So I went to Ilum tonight for a little pvp. I come to the middle point and I see a huge group of Reps. Sweet. Then what do I see? They're standing nicely around with Imperial players, trading kills. I got mocked for not wanting to participating in that.
I gotta admit, that really just kind of ruined pvp for me...at least world pvp. Dailies/Weeklies are a nice incentive to pvp, but they're not a chore to me, they're part of the game. Sitting around kill trading just ruins it...it's a job now.
Yeah, rage/focus is a terrific spec for Jugg/Guardian. I don't think it would be as good for Sentinel/Marauder since they can't get the extra 30% on sweep/slam damage, but they have 2 good pvp specs anyway. I've heard Vigilance/Vengeance is a good pvp spec too, but it doesn't have the burst, just more single target sustained without relying on the one setup.
I find rage jugs and maras funny, mostly because they are predictable as fuck and have more or less just one trick they constantly try to pull off
slash slash, place dot and or force choke smash
a force camo between the choke and smash renders the entire spec useless
hell even just using force camo whenever makes some of them use smash as a "oh shit he is invisible, better use aoe" button
Nobody specs Rage because they love the playstyle, it's just the only effective pvp spec available to us. And the only way to kill anything is to set up that Smash combo. So yes, we're going to be trying to do that on cool down. No, we don't have any other tricks. Congrats on finding our enormous, glaring achilles heel.
The tank spec offers slightly more survivability and better CC at the cost of almost all of the rage spec's increased damage output. It's cool if you're running a premade group or carrying in huttball but can be frustrating if you're queued solo. That's my take.
Vengeance can be effective, but you have to stick on a target way too long for my taste
Most tanks, Guardian/Jugg tanks in particular, need a pocket healer (or be the pocket tank for a healer :P) to really dominate in PvP, mainly by becoming some unkillable thing that has mountains of armor and hp, kept going by the healer he has guarded so he can wail on his foes endlessly... and the wailing for tank Guardians and Juggernauts, comparded to pretty much any other AC/build, is not that impressive... but even those numbers add up when you spend significatly less time running back from the respawn point than the rest of your team.
For Jugg/Guardian, Vigilance/Vengeance is a just fine PvP spec. You can do good damage, and you have all the same good utility. People just don't like it because you don't have anything that hits as hard as the gimmick smash. You do however, have the ability to actually kill people with other things besides that. It doesn't compete on damage with some specs, but has a TON of utility, in the AoE snare, guardian leap, taunts, and all that.
Is there a fansite out there dedicated to SWTOR pvp, like the way WoW has ArenaJunkies? All I can seem to find when looking for Marauder pvp discussion is people on various forums bitching about how the class is underpowered, but no real guides or spec debates or anything. There's one good youtube video about an annihilation build, but not much else that's been helpful.
You are seeing people bitching about Marauder being underpowered? Most of the whining I see is about how OP they are, because people don't realize if you don't stop attacking them and let Rebuke fall off or if you keep attacking pointlessly while Guarded by the Force is up they're still not going to die. Watchman/Annihilation is the best pvp spec for that AC as far as I know. I think some people like to run Combat/Carnage, but outside of being able to wreck somebody with the armor pen up, you're not going to be as effective as watchman/annihilation.
I'm not sure if there's a pvp specific site people are using.
Watchman/Annihilation is the best pvp spec for that AC as far as I know. I think some people like to run Combat/Carnage, but outside of being able to wreck somebody with the armor pen up, you're not going to be as effective as watchman/annihilation.
Yeah I ran Combat for a while, but when I finally switched to Watchman the improvement was very noticeable.
I just had one of my best matches since switching to Vigilance on my Guardian. We were losing on Alderaan, and ended up turning it around and 3 cap winning from like 50-15 to 5-0. I only had like 10 kills in the match where I usually have 30+, but I had over 300k damage done, because the whole match I was just pressuring the healers. I wasn't able to outright kill them much, but forcing them to heal themselves instead of their teammates is a huge help. People don't seem to get that enough.
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ArrynAsk not the InnkeeperFor destiny is thy name!Registered Userregular
edited March 2012
Guardians on a healer are a nightmare, I love it, lol. With all of our stuns/interrupts/knockbacks ... and I love when it becomes obvious that they just told their teammates to come take care of me, because they run over in a bunch. That's when I pop Awe.
