Constrictor is kind of a special case for trynd though, i mean he pretty much plays nothing but tryndamere and has what I imagine must be an unbelievable number of games played with him. Yes i'm sure he could beat singed with trynd, but i'm equally sure he could beat almost anyone on the board with any character with trynd, not because trynd is necessarily good but because he's so good with him.
KayWhat we need...Is a little bit of PANIC.Registered Userregular
edited August 2011
INFO FOR 21st CENTURY:
Well, Annie's a terrifying AP Carry with built-in stuns every five spells. She's pretty simple. Drop your Ult on teams when you have your swirly stun going. Win.
Malphite's a little more complex, I explained how he worked, but you'd need someone else to give you finer pointers. I don't play either of 'em. I suggested them as they were both cheap, and kinda close (sort of) to Malzahar and Leona.
I really want to try a game of Udyr where I macro my QWER keys so I'm shouting "I'm a BEAR!", "Now I'm a TURTLE!", "Now I'm a TIGER!" every time I switch stances.
Constrictor is kind of a special case for trynd though, i mean he pretty much plays nothing but tryndamere and has what I imagine must be an unbelievable number of games played with him. Yes i'm sure he could beat singed with trynd, but i'm equally sure he could beat almost anyone on the board with any character with trynd, not because trynd is necessarily good but because he's so good with him.
this.
i'm not going to tell anyone that trynd can beat singed. i would tell you that constrictor's trynd could beat singed though. i would even say it with confidence.
i say that you take singed, and 1v1 constrictor to find out who is right.
if i were a betting man, i'd put my money on constrictor.
I don't really feel the desire to 1v1 somebody using a champ I don't play often to prove a point that I already know is true (fling interrupts autoattacks).
that wasn't actually the argument. you came in here and pretty much said that constrictor was wrong and there was no way he could be beating singed with tryndamere. don't trash on someone's actual experience with anecdotal evidence because just because you say that singed has this skillset that allows him to beat any melee. you also seem to ignore the fact that constrictor might be better than most tryndamere's, or that his runes/masteries allow him to fight singed easier than most.
and if you don't play singed very often, then why are you in here saying that he can beat a champ just because you list some skills and say
A combo that relies on you getting into melee ranged against Singed without using a slow or blink is usually not going to work. Also, Fling does 100 damage at level 1, plus poison for another 88 damage. Unless you have 100 MR at level 1, there's no way fling is only dealing 50. There's also the problem of creep aggro to deal with, which can be mitigated, I grant you, but is pretty significant considering Trynd's squishiness.
You're basically relying on Singed to let you get into melee range without any kind of harassment, which doesn't work. If he sees you running up, he can fling (interrupting your attack) and poison, meaning you've taken 188 damage (before MR) and if you spin back to attack him, you're also in prime creep aggro territory and he can semi-easily kite you around the minions. I'm not saying you can't attack Singed, but your strategy relies on a Singed that's really terribly awful.
So, what I said was...
I doubted Constrictor could start off, against Singed, by running up and autoattacking without using either his slow or his spin.
I pointed out that Fling will be dealing more than 50 damage unless he starts out with 100 MR.
I pointed out that the combo he listed (hit, shout, hit, hit, spin, hit) doesn't work if Singed flings you out of the first autoattack.
I said that it required a Singed that is terrible (letting people run up and hit him in melee range instead of flinging them).
None of that is saying anything about Constrictor in general, or his play, or anything. All I am saying is that A: his math on the MR was wrong, and B: Singed can just fling Trynd out of an autoattack if his strategy is to run up and hit Singed (He can spin in and hit reasonably well, I believe, but that's a much less damaging combo).
Also, actual experience and anecdotal evidence are the same thing, and from my anecdotal evidence/actual experience, Tryndamere isn't a threat to most people in the lane. I never said Singed could beat any melee champ, so I have no clue what that's about. I never said he couldn't beat Singed, I just assumed that the Singed players were much worse than him, which, if his combo worked as listed, seems obvious.
