Well, that's the last time I ever pay attention to Qingu
I like it when people make it easy like this
Doesn't Qingu dislike all forms of organized religion?
Between his singling out Judaism and the crack about the "Jew York Times", I'm thinking it goes deeper than that?
Woah there, internet sarcasm detector malfunction.
He said "those dirty liberals at the Jew York Times".
Qingu is supporting Obama, the NYT just ran a story supporting Obama, he jokingly suggested that no one can trust the NYT because they're damn dirty liberals. Let your finger off that hair trigger a bit.
I think it's forbidden to talk about politics in my household now.
I found out my parents are going to be voting McCain. I asked them why and they said because Obama has been doing nothing but lying his entire campaign.
I asked them what he's lied about, but they couldn't give me a straight answer. Then they went on to say that he wants to tax us to give more money to the jobless, and something about country wide health care and how that's bad for the economy.
I just told them that they're scared of change, and it's okay because it's coming. We don't need George Bush the Second in office (I only say that to piss people off, I don't really believe that too much).
My family keeps coming to me to talk about politics, oddly enough.
I have all of them firmly set against McCain. Convincing them to go for Obama is proving rather difficult, though. My sister has some misgivings on the abortion front (she was going to become a nun at one point) and on a few other matters which I can respect, but she asks me to send any news that I get, and I remain convinced that in the voting booth, she'll go for Obama. My father likes to laugh at all the stupidity with me, but he's in the "they're both silly" crowd and plans on voting for Barr as an objection vote. Given that they're in VA and he's normally Republican, I count that as a win. My mother is....interesting. She likes Obama better, but she has somehow managed to make issues which haven't even been remotely mentioned (for example, a theoretical draft) her central sticking point, and I can't seem to convince her how silly that is. My inclination is that she's going to vote for Barr too, per my Dad's influence.
However, with your family, they're citing specific things - show them the taxation chart, and describe Obama's health care plan as it actually is to them, while pointing out that 20 million Americans would LOSE employer-granted healthcare under McCain because he wants to remove the benefits that corporations get for providing healthcare, and tax health care benefits as income.
What I am saying is that computers are handy tools for people to get information and communicate with other people.
I don't think it's unreasonable to assume that the President primarily gets his information in a series of carefully-prepared reports or meetings with various experts.
So, while computers are certainly essential to running our country, the people on top never actually have to use them.
Now, you can certainly argue that there are policy level decisions that need to be made wrt technology, but just like every other sector, there are experts available. Obama probably doesn't know all that much about auto assembly plants or open-heart surgery, but that does not disqualify him from making decisions that affect manufacturing or healthcare fields.
Ok. So who are the experts McCain will be relying on?
Obama has proposed a Tech Czar position and named Laurence Lessig, who demonstrably has an excellent grasp of the regulatory issues surrounding emerging tech, as someone who would be valuable in such a position.
McCain has named no one, and has no discernable grasp of the issues in his own right.
There's no reason to believe he won't take the word of whichever Telecom lobbyist has his ear at face value, because the man has nothing against which to judge their recommendations.
That's the harm in his cluelessness. This isn't OMG he can't change a stick of RAM.
I think it's forbidden to talk about politics in my household now.
I found out my parents are going to be voting McCain. I asked them why and they said because Obama has been doing nothing but lying his entire campaign.
I asked them what he's lied about, but they couldn't give me a straight answer. Then they went on to say that he wants to tax us to give more money to the jobless, and something about country wide health care and how that's bad for the economy.
I just told them that they're scared of change, and it's okay because it's coming. We don't need George Bush the Second in office (I only say that to piss people off, I don't really believe that too much).
My family keeps coming to me to talk about politics, oddly enough.
I have all of them firmly set against McCain. Convincing them to go for Obama is proving rather difficult, though. My sister has some misgivings on the abortion front (she was going to become a nun at one point) and on a few other matters which I can respect, but she asks me to send any news that I get, and I remain convinced that in the voting booth, she'll go for Obama. My father likes to laugh at all the stupidity with me, but he's in the "they're both silly" crowd and plans on voting for Barr as an objection vote. Given that they're in VA and he's normally Republican, I count that as a win. My mother is....interesting. She likes Obama better, but she has somehow managed to make issues which haven't even been remotely mentioned (for example, a theoretical draft) her central sticking point, and I can't seem to convince her how silly that is. My inclination is that she's going to vote for Barr too, per my Dad's influence.