I know it's considered the "weakest" healer, but I'm really enjoying playing a heal-spec Operative in PvP, especially when I discovered that SWOTOR has a (albeit rather poor) secondary/focus target system, so I can always keep a good eye on the tank that's guarding me. Coming into battle stealthed almost always makes sure noone notices me until a number of heals in, and having a spammable instant heal when the target's health is under 30% is soo fun.
...and that was before I hit 36 and now have a stealth opener. :twisted:
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MorninglordI'm tired of being Batman,so today I'll be Owl.Registered Userregular
edited March 2012
I plan to get this soon and on Basil's advice I'm making a combat medic on his server. Medic concealment. Use the spec dot to build lacerates for dps. Been toying around with builds, I think this would end up being like a disciple of khaine in WAR. Or more specifically, my hybrid sac/heals disciple of khaine, who stood just behind the front line supporting and if any smart ass dps thought he could take me, I murdered them and continued on.
If I though the situation demanded it, I would nip out to the front front line and start hurting people, healing around me as I went.
If I had guard, I was a nightmare monster thing that could not be stopped.
On oceania I'm probably making a sentinel unless my partner decides not to play, in which case I'll make a jedi guardian.
Now that I know I can get it next monday for sure, I'm having a hard time not thinking about this constantly.
Morninglord on
(PSN: Morninglord) (Steam: Morninglord) (WiiU: Morninglord22) I like to record and toss up a lot of random gaming videos here.
My Operative hasn't gotten high enough to do the favored hybrid, but I find I still have enough burst to be a threat to just about anything I'd normally be able to kill as pure concealment.
Even gives me a bit more staying power against things that would normally give concealment ops trouble. Tank Guardians and Powertechs? Simply do not have enough burst to kill you 1v1 when you get below 30% and start spamming your instant heal on yourself... not without smart use of thier stuns and poping any offensive CDs they have at least, and probably an adrenal on top of that as well.
You are seeing people bitching about Marauder being underpowered? Most of the whining I see is about how OP they are, because people don't realize if you don't stop attacking them and let Rebuke fall off or if you keep attacking pointlessly while Guarded by the Force is up they're still not going to die. Watchman/Annihilation is the best pvp spec for that AC as far as I know. I think some people like to run Combat/Carnage, but outside of being able to wreck somebody with the armor pen up, you're not going to be as effective as watchman/annihilation.
I'm not sure if there's a pvp specific site people are using.
At 50, Marauders are great.
Sub 50, they are kind of shit (as I am finding on my lvl 22 sentinel currently). They just don't have the talents it takes to succeed, whereas other classes do fine with just the stat boost in BGs.
Bud Light Presents: Real Men of Genius
(real men of genius)
Today we salute you, Mr. Absolutely Fucking Terrible in PVP Guy
(Mr. Absolutely Fucking Terrible in PVP Guy)
Anyone can stand next to a objective racking up defense medals but only you can wait until your dead to call incoming
(Return to med center?) Perched next to the door in your level 40 orange gear you tirelessly wait until there is no chance for us to get there in time.
(Keep on suckin')
And while you will complain how there should be two people defending, if anyone shows up to help you are you going to stay put?
(No!)
And even though you've drug every team you have ever been on down like an anchor dropped in a black hole
(Never forget you!)
So crack open an ice-cold Bud Light, you fucktard, because every match you join, you're the MVP.
(Mr. Absolutely Fucking Terrible in PVP Guy)
You are seeing people bitching about Marauder being underpowered? Most of the whining I see is about how OP they are, because people don't realize if you don't stop attacking them and let Rebuke fall off or if you keep attacking pointlessly while Guarded by the Force is up they're still not going to die. Watchman/Annihilation is the best pvp spec for that AC as far as I know. I think some people like to run Combat/Carnage, but outside of being able to wreck somebody with the armor pen up, you're not going to be as effective as watchman/annihilation.
I'm not sure if there's a pvp specific site people are using.
At 50, Marauders are great.
Sub 50, they are kind of shit (as I am finding on my lvl 22 sentinel currently). They just don't have the talents it takes to succeed, whereas other classes do fine with just the stat boost in BGs.
