America's Education System Is Fine

Agent 1337

After seeing some people, mostly Europeans, claim that all Americans are stupid because our "education system is worse than North Korea's" and making other baseless claims like that, I've decided to share my own experience with the education system of the United States. After going through America's 13 year system, let me say this, it was easy. I wish I could be one of those people who say that high school (the last 4 years of the education system; the last 6 years, if you count junior high school), but they weren't, in fact I am a much happier person now than I was in high school. By no means am I implying that the American education system is perfect, since no system is entirely perfect, but it's definitely not as bad as the liberal media makes it out to be.

No, I'm not a prodigy or anything, but I went through the education system and it worked fine. I didn't go to some fascist Orwellian high school with metal detectors, school uniforms, strict dress code, drug sniffing dogs, or police everywhere. I also didn't go to a run-down high school with gangs, violence, bullying, or anything like that. I just went to a normal American high school. Please note that I am basing this entire thread upon my personal experience, which was with a high school in a semi-rural area, and by no means represents urban (city) high schools, which are likely gang infested.

I went through the system like everyone else, did my education like everyone else, K-6, 7-8, and 9-12, and I wasn't generally a straight A student, nor did I have perfect behavior. I definitely could have been a straight A student had I applied myself more, but that was not the fault of the education system, that was a fault of my own. I am an extremely intelligent human being, and have been since I was about 13. I can code and design an entire fully functional website in less than an hour, I am informed about almost all political issues and have opinions on them, I study political ideologies and religions in my free time to further my knowledge, I know how the world works both in high school and after it, and I was always a step ahead of most of my peers, and still am today in many cases.

We teach our children and later our teenagers just fine, and I wouldn't have it any other way. Does that mean I want to lessen funding towards education? No, in fact I want to increase funding towards education. I feel as though education is very important for today's young people, but remember, high school is all about learning how to become a productive and social member of society, K-6 on the other hand is all about learning basics such as the English language, science, mathematics, and other core classes. My school district never had the best funding, and in my final year of high school it was/is crumbling now, because of lack of state funding. It has gotten so bad that they had to close down a lot of elementary schools in the area, and merge them with other elementary schools. They're even planning on merging an elementary school with my local junior high school, which many of the locals, myself included, are strongly against.

Now lets get down to the social aspect, high school has virtually no bullying, bullying is something little kids do in the K-6 system, not teenagers. No, I wasn't some popular football playing jock who had a cheerleader girlfriend, in fact, I was the opposite. I was the video game playing geek with practically no friends. Sure, I had some "friends" who I would hang out with at school and talk to online, but like most people, I only had maybe one or two real friends. But even within my own group, I was one of the people who just didn't fit in entirely, despite me being one of the two leaders of the group, and the administrator of the group's official message board. We had cliques, of course, like every high school does, there were the jocks, the emos, the stoners, the cheerleaders, the preps, the band geeks, the goths, us gamers, and all other kinds of cliques, and of course there was also individuality. But cliques are nothing like what Hollywood makes it out to be, everyone gets along with everyone else, and everyone has friends in every group, and all groups peacefully socialize with each other.

There were no gangs, but again, I've never lived in a major city, especially not a poor area of a city. We did have some drugs though, of course there was alcohol and smoking, but never on campus, and those are of course general things teenagers do to rebel (or because they get addicted). There wasn't any peer pressure though, no one ever pressured you into doing drugs, or even really asked you too. Of course, there's the occasional pot, but pretty much no one got into the hard drugs, maybe a few of the stoners did some of the hardcore stuff like meth, but no one I know (aside from one girl, but she graduated a few years before me). Now then, teen sex, sure, there was a lot of that, but most people played it safe and used condoms and/or birth control. There were a handful of pregnancies each year, but they brought that upon themselves. As for fashion, let me say that, like most guys, I'm not very adept when it comes to fashion. I would just wear whatever I felt like, and never got made fun of or singled out too much. Sure, there were the preps who always wore Hollister or the emos who generally wore darker clothing, but it certainly wasn't a fashion contest or anything like that.

I'd say the school system is pretty damn good, if not the best in the world. Sure, after high school, like most people, I missed it, and still do sometimes. I wish I could go back and be 13 again, a teenager, and start my adult/teenage life over. But all-in-all I'm glad of the person I am now, I'm not rich or overly successful yet, but I work hard and I'm getting there, since that's what America is all about, hard-work and making your own future. The school system has already vastly improved, my baby brother learned in 3rd grade what they taught me and everyone else in 5th grade. He was learning multiplication and division in like second grade. So yes, I'm glad our school system is making strides to become better, because our young people are the future of this country. Do I think we need to completely overhaul the school system? No. Do I think we need to take extreme stances like metal detectors, teachers beating students, school uniforms, strict dress codes, search and seizures every 2 hours, drug sniffing dogs, or anything like that? No. But I do think we need to fund education more. Of course, you have to remember that every high school is different, and with that, I bid adieu.

