Phthano's Bad Art Emporium

PhthanoPhthano Registered User
edited May 2011 in Artist's Corner
Hello denizens of PA Artist's Corner. My name is Phthano, and I'm 18 and from the midwest. I created this thread to force myself to draw more often and man up and actually make some progress. I'm going to try to post most everything I am drawing from this point on, so I am baring my black squishy soul for you all. Be as harsh as you like. I apologize if the scans or pictures aren't high quality, but some of the stuff is too big to scan.


A mario painting I did in acrylic:
mario.jpg

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A girl I drew for a friend
girl122710.jpg

Phthano on
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Posts

  • PhthanoPhthano Registered User
    edited January 2011
    Did some more last night!

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    Phthano on
  • IrukaIruka Registered User, Moderator mod
    edited January 2011
    I think you are off to a good start. If you are going to study faces and go for realism, you may as well start trying to study from life. I don't know what your options are for classes in the midwest, but you can always set up some still lives with strong light sources and do some studies of your own face with a mirror.

    Have you checked out some of the tutorials and such in the stickies? Do you have some goals for yourself as an artist? What artists do you like/look up to?

    Iruka on
  • Arden CaneloArden Canelo Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    I'll be the first to say it - draw from wife.

    I mean life, yeah don't draw from wife.

    Unless they're sexy wives, then, by all means sketch 'em up.
    I look forward to seeing your progress in this new year, which is slightly old by 5 days now.

    Arden Canelo on
  • PhthanoPhthano Registered User
    edited January 2011
    Iruka: I have checked out the stickies and done a lot of the tutorials. I draw a lot from photographs, probably more than I should. I'll do a lot of studies. Eventually, I want to be able to do concept art with a tablet. I have an Intuos3 9x12.

    Arden Canelo: Thanks.

    I'm going to go draw from life some more.

    Some influences: http://fealasy.deviantart.com/ , http://zain7.deviantart.com/ , Jean Giraud.

    Phthano on
  • MustangMustang Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    With your photo studies once you are finished lay the photo over the top of your drawing in photoshop (or something else). It will highlight the areas where you fell down. Remember that's AFTER you finish, you don't want to get caught up tracing.

    As such:
    r8dz4ke3.gif

    Mustang on
  • PhthanoPhthano Registered User
    edited January 2011
    Mustang: Thank you, I think that trick will be very helpful.

    Phthano on
  • GlipherGlipher Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Besides drawing from life, I also suggest working from different angles. Not sure how helpful this'll be, but I'll try explaining what I mean. If it seems like I'm going off to crazy town, please take it as me venting steam out of my ears at midnight.

    Most of your pictures have the person facing straight on at you; your second picture as well as the one of Beethoven are the exception (where it's most noticeable) but why I think this is a problem is because of foreshortening.

    While there's nothing wrong with foreshortening in itself and it's something that should be practiced, it is something that is particularly hard to deal with when you are working from photographs. As you mentioned you work from photographs often, I will expand a little further on this subject since it's something that's hard to notice until you start using plain old life as your reference more often.

    To give an example of what I mean (with some exaggeration to emphasize) though, compare these two images and think about their noses.

    1
    2

    Look at the first picture; evidently, based on it's title, the mask is intended to have a very long (and gigantic!) nose but because of the angle of the shot, this is hard to tell. While you can point at the shadows, note the value changes as it goes from the top of the nose to the bottom, etc. etc. to indicate that that is in fact a very long nose, the picture's angle simply does not allow you to picture the form of the nose very well. As a further ridiculous example, picture Pinnochio staring straight at you straight after a lengthy, truthful! interrogation. Just how exactly could anyone ever do justice to that nose with such an angle as this?

    The second picture has a side angle view. You should get a better (though still hardly perfect) sense of the actual structure of the face. You can ask yourself questions that with a straight on head shot you'd have a harder time addressing: does the chin jut out? how pronounced is the forehead? does the mouth recede or protrude? how long is this person's nose and how wide?

    My main point is that, if you really do have to work with pictures, have some variety! Things exist in three dimensions and though you are working with a two dimensional surface, if you can't think of things three dimensionally they won't come off as reality. After all, if you approach drawing two dimensionally (that is, without a form of which that would allow you to see it from all angles) then how could you ever represent life, a very three dimensional thing? Also, straight up head shots are boring IMO, not only because I can't really picture the face from multiple angles, but also because mirrored features is boring and artificial! It just screams prison lineup to me.

    And my main, main point which is very important whether you intend to go into cartoons or portraiture and which is the most helpful thing anyone can ever offer you as advice is to simply draw from life.

