The new forums will be named Coin Return (based on the most recent vote)! You can check on the status and timeline of the transition to the new forums here.
Please vote in the Forum Structure Poll. Polling will close at 2PM EST on January 21, 2025.
Ooh, it's a lady...
Popices
Registered User regular
Registered User regular
Hey guys.
I come to you for some advice regarding a lady situation, who would have thunk it.
I'm your typical nice guy who lacks a fair amount of game to 'pick up' ladies, and have never really been on the market or have had much dating experience since my last relationship was a long one throughout highschool and college.
Brief background: One of my friends brought along one of her good friends to an outdoor gathering about 6 weeks ago at the start of the school year. I proceeded to talk to said friend, we'll call her Ann, for a good four hours this day, and had developed somewhat of an interest in her, mostly because she was very laid back, and shares a similar carefree attitude that I do...that and she is very cute. We proceed to hang out (as a group of 5, 2 ladies and 3 dudes) at least once a week and I continue to enjoy her company and develop a 'damn, this girl is awesome' complex. I am usually the one organizing outings, and if she can't come to something she usually apologizes and states that she'll have to make it up to me....cool, she's showing a bit of interest, right?
Last night the 5 of us go out to a hockey game and watch our team beat the crap out of another team, and have a fantastic time. It was Ann's first professional hockey game ever, so obviously she was living it up and enjoying herself greatly. We chat a bit more off and on throughout the game, and we head to a local bar afterward for a few drinks and some time to unwind. There was a bunch of people I knew from high school there, and there was much dart playing/reminiscing to be had. Keep in mind, Ann is from a town about an hour from where we currently reside, as we are both in school at the moment (Ages are 22 and 22, for those interested).
As a bit of backstory, she had just gotten out of a 3 some odd year relationship (the last year had been long distance) about a month ago. I have been out of an 8.5 year relationship now for 9 months, and this is the first lady I have felt any sort of connection with that makes me take a step back and think to myself.
Well, a guy who is a few years older than us started macking on her hardcore throughout the entire night (I guess they had met the week prior and somewhere had exchanged phone #s). I wasn't really bothered by it, I just thought it was odd that she wasn't rejecting any of his advances. The night drags on, and around 2:30am we decide to leave (I was her ride). The night ends with said guy pulling her in for a kiss, and kissing her.
This is where it gets interesting. Upon driving her home (15 minute drive) she asks me what to do about her situation. She said that she is not ready for any type of relationship since she is so fresh out of one, and is not looking for any kind of casual sex at the moment, and even said 'sex is something I can still only picture doing with Bill (her ex)'. She said that she was thinking she would hang out with said guy a few times and show no interest, and be done with him. I basically said that I don't act the same way as him when I am interested in someone, and told her that if she isn't ready for something she shouldn't be pressured into it (she is extremely nice and has trouble telling people no...especially in a situation that could make the other person feel bad). She also revealed to me that she has somewhat of an interest in one of the friends in our group of 5...that isn't me. Fuck, right? As we got to her car, she told me she really appreciated all the insight I had, that she had a fun night, etc.
Now, H/A I come to you to ask: what the fuck? Every time I have had conversation with Ann it has been excellent. We seem to have a lot in common, we both laugh a lot more when the other is around, share similar values, etc. I cannot figure out if she has any interest at all, or if I am simply just a friend. I don't really mind that she doesn't want to have any type of relationship anytime soon due to her recent breakup, but if I have no shot at anything in the future I want to divest myself of most emotional involvement with her.
What is the best way to go about this situation? I don't think 'asking her out' would be THAT great, since she said the dude at the bar made her feel really awkward and all that. Should I maintain friendship and see if anything could develop in the future? Again, I haven't felt like this since my last relationship and I have been on several dates with several ladies since then...which is probably why I'm taking this the way I am.
I come to you for some advice regarding a lady situation, who would have thunk it.
I'm your typical nice guy who lacks a fair amount of game to 'pick up' ladies, and have never really been on the market or have had much dating experience since my last relationship was a long one throughout highschool and college.
Brief background: One of my friends brought along one of her good friends to an outdoor gathering about 6 weeks ago at the start of the school year. I proceeded to talk to said friend, we'll call her Ann, for a good four hours this day, and had developed somewhat of an interest in her, mostly because she was very laid back, and shares a similar carefree attitude that I do...that and she is very cute. We proceed to hang out (as a group of 5, 2 ladies and 3 dudes) at least once a week and I continue to enjoy her company and develop a 'damn, this girl is awesome' complex. I am usually the one organizing outings, and if she can't come to something she usually apologizes and states that she'll have to make it up to me....cool, she's showing a bit of interest, right?