However, with your family, they're citing specific things - show them the taxation chart, and describe Obama's health care plan as it actually is to them, while pointing out that 20 million Americans would LOSE employer-granted healthcare under McCain because he wants to remove the benefits that corporations get for providing healthcare, and tax health care benefits as income.
Obama has proposed a Tech Czar position and named Laurence Lessig, who demonstrably has an excellent grasp of the regulatory issues surrounding emerging tech, as someone who would be valuable in such a position.
The point is that having basic computer literacy is absolutely essential to the job she's performing now, much less the job we are hopefully not going to vote her into, and she has demonstrated that she lacks basic computer literacy.
I strongly disagree, it's completely possible to be an effective President or VP and never sit in front of a computer yourself.
What
I agree with Deacon.
I think it makes him culturally out of touch and probably interferes with his judgement about matters touching on the internet, but it isn't as though the running of the executive branch absolutely demands that the head of state use e-mail.
What I am saying is that computers are handy tools for people to get information and communicate with other people.
I don't think it's unreasonable to assume that the President primarily gets his information in a series of carefully-prepared reports or meetings with various experts.
So, while computers are certainly essential to running our country, the people on top never actually have to use them.
Now, you can certainly argue that there are policy level decisions that need to be made wrt technology, but just like every other sector, there are experts available. Obama probably doesn't know all that much about auto assembly plants or open-heart surgery, but that does not disqualify him from making decisions that affect manufacturing or healthcare fields.
Ok. So who are the experts McCain will be relying on?
Obama has proposed a Tech Czar position and named Laurence Lessig, who demonstrably has an excellent grasp of the regulatory issues surrounding emerging tech, as someone who would be valuable in such a position.
McCain has named no one, and has no discernable grasp of the issues in his own right.
There's no reason to believe he won't take the word of whichever Telecom lobbyist has his ear at face value, because the man has nothing against which to judge their recommendations.
That's the harm in his cluelessness. This isn't OMG he can't change a stick of RAM.
We've never had a president who would appoint stupid people to important positions based off of connections alone.....
I agree with Deacon. While I think it's important to have an understanding of computing insofar as making policy decisions is concerned, I can easily see the President going for extended periods of time without having to use a computer - computers might make it EASIER, so it wouldn't surprise me if they used them, but it's not essential.
Except nobody thinks she can't use a computer, because she clearly already does exactly that. The problem is she does it very badly.
And as for using non-gov't accounts, Cheney already did that as has been pointed out, so yes, it is a legitimate concern.
What I am saying is that computers are handy tools for people to get information and communicate with other people.
I don't think it's unreasonable to assume that the President primarily gets his information in a series of carefully-prepared reports or meetings with various experts.
So, while computers are certainly essential to running our country, the people on top never actually have to use them.
Now, you can certainly argue that there are policy level decisions that need to be made wrt technology, but just like every other sector, there are experts available. Obama probably doesn't know all that much about auto assembly plants or open-heart surgery, but that does not disqualify him from making decisions that affect manufacturing or healthcare fields.
I think you're totally right on this regard, but I'm more concerned about possible ethics violations. When your correspondences are supposed to be cataloged, going out of your way to make sure that they're not is a little suspect.
The point is that having basic computer literacy is absolutely essential to the job she's performing now, much less the job we are hopefully not going to vote her into, and she has demonstrated that she lacks basic computer literacy.
I strongly disagree, it's completely possible to be an effective President or VP and never sit in front of a computer yourself.
What
I agree with Deacon.
I think it makes him culturally out of touch and probably interferes with his judgement about matters touching on the internet, but it isn't as though the running of the executive branch absolutely demands that the head of state use e-mail.
But Deacon is also arguing that no level of competency is required at all and experts and advisors can fill in the gaps in order for the president to make policy decisions. That's unacceptable.
Yeah, the problem isn't specifically that she uses a bad password. It's just another data point in the "Sarah Palin has no idea what she's talking about, ever" sea of data points. A sea that gets bigger every time she says or does anything. Even if you think Obama and Palin have comparable experience, at leats Obama has demonstrated knowledge of the issues that are important, where as Palin continually shows how uninformed she is and a clear lack of deep thought about anything on a national level.
The potential shifty reason for using a private account gets added to the stack of shifty issues surrounding her.
Obama has proposed a Tech Czar position and named Laurence Lessig, who demonstrably has an excellent grasp of the regulatory issues surrounding emerging tech, as someone who would be valuable in such a position.
Oh god, Lessig is the motherfucking MAN.
