I am officially down for a child actor to play Death.
So many ways you could make that creepy as hell.
For one, film the kid reading innocuous, even humorous lines, then dub it over with an adult's voice reading the actual dialogue. Voices and mannerisms wouldn't match at all, and that could be really creepy. Or maybe cheesy, I don't know.
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Inquisitor772 x Penny Arcade Fight Club ChampionA fixed point in space and timeRegistered Userregular
Macaulay Culkin was creepy AF in "The Good Son" (link NSFW).
I am officially down for a child actor to play Death.
So many ways you could make that creepy as hell.
For one, film the kid reading innocuous, even humorous lines, then dub it over with an adult's voice reading the actual dialogue. Voices and mannerisms wouldn't match at all, and that could be really creepy. Or maybe cheesy, I don't know.
If they planned to have Death in both Dr Strange and Infinity War... how far apart are those two going to be filmed? About 18 months, give or take between DrS and IW pt 1 release dates. If you cast a kid at a certain age you can probably make him/her look roughly the same age, or just grab Brolin while you're filming DrS and do some Thanos stuff too?
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FakefauxCóiste BodharDriving John McCain to meet some Iraqis who'd very much like to make his acquaintanceRegistered Userregular
I keep wondering, what's to keep them from having Swinton play The Ancient One as a couple hundred year old Asian man? The last couple of things I remember seeing her in used relatively heavy make-up, and if they can do it in that god-awful Cloud Atlas movie... They've also capitalized on her androgynous qualities a few times, Constantine and Orlando coming immediately to mind.
I keep wondering, what's to keep them from having Swinton play The Ancient One as a couple hundred year old Asian man? The last couple of things I remember seeing her in used relatively heavy make-up, and if they can do it in that god-awful Cloud Atlas movie... They've also capitalized on her androgynous qualities a few times, Constantine and Orlando coming immediately to mind.
Mainly good taste. Dressing up white actors in makeup to play characters of other ethnicities is a little bit questionable given the history of that.
Inquisitor772 x Penny Arcade Fight Club ChampionA fixed point in space and timeRegistered Userregular
And seriously if you're telling me that the only person who can play an old asian man is Tilda Swinton in heavy makeup then fuck you, because if anything one of the only things Western cinema has allowed asian men to do is play wise old mystics. If you're going to change the role and give it to her, then get rid of the asian component altogether. And give one of the nominally non-asian roles to an asian, while you're at it. (Because fuck you.)
And seriously if you're telling me that the only person who can play an old asian man is Tilda Swinton in heavy makeup then fuck you, because if anything one of the only things Western cinema has allowed asian men to do is play wise old mystics. If you're going to change the role and give it to her, then get rid of the asian component altogether. And give one of the nominally non-asian roles to an asian, while you're at it. (Because fuck you.)
I think that they'll just have Tilda Swinton playing a white female ancient magic person instead of an asian male ancient magic person.
I think the key designator here is "magic person," not "white female" or "asian male." There are only a limited number of actual magic people in Hollywood, so that's major credentials for Swinton.
And seriously if you're telling me that the only person who can play an old asian man is Tilda Swinton in heavy makeup then fuck you, because if anything one of the only things Western cinema has allowed asian men to do is play wise old mystics. If you're going to change the role and give it to her, then get rid of the asian component altogether. And give one of the nominally non-asian roles to an asian, while you're at it. (Because fuck you.)
I think that they'll just have Tilda Swinton playing a white female ancient magic person instead of an asian male ancient magic person.
I think the key designator here is "magic person," not "white female" or "asian male." There are only a limited number of actual magic people in Hollywood, so that's major credentials for Swinton.
Ming-Na Wen could have done it if she wasn't already on AoS.
Are you saying that, per capita, there are more magical asian people?
They're not having a shortage.
I suppose that's slightly less problematic than suggesting a larger quantity of magical black people.
I don't see how that's less problematic then a white actor getting a role for a character whose Asian. It isn't like the MCU films are overpopulated with Asian actors or anything. This'd be less of an issue on the tv side, who have a better track record with this sort of thing. Helen Cho was a big hit in Age of Ultron, and people were excited for Ken Watanabe being Ra's in Batman Begins
Hollywood has a pretty bad track record with magical black men who somehow improve the life of a white guy. Bagger Vance et. al. Asian mystics are such a hoary trope that even Quentin Tarantino played it straight in Kill Bill: Part 2.
