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Need help with Choosing a First Car
GiantRobo
Registered User regular
Registered User regular
So, I recently decided to start saving up for a car so I can start getting around myself. I currently do not drive, and want to learn stick. What would be good for a first car? I know I want a coupe or a sedan. And as for the price range, I have no idea what I'd be spending as I'm just saving up now. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
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Probably an early 90's import with high milage.
You don't have many options at the price range you suggest.
Hell, some people pay 2k to get a dent removed from their car.
Anyway, I ended up boosting my price to $5000. I decided I would spend that much after taxes on the car, not including linsencing fees and what not.
Do not go to an actual dealership, such as Honda, and ask for a used car for that price. Chances are, there won't be anything. If there is, you'll find a shit box.
What you need to do is decide what you want to spend and how much you're going to have to pay for insurance. This influenced my purchase quite a bit. While I could have bought a 95 Honda with 180,000 KM on it for $4000, I would have paid about $500/mo in insurance.
I ended up going with a 98 Mazda Protege with 116,000 KM for $5000+. I talked the guy down to $5100 taxes included. I ended up spending a few hundred on it since on little things: tires, windshield washer pump, etc. It's also standard.
Just visit little used car places and look around. Take a few cars for a spin. My suggestion: if you have never driven stick before, buy automatic. How are you going to test your cars if you don't know how to drive em?
That's about the extent of my car knowledge.
On a more serious note, buy something used, the less used the better though, if you can get something about a year old you can usually get it at almost half price. Thats the best time to buy any car, just a year old, that way it hasn't had time to get too damaged, and you're not gonna lose that "50%" or whatever it is as soon as you drive it off the lot.
That said, check your local pennysaver/tell and sell type paper for a small import. An early 90s honda (think civic, crx, accord) would be ideal as they are tough little fuckers and basic repairs/maintainance are not terribly difficult. You SHOULD be able to find one for a decent price.
While individuals aren't any more or less crooked than a used car salesman; I would ask a few people to recommend a good mechanic (ask an older sibling, your parents... hell, get on craig's list and ask) and see if you can't get said mechanic to come with you to check out the car ($50 plus lunch for an hour or two of their time is sufficient in most cases) so that they can determine if there is any immediate and serious repairs that need to be made.
Needs some spark plugs and the brake pads could probably stand to be changed? Fine.
Car doesn't want to move out of second into third gear? RUN AWAY.
You're not L33T enough for IDI/RN FTP!
They're fun and reliable.
And they're cheap.
Look for something a bit before 60k miles, or something pretty well after 60k miles (the exception here is VW's). 60k miles is the big service for most cars, and is where people tend to dump them instead of service them and the 60k service is expensive. Preferably you are looking for an import(Honda or Toyota).
The test drive is *not* the place to learn how to drive stick, and you definitely want to take the car for a test drive. Call anyone you know with a manual shift car and learn to drive theirs. Alternatively, take someone who can drive a standard with you and let them do the test drive. They should know what does/doesnt feel normal and should be able to give you a good opinion.
Get a carfax report if you have time. This wont get everything, but it will come pretty close for all major damage/problems with the car. Look at the body panels and make sure that the gaps are all even and that hood/trunk/doors open close easily, if not, the car has probably been in an accident and may have frame damage, run away.
Make sure you are more concerned with the car running well than looking good, and make sure that you still thoroughly test drive and look over a car that looks great.
This is probably most important: You dont owe the seller anything. If anything about the sale/vehicle/seller doesnt sit right with you, walk away. Other cars will come along, so be patient. And dont be afraid to bargain with the seller.
I almost ended up buying a Gone in 60 Seconds (the original)-esque stolen/rebuilt car, but the CarFax check showed me something was up right away.
http://www.thelostworlds.net/
I was able to find a good deal, getting a 92 Infinity with decent miles for 1800. I just scourged the wanted ads for a while, and hit up tons of places. Haven't regretted my purchase once.
Anyways, that's my little bit of information.
As for the 240, that's one idea that came across my mind since I've heard good things about them from friends. And as for going to a dealer, I'm not going to and never really planned from the beginning to go to one.
Also, unless he's confident in doing his own repairs (which it sounds like he's not or would be learning at the same time, which isn't necessarily bad) or has a friend/family who would help, a newer car which hopefully will need fewer repairs and not as soon, may still be under warranty (although he'll probably have to bump up his price a bit for that), etc. is probably a better choice.
1. Yes, do learn to drive a stick before you go shopping for one. Learn so you can handle hills without a problem.
2. Browse through newspapers, circle all the early-to-mid 90's Japanese cars in your price range. Anything older is going to have problems of some sort and anything newer is being sold for reasons you don't want to buy.