At 26 I'm squishy as hell and most of the time I'm snared and/or knocked around like a ragdoll but man I'm having fun anyway. I get about half the number of medals in warzones on my Marauder as I do on my Powertech, but I assume that's because of guard and taunt soaking damage. I'm gonna stick it out to 50 because from what I keep reading, Marauder gets fun as hell once you get all the abilities.
You are seeing people bitching about Marauder being underpowered? Most of the whining I see is about how OP they are, because people don't realize if you don't stop attacking them and let Rebuke fall off or if you keep attacking pointlessly while Guarded by the Force is up they're still not going to die. Watchman/Annihilation is the best pvp spec for that AC as far as I know. I think some people like to run Combat/Carnage, but outside of being able to wreck somebody with the armor pen up, you're not going to be as effective as watchman/annihilation.
I'm not sure if there's a pvp specific site people are using.
At 50, Marauders are great.
Sub 50, they are kind of shit (as I am finding on my lvl 22 sentinel currently). They just don't have the talents it takes to succeed, whereas other classes do fine with just the stat boost in BGs.
Oh, no doubt. I really want to play a Marauder, but it would really only be for pvp, and since this game follows the typical MMO character development of "You don't get a complete character until at least level 40!" some classes are just pointless to pvp on before then.
I've found I can't move away from classes that have taunts even though I rarely spec them tanks. The versatility of being able to reduce the damage my teammates are taking while doing really good damage (especially burst wise on my deception assassin) is just too good for me to justify playing a damage only class. Anyone else have this problem? I want to try a Sniper or Marauder out at 50 but even early on I miss my beloved taunt skills.
I've found I can't move away from classes that have taunts even though I rarely spec them tanks. The versatility of being able to reduce the damage my teammates are taking while doing really good damage (especially burst wise on my deception assassin) is just too good for me to justify playing a damage only class. Anyone else have this problem? I want to try a Sniper or Marauder out at 50 but even early on I miss my beloved taunt skills.
Yeah, then I saw how I was picking off people at an insane rate from 30m away as a Gunslinger, and decided that the pure DPS ACs have thier perks
Marauders have a bit of group utility, especially with all the things they can do with a full stack of Fury (like increasing thier movement speed and defence, increasing damage and healing done, or healing them for the next 6 tics of your dots) Most Annihilation Marauders I've seen are right behind any dedicated healers in total healing done in the match.
Unfortunatly, other than getting the ability to ruin a enemy Gunslinger or Sentinel's day have halving thier base accuarcy, and then only if they spec Marksmanship, Snipers don't get anything like that until 42, with Ballistic Shield.
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ObiFettUse the ForceAs You WishRegistered Userregular
Bud Light Presents: Real Men of Genius
(real men of genius)
Today we salute you, Mr. Absolutely Fucking Terrible in PVP Guy
(Mr. Absolutely Fucking Terrible in PVP Guy)
Anyone can stand next to a objective racking up defense medals but only you can wait until your dead to call incoming
(Return to med center?) Perched next to the door in your level 40 orange gear you tirelessly wait until there is no chance for us to get there in time.
(Keep on suckin')
And while you will complain how there should be two people defending, if anyone shows up to help you are you going to stay put?
(No!)
And even though you've drug every team you have ever been on down like an anchor dropped in a black hole
(Never forget you!)
So crack open an ice-cold Bud Light, you fucktard, because every match you join, you're the MVP.
(Mr. Absolutely Fucking Terrible in PVP Guy)
I've found I can't move away from classes that have taunts even though I rarely spec them tanks. The versatility of being able to reduce the damage my teammates are taking while doing really good damage (especially burst wise on my deception assassin) is just too good for me to justify playing a damage only class. Anyone else have this problem? I want to try a Sniper or Marauder out at 50 but even early on I miss my beloved taunt skills.
While I still intend to play a Marauder and some other DPSers, I love my Vigilance Guardian and Infiltration Shadow, and part of it is definitely getting to semi-tank by using my taunts. It makes a big difference in group battles.
Especially since the area taunt doesn't break stealth, so you can make a group of enemies hit 30% less without any danger to yourself. I do this all the time in Huttball if I'm stealthing near a small skirmish on my way to something else. I figure if I did play a pure damage it would be a Sniper, because the other ranged dps options don't interest me and I'm not going two stealth characters.
