The new forums will be named Coin Return (based on the most recent vote)! You can check on the status and timeline of the transition to the new forums here.
The Guiding Principles and New Rules document is now in effect.
Living with my estranged father
Dread Pirate Arbuthnot
OMG WRIGGLYT O X O P L A S M O S I SRegistered User regular
OMG WRIGGLYT O X O P L A S M O S I SRegistered User regular
So, I'm nineteen, female, living at home. I am currently in a state where I am focusing on my mental health and recovery, as I was instituted at the age of 17 for a period of time with bipolar disorder, and I cannot leave the emotional and economic support systems at home until I recover to a state where this is the case. I am also a full time student, and live a quick bus ride away from school.
This shouldn't be a problem at all, except that I live with my dad. We had a good relationship growing up, but over time it soured. He worked long hours to support his four kids and grew a large sense of resentment over it, he has unresolved issues of his own that he refuses to sort out with medication or therapy. Right until shortly before my instituion, our relationship was steadily getting worse and worse, with abusive behavior on his part. When I was instituted, he came in to talk to me and try to explain his side of our conflict. I told him to leave. We haven't talked for more than two sentances at a time since.
Because of all of these factors, he and my mother have been having a hard time maintaining their marriage. He went to China for a year to teach ESL and give my mother some space to reconsider his options. We did not communicate for the entire year. My mother told him to ask me if I wanted my e-mail put out on a little diary he was sending out to friends and family about working and living in China, he never asked me and lied to her about this. I never reached out to him.
My mother loved the freedom, the lack of tension, and while she missed him this was an overall satisfactory year for her. My father had 'a breakdown' overseas and was instituted for a period of time in a Chinese hospital. I don't know too many details about this, as I haven't asked my mother and I do not talk to my father.
My father finished his year in China and returned home. We do not talk. Any conversation we have is extremely short, tense and aggressive. He complains about me to multiple third sources, stomps around and mutters and curses over small things such as a butter knife not being wiped completely clean before being placed in the sink or a piece of paper floating onto the floor from an open window, or a chair being in his way. Any communication we have had is effectively him telling me his problems with him. I have no interest in opening any lines of communication with him.
So my father is at home, still living with my mother. Life must be juggled around him. If I have a friend over, he will shout and yell at my mother about how inconsiderate I am for bringing someone over and turning the television on at a low level and speaking with indoor voices. He only tolerates my boyfriend being over because my mom stood firm on that. I am encouraged to leave the house entirely when he is not working, as he will find fault with the mildest thing and turn it into a screaming match. Much of the abusive behavior has been curtailed, but not all.
For about a year, she has been telling him that the marriage is effectively over and she cannot live with him in this state, nor can she allow him to be near me due to the intense negative effect he is having on my recovery. The two of them are planning to put this condo on the market. This is an extremely slow process for two reasons.
1. He is refusing to speak to her about the end of their marriage and moving on to her face. He is refusing to help with any divorce proceedings. He is talking about all possibilities to my older brother, who relays the information to my mother. This is very emotionally hard on her, and is not an effective or sustainable means of moving this process along.
2. We currently live in a condo embroiled in lawsuits against management, bad publicity, insurance blacklistings, etc. This is not a property which will move quickly.
So what this means is my plea for advice is twofold. How can I live in the environment that I am in now while continuing to recover quickly and begin to plan my life beyond home? And when this entire process is done, how do I deal with the knowledge that my estrangement from my father is going to lead to me missing the last years of his life? He has, at the very least, severe and chronic depression. I believe the chances of him committing suicide are astronomically high. Even if he does not, he is in his mid sixties. If I continue on this course, which I feel like I must at this point, I am going to have to tell my mother I will not be attending my father's funeral. This is a very emotionally difficult thing for both my mother and I.
As for suggestions for therapy, I am currently in the process of setting up a free counselling service through my school which will last for 12 sessions, after which I will recieve a referral.
This shouldn't be a problem at all, except that I live with my dad. We had a good relationship growing up, but over time it soured. He worked long hours to support his four kids and grew a large sense of resentment over it, he has unresolved issues of his own that he refuses to sort out with medication or therapy. Right until shortly before my instituion, our relationship was steadily getting worse and worse, with abusive behavior on his part. When I was instituted, he came in to talk to me and try to explain his side of our conflict. I told him to leave. We haven't talked for more than two sentances at a time since.
Because of all of these factors, he and my mother have been having a hard time maintaining their marriage. He went to China for a year to teach ESL and give my mother some space to reconsider his options. We did not communicate for the entire year. My mother told him to ask me if I wanted my e-mail put out on a little diary he was sending out to friends and family about working and living in China, he never asked me and lied to her about this. I never reached out to him.
