Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
Is Death Strike the only option available for self healing for Unholy? I'm trying to quest and some self healing would be nice. Death Strike is kind of awkward to work into my rotation.
You can sacrifice your minion.
But otherwise, yes.
Munkus Beaver on
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
Blood
Death Strike now heals you for 25% (down from 30%) of the damage sustained during the preceding 5 sec, minimum of at least 7% (down from 10%) of your maximum health.
Rune Tap now heals you for 10% of your maximum health, down from 15%.
Blah - blood shield certainly didn't need a nerf at 80...I guess geared out 85s could get pretty high health pools though. For blood pvp, while I can heal myself quite nicely, I still feel way more squishy than druids, paladins, and warriors.
Unholy's self-healing options are fucking terrible now. DS is a huge sacrifice in damage, and Death Pact is as well since your pet is like 30%+ of your damage.
Edit: And this was before reading sim's post. Christ. I guess if you want to play a self-healing melee DPS class now, you play a rogue, warrior, or shit, pretty much anything but a DK?
And presumably, the only reason why I hear so many people complain about this, is because there's actually a lot of self-healing you have to do, when levelling in Cataclysm. I'm prepared for unholy to need maybe something like 1-2 DSes on every mob, as opposed to every couple of mobs, which leave me considering blood the only acceptable levelling spec.
I'd like to know what the reasoning behind the nerf is. Are blood tanks self-healing too much? Or is it that the DPS specs are actually healing too much (which seems unlikely, but that's why I'm curious)?
forty on
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Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
edited November 2010
Blood tanks are healing for way, way, way, way too much.
Munkus Beaver on
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
Blood tanks are healing for way, way, way, way too much.
This.
Their design for the DK has been .... unfocused this whole expansion. They've killed our self-healing, made it incredibly difficult for one spec to even use it and then they nerfed it again because the one spec with good self-healing was too good. Our self-healing is now way worse then a bunch of other DPS classes.
Really, I think designing one tank around self-healing in an expansion designed to make healing more difficult was not a good idea.
I guess there's no talent in the blood tree related to the healing death strike does that can be changed to adjust one spec without touching others.
The really stupid thing is, it's the "heal for X% of the damage you take" part that makes it overpowered for tanking, not the minimum heal. But they nerfed the minimum heal anyway, despite the fact that it's the most important part of the move to the DPS specs and is already kinda subpar for them.
Though I've seen some claims that the nerf is designed to compensate for the new, rather huge, bump in stamina scaling everyone got.
Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
edited November 2010
DKs are the best tanks by far right now for raid bosses.
Munkus Beaver on
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
DKs are the best tanks by far right now for raid bosses.
Is this on live or on beta? I ask because supposedly druids were rock hard to point that encounters designed around them led to other tanks getting two-shot
Taunt's mechanics make it completely useless as a method of pulling/gaining initial aggro. All it does is put you just above the highest threat the mob has. I believe it's the mob's target's threat +1. Death Grip is a better choice, as all it does is force your target to attack you for 3 seconds. In either case you must actually do some damage in order to actually keep the mob on you.
I should note that death grip and dark command work exactly the same (bar DG's yank effect) - they both taunt to match the highest threat and they both force the target to attack you for up to 3 seconds.
Is Death Strike the only option available for self healing for Unholy? I'm trying to quest and some self healing would be nice. Death Strike is kind of awkward to work into my rotation.
You could eat your ghoul once you get sufficiently low. What's wrong with deathstrikin'? Just burn the excess blood rune on a blood strike.
Unless it's been changed, Deathgrip worked on mocking blow mechanics, which just forced the mob to attack you for three seconds, leaving threat unchanged.
edit:
After about 30 seconds of google-fu i have determined that your are correct
How well are WoG speced paladins doing with self healing in comparison? I know one of the guild's MTs was speced for it in beta and was impressed with the results.