    Think of it as taking away a middleman; a photograph by its very nature provides a flattened view of the world. You can't jump into a photograph to touch or feel or even move around to better understand your subject matter. You can't see how far, close, deep, or shallow something is by a photograph. You can guess, but you can never really know. That's not to say that photos can't ever be used as a reference tool, but if you're serious about improving your art, stepping away from photos and looking towards your actual surroundings is one of the best ways to go about it.

    I wish you luck! Don't underestimate the importance of simply keeping at it. You'll probably see this thrown around some time in the future and that is because it is awesome. The Journey of an Absolute Rookie.

    Glipher on
  • PhthanoPhthano Registered User
    edited January 2011
    Glipher: It's funny you link that, because that is what actually got me to make this thread. I've been drawing on and off for a few years but I think I've been scared to try to take this up as a serious undertaking because It could fail and I'd have to post a lot of artwork I consider poor. I've been drawing from Burne Hogarth's book Dynamic Figure Drawing because I thought it would help with foreshortening. I think I'm going to get some mannequins to draw things in three dimensions better. Your point about foreshortening is well taken and drawing headshots is well taken, I'll draw reality more often from now on.

    Thanks for all the input and critique guys. I'll post some more stuff when I finish it.

    Phthano on
  • PhthanoPhthano Registered User
    edited January 2011
    SO MANY STUDIES
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    Phthano on
  • m3nacem3nace Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Hayao's forehead is too small and his eyes too big and the side of his head looks to be too curved, it should start curving down at the jaw. His head should be more like a square and more bulky.

    m3nace on
  • PhthanoPhthano Registered User
    edited January 2011
    m3nace: I think you are right. I will make note of these features next portrait I do.

    Phthano on
  • HugmasterGeneralHugmasterGeneral Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    I just want to put in that those studies show a lot of potential and desire to improve. Make this thread 100 pages long and you'll be as good as you want to be!

    HugmasterGeneral on
  • PhthanoPhthano Registered User
    edited January 2011
    rfilyaw: Thank you, your words mean a lot. I'm going to go do more studies now.

    Phthano on
  • pineappleherbpineappleherb Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    draw smaller, especially for the faces. its so much easier to control the shapes and details when you draw just a bit smaller and tighter :) keep up the good work, i hope this thread does make it to 100 pages

    pineappleherb on
  • earthwormadamearthwormadam ancient crust Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Yes it may be easier, but I'm pretty sure its more beneficial to work big.

    earthwormadam on
  • PhthanoPhthano Registered User
    edited January 2011
    I've always been told to work big, and I saw it as a way to increase the detail in your drawings when you have to scale them up. I'm going to continue to work big.

    Phthano on
  • pineappleherbpineappleherb Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    i think if you work too big you lose that sense of shape and proportion that is much easier to control when working at a more average size. and you arent gaining any detail by working so large, you're leaving huge areas looking unfinished, or sometimes there isnt enough detail in the original photo to accurately draw it so big

    im not knocking on large art by any means, i just think youre in the sketching stage where you should be drawing everything and anything, filling entire pages with sketches, trying to get shapes and textures under control, working large is holding you back imo

    pineappleherb on
  • PhthanoPhthano Registered User
    edited January 2011
    I'm drawing on a Strathmore 11''x14'' pad, and that seems to be about the right size for now.

    Phthano on
  • pineappleherbpineappleherb Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    hey im drawing in the same sketchpad right now :) anyway dont think im trying to tell you what to do or anything, just friendly advice! keep up the large work! haha

    pineappleherb on
  • ninjaininjai Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    rfilyaw wrote: »
    I just want to put in that those studies show a lot of potential and desire to improve. Make this thread 100 pages long and you'll be as good as you want to be!

    Gonna have to go with him on this. Looking good man, keep it up :)

    ninjai on
  • PhthanoPhthano Registered User
    edited January 2011
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  • PhthanoPhthano Registered User
    edited January 2011
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  • PhthanoPhthano Registered User
    edited January 2011
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  • PhthanoPhthano Registered User
    edited January 2011
    (Charcoal)
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    Phthano on
  • winter_combat_knightwinter_combat_knight Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    You are suffering from the same problems i did and kinda still do. You'll show huge progress if you slow down and look at what you're drawing (easier said than done - i remember doing this stuff in 2008 when i started drawing and being overwhelmed by all the diferent shapes, directions and angles)
    Really try to focus - quality is always better than quantity.

    On a plus - your portraits look like who they are supposed to look like so :^::^::^:

    Just slow it down mate!

    winter_combat_knight on
  • PhthanoPhthano Registered User
    edited January 2011
    winter_combat_knight: I remember seeing that, even! I've been lurking for a while. I'll slow down.

