On July 7 at 2 p.m. EDT, Mag Prime, Boar Prime and Dakra Prime will enter the Prime Vault, with all of their crafting parts abolished from The Void. If you already wield the power of these Primes, they will remain in your inventory.
Also you have presents waiting if you log in, Red White and Blue colors, some fireworks and a Paris skin.
I don't understand, what's the point of removing prime versions of warframes?
Not gonna lie, as a new player who really likes playing Mag, I'm kind of disappointed that I won't be able to craft a prime version.
Reduce supply, increase secondary market prices, sell more plat.
That's the point.
It's also the point of the void trader. Over time people acquired tons of copies of the old stuff. This lowered their value on the market. Void trader comes around and gets people to shred their inventory. Then they can discontinue the old items to raise their trade value again.
And yes, they are giving you the middle finger for not playing a year or two ago. This keeps being brought up, but a lot of people REALLY want more exclusive gear that they can Lord over people or try to sell at exorbitant prices.
I'm starting to see why this game has a problem with player retention.
This definitely won't get me to quit, don't get me wrong, I'm still having a lot of fun with the game. I just wish the developers weren't so hostile to newer players.
They could also remove resources and keys from void, then shift all key drops to nonendless planet missions to give them a point. That alone would probably resolve it.
On July 7 at 2 p.m. EDT, Mag Prime, Boar Prime and Dakra Prime will enter the Prime Vault, with all of their crafting parts abolished from The Void. If you already wield the power of these Primes, they will remain in your inventory.
Also you have presents waiting if you log in, Red White and Blue colors, some fireworks and a Paris skin.
I don't understand, what's the point of removing prime versions of warframes?
Not gonna lie, as a new player who really likes playing Mag, I'm kind of disappointed that I won't be able to craft a prime version.
Reduce supply, increase secondary market prices, sell more plat.
That's the point.
Arguments like these seem to suggest that you think DE, a company, is not providing a product with the intent to make money off it. :hydra:
That said, something old goes so something new can come in. There's a functional limit to how much you can maintain within the loot tables w/o rendering them even more to the point of "nobody ever gets what they want."
Yes, they can add a token/exchange system like the ones many have suggested, but that takes time, restructuring, and the system that's there isn't necessarily broken just yet.
...It's also the point of the void trader. Over time people acquired tons of copies of the old stuff. This lowered their value on the market. Void trader comes around and gets people to shred their inventory. Then they can discontinue the old items to raise their trade value again.
And yes, they are giving you the middle finger for not playing a year or two ago. This keeps being brought up, but a lot of people REALLY want more exclusive gear that they can Lord over people or try to sell at exorbitant prices.
An edit like that 6 minutes after post warrants a tag to say what you edited in. :P
You're absolutely right about the void trader coming into existence to regulate the value of the old void items. Why? Because:
As for your latter, you can't really argue the intentions of a population based off either end of the optimistic or pessimistic spectrum. Yes, some people do want exclusive gear to do that. But possessing a thing that other people cannot possess doesn't necessarily imply that you are better than them or a need to display that. But that's a circular and highly subjective argument in and of itself. So, just gonna leave it at that.
tastydonuts on
“I used to draw, hard to admit that I used to draw...”
The void loot system has been flawed for years and only gets more dilluted over time. Players have continuously suggested solutions, such as a token buy system, but player feedback has been consistently ignored in favor of compounding the problem by stuffing more prime parts into the tables and devoting most of the tables to trash rewards like o-cells, credits, and keys.
This is all on DE.
3DS Friend Code:
Armchair: 4098-3704-2012
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MaddocI'm Bobbin Threadbare, are you my mother?Registered Userregular
I would argue strongly that the system has been broken since they added the second wave of Prime items way back in the fucking mists of time.
The problem is that DE stuffs ludicrous amounts of parts into a small pool of void missions, and then shrinks the pool even further by filling the loot tables with garbage rewards. And the common parts are of course duplicated across multiple missions, taking up even more space on the tables.
T1 missions are easy, and the keys drop like candy, so of course they have nothing of fucking value. T1 Defense doesn't even have a single prime part in its entire drop table. I have 60+ of those keys, they pile up because there's literally no reason to run them.
