Here's another issue to consider about the whole representation of women in the game.
As a woman, I find the female character design in TERA . . . off-putting. I tend to play as female characters, because I feel odd playing as male ones. I don't like that my only choice in this game is to play as a hypersexual, almost naked pin-up, because that's not how I want to represent myself. If it's my only option, I get a little annoyed.*
At least in Guild Wars, as ridiculous as some of the armor designs were, most of the classes allowed you an option to wear covering clothes. I played as a Mesmer mainly, and, although I rolled my eyes at the lingerie set, I could find armor that was beautiful, elegant and didn't make me look like a call-girl. Part of the reason I never played much elementalist was that every option available basically made me half-naked, and I found it off-putting.
One of the aspects of LOTRO that I really appreciate is the lack of a double standard in the armor. If I put a male character and a female character in exactly the same armor, they will look almost exactly the same, bar a few adjustments to accommodate the underlying body structure. It's not like my man will be in a full set of plate mail and my woman will be in a thong.
So, they're essentially alienating a good part of their potential audience over something stupid. And, yes, women play MMOs in vast numbers. It's worth taking us into consideration, rather than deliberately aiming at the fourteen-and-horny market.
*Obviously, I can't speak for all women. Some women may enjoy being hypersexual in a game.
I've seen the "stutter a lot" shit in a bunch of trailers for various games recently. What's up with that? You'd think the developers and PR department would take the time to coordinate smooth gameplay footage at the very least.
Yeah, it's kinda terrible.
The actual gameplay, at least, from the HD video's that people uploaded, is in fact sickeningly smooth.
I was pretty startled by how smooth and fast some of that animation looked.
I've been thinking for a while that it would be nice if each item of armor had three appearances- conservative, lingerie, and something in between. Then each player could set how provocative they wanted their character to look. This would triple some guy's workload though.
[That was a general thought; I have only played WoW and only know about TERA because of this thread.]
Wolfrider on
If this had been an actual alien invasion, you would have protected as many as SOME of your population. Congratulations.
Official trailers were probably made with workstation-class graphics accelerators instead of consumer-level videocards. That's just my best guess, though. Could be something else stupid, like what they used to record the gameplay and at what frame rate (fixed?) and resolution, or what they used to edit the footage and at what frame rate, or what they used to encode the footage, etc..
MarkJW on
PAX Prime 2013 Checklist ➤ ✔ Enforcer Badge ✔ Hotel ✔ Flight
I was pretty startled by how smooth and fast some of that animation looked.
I've been thinking for a while that it would be nice if each item of armor had three appearances- conservative, lingerie, and something in between. Then each player could set how provocative they wanted their character to look. This would triple some guy's workload though.
[That was a general thought; I have only played WoW and only know about TERA because of this thread.]
I was thinking something along these lines last night. Perhaps just a setting in the options called "Conservative Armor" when if checked turned all the thong-bikini armor into non-revealing full body armor.
That way the people that don't care about the thong armor, or even enjoy it could play along side the people that do care, and neither would be offended or bothered.
The nice thing about TERA is that every race can be every class.
You want to make a hot slutty looking Warrior? Pick a Castanic
You want to make a hot conservative looking warrior? Pick a Human
You want to make an ugly looking warrior? Pick an Aman
So we get stiff once in a while. So we have a little fun. What’s wrong with that? This is a free country, isn’t it? I can take my panda any place I want to. And if I wanna buy it a drink, that’s my business.
I dunno, my Human Archer was looked like a biker babe with her short shorts and shirt that stopped somewhere halfway down her torso. I don't know if you'd categorize that as conservative... :winky:
MarkJW on
PAX Prime 2013 Checklist ➤ ✔ Enforcer Badge ✔ Hotel ✔ Flight
I dunno, my Human Archer was looked like a biker babe with her short shorts and shirt that stopped somewhere halfway down her torso. I don't know if you'd categorize that as conservative... :winky:
Well of course you can make a Human Female slutty as well, same with the Elves.