Last night the 5 of us go out to a hockey game and watch our team beat the crap out of another team, and have a fantastic time. It was Ann's first professional hockey game ever, so obviously she was living it up and enjoying herself greatly. We chat a bit more off and on throughout the game, and we head to a local bar afterward for a few drinks and some time to unwind. There was a bunch of people I knew from high school there, and there was much dart playing/reminiscing to be had. Keep in mind, Ann is from a town about an hour from where we currently reside, as we are both in school at the moment (Ages are 22 and 22, for those interested).
As a bit of backstory, she had just gotten out of a 3 some odd year relationship (the last year had been long distance) about a month ago. I have been out of an 8.5 year relationship now for 9 months, and this is the first lady I have felt any sort of connection with that makes me take a step back and think to myself.
Well, a guy who is a few years older than us started macking on her hardcore throughout the entire night (I guess they had met the week prior and somewhere had exchanged phone #s). I wasn't really bothered by it, I just thought it was odd that she wasn't rejecting any of his advances. The night drags on, and around 2:30am we decide to leave (I was her ride). The night ends with said guy pulling her in for a kiss, and kissing her.
This is where it gets interesting. Upon driving her home (15 minute drive) she asks me what to do about her situation. She said that she is not ready for any type of relationship since she is so fresh out of one, and is not looking for any kind of casual sex at the moment, and even said 'sex is something I can still only picture doing with Bill (her ex)'. She said that she was thinking she would hang out with said guy a few times and show no interest, and be done with him. I basically said that I don't act the same way as him when I am interested in someone, and told her that if she isn't ready for something she shouldn't be pressured into it (she is extremely nice and has trouble telling people no...especially in a situation that could make the other person feel bad). She also revealed to me that she has somewhat of an interest in one of the friends in our group of 5...that isn't me. Fuck, right? As we got to her car, she told me she really appreciated all the insight I had, that she had a fun night, etc.
Now, H/A I come to you to ask: what the fuck? Every time I have had conversation with Ann it has been excellent. We seem to have a lot in common, we both laugh a lot more when the other is around, share similar values, etc. I cannot figure out if she has any interest at all, or if I am simply just a friend. I don't really mind that she doesn't want to have any type of relationship anytime soon due to her recent breakup, but if I have no shot at anything in the future I want to divest myself of most emotional involvement with her.
What is the best way to go about this situation? I don't think 'asking her out' would be THAT great, since she said the dude at the bar made her feel really awkward and all that. Should I maintain friendship and see if anything could develop in the future? Again, I haven't felt like this since my last relationship and I have been on several dates with several ladies since then...which is probably why I'm taking this the way I am.
Popices on
0
Posts
but they're listening to every word I say
Either be her friend or don't, but don't pine after her hoping things'll change magically. There'll be other interesting women down the road so long as you're open to them. It also couldn't hurt to include some flirting the next time you talk to a girl for hours, cause chances are if she's talking to you for hours, she's putting herself on the line just a little bit. My guess is she probably tested the waters with you, showed some interest by talking with you for hours, but gave up when you didn't take the bait and moved on.
I don't know if that is necessarily true. You can move from friend status to dating status. Just don't expect it to happen and don't go pining after something for a long time just to realize it is never going to happen. Best to just go try and date other people.
but they're listening to every word I say
I don't know how you can't see that she hasn't shown interest in you beyond friendship except for you being so desperate for her to like you that her simply being nice is her showing interest in your mind. Telling someone they'll make it up to you, unless in your head she's winking suggestively it doesn't mean anything except she's bummed she can't hang out with a friend. When I tell a guy friend I'm sorry I can't hang out I'll make it up to you I mean I'll bring a six pack next time not that I'll make out with you.
You have stuff in common and get along really well, hence why she sees you as someone who can be a good friend, it doesn't mean she's going to automatically want to jump your bones because you make her laugh.
The only way I've ever seen a stable male/female friendship is if neither finds the other one physically attractive and/or a potential love interest. If one or both even have the slightest interest, hello awkwardsville.
For her to say "'sex is something I can still only picture doing with Bill (her ex)", well, sorry dude, I think that's pretty clear cut. You're in the friend zone.
Believe me I've had unrequited crushes and while it sucks, it's probably better to just look elsewhere if you want a serious relationship, after you've gotten over the hurt you will feel (again, sorry dude) by breaking it off and looking elsewhere.
