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College/Military/Life Decisions
Quid
Definitely not a bananaRegistered User regular
Definitely not a bananaRegistered User regular
Background: I've been in the Navy for 7 years now and have about 2 more to go before I finish this enlistment. And the fact of the matter is as far as my job goes, I hate it. I don't like what I do, I don't like the culture I'm often surrounded by, and I simply do not have an interest in the Navy that my supervisors want. I still work hard at my job and take care of my junior people but otherwise it's mostly just a paycheck for me, which is causing some friction between me and my higher ups.
My options: One, I could suck it up and deal with it for another decade until I could retire, at which point a steady income and healthcare would be guaranteed for myself and my wife. I didn't have either of those before I joined the military and they're the biggest draws for me to stay. I lived the first two decades of my life without them and have zero desire to ever go back to that nightmare. Leaving the navy at almost 10 years also almost feels like a waste given I'd be half way to retiring.
Two, I could get out and finish college. I've managed to get an associates in Chinese so far. I've looked at University of Washington and a bachelor's in in Chinese or Asian Studies would be very doable. Their CISB program interests me too, with my only real concern being the calculus requirement given my abysmal history with math. My GI Bill would cover tuition and most if not all we'd need for housing. But then I have no real idea of what I would do after that and I'm terrified of being out of work with no real guarantee of being able to help support us, particularly given a shaky economy.
Ultimately the decision is going to be up to my wife and I, but I'd like to get input from others, particularly any prior military who've made the transition. I've got about a year before I'll absolutely have to decide, so it's hardly dire right now. But either choice is going to have a huge impact on my future after that.
My options: One, I could suck it up and deal with it for another decade until I could retire, at which point a steady income and healthcare would be guaranteed for myself and my wife. I didn't have either of those before I joined the military and they're the biggest draws for me to stay. I lived the first two decades of my life without them and have zero desire to ever go back to that nightmare. Leaving the navy at almost 10 years also almost feels like a waste given I'd be half way to retiring.
Two, I could get out and finish college. I've managed to get an associates in Chinese so far. I've looked at University of Washington and a bachelor's in in Chinese or Asian Studies would be very doable. Their CISB program interests me too, with my only real concern being the calculus requirement given my abysmal history with math. My GI Bill would cover tuition and most if not all we'd need for housing. But then I have no real idea of what I would do after that and I'm terrified of being out of work with no real guarantee of being able to help support us, particularly given a shaky economy.
Ultimately the decision is going to be up to my wife and I, but I'd like to get input from others, particularly any prior military who've made the transition. I've got about a year before I'll absolutely have to decide, so it's hardly dire right now. But either choice is going to have a huge impact on my future after that.
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Unfortunately I'll be 29 by the time I'd separate which is the cut off for OCS. I can apply for a waiver but getting back in wouldn't be a guarantee.
Not sure how that works with currently being active in the Navy, but it might be an option.
I haven't talked to single person that has regretted it, although I can say the same for people who retire, but they are out as well.
I don't know what transferable skill set the army provided you, but I would really not want to be pushing 30 and entering the job market with a Liberal Arts BA while needing to support a family.
Is this "I hate the Navy" or "I hate the specific task I do in the Navy". If it's the former, could you reclass to something else? I have an Air Force friend who went from fixing planes to flying on planes, and he's the happiest I've ever seen him.
If you just hate the Navy period, I think you have to think about it this way. You're nearing 30, and life expectancy is about 75. So, you have 45 years or so left. Do you want to spend a quarter of the rest of your life in total misery? I don't in any way mean to sound morbid, but that's how I think this has to be assessed.
I don't get in to the details of what I do but this is my overall job description. Before that I did admin work taking care of people's pay, records, etc.
Security > amount of unhappiness, try to reclass and stay.
Amount of unhappiness > security, leave.
If you have moved from an admin role to linguist, then presumably you have done a military language course at some point, which I'll take an educated guess is in Mandarin. Only you know actually how good you are and in which area of that language, but you should recognise that outside employers are both keen for linguists (particularly in Chinese languages), and will value the formal training and experience your role implies quite highly. However, if you think you aren't much good, then though you may initially get a job, it could be short-lived - as such I'd suggest you spend as much of the rest of your enlistment improving your language. Alternatively, if one of the aspects you hate is being a linguist, then this isn't much help.
