that isn't an actual act of piracy, when there are legitimate uses to be had.
Speaking of taking data and coming to silly conclusions:
Nintendo's facing "weak" hardware and software sales, but it's the contraction in DS software that's been the most severe, says Wedbush analyst Michael Pachter -- who concludes that the company will likely leverage the launch of the 3DS to drive software prices on its portable platform higher.
Like many industry-watchers, Pachter was impressed by the 3DS' E3 showing, calling it a "revolutionary" device, and predicting "Nintendo will be able to sell millions of units even at a price of upwards of $250."
He continues: "From a software perspective, we believe Nintendo will be able to increase DS software prices, from a blended average of around $25 today to over $29 next year."
NPD results have indicated that the new Wii Sports Resort bundle with MotionPlus that launched in May helped raise Wii sales for the first quarter 4 percent -- but this growth was offset by a 45 percent decline in DS hardware units.
As a result, Pachter lowered his quarterly estimate for Nintendo to 215 billion yen ($2.47 billion) versus the 259 billion yen ($3 billion) previously projected. As the year continues, current sales weakness and the continued "drag" of exchange rates currently unfavorable to the Japanese yen will continue to be a problem for Nintendo, he says.
However, the analyst notes that the anticipated strong launch of the 3DS in the fourth quarter of 2011 should present a better outlook for fiscal 2012. Nintendo's fiscal year ends March 31, and its first quarter closes June 30.
"Despite Q1 weakness, we believe the company will track about in-line with its FY:11 guidance for DS hardware (30 million units) and software (150 million units) and Wii hardware (18 million units) and software (165 million units)," Pachter concludes.
"Wii unit sales should continue [to] accelerate due to the new bundle and a solid release slate (Super Mario Galaxy 2 in Q1, Metroid: Other M in Q2), while DS sales should pick up once the 3DS is introduced (by fiscal end March 2011). "
He continues: "From a software perspective, we believe Nintendo will be able to increase DS software prices, from a blended average of around $25 today to over $29 next year."
Since when are DS games $25? Maybe Imaginz Babiez Partiez 4 or something... but non-shovelware stuff is $30-35 already....
cloudeagle, Jaffe seems to come out of that post looking better than you...
How? He's long since proven himself to be an ass, so the name isn't exactly unfair. Not to mention that veiled slam on his ex-wife.
Well, why'd you spend most of the post complaining about extra concepts he showed off that didn't even make it into a real game?
Because the extra concepts were lame and derivative. The Twisted Metal games have always skirted the line of apocalypse, and everyone takes "inspiration" from Grand Theft Auto.
So you're trying to get on him because of ideas he had that you don't like that he actually had enough sense to not put in the final game? You're pretty much angry because he had ideas, considered them, and then realized that they were probably as "lame and derivative" as you thought they were and scrapped them from the final product. I don't even like Jaffe, but you're digging deep for insults there man.
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YggiDeeThe World Ends With You ShillRegistered Userregular
edited July 2010
I'm usually paying 40+ for DS games, but I don't know if that's the Square-Enix tax, or if Canadian games automatically cost 10$ extra like all our books do
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Warlock82Never pet a burning dogRegistered Userregular
I'm usually paying 40+ for DS games, but I don't know if that's the Square-Enix tax, or if Canadian games automatically cost 10$ extra like all our books do
Square-Enix games are always about $5 more than any other DS game, but I *think* they stick around $35. I suppose the last one I bought was Kingdom Hearts which was awhile back, and it was on Amazon so it was already discounted off regular price (I seem to recall paying $32 for it, so yeah, probably $35).
Honestly, i just cant understand why people dont see the simple truth.
X Fanboy = Means fanboy can only afford X console, so those other consoles only produce sour grapes.
Sure, there are some games that look or play better on one console vs the other and at times in their shelf lives, they have ups and downs. Why are the fanboy's tolerated instead of just shouted down.
cloudeagle, Jaffe seems to come out of that post looking better than you...