All 213+ level 80 non-tank 1hers have agility, so Nighttime is as good as anything else at that ilevel. The tank weapons have strength but are too fast to be good in addition to having one or sometimes two avoidance stats that do nothing for you.
forty on
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INeedNoSaltwith blood on my teethRegistered Userregular
Yeah, I forgot about those. Although with Cataclysm this close it's not really worth grinding the honor for them. Think it's around 2,500 for both the MH and OH?
I'm quite happy with my heroic icc lootship 1h axe with the really cheap PVP axe in my offhand. AGI on slow 1h's is a real waste - and I'm not sure the trend will be changing in cata, but top end weapon damage is so much more important than stats on the weapons that who cares.
I just realized, the only spec I like for DKs now is blood. And here I was bitching about it 3 weeks ago. Man I really don't like DKs that much anymore.
I just realized, the only spec I like for DKs now is blood. And here I was bitching about it 3 weeks ago. Man I really don't like DKs that much anymore.
This seems strange to me. All three trees are much more focused and each has more character, the differences are more defined. But I really like the changes, take the RNG out of my threat and I'll be a happy camper.
Oh, I definitely think DKs are better off, though to a lesser degree than several other classes that got huge changes.
I do believe some of the classes changes that seem drastic are more due to bad itemizeation at lvl 80 (for those specs). Blizz had said they were not worried about balance at 80....Of course then all the Warriors started crying about fury....I wonder why they haven't changed anything for rogues, they got hit pretty hard. At any rate, I guess we can only hope that they are aiming at something concrete in terms of balance at level 85.
With regards to DK changes for Cataclysm, the class is pretty much the same on the surface, but the alteration to how runes regenerate and the changes to all of the rune costs of abilities changed how the class plays quite a bit. Your abilities have the same names but how you use them is pretty different. For example, Unholy's priority system feels a lot like the old Blood, where you use your 2 rune strike so you can blow through an entire sequence of 1 rune abilities. Just not having fixed rotations is a pretty big difference.
And speaking of which, I feel like my Unholy DPS is not as competitive as it should be. Granted, I don't have the best gear, but there is no reason I should ever be falling below 5k DPS in a heroic, regardless of dps spec. My general strategy is for 3 pulls, do single target priority with pestilence and death and decay (since it is ~even damage with plague strike) and for 5+ pulls, do AOE. For whatever reason, I am only averaging about 5.3-5.5k dps on boss dummies and much lower in heroics, as stuff tends to die before my DPS can ramp up.
I've tracked my damage reports from Recount, and my damage priorities are exactly where they should be, with expected returns from Scourge Strike, Death Coil, Ghoul Damage, and I am reasonably certain my priority is fine (if not flawless 99% of the time). So why is my damage sucking so bad? Should I not be using pestilence/dnd on 3 pulls? I dunno.
Here is my armory btw (dps spec changes between frost/unholy near constantly): http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/ravenholdt/andurewns/
Aside from reforging/gear optimization issues (LOL OVER HIT CAP, UNSOCKETED STUFF, cataclysm laziness is my excuse) what could be the problem? My unholy spec is the same optimized spec in the OP, if its not on my armory atm.
Is the EJ recommended focus for unholy still haste? I've been wondering how unholy would do with stats dumped into mastery and strength - kinda avoiding haste in favor of bigger hits and dot damage.
Frost PVE is delicious now for bosses and aoe - also great for blowing up vehicles in pvp. I have a feeling that blood will be a pretty common pvp spec once RS is fixed.
I logged in my DK for the first time in weeks, and for the hell of it, I hit Blood Boil. Holy shit, Blood Boil has a real graphic now! It's more like a Blood Nova.
EDIT: Also, I'm frosting it up, and KM pops. Obliterate is on CD, and won't be up for several seconds. All my other runes are on CD. What do I do? Wait, or use KM on FS?
EDIT: Also, I'm frosting it up, and KM pops. Obliterate is on CD, and won't be up for several seconds. All my other runes are on CD. What do I do? Wait, or use KM on FS?
Use it, don't waste time. FS isn't ideal to use a KM on, but it's better than nothing, and if it procs a rune then you're in even better shape.
Posts
You can sacrifice your minion.
But otherwise, yes.