Fallout2man

Well I'm glad you went to a good school. I don't know if I was fortunate or unfortunate ultimately. I went to a nicer school....but in city with no Teacher's Unions and a climate much like a piece of the south got torn out and transplanted into the center of California. Seriously I suspect if they thought they could've gotten away with it we would've had to sign waivers to get taught evolution in Biology classes. It was THAT bad.

The entire experience gave me a first hand lesson on exactly why teacher's unions are necessary. Out of my entire educational history I only ever had two teachers who ever really broke the mold and tried to ever expand anyone's mind beyond teaching blindly to tests and appeasing the soccer-mombureau (I'm inventing that word now, a politbureau like schoolboard composed entirely of ultra-religious soccer moms! ) and I was eternally grateful I had them. But I feel like I came out of that entire school system with several screws in my head loose because of all the brainwashing that went on there.

BubbaT

K-12 is both excellent and atrocious, largely depending on how rich the neighborhood is.

Universities are pretty good.

Do I think we need to take extreme stances like metal detectors, teachers beating students, school uniforms, strict dress codes, search and seizures every 2 hours, drug sniffing dogs, or anything like that? No.

is directly related to

There were no gangs, but again, I've never lived in a major city, especially not a poor area of a city.

You do not want an "open" campus in many inner-city schools, with kids and teenagers allowed to concealed-carry whatever they feel like.

Nor is it good for students to be sporting their "team colors" (aka, gang colors) around campus - it provides no benefit, and is implicitly threatening in schools which have a significant gang presence.

Syrdon

Agent 1337 wrote: »

We teach our children and later our teenagers just fine ... I feel as though education is very important for today's young people, but remember, high school is all about learning how to become a productive and social member of society, K-6 on the other hand is all about learning basics such as the English language, science, mathematics, and other core classes.

In my direct experience with the educational systems in two very different states and indirect (observing other people) experience with several other states I have yet to see a system that leaves its students with enough math to not be trivially confused and mislead with some very easy stats or discussion of moderate level math, nor have a seen a system that leaves its students with enough of an understanding of science to tell the difference between decent science and pseudo-science. I'd say that means they're failing to generate productive members of society when so much of politics/governance/trial evidence/advertising hinges on one or all of those. I'm not sure if that's the same claims that other people are making about the US education system, but as far as I'm concerned they're huge problems. As far as fixing them, I think a start is paying teachers with hard science/math backgrounds a whole lot more. Another good start would be requiring a class that is basically how to lie with statistics. For that matter, a class in how to tell the difference between a valid argument with data to back it up and someone making something up that simply sounds good would be another place to start making a dent.

Oh, and recruiting some teachers and administrators with a spines. Starting with telling helicopter parents who think their kid deserves any grade other than an f for simply showing up to class to sod off. Ditto for people requiring them to turn out students who are not able to reason for themselves.

edit: oh, and just to be clear, none of these districts fall into the heading of having really serious budget problems although some of them are having issues. As far as safety and security goes, none of them had any substantial issues at all as I recall.

Fallout2man

BubbaT wrote: »

K-12 is both excellent and atrocious, largely depending on how rich the neighborhood is.

Universities are pretty good.

Do I think we need to take extreme stances like metal detectors, teachers beating students, school uniforms, strict dress codes, search and seizures every 2 hours, drug sniffing dogs, or anything like that? No.

is directly related to

There were no gangs, but again, I've never lived in a major city, especially not a poor area of a city.

You do not want an "open" campus in many inner-city schools, with kids and teenagers allowed to concealed-carry whatever they feel like.

Nor is it good for students to be sporting their "team colors" (aka, gang colors) around campus - it provides no benefit, and is implicitly threatening in schools which have a significant gang presence.

Not entirely true! My school would refuse people to enter campus if they had anything more electronic than a watch or a non-graphing calculator, or were wearing so much as bright mismatching colors or had a slight bit of facial hair. Sometimes the affluent schools can be absolutely retarded if the area's populated with dittoheads.

OptimusZed

I don't think the American educational system is failing in the terms that people usually use to talk about the assumed failure of it. Where we have the resources and environments to do so, we do a very good job of educating our students to the standards we've set for ourselves. In situations where we lack those resources or find ourselves in environments that aren't conducive to student success, we struggle. And that needs addressed.

BUT

I think a much larger problem with our educational system as it stands is that we're educating our students to the standards required of a 19th century industrial work force and peppering their studies with bits of classical knowledge that were considered relevant during the enlightenment. We're doing nothing to address the needs of our workforce in the information age. And if that doesn't get fixed, it's going to quash whatever gains might be made by empowering lower performing schools under the current system.

The entire concept of our schools needs to be reexamined. Methods, purpose, end goals, all of it. Because we're not turning out people who are going to spend their entire adulthoods running die presses anymore, but we sure do try to educate them like it.