    Phthano on
  • PhthanoPhthano Registered User
    edited January 2011
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    Phthano on
  • NibCromNibCrom Registered User regular
    edited January 2011
    Work on thinking about the geometric shapes the subjects are made of. It will make your products less flat. Keep working on it!

    NibCrom on
  • tapeslingertapeslinger Space Unicorn Slush Ranger Social Justice Rebel ScumRegistered User regular
    edited January 2011
    NibCrom wrote: »
    Work on thinking about the geometric shapes the subjects are made of. It will make your products less flat. Keep working on it!

    this is an excellent point-- especially when you are working from photos or other "flat" reference materials! Think of all three dimensions and it will make it easier to visualize the elements that compose the objects you are drawing. (this is especially helpful when drawing body parts, because the volumes of those body parts change when the body moves, but the overall space they occupy is the same.)

    I think it is really great that you are so enthusiastic, Phthano-- having a good attitude is the first hurdle. :D

    tapeslinger on
  • PhthanoPhthano Registered User
    edited January 2011
    Nib, tapeslinger:
    Thanks. When you're just starting out, enthusiasm is all you've got. I've been drawing a lot of stuff but not posting it. I'll post some moar stuff soon.

    Phthano on
  • PhthanoPhthano Registered User
    edited February 2011
    The journey continues.
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  • PhthanoPhthano Registered User
    edited February 2011
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  • PhthanoPhthano Registered User
    edited February 2011
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  • jhojho Registered User
    edited February 2011
    i think you need to step back, slow down and learn how to draw shapes first. observatory images are good, but if you keep doing that without breaking them down into shapes for you to understand, you will probably have a hard time drawing things not looking flat.. I highly recommend loomis art books as a starting point.


    things have structures and it's really valuable for artists to recognize this first, then after understanding them artists can deviate from it and add their own styling or brand to it.

    your drawings hardly have any structure right now so I highly recommend you step back and draw basic shapes first, like the earlier poster suggested. Personally, I find breaking down things into shapes actually helps me appreciate the value of the object, and it's way easier to manipulate afterwards too.

    Learning structure will also help you decide why certain shading is darker than the other, which helps you making thing not flat. :)

    and here, I made a quick (and probably not too good) lining over one of your drawing just to show some breaking down http://i54.tinypic.com/swzh1s.jpg though since my ps is having some problem i cant finish it well, but i did some shape structuring on the nose, albeit not perfect, but i hope it'll give you some idea... keep it up.

    jho on
  • PhthanoPhthano Registered User
    edited February 2011
    jho: I've gone through and drawn Loomis' exercises before. I understand your point about shapes though. I'll do some more shape-based exercises rather than observatory tonight. Thanks for the draw-over.

    Phthano on
  • PhthanoPhthano Registered User
    edited February 2011
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  • The_Glad_HatterThe_Glad_Hatter Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    Phthano wrote: »
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    Good that you're studying some shapes and face structures, but perhaps try to slow down a bit more.
    Let's take a look at your cube: note how the left side actually seems to get higher as it gets further away from us.
    It's clear that you want to show some perspective but are struggling a bit.

    Figures like these helped me start off:
    two-point.jpg
    You don't have to do all of these lines for each cube you draw, but try to make some notes here.
    See how the cube seems at it highest at the edge closest to us? And the further it gets, the less high the edge lines get.

    Try to draw a cube by connecting two random dots on the horizon line just like in the figure, and you'll see that you get a very convincing result. Now compare that with the cube you've drawn.
    Try to see what happens if you put a cube lower on your page, further from the horizon. Or what happens if you start drawing the cube higher than your horizon?
    First draw the upright edge closest to you, and connect the dots from there. You can even try and draw your house that way!

    Once you've done a few of these using guidelines, try some freehand ones, while keeping earlier results in mind.

    portraiture is a very very deep pool to jump in right away. i've been drawing for quite some years and have only begun to understand the human face better recently. and cubes and shapes are definately a big help.

    The_Glad_Hatter on
  • PhthanoPhthano Registered User
    edited February 2011
    The_Glad_Hatter: Thanks. I did a bunch more perspective drawings from that. I think it's helped.
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    Phthano on
  • Michael VoxMichael Vox Registered User regular
    edited February 2011
    I think you've got the right idea of giving yourself a goal to shoot for. While not a phenomenal artist myself (to say the least), my art did not start to improve until I did it every day with a purpose. Since you seem very focused on portraits, I can't recommend enough Making Faces. It's got a solid beginning on structure and then a lot of fun working on different human expressions. I was able to find it at my local library. Good luck!

    Michael Vox on
  • PhthanoPhthano Registered User
    edited February 2011
    Michael Vox: Thanks, I'll take a look at it.
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    Phthano on
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