I think my real issue here is that they're probably locked into doing an "asian mentor for a white guy" trope in the Iron Fist Netflix show. They probably just considered veteran "otherworldly" actors for The Ancient One and went with Tilda because their casting gurus, who have been pretty spot-on, think that she'll knock it out of the park.
Hollywood has a pretty bad track record with magical black men who somehow improve the life of a white guy. Bagger Vance et. al. Asian mystics are such a hoary trope that even Quentin Tarantino played it straight in Kill Bill: Part 2.
They don't have to play it straight, though. That's a juicy role for any Asian actor to have. They can subvert it in any number of entertaining ways. Write it as a wise mentor who happens to be Asian, not an Asian who happens to be a wise mentor. The MCU's excelled at this when they're motivated. That's why Nick Fury, Falcon and Helen Cho worked.
I think my real issue here is that they're probably locked into doing an "asian mentor for a white guy" trope in the Iron Fist Netflix show. They probably just considered veteran "otherworldly" actors for The Ancient One and went with Tilda because their casting gurus, who have been pretty spot-on, think that she'll knock it out of the park.
Technically they started off with Yinsen with Iron Man. He wasn't Asian, but he wasn't white either. Why would their Netflix series having an Asian mentor effect their movie division? The movies are their crown jewel with the largest audience, Netflix can't compete with that. It also discounts Stick who was Daredevil's white mentor, and that didn't stop them from casting Swinton. The casting gurus have been spot on, this is a great casting. That's not the problem. It's that they're whitewashed another big Asian role when the movies haven't got many Asian actors to begin with.
I have mixed feelings about this Tilda Swinton thing.
On the one hand, she's a great actor, the MCU needs more prominent women, and the comics Ancient One is a blatant "Wise Old Asian Man On Top of a Mountain" stereotype. On the other hand, the MCU has even fewer prominent roles for Asians than it does for women, and there are ways to get around the worst of the cliches in the Ancient One's character, so to some extent this feels like a bit of a missed opportunity.
Also, Swinton would have made a kickass Nightmare.
Really curious to see how they handle Wong, now.
I dunno, I have difficulty getting too bent out of shape because a role that should have gone to this underrepresented group instead went to that underrepresented group.
Well for one, you aren't going to get any change in the underrepresentation if all you're doing is robbing Peter to pay Paul. If you actually want to address the issue, and take for granted that there are only so many roles to go around, then I'd say it's 100% a problem unless they're changing male or non-white roles as well. Companies still do this thing where they hire black females for one job just to fulfill their "quota".
It isn't about fulfilling a quota, it's about giving characters who aren't defined by their caucasian ancestry a chance to be played by minorities because there's no reason they can't do it now. And the fact that the lead roles in the movies are still dominated by white men. As well as giving minorities a shot at big roles in their movies. Age of Ultron did this with Helen Cho, Asian actors are very rare in those sort of roles and they lost one to Tilda Swinton, presumably. By adding minorities to roles they're definitely adding representation to their movies. Samuel L. Jackson is a huge success as Nick Fury in the MCU.
A good example of this is Trask in X-Men: DofP. There's no need whatsoever for the role to be played by a short person: it just is. Brilliantly, I might add. It doesn't define the character in any way whatsoever, they just went out and bagged themselves a good actor.
I have mixed feelings about this Tilda Swinton thing.
On the one hand, she's a great actor, the MCU needs more prominent women, and the comics Ancient One is a blatant "Wise Old Asian Man On Top of a Mountain" stereotype. On the other hand, the MCU has even fewer prominent roles for Asians than it does for women, and there are ways to get around the worst of the cliches in the Ancient One's character, so to some extent this feels like a bit of a missed opportunity.
Also, Swinton would have made a kickass Nightmare.
Really curious to see how they handle Wong, now.
I dunno, I have difficulty getting too bent out of shape because a role that should have gone to this underrepresented group instead went to that underrepresented group.