As for why I am saying Singed can beat Tryndamere: Because I know how to play the game and have actually seen this matchup before, and in fact, played this matchup before (pre fury nerfs, even!)? I don't need to play every champ against every other champ in a 1v1 deathmatch to get a general idea of how things work, and I know that in general, Trynd is a weak laner and Singed can pretty well punish people for trying to run up and hit him. Maybe Constrictor is some amazing godlike Trynd who can beat every Singed ever, but that doesn't mean that any of the things I've said are untrue in general.
The only other thing I said, and it was me misinterpreting something Constrictor said, was that no good Singed would be stupid enough to try to just slug it out with Trynd using autoattacks.
This is just false. He has a dash, a knock up, and the most amazing ult that has so many uses. Few things in League of Legends are as satisfying as getting super tanky and ulting into the middle of the enemy team and getting a double kill in your ring while their teammates run screaming from your mighty extendo spear.
Ashe on the other hand shoots things and runs away, then gets stunned and dies in two hits. Not really comparable at all.
Assuming you get a catalyst either way, Sorc Shoes + Haunting Guise + Codex is actually higher damage for quite a while (at 70 MR; below that, and the spell pen is much stronger, above 100, deathcap is stronger), and comes in at just a slightly higher cost than a Deathcap. If you build into a Morello's and compare that to a Cap plus a void staff, you get slightly less damage for 1k less gold (and that includes the cost of your boots, unlike Deathcap).
Math is fun!
EDIT: Ashe is boring, sure, but she's also probably one of the most game changing champs. Go go best initiation ult in the game!
you forgot the 35 tenacity and 25 mr from mercs which is a huge deal 1v1ing other ap carries at mid. also the void staff becomes more useful the later the game goes on, haunting guise turns into nothing and becomes a waste of an item slot that you have to sell off. no reason to build morellos on annie either. if you want to have an extremely specialized early game build that scales horribly into the mid and late game sure you can do that. or go deathcap voidstaff.
This is just false. He has a dash, a knock up, and the most amazing ult that has so many uses. Few things in League of Legends are as satisfying as getting super tanky and ulting into the middle of the enemy team and getting a double kill in your ring while their teammates run screaming from your mighty extendo spear.
Ashe on the other hand shoots things and runs away, then gets stunned and dies in two hits. Not really comparable at all.
Jarvan fanboy
I dunno. I just don't really enjoy these so-called "tanky dps" types.
you forgot the 35 tenacity and 25 mr from mercs which is a huge deal 1v1ing other ap carries at mid. also the void staff becomes more useful the later the game goes on, haunting guise turns into nothing and becomes a waste of an item slot that you have to sell off. no reason to build morellos on annie either. if you want to have an extremely specialized early game build that scales horribly into the mid and late game sure you can do that. or go deathcap voidstaff.
The numbers I used were for similar gold; with mercs, sure, you get the tenacity, but you're also 1.2k over the other build in cost. You can have boots 1 and only be slightly above the cost of the other build (with sorcs included) if you rush deathcap.
Can someone tell me how to play Veigar? I just unlocked him, I really like his abilities, but he didn't seem to be doing as much damage as the Monkey king, or Gangplank, or even Nunu. But I feel like he could be awesome. And I got a lot of assists.
But seriously, some people will advocate building some defensive items on Annie.
These people are godless infidels.
Ignore them.
well is a roa a defensive item
because I'd build that
other than that catalyst-deathcap-void staff is the #1 caster build and annie is no exception
Deathcap and void staff before RoA?
you can probably sit on the catalyst then rush deathcap for maximum damage
but I usually like finishing rod to get the over time benefits right away. on annie in particular though the extra damage is probably preferable
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21stCenturyCall me Pixel, or Pix for short![They/Them]Registered Userregular
I tried annie in a co-op vs bots game to get a feel for her... Are there any good ways of raising her survivability? I got stunned by Taric entirely too many times, which lead me to die a couple times. Or is it a strategy flaw on my end?
Basically, as Annie, do I run away as soon as something that can beat me comes over?
