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# Miegakure: Platforming in 4D

Registered User regular
edited April 2010
I did a search, and the only post I found about this game was in relation to a(n?) xkcd comic strip (which is how I found out about it)... So, fuck it, I'm quoting them.
crwth wrote: »
crwth wrote: »
BusterK wrote:
I can't live without stating that the fourth dimension is time
So all games travel in that dimension as well
What the fuck Miegakure?

Miegakure is a platform game where you explore the fourth dimension to solve puzzles.

Our world is three-dimensional: width, depth, and height. But what if there was a fourth physical dimension that we cannot see, in addition to the other three?

This game is about exploring the consequences of being able to move in four spatial dimensions. It plays like a regular three-dimensional platformer, but at the press of a button one of the dimensions is exchanged with the fourth dimension, allowing for four-dimensional movement.

How to get on the other side? Exchange dimensions. Move to the other side. Exchange back.

Think about a two-dimensional character living on a horizontal, flat two-dimensional plane. To this character, height would be a foreign concept. A number of actions we three-dimensional beings take for granted feel like absolute magic to this two-dimensional character.

For example, if there is a wall in the shape of a circle around an object in 2D, it is essentially closed-off, since to reach it one would have to leave the 2D plane. It is also impossible for an outsider to know what is inside.

But us 3D beings can see the object from above, and also simply lift it off the ground to move it outside, essentially teleporting it. Now by analogy a four-dimensional being could perform many similar miracles to us living in only three-dimensions. This game allows you to perform these "miracles."

The games medium makes the mathematical concept of a fourth dimension easier to understand by allowing to experience it first-hand, using trial and error, as opposed to being told about it.

VIDEO!

Plus, for possible Mac awesomeness:
The game is currently in development and the goal is to release it in downloadable form for consoles and PC/Mac. There is no announced date and platform yet. There is no publicly released demo at this point. There will be one when the game is released though, so please be patient Thanks.

The concept of the game basically sounds like Super Paper Mario for the Wii, but bumped up by one dimension on both sides of the ratio. That's right everyone, Super Paper Mario divided by zero, and this game happened.

Nerdtendo on

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Registered User regular
edited April 2010
Ew, don't compare this potentially good game to Super Paper Mario.

Anyway, I'm glad to hear this is coming to consoles. I was worried it was gonna be one of those awesome PC indie titles that we console plebs never get to see.

Princepeach on
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Registered User regular
edited April 2010
I'd like to point out that Super Paper Mario was also only in 3D. Never 4D.

Xtarath on
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Registered User regular
edited April 2010
This doesn't seem at all unique.

Zombiemambo on
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Registered User regular
edited April 2010
Ha ha ha, XKCD. You are always the worst, XKCD.

Davoid on
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Hard to miss. Registered User regular
edited April 2010
Whatever happened to Fez? That always seemed like a Cave Story version of this concept.

Delzhand on
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Registered User regular
edited April 2010
Isn't the 4th dimension time?

Trus on
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Registered User regular
edited April 2010
I like how the video calls it the "fourrth" dimension

Davoid on
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Registered User regular
edited April 2010
Xtarath wrote: »
I'd like to point out that Super Paper Mario was also only in 3D. Never 4D.

Anything that moves is in "4d" :...:

randombattle on

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Registered User regular
edited April 2010
Xtarath wrote: »
I'd like to point out that Super Paper Mario was also only in 3D. Never 4D.

Anything that moves is in "4d" :...:

Yes, but regardless, in SPM you switched from "2D" to "3D, and not Miegakure's "4D"

Xtarath on
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Registered User regular
edited April 2010
Xtarath wrote: »
I'd like to point out that Super Paper Mario was also only in 3D. Never 4D.

Anything that moves is in "4d" :...:

Time is not a fourth physical dimension, though. The dimensions don't necessarily have a number assigned to them, or anything.

Raoulduke20 on
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Rated PG! Registered User regular
edited April 2010
Fez has been in development forever, what the hell is taking them so long?

Satsumomo on
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Registered User regular
edited April 2010
Xtarath wrote: »
I'd like to point out that Super Paper Mario was also only in 3D. Never 4D.

I preemptively agree with you.

I'm definitely more interested in Fez than this, but this looks like it might be entertaining. I'm also enjoying the art style and atmosphere of this game.