Well for one, you aren't going to get any change in the underrepresentation if all you're doing is robbing Peter to pay Paul. If you actually want to address the issue, and take for granted that there are only so many roles to go around, then I'd say it's 100% a problem unless they're changing male or non-white roles as well. Companies still do this thing where they hire black females for one job just to fulfill their "quota".
It isn't about fulfilling a quota, it's about giving characters who aren't defined by their caucasian ancestry a chance to be played by minorities because there's no reason they can't do it now. And the fact that the lead roles in the movies are still dominated by white men. As well as giving minorities a shot at big roles in their movies. Age of Ultron did this with Helen Cho, Asian actors are very rare in those sort of roles and they lost one to Tilda Swinton, presumably. By adding minorities to roles they're definitely adding representation to their movies. Samuel L. Jackson is a huge success as Nick Fury in the MCU.
A good example of this is Trask in X-Men: DofP. There's no need whatsoever for the role to be played by a short person: it just is. Brilliantly, I might add. It doesn't define the character in any way whatsoever.
And seriously if you're telling me that the only person who can play an old asian man is Tilda Swinton in heavy makeup then fuck you, because if anything one of the only things Western cinema has allowed asian men to do is play wise old mystics. If you're going to change the role and give it to her, then get rid of the asian component altogether. And give one of the nominally non-asian roles to an asian, while you're at it. (Because fuck you.)
I think that they'll just have Tilda Swinton playing a white female ancient magic person instead of an asian male ancient magic person.
I think the key designator here is "magic person," not "white female" or "asian male." There are only a limited number of actual magic people in Hollywood, so that's major credentials for Swinton.
After her scene in Constantine, I wouldn't be surprised if they just did "white ancient magic person" an leave it to the audience as to what gender she's suppose to be.
The could address the lack of asians in the MCU by borrowing a certain kick ass SHIELD agent
alls Im sayin...
She's awesome, but I would love to see a Jimmy Woo in Agents of Atlas movie. The setup would work so well within the MCU.
Agents of Atlas:
Jimmy Wu is a SHIELD agent who ends up inheriting an ancient evil supervillain group from his evil dead dad. Wu and his team decide to roll with it, keeping up the evil supervillain image so his troops don't defect while actually doing good.
They're great fun. Plus, with the setup, you can have them fight the Avengers and win.
Nah. Monica Rambeau, Manifold, Falcon, Luke Cage, Brother Voodoo, War Machine, Nick Fury (if you want to count being inpossible to kill off as a power), Cyborg, Green Lantern, and some others that I can't remember the names to right now are all non-electric.
In the movies there's what, Electro and Static Shock? Static is the only one out of the comics I can think of that's a black guy with electric powers.
Hollywood has a pretty bad track record with magical black men who somehow improve the life of a white guy. Bagger Vance et. al. Asian mystics are such a hoary trope that even Quentin Tarantino played it straight in Kill Bill: Part 2.
They don't have to play it straight, though. That's a juicy role for any Asian actor to have. They can subvert it in any number of entertaining ways. Write it as a wise mentor who happens to be Asian, not an Asian who happens to be a wise mentor. The MCU's excelled at this when they're motivated. That's why Nick Fury, Falcon and Helen Cho worked.
Neither Fury nor Falcon nor Cho are doing that at all. They are all just characters who happen to be black. There is no stereotype to play in to there.
Your wise ancient sage who teaches the broken wandering white hero how to harness his inner power is asian because of course (s)he fucking is, they always are cause that's the stereotype.
Nah. Monica Rambeau, Manifold, Falcon, Luke Cage, Brother Voodoo, War Machine, Nick Fury (if you want to count being inpossible to kill off as a power), Cyborg, Green Lantern, and some others that I can't remember the names to right now are all non-electric.
In the movies there's what, Electro and Static Shock? Static is the only one out of the comics I can think of that's a black guy with electric powers.
Yes, but think of characters with electric powers and note how many are black.
Edit - oh, you tried. Also add Black Vulcan, Storm, Miles Morales, Black Lightning
Nah. Monica Rambeau, Manifold, Falcon, Luke Cage, Brother Voodoo, War Machine, Nick Fury (if you want to count being inpossible to kill off as a power), Cyborg, Green Lantern, and some others that I can't remember the names to right now are all non-electric.
In the movies there's what, Electro and Static Shock? Static is the only one out of the comics I can think of that's a black guy with electric powers.