So we get stiff once in a while. So we have a little fun. What’s wrong with that? This is a free country, isn’t it? I can take my panda any place I want to. And if I wanna buy it a drink, that’s my business.
I'm not sure if only the elves do it, but when they cast spells they shake their ass much more than one would think necessary. My explanation for this obviously gratuitous action is that it somehow helps channel the magic more efficiently. :winky:
God that emote is the best.
MarkJW on
PAX Prime 2013 Checklist ➤ ✔ Enforcer Badge ✔ Hotel ✔ Flight
Just_Bri_ThanksSeething with ragefrom a handbasket.Registered User, ClubPAregular
edited May 2010
I too strongly dislike a kill grind pretending to be a quest progression.
I don't even use the term quest grind. In my experience all quest grinds are actually kill grinds.
If the quests have any thought behind them at all, it doesn't end up being a grind.
WoW is a prime example of this. If you do only the objectives required by the quests in any given area, you will still kill several dozen of EVERY MONSTER IN THE AREA.
Thanks, but no thanks.
Just_Bri_Thanks on
...and when you are done with that; take a folding
chair to Creation and then suplex the Void.
I'm not sure if only the elves do it, but when they cast spells they shake their ass much more than one would think necessary. My explanation for this obviously gratuitous action is that it somehow helps channel the magic more efficiently. :winky:
God that emote is the best.
HaHa. Awesome.
Yeah I did see some of that booty shaking in one of the gameplay vids I watched.
I asked my wife if she is offended in any way by the thong armor or having the "kiddys" in the game. She didn't even think it was a kid when I showed her the picture on the first page. Even when I explained that it wasn't a kid, but "looked" like a kid she didn't see the problem.
Which reminds me, why don't people freak out about games objectifying guys when they are impossibly muscular?
I guess there will always be those people that freak out over things that don't match their ideals, instead of just ignoring it or letting people do their own thing.
ghost_master2000 on
0
Options
Just_Bri_ThanksSeething with ragefrom a handbasket.Registered User, ClubPAregular
Which reminds me, why don't people freak out about games objectifying guys when they are impossibly muscular?
America regards being impossibly muscular as something to aspire to.
Edit: Unless you are a woman.
While simultaneously having impossibly skinny women with big boobs be "something to aspire to", yet people freak out about large breasted skinny women in games, but not muscular guys. I'm just pointing out the double standard that a lot of people have. I couldn't care either way, but think it's funny that people don't notice this.
As for there possibly not being specs in the game, I'm actually fine with that. Every game that allows for different specs usually has a "best build" anyways, so might as well just give everybody the same build anyways.
While simultaneously having impossibly skinny women with big boobs be "something to aspire to", yet people freak out about large breasted skinny women in games, but not muscular guys. I'm just pointing out the double standard that a lot of people have. I couldn't care either way, but think it's funny that people don't notice this.
I am not disagreeing with you. I personally would find a lot of value in a properly proportioned athletic body model for both men and women in the game, as well as sensible armor and clothing options; but most game designers don't seem to think that will sell.
As for chain mail bikinis in game my stance is that it is great and all if you want to wear them: Knock yourself out. Just don't try to persuade me that this will do anything for you other than poke or scratch you in uncomfortable places, which would never be represented in a video game anyway.
Just_Bri_Thanks on
...and when you are done with that; take a folding
chair to Creation and then suplex the Void.
It's interesting that if some people see a buff and perfectly sculpted male barbarian in a loincloth they think nothing of it because he'd just look like the hulk in most games, and hey, we're used to it.
but if we see a female barbarian with curves in just a loincloth people start getting upset
It's interesting that if some people see a buff and perfectly sculpted male barbarian in a loincloth they think nothing of it because he'd just look like the hulk in most games, and hey, we're used to it.
but if we see a female barbarian with curves in just a loincloth people start getting upset
Because there isn't the same tradition of objectification there?
Do you really want to get started back in on this?
It's interesting that if some people see a buff and perfectly sculpted male barbarian in a loincloth they think nothing of it because he'd just look like the hulk in most games, and hey, we're used to it.
but if we see a female barbarian with curves in just a loincloth people start getting upset
Because there isn't the same tradition of objectification there?