How? He's long since proven himself to be an ass, so the name isn't exactly unfair. Not to mention that veiled slam on his ex-wife.
Well, why'd you spend most of the post complaining about extra concepts he showed off that didn't even make it into a real game?
Because the extra concepts were lame and derivative. The Twisted Metal games have always skirted the line of apocalypse, and everyone takes "inspiration" from Grand Theft Auto.
So you're trying to get on him because of ideas he had that you don't like that he actually had enough sense to not put in the final game? You're pretty much angry because he had ideas, considered them, and then realized that they were probably as "lame and derivative" as you thought they were and scrapped them from the final product. I don't even like Jaffe, but you're digging deep for insults there man.
Nah, I think GTA's okay, I just think that far too many people try a little too hard to glom on to that success. Besides, I prefer scrapped ideas that were kind of interesting on paper but didn't work in the implementation.
He continues: "From a software perspective, we believe Nintendo will be able to increase DS software prices, from a blended average of around $25 today to over $29 next year."
Since when are DS games $25? Maybe Imaginz Babiez Partiez 4 or something... but non-shovelware stuff is $30-35 already....
They're never $25. By "blended average" he means the average of software across all the software sold. There's tons of DS software that retails for $19.99. And enough rare instances of $14.99 MSRP ds games to offset any $39.99 DS games. Most DS games go for $29.99, although a few typically bigger games, or games aimed at the market of core gamers, go for $34.99.
But on average across games sold the average falls to around $25.
With the 3DS, Pachter is suggesting that this average will rise with 3DS games and he's probably right on this one.
He continues: "From a software perspective, we believe Nintendo will be able to increase DS software prices, from a blended average of around $25 today to over $29 next year."
Since when are DS games $25? Maybe Imaginz Babiez Partiez 4 or something... but non-shovelware stuff is $30-35 already....
They're never $25. By "blended average" he means the average of software across all the software sold. There's tons of DS software that retails for $19.99. And enough rare instances of $14.99 MSRP ds games to offset any $39.99 DS games. Most DS games go for $29.99, although a few typically bigger games, or games aimed at the market of core gamers, go for $34.99.
But on average across games sold the average falls to around $25.
With the 3DS, Pachter is suggesting that this average will rise with 3DS games and he's probably right on this one.
Yeah but it's a completely stupid thing to say. He's acting like Nintendo will consciously raise the price of all their handheld titles, but I don't see that as being true. Higher dev costs will surely lessen the amount of "budget games" which will of course drive that figure up, but I really don't see 3DS titles going above $35... Overall, what the hell does it matter to Nintendo if Ubisoft is releasing more expensive shovelware?
He continues: "From a software perspective, we believe Nintendo will be able to increase DS software prices, from a blended average of around $25 today to over $29 next year."
Since when are DS games $25? Maybe Imaginz Babiez Partiez 4 or something... but non-shovelware stuff is $30-35 already....
They're never $25. By "blended average" he means the average of software across all the software sold. There's tons of DS software that retails for $19.99. And enough rare instances of $14.99 MSRP ds games to offset any $39.99 DS games. Most DS games go for $29.99, although a few typically bigger games, or games aimed at the market of core gamers, go for $34.99.
But on average across games sold the average falls to around $25.
With the 3DS, Pachter is suggesting that this average will rise with 3DS games and he's probably right on this one.
Yeah but it's a completely stupid thing to say. He's acting like Nintendo will consciously raise the price of all their handheld titles, but I don't see that as being true. Higher dev costs will surely lessen the amount of "budget games" which will of course drive that figure up, but I really don't see 3DS titles going above $35... Overall, what the hell does it matter to Nintendo if Ubisoft is releasing more expensive shovelware?
Oh. I read it not as Nintendo is consciously raising it so much as it is something that will be able to occur for them by the fact that they're releasing a hot new hand-held console. The higher dev costs will stave off a lot of $19.99 and $14.99 for a while, for sure.