If you just like that he's talked to Lessig, you'll absolutely love this (warning: pdf).
The point is that having basic computer literacy is absolutely essential to the job she's performing now, much less the job we are hopefully not going to vote her into, and she has demonstrated that she lacks basic computer literacy.
I strongly disagree, it's completely possible to be an effective President or VP and never sit in front of a computer yourself.
What
I agree with Deacon.
I think it makes him culturally out of touch and probably interferes with his judgement about matters touching on the internet, but it isn't as though the running of the executive branch absolutely demands that the head of state use e-mail.
But Deacon is also arguing that no level of competency is required at all and experts and advisors can fill in the gaps in order for the president to make policy decisions. That's unacceptable.
In a cabinet meeting today, Technology Czar Steve Ballmer reportedly hurled a chair at the Secretary of Defense. When questioned about his behavior, a white house corresponded had this to say: "Developers developers developers."
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The point is that having basic computer literacy is absolutely essential to the job she's performing now, much less the job we are hopefully not going to vote her into, and she has demonstrated that she lacks basic computer literacy.
I strongly disagree, it's completely possible to be an effective President or VP and never sit in front of a computer yourself.
What
I agree with Deacon.
I think it makes him culturally out of touch and probably interferes with his judgement about matters touching on the internet, but it isn't as though the running of the executive branch absolutely demands that the head of state use e-mail.
But Deacon is also arguing that no level of competency is required at all and experts and advisors can fill in the gaps in order for the president to make policy decisions. That's unacceptable.
I didn't see him say that at all. I saw a couple of people saying he said that, but I don't think Deacon actually said that.
There are bad things about the email thing, namely using a private email to avoid the emails being called on. having a weak password doesn't fucking mean shit.
The point is that having basic computer literacy is absolutely essential to the job she's performing now, much less the job we are hopefully not going to vote her into, and she has demonstrated that she lacks basic computer literacy.
I strongly disagree, it's completely possible to be an effective President or VP and never sit in front of a computer yourself.
What
I agree with Deacon.
I think it makes him culturally out of touch and probably interferes with his judgement about matters touching on the internet, but it isn't as though the running of the executive branch absolutely demands that the head of state use e-mail.
But Deacon is also arguing that no level of competency is required at all and experts and advisors can fill in the gaps in order for the president to make policy decisions. That's unacceptable.
Which shoots the experience argument in the head, I'd think.
The point is that having basic computer literacy is absolutely essential to the job she's performing now, much less the job we are hopefully not going to vote her into, and she has demonstrated that she lacks basic computer literacy.
I strongly disagree, it's completely possible to be an effective President or VP and never sit in front of a computer yourself.
What
I agree with Deacon.
I think it makes him culturally out of touch and probably interferes with his judgement about matters touching on the internet, but it isn't as though the running of the executive branch absolutely demands that the head of state use e-mail.
Let's compare.
McCain doesn't use email. Big whoop.
Palin uses email, a lot. In ways that seem designed to circumvent the standards of accountability that one assumes government emails should be legally held to. She does so in a way that's so shockingly inept that the mouth-breathing cretins at 4chan can then access those emails.
There may, perhaps, just be a wee bit of difference between the two.
What I am saying is that computers are handy tools for people to get information and communicate with other people.
By that definition, so are books and libraries. I sure as hell wouldn't want a president who doesn't know how to use a library.
So, while computers are certainly essential to running our country, the people on top never actually have to use them.
I disagree. As I said, using a computer, especially the internet, actually shapes the way you view the world. Computers and the internet are more than just "tools," like a jackhammer. The internet is a new form of communication that will become increasingly, probably exponentially, more important in the coming decade.
Would you agree, Deacon, that certain forms of "literacy" are more important and relevant than others? For example, would you agree that it is more important for a president to know how to use the internet than it is for him to know how to beat Guitar Hero on Expert? Or field-dress a moose?
Ok. So who are the experts McCain will be relying on?
He's expressed interest in snagging Cisco CEO John Chambers, Fed EX's Fred Smith, and Steve Ballmer.
God, he's going to be so uninformed and out-of-touch.
I would argue that using CEOs of tech companies would be directly contrary to the interests of the populous as a whole when it comes to things like net neutrality, and if they're the only people providing the information that could be problematic because he doesn't have a base foundation understanding of computing and networking himself.
But this goes back to what I've always said about their tech policies - Obama's favors the users, McCain's favors the corporations.
Obama has proposed a Tech Czar position and named Laurence Lessig, who demonstrably has an excellent grasp of the regulatory issues surrounding emerging tech, as someone who would be valuable in such a position.