Nerdtendo on
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RAGE vympyvvhyc vyctyvyRegistered User regular
edited April 2010
This looks interesting, I'll be looking forward to this and Fez too since I enjoy games with twists like this.

Darmak on
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We are only now beginning to understand the full power and ramifications of sexual intercourse Registered User regular
edited April 2010
Trus wrote: »
Isn't the 4th dimension time?

No. We're talking about spatial dimensions.

Mojo_Jojo on
Homogeneous distribution of your varieties of amuse-gueule
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is it because you were insulted when I insulted your hair?Registered User regular
edited April 2010
I read the description, I watched the video, and I still don't understand what the 4th dimension actually is (a quick visit to wiki would probably help).

Alfred J. Kwak on
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Top Tier One FearRegistered User regular
edited April 2010
I read the description, I watched the video, and I still don't understand what the 4th dimension actually is (a quick visit to wiki would probably help).

agoaj on

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Registered User regular
edited April 2010
I read the description, I watched the video, and I still don't understand what the 4th dimension actually is (a quick visit to wiki would probably help).

The animation they have on the wiki page hurts my brain. Hopefully Carl Sagan does a better job of explaining :P

EDIT: Oh, I see. It still hurts to try and comprehend, though.

Ayulin on
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Registered User regular
edited April 2010
Little-known fact: Time is actually the 5th dimension, not the 4th.

Mr Fuzzbutt on
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Registered User regular
edited April 2010
agoaj wrote: »
I read the description, I watched the video, and I still don't understand what the 4th dimension actually is (a quick visit to wiki would probably help).

I heard a pretty interesting visualisation that is kind of an extention of that movie. A sphere passing through flatland would appear to the flatlander as a point appearing, becoming a growing circle until it reaches maximum size after which it starts to shrink to a dot and disappear.

A fourth dimentional "sphere" passing through our three dimensional world would appear as a dot and become a growing sphere, which would then shrink back into a dot and disappear. Not very useful perhaps, but interesting.

I'd also like to note that from my impression the concept of time as a dimension is rather flawed. Time is a mental construct, representing the rates of enthropy and change.

Vic on
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Registered User regular
edited April 2010
Vic wrote: »
I heard a pretty interesting visualisation that is kind of an extention of that movie. A sphere passing through flatland would appear to the flatlander as a point appearing, becoming a growing circle until it reaches maximum size after which it starts to shrink to a dot and disappear.

A fourth dimentional "sphere" passing through our three dimensional world would appear as a dot and become a growing sphere, which would then shrink back into a dot and disappear. Not very useful perhaps, but interesting.

I'd also like to note that from my impression the concept of time as a dimension is rather flawed. Time is a mental construct, representing the rates of enthropy and change.
That's the analogy I've heard a few times to explain it.

Actually, there's also a wonderfully weird comic that has a faux-Fantastic Four fighting a beeeing from the 5th dimension! who can reach around panels to attack them.

Also time gets brought up as the 4th dimension because you tag things with (X,Y,Z, 5:00), and I suppose in games since you can move back and forth in it if you wanted to, it counts more.

durandal4532 on
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Registered User regular
edited April 2010
I hear that time is actually the second dimension, and that x, y, and z are the first, third, and fourth.

jothki on
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ski-bap ba-dapModerator mod
edited April 2010
Little-known fact: Time is actually the 5th dimension, not the 4th.

Weeell. Depends on your definitions and stuff. But yeah, you need five dimensions for "real" time travel, otherwise you have three dimensions and just move back and forth in a straight line on the fourth - like rewinding a tape, you can go back but nothing changes when you press play and it starts moving forward again. You need a fifth dimension for alternate timelines, making time 2-dimensional.

I have no problems visualizing five dimensions, but then my head asplodes.

edit: here's a movie I just remembered.

Echo on
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Registered User regular
edited April 2010
None of you really understand time...

Raiden333 on
There was a steam sig here. It's gone now.
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Registered User regular
edited April 2010
Raiden333 wrote: »
None of you really understand time...

I wonder how many pageviews that's gotten
and if the guy who made it is still alive, or missing/presumed dead

Edit: oh holy shit it was updated with stuff about obama!