I'm not sure about how prices on games will be though. The production costs on these games have the potential to be as high as Wii games and arguably even higher, depending on how much developers and publishers end up feeling that it's necessary to spend to make games.
I must admit that I am nervous that with the "Gamecube with advanced rendering capabilities" level of hardware that the MSRP for most of the "better" games on the system are going to be $39.99 like they were standard for PSP games for a long while.
He continues: "From a software perspective, we believe Nintendo will be able to increase DS software prices, from a blended average of around $25 today to over $29 next year."
Since when are DS games $25? Maybe Imaginz Babiez Partiez 4 or something... but non-shovelware stuff is $30-35 already....
They're never $25. By "blended average" he means the average of software across all the software sold. There's tons of DS software that retails for $19.99. And enough rare instances of $14.99 MSRP ds games to offset any $39.99 DS games. Most DS games go for $29.99, although a few typically bigger games, or games aimed at the market of core gamers, go for $34.99.
But on average across games sold the average falls to around $25.
With the 3DS, Pachter is suggesting that this average will rise with 3DS games and he's probably right on this one.
Yeah but it's a completely stupid thing to say. He's acting like Nintendo will consciously raise the price of all their handheld titles, but I don't see that as being true. Higher dev costs will surely lessen the amount of "budget games" which will of course drive that figure up, but I really don't see 3DS titles going above $35... Overall, what the hell does it matter to Nintendo if Ubisoft is releasing more expensive shovelware?
Oh. I read it not as Nintendo is consciously raising it so much as it is something that will be able to occur for them by the fact that they're releasing a hot new hand-held console. The higher dev costs will stave off a lot of $19.99 and $14.99 for a while, for sure.
I'm not sure about how prices on games will be though. The production costs on these games have the potential to be as high as Wii games and arguably even higher, depending on how much developers and publishers end up feeling that it's necessary to spend to make games.
I must admit that I am nervous that with the "Gamecube with advanced rendering capabilities" level of hardware that the MSRP for most of the "better" games on the system are going to be $39.99 like they were standard for PSP games for a long while.
We'll have to see, but honestly I think a large reason Nintendo tries to stay a bit behind on the tech curve is to keep these costs down. Cheaper hardware/components, better tools available, etc etc. I could *maybe* see companies (*cough*Square-Enix*cough*) going as high as $40, but I'm guessing prices will hover around $30-35, perhaps closer to $35 this time around. It gets to a point where you are outpricing console games, and consumers start asking "why am I paying this much for a handheld title?"
Edge is reporting that things are looking up over at Sony, with the company preparing to announce solid first-quarter earnings:
Quote:
As a result of aggressive cost-cutting Sony will likely post a company-wide operating profit of 30 billion yen ($342 million) for the three month period ended June 30, compared with a 25.7 billion yen loss a year earlier, according to Nikkei (via AGP).
The report also suggests that Sony’s PlayStation division swung to a quarterly profit following significant first quarter and annual losses last year.
It gets to a point where you are outpricing console games, and consumers start asking "why am I paying this much for a handheld title?"
I hate this so much. When a handheld game is as graphically intensive and as much a full experience as a console game, why shouldn't it cost the same? Devs have to spend almost the same amount to make those games. The fact that it's portable is just another plus over the console for many people.
Really we've just got a good thing going here, paying less for DS games, and of course we don't want to lose that.
It gets to a point where you are outpricing console games, and consumers start asking "why am I paying this much for a handheld title?"
I hate this so much. When a handheld game is as graphically intensive and as much a full experience as a console game, why shouldn't it cost the same? Devs have to spend almost the same amount to make those games. The fact that it's portable is just another plus over the console for many people.
Really we've just got a good thing going here, paying less for DS games, and of course we don't want to lose that.
But it's the truth. There is a perception there that will kill sales if you try to defy it.