Can someone tell me how to play Veigar? I just unlocked him, I really like his abilities, but he didn't seem to be doing as much damage as the Monkey king, or Gangplank, or even Nunu. But I feel like he could be awesome. And I got a lot of assists.
Veigar is a tough cookie to learn early. I did exactly the same thing because he looks very baller, but here's my take on him for you:
Veigar has horrible, horrible mana costs on his spells. The upside is that Veigar becomes horrendously powerful when he starts farming enemy minions (and later, champs) with his Q. Use this to last-hit everything. Minions, champions, everything. By doing this, you will permanently gain 1AP per creep kill on usage. When it comes to champions, the ability is twofold: the same 1 permanent point of AP applies, but passively Veigar will gain 1AP per level of the ability (so up to 5AP) per champion kill from any source. Because of the affordable cooldown, it is also good for popping Banshee's Veil.
His W is a powerful AoE nuke but it's telegraphed kinda obviously and has a long time between cast and the damage - 1.2 seconds. Good for farming big creep waves in an emergency or to drop in the middle of a fight.
His E is a stun. It creates a big squared-circle and when people touch the edges, they get stunned. This is naturally a good use to block alleyways when being chased, dropping it in a teamfight is very beneficial, and of course use it to line up his W. The stun won't actually last long enough for W to land before you invest a couple of ranks in it, so plan wisely where your enemy might flee to if you want to get that one-two combo in early.
His R is where it's at. A horrifying ability. It's a very strong ult, but it's also on a long cooldown so use it wisely. Because of the additional effect of stacking 80% of the target's AP to the damage, you should make your priority in teamfights the enemy AP casters, supports, and to a lesser extent hybrids. This ability also works on those bulky melee-ranged characters who use AP - Sion, Maokai etc). Using it to take a support or caster out of the fight can really turn the tables in a teamfight because things just go squish.
I like to start with a Meki Pendant and 2x HP pots because he is insanely squishy. Lane with someone who is happy to babysit you and do the harrassing for you. Later on that Meki Pendant will become a Fiendish Codex, and eventually a Deathfire Grasp. Other good items on Veigar include, naturally, Rylai's Crystal Sceptre, Rabaddon's Deathcap, Zhonya's Hourglass for armour+AP and abyssal sceptre for MRes+AP. My boots of choice are either Sorc shoes if I don't have MPen Quints, or Ionian Boots if I do. If I do take Ionians I play extra carefully and sacrifice one of my defensive items for a Void Staff, usually my preference being to lose the Abyssal Sceptre since Veigar shouldn't be in melee range to make the MPen Aura worthwhile anyway. When you single out that AP champ to attack in a teamfight, go E > 1 (Deathfire Grasp item slot) >W > R > Q. Remember to start with Q if they go Banshee Veil to pop it!
I tried annie in a co-op vs bots game to get a feel for her... Are there any good ways of raising her survivability? I got stunned by Taric entirely too many times, which lead me to die a couple times. Or is it a strategy flaw on my end?
Basically, as Annie, do I run away as soon as something that can beat me comes over?
well, for one thing, bots are unusually aggressive. if you have trouble though, you can grab a doran's ring first item for the extra health, though i like to go sapphire into catalyst. you can use q to farm as long as you're getting last hits, it won't really kill your mana. gotta play passive though, she is soft early on. if you need, grab a level of molten shield, give a good bit of armor and mr.
Can someone tell me how to play Veigar? I just unlocked him, I really like his abilities, but he didn't seem to be doing as much damage as the Monkey king, or Gangplank, or even Nunu. But I feel like he could be awesome. And I got a lot of assists.
Veigar is a tough cookie to learn early. I did exactly the same thing because he looks very baller, but here's my take on him for you:
Veigar has horrible, horrible mana costs on his spells. The upside is that Veigar becomes horrendously powerful when he starts farming enemy minions (and later, champs) with his Q. Use this to last-hit everything. Minions, champions, everything. By doing this, you will permanently gain 1AP per creep kill on usage. When it comes to champions, the ability is twofold: the same 1 permanent point of AP applies, but passively Veigar will gain 1AP per level of the ability (so up to 5AP) per champion kill from any source. Because of the affordable cooldown, it is also good for popping Banshee's Veil.