Jaunty on

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Registered User regular
edited April 2010
Meh, when I think of a 4D game, I think of something like Achron (RTS game with time travel)

Dracil on
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MH3U Monster Cheat Sheet / MH3U Veggie Elder Ticket Guide
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RAGE vympyvvhyc vyctyvyRegistered User regular
edited April 2010
That's why I think it's interesting, because in the few games that use a 4th dimension it's always time instead of a spatial dimension. A 4th spatial dimension is usually something that's pretty hard for most people to grasp, whereas traveling back and forth through time is something that's usually easier to understand.

Darmak on
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Registered User regular
edited April 2010
I understand how its adding another level of travel, but I fail to see how this is an actual demension. Im interested, but slightly suspicious that this isn't an actual 4th demension.

Mr.Brick on
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RAGE vympyvvhyc vyctyvyRegistered User regular
edited April 2010
But even in that video the fourth dimension is just time, I'm talking about an actual, physical, fourth spatial dimension.

Darmak on
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Registered User regular
edited April 2010
Goddammit people mathematically the fourth dimension does not refer to time

Put "4th Dimension Not Necessarily Time" in the OP or this is going to go on forever

Jaunty on

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Registered User regular
edited April 2010
Duh, come on guys, time is the 0th dimension.

At least that's how I label it in my 4-vectors.

Teriferin on
teriferin#1625
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Registered User regular
edited April 2010
Ok im starting to understand a bit more (mathematically anyways). Does this game really represent a 4th demension though? Or is it just a "lol extra geometry you couldn't see before" gimick?

ill check it out when I get home from work though regardless.

Mr.Brick on
pew pew pew
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Registered User regular
edited April 2010
Turns out the 4th dimension is just noclip..

Æthelred on
pokes: 1505 8032 8399
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Registered User regular
edited April 2010
agoaj wrote: »
I read the description, I watched the video, and I still don't understand what the 4th dimension actually is (a quick visit to wiki would probably help).

Lars_Domus on
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Registered User regular
edited April 2010
Mr.Brick wrote: »
Ok im starting to understand a bit more (mathematically anyways). Does this game really represent a 4th demension though? Or is it just a "lol extra geometry you couldn't see before" gimick?

ill check it out when I get home from work though regardless.
But to us, isn't that exactly what it is? Ack! This shit makes my head asplode.

I must know more!

Monsty on
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Registered User regular
edited April 2010
Pity that the transitions are discrete instead of continuous.

At some point, I'd like to see a game where you can roam freely in a 4-d environment. It'd be similar to Descent, but in addition to moving forward and turning up or down, you could also turn along a fourth axis. Instead of transitioning between discrete worlds, you'd move through a complete, geometrically realised environment.

jothki on
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Registered User regular
edited April 2010
jothki wrote: »
Pity that the transitions are discrete instead of continuous.

At some point, I'd like to see a game where you can roam freely in a 4-d environment. It'd be similar to Descent, but in addition to moving forward and turning up or down, you could also turn along a fourth axis. Instead of transitioning between discrete worlds, you'd move through a complete, geometrically realised environment.

There is a 4D space sim called Adnaxis but I haven't tried it. I only know about it from seeing it in passing in ubuntu software center's game section, altough they apparently have a commercial windows version with better graphics and sound too.

http://www.mushware.com/portal.php#mushware_shop

Okasvi on
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Registered User regular
edited April 2010
Okasvi wrote: »
jothki wrote: »
Pity that the transitions are discrete instead of continuous.

At some point, I'd like to see a game where you can roam freely in a 4-d environment. It'd be similar to Descent, but in addition to moving forward and turning up or down, you could also turn along a fourth axis. Instead of transitioning between discrete worlds, you'd move through a complete, geometrically realised environment.

There is a 4D space sim called Adnaxis but I haven't tried it. I only know about it from seeing it in passing in ubuntu software center's game section, altough they apparently have a commercial windows version with better graphics and sound too.

http://www.mushware.com/portal.php#mushware_shop

Nice, that's pretty much exactly what I'm talking about.

jothki on
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Registered User regular
edited April 2010
Lars_Domus wrote: »
agoaj wrote: »
I read the description, I watched the video, and I still don't understand what the 4th dimension actually is (a quick visit to wiki would probably help).