There is something to be said for playing the game in HD on a 50" Plasma though :P
It gets to a point where you are outpricing console games, and consumers start asking "why am I paying this much for a handheld title?"
I hate this so much. When a handheld game is as graphically intensive and as much a full experience as a console game, why shouldn't it cost the same? Devs have to spend almost the same amount to make those games. The fact that it's portable is just another plus over the console for many people.
Really we've just got a good thing going here, paying less for DS games, and of course we don't want to lose that.
But it's the truth. There is a perception there that will kill sales if you try to defy it.
There is something to be said for playing the game in HD on a 50" Plasma though :P
And then the price increase happens and everybody who'd buy it, buys it anyway. We're talking about a five or ten dollar increase on a thirty dollar price point. Not suddenly upping the price to sixty and claiming 'loldevcosts!'
It gets to a point where you are outpricing console games, and consumers start asking "why am I paying this much for a handheld title?"
I hate this so much. When a handheld game is as graphically intensive and as much a full experience as a console game, why shouldn't it cost the same? Devs have to spend almost the same amount to make those games. The fact that it's portable is just another plus over the console for many people.
Really we've just got a good thing going here, paying less for DS games, and of course we don't want to lose that.
But it's the truth. There is a perception there that will kill sales if you try to defy it.
There is something to be said for playing the game in HD on a 50" Plasma though :P
Will it, though? Has it been tried?
I know MGS3DS won't be ready for launch, but if it was a launch game and they charged $50, it would sell extremely well and would set a precedent for the rest of the generation.
It gets to a point where you are outpricing console games, and consumers start asking "why am I paying this much for a handheld title?"
I hate this so much. When a handheld game is as graphically intensive and as much a full experience as a console game, why shouldn't it cost the same? Devs have to spend almost the same amount to make those games. The fact that it's portable is just another plus over the console for many people.
Really we've just got a good thing going here, paying less for DS games, and of course we don't want to lose that.
But it's the truth. There is a perception there that will kill sales if you try to defy it.
Pretty much. It's consumer perception and regardless of the actual developer cost or production value, it's going to be perceived as something that isn't "worth" as much as a console title.
And then the price increase happens and everybody who'd buy it, buys it anyway. We're talking about a five or ten dollar increase on a thirty dollar price point. Not suddenly upping the price to sixty and claiming 'loldevcosts!'
Well, yeah, if price increases are gradual then they're more likely to be accepted.
It gets to a point where you are outpricing console games, and consumers start asking "why am I paying this much for a handheld title?"
I hate this so much. When a handheld game is as graphically intensive and as much a full experience as a console game, why shouldn't it cost the same? Devs have to spend almost the same amount to make those games. The fact that it's portable is just another plus over the console for many people.
Really we've just got a good thing going here, paying less for DS games, and of course we don't want to lose that.
But it's the truth. There is a perception there that will kill sales if you try to defy it.
There is something to be said for playing the game in HD on a 50" Plasma though :P
And then the price increase happens and everybody who'd buy it, buys it anyway. We're talking about a five or ten dollar increase on a thirty dollar price point. Not suddenly upping the price to sixty and claiming 'loldevcosts!'
I'm just saying, people are fickle. Yes, *you* would buy it. Random soccer mom looking for birthday presents for her 10 year old might not want to pay that much though. You have to remember, at least half of the consumers of this stuff are completely ignorant of what they're buying. (edit: you know, the people who keep Ubisoft's shovelware department in business)
Why is fifty percent of all defensive positions couched in terms of 'Soccer moms not understanding what they're buying'?
First of all, she could balk at $30 anyway. Second, by this point, even she'd have to realise that the price for buying shit goes up eventually. And third, she's too busy pirating to R4 chips anyway.
It gets to a point where you are outpricing console games, and consumers start asking "why am I paying this much for a handheld title?"
I hate this so much. When a handheld game is as graphically intensive and as much a full experience as a console game, why shouldn't it cost the same? Devs have to spend almost the same amount to make those games.