Do you really want to get started back in on this?
This.
The Hulk, Conan, Tarzan aren't sexualised at all. Their outfits and their body shape aren't meant to be erotic. They're meant to promote male identification, not objectification.
Obviously, I don't think it's great that is the only image of masculinity available to men. I think there's a reason that eating disorders and excessive exercise have risen exponentially over the past few decades, and I think it has to do with the images available in our culture.
I also found it stupid when they buffed up the originally slender blood elves in WoW. I thought it was good to have an alternative, but apparently the fans wanted a hypermasculine image. As a result, you have Elves that are built like brick walls.
I would have problems if the game presented a young boy in the same sexualised way as they do the Lolicoons.
But I think everyone is tired of this discussion, and I don't want to keep repeating myself.
While simultaneously having impossibly skinny women with big boobs be "something to aspire to", yet people freak out about large breasted skinny women in games, but not muscular guys. I'm just pointing out the double standard that a lot of people have. I couldn't care either way, but think it's funny that people don't notice this.
I am not disagreeing with you. I personally would find a lot of value in a properly proportioned athletic body model for both men and women in the game, as well as sensible armor and clothing options; but most game designers don't seem to think that will sell.
As for chain mail bikinis in game my stance is that it is great and all if you want to wear them: Knock yourself out. Just don't try to persuade me that this will do anything for you other than poke or scratch you in uncomfortable places, which would never be represented in a video game anyway.
What if they added a minigame where after every time you ran a certain distance you had to pick out your chainmail wedgie?
As for the protection given by this armor (or lack thereof), it IS armor in a world with magic and if the armor is imbued with magic then it may in fact give significant protection, and if anything the revealing nature of the outfit will give them an advantage by distracting the opponent. There are plenty of cultures that use(d) distraction techniques in battle.
Which is purely a justification for the dev's design look and nothing more. They'd be scantly clad regardless.
I wasn't justifying anything. Just giving a possible counterpoint to the stated lack of protection provided by such outfits. Considering you responded in such a manner to my comment, I think you just like arguing. Either that or you HAVE to be "right". We get it. You have a problem with the portrayal of women in the game.
If it'll make you shut your mouth about the topic, then yes, you're right. They're scantily clad and it's soooo terrible. Now I kindly request that you get out of this thread if you're going to keep dirtying it up with your bullshit because you aren't contributing anything anymore (not that you really were very much in the first place). :winky:
A counterpoint that is useless since it's a game and not a real situation. The devs decided they wanted their females dressed like whores and you are indeed trying to justify that decision with nonsense.
There is no counterpoint to this. It's an artificial environment, that's how the devs wanted it. Anybody saying otherwise just wants to look at it in such a way so that they don't feel bad.
Shorn Scrotum Man on
0
Options
ArchonexNo hard feelings, right?Registered Userregular
edited May 2010
Or, you know, maybe we just don't think it's as much of a big deal as you do. It's not like the gaming industry is going to screech to a halt over some TnA being shown.
A counterpoint that is useless since it's a game and not a real situation. The devs decided they wanted their females dressed like whores and you are indeed trying to justify that decision with nonsense.
There is no counterpoint to this. It's an artificial environment, that's how the devs wanted it. Anybody saying otherwise just wants to look at it in such a way so that they don't feel bad.
Wow. I'm sorry that you get so offended over something so petty. Do you get so upset over shooters like Modern Warfare since the devs decided they wanted to depict people getting murdered over and over? If so, why are you on a videogame forum? Go play tetris or something... oh wait, those poor blocks getting destroyed...
ghost_master2000 on
0
Options
BeezelThere was no agreement little morsel..Registered Userregular
edited May 2010
So how many sheets of thinking aluminum am I going to need to get this shit to run on my 2 year old PC?
So how many sheets of thinking aluminum am I going to need to get this shit to run on my 2 year old PC?
