Seriously why does this game (technically a series now I guess) have such a hard time making sales? The original was a better zelda game than the same generation zelda game!
Aside from the issue of brand (Okami was a totally new IP and is frankly alien-looking compared to most of the stuff on the market), I'd argue that it's not really enough like Zelda in the areas that make a lot of people buy Zelda.
1) Story. Okami's is well-written and charming, but extensive. You can be sitting there for minutes at a time doing nothing but advancing text. I think a lot of the charm of the Zelda series is that most of the time you're just doing things - conversations are brief affairs designed to point you in the right direction, and cutscenes are rare visual treats at major turning points.
2) Level design. Zelda's dungeons feel like expertly-crafted puzzles - very little space is wasted, and most are very visually distinct from each other. I loved how Okami blended the dungeons more organically with the overworld, but there never felt like there was much variation - whether you were underwater, in a forest cave or in the spirit realm, it was all a beautiful melange of parts that left behind very few distinctive memories.
3) Combat. Okami's combat segements last far longer than Zelda's, are segregated from the environment, and ended up just feeling like a chore after the first few hours. It just felt exhausting, and I noticed that most of things people enjoy about Zelda don't place a heavy emphasis on the combat - keeping it simple and relatively infrequent broadens the appeal.
4) Inventory options. Okami has a metric ton of collectables, weapons and upgrades to keep track of. Again, I love the constant stream of new stuff that you get (and the game really needs it given the length), but I think a large amount of Zelda's appeal stems from keeping it as pared-down as possible. Few items, with many possibilities. An upgraded sword is just that, rather than one of 4 different classes of weapon that can be equipped in two different modes.
I can easily see that a massive fan of one game may well dislike the other, although that just accounts for a potential lack of overlap between fanbases. I have no idea why 'Zelda except that it's for the most popular console in the world and twice the length' didn't appeal as much as it should have.
Seriously why does this game (technically a series now I guess) have such a hard time making sales? The original was a better zelda game than the same generation zelda game!
Aside from the issue of brand (Okami was a totally new IP and is frankly alien-looking compared to most of the stuff on the market), I'd argue that it's not really enough like Zelda in the areas that make a lot of people buy Zelda.
1) Story. Okami's is well-written and charming, but extensive. You can be sitting there for minutes at a time doing nothing but advancing text. I think a lot of the charm of the Zelda series is that most of the time you're just doing things - conversations are brief affairs designed to point you in the right direction, and cutscenes are rare visual treats at major turning points.
2) Level design. Zelda's dungeons feel like expertly-crafted puzzles - very little space is wasted, and most are very visually distinct from each other. I loved how Okami blended the dungeons more organically with the overworld, but there never felt like there was much variation - whether you were underwater, in a forest cave or in the spirit realm, it was all a beautiful melange of parts that left behind very few distinctive memories.
3) Combat. Okami's combat segements last far longer than Zelda's, are segregated from the environment, and ended up just feeling like a chore after the first few hours. It just felt exhausting, and I noticed that most of things people enjoy about Zelda don't place a heavy emphasis on the combat - keeping it simple and relatively infrequent broadens the appeal.
4) Inventory options. Okami has a metric ton of collectables, weapons and upgrades to keep track of. Again, I love the constant stream of new stuff that you get (and the game really needs it given the length), but I think a large amount of Zelda's appeal stems from keeping it as pared-down as possible. Few items, with many possibilities. An upgraded sword is just that, rather than one of 4 different classes of weapon that can be equipped in two different modes.
I can easily see that a massive fan of one game may well dislike the other, although that just accounts for a potential lack of overlap between fanbases. I have no idea why 'Zelda except that it's for the most popular console in the world and twice the length' didn't appeal as much as it should have.
This is pretty accurate. It's what I was thinking but I didn't know if I could articulate it. But yeah, it's only a "better" Zelda game if you really liked the things it did differently...and for quite a few people, it didn't offer universal improvements.
True, but half the time when I use sleep on my DS or PSP the game either heads back to the title screen or just freezes up and I'm not the only one that happens to judging from the threads I bitch about that on GameFAQs. Consoles can pause for hours because they're plugged in but, yeah, I would like save anywhere in every game.
Seriously? Half the time. Because the DS line has frozen up on me maybe 3 times in all the years I've had it, and it's never been related to sleep mode, it's poorly programmed games.
There's also the fact that the 'take a heavily corrupted world and make it all pretty' aspect has now been done better by De Blob, especially the sequel.
There's also the fact that the 'take a heavily corrupted world and make it all pretty' aspect has now been done better by De Blob, especially the sequel.
There's also the fact that the 'take a heavily corrupted world and make it all pretty' aspect has now been done better by De Blob, especially the sequel.
This is insanity.