Oh god, Lessig is the motherfucking MAN.
If you just like that he's talked to Lessig, you'll absolutely love this (warning: pdf).
This is the reason I originally decided to support Obama.
Ok, ok, I can see a person, without much knowledge of computer security, picking a terrible password like "popcorn." The reasons that it's bad are not immediately obvious if you think of it in terms of an actual password, like what guards use. "Popcorn" doesn't have anything to do with the context, so it's unlikely that a person would guess it.
This is no more than I would expect.
But... picking your zipcode to be your security question answer... there can be no excuse for being that stupid, and also in charge of anything more important than a McDonalds chain. It flies in the face of the whole concept. How could a person think that her zipcode- by definition a thing that must be public information- would be a good choice for something supposed to be, at the very, absolute least, a secret?
If the security question even referenced the mail system in any way, it is roughly 5000 times worse.
It has to be inaccurate. It has to be. How can one person give a speech without falling down or drooling, and still be this monumentally idiotic?
The point is that having basic computer literacy is absolutely essential to the job she's performing now, much less the job we are hopefully not going to vote her into, and she has demonstrated that she lacks basic computer literacy.
I strongly disagree, it's completely possible to be an effective President or VP and never sit in front of a computer yourself.
What
I agree with Deacon.
I think it makes him culturally out of touch and probably interferes with his judgement about matters touching on the internet, but it isn't as though the running of the executive branch absolutely demands that the head of state use e-mail.
But Deacon is also arguing that no level of competency is required at all and experts and advisors can fill in the gaps in order for the president to make policy decisions. That's unacceptable.
By that argument Obama can't be president because he was never in the military, and John McCain can't be president because he has never had a job in the private sector.
I mean come on. There is no one who has such a varied life experience that they have personal first hand knowledge of the entire scope of issues which the federal government touches upon.
What I am saying is that computers are handy tools for people to get information and communicate with other people.
By that definition, so are books and libraries. I sure as hell wouldn't want a president who doesn't know how to use a library.
So, while computers are certainly essential to running our country, the people on top never actually have to use them.
I disagree. As I said, using a computer, especially the internet, actually shapes the way you view the world. Computers and the internet are more than just "tools," like a jackhammer. The internet is a new form of communication that will become increasingly, probably exponentially, more important in the coming decade.
Would you agree, Deacon, that certain forms of "literacy" are more important and relevant than others? For example, would you agree that it is more important for a president to know how to use the internet than it is for him to know how to beat Guitar Hero on Expert? Or field-dress a moose?
Hold on, now. I'll not have you attacking my credentials. You sexist.
Obama has proposed a Tech Czar position and named Laurence Lessig, who demonstrably has an excellent grasp of the regulatory issues surrounding emerging tech, as someone who would be valuable in such a position.
Oh god, Lessig is the motherfucking MAN.
If you just like that he's talked to Lessig, you'll absolutely love this (warning: pdf).
This is the reason I originally decided to support Obama.
The point is that having basic computer literacy is absolutely essential to the job she's performing now, much less the job we are hopefully not going to vote her into, and she has demonstrated that she lacks basic computer literacy.
I strongly disagree, it's completely possible to be an effective President or VP and never sit in front of a computer yourself.
Twenty years ago? Yeah. Today? I think it would be a serious detriment. Computers are, by an order of magnitude, the fastest way to send information. Do you not see speed of communication as somewhat important?
ElJeffe on
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I. Um.
What
Edit: Oh, nm atheist.
Woah there, internet sarcasm detector malfunction.
He said "those dirty liberals at the Jew York Times".
Qingu is supporting Obama, the NYT just ran a story supporting Obama, he jokingly suggested that no one can trust the NYT because they're damn dirty liberals. Let your finger off that hair trigger a bit.
ANYways, this is shockingly off topic.
Read this page.
Edit: Beat'd
There is a strong tradition of (ethnically) Jewish atheists.
My Dad doesn't like him either. It's a protest vote.
The 'using personal email as a way to get around record keeping requirements' is a very good argument against her being a candidate.
2 pages ago, I know, but I instantly got that song in my head when I read Hymie Town
Dooon't let me doowwwnn...
Dooon't let me doowwwnn...
Hymie towwwwwnnn.....
Ok. So who are the experts McCain will be relying on?
Obama has proposed a Tech Czar position and named Laurence Lessig, who demonstrably has an excellent grasp of the regulatory issues surrounding emerging tech, as someone who would be valuable in such a position.
