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Getting offended: the new national pastime
Posts
Yes, totally! I'm not metamodding, just trying to be real clear that nobody here is claiming the comic is legitimately offensive. So that point shouldn't be brought up, there need be no allusions to forumers who hate PA or were offended by the comic.
As for "what jokes should be allowed" I think that's a pretty nebulous criteria. Allowed where? Allowed how? What jokes should be allowed by law? All of them. What jokes should you be allowed to recite at a 6 year old's birthday party? Only some of them! But not by law, by decency! Unless you're not invited and you're telling raunchy jokes and trying to evade the police, in which case you're creepy.
Actually regardless of statistics my question still stands. Violence is just as bad a problem as rape, if not more so, but do they have their own seperate little bubble where it's okay to make hilarious jokes about people being mauled?
"This" attempting to bait me with stupid one-liner tangential questions while openly admitting to not giving a damn about the answers and then whining when I don't bite.
this trolling.
People were in the new comic thread though which is why this thread was created.
Some people in this thread disagree with this.
Violence does not have a social stigma attached to it of being ignored or discounted, at least not in the same manner as rape.
If someone were to break into my apartment and steal my TV after stabbing me in the stomach, nobody would dare claim in a court of law that I "deserved it." Look at some of the less scrupulous defenses used against rape allegations.
Different subject matters have different context. Not really that complicated.
DeShadowC, you better have a link to back that up because I'm getting really tired of "RANDOM MYSTERY POSTER X" being used as some sort of strawman over and over and over again.
Who, specifically is arguing that some jokes should be outlawed?
Just like, if instead of 'raped by dickwolves' the phrase was 'viciously savaged by a pack of cockmonglers', would there be as much complaint? Isn't that just as 'offensive' to victims of assault?
You totally deserved it.
I'd have stabbed you twice.
Qingu multiple times has said rape jokes shouldn't be allowed. The term outlawed was never used but you can go read through the posts if you'd like.
Different subject matters have different levels of context and different social experiences to go along with them.
If I asked a black man if he was hungry for a tuna sandwhich with a glass of orange juice, would that be racist? If I asked him if he was hungry for fried chicken and grape drank, would that be racist? Should he be equally offended at each statement?
So yes Jintor, different things are different, and because they're different they may be different.
Shouldn't have had that sign outside advertising a TV in your home and shown off all that stabbable flesh.
Well, if he did say they should be outlawed you should link it because then we can all laugh and say "Haha that's dumb!"
If he didn't you shouldn't strawman that point. It makes you look foolish and lowers the discourse overall, its really hard to agree with an argument when the point you're responding to doesn't exist. I mean, sure, fuck those guys who think that rape jokes should be outlawed! And fuck those guys who think rape is great and should be legal! Also fuck those guys who leave their cell phones on during movies and fuck those guys who disconnect when you're winning a game of Street Fighter!
Anyone else who isn't relevant to this thread we should fuck?
Goddamn I'm buying a big, mean dog.
There's nothing tangential about the questions, although I may well be "stupid" in expecting a response to them. They are "one-liner" on account of being fairly simple questions. But do what you feel. I've been notified that I'm teasing you too much, so I'll leave you be. After this.
Seriously go read every post Qingu has made in this thread. It's the whole reason I even started posting in it.
Why would you wish those posts upon me?
I thought a main reason for avoiding rape jokes was unnecessarily making a victim relive the the trauma of a rape. Which would hold true for a victim of a violent attack too, right?
You're telling me to quote them, I'm stating there's too many to quote.
goddamn tautologies
Yeah, more or less this. I'm not trying to be deliberately stupid or anything - I get that they're different crimes, Potato, thank you very much - but in terms of 'offensive capability' at just making a joke about the subject I don't see a huge difference...
Rape is different than assault.
Oranges are not apples.
Monkeys are not rollercoasters.
I'm sorry that reality doesn't confirm to your desire for an incontestable singularity?
But then you're letting other rapewolves live that will go out and rape.
Because rape has a huge social stigma attached to the victim being a "slut" or "whore" and rape charges are incredibly difficult to prove and rape is often dismissed as "not a real crime" or "she was asking for it" or "she probably liked it because he's hot / famous / young / she's ugly."
Which means that if someone isn't taking rape seriously, and the above conditions concern you, you may find it offensive that a crime that is treated so flippantly by society is treated flippantly by a comedian.
Assault doesn't have that. Nobody says "you were assaulted by a good looking guy and he's famous so its not really assault."
Seriously, VASTLY different contexts that you'd need to intentionally ignore to not understand.
No, PETA would be offended and this thread would now be an argument about the morality of vegetarianism.
"Kill 20 rapewolves and give all the other rapewolves a stern talking-to."
/edit hrmmm. Actually, no, you're right about this.
But does the trivialization of rape mean PA shouldn't make rape jokes?
At which point all is right with the world.
Until you go to the next area and discover a bunch of Red Rapewolves kidnapping the local villagers.
Depends on the context of the assault. If someone is assaulted by an authority figure (esp. if the parties are a. a nonwhite and b. a cop), it's actually extremely common for certain subsets of the population to assume they deserved it, and quite vocally too. Similarly, male complainants in domestic abuse cases are routinely laughed at.
Your point about the persistence of rape myths is a good one, although in North America at least it seems to me that kind of thinking is less prevalent than it was 40 years ago.
*Cough* Roman Polanski *Cough*
To quote Whoopi Goldberg "I know it wasn't rape-rape. It was something else but I don't believe it was rape-rape."
So do you think this
is less important than the social stigma?
Not even a little bit, at least not like the ones they're doing. I'd find a joke like "Man, that bitch deserved it LOOK AT THAT ARMOR" (lol joke about WoW armor being slutty) to be, uh, in bad taste (and also not funny).
It does mean that if you want to communicate effectively you should be aware of the social stigmas and conditions surrounding rape and put a little thought into how you communicate when dealing with that issue. I don't think it means its off-limits for jokes or that its off-limit in general, and I doubt that a blanket ban on mentioning rape in culture would do any good for concerns about how it is treated by society.
If you want a sort of thesis point, I guess I'd like people to understand why being offended isn't some horrible sin and why some people may take offense at jokes about rape, but in the example used to start this thread I don't believe the criticisms against PA have much merit or merit much response.
She said that? For real?
I don't really buy that, if you have a trauma that is caused by a specific type of media you need to self-censor to protect yourself against it.
Loud noises can make some soldiers really freak out due to PTSD, and that's tragic and hopefully they can get treatment and recover, but it doesn't mean we should ban loud noises.
If you're (you in the general sense, if it wasn't immediately obvious) traumatized enough by a rape experience that Wednesday's PA comic causes you to relive horrible flashbacks, you probably need some serious psychological assistance (that isn't meant as an insult--you probably actually need real help on a medically valid level) and exposure to all sorts of pop culture could be potentially hazardous to your mental well-being.
I'm still stuck at the part where he claims that calling an argument stupid is in itself stupid because, I guess, you can't disagree with stupid things without agreeing with them, or something.
I don't think anyone in this thread said people shouldn't be allowed to find rape offensive. Actually some people stated you were allowed to be offended about rape jokes but not religious ones because only rape is a traumatic experience.
Yes. Whoopi Goldberg. Not kidding.
Rape stigmas and victim-blaming are serious problems. Not a joke.
Yeah I'm not touching the religion thing. I don't debate religion on PA forums, its like that joke about wrestling with a pig except it takes longer and not even perverts can get off on it.
The Aristocrats.
Ah, okay. Eminently sensible.