What handheld do you play on? I sure want one of those!
Whether or not DS (or even PSP or 3DS games) are as long as a full-priced console game, they are neither as "graphically intensive" or as large a time investment as those.
A "full-experience" doesn't cost a specific dollar amount. What does cost specific dollars is the size of teams, how close to the cutting edge the graphics are, and the length of time spent in development. On all these fronts, titles for any current handheld system simply don't match those on the consoles. It's not a mark of shame, just a matter of fact.
EDIT: and a five to ten dollar increase on a 30 dollar price point is incredibly similar to the "dev cost tax" that made current-gen games cost 60 dollars. It's probably safe to assume that the reason console devs are suddenly so concerned about the used market and are convinced that every title must be a AAA blockbuster is because even though it was only a ten dollar jump, a lot of consumers considered 50 a psychological barrier and have been opting to buy used ever since. They might spring the 60 for those AAA blockbusters, but anything that falls even a little short of that mark sees significantly less sales because, hey, 60 dollars.
Soccer moms are easy to pick on. They like soccer (also they are obnoxious)
And Soccer's unamerican for some reason!
Seriously, [strike]Howard the Republican[/strike] Mallard Fillmore made fun of it for a week straight shortly after the World Cup ended. Only godless hippies are allowed to like it.
What handheld do you play on? I sure want one of those!
Whether or not DS (or even PSP or 3DS games) are as long as a full-priced console game, they are neither as "graphically intensive" or as large a time investment as those.
Developmentally intensive is enough, then.
PSP and DS games still take as much effort to create. Textures at half the resolution does not equate with half the time spend making them. Hell, a bunch of Square Enix games on the handhelds have had multi-year dev cycles, more than most games. While it's a form of MIDI, some DS games have four times as many music tracks as console games, and somebody has to compose that. Same for storylines, gameplay and level design.
Mainly I was referring to the 3DS which for all intents and purposes is the same as developing for a modern console. Ok, so they don't have to pay the one guy who does the bloom lighting. That doesn't make the game worth half as much.
Effort, maybe, but budget and team size are going to be miniscule for the average DS or PSP game as compared to the average console game, especially if you're talking 360/PS3.
The PSP and DS don't require as many assets to be built, nor do they require as much detail in the assets. The devkits are smaller and reportedly pretty easy to work with.
Now, the PSP and DS have some games that probably cost more and took longer to develop than some Wii games, some PS2 games, yes. Dragon Quest IX probably took a hell of a lot more resources and time to make than, say, Trauma Team on the Wii. (incidentally both of these games had the same MSRP at retail -- $39.99)
But typically handhelds require much lower resources, budgets, and time to make than console games.
Now the 3DS is probably about on par in terms of what you can do with it as compared to the Wii. It probably pushes a few less polygons or about the same, but it also seems to support more post processing and what have you effects. So in theory you could probably throw a ton of money and dev time into it as you would a great big triple A wii console game.
But I doubt most developers will do that, because it's impractical unless you've got a guaranteed hit on your hands. Some devs/pubs will push it to console degrees of budget and dev resources but most won't.
So the question is where will everyone fall? How much will they necessarily have to increase resources, and how much will they be able to hold back? It's got to be more than the NDS, and theoretically it has to max out at somewhere around Wii level. So somewhere in the middle then, but where, we don't know yet.
So Steam via VAC (Valve anti cheat or something) accidentally banned 12,000 user accounts from playing Modern Warfare 2 over the past couple of weeks.
So what does Valve do? They decide to be an awesome company.
Gabe Newell sent an email to everyone affected, unbanned their accounts, then gave them a free copy of Left 4 Dead 2, as well as a free gift code to give the game to a friend.
I'm impressed.
If this were Ubisoft or Apple or Activision or something, the response would have likely been the respective officer of the company making a press statement that only some small x percent of people were affected and that the problem had been resolved thank you for your patience okthxbai.