Yes, but think of characters with electric powers and note how many are black.
Hollywood has a pretty bad track record with magical black men who somehow improve the life of a white guy. Bagger Vance et. al. Asian mystics are such a hoary trope that even Quentin Tarantino played it straight in Kill Bill: Part 2.
They don't have to play it straight, though. That's a juicy role for any Asian actor to have. They can subvert it in any number of entertaining ways. Write it as a wise mentor who happens to be Asian, not an Asian who happens to be a wise mentor. The MCU's excelled at this when they're motivated. That's why Nick Fury, Falcon and Helen Cho worked.
Neither Fury nor Falcon nor Cho are doing that at all. They are all just characters who happen to be black. There is no stereotype to play in to there.
Exactly, that's why I listed those as positive examples. There's always negative stereotypes for minority actors to play in roles, Marvel simply rose above it and exceeded expectations.
Your wise ancient sage who teaches the broken wandering white hero how to harness his inner power is asian because of course (s)he fucking is, they always are cause that's the stereotype.
It's a negative stereotype if it's written that way, hiring an Asian actor doesn't mean they have to do that anymore than having a black actor for Nick Fury means he has to be black negative stereotype. It's on the writers, not the actor - no matter their ethnicity. We know Marvel can do this, and having an Asian actor isn't going to force them to write negative stereotypes. If that was the case Marvel wouldn't touch Luke Cage, not give him a series on Netflix. There's also a dearth of Asian roles in the movie branch, this is their opportunity to give a major role to them.
edit: I gather if Tilden gets the role they'll be changing it for her. No reason they can't do that for an Asian actor so it's not a negative stereotype.
Nah. Monica Rambeau, Manifold, Falcon, Luke Cage, Brother Voodoo, War Machine, Nick Fury (if you want to count being inpossible to kill off as a power), Cyborg, Green Lantern, and some others that I can't remember the names to right now are all non-electric.
In the movies there's what, Electro and Static Shock? Static is the only one out of the comics I can think of that's a black guy with electric powers.
Yes, but think of characters with electric powers and note how many are black.
It's really not that many and those lists are pretty generous with who they're counting as being able to shoot electricity.
I guess there's Storm but she's always firmly been just straight up "controls the weather" in my mind. I will freely admit complete ignorance regarding anything involving DC so there is that.
Nah. Monica Rambeau, Manifold, Falcon, Luke Cage, Brother Voodoo, War Machine, Nick Fury (if you want to count being inpossible to kill off as a power), Cyborg, Green Lantern, and some others that I can't remember the names to right now are all non-electric.
In the movies there's what, Electro and Static Shock? Static is the only one out of the comics I can think of that's a black guy with electric powers.
Yes, but think of characters with electric powers and note how many are black.
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Imagine the dialogue! And Drew Carrey could be his man servant. The original Drew Carrey, not the weird shell of a Drew Carrey that we have now.
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As for Death, they should do the thing where she appears as a little girl and it creeps Thanos the fuck out. Maybe Elle Fanning?
A late night talk show host whose show was stolen by a big chinned denim wearing former friend?
Truth be told, I would love for death to first show up in that form.
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So many ways you could make that creepy as hell.
For one, film the kid reading innocuous, even humorous lines, then dub it over with an adult's voice reading the actual dialogue. Voices and mannerisms wouldn't match at all, and that could be really creepy. Or maybe cheesy, I don't know.
Which is a travesty. I love The Oath but I really wish I could direct people to a way to easily access some of the other great Strange stories.
Mainly good taste. Dressing up white actors in makeup to play characters of other ethnicities is a little bit questionable given the history of that.
I think that they'll just have Tilda Swinton playing a white female ancient magic person instead of an asian male ancient magic person.
I think the key designator here is "magic person," not "white female" or "asian male." There are only a limited number of actual magic people in Hollywood, so that's major credentials for Swinton.
Ming-Na Wen could have done it if she wasn't already on AoS.
I suppose that's slightly less problematic than suggesting a larger quantity of magical black people.
They're not having a shortage.