Meanwhile T3/T4 Survival and the Sabotages are bursting at the gills with critical parts that you can't get anywhere else. Because they're "the rare keys" they're the go-to bottleneck for slowing down acquisition which I'm sure would be defended as "extending the life of the game" but also has that delightful side-effect of jacking up trade prices and thus selling more plat.
I'm not even gonna get into the o-cells, fusion cores (but not 5xR5 packs, oh no!) or forma bps.
If they'd actually make an effort to include all the game modes, times four (or even five!) tiers, and quit it with the useless garbage "rewards" then nothing would ever need to go into the damn disney vault.
But they won't.
First they came for the Muslims, and we said NOT TODAY, MOTHERFUCKERS
Poked my head into this game for the first time in two years...Jesus Christ there's a lot of changes. Ships? Hubs? Void traders? New melee system? Flowing scarfs? So much stuff.
Since Excalibur apparently just went through a rework, and my Excal Prime was never leveled, I guess I'll start with him and start working my way through the game again.
Do fresh frames generally just go through the quests like before to level, or are there more efficient methods that have been added?
I literally need to learn this entire game over again.
If it was greed they would have the arcane hats and retired prime stuff in market on occasion like they do the special skins. As it is, outside of slots and the occasional tater/forma there isn't a Plat sink. Just looks how expensive frames are, you can generally get a prime set off trade for less then the base frame sold in DE's market.
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Caulk Bite 6One of the multitude of Dans infesting this placeRegistered Userregular
T1 missions are easy, and the keys drop like candy, so of course they have nothing of fucking value. T1 Defense doesn't even have a single prime part in its entire drop table. I have 60+ of those keys, they pile up because there's literally no reason to run them.
Not sure which table you're looking at, but these are on T1 defense
Hikou Prime Stars
Vasto Prime Receiver
Ankyros Prime Blueprint
Rhino Prime Systems Blueprint
I'm just saying, if you want to predict DE's actions, then ask yourself the following questions.
Will the decision increase grind? Will it raise trade chat prices? Can they quietly sweep this new feature under the rug a month after release once they've squeezed all the hype from it?
Those are the dousing rods you can use to predict how DE will respond 9 times out of 10.
The void loot system has been flawed for years and only gets more dilluted over time. Players have continuously suggested solutions, such as a token buy system, but player feedback has been consistently ignored in favor of compounding the problem by stuffing more prime parts into the tables and devoting most of the tables to trash rewards like o-cells, credits, and keys.
This is all on DE.
First and foremost, I do agree that tying a large stock of items to a small portion of content without consideration to how much your content was going to scale and grow wasn't an ideal choice. But...
As a free to play game, it thrives on the purchase of platinum to finance itself in lieu of subscriptions. It could be argued that the Prime Access options are a form of upfront subscription packages, but they need to keep the in-game economy churning to generate money to keep the lights on and less "hey guys we got bought out" from happening. A la carte offerings, while good for the player are not good for a Free to Play game's finances long-term, and really just pushes the perception of their micro-transactions heavily into the "pay 2 win" criticism.
I guess I'm just saying I'm not too bothered by their curating the random, because I know it has to be random. Having all the things available all the time devalues everything, so it's also necessary to take things out and rotate them in too. Players ripping off other players is just a product of how free markets work in general though (we are greedy by nature), and they definitely need an auction house, public marketplace or other first party means of tracking trade values so that transactions don't occur in a vacuum and the market's prices could sustainably regulate themselves.
“I used to draw, hard to admit that I used to draw...”
Don't think you will find an argument against extremely rarity of a key part pushing prime packs. I just find the Disney Vault to free up loot table slots to be a screwy reason for DE to give.
If they really want to enforce rarity all they have to do is limit on-hand amounts of distinct parts like they do kubrow eggs to prevent hoarding.
On July 7 at 2 p.m. EDT, Mag Prime, Boar Prime and Dakra Prime will enter the Prime Vault, with all of their crafting parts abolished from The Void. If you already wield the power of these Primes, they will remain in your inventory.