His W is a powerful AoE nuke but it's telegraphed kinda obviously and has a long time between cast and the damage - 1.2 seconds. Good for farming big creep waves in an emergency or to drop in the middle of a fight.
His E is a stun. It creates a big squared-circle and when people touch the edges, they get stunned. This is naturally a good use to block alleyways when being chased, dropping it in a teamfight is very beneficial, and of course use it to line up his W. The stun won't actually last long enough for W to land before you invest a couple of ranks in it, so plan wisely where your enemy might flee to if you want to get that one-two combo in early.
His R is where it's at. A horrifying ability. It's a very strong ult, but it's also on a long cooldown so use it wisely. Because of the additional effect of stacking 80% of the target's AP to the damage, you should make your priority in teamfights the enemy AP casters, supports, and to a lesser extent hybrids. This ability also works on those bulky melee-ranged characters who use AP - Sion, Maokai etc). Using it to take a support or caster out of the fight can really turn the tables in a teamfight because things just go squish.
I like to start with a Meki Pendant and 2x HP pots because he is insanely squishy. Lane with someone who is happy to babysit you and do the harrassing for you. Later on that Meki Pendant will become a Fiendish Codex, and eventually a Deathfire Grasp. Other good items on Veigar include, naturally, Rylai's Crystal Sceptre, Rabaddon's Deathcap, Zhonya's Hourglass for armour+AP and abyssal sceptre for MRes+AP. My boots of choice are either Sorc shoes if I don't have MPen Quints, or Ionian Boots if I do. If I do take Ionians I play extra carefully and sacrifice one of my defensive items for a Void Staff, usually my preference being to lose the Abyssal Sceptre since Veigar shouldn't be in melee range to make the MPen Aura worthwhile anyway. When you single out that AP champ to attack in a teamfight, go E > 1 (Deathfire Grasp item slot) >W > R > Q. Remember to start with Q if they go Banshee Veil to pop it!
Awesome, thanks. I should mention that I only play against bots.
But seriously, some people will advocate building some defensive items on Annie.
These people are godless infidels.
Ignore them.
Sometimes if I'm feeling real nervous, I start Annie with a Doran's Shield.
Though I am not proud of this.
Though I assume the core build for annie would be stuff like Rod of Ages, Rabaddon's Deathcap and other items that increase AP and MP, right?
Typical build for Annie is either Blue Crystal + 2 pots, getting an early Catalyst for sustain (and you can build it into RoA, which is really nice on Annie) or boots + 5 pots, then just grab blasting wands and start building those into stuff like Void Staff, Rabadon's maybe an Hourglass or Abyssal.
I prefer the Crystal + 2 pots start into Rod of Ages, personally, then go for Void Staff -> Rabadon's (unless then don't have significant Magic Resist, in which case I just go right for the Deathcap).
I highly recommend going into a few practice games with Annie and get really, really good at last hitting with her Q, because that's one of her strongest assets in the early game: infinite farming with the Q, then occasionally using Q + E to stun harass your opponent.
Take Flash / Ignite, and when you hit 6, it's just a matter of (when you have your stun ready) Flash + Ignite Q + E + R. Almost nobody will survive that burst, and if they do, they certainly won't survive your next Q. I find the combo easier to land if you have everything on Smartcast, but that's just me.
EDIT: This should be obvious enough, but if you have a Mordekaiser against you and they have a full shield, do not go for the burst cmbo on them. You will get killed.
Bots build (or get for free, I guess) tons of MR with a lot less armor, so if you're having trouble winning due to teammate incompetence or whatever, you're usually better off picking an AD carry.
Posts
He's as boring as Ashe.
Glad I didn't spend real money dollars.
Well, Annie's a terrifying AP Carry with built-in stuns every five spells. She's pretty simple. Drop your Ult on teams when you have your swirly stun going. Win.