3. Take someone with you when you go looking at them. The more this person knows about cars, the better. Make sure you check that the brake lights, head lights, turn signals etc work.
4. In PA, you've got to get your cars inspected annually. This can be a pretty pricey affair, so ideally you want a car that JUST got inspected. That way you know everything works and you won't have to pay to have it done yourself anytime soon. There's a sticker in the corner of the windshield that has the date of the last inspection.
5. First car I ever bought was an old Camaro, thinking it'd be fun and maybe I could get it pained, etc. I felt pretty stupid about that when I found myself standing by I-95 in the rain, trying to call Triple-A. Then I bought a Hyundai Elantra, but some little old lady was selling it and I felt bad grilling her and didn't take anyone with me, and it turned out to be a piece of shit. Then I bought a 95 Corolla, did the whole process right, and haven't had to even open the hood in three years except for an oil change. Learn from my mistakes!
How old are you by the way?
Check the Daily Local, the Inquirer and their online versions. The Inquirer online car section is really rather good.
Since you are in West Chester go check out Scott Honda and that other dealer next to it that specializes in used cars. I know from a few experiences at Scott that they do get some fairly cheap, but clean cars from time to time so it's worth checking.
It's a Mazda mx-3. I find it to be a nice little car, it has the smallest V6 engine ever made, handles really well, can be had for not much at all, and is generally trouble free to own and cheap to operate. When I bought it this fall I had plans to replace the standard 1.8 litre V6 with a 2.5 litre V6, something which is quite easily done. Doing this gives you a car that does 0-100 km/h in about six seconds and outperformes anything in the class when the road is curvy. But considering that I drive like an old man, I dont really think I need to do this....
Anyway, I think this is a better car than the Nissan, but you might have a different opinion....
Ahh...don't bother then. I never checked them out but remembered they were there. I usually just drive right by to have a walk around Scott from time to time.
Anyway...everything else I mentioned is pretty sound. A manual Civic while not being that fast can still be fun to drive. Typically good Honda transmissions, and decent handling. I had a 1990 CRX Si as my first car in the late 90's that I got for 1500 bucks. It had 140,000 miles on it and when I sold it (for 1500 bucks) it had 234,000 miles and hardly anything went wrong. Clutch needed replacing but that will happen to every manual car eventually. Distributor shit the bed but that was at 200,000 miles, and the radiator needed replacing as well. Although the radiator was due to the asshole who replaced the distributor breaking it by leaning on it. At the end of the day though the car was almost free other than gas, oil, tires and brakes.
See how many books I've read so far in 2010
As for a specific vehicle recommendation; try and find an older GM vehicle with a Buick 3800 V6. Unless the previous owner(s) didn't properly maintain it, most vehicles with that engine are absolutely bulletproof.
From what I recall, Illusions only does bodywork and systems, right?
OH and NEVER buy a VW... my 2001 golf died with 31,000 miles on it.
While I agree that 240's can be had for cheap and can be fun, keep in mind that something "fun" will most likely also have been beaten on. If you go to look at a "fun" car and there are any modifications to it, RUN. Dont look, dont ask questions, just walk away. Hell, this holds true for any car, especially a first car with not a lot of money, unless youre going to wrench on it yourself. Also, since you're in PA, keep in mind snow and hills. Which, with a RWD car with an open differential (IIRC on the early ones) will make things entertaining.
That's like telling someone not to buy a house because yours burnt down. Just because you had an issue with your vehicle does not mean that every vehicle made by that company are, by association, complete crap.
Granted, I've heard VW's quality has gone down slightly over the last ten or so years, but I've also heard it's coming back up again. And either way, many VW vehicles last much longer than a lot of other cars out on the road.
As long as the OP follows most of the advice in this thread (learn to drive standard first, bring along the most vehicle-knowledgable person you know, etc.) they'll greatly improve the odds of getting a good car.
Actually I've heard from a number of people that VWs don't last. And they're very expensive, comparatively. For the price of a VW you can easily be driving a Honda or a Toyota, and generally speaking, you should be.
If you're looking to save money, buy a 2004 Hyundai or more recent. Particularly the Elantra, Tiburon and SUVs have been coming out as incredible values as of late. They're very reliable, and dirt cheap because the company has a shitty reputation. Of course, don't buy anything pre-2004, and keep in mind that the Accent is not a high end ride. They come with good warranties too though, so if you're looking at a used 2002-2004 VW, or a new Accent, one of them is going to come with a huge warranty.