The way Valve did it, gets them more loyal customers, spreads positive articles across every gaming website, and gets everyone on the internet to spread the word about how great a thing that was to do and how great a company Valve is; admit the mistake, apologize, fix the screw up, then give away a free game plus a gift.
If they had followed the latter strategy, the result would have been a bunch of sour and pissed off people talking about how busted their thing is. Whether it's Uplay or the Iphone4 or Guitar Hero in mono sound.
I hate to say it, but having played the beta, I have no interest in SC2 =(
I'm probably the minority though. It'll sell a ton.
SC2 disinterest ^5!
But seriously, aside from people on this board, I don't really know anybody waiting for SC2. I would think that to be odd except the original came out over ten years ago. Regardless, it would require an incredible negative miracle for SC2 to sell anything less than 80,000 metric buttloads.
Also, slick move on Valve's part. I bet most other devs just hate Valve for being intentionally awesome instead of trying to rape consumers for every red cent.
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How? He's long since proven himself to be an ass, so the name isn't exactly unfair. Not to mention that veiled slam on his ex-wife.
Mmm, I think you could make a stronger case that people are jailbreaking for non-pirate reasons on the iPhone than on the consoles/handhelds, since there's loads of annoyance at AT&T and some people do want to use the phone internationally.
Then again I'm sure the majority of jailbreakers pick up some "free" stuff while they're at it.
Well, why'd you spend most of the post complaining about extra concepts he showed off that didn't even make it into a real game?
Because the extra concepts were lame and derivative. The Twisted Metal games have always skirted the line of apocalypse, and everyone takes "inspiration" from Grand Theft Auto.
What concepts don't sound 'lame and derivative' when you have to describe them in a couple of sentences? And why you felt the need to bring up GTA when he'd already mentioned Midnight Club (you know, an actual racing game), I'm not sure.
Nothing in that article apart from the very last line warranted any sort of snarky comment and even then, he was pretty obviously joking.
And the fact that he's all excited about delving into the mommy issues of all the characters AGAIN after doing the same thing in the PS2 version isn't worthy of snark because...?
Also Midnight Club doesn't involve the Yakuza and other gangs near as I can tell. GTA does.
The majority of people running a noncommercial Bittorrent client probably use it for piracy, but I don't think the government should make it illegal to install the clients, and I don't consider their failure to do so a stamp of approval for illegal file sharing.
The usual defense against this kind of thing is that it's ridiculous to make it illegal to have a P2P program, to jailbreak your phone, or anything else that isn't an actual act of piracy, when there are legitimate uses to be had.
http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/29586/Analyst_3DS_Launch_Could_Lead_To_Higher_Software_Prices.php
Since when are DS games $25? Maybe Imaginz Babiez Partiez 4 or something... but non-shovelware stuff is $30-35 already....
Square-Enix games are always about $5 more than any other DS game, but I *think* they stick around $35. I suppose the last one I bought was Kingdom Hearts which was awhile back, and it was on Amazon so it was already discounted off regular price (I seem to recall paying $32 for it, so yeah, probably $35).
X Fanboy = Means fanboy can only afford X console, so those other consoles only produce sour grapes.
Sure, there are some games that look or play better on one console vs the other and at times in their shelf lives, they have ups and downs. Why are the fanboy's tolerated instead of just shouted down.
Nah, I think GTA's okay, I just think that far too many people try a little too hard to glom on to that success. Besides, I prefer scrapped ideas that were kind of interesting on paper but didn't work in the implementation.
They're never $25. By "blended average" he means the average of software across all the software sold. There's tons of DS software that retails for $19.99. And enough rare instances of $14.99 MSRP ds games to offset any $39.99 DS games. Most DS games go for $29.99, although a few typically bigger games, or games aimed at the market of core gamers, go for $34.99.
But on average across games sold the average falls to around $25.
With the 3DS, Pachter is suggesting that this average will rise with 3DS games and he's probably right on this one.