Malphite's a little more complex, I explained how he worked, but you'd need someone else to give you finer pointers. I don't play either of 'em. I suggested them as they were both cheap, and kinda close (sort of) to Malzahar and Leona.
3DS FCode: 1993-7512-8991
this.
i'm not going to tell anyone that trynd can beat singed. i would tell you that constrictor's trynd could beat singed though. i would even say it with confidence.
i've flashed at the exact same time stun tibbers was dropped on me, it can happen with anything like that
This was my response to Constrictor:
So, what I said was...
I doubted Constrictor could start off, against Singed, by running up and autoattacking without using either his slow or his spin.
I pointed out that Fling will be dealing more than 50 damage unless he starts out with 100 MR.
I pointed out that the combo he listed (hit, shout, hit, hit, spin, hit) doesn't work if Singed flings you out of the first autoattack.
I said that it required a Singed that is terrible (letting people run up and hit him in melee range instead of flinging them).
None of that is saying anything about Constrictor in general, or his play, or anything. All I am saying is that A: his math on the MR was wrong, and B: Singed can just fling Trynd out of an autoattack if his strategy is to run up and hit Singed (He can spin in and hit reasonably well, I believe, but that's a much less damaging combo).
Also, actual experience and anecdotal evidence are the same thing, and from my anecdotal evidence/actual experience, Tryndamere isn't a threat to most people in the lane. I never said Singed could beat any melee champ, so I have no clue what that's about. I never said he couldn't beat Singed, I just assumed that the Singed players were much worse than him, which, if his combo worked as listed, seems obvious.
As for why I am saying Singed can beat Tryndamere: Because I know how to play the game and have actually seen this matchup before, and in fact, played this matchup before (pre fury nerfs, even!)? I don't need to play every champ against every other champ in a 1v1 deathmatch to get a general idea of how things work, and I know that in general, Trynd is a weak laner and Singed can pretty well punish people for trying to run up and hit him. Maybe Constrictor is some amazing godlike Trynd who can beat every Singed ever, but that doesn't mean that any of the things I've said are untrue in general.
The only other thing I said, and it was me misinterpreting something Constrictor said, was that no good Singed would be stupid enough to try to just slug it out with Trynd using autoattacks.
well is a roa a defensive item
because I'd build that
other than that catalyst-deathcap-void staff is the #1 caster build and annie is no exception
Deathcap and void staff before RoA?
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This is just false. He has a dash, a knock up, and the most amazing ult that has so many uses. Few things in League of Legends are as satisfying as getting super tanky and ulting into the middle of the enemy team and getting a double kill in your ring while their teammates run screaming from your mighty extendo spear.
Ashe on the other hand shoots things and runs away, then gets stunned and dies in two hits. Not really comparable at all.
Math is fun!
EDIT: Ashe is boring, sure, but she's also probably one of the most game changing champs. Go go best initiation ult in the game!
honestly I think the ability to blink through walls and cliffs makes any character almost instantly more fun than those who can't
ezreal, gragas, nidalee, jarvan, kassadin, lee sin (with ward) etccc
Jarvan fanboy
I dunno. I just don't really enjoy these so-called "tanky dps" types.
The numbers I used were for similar gold; with mercs, sure, you get the tenacity, but you're also 1.2k over the other build in cost. You can have boots 1 and only be slightly above the cost of the other build (with sorcs included) if you rush deathcap.
you can probably sit on the catalyst then rush deathcap for maximum damage
but I usually like finishing rod to get the over time benefits right away. on annie in particular though the extra damage is probably preferable
Basically, as Annie, do I run away as soon as something that can beat me comes over?
Check out my site, the Bismuth Heart | My Twitter
drop rally to help your team with baron then immediately leave and go steal the enemy's red while they're distracted
if you took clairvoyance, use it on the enemy nexus and rush it
if you reach their summoner pool, you win
The only thing that saved us was having an Ashe that was almost as powerful, and my slightly ok Gangplank.