My mother loved the freedom, the lack of tension, and while she missed him this was an overall satisfactory year for her. My father had 'a breakdown' overseas and was instituted for a period of time in a Chinese hospital. I don't know too many details about this, as I haven't asked my mother and I do not talk to my father.
My father finished his year in China and returned home. We do not talk. Any conversation we have is extremely short, tense and aggressive. He complains about me to multiple third sources, stomps around and mutters and curses over small things such as a butter knife not being wiped completely clean before being placed in the sink or a piece of paper floating onto the floor from an open window, or a chair being in his way. Any communication we have had is effectively him telling me his problems with him. I have no interest in opening any lines of communication with him.
So my father is at home, still living with my mother. Life must be juggled around him. If I have a friend over, he will shout and yell at my mother about how inconsiderate I am for bringing someone over and turning the television on at a low level and speaking with indoor voices. He only tolerates my boyfriend being over because my mom stood firm on that. I am encouraged to leave the house entirely when he is not working, as he will find fault with the mildest thing and turn it into a screaming match. Much of the abusive behavior has been curtailed, but not all.
For about a year, she has been telling him that the marriage is effectively over and she cannot live with him in this state, nor can she allow him to be near me due to the intense negative effect he is having on my recovery. The two of them are planning to put this condo on the market. This is an extremely slow process for two reasons.
1. He is refusing to speak to her about the end of their marriage and moving on to her face. He is refusing to help with any divorce proceedings. He is talking about all possibilities to my older brother, who relays the information to my mother. This is very emotionally hard on her, and is not an effective or sustainable means of moving this process along.
2. We currently live in a condo embroiled in lawsuits against management, bad publicity, insurance blacklistings, etc. This is not a property which will move quickly.
So what this means is my plea for advice is twofold. How can I live in the environment that I am in now while continuing to recover quickly and begin to plan my life beyond home? And when this entire process is done, how do I deal with the knowledge that my estrangement from my father is going to lead to me missing the last years of his life? He has, at the very least, severe and chronic depression. I believe the chances of him committing suicide are astronomically high. Even if he does not, he is in his mid sixties. If I continue on this course, which I feel like I must at this point, I am going to have to tell my mother I will not be attending my father's funeral. This is a very emotionally difficult thing for both my mother and I.
As for suggestions for therapy, I am currently in the process of setting up a free counselling service through my school which will last for 12 sessions, after which I will recieve a referral.
Dread Pirate Arbuthnot on
0
Posts
How very dramatic of you.
Honest question - is it even possible for you to be on your own?
Families can suck. They can often be toxic. Do you feel like its possible for you to completely cut them out of your life?
What are you prepared to do? It may take you stopping school . . . are you okay with that?
It may take you getting several jobs and saving every penny, are you okay with that?
This is hard for me to answer because I've never not lived at home.
When I got really unwell and was a danger to myself, my mother got me admitted to the hospital, did the paperwork, visited me and brought me food, brought pictures of my cat to put above my bed, and so on. She picked me up when I was released and dropped me off to my outpatient sessions. She pays for my medications, which is about $100+ a month for a variety of pills. This is under her insurance. I'm Canadian, so I'm not sure how much of the tab is picked up by government. This is something I should actually ask her about because I need to know this.
My mom is a safety net for me.
My father? Yes, we are already as estranged as we can be without him biting the bullet, divorcing, and moving out.
My mother and brothers? They may be enabling his behavior to some point, but they have mostly supported and nurtured me and so I cannot cut them off. They are an essential support system and will continue to be one even after I move out.
In all honesty, I don't know what I'm capable of.
I've worked shitty jobs for students, full time. I've worked 40 hours a week. I don't know if I could work, say, 60 hours a week, or in a factory, or whatever. I feel like I need to start looking at taking a large loan out.
I have a brother moving to Toronto next year, he is asking me if I want to split rent. This may be a great opportunity to test the waters or a really horrible plan. I'm not sure.
Taking a large loan out w/ your folks involved is going to be extremely taxing..in the emotional sense.
I dont know how it works in Canada, but here in the states, students are dependant on their parents unless they can prove financial and residential independence, they turn 25, they join the military, or they get married. Once independant they can get their own aide via loans and grants without input or requirement from the parents. These are Gov backed loans, so there is no credit check involved.
Its very important for you to look up every gov program for your health services. You may suddenly find yourself without the regular support of your mom or dad, so knowing your options is Critical. I'd start that right away.