I've found I can't move away from classes that have taunts even though I rarely spec them tanks. The versatility of being able to reduce the damage my teammates are taking while doing really good damage (especially burst wise on my deception assassin) is just too good for me to justify playing a damage only class. Anyone else have this problem? I want to try a Sniper or Marauder out at 50 but even early on I miss my beloved taunt skills.
While I still intend to play a Marauder and some other DPSers, I love my Vigilance Guardian and Infiltration Shadow, and part of it is definitely getting to semi-tank by using my taunts. It makes a big difference in group battles.
Oh absolutely. I play a squishy Madness Assassin in PvP now and I love throwing down the taunts. If I don't keep them on constant cooldown, I feel like I failed the match.
My Operative hasn't gotten high enough to do the favored hybrid, but I find I still have enough burst to be a threat to just about anything I'd normally be able to kill as pure concealment.
Even gives me a bit more staying power against things that would normally give concealment ops trouble. Tank Guardians and Powertechs? Simply do not have enough burst to kill you 1v1 when you get below 30% and start spamming your instant heal on yourself... not without smart use of thier stuns and poping any offensive CDs they have at least, and probably an adrenal on top of that as well.
There isn't much a Concealment Op can't take if you're smart. It's all about positioning, timing, and knowing exactly what you and your enemies can do in any given fight. If you get it right, you destroy your enemy and stealth away. If you get it wrong and your escapes aren't sufficient, you're dead without making much of a dent. Probably 80% of my Huttball games end without a death, and that's often with scoring a goal or two. I've won a couple of Voidstars without dying but that's probably the toughest WZ as Concealment as you stand very little chance of picking someone off out of the pack and getting away, or finding someone 1v1. Civil War is tedious and I hate it even though it's easy to do well there. I wish I could avoid it altogether.
I've tried Medic spec a bit and it's fun to be nigh-invincible but your DPS is too low to overcome even the mildest healing or damage reduction. I've just hit 48 and want to try out hybrid Medic/Concealment, but keeping an eye on 50 PvP gear I don't know if it's ideal there. You don't need alacrity rating at all, but accuracy rating is wasted on your heal abilities. Stacking crit/surge/power seems like the best way to go.
My biggest complaint about playing an Operative is that there are far too many useful abilities to keybind efficiently. Keeping track of what key does what in all of its shift-ctrl-alt permutations makes it hard to time things like Evasion and Adrenaline Probe correctly. Way too much shit to keep track of.
I figure if I did play a pure damage it would be a Sniper, because the other ranged dps options don't interest me and I'm not going two stealth characters.
I've got a 50 Sniper and it's very fun - the interesting thing is that I have much more success with the shared DPS poison tree (Lethality?) than I ever did with Marksman or Engineering. Sniper has a few tricks that the Operative doesn't have (Leg shot, cover pulse) but honestly there are more than a few times I think to myself that I'd trade those in for the ability to open up the poison barrage from stealth, or to have a heal button somewhere.
Marksman blows things up, but you're a turret. You are going to be the center of all enemy AoE effects. People are going to line of sight you.
Engineering is more mobile, but lacks the punch of Marksman. Interrogation probe is omgwtf awesome for Huttball and for kiting, but there's just not a lot of burst there.
And, the IA has an amazing storyline, so you get that perk.
"Sometimes things aren't complicated," I said. "You just have to be willing to accept the absolute corruption of everybody involved."
Fuck snipers, haha. I've found I can handle myself 1 on 1 against about any class as Vigilance Guardian in pvp, except snipers. Not being able to interrupt them, and the knockback with immobilize just ends my day since I can't leap to them and get my unremitting.
Speaking of unremitting, it's the greatest talent for Guardian/Jugg. Every god damned time I force leap a sorceror/mercenary and they hit their knockback instantly only to have it not work is just magic to me. I can feel them panicking every time.
I can't believe how much better Vigilance Guardian is than I thought it would be. The almost guaranteed crit chance on blade storm and dispatch really make it capable of some heavy sustained. I don't see many, since most people want to spec focus and lol aoe, but in spite of not being focused on AoE and not even hitting force sweep that often unless in a big group, I routinely top damage on my pvp teams. Granted, I'm just better than average players so I would probably do the same on most dps specs, but I'm having a blast.