Depends on how pretty you want it to look, bro. Do you like mud? Because that's probably what a lot of the textures will look like if you're playing TERA on a 7XXX-series card (or the ATi equivalent). Personally I run TERA on a 8800M GTS and C2D T9300 (2.5ghz) with 4gb of memory on Windows 7 64-bit (yes, it's a laptop). I can jack up the settings when no one's around, but in the cities and during PvP I turned them down. I also turned off the dynamic lighting (including HDR/Bloom) after a while because it caused eyestrain for me, but I turned it back on later.
MarkJW on
PAX Prime 2013 Checklist ➤ ✔ Enforcer Badge ✔ Hotel ✔ Flight
BeezelThere was no agreement little morsel..Registered Userregular
edited May 2010
wait, you're playing it?
WITCH!
BURN THE WITCH
also. Dude should get thongs in game. Banana hammocks with nutswing(tm) physics. Except ladies wouldn't find that sort of thing attractive I'm betting.
So how many sheets of thinking aluminum am I going to need to get this shit to run on my 2 year old PC?
Depends on how pretty you want it to look, bro. Do you like mud? Because that's probably what a lot of the textures will look like if you're playing TERA on a 7XXX-series card (or the ATi equivalent). Personally I run TERA on a 8800M GTS and C2D T9300 (2.5ghz) with 4gb of memory on Windows 7 64-bit (yes, it's a laptop). I can jack up the settings when no one's around, but in the cities and during PvP I turned them down. I also turned off the dynamic lighting (including HDR/Bloom) after a while because it caused eyestrain for me, but I turned it back on later.
That's good to hear what specs you're playing this on.
I've got an 8800GT and it's the biggest bottleneck in my system currently. These eastern MMO's always get me nervous if I can play them with the ridiculous graphics they advertise.
Just out of curiousity, has there been an MMO that allowed you to have two graphics settings: one for cities/raids/other gpu pits and one for more open areas? I feel like I could give up a 2 - 3 second transition time to let it reload if it meant not having to wait 30 - 50 seconds while my graphics cards shits a brick.
Just out of curiousity, has there been an MMO that allowed you to have two graphics settings: one for cities/raids/other gpu pits and one for more open areas? I feel like I could give up a 2 - 3 second transition time to let it reload if it meant not having to wait 30 - 50 seconds while my graphics cards shits a brick.
AoC allows you to swith to RAID/SIEGE which is drastically lowered graphics with the click in the Video Options menu. You can then switch to another higher setting, but it won't save your custom settings.
So we get stiff once in a while. So we have a little fun. What’s wrong with that? This is a free country, isn’t it? I can take my panda any place I want to. And if I wanna buy it a drink, that’s my business.
I find it odd that any of you would be shocked to see both the words "appealing to a western audience" and "tits and ass and objectifying women" used to describe something
So how many sheets of thinking aluminum am I going to need to get this shit to run on my 2 year old PC?
Depends on how pretty you want it to look, bro. Do you like mud? Because that's probably what a lot of the textures will look like if you're playing TERA on a 7XXX-series card (or the ATi equivalent). Personally I run TERA on a 8800M GTS and C2D T9300 (2.5ghz) with 4gb of memory on Windows 7 64-bit (yes, it's a laptop). I can jack up the settings when no one's around, but in the cities and during PvP I turned them down. I also turned off the dynamic lighting (including HDR/Bloom) after a while because it caused eyestrain for me, but I turned it back on later.
That's good to hear what specs you're playing this on.
I've got an 8800GT and it's the biggest bottleneck in my system currently. These eastern MMO's always get me nervous if I can play them with the ridiculous graphics they advertise.
I'd upgrade that part eventually. Depending on the amount of memory your card was blessed with, you might get to experience the wonderful Unreal engine's streaming textures stutterbug!
I wish I had the money to make a new PC, honestly. Can't Fraps and run TERA at the same time.
MarkJW on
PAX Prime 2013 Checklist ➤ ✔ Enforcer Badge ✔ Hotel ✔ Flight
Isn't the 8800GT a pretty big step above the 8800GTS?