Also you have presents waiting if you log in, Red White and Blue colors, some fireworks and a Paris skin.
I don't understand, what's the point of removing prime versions of warframes?
Not gonna lie, as a new player who really likes playing Mag, I'm kind of disappointed that I won't be able to craft a prime version.
It's their halfassed solution to the bloat in the void loot tables. Rather than add new mission types or something (Void Spy! Void Sabotage! Void Interceptions other than T4!), they started cycling the old primes into the disneyprime vault
Don't think you will find an argument against extremely rarity of a key part pushing prime packs. I just find the Disney Vault to free up loot table slots to be a screwy reason for DE to give.
If they really want to enforce rarity all they have to do is limit on-hand amounts of distinct parts like they do kubrow eggs to prevent hoarding.
Problem with that is now you have players that do a run and can truly wind up with nothing (you can still trade a bp/part you don't want) and the best means of preventing that (excluding items from dropping if already possessed/capped) leads to the system being gamed beyond their intent.
It's all a tightrope of balancing player fairness and well, your bottom line.
“I used to draw, hard to admit that I used to draw...”
It's all a tightrope of balancing player fairness and well, your bottom line.
I don't buy that. Treating players poorly doesn't mean they'll pay you more money (the whales will, but nobody else). Treating players poorly means they'll just start hemorrhaging from your game. I think Valve has pretty convincingly proven that building of a consistent amount of goodwill with your community will make them throw money at you, even if you make the whole thing free. Not even free with grinding, just free.
I think DE would be doing fine if Warframe was an entirely free game with some grind. Trying to milk their players for more platinum like this just makes people dislike them, but the irony is if they removed those sorts of walls and just treated their players well, I think the players would spend just as much, if not more, money on the game.
I will pull my wallet out and pay 40 bucks to Dota 2 for an Arcana set just because. I won't do that for Warframe. Being unfair (even appearing unfair) to your players has financial consequences.
Edit: I want to be clear. I don't mean that DE should remove the grinding from Warframe, as it is a Diablo-like game. I mean that adding more grindwalls to make their players buy platinum is doing more harm than good.
Don't think you will find an argument against extremely rarity of a key part pushing prime packs. I just find the Disney Vault to free up loot table slots to be a screwy reason for DE to give.
If they really want to enforce rarity all they have to do is limit on-hand amounts of distinct parts like they do kubrow eggs to prevent hoarding.
Problem with that is now you have players that do a run and can truly wind up with nothing (you can still trade a bp/part you don't want) and the best means of preventing that (excluding items from dropping if already possessed/capped) leads to the system being gamed beyond their intent.
It's all a tightrope of balancing player fairness and well, your bottom line.
They already do a dupe check for the sigils and eggs, no reason they couldn't just cash out the dupe as duckets on reward screen.
On a lighter note several new ungodly nightmare mods (platinum pack bonus and in nightmare loot come thurs):
A comparison between DE and Valve doesn't really work because one of them is financially sustained by virtue of its being one of (if not) the world's major digital distribution marketplaces for a platform and the other? Well, offering their games in said marketplace.
I don't think it's unfair that a person who is just starting after Mag Prime is removed won't be able to go into the void and randomly have a shot at getting her because Mag Prime's been in the game for nearly 2 years? It's old content, and as a game that's free, they're under no obligation to keep it available in perpetuity. The base model for Mag Prime (and Frost Prime, and whichever Prime is on the chopping block next when we revisit this conversation in a few months) are still around for a player to use, and given it's the mods that carry frames, not having the blinged out version isn't truly big deal.
Even in the area of event mods (of which as an Xbox One player I lack many), you can still build a weapon that performs just as well, even if there is a slight gap in performance.
But as you said, it's a matter of appearances. It appears unfair to you, but largely fair to me. I guess we just gotta agree to disagree?
tastydonuts on
“I used to draw, hard to admit that I used to draw...”
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Citizen KupoIn between here and thereRegistered Userregular
edited June 2015
Jesus, when was the last time they added nightmare mods? I don't think they've done that since I started playing. At any rate, those look pretty sweet.