Steam ID: slashx000______Twitter: @bill_at_zeboyd______ Facebook: Zeboyd Games
Yeah but it's a completely stupid thing to say. He's acting like Nintendo will consciously raise the price of all their handheld titles, but I don't see that as being true. Higher dev costs will surely lessen the amount of "budget games" which will of course drive that figure up, but I really don't see 3DS titles going above $35... Overall, what the hell does it matter to Nintendo if Ubisoft is releasing more expensive shovelware?
Oh. I read it not as Nintendo is consciously raising it so much as it is something that will be able to occur for them by the fact that they're releasing a hot new hand-held console. The higher dev costs will stave off a lot of $19.99 and $14.99 for a while, for sure.
I'm not sure about how prices on games will be though. The production costs on these games have the potential to be as high as Wii games and arguably even higher, depending on how much developers and publishers end up feeling that it's necessary to spend to make games.
I must admit that I am nervous that with the "Gamecube with advanced rendering capabilities" level of hardware that the MSRP for most of the "better" games on the system are going to be $39.99 like they were standard for PSP games for a long while.
Steam ID: slashx000______Twitter: @bill_at_zeboyd______ Facebook: Zeboyd Games
We'll have to see, but honestly I think a large reason Nintendo tries to stay a bit behind on the tech curve is to keep these costs down. Cheaper hardware/components, better tools available, etc etc. I could *maybe* see companies (*cough*Square-Enix*cough*) going as high as $40, but I'm guessing prices will hover around $30-35, perhaps closer to $35 this time around. It gets to a point where you are outpricing console games, and consumers start asking "why am I paying this much for a handheld title?"
http://www.next-gen.biz/news/playstation-biz-swings-to-q1-profit-%E2%80%93-report
I hate this so much. When a handheld game is as graphically intensive and as much a full experience as a console game, why shouldn't it cost the same? Devs have to spend almost the same amount to make those games. The fact that it's portable is just another plus over the console for many people.
Really we've just got a good thing going here, paying less for DS games, and of course we don't want to lose that.
But it's the truth. There is a perception there that will kill sales if you try to defy it.
There is something to be said for playing the game in HD on a 50" Plasma though :P
And then the price increase happens and everybody who'd buy it, buys it anyway. We're talking about a five or ten dollar increase on a thirty dollar price point. Not suddenly upping the price to sixty and claiming 'loldevcosts!'
Will it, though? Has it been tried?
I know MGS3DS won't be ready for launch, but if it was a launch game and they charged $50, it would sell extremely well and would set a precedent for the rest of the generation.
Pretty much. It's consumer perception and regardless of the actual developer cost or production value, it's going to be perceived as something that isn't "worth" as much as a console title.
Well, yeah, if price increases are gradual then they're more likely to be accepted.
Steam ID: slashx000______Twitter: @bill_at_zeboyd______ Facebook: Zeboyd Games
I'm just saying, people are fickle. Yes, *you* would buy it. Random soccer mom looking for birthday presents for her 10 year old might not want to pay that much though. You have to remember, at least half of the consumers of this stuff are completely ignorant of what they're buying. (edit: you know, the people who keep Ubisoft's shovelware department in business)
First of all, she could balk at $30 anyway. Second, by this point, even she'd have to realise that the price for buying shit goes up eventually. And third, she's too busy pirating to R4 chips anyway.
What handheld do you play on? I sure want one of those!
Whether or not DS (or even PSP or 3DS games) are as long as a full-priced console game, they are neither as "graphically intensive" or as large a time investment as those.
A "full-experience" doesn't cost a specific dollar amount. What does cost specific dollars is the size of teams, how close to the cutting edge the graphics are, and the length of time spent in development. On all these fronts, titles for any current handheld system simply don't match those on the consoles. It's not a mark of shame, just a matter of fact.