This is...memetic?
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FencingsaxIt is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understandingGNU Terry PratchettRegistered Userregular
edited March 2011
What's wrong with your DSs? I always just close my DS and it's fine.
Yeah, I've never had a problem with mine. Well, except when I foolishly ejected the cartridge while it was asleep. No, putting it back in before you open it will not fix it.
I haven't had any trouble with the PSP either. I never shut down the PSP while playing through the game because of how long it takes to boot up. So that's hundreds of sleeps without a single issue.
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There's also the fact that the 'take a heavily corrupted world and make it all pretty' aspect has now been done better by De Blob, especially the sequel.
Speaking of that, how's that aspect in Okamiden?
Like the previous game it's not really a mechanic just an effect of meeting your goals. All it does is allow you to move to new areas.
King Riptor on
I have a podcast now. It's about video games and anime!Find it here.
There's also the fact that the 'take a heavily corrupted world and make it all pretty' aspect has now been done better by De Blob, especially the sequel.
Speaking of that, how's that aspect in Okamiden?
Like the previous game it's not really a mechanic just an effect of meeting your goals. All it does is allow you to move to new areas.
Kind of disappointing, what I really wanted to do in the original was to slowly tear the land from the grasp of evil. As nifty as the sudden waves of purification were, they didn't quite feel visceral enough.
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AJRSome guy who wrestlesNorwichRegistered Userregular
There's also the fact that the 'take a heavily corrupted world and make it all pretty' aspect has now been done better by De Blob, especially the sequel.
I’ve only played bits and pieces of De Blob and Okami, but I have a hard time seeing how De Blob made making the world prettier more enjoyable or interesting. The hour or so I spent with De Blob was honestly kind of boring and I didn’t really get much out of improving the world. Okami, from what I played, was fairly satisfying. I take it that De Blob 2 is a huge improvement over the original?
There's also the fact that the 'take a heavily corrupted world and make it all pretty' aspect has now been done better by De Blob, especially the sequel.
I’ve only played bits and pieces of De Blob and Okami, but I have a hard time seeing how De Blob made making the world prettier more enjoyable or interesting. The hour or so I spent with De Blob was honestly kind of boring and I didn’t really get much out of improving the world. Okami, from what I played, was fairly satisfying. I take it that De Blob 2 is a huge improvement over the original?
Yes and no. The sequel does do a better job of changing the environment as you paint things, rather than just applying a coat of paint over buildings and occasionally altering landmarks. Painting blocks of buildings or completing objectives can often remove patches of ink or other nearby obstacles, and areas can often end up almost completely unrecognizable once you're through with them. There's also a nifty effect where the majority of the terrain itself is colorless until you move over it a bunch, although there's no reward for doing so beyond having less white in the world.
If the original game bored you, though, you probably won't like the sequel any better.
Picked up Okamiden yesterday and played it for an hour today. I feel like it's missing some of the charm of the first game but it tries its hardest to make it up with its own kind of charm. It's a bit more puzzle-ish as well. I miss filling in things over tracing them though.
All in all I'm satisfied with it so far. Probably play through more later.
There's also the fact that the 'take a heavily corrupted world and make it all pretty' aspect has now been done better by De Blob, especially the sequel.
Speaking of that, how's that aspect in Okamiden?
Like the previous game it's not really a mechanic just an effect of meeting your goals. All it does is allow you to move to new areas.
Kind of disappointing, what I really wanted to do in the original was to slowly tear the land from the grasp of evil. As nifty as the sudden waves of purification were, they didn't quite feel visceral enough.
Opposite for me, got choked up every time I released more of the world and felt elated to have a new piece of world to run around in and explore.
I picked this up on a whim, because even though the Nintendo Channel demo was too short to really give much of a taste of the game, it grew on me after playing it a couple of times. Not only does the game take a while to get going, but you only get one save slot. I really wish they'd given you at least two, in case you ever wanted to replay the game without nuking your old save.
It's still adorable, though. i love the graphical style.
I'm pretty sure there is New Game+ like the original.
I cant help but smile when playing this game. I realized that you can bloom more than one thing at a time which is great. Still tons of stuff to collect though.
Just played an hour or so through intro stuff, but thus far it's just like Okami but with a bit of streamlining, the graphics shrunk down and the cute cranked up.
This nine month thing. Will the fact that the age (or even existance) of the child partner entirely fails to fit in with this clearly stated time since the last game, be explained, or is it just airbrushed over? It's kinda bugging me.
This nine month thing. Will the fact that the age (or even existance) of the child partner entirely fails to fit in with this clearly stated time since the last game, be explained, or is it just airbrushed over? It's kinda bugging me.
One thing that annoyed me about Okami was the repeating of bosses. Also, there I there was a repeat of that dragon as well at the end. Aside from that, it was great.