I don't see how that's less problematic then a white actor getting a role for a character whose Asian. It isn't like the MCU films are overpopulated with Asian actors or anything. This'd be less of an issue on the tv side, who have a better track record with this sort of thing. Helen Cho was a big hit in Age of Ultron, and people were excited for Ken Watanabe being Ra's in Batman Begins
I think my real issue here is that they're probably locked into doing an "asian mentor for a white guy" trope in the Iron Fist Netflix show. They probably just considered veteran "otherworldly" actors for The Ancient One and went with Tilda because their casting gurus, who have been pretty spot-on, think that she'll knock it out of the park.
Plus, if you can't get Mako, why bother?
(I blame a lack of sleep)
They don't have to play it straight, though. That's a juicy role for any Asian actor to have. They can subvert it in any number of entertaining ways. Write it as a wise mentor who happens to be Asian, not an Asian who happens to be a wise mentor. The MCU's excelled at this when they're motivated. That's why Nick Fury, Falcon and Helen Cho worked.
Technically they started off with Yinsen with Iron Man. He wasn't Asian, but he wasn't white either. Why would their Netflix series having an Asian mentor effect their movie division? The movies are their crown jewel with the largest audience, Netflix can't compete with that. It also discounts Stick who was Daredevil's white mentor, and that didn't stop them from casting Swinton. The casting gurus have been spot on, this is a great casting. That's not the problem. It's that they're whitewashed another big Asian role when the movies haven't got many Asian actors to begin with.
Because there's more Asian talent waiting for the opportunity.
A good example of this is Trask in X-Men: DofP. There's no need whatsoever for the role to be played by a short person: it just is. Brilliantly, I might add. It doesn't define the character in any way whatsoever, they just went out and bagged themselves a good actor.
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And Bill Duke was Trask in X-men: The Last Stand.
I just wanted an excuse to post the Bushido Blade commercial.
After her scene in Constantine, I wouldn't be surprised if they just did "white ancient magic person" an leave it to the audience as to what gender she's suppose to be.
She's awesome, but I would love to see a Jimmy Woo in Agents of Atlas movie. The setup would work so well within the MCU.
Agents of Atlas:
They're great fun. Plus, with the setup, you can have them fight the Avengers and win.
Everyone knows black people aren't magical. They're made out of electricity.
Er... black people are plenty magical
WARNING: Might not be SFW
Oh I know all about that. But there is a crazy over arcing trend that when a black guy gets powers in the comics, they are electric based.
In the movies there's what, Electro and Static Shock? Static is the only one out of the comics I can think of that's a black guy with electric powers.
Neither Fury nor Falcon nor Cho are doing that at all. They are all just characters who happen to be black. There is no stereotype to play in to there.
Your wise ancient sage who teaches the broken wandering white hero how to harness his inner power is asian because of course (s)he fucking is, they always are cause that's the stereotype.
They recently recast a white villain with a black actor, that villain, was of course Electro
Yes, but think of characters with electric powers and note how many are black.
Edit - oh, you tried. Also add Black Vulcan, Storm, Miles Morales, Black Lightning
Exactly, that's why I listed those as positive examples. There's always negative stereotypes for minority actors to play in roles, Marvel simply rose above it and exceeded expectations.
It's a negative stereotype if it's written that way, hiring an Asian actor doesn't mean they have to do that anymore than having a black actor for Nick Fury means he has to be black negative stereotype. It's on the writers, not the actor - no matter their ethnicity. We know Marvel can do this, and having an Asian actor isn't going to force them to write negative stereotypes. If that was the case Marvel wouldn't touch Luke Cage, not give him a series on Netflix. There's also a dearth of Asian roles in the movie branch, this is their opportunity to give a major role to them.
edit: I gather if Tilden gets the role they'll be changing it for her. No reason they can't do that for an Asian actor so it's not a negative stereotype.
http://marvel.wikia.com/Category:Electrokinesis
http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Category:Electrokinesis
It's really not that many and those lists are pretty generous with who they're counting as being able to shoot electricity.
I guess there's Storm but she's always firmly been just straight up "controls the weather" in my mind. I will freely admit complete ignorance regarding anything involving DC so there is that.
EDIT: Haha, wow. http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Black_Power_(Crisis_on_Two_Earths) "Black Power is the evil counterpart of Black Lightning"
I'm trying really hard not to be snarky here, so I'm just gonna say that your links do not self-evidently support your argument.