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Getting IT Certs (A+, Network+, etc...) - Worth the time?
Straygatsby
Registered User regular
Registered User regular
First some brief exposition to fill in where I'm coming from! I've spent the last four years being the all around IT guy for a smallish retail business (college bookstore for a major state university). I do a little bit of everything from maintaining our PC fleet to keeping our firewall humming to using my laughably crude design skillz to manipulate our web page. I don't get paid much, but I have the freedom to learn pretty much any new or old technology we use and/or want to implement, which has given me an enormous amount of really valuable hands on time with all kinds of stuff. Next year, my better half (and the brains of the op) will be finishing her degree here, and we'll be off into the winds of the future in some new city, so I'll have to look at what I can do and what I know and try and snow some new group of people into paying me for it. This simultaneously horrifieds me and fills me with joy.
So, in order to look as shiny as possible on paper (and for my own edificatiamashun), I've been looking into at least getting A+ certified (and probably a Network+ or whatever general cert is hip and cool with the Microsoft kids these days). I have 3 years of screenwriting classes at NYU, so that's...useless (but wouldn't trade it for the universe), so anything that adds to my paper value will be a big plus.
So the question (finally? I kno, rite?!): Can I grab a couple of books, use my pre-existing knowledge, set aside a coupla hours a day, and just grind out learning everything I need to pass these cert tests? And, assuming this is doable, is it worth it? I know that my 5 years experience in a live, varied environment is supagreat, and I can work that like crazy, but I hate my lack of formal education and fear its effects when looking in an already overcrowded, over-educated industry (Oh yeah, and I'm, like, totally old, dude).
So I come to you now, professional nerds, on the day of your daughter's wedding. Tell me of your journey.
So, in order to look as shiny as possible on paper (and for my own edificatiamashun), I've been looking into at least getting A+ certified (and probably a Network+ or whatever general cert is hip and cool with the Microsoft kids these days). I have 3 years of screenwriting classes at NYU, so that's...useless (but wouldn't trade it for the universe), so anything that adds to my paper value will be a big plus.
So the question (finally? I kno, rite?!): Can I grab a couple of books, use my pre-existing knowledge, set aside a coupla hours a day, and just grind out learning everything I need to pass these cert tests? And, assuming this is doable, is it worth it? I know that my 5 years experience in a live, varied environment is supagreat, and I can work that like crazy, but I hate my lack of formal education and fear its effects when looking in an already overcrowded, over-educated industry (Oh yeah, and I'm, like, totally old, dude).
So I come to you now, professional nerds, on the day of your daughter's wedding. Tell me of your journey.
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The network + is a little harder, depending on your level of network exposure.
Is it worth it? Sure...it never hurts to be more qualified.
As for the MS Certs - just go to the top of the list and start with the 2010 and Windows 7 certs.
I can't speak to the higher level certs or MS stuff though as I've moved out of the MS admin/support world.
P.S. While the tests aren't complicated, they ARE mostly trivia and youre not going to be able to answer a lot of the questions without memorizing it. Don't think just because youre experienced youre going to pass these. Experience isn't going to help you answer a question like "what are the speeds of USB 1.0, 1.1, 2.0, and 3.0."
That's one thing I really noticed going over both the areas covered by the test(s) and the practice tests available. I suspect the bulk of my prep will be memorizing a lot of numbers and make/model type stuff that I probably will never need to have to recall on demand, but eh, if that's the process, so be it.
I guess I also need to figure out exactly *what* I want to do, more specifically. The place I'm at now is a blessing/curse situation in that I have the freedom to learn a little about a lot, but there's not a high level of rigor that'll turn me into an expert in a specific job.
The MS certs aren't bad, but not much use past a mid level job.
CCIE, CCIA are pure gold.
The Red Hat certifications are also very good.
But CCIE and Red Hat certs are a lot of work to get and you can fail them.
I have all of these, none of them will help you prepare in any meaningful way for the other. The CCNA will help prepare you for the CCNA. The overlap between them is not meaningful. Even if they cover some of the same concepts, the questions regarding those concepts are completely different in scope and reason. I think the certs you study are probably best tailored to your current job or a job that is slightly above yours. Play to whatever your job cares about. If you work for a Cisco Partner ... Cisco, if you are doing Desktop support... Microsoft,, if you are working for the Gov't...CompTIA.
Also, most people won't get the CCIE with any amount of experience or study because it requires more than most people are willing to give up. You need to be capable of studying a couple hours a day, for a year. This is studying on your own, without anyone helping or caring, without reward, on a home lab. There is no use in even thinking about it until you have an NP. It would be like a Pol Sci major talking about being Governor before he has held any public office.
How long do they last?
Back in the day (read: 2001-2003), I entered the IT workforce with similar skills to your own, but no clear direction or specialization. I was an IT contractor on some very brief contracts, but they gave me much needed experience in various aspects of IT administration. It was hand to mouth living, but the job market in my area sucked hard, so you took what you got, and made do. I didn't have a degree, or any certifications, and for the most part, nor did my co-workers. Looking back, maybe if I had at least a CompTIA cert, I may have had a bit more longevity on my contracts. But I digest....
So fast forward a few years, when I landed a contract with the Navy. They liked my work, and kept me around, and now it's 7 years later, and I work for the Air Force. I still don't have a degree, but I did get a 2003 MCSE, and of course I work for The Man, so they made me take my Security+. I'm a few credit hours shy my degree as well.