Want that puppy plush.
Still waiting for a HD re-release of Okami on PS3...
Siliconera: I'm sure you know this, but a lot of Okami fans want an Okami game in HD. Motohide Eshiro: Yeah, I’ve heard requests like that way before even. Our goal with this game is to make an Okami game you can bring with you and play at any time. The whole point of being on a portable system is you can have Okamiden whenever you want it. That’s why we decided to put it on Nintendo DS.
As far as a HD version goes, I understand why Okami fans would want such a graphic improvement over the original. I wouldn’t rule anything out. After this game comes out, if the response is good and people still want an HD Okami it will be something I definitely consider.
For now, I hope Okami fans and fans who want Okami HD will try out Okamiden and enjoy it for what it is, a portable Okami experience. Then maybe later down the line we can talk about something HD.
Translation: Want Okami HD? Buy Okamiden. Lots and lots of copies of Okamiden. -source-
Same thing was said for Okami Wii and Klonoa Wii. They both sold like pants.
Okami wii was a criminal act and all involved should be hung.
Fuck that Tree dance.
That I enjoy the series in spite of that god awful port is a testament to it's charm and humor.
So far the sequel isn't better and its' definitely not Portable friendly( it's got I think 30 minutes of cutscenes before you even meet your first partner and you still use the mirrors to save not a pick up and play title) but as a proper sequel it is so far acceptable.
Never played the PS2 version, what was so wrong with the wii port?
Really, I would not want on Okami HD remake. Just make another entry in the series and make that HD. An Okami in modern times would be interesting. You could have all the ancient demons and spirits crop up in the modern world.
After seeing most of the concept stuff (Realistic Graphics/Dinosaurs/Dolphin and Eagle Forms/Etc.) I think a modern setting game would not work out so well...
Still waiting on my Okamiden artbook Capcom, make it happen.
Never played the PS2 version, what was so wrong with the wii port?
Nothing, it was a fine port. It's all down to personal preference.
The PS2 game had a slight paper texture applied to the screen at all times, while the Wii one didn't. Personally I like it without it, the colors and lines are crisper, but I can understand why some might like that texture.
The Wii game uses motion controls for drawing, which is a big improvement over using an analog stick. The Wii game also uses motion controls ("waggle") for attacking, which is a big step backward from using a button. Again, whichever is more important to you vs. what's annoying to you.
Finally, the Wii version is 16:9 and 480p, which I don't think the PS2 one could do.
Never played the PS2 version, what was so wrong with the wii port?
Nothing, it was a fine port. It's all down to personal preference.
The PS2 game had a slight paper texture applied to the screen at all times, while the Wii one didn't. Personally I like it without it, the colors and lines are crisper, but I can understand why some might like that texture.
The Wii game uses motion controls for drawing, which is a big improvement over using an analog stick. The Wii game also uses motion controls ("waggle") for attacking, which is a big step backward from using a button. Again, whichever is more important to you vs. what's annoying to you.
Finally, the Wii version is 16:9 and 480p, which I don't think the PS2 one could do.
Much appreciated! I remember hearing some of these things when I went to get my Wii copy, and looking at comparison videos of the effect it didn't seem a big enough difference to matter to me.
I really should get around to playing it, never beat it, never even got past the intro. Long dialog with a lot of cultural influences from a culture I'm not that familiar with.
Never played the PS2 version, what was so wrong with the wii port?
Nothing, it was a fine port. It's all down to personal preference.
The PS2 game had a slight paper texture applied to the screen at all times, while the Wii one didn't. Personally I like it without it, the colors and lines are crisper, but I can understand why some might like that texture.
The Wii game uses motion controls for drawing, which is a big improvement over using an analog stick. The Wii game also uses motion controls ("waggle") for attacking, which is a big step backward from using a button. Again, whichever is more important to you vs. what's annoying to you.
Finally, the Wii version is 16:9 and 480p, which I don't think the PS2 one could do.
You're forgettting that half of the Brush techniques didn't work at all.
Forget using the Warp or trying to make a flower bloom if the sky was in the background! Made the game borderline unplayable
King Riptor on
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Aside from the issue of brand (Okami was a totally new IP and is frankly alien-looking compared to most of the stuff on the market), I'd argue that it's not really enough like Zelda in the areas that make a lot of people buy Zelda.
1) Story. Okami's is well-written and charming, but extensive. You can be sitting there for minutes at a time doing nothing but advancing text. I think a lot of the charm of the Zelda series is that most of the time you're just doing things - conversations are brief affairs designed to point you in the right direction, and cutscenes are rare visual treats at major turning points.