I guess we'll see what the required and recommended specs will be eventually. I was at least able to run Aion pretty well with my setup, so I can't imagine this will be too much different.
Posts
That comic was the first thing that came to mind after seeing the trailer & related debate. It does raise some good points.
As a woman, I find the female character design in TERA . . . off-putting. I tend to play as female characters, because I feel odd playing as male ones. I don't like that my only choice in this game is to play as a hypersexual, almost naked pin-up, because that's not how I want to represent myself. If it's my only option, I get a little annoyed.*
At least in Guild Wars, as ridiculous as some of the armor designs were, most of the classes allowed you an option to wear covering clothes. I played as a Mesmer mainly, and, although I rolled my eyes at the lingerie set, I could find armor that was beautiful, elegant and didn't make me look like a call-girl. Part of the reason I never played much elementalist was that every option available basically made me half-naked, and I found it off-putting.
One of the aspects of LOTRO that I really appreciate is the lack of a double standard in the armor. If I put a male character and a female character in exactly the same armor, they will look almost exactly the same, bar a few adjustments to accommodate the underlying body structure. It's not like my man will be in a full set of plate mail and my woman will be in a thong.
So, they're essentially alienating a good part of their potential audience over something stupid. And, yes, women play MMOs in vast numbers. It's worth taking us into consideration, rather than deliberately aiming at the fourteen-and-horny market.
*Obviously, I can't speak for all women. Some women may enjoy being hypersexual in a game.
PSN: GetMediaeval
Yeah, it's kinda terrible.
The actual gameplay, at least, from the HD video's that people uploaded, is in fact sickeningly smooth.
That is why it is so ridiculous that the one official video is all wonky.
I've been thinking for a while that it would be nice if each item of armor had three appearances- conservative, lingerie, and something in between. Then each player could set how provocative they wanted their character to look. This would triple some guy's workload though.
[That was a general thought; I have only played WoW and only know about TERA because of this thread.]
ArcheAge News
ArcheAge Forums
I was thinking something along these lines last night. Perhaps just a setting in the options called "Conservative Armor" when if checked turned all the thong-bikini armor into non-revealing full body armor.
That way the people that don't care about the thong armor, or even enjoy it could play along side the people that do care, and neither would be offended or bothered.
You want to make a hot slutty looking Warrior? Pick a Castanic
You want to make a hot conservative looking warrior? Pick a Human
You want to make an ugly looking warrior? Pick an Aman
The same is true of all the other classes.
ArcheAge News
ArcheAge Forums
Well of course you can make a Human Female slutty as well, same with the Elves.
God that emote is the best.
ArcheAge News
ArcheAge Forums
I don't even use the term quest grind. In my experience all quest grinds are actually kill grinds.
If the quests have any thought behind them at all, it doesn't end up being a grind.
WoW is a prime example of this. If you do only the objectives required by the quests in any given area, you will still kill several dozen of EVERY MONSTER IN THE AREA.
Thanks, but no thanks.
chair to Creation and then suplex the Void.
HaHa. Awesome.
Yeah I did see some of that booty shaking in one of the gameplay vids I watched.
I asked my wife if she is offended in any way by the thong armor or having the "kiddys" in the game. She didn't even think it was a kid when I showed her the picture on the first page. Even when I explained that it wasn't a kid, but "looked" like a kid she didn't see the problem.
Which reminds me, why don't people freak out about games objectifying guys when they are impossibly muscular?
I guess there will always be those people that freak out over things that don't match their ideals, instead of just ignoring it or letting people do their own thing.
America regards being impossibly muscular as something to aspire to.
Edit: Unless you are a woman.
chair to Creation and then suplex the Void.
While simultaneously having impossibly skinny women with big boobs be "something to aspire to", yet people freak out about large breasted skinny women in games, but not muscular guys. I'm just pointing out the double standard that a lot of people have. I couldn't care either way, but think it's funny that people don't notice this.
As for there possibly not being specs in the game, I'm actually fine with that. Every game that allows for different specs usually has a "best build" anyways, so might as well just give everybody the same build anyways.
