I need a bit of advice (apartment stuff)

DirtyDirtyVagrant

I'm moving out of this house. My housemates are a couple with two kids, and she runs a daycare out of her living room. It's not working out.

I started looking for rooms almost a month ago (informed her of this although it would seem she didn't get the message), secured one, even got my deposit waived. Ready to move in. But I wasn't supposed to move in until next month.

It opened early, and the landlord says they can't hold it for me.

So I told my housemates that I've gotta go or I'm going to lose this apartment. And they want me to pay July's rent anyway, even though I won't be here.

I never signed any kind of lease agreement, so I'm pretty sure that legally I am on solid footing to tell them no.

Morally, I'm not sure. Leaving without notice sucks, and I hate to be that person, but I don't see how I have much of a choice. Also, I can not afford to pay two separate rent payments. I'm moving into my own place for cheaper than I rent this room for.

What should I do? I'm tempted to just skate, because it's not like I'll ever see them again. Am I a bad person?

Daenris

Have you signed the lease for the new place yet? If so, there should be no "they can't hold it for me."

If it were me, I'd feel obligated to pay the month -- or at least try to work out a compromise, like half a month or something. If you were on a month-to-month lease, you'd need to give 30 days notice, so I would want to do the same even if you aren't on a lease, and since you're now moving out sooner than expected you're putting that extra burden on them.

Like you say, if you're not on a lease, legally you should be fine, but I'd try to pay it.

Skoal Cat

If they didn't have you sign anything for your current place, they decided the risks were worth the benefits of being able to basically tell you anything.
Pack up and leave.

Dr. Frenchenstein

I know as a landlord, even without a lease, you still have to give 30 days notice to a tenant if you are booting them. however i am not sure if it's the same case as a tenant without a lease. Just saying, if they really wanted to, they might be able to take you to small claims court. this may vary from state to state though. it will be a huge hassle though, and probably not worth a months rent.

bowen

Sounds like you're a subtenant/subletter and you're not really bound by anything more than your moral code.

Deebaser

Legally you're safe.
Morally