Currently, of the 18 guys in my shop, maybe 50% have degrees, and none have a graduate degree. We all have certifications, but that's because Uncle Sam makes us have them (and most of us did prior to, so it's no big deal).
So how'd we get hired without certs or degrees? Job experience man, job experience. You don't need certs or a degree to be a sysadmin - you need valuable hands on experience of being in the shit, plain and simple. Most of what I obtained, I did so with little to no certs or formal education. However, now that I'm a mid level syadmin, that's all changed. If I want any hope of progressing into a more senior position, I've gotta have certifications that are current, and a degree (or two!). The competition to get an IT job can be fierce, but the upper level stuff can be downright cut throat. You have to pimp that resume out, and it needs all the career bling you can put on it.
I would seriously consider getting your resume up to par, and start with some IT contracting firms in whatever area you move too. TekForce, Manpower Professional, K-Force, whatever it takes. There's also the Geek Squads, or mom and pop PC shops as well, if you'd prefer that. I'd grab whatever opens up first, and start plugging at getting more skill sets, and some much needed certifications. Maybe grab some CompTIA certs, and then pick what you like or can do easily, like a Microsoft cert. Certs will get you past HR usually, and into an interview, after that, your job experience is what the interviewer cares about, not your certs.
tl;dr - cocks, dicks, resume, lol
The one thing I really lament here is the lack of A) an exchange server and
Hopefully the surprisingly inbred world of college bookstores will offer a partially open door, assuming, you know, they haven't all gone belly up by then. :P
Thanks, and I'll be sure to necropost this thread 2 years from now when I'm sleeping in a dumpster cursing all of you until the TB finally takes me (with love, natch).
I have a friend who was an administrative assistant who was also the onsite IT guy. On his resume he says he "built and maintained computer systems" but what that meant was that he dug around in the closet for parts from used computers and put them together until they worked, and when someone said "My computer isn't working" he'd go and try to figure out what the problem was, which was usually wiggling the mouse, rebooting it, or running a virus scan. I'm not saying that's what YOU do, I'm saying that you need to have a clear way of differentiating yourself from people who are actually much less qualified than you are.
For a lot of programming jobs, having a cert will not get you the job. That's generally what hiring managers mean when they say they "don't care about certs." But if it's between you, and you with a cert? The hiring manager is going to pick you with a cert over the you without.
The general ones should be fine if you don't really know what you want to go into, and you have the time and money to afford them. My own experience is that after applying for jobs, you start to pick up certain details that make it clear that having a specific cert or class or way to say "see, I know this" makes you more attractive. For me, that's SQL experience. I'm not a programmer, but it's been consistently on jobs that I interviewed for. Most of them say "well, if you understand it, we can work from there. The other parts of the job are ultimately more important."
But if I had SQL experience, I'd be a shoe in. So, when I'm back on the job market, or even before I'm back on the job market if I'm bored, I'm going to look at getting some SQL experience and certs. Just to have them and be more qualified than the competition, or at least at the same level.
So that's what I'd suggest. Look at some potential jobs and see if you can spot an area that you're currently lacking.
That said, A+ and perhaps just a Win7 cert may help you land a more corporate level job, and not cost terribly much.
I did take prep classes for MCSE certs, but before I bothered to take the tests for them, the instructor hired me and my friend to work at his consulting company. We didn't have certs, but he just taught us so he knew we knew the material. So I took an odd path into the field.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0789740478
CBT Nuggets videos are well-regarded, if you'd prefer to study by watching moving pictures and listening to a guy talk.
Studying for the tests however is less along the lines of practical knowledge and more along the lines of memorization. For instance one of the questions was how many pins are in a VGA cable? 15. But in reality who cares? It's either upside down or it doesn't go there.
Certifications are an excellent way to pad your resume and possibly increase how much you make, they they're cheaper than a degree and they can get you that foot in the door so you aren't stuck waiting tables or digging holes. Also remember that that certifications work with your work experience not one or the other.
So:
Certifications < Work Experience < Work Experience + Certifications <Work Experience + Certifications + Degree
This so much.
It's a triangle really, where education, experience, and relevant industry certifications meet in the middle, and equal employment and dollar signs. You don't have to have all three on the outset, but you'll want to have all three as your career progresses.
Also, as an FYI, when I say education, I mean a 4 year degree. Technical schools are a great way to get some lab time, and take some functional courses to learn the field, but ultimately come up short when compared to a 4 year accredited institution degree. I don't want to bag on technical schools, they serve a good purpose. Just hope that those classes transfer to a 4 year institution.
Also, keep in mind certifications have to stay current. My 2003 MCSE is starting to show it's age, and I'll need to get Win7 pretty soon. The MCSE's don't expire, so someone who's NT4 MCSE would be laughed right out of an interview.
The vendor books are fairly good for giving a depth of knowledge, but don't prepare you for the actual exams so much. For example, the Windows books throw a lot at you, and it's hard to digest it all, but to prepare for an exam, self test questions are where it's at. I also highly recommend Transcender, or Labsim CBT modules - their video lectures are really great, with great self test questions. Only real downside is cost, but if you're a student you can usually get academic discounts. I recently did a Labsim for the CISSP, and it was ace.
I have taken all the class and passed all of them. I've taken the CompTIA Network+ twice and have failed. I have used all the study material my school has provided for me which is the Glen E. Clarke 4th edition comptia network +. I use the disk that came with the book. I took the three practice the question that the disk had and went through all question I got wrong in the book from beginning to end along with the comptia n+ objectives as a guideline. Also just recently started .com. I don't know what I am doing wrong and can use some advice from anyone.