Veigar is a tough cookie to learn early. I did exactly the same thing because he looks very baller, but here's my take on him for you:
His W is a powerful AoE nuke but it's telegraphed kinda obviously and has a long time between cast and the damage - 1.2 seconds. Good for farming big creep waves in an emergency or to drop in the middle of a fight.
His E is a stun. It creates a big squared-circle and when people touch the edges, they get stunned. This is naturally a good use to block alleyways when being chased, dropping it in a teamfight is very beneficial, and of course use it to line up his W. The stun won't actually last long enough for W to land before you invest a couple of ranks in it, so plan wisely where your enemy might flee to if you want to get that one-two combo in early.
His R is where it's at. A horrifying ability. It's a very strong ult, but it's also on a long cooldown so use it wisely. Because of the additional effect of stacking 80% of the target's AP to the damage, you should make your priority in teamfights the enemy AP casters, supports, and to a lesser extent hybrids. This ability also works on those bulky melee-ranged characters who use AP - Sion, Maokai etc). Using it to take a support or caster out of the fight can really turn the tables in a teamfight because things just go squish.
I like to start with a Meki Pendant and 2x HP pots because he is insanely squishy. Lane with someone who is happy to babysit you and do the harrassing for you. Later on that Meki Pendant will become a Fiendish Codex, and eventually a Deathfire Grasp. Other good items on Veigar include, naturally, Rylai's Crystal Sceptre, Rabaddon's Deathcap, Zhonya's Hourglass for armour+AP and abyssal sceptre for MRes+AP. My boots of choice are either Sorc shoes if I don't have MPen Quints, or Ionian Boots if I do. If I do take Ionians I play extra carefully and sacrifice one of my defensive items for a Void Staff, usually my preference being to lose the Abyssal Sceptre since Veigar shouldn't be in melee range to make the MPen Aura worthwhile anyway. When you single out that AP champ to attack in a teamfight, go E > 1 (Deathfire Grasp item slot) >W > R > Q. Remember to start with Q if they go Banshee Veil to pop it!
well, for one thing, bots are unusually aggressive. if you have trouble though, you can grab a doran's ring first item for the extra health, though i like to go sapphire into catalyst. you can use q to farm as long as you're getting last hits, it won't really kill your mana. gotta play passive though, she is soft early on. if you need, grab a level of molten shield, give a good bit of armor and mr.
Awesome, thanks. I should mention that I only play against bots.
Sometimes if I'm feeling real nervous, I start Annie with a Doran's Shield.
Though I am not proud of this.
Typical build for Annie is either Blue Crystal + 2 pots, getting an early Catalyst for sustain (and you can build it into RoA, which is really nice on Annie) or boots + 5 pots, then just grab blasting wands and start building those into stuff like Void Staff, Rabadon's maybe an Hourglass or Abyssal.
I prefer the Crystal + 2 pots start into Rod of Ages, personally, then go for Void Staff -> Rabadon's (unless then don't have significant Magic Resist, in which case I just go right for the Deathcap).
I highly recommend going into a few practice games with Annie and get really, really good at last hitting with her Q, because that's one of her strongest assets in the early game: infinite farming with the Q, then occasionally using Q + E to stun harass your opponent.
Take Flash / Ignite, and when you hit 6, it's just a matter of (when you have your stun ready) Flash + Ignite Q + E + R. Almost nobody will survive that burst, and if they do, they certainly won't survive your next Q. I find the combo easier to land if you have everything on Smartcast, but that's just me.
EDIT: This should be obvious enough, but if you have a Mordekaiser against you and they have a full shield, do not go for the burst cmbo on them. You will get killed.
yessssss save the replay.
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irelia. . .
you should never rush a void staff. you're spending 1000 gold to penetrate like 10 mr on someone with base mr.
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Only if you think you will actually play her.
I bought her, played like 6-7 games, and never again.
do you want to win every game at the cost of your (im)mortal soul
if so, yes
advice pretty much stands as it is then. They will build Banshee's. You will need to pop it.
Only time I actually use Akali or Katarina. Just get Mejai, SotO, and stack gunblades.