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Need some good advice (underage drinking, caught)
Perpetual
Registered User regular
Registered User regular
Not me. My sister.
In Texas.
Basically what happened is this. She is under 21. She goes to a bar with her friend (who is from out of state). The bouncer lets them in for whatever reason. They drink. They then leave the bar around 3am. They pass out at a bus stop. A police car stops by and asks them how they are doing, and notice that they're obviously drunk. So the cops take them back to their dorms. The caveat is that they have to appear in front of a judge for "minor in possession".
I advised to my sister that she tell the truth and apologize and plead guilty. The worst she can get, it seems, is community service hours. But the guy (my sister's friend, who was with her) is thinking about telling a different story. Their court dates are different, so this is a possible sticking point. If the stories don't match then it can get more complicated.
Oh yeah, also, the guy who was with my sister apparently confessed to the police that they were drinking. Fucking idiot, but whatever. At least he remembers that he confessed.
In Texas.
Basically what happened is this. She is under 21. She goes to a bar with her friend (who is from out of state). The bouncer lets them in for whatever reason. They drink. They then leave the bar around 3am. They pass out at a bus stop. A police car stops by and asks them how they are doing, and notice that they're obviously drunk. So the cops take them back to their dorms. The caveat is that they have to appear in front of a judge for "minor in possession".
I advised to my sister that she tell the truth and apologize and plead guilty. The worst she can get, it seems, is community service hours. But the guy (my sister's friend, who was with her) is thinking about telling a different story. Their court dates are different, so this is a possible sticking point. If the stories don't match then it can get more complicated.
Oh yeah, also, the guy who was with my sister apparently confessed to the police that they were drinking. Fucking idiot, but whatever. At least he remembers that he confessed.
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Lying to a cop is one thing, lying to a judge is perjury.
She must tell the truth. Community service is nothing compared to what will happen if she gets caught perjuring herself. There is no earthly reason in the world to lie about this. None. Lying about this would be stupid. Stupid. Reckless. And stupid.
you should probably emphasize the stupidity of lying about this in court.
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edit:
And for the record, she will not be telling the judge anything. She will first meet with a prosecutor who will tell her what she is being charged with and what they are going to convict her of, and what her punishment will be. She can either accept the plea (of guilty) and proceed with her punishment, or she can plead (not guilty) and go from there.
Secondly, that charge is garbage - the cops pinged them several hours after they had gone to a bar, they had no booze on them and were not anywhere near alcohol at the time. Elements of charge not even close to being met.
Having said that, your sister's idiot friend fucked the both of them with his big mouth. Unbelievable considering its fucking drilled into everyone's head not to talk to cops when they are booking you for something!
I think, considering that confession, she's going to get done, unless of course your parents or legal guardian were with her at any time of the night prior - that would nullify the offence entirely.
This is correct, front to back. It's her friend who is to blame here, for saying anything to the cops. I'd suggest a lawyer - two options that I can see:
1) She tells the truth and pleads guilty with community service. Hell with the guy, it's time for real talk. She won't remember the guy's name in 2 years but if she's busted lying that shit will be on her record forever. If the guy wants to lie, that's on him - she should have no loyalty.
2) She offers to give up the name of the bar, and testify against them, in exchange for dropping the charges. With a lawyer, that might work... especially if the guy offered his confession before hearing miranda.
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Can you say Prisoner's Dilemma? hah!
What your sister is looking for is something called Deferred Disposition, which will involve community service and other various hoops she will have to jump through. If she can do that and keep out of trouble, her charge will be dismissed and eventually expunged.
She might be able to get legal advice from her school.
If the school doesn't have legal services, get an attorney.
Don't want to play down underage drinking but if this is her first offense and she has a clean record I can't see it being a huge deal.
Though the posession charge seems like bs given the circumstances. Public intoxication? Maybe.
This is what I don't understand. There was no possession to be charged with possession, unless she had a flask hidden away somewhere.
Disorderly Conduct; Breach of Peace; Public Intoxication. I can see those, but possession seems trumped up.
She needs legal aid more than anything.
Naturally it's different in different jurisdictions, but in my grand old state an underage drinking charge- even if no vehicles are involved- will result in a 1+ year driving license suspension, plus a criminal record.
It depends on the state. Some states have defined the human body as a container specifically so they can cite kids for minor in possession even when there isn't any alcohol around.
But yeah, she should be able to get free legal advice through her school. Tell her to look into it.
I grew up in Houston, and by the time we got out of high school half my friends had gotten at least one MIP.
Often times they're really sloppy on the police work for these too, so you can get them thrown out of court (that happened to me)
however, the punishment for underage drinking is minimal, more than likely you will get PBJ, a fine, and some community service. I got caught about 2 weeks before i hit 21, and that's what i got. if she is an actual minor, her records are sealed/she can get it expunged later. if not, you can probably get it expunged anyways.
Do this. I know in Florida a fellow peer in college got caught in the same situation. There was a statue of Florida law that allowed this to be cleaned off the record if you did a one year probation and don't get caught breaking the law again.
There is a line between not incriminating yourself and perjuring yourself. IANAL so i don't know what that line is exactly. what's the term? It's not what you know, it's what you can prove?