Moving might give you piece of mind, but that means operating without that safety net of your mom. Don't dispair over this - everyone has to play without a net eventually. You'll find a way through because you have to - its part of living & learning.
Best advice I can think of is to start making a plan. Figure out what you where you want to be and start moving in that direction - make sure to do a lot of research before you leap, so you're well informed, and can make some educated guesses. Example: If you take the toronto offer, read up on the neighborhood, cost of living, crime stats, jobs available, local colleges, local hangouts, etc.
It basically boils down to the fact that you get to start your own life now and you get to choose who you want to be. Its time to start asking yourself what you want, and how you plan on getting it.
Heh..I just realized I'm asking you what you want to be when you grow up?
In fair context, I just turned 26 and I'm still askin myself this same question.
Mega hugs next time I'm in town, hon!
Take out a student loan and get the hell out of there.
Living in Toronto won't even be that far from home for you so seriously, whatever.
You could even make it a temporary thing if it worked out, and move home once the rotten bastard is kicked to the curb. Take out a loan and get going, if it is what is best for your sanity.
Right now that is the most important thing; people like me want you around!
Got my number?
You do now!
They cast a shadow like a sundial in the morning light. It was half past 10.
Your mother and father.
Why hasn't one of them moved out yet?
You don't need to be divorced in order to not live together.
Satans..... hints.....
A quick overview of the situation:
My mother is currently trying to tell my father to get out without kicking him out. They have been married for over 30 years so she is not throwing him out on the streets. She is trying her best to organize a quick, amicable move out like adults. She also feels like this could be a temporary divorce and if my dad gets help, they could get back together.
One thing we are considering is that he move into my brother's apartment - he owns a single apartment in the same condo building as us but seven floors up. My brother and his two cats would move down with us until my brother found another place. My dad is considering this, but it's a slow process as he is in complete denial and refuses to talk to my mom about it.
My mom wants him to move out, but wants to stay here for the moment. She's kind of okay with him staying here while she figures out her options. She's sacrificed a lot over the years for her husband and her kids and it's kind of a habit for her now. She's looking at real estate, getting our place up on the market, organizing her finances, and so on.
We currently live within bussing distance of my primary care provider, my school, the hospital where I see my doctors regarding long term care, and so on. Mom says she doesn't want to displace me from these things; I kind of feel like this is an excuse because she wants to avoid conflict. My dad's been especially volatile lately, you can tell his general state from the amount of liquor he hides around the house.
I understand the avoidance everyone does because nobody wants to deal with the situation.
While this may not be the most popular opinion, I say just tough it out until you are mentally and financially capable of leaving. You have your own issues to deal with. It is not your job to fix your father's problems. It is not your job to fix or end your parent's marriage. They are adults and are free to make their own decisions. Understand that they are people with issues as well and try to be as supportive as you can, but just focus on your own recovery.
It's also quite likely you'll find that once you move out you'll get along better with your parents, so don't worry about the future and whether you'll speak after you move out. You may never have a big, happy family sitdown where you hash out all your problems, but the situation will be better when you don't have to deal with it constantly.
Well your mother honestly has to really lay down the law to your father.
Basically she is doing what the great Apu once did.
She wants to end the marriage.
He does not.
What usually happens is that the person that doesn't want to stay in the relationship leaves. Demanding the other person that doesn't want to leave doesn't work. Because they have no incentive to leave.
Where you are living now I am certain is not the only house in the district. Encourage your mother to move out because your father isn't going to make the next step.
Really what I am getting at here is that your home environment is toxic because everyone's relationship with your father (with the exception of your brother) sucks.
Once people get away from him it might be ok. The easiest way to get away if you can't afford a place is to go with someone else who doesn't want to be there. That would be your mother.
Satans..... hints.....
Analyze the last post for confirmation - this is how you began each line:
"My mother"
"One thing we are considering"
"My mom wants"
"We currently live"
You haven't really made enough "I" statements in the conversation so far.
I'm less worried about your mom and dad, they've managed to make it this far, and they'll figure out how to move forward.
But their relationship isnt YOUR relationship, and I think thats an important distinction.
I'd rather hear about what you think. I'd like to know how this is affecting you, and just how you feel.
In the process of getting counseling for 12 sessions through my school, after that they will refer me to a long term thing. I might try to get in touch with one of the United Way's programs again, as I did that in high school and it worked really well.
No, my brother's place has a bed that he sleeps in and the only other place to live in is a loveseat. It's small and cramped.
What's going to happen when my dad moves up there (if?) is that my brother is going to stay in our roomy family condo until he gets a new place