CUZ THERE'S SOMETHING IN THE MIDDLE AND IT'S GIVING ME A RASH
Anyways, some car suggestions:
-a Mazda Protege from the '92-95 year range. Mazda makes very good engines (Ford is using them in almost every car that isn't a truck). They are good cars that have good reliability but depreciate more rapidly than the hondas and toyotas. So strike while you can.
-Volkswagen are hit and miss. The Jetta always appears on "least reliable" lists, yet they never really take bad hits image-wise. You can't stay mad at Germans
-Jeep grand cherokees are good cars. If you look for a '95 or earlier model they can be a nice car to start off with and range from the 4-5k range with about 80-90k miles. I have never seen or experienced any problems with Jeeps that aren't normal wear and tear. Even when they were under the awful AMC brand in the 70's-80's, they were still ok.
Just remember that you will have to invest some money in fixing the car you buy. Always put some rainy day money away.
Off topic: I bought it to have fun with myself, modify, wrench on, and learn with. Perfect for me, until I can get a 1st gen Z again.
See how many books I've read so far in 2010
It ran wonderfully, the engine purred like you wouldn't believe. The interior was pristine, and the '93 car looked like it came off the lot.
But after you'd been driving it 40 minutes, the tranny started slipping and lurching like a bitch at >60 miles per hour.
The moral: Make sure you really test a car out; if the owner doesn't want you opening it up (she didn't like us going faster than 65 - claimed for legal reasons), I'd say beware. I first noticed the problem when I was going about 70-75 miles an hour and the problem started getting worse the longer I had it until it would lurch once I got to 40. Eventually it got so bad I couldn't even take off from a stoplight faster than 5 miles an hour.
It would have cost $3000 for a new tranny, so I said screw it, sold it for 2500 and bought myself my first manual; a VW bus (Which I love).
As for cars.... Honda Preludes are pretty swell for being a honda. Dad bought one for 800 bucks (The 2.0 version too). Tons of miles, but it seems to run pretty well (and fast).
Illusions? That place on 30 in Frazer next to the Wawa? As far as I know that's all they do. It looks like a pretty low rent place between you and me...and anybody else reading this.
I wouldn't say all VW's are crap. I drive a 2002 GTi 1.8 Turbo that has been a pretty good car for me the last 5 years. Not too much has gone wrong, but the couple of repairs I have had to pay for were kind of a punch in the balls. Overall it has been a good car. Fun to drive, strong engine, good brakes, nice interior. I wish it had an independant rear suspension, a better gearbox, and that the ride was a bit more firm to fix the little handling things I don't like about it...but overall, good car. Way out of your price range but the new GTi is a phenomenal car. Cannot be stressed enough.
I would also second the Prelude mention. That was my second car. 1998, Red, 2.2 litre VTEC, non-SH. My favorite by far. Not as nice inside, but the engine is amazing, the transmission was fantastic and it was the sweetest handling front wheel drive car I have ever driven. Although, out of your price range.
Off Topic: I did the same thing with my RX-7. Bought for $450 on ebay, new set of tires, did all my own maintenance, mods, learned about the car, it was awesome. Just didnt have the time to put into it in college anymore (and it needed a hose job, oh sweet jesus)
On Topic: Virum is right. When you go for a test drive drive the car like you normally would drive. But make sure you take the time to "beat on it" a little. Go fast, go on a bumpy road, go on a twisty road. Make sure that the car can handle a little spirited driving, but make sure you do it safely.
One other point: many older "fun" cars (240, CRX, mustang, etc) will have buyers guides online, usually on fan sites. These can tell you how to pretty thoroughly check over a car for the more common problems and the approximate seriousness/costliness of these problems.
See how many books I've read so far in 2010
Shogun Streams Vidya
As far as make/model goes, don't think too hard about that. Find a car you can afford that doesn't suck and test it out. Shop around. You never know what kind of deals you can find. My current car is a '91 mustang I bought last year for $2500 CDN. It had 92,000 KMs on it. Good deals can be had.
Also, high mileage isn't always bad. My previous car was an '86 Olds Cutlass that I got for $1900. It had 220,000 KMs on it and lasted me the three years I owned it with 0 problems. If you're looking to get started without spending a lot of money, buying a car that's been cared for but has high mileage can work. Of course, any car with high mileage is more likely to break down, but even new cars break down.
If you can, find a car where you know its history. I knew everyone who had owned that Olds and almost everyone who has owned my Mustang. Which means I can be pretty sure that the car hasn't been abused. A car with 50K miles on it that's been driven hard and recklessly is going to be more worn than a car with 100K miles on it that's been driven carefully and mostly on highways.