The new Abra Paris skin looks pretty neat too. Shame I can't slap it onto my Paris Prime yet. They've said they're working on that here, but who knows how long that'll take or how far it'll extend (i.e. would it just be the stuff with community skins, or all primes with applicable skins?).
But as you said, it's a matter of appearances. It appears unfair to you, but largely fair to me. I guess we just gotta agree to disagree?
Maybe that has something to do with you being a longtime player and me starting last week :surprised:
I know it's unfair to compare Valve and DE, I was just looking for a similar example. I guess a better comparison would be to compare DE and the Path of Exile devs, Grinding Gear Games. Both only have one game, and PoE is free to play as well. But anyways, that's getting side tracked.
I mean just look at how the tone of my comments changed ever since this announcement. I'm not particularly happy with DE, and I'm brand spanking new, I started last week.
I think this is something that a lot of free to play developers get wrong in the industry. They're focused on the profit, when instead they should be focused on making their players happy. If the players aren't happy, the profit dries up, and then the game gets into this feedback loop: they try to milk the whales out of more money, but that discourages the newer players from staying, so they leave. The whales then stop playing too, because the only reason the whales are playing is because they have more shiny things than the new players.
If they're having problems with profit, why would they want to punish people like me who are excited about the game?
Valves financial security allowed them to experiment with making profit with a free game like Dota where your purchases are purely cosmetic and give you no mechanical advantage (or a time advantage by circumventing grind). A game where both a newbie and vet play each game on mechanically equal footing. The only difference between the player is experience and skill.
Valve showed that such a system can not only work, but thrive as a huge success. It is no longer uncertain ground. Others can follow in valve's footsteps without needing the kind of financial safety net that valve enjoys.
Edit:
I need that run speed mod to stack with my sprint aura, vanilla sprint mod, and maglev.
Also the shotgun mod for my carrier.
Hopefully these mods will have drop rates higher than blaze
While it is framed as being for the €£$, there is a functional reason for Mag getting retired.
The way it works there will always be common/"junk" rewards on the tables. Adding another item dilutes the pool, and when it comes to rares thats a n% * n% hit in odds. Not viable.
Not many people like the rotations either... so they cant add another tier of that w/o making things annoying for all. Not viable.
A la carte? Not viable.
Swapping the olds for the new, given what they have to work with is simply more pragmatic.
“I used to draw, hard to admit that I used to draw...”
T1 missions are easy, and the keys drop like candy, so of course they have nothing of fucking value. T1 Defense doesn't even have a single prime part in its entire drop table. I have 60+ of those keys, they pile up because there's literally no reason to run them.
Not sure which table you're looking at, but these are on T1 defense
Hikou Prime Stars
Vasto Prime Receiver
Ankyros Prime Blueprint
Rhino Prime Systems Blueprint
Granted they're all on wave C, but still.
While all of those are good, like you said they're on Wave C. Furthermore, this one exception doesn't excuse how much great loot Towers III and IV have in comparison to I and II. It's just absolutely mind blowing how the best stuff is kept on them. If DE would just do away with Fusion Cores and Orokin Cells are rewards (I must admit for all the time in the void I've put in, today was my first time getting Orokin Cells as a reward) then maybe they could focus on spreading some of the rewards around to compensate. I don't think that'd be hard at all, just make some edits and so many people could be made happy.
Then again, I'm probably wrong about something there.
The solution to dilution is to increase the size of the pool. This isn't rocket science, it's been pointed out for years, and the silence is deafening.
First they came for the Muslims, and we said NOT TODAY, MOTHERFUCKERS
Blueprint: Tower III Defense (C), Tower III Exterminate
Helmet: Tower IV Sabotage, Tower IV Survival C
Chassis : Tower II Survival (C), Tower III Exterminate
Systems: Tower III Sabotage, Tower III Survival (C), Tower IV Interception (B)
So just run those void missions to get them. The only real difficulty will likely be in getting the helmet. That's the only part that doesn't seem to be common.
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Orphanerivers of redthat run to seaRegistered Userregular
RNGthulhu will not fall for your clever reverse psychology!