Margaret Thatcher
Maybe that's not what you mean to do, but that's the communication that happened!
When you suck at 'game' or 'pick up' or whatever, forget trying to have any. Just be blunt. If you have an interest in someone in the first few times you meet make it very, very clear. If you think you MIGHT have an interest, make THAT clear too.
A simple line like 'You seem like an awesome person and I'd like to get to know you better and see if something develops. Let's go do <insert activity here> this Saturday' is about as clear as it gets.
The advice has been helpful, as it has shown that I am probably reading too much into things, and at the moment it seems as though she has no idea of what she wants judging by how her actions and then discussion that came afterward really did not correlate whatsoever.
I guess my plan is to either show my interest toward her in a direct, non-passive way (as I have been doing, in retrospect) relatively soon and deal with the consequences that come along with it, or distance myself and ride the wave. She also stated she planned on being single for awhile because she enjoys doing whatever she wants whenever she wants, so I guess my decision should be pretty easy at this point.
Hmm. Okay, Popices, let's forget about Ann for a minute and address what you're doing wrong here. I can't say one way or another what is wrong or isn't about Ann, but we can help you.
You are not being entirely forthright about what you want when you approach women. You are probably doing this for one of the following reasons:
Basically all you're doing at this point is complimenting Ann and expressing something like availability on your part -- "Hey, you're a really cool person, we should hang out sometime, and I'm totally into Avenue Q if you have any interest in asking me to go with you." What you are NOT expressing is anything like ardent desire to go out with this bird.
In the future, here's what you do when you meet a woman you're interested in going out with:
1. Ask her for her phone number.*
2. Ask her on a date.**
*When I say ask her for her phone number, I literally mean "ask her for her phone number." Remembering her name and what college she went to/goes to so you can message her later may be less stressful and therefore mentally easier for you, but it does not cut it as an acceptable substitute. The phone number ask is a very important step for initiating a dating relationship because it's a fairly low-stress way of asking for permission to contact her in the future while making it precisely clear what it is you want -- back when I was single and wanted a girl's phone number, I made sure to ask her by saying, "I'd like to give you a call later this week and ask you out for a coffee date or a drink after work, may I have your phone number?" Asking like this makes it clear what you want and also expresses both sincerity and confidence, while the way you're doing things shows a lack of confidence -- hiding behind emails and text messages is the communications filter chumps use to avoid feeling emotionally exposed, and using MeetUp, MySpace or Facebook as a primary means of communication is the resource favored by people who have so little confidence that they won't ask for a phone number and risk being told "no."
**When I say ask for a date, I literally mean "ask her on a date." I do not mean say, "Hey you're cool we should hang out some time." That's an ambiguous, non-commital and frankly cowardly way of asking someone out because by disguising the date as something meaningless, you've basically negated her ability to say "no, I'm not interested" without sounding like an unfriendly bitch. Furthermore, women aren't actually mind-readers -- just like you sometimes can't discern a woman's signals, women likewise aren't gifted with some preternatural ability to discern when "hanging out" means dating and when it simply means being friends. So if they do you the credit of taking you at face value, you're likely to unintentionally ambush them halfway through one of your "hanging out" sessions when they suddenly realize that they're actually out on a date. Which is kind of deceitful, isn't it? And shows a lack of confidence, doesn't it? You're avoiding being more forthright because you're afraid she might say no otherwise. But that's lame and ultimately self-defeating. As a rule of thumb: if you don't use the word "date" in your ask, you're doing it wrong.
Real life example to learn from: I once had tickets to attend a ball, and I needed a date, so I wrote to a friend I had a crush on in a neighboring city, "Hey, Sonja, I have a couple of tickets to a gala next weekend and I was thinking it'd be fun and I need a date anyway so I thought maybe you'd like to come."
Sonja wrote back: "No thanks."
I asked why, and she elaborated: "A new dress costs a minimum of $200, it takes me thirty minutes to do my makeup and hair, and I'll have to sit an hour in traffic during rush hour to get from my city to yours. If you want me to go to all of that effort for something you want to go to, you could at least have the common courtesy to act like you care whether I go with you or not instead of giving me this wishy-washy 'if you want to' nonsense."
So I called her up and said, "Sonja, there's a gala next weekend which I was invited to. You're a beautiful young woman with whom I've greatly enjoyed dancing with in the past, and I would be both thrilled and honored if you would come with me as my date."
She laughed and said, "Well, in that case, I would love to."
For what it's worth, I was just starting to enjoy being single and doing whatever I wanted whenever I wanted when I met my wife.