McCain has named no one, and has no discernable grasp of the issues in his own right.
There's no reason to believe he won't take the word of whichever Telecom lobbyist has his ear at face value, because the man has nothing against which to judge their recommendations.
That's the harm in his cluelessness. This isn't OMG he can't change a stick of RAM.
Oh, I thought when you compared using a dictionary word as a password to eating your own shit it was cool to do that.
My bad.
I don't like him either! He'd best watch himself! We're wanted men!
I have the death sentence on twelve systems!
Oh god, Lessig is the motherfucking MAN.
I agree with Deacon.
I think it makes him culturally out of touch and probably interferes with his judgement about matters touching on the internet, but it isn't as though the running of the executive branch absolutely demands that the head of state use e-mail.
We've never had a president who would appoint stupid people to important positions based off of connections alone.....
OH SHIT
Except nobody thinks she can't use a computer, because she clearly already does exactly that. The problem is she does it very badly.
And as for using non-gov't accounts, Cheney already did that as has been pointed out, so yes, it is a legitimate concern.
Hey it's all cool as long as they've got a babysitter, right?
I think you're totally right on this regard, but I'm more concerned about possible ethics violations. When your correspondences are supposed to be cataloged, going out of your way to make sure that they're not is a little suspect.
I would like to see someone run the following talking point:
"Sarah Palin can't even secure her own e-mail. How the heck can she expect to secure the entire nation?"
no, that's terrible.
But Deacon is also arguing that no level of competency is required at all and experts and advisors can fill in the gaps in order for the president to make policy decisions. That's unacceptable.
He's expressed interest in snagging Cisco CEO John Chambers, Fed EX's Fred Smith, and Steve Ballmer.
God, he's going to be so uninformed and out-of-touch.
The potential shifty reason for using a private account gets added to the stack of shifty issues surrounding her.
If you just like that he's talked to Lessig, you'll absolutely love this (warning: pdf).
Ice burn.
pleasepaypreacher.net
I didn't see him say that at all. I saw a couple of people saying he said that, but I don't think Deacon actually said that.
There are bad things about the email thing, namely using a private email to avoid the emails being called on. having a weak password doesn't fucking mean shit.
Which shoots the experience argument in the head, I'd think.
Let's compare.
McCain doesn't use email. Big whoop.
Palin uses email, a lot. In ways that seem designed to circumvent the standards of accountability that one assumes government emails should be legally held to. She does so in a way that's so shockingly inept that the mouth-breathing cretins at 4chan can then access those emails.
There may, perhaps, just be a wee bit of difference between the two.
I disagree. As I said, using a computer, especially the internet, actually shapes the way you view the world. Computers and the internet are more than just "tools," like a jackhammer. The internet is a new form of communication that will become increasingly, probably exponentially, more important in the coming decade.
Would you agree, Deacon, that certain forms of "literacy" are more important and relevant than others? For example, would you agree that it is more important for a president to know how to use the internet than it is for him to know how to beat Guitar Hero on Expert? Or field-dress a moose?
I would argue that using CEOs of tech companies would be directly contrary to the interests of the populous as a whole when it comes to things like net neutrality, and if they're the only people providing the information that could be problematic because he doesn't have a base foundation understanding of computing and networking himself.
But this goes back to what I've always said about their tech policies - Obama's favors the users, McCain's favors the corporations.
This is the reason I originally decided to support Obama.
Sorry if its been posted, you lot move fast.
This is no more than I would expect.
But... picking your zipcode to be your security question answer... there can be no excuse for being that stupid, and also in charge of anything more important than a McDonalds chain. It flies in the face of the whole concept. How could a person think that her zipcode- by definition a thing that must be public information- would be a good choice for something supposed to be, at the very, absolute least, a secret?
If the security question even referenced the mail system in any way, it is roughly 5000 times worse.
It has to be inaccurate. It has to be. How can one person give a speech without falling down or drooling, and still be this monumentally idiotic?
By that argument Obama can't be president because he was never in the military, and John McCain can't be president because he has never had a job in the private sector.
I mean come on. There is no one who has such a varied life experience that they have personal first hand knowledge of the entire scope of issues which the federal government touches upon.
Hold on, now. I'll not have you attacking my credentials. You sexist.
Me too.
Twenty years ago? Yeah. Today? I think it would be a serious detriment. Computers are, by an order of magnitude, the fastest way to send information. Do you not see speed of communication as somewhat important?