2) Level design. Zelda's dungeons feel like expertly-crafted puzzles - very little space is wasted, and most are very visually distinct from each other. I loved how Okami blended the dungeons more organically with the overworld, but there never felt like there was much variation - whether you were underwater, in a forest cave or in the spirit realm, it was all a beautiful melange of parts that left behind very few distinctive memories.
3) Combat. Okami's combat segements last far longer than Zelda's, are segregated from the environment, and ended up just feeling like a chore after the first few hours. It just felt exhausting, and I noticed that most of things people enjoy about Zelda don't place a heavy emphasis on the combat - keeping it simple and relatively infrequent broadens the appeal.
4) Inventory options. Okami has a metric ton of collectables, weapons and upgrades to keep track of. Again, I love the constant stream of new stuff that you get (and the game really needs it given the length), but I think a large amount of Zelda's appeal stems from keeping it as pared-down as possible. Few items, with many possibilities. An upgraded sword is just that, rather than one of 4 different classes of weapon that can be equipped in two different modes.
I can easily see that a massive fan of one game may well dislike the other, although that just accounts for a potential lack of overlap between fanbases. I have no idea why 'Zelda except that it's for the most popular console in the world and twice the length' didn't appeal as much as it should have.
There's only so many times I can tell my wife that I "tripped" before she gets suspicious, Magus.
Thing is...
there's doorknobs everywhere.
:^::^::^:
This is pretty accurate. It's what I was thinking but I didn't know if I could articulate it. But yeah, it's only a "better" Zelda game if you really liked the things it did differently...and for quite a few people, it didn't offer universal improvements.
Seriously? Half the time. Because the DS line has frozen up on me maybe 3 times in all the years I've had it, and it's never been related to sleep mode, it's poorly programmed games.
Yes. A total of three times; tried it six times. It took three times for me to never do it again.
Speaking of that, how's that aspect in Okamiden?
There's been a time (a year ago) that I closed the shell and opened it again, only to find the game reset. Never again.
This is insanity.
This is...memetic?
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Like the previous game it's not really a mechanic just an effect of meeting your goals. All it does is allow you to move to new areas.
Kind of disappointing, what I really wanted to do in the original was to slowly tear the land from the grasp of evil. As nifty as the sudden waves of purification were, they didn't quite feel visceral enough.
I’ve only played bits and pieces of De Blob and Okami, but I have a hard time seeing how De Blob made making the world prettier more enjoyable or interesting. The hour or so I spent with De Blob was honestly kind of boring and I didn’t really get much out of improving the world. Okami, from what I played, was fairly satisfying. I take it that De Blob 2 is a huge improvement over the original?
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Yes and no. The sequel does do a better job of changing the environment as you paint things, rather than just applying a coat of paint over buildings and occasionally altering landmarks. Painting blocks of buildings or completing objectives can often remove patches of ink or other nearby obstacles, and areas can often end up almost completely unrecognizable once you're through with them. There's also a nifty effect where the majority of the terrain itself is colorless until you move over it a bunch, although there's no reward for doing so beyond having less white in the world.
If the original game bored you, though, you probably won't like the sequel any better.
All in all I'm satisfied with it so far. Probably play through more later.
It's still adorable, though. i love the graphical style.
Becoming all too common. They don't want people in the same household sharing a cart.
Wait, what? Is it still up?
I cant help but smile when playing this game. I realized that you can bloom more than one thing at a time which is great. Still tons of stuff to collect though.
i.e. frikkin' awesome!
I think its cute that the imps have Hanafuda cards as their mask now.
About 12ish hours in and I have to charge every few hours because my DSphat is the only one with a screen protector.
It is explained right at the first boss.
This game is quite long for a DS game, I'm surprised.
Never played the PS2 version, what was so wrong with the wii port?
Still waiting on my Okamiden artbook Capcom, make it happen.
Nothing, it was a fine port. It's all down to personal preference.
The PS2 game had a slight paper texture applied to the screen at all times, while the Wii one didn't. Personally I like it without it, the colors and lines are crisper, but I can understand why some might like that texture.
The Wii game uses motion controls for drawing, which is a big improvement over using an analog stick. The Wii game also uses motion controls ("waggle") for attacking, which is a big step backward from using a button. Again, whichever is more important to you vs. what's annoying to you.
Finally, the Wii version is 16:9 and 480p, which I don't think the PS2 one could do.
Much appreciated! I remember hearing some of these things when I went to get my Wii copy, and looking at comparison videos of the effect it didn't seem a big enough difference to matter to me.
I really should get around to playing it, never beat it, never even got past the intro. Long dialog with a lot of cultural influences from a culture I'm not that familiar with.
You're forgettting that half of the Brush techniques didn't work at all.
Forget using the Warp or trying to make a flower bloom if the sky was in the background! Made the game borderline unplayable