Blah - blood shield certainly didn't need a nerf at 80...I guess geared out 85s could get pretty high health pools though. For blood pvp, while I can heal myself quite nicely, I still feel way more squishy than druids, paladins, and warriors.
Edit: And this was before reading sim's post. Christ. I guess if you want to play a self-healing melee DPS class now, you play a rogue, warrior, or shit, pretty much anything but a DK?
This.
Their design for the DK has been .... unfocused this whole expansion. They've killed our self-healing, made it incredibly difficult for one spec to even use it and then they nerfed it again because the one spec with good self-healing was too good. Our self-healing is now way worse then a bunch of other DPS classes.
Really, I think designing one tank around self-healing in an expansion designed to make healing more difficult was not a good idea.
The really stupid thing is, it's the "heal for X% of the damage you take" part that makes it overpowered for tanking, not the minimum heal. But they nerfed the minimum heal anyway, despite the fact that it's the most important part of the move to the DPS specs and is already kinda subpar for them.
Though I've seen some claims that the nerf is designed to compensate for the new, rather huge, bump in stamina scaling everyone got.
Is this on live or on beta? I ask because supposedly druids were rock hard to point that encounters designed around them led to other tanks getting two-shot
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1OLcAGbXhWIVcl5IziVpG0eKFJS3xi_Sac9kYMkRFvD8/edit?usp=sharing
Unless it's been changed, Deathgrip worked on mocking blow mechanics, which just forced the mob to attack you for three seconds, leaving threat unchanged.
edit:
After about 30 seconds of google-fu i have determined that your are correct
Lol, what, my 30-45k self heals on LK are OP? Says who?!
Origin: KafkaAU B-Net: Kafka#1778
EDIT: Damn, get out of my head.
This seems strange to me. All three trees are much more focused and each has more character, the differences are more defined. But I really like the changes, take the RNG out of my threat and I'll be a happy camper.
I do believe some of the classes changes that seem drastic are more due to bad itemizeation at lvl 80 (for those specs). Blizz had said they were not worried about balance at 80....Of course then all the Warriors started crying about fury....I wonder why they haven't changed anything for rogues, they got hit pretty hard. At any rate, I guess we can only hope that they are aiming at something concrete in terms of balance at level 85.
And speaking of which, I feel like my Unholy DPS is not as competitive as it should be. Granted, I don't have the best gear, but there is no reason I should ever be falling below 5k DPS in a heroic, regardless of dps spec. My general strategy is for 3 pulls, do single target priority with pestilence and death and decay (since it is ~even damage with plague strike) and for 5+ pulls, do AOE. For whatever reason, I am only averaging about 5.3-5.5k dps on boss dummies and much lower in heroics, as stuff tends to die before my DPS can ramp up.
I've tracked my damage reports from Recount, and my damage priorities are exactly where they should be, with expected returns from Scourge Strike, Death Coil, Ghoul Damage, and I am reasonably certain my priority is fine (if not flawless 99% of the time). So why is my damage sucking so bad? Should I not be using pestilence/dnd on 3 pulls? I dunno.
Here is my armory btw (dps spec changes between frost/unholy near constantly): http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/ravenholdt/andurewns/
Aside from reforging/gear optimization issues (LOL OVER HIT CAP, UNSOCKETED STUFF, cataclysm laziness is my excuse) what could be the problem? My unholy spec is the same optimized spec in the OP, if its not on my armory atm.
Frost PVE is delicious now for bosses and aoe - also great for blowing up vehicles in pvp. I have a feeling that blood will be a pretty common pvp spec once RS is fixed.
So basically socketing strength but reforging haste?
Runestrike is fixed. Yay.
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EDIT: Also, I'm frosting it up, and KM pops. Obliterate is on CD, and won't be up for several seconds. All my other runes are on CD. What do I do? Wait, or use KM on FS?
Origin: KafkaAU B-Net: Kafka#1778
Use it, don't waste time. FS isn't ideal to use a KM on, but it's better than nothing, and if it procs a rune then you're in even better shape.