As for being tired of the military culture, I completely sympathise. However, it is a culture that only makes things worse for people who are fed up with it, and try to treat it like a job. Either you:
a) accept it - or terrifyingly, like it - for what it is
b) still have a desire and will to try and change it
c) you don't want or think it can be changed, and just try to ride your time out.
You know as well as I do the standard line about "it's a vocation not a job" and the attitudes you mention, which mean the last option will only see things getting worse for you. This may not be entirely fair, but think about it as a commander of one of the junior people you mention: nobody in the military wants the guy who has mentally signed off under their command, because no matter how technically proficient or good at their job they are, they will steadily lose the will and ability to deal with all the other bullshit and constraints that go with military life. If you do decide to stay in, I would suggest you need to find a way of being either a) or b), because be careful of thinking that you can be c) for 10 years and not become either seriously unhappy, or a bad sailor, or both.
Ultimately you know that you will have to make the risk/reward decision, but depending on your language skills and training, you may be much more employable than you think.
I have a job with a company I adore that makes me happy. Quid and I both like my working for this company and it's something I'd like to make a career out of. I was in management before we moved, I've got a good reputation with this company, the respect of all my superiors who have made every effort to make sure I stay with them.
The only downside to this job in terms of Quid's potentially ending his military service is that as long as we're in Hawai'i there's no advancement for me. There was no management open once we moved and it's very unlikely something will open up before I leave. If we were to move back to the mainland for him to attend college my job, being retail, puts me in the position of only being able to take what's available. More opportunities could open up but if there's no management, or even full-time, I could still only be working part-time until something happens. When that could happen is pretty much unguessable.
My ultimate goal is to move into some sort of training or retail support position, which I can more easily work on in the larger market, but not so much here where's there's only one shop.
I am open to whatever decision Quid and I come to. I want him to not be miserable. We are also pretty smart and responsible people who have savings and can build that up and are fairly good with handling our finances and I think we could make any situation work for a good while.
Flip side:
I'm also terrified of the job market right now and I worry what our options would be. Quid is very smart and has a lot of marketable skills, but I feel like even with what we have it's all a bit of a risk. I also can't get healthcare with my job unless I'm in management... which is no guarantee when we move.
I would be open to leaving the company if it meant getting a position somewhere that could better provide these things until he finished school and gets his career settled out as well but I'm unsure of how easily that could be done giving the state of things.
No plans for kids; we're also pretty good at making babies not happen but we had a scare about a year ago and in the farthest part of my mind I guess I want to factor in all the "Oh shit" moments that can happen.
The first should be the pros and cons of staying in the military. The second should be the pros and cons of not staying in the military, moving to Seattle, and going to college. It seems weird, but thinking about them independently like that may make you think of things you otherwise wouldn't. And honestly, I'd make a third list consisting of just the stuff you don't like about what you're currently doing. Take an objective look at that list, and start looking at ways to mitigate them. There may even be someone on-base you could talk to about them (chaplain, maybe? Some sort of HR officer?) who could help out. If you can improve your current situation, maybe it will make this less of a decision.
And it's fair enough for everyone to say "is it really worth being miserable for the next ten years just for healthcare and a pension?" but something to keep in mind is that the two things people stress out the most about are health and money. Not having healthcare or pension may very well make you way more miserable than ten more years in the military would; however, that's basically an impossible call to make for you guys, doubly so for a bunch of people on the internet who aren't intimately involved in your life.
Finally, you can't really look at the years you've spent in the military as "wasted." Rationally speaking, they're what we refer to as a "sunk cost." It doesn't matter whether you spend ten more years in the military or not, those ten years are spent. The only question is whether it's worth the next ten years for you to get that retirement package.
On another note, my own, very selfish vote is for you guys to move to Seattle, but that has nothing to do with what is best for you guys, and everything to do with me wanting more friends in Seattle. :P
But you do have to remember that at this point, the armed forces are pretty much the only place you're going to get a pension from. Think of it this way - in another ten years you can retire at thirty or forty something and earn an income with some healthcare for doing nothing more than breathing. It's a really sweet deal, especially if you are employed on top of it. That said, you don't have to be a diggit to stay in the Navy, but you could definitely find yourself a rate with a different duty station that would suit you both better.
Hope this helps and best to you and your wife
― Dr. Seuss, Oh, the Places You'll Go!
As far as savings, I feel like it's pretty good for where we're at and how long we've been married but I definitely want to add a lot more to it to feel secure before we consider a switch like this.
I won't be! :P