EDIT: and a five to ten dollar increase on a 30 dollar price point is incredibly similar to the "dev cost tax" that made current-gen games cost 60 dollars. It's probably safe to assume that the reason console devs are suddenly so concerned about the used market and are convinced that every title must be a AAA blockbuster is because even though it was only a ten dollar jump, a lot of consumers considered 50 a psychological barrier and have been opting to buy used ever since. They might spring the 60 for those AAA blockbusters, but anything that falls even a little short of that mark sees significantly less sales because, hey, 60 dollars.
And Soccer's unamerican for some reason!
Seriously, [strike]Howard the Republican[/strike] Mallard Fillmore made fun of it for a week straight shortly after the World Cup ended. Only godless hippies are allowed to like it.
Developmentally intensive is enough, then.
PSP and DS games still take as much effort to create. Textures at half the resolution does not equate with half the time spend making them. Hell, a bunch of Square Enix games on the handhelds have had multi-year dev cycles, more than most games. While it's a form of MIDI, some DS games have four times as many music tracks as console games, and somebody has to compose that. Same for storylines, gameplay and level design.
Mainly I was referring to the 3DS which for all intents and purposes is the same as developing for a modern console. Ok, so they don't have to pay the one guy who does the bloom lighting. That doesn't make the game worth half as much.
The PSP and DS don't require as many assets to be built, nor do they require as much detail in the assets. The devkits are smaller and reportedly pretty easy to work with.
Now, the PSP and DS have some games that probably cost more and took longer to develop than some Wii games, some PS2 games, yes. Dragon Quest IX probably took a hell of a lot more resources and time to make than, say, Trauma Team on the Wii. (incidentally both of these games had the same MSRP at retail -- $39.99)
But typically handhelds require much lower resources, budgets, and time to make than console games.
Now the 3DS is probably about on par in terms of what you can do with it as compared to the Wii. It probably pushes a few less polygons or about the same, but it also seems to support more post processing and what have you effects. So in theory you could probably throw a ton of money and dev time into it as you would a great big triple A wii console game.
But I doubt most developers will do that, because it's impractical unless you've got a guaranteed hit on your hands. Some devs/pubs will push it to console degrees of budget and dev resources but most won't.
So the question is where will everyone fall? How much will they necessarily have to increase resources, and how much will they be able to hold back? It's got to be more than the NDS, and theoretically it has to max out at somewhere around Wii level. So somewhere in the middle then, but where, we don't know yet.
Steam ID: slashx000______Twitter: @bill_at_zeboyd______ Facebook: Zeboyd Games
So what does Valve do? They decide to be an awesome company.
Gabe Newell sent an email to everyone affected, unbanned their accounts, then gave them a free copy of Left 4 Dead 2, as well as a free gift code to give the game to a friend.
I'm impressed.
If this were Ubisoft or Apple or Activision or something, the response would have likely been the respective officer of the company making a press statement that only some small x percent of people were affected and that the problem had been resolved thank you for your patience okthxbai.
The way Valve did it, gets them more loyal customers, spreads positive articles across every gaming website, and gets everyone on the internet to spread the word about how great a thing that was to do and how great a company Valve is; admit the mistake, apologize, fix the screw up, then give away a free game plus a gift.
If they had followed the latter strategy, the result would have been a bunch of sour and pissed off people talking about how busted their thing is. Whether it's Uplay or the Iphone4 or Guitar Hero in mono sound.
Steam ID: slashx000______Twitter: @bill_at_zeboyd______ Facebook: Zeboyd Games
I knew this was gonna pop up! :x
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a bajillion?
I'm probably the minority though. It'll sell a ton.
Therefore, Valve is the devul.
Some Koreans will die, I'll wager.
SC2 disinterest ^5!
But seriously, aside from people on this board, I don't really know anybody waiting for SC2. I would think that to be odd except the original came out over ten years ago. Regardless, it would require an incredible negative miracle for SC2 to sell anything less than 80,000 metric buttloads.
Also, slick move on Valve's part. I bet most other devs just hate Valve for being intentionally awesome instead of trying to rape consumers for every red cent.
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