The key to snipers is that most of their damage is white damage. Any defensive cooldown you have will work. Lethality has some yellow damage but that's it. Also, any cc will knock them out of cover and any immobilize will keep them out.
Yeah, I can pop saber ward for 12 seconds, but since I can't interrupt them and can't leap them, they feel like a pretty hard counter to me, in a 1v1. Especially since if they pop their cc immunity, I can't stasis, push, or awe them.
I'm happy with how my vig guardian plays, because I get to kill tracer missile mercs and dps sorcerors insanely easily. It's not even close with those two, unless the merc realizes not to use his knockback for the first 4 seconds after I leap, and even then I'll generally be back in his face in short order.
Posts
I gotta admit, that really just kind of ruined pvp for me...at least world pvp. Dailies/Weeklies are a nice incentive to pvp, but they're not a chore to me, they're part of the game. Sitting around kill trading just ruins it...it's a job now.
http://www.reddit.com/r/swtor/comments/q9ghl/swtor_huttball_jumping_the_ledge_near_the_air_vent/
Pluto was a planet and I'll never forget
GIS is evil
need to try this tomorrow
I've successfully pulled it off... once. First try, too. :-( Harder than the guy makes it look.
Speaking of obliterate... I've been trying out the rage spec on my juggernaut, and it's a magical wonderland of increased killing power.
slash slash, place dot and or force choke smash
a force camo between the choke and smash renders the entire spec useless
hell even just using force camo whenever makes some of them use smash as a "oh shit he is invisible, better use aoe" button
don't see a lot of vengeance ones tough
Vengeance can be effective, but you have to stick on a target way too long for my taste
PSN: Hellcore- Steam MWO: Hellcore
I'm not sure if there's a pvp specific site people are using.
Yeah I ran Combat for a while, but when I finally switched to Watchman the improvement was very noticeable.
Nintendo Network ID: imperialparadox | 3DS FC: 2294-4029-6793
XBL Gamertag: Paradox3351 | PSN: imperialparadox
...and that was before I hit 36 and now have a stealth opener. :twisted:
If I though the situation demanded it, I would nip out to the front front line and start hurting people, healing around me as I went.
If I had guard, I was a nightmare monster thing that could not be stopped.
On oceania I'm probably making a sentinel unless my partner decides not to play, in which case I'll make a jedi guardian.
Now that I know I can get it next monday for sure, I'm having a hard time not thinking about this constantly.
Even gives me a bit more staying power against things that would normally give concealment ops trouble. Tank Guardians and Powertechs? Simply do not have enough burst to kill you 1v1 when you get below 30% and start spamming your instant heal on yourself... not without smart use of thier stuns and poping any offensive CDs they have at least, and probably an adrenal on top of that as well.
At 50, Marauders are great.
Sub 50, they are kind of shit (as I am finding on my lvl 22 sentinel currently). They just don't have the talents it takes to succeed, whereas other classes do fine with just the stat boost in BGs.
(real men of genius)
Today we salute you, Mr. Absolutely Fucking Terrible in PVP Guy
(Mr. Absolutely Fucking Terrible in PVP Guy)
Anyone can stand next to a objective racking up defense medals but only you can wait until your dead to call incoming
(Return to med center?) Perched next to the door in your level 40 orange gear you tirelessly wait until there is no chance for us to get there in time.
(Keep on suckin')
And while you will complain how there should be two people defending, if anyone shows up to help you are you going to stay put?
(No!)
And even though you've drug every team you have ever been on down like an anchor dropped in a black hole
(Never forget you!)
So crack open an ice-cold Bud Light, you fucktard, because every match you join, you're the MVP.
(Mr. Absolutely Fucking Terrible in PVP Guy)
At 26 I'm squishy as hell and most of the time I'm snared and/or knocked around like a ragdoll but man I'm having fun anyway. I get about half the number of medals in warzones on my Marauder as I do on my Powertech, but I assume that's because of guard and taunt soaking damage. I'm gonna stick it out to 50 because from what I keep reading, Marauder gets fun as hell once you get all the abilities.