My Kubro finally matured. His name is Klepto, since he opens lockers. He's the breed that runs down capture targets (Sunika), so Bumpus in honor of the neighbor bloodhounds from A Christmas Story might have been better. Too late now! Also, he's got mod slots with polarity. Can you forma a dog?
After 30 extractor runs (16 Titan & 14 Distilling) not one rare resource has been produced. Has anyone found extractors worthwhile?
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Orphanerivers of redthat run to seaRegistered Userregular
you can orokin reactor and forma dogs, yeah
and extractors are not something you should expect to get rare resources from, expect nothing but commons and you will be pleasantly surprised when you get the rare stuff
Goddamn it I've killed like a million lancers by now.
Where's my fucking Heavy Trauma mod.
Why would you want one? It's generally inferior to all other damage mods.
"The western world sips from a poisonous cocktail: Polarisation, populism, protectionism and post-truth"
-Antje Jackelén, Archbishop of the Church of Sweden
I forget the rare resource drop rate for the extractors, but I'm 90% sure it is lower single digits (i think distilling extractors are twice as likely to give you rares...and still in the single digit %'s to get you a rare drop).
I mostly use my extractors to maintain a trickle of common mats from zones that I never visit anymore so that I can keep spamming my large restores.
Blueprint: Tower III Defense (C), Tower III Exterminate
Helmet: Tower IV Sabotage, Tower IV Survival C
Chassis : Tower II Survival (C), Tower III Exterminate
Systems: Tower III Sabotage, Tower III Survival (C), Tower IV Interception (B)
So just run those void missions to get them. The only real difficulty will likely be in getting the helmet. That's the only part that doesn't seem to be common.
Dang, I was hoping these would be easier. I don't think I have the gear to do a bunch of IVs and IIIs
Blueprint: Tower III Defense (C), Tower III Exterminate
Helmet: Tower IV Sabotage, Tower IV Survival C
Chassis : Tower II Survival (C), Tower III Exterminate
Systems: Tower III Sabotage, Tower III Survival (C), Tower IV Interception (B)
So just run those void missions to get them. The only real difficulty will likely be in getting the helmet. That's the only part that doesn't seem to be common.
Dang, I was hoping these would be easier. I don't think I have the gear to do a bunch of IVs and IIIs
Your other option is looking at the PA trade document, seeing who has what you want and acquiring what they want for a trade. Although I'm not sure how accurate the trade doc is these days. Most of the entries are old, and I'm sure some stock has dwindled now that the Void Trader is a thing.
Blueprint: Tower III Defense (C), Tower III Exterminate
Helmet: Tower IV Sabotage, Tower IV Survival C
Chassis : Tower II Survival (C), Tower III Exterminate
Systems: Tower III Sabotage, Tower III Survival (C), Tower IV Interception (B)
So just run those void missions to get them. The only real difficulty will likely be in getting the helmet. That's the only part that doesn't seem to be common.
Dang, I was hoping these would be easier. I don't think I have the gear to do a bunch of IVs and IIIs
Last I checked if you have a Mag + Greedy Pull your probably qualified. Nekros is another one that if your shooting stuff then something has generally gone wrong.
Though at that level folks generally want to see a corrosive projection aura as 4x negates all armor.
I still don't get why people are claiming DE is losing players. Warframe has consistently had like 17k players for the last year. It remains on the ps4 top digital list. People might shuffle but DE isn't really losing anything.
Also a completely cosmetic shop only really works when you can regularly show off. I'd wager a large portion of the WF playerbase probably doesn't even interact with other people. It's the main reason I really don't bother with cosmetics.
I still don't get why people are claiming DE is losing players. Warframe has consistently had like 17k players for the last year. It remains on the ps4 top digital list. People might shuffle but DE isn't really losing anything.
Also a completely cosmetic shop only really works when you can regularly show off. I'd wager a large portion of the WF playerbase probably doesn't even interact with other people. It's the main reason I really don't bother with cosmetics.
People claim all sorts of stuff that suits their particular views, regardless of objective logic.
I still don't get why people are claiming DE is losing players. Warframe has consistently had like 17k players for the last year. It remains on the ps4 top digital list. People might shuffle but DE isn't really losing anything.