TnA and Swords is the work of satan
The internet told me this
I am not disagreeing with you. I personally would find a lot of value in a properly proportioned athletic body model for both men and women in the game, as well as sensible armor and clothing options; but most game designers don't seem to think that will sell.
As for chain mail bikinis in game my stance is that it is great and all if you want to wear them: Knock yourself out. Just don't try to persuade me that this will do anything for you other than poke or scratch you in uncomfortable places, which would never be represented in a video game anyway.
chair to Creation and then suplex the Void.
but if we see a female barbarian with curves in just a loincloth people start getting upset
Because there isn't the same tradition of objectification there?
Do you really want to get started back in on this?
but no, no I dont
This.
The Hulk, Conan, Tarzan aren't sexualised at all. Their outfits and their body shape aren't meant to be erotic. They're meant to promote male identification, not objectification.
Obviously, I don't think it's great that is the only image of masculinity available to men. I think there's a reason that eating disorders and excessive exercise have risen exponentially over the past few decades, and I think it has to do with the images available in our culture.
I also found it stupid when they buffed up the originally slender blood elves in WoW. I thought it was good to have an alternative, but apparently the fans wanted a hypermasculine image. As a result, you have Elves that are built like brick walls.
I would have problems if the game presented a young boy in the same sexualised way as they do the Lolicoons.
But I think everyone is tired of this discussion, and I don't want to keep repeating myself.
PSN: GetMediaeval
What if they added a minigame where after every time you ran a certain distance you had to pick out your chainmail wedgie?
As for the protection given by this armor (or lack thereof), it IS armor in a world with magic and if the armor is imbued with magic then it may in fact give significant protection, and if anything the revealing nature of the outfit will give them an advantage by distracting the opponent. There are plenty of cultures that use(d) distraction techniques in battle.
I wasn't justifying anything. Just giving a possible counterpoint to the stated lack of protection provided by such outfits. Considering you responded in such a manner to my comment, I think you just like arguing. Either that or you HAVE to be "right". We get it. You have a problem with the portrayal of women in the game.
If it'll make you shut your mouth about the topic, then yes, you're right. They're scantily clad and it's soooo terrible. Now I kindly request that you get out of this thread if you're going to keep dirtying it up with your bullshit because you aren't contributing anything anymore (not that you really were very much in the first place). :winky:
There is no counterpoint to this. It's an artificial environment, that's how the devs wanted it. Anybody saying otherwise just wants to look at it in such a way so that they don't feel bad.
If it makes you feel better I think that Chris Redfield looks absolutely retarded along with most ultramuscled game characters.
Wow. I'm sorry that you get so offended over something so petty. Do you get so upset over shooters like Modern Warfare since the devs decided they wanted to depict people getting murdered over and over? If so, why are you on a videogame forum? Go play tetris or something... oh wait, those poor blocks getting destroyed...
"...only mights and maybes."
ArcheAge News
ArcheAge Forums
WITCH!
BURN THE WITCH
also. Dude should get thongs in game. Banana hammocks with nutswing(tm) physics. Except ladies wouldn't find that sort of thing attractive I'm betting.
Red panda with a lance and speedo here I come.
"...only mights and maybes."
That's good to hear what specs you're playing this on.
I've got an 8800GT and it's the biggest bottleneck in my system currently. These eastern MMO's always get me nervous if I can play them with the ridiculous graphics they advertise.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1OLcAGbXhWIVcl5IziVpG0eKFJS3xi_Sac9kYMkRFvD8/edit?usp=sharing
AoC allows you to swith to RAID/SIEGE which is drastically lowered graphics with the click in the Video Options menu. You can then switch to another higher setting, but it won't save your custom settings.
Hoooooly shit, I've never heard of this but just at a glance that looks amazing. I know what I'll be reading today during any downtime I get at work.
I wish I had the money to make a new PC, honestly. Can't Fraps and run TERA at the same time.
ArcheAge News
ArcheAge Forums
I guess we'll see what the required and recommended specs will be eventually. I was at least able to run Aion pretty well with my setup, so I can't imagine this will be too much different.