PSN: Hellcore- Steam MWO: Hellcore
Oh, no doubt. I really want to play a Marauder, but it would really only be for pvp, and since this game follows the typical MMO character development of "You don't get a complete character until at least level 40!" some classes are just pointless to pvp on before then.
Yeah, then I saw how I was picking off people at an insane rate from 30m away as a Gunslinger, and decided that the pure DPS ACs have thier perks
Marauders have a bit of group utility, especially with all the things they can do with a full stack of Fury (like increasing thier movement speed and defence, increasing damage and healing done, or healing them for the next 6 tics of your dots) Most Annihilation Marauders I've seen are right behind any dedicated healers in total healing done in the match.
Unfortunatly, other than getting the ability to ruin a enemy Gunslinger or Sentinel's day have halving thier base accuarcy, and then only if they spec Marksmanship, Snipers don't get anything like that until 42, with Ballistic Shield.
:^: :^: :^:
While I still intend to play a Marauder and some other DPSers, I love my Vigilance Guardian and Infiltration Shadow, and part of it is definitely getting to semi-tank by using my taunts. It makes a big difference in group battles.
Oh absolutely. I play a squishy Madness Assassin in PvP now and I love throwing down the taunts. If I don't keep them on constant cooldown, I feel like I failed the match.
There isn't much a Concealment Op can't take if you're smart. It's all about positioning, timing, and knowing exactly what you and your enemies can do in any given fight. If you get it right, you destroy your enemy and stealth away. If you get it wrong and your escapes aren't sufficient, you're dead without making much of a dent. Probably 80% of my Huttball games end without a death, and that's often with scoring a goal or two. I've won a couple of Voidstars without dying but that's probably the toughest WZ as Concealment as you stand very little chance of picking someone off out of the pack and getting away, or finding someone 1v1. Civil War is tedious and I hate it even though it's easy to do well there. I wish I could avoid it altogether.
I've tried Medic spec a bit and it's fun to be nigh-invincible but your DPS is too low to overcome even the mildest healing or damage reduction. I've just hit 48 and want to try out hybrid Medic/Concealment, but keeping an eye on 50 PvP gear I don't know if it's ideal there. You don't need alacrity rating at all, but accuracy rating is wasted on your heal abilities. Stacking crit/surge/power seems like the best way to go.
My biggest complaint about playing an Operative is that there are far too many useful abilities to keybind efficiently. Keeping track of what key does what in all of its shift-ctrl-alt permutations makes it hard to time things like Evasion and Adrenaline Probe correctly. Way too much shit to keep track of.
I've got a 50 Sniper and it's very fun - the interesting thing is that I have much more success with the shared DPS poison tree (Lethality?) than I ever did with Marksman or Engineering. Sniper has a few tricks that the Operative doesn't have (Leg shot, cover pulse) but honestly there are more than a few times I think to myself that I'd trade those in for the ability to open up the poison barrage from stealth, or to have a heal button somewhere.
Marksman blows things up, but you're a turret. You are going to be the center of all enemy AoE effects. People are going to line of sight you.
Engineering is more mobile, but lacks the punch of Marksman. Interrogation probe is omgwtf awesome for Huttball and for kiting, but there's just not a lot of burst there.
And, the IA has an amazing storyline, so you get that perk.
Speaking of unremitting, it's the greatest talent for Guardian/Jugg. Every god damned time I force leap a sorceror/mercenary and they hit their knockback instantly only to have it not work is just magic to me. I can feel them panicking every time.
I can't believe how much better Vigilance Guardian is than I thought it would be. The almost guaranteed crit chance on blade storm and dispatch really make it capable of some heavy sustained. I don't see many, since most people want to spec focus and lol aoe, but in spite of not being focused on AoE and not even hitting force sweep that often unless in a big group, I routinely top damage on my pvp teams. Granted, I'm just better than average players so I would probably do the same on most dps specs, but I'm having a blast.
I destroy snipers with ease on my assassin.
I'm happy with how my vig guardian plays, because I get to kill tracer missile mercs and dps sorcerors insanely easily. It's not even close with those two, unless the merc realizes not to use his knockback for the first 4 seconds after I leap, and even then I'll generally be back in his face in short order.