Also a completely cosmetic shop only really works when you can regularly show off. I'd wager a large portion of the WF playerbase probably doesn't even interact with other people. It's the main reason I really don't bother with cosmetics.
People claim all sorts of stuff that suits their particular views, regardless of objective logic.
While true, you could probably phrase that a little less abrasively. :P
“I used to draw, hard to admit that I used to draw...”
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Reduce supply, increase secondary market prices, sell more plat.
That's the point.
It's also the point of the void trader. Over time people acquired tons of copies of the old stuff. This lowered their value on the market. Void trader comes around and gets people to shred their inventory. Then they can discontinue the old items to raise their trade value again.
And yes, they are giving you the middle finger for not playing a year or two ago. This keeps being brought up, but a lot of people REALLY want more exclusive gear that they can Lord over people or try to sell at exorbitant prices.
Armchair: 4098-3704-2012
This definitely won't get me to quit, don't get me wrong, I'm still having a lot of fun with the game. I just wish the developers weren't so hostile to newer players.
Arguments like these seem to suggest that you think DE, a company, is not providing a product with the intent to make money off it. :hydra:
That said, something old goes so something new can come in. There's a functional limit to how much you can maintain within the loot tables w/o rendering them even more to the point of "nobody ever gets what they want."
Yes, they can add a token/exchange system like the ones many have suggested, but that takes time, restructuring, and the system that's there isn't necessarily broken just yet.
ETA:
An edit like that 6 minutes after post warrants a tag to say what you edited in. :P
You're absolutely right about the void trader coming into existence to regulate the value of the old void items. Why? Because:
As for your latter, you can't really argue the intentions of a population based off either end of the optimistic or pessimistic spectrum. Yes, some people do want exclusive gear to do that. But possessing a thing that other people cannot possess doesn't necessarily imply that you are better than them or a need to display that. But that's a circular and highly subjective argument in and of itself. So, just gonna leave it at that.
This is all on DE.
Armchair: 4098-3704-2012
T1 missions are easy, and the keys drop like candy, so of course they have nothing of fucking value. T1 Defense doesn't even have a single prime part in its entire drop table. I have 60+ of those keys, they pile up because there's literally no reason to run them.
Meanwhile T3/T4 Survival and the Sabotages are bursting at the gills with critical parts that you can't get anywhere else. Because they're "the rare keys" they're the go-to bottleneck for slowing down acquisition which I'm sure would be defended as "extending the life of the game" but also has that delightful side-effect of jacking up trade prices and thus selling more plat.
I'm not even gonna get into the o-cells, fusion cores (but not 5xR5 packs, oh no!) or forma bps.
If they'd actually make an effort to include all the game modes, times four (or even five!) tiers, and quit it with the useless garbage "rewards" then nothing would ever need to go into the damn disney vault.
But they won't.
Since Excalibur apparently just went through a rework, and my Excal Prime was never leveled, I guess I'll start with him and start working my way through the game again.
Do fresh frames generally just go through the quests like before to level, or are there more efficient methods that have been added?
I literally need to learn this entire game over again.
If it was greed they would have the arcane hats and retired prime stuff in market on occasion like they do the special skins. As it is, outside of slots and the occasional tater/forma there isn't a Plat sink. Just looks how expensive frames are, you can generally get a prime set off trade for less then the base frame sold in DE's market.
Not sure which table you're looking at, but these are on T1 defense
Hikou Prime Stars
Vasto Prime Receiver
Ankyros Prime Blueprint
Rhino Prime Systems Blueprint
Granted they're all on wave C, but still.
Will the decision increase grind? Will it raise trade chat prices? Can they quietly sweep this new feature under the rug a month after release once they've squeezed all the hype from it?
Those are the dousing rods you can use to predict how DE will respond 9 times out of 10.
Armchair: 4098-3704-2012
First and foremost, I do agree that tying a large stock of items to a small portion of content without consideration to how much your content was going to scale and grow wasn't an ideal choice. But...