Can she get off scot free here? possibly. is it worth trying? probably not. You'd pay a lawyer well over $500 to defend you, and that's more than likely the maximum fine she could get.
In this case, though, it may not be worth the money.
This is fucking ridiculous. Assuming this is a first time offense, here's what is going to happen:
Your sister is going to wind up in front of a muni court judge. The judge is going to ask her if she was in possession of alcohol by means of intoxication. At this point she can either say yes, pay the fine, do community service and/or diversion, and wind up hopefully a bit smarter, light 300 bucks (less if she pleads hardship), and (probably) without a record that will follow her around. Or, she can deny it. Eventually the officer will be brought in to testify, he's going to explain how and why he came to cite her. And she'll wind up paying the same penalties, only the judge will be annoyed that you wasted her time.
Consulting a lawyer isn't a horrible idea, but fighting something like this in court is almost certainly not worth the time and cost given that your sister will almost certainly lose. The best way to move forward would be to get with her school's legal aid folks, and be the fifth or sixth person in her situation they'll talk to that day.
that's why we call it the struggle, you're supposed to sweat
Most muni judges are actually really nice people who deal with this kind of thing all. the. time (especially in college towns/areas) and will be understanding and helpful assuming you don't ask for a trial or something similarly retarded.
that's why we call it the struggle, you're supposed to sweat
This is almost certainly not worth the expense of hiring a lawyer provided this is her first offense and provided that she wasn't issued a citation for any other misdemeanors at the time. (EDIT: but it is totally worth a free consultation) Here's the relevant statutes from Texas state code:
(b) Except as provided by Subsection (c), an offense to which this section applies is a Class C misdemeanor.
(c) If it is shown at the trial of the defendant that the defendant is a minor who is not a child and who has been previously convicted at least twice of an offense to which this section applies, the offense is punishable by:
(1) a fine of not less than $250 or more than $2,000;
(2) confinement in jail for a term not to exceed 180 days; or
(3) both the fine and confinement.
(d) In addition to any fine and any order issued under Section 106.115:
(1) the court shall order a minor placed on deferred disposition for or convicted of an offense to which this section applies to perform community service for:
(A) not less than eight or more than 12 hours, if the minor has not been previously convicted of an offense to which this section applies; or
(B) not less than 20 or more than 40 hours, if the minor has been previously convicted once of an offense to which this section applies; and
(2) the court shall order the Department of Public Safety to suspend the driver's license or permit of a minor convicted of an offense to which this section applies or, if the minor does not have a driver's license or permit, to deny the issuance of a driver's license or permit for:
(A) 30 days, if the minor has not been previously convicted of an offense to which this section applies;
(B) 60 days, if the minor has been previously convicted once of an offense to which this section applies; or
(C) 180 days, if the minor has been previously convicted twice or more of an offense to which this section applies.
(e) Community service ordered under this section must be related to education about or prevention of misuse of alcohol if programs or services providing that education are available in the community in which the court is located. If programs or services providing that education are not available, the court may order community service that it considers appropriate for rehabilitative purposes.
(f) In this section:
(1) a prior adjudication under Title 3, Family Code, that the minor engaged in conduct described by this section is considered a conviction; and
(2) a prior order of deferred disposition for an offense alleged under this section is considered a conviction.
(g) In this section, "child" has the meaning assigned by Section 51.02, Family Code.
(h) A driver's license suspension under this section takes effect on the 11th day after the date the minor is convicted.
(i) A defendant who is not a child and who has been previously convicted at least twice of an offense to which this section applies is not eligible to receive a deferred disposition or deferred adjudication.
It looks as though the worst your sister could be looking at is 12 hours of community service and a suspended driver's license for 30 days. As long as she's honest, contrite and agrees readily to the community service, she can probably get away with asking the judge not to suspend her license; she was at least smart enough to know that she was too drunk to drive home, as evidenced by the fact that she was caught at a bus stop. Should the judge agree, he may defer disposition and simply assess the community service hours against your sister. Ain't the worst thing in the world.
...may I humbly suggest, however, that your sister's problem isn't that she was caught drinking under the age of 21 but that she got so drunk she passed out at a fucking bus stop? She's actually very lucky it was the police who found her; in some places passing out at a bus stop can be a great way to get yourself robbed or murdered.
Second edit: For all the folks saying this sounds like a bogus charge, the statute for public intoxication in the penal code kicks you right back to possession by a minor when the defendant is under the age of 21.
This is a fair point and, as long as you're giving big-brother advice, probably worth a mention.
Lawyer up.
In this particular situation, the absolute worst case scenario for a first offense is 12 hours of community service (even on deferred disposition) and a 30 day suspension of her driver's license for a conviction. No possible jail time. No possible monetary fine. So the only real question regarding the necessity of a lawyer is how much the defendant needs to be able to drive herself for 30 days or whether she can get by with walking, public transport or carpooling.
I therefore reiterate that the point which really ought to be made to the OP's sister is that while 12 hours of community service is kind of a bummer, it's infinitely better to be the defendant in your own case than the victim in someone else's. She needs to apologize to the court, thank the officer who drove her home, and take this entire experience as a wake-up call to get her drinking under control lest something worse happen to her the next time she passes out at a bus stop.
Winner.