As a free to play game, it thrives on the purchase of platinum to finance itself in lieu of subscriptions. It could be argued that the Prime Access options are a form of upfront subscription packages, but they need to keep the in-game economy churning to generate money to keep the lights on and less "hey guys we got bought out" from happening. A la carte offerings, while good for the player are not good for a Free to Play game's finances long-term, and really just pushes the perception of their micro-transactions heavily into the "pay 2 win" criticism.
I guess I'm just saying I'm not too bothered by their curating the random, because I know it has to be random. Having all the things available all the time devalues everything, so it's also necessary to take things out and rotate them in too. Players ripping off other players is just a product of how free markets work in general though (we are greedy by nature), and they definitely need an auction house, public marketplace or other first party means of tracking trade values so that transactions don't occur in a vacuum and the market's prices could sustainably regulate themselves.
If they really want to enforce rarity all they have to do is limit on-hand amounts of distinct parts like they do kubrow eggs to prevent hoarding.
DE is full of half-assed solutions.
Problem with that is now you have players that do a run and can truly wind up with nothing (you can still trade a bp/part you don't want) and the best means of preventing that (excluding items from dropping if already possessed/capped) leads to the system being gamed beyond their intent.
It's all a tightrope of balancing player fairness and well, your bottom line.
I don't buy that. Treating players poorly doesn't mean they'll pay you more money (the whales will, but nobody else). Treating players poorly means they'll just start hemorrhaging from your game. I think Valve has pretty convincingly proven that building of a consistent amount of goodwill with your community will make them throw money at you, even if you make the whole thing free. Not even free with grinding, just free.
I think DE would be doing fine if Warframe was an entirely free game with some grind. Trying to milk their players for more platinum like this just makes people dislike them, but the irony is if they removed those sorts of walls and just treated their players well, I think the players would spend just as much, if not more, money on the game.
I will pull my wallet out and pay 40 bucks to Dota 2 for an Arcana set just because. I won't do that for Warframe. Being unfair (even appearing unfair) to your players has financial consequences.
Edit: I want to be clear. I don't mean that DE should remove the grinding from Warframe, as it is a Diablo-like game. I mean that adding more grindwalls to make their players buy platinum is doing more harm than good.
They already do a dupe check for the sigils and eggs, no reason they couldn't just cash out the dupe as duckets on reward screen.
On a lighter note several new ungodly nightmare mods (platinum pack bonus and in nightmare loot come thurs):
Seeking fury: 15% reload speed, 1.2M punchthrough -- shotgun -- polarity V, drain 11. Conclave 10.
Animal Instinct: 30M loot radar, 20M enemy sense -- sentinel/koolbro -- polarity -, drain 11. Conclave 15.
Armored Agility: 15% runspeed, 50% armor -- warframe -- polarity D, drain 11. Conclave 20.
DE page.
Good news for new folks, probably dojo wide crazy nightmare farming this weekend.
I don't think it's unfair that a person who is just starting after Mag Prime is removed won't be able to go into the void and randomly have a shot at getting her because Mag Prime's been in the game for nearly 2 years? It's old content, and as a game that's free, they're under no obligation to keep it available in perpetuity. The base model for Mag Prime (and Frost Prime, and whichever Prime is on the chopping block next when we revisit this conversation in a few months) are still around for a player to use, and given it's the mods that carry frames, not having the blinged out version isn't truly big deal.
Even in the area of event mods (of which as an Xbox One player I lack many), you can still build a weapon that performs just as well, even if there is a slight gap in performance.
But as you said, it's a matter of appearances. It appears unfair to you, but largely fair to me. I guess we just gotta agree to disagree?
The new Abra Paris skin looks pretty neat too. Shame I can't slap it onto my Paris Prime yet. They've said they're working on that here, but who knows how long that'll take or how far it'll extend (i.e. would it just be the stuff with community skins, or all primes with applicable skins?).
Maybe that has something to do with you being a longtime player and me starting last week :surprised:
I know it's unfair to compare Valve and DE, I was just looking for a similar example. I guess a better comparison would be to compare DE and the Path of Exile devs, Grinding Gear Games. Both only have one game, and PoE is free to play as well. But anyways, that's getting side tracked.
I mean just look at how the tone of my comments changed ever since this announcement. I'm not particularly happy with DE, and I'm brand spanking new, I started last week.
I think this is something that a lot of free to play developers get wrong in the industry. They're focused on the profit, when instead they should be focused on making their players happy. If the players aren't happy, the profit dries up, and then the game gets into this feedback loop: they try to milk the whales out of more money, but that discourages the newer players from staying, so they leave. The whales then stop playing too, because the only reason the whales are playing is because they have more shiny things than the new players.
If they're having problems with profit, why would they want to punish people like me who are excited about the game?
Valve showed that such a system can not only work, but thrive as a huge success. It is no longer uncertain ground. Others can follow in valve's footsteps without needing the kind of financial safety net that valve enjoys.
Edit:
I need that run speed mod to stack with my sprint aura, vanilla sprint mod, and maglev.
Also the shotgun mod for my carrier.
Hopefully these mods will have drop rates higher than blaze
Armchair: 4098-3704-2012
The way it works there will always be common/"junk" rewards on the tables. Adding another item dilutes the pool, and when it comes to rares thats a n% * n% hit in odds. Not viable.
Not many people like the rotations either... so they cant add another tier of that w/o making things annoying for all. Not viable.
A la carte? Not viable.
Swapping the olds for the new, given what they have to work with is simply more pragmatic.
While all of those are good, like you said they're on Wave C. Furthermore, this one exception doesn't excuse how much great loot Towers III and IV have in comparison to I and II. It's just absolutely mind blowing how the best stuff is kept on them. If DE would just do away with Fusion Cores and Orokin Cells are rewards (I must admit for all the time in the void I've put in, today was my first time getting Orokin Cells as a reward) then maybe they could focus on spreading some of the rewards around to compensate. I don't think that'd be hard at all, just make some edits and so many people could be made happy.
Then again, I'm probably wrong about something there.
Where's my fucking Heavy Trauma mod.
PSN: ShogunGunshow
Origin: ShogunGunshow
The wiki lists the parts as such:
Blueprint: Tower III Defense (C), Tower III Exterminate
Helmet: Tower IV Sabotage, Tower IV Survival C
Chassis : Tower II Survival (C), Tower III Exterminate
Systems: Tower III Sabotage, Tower III Survival (C), Tower IV Interception (B)
So just run those void missions to get them. The only real difficulty will likely be in getting the helmet. That's the only part that doesn't seem to be common.
you won't have any problem getting mag parts
this is how you do it
go into a mission where mag parts will drop
desire anything else
acquire mag parts
My Kubro finally matured. His name is Klepto, since he opens lockers. He's the breed that runs down capture targets (Sunika), so Bumpus in honor of the neighbor bloodhounds from A Christmas Story might have been better. Too late now! Also, he's got mod slots with polarity. Can you forma a dog?
After 30 extractor runs (16 Titan & 14 Distilling) not one rare resource has been produced. Has anyone found extractors worthwhile?
and extractors are not something you should expect to get rare resources from, expect nothing but commons and you will be pleasantly surprised when you get the rare stuff
Why would you want one? It's generally inferior to all other damage mods.
-Antje Jackelén, Archbishop of the Church of Sweden
I mostly use my extractors to maintain a trickle of common mats from zones that I never visit anymore so that I can keep spamming my large restores.
Armchair: 4098-3704-2012
Dang, I was hoping these would be easier. I don't think I have the gear to do a bunch of IVs and IIIs
Your other option is looking at the PA trade document, seeing who has what you want and acquiring what they want for a trade. Although I'm not sure how accurate the trade doc is these days. Most of the entries are old, and I'm sure some stock has dwindled now that the Void Trader is a thing.
Armchair: 4098-3704-2012
Last I checked if you have a Mag + Greedy Pull your probably qualified. Nekros is another one that if your shooting stuff then something has generally gone wrong.
Though at that level folks generally want to see a corrosive projection aura as 4x negates all armor.
Also a completely cosmetic shop only really works when you can regularly show off. I'd wager a large portion of the WF playerbase probably doesn't even interact with other people. It's the main reason I really don't bother with cosmetics.
People claim all sorts of stuff that suits their particular views, regardless of objective logic.
While true, you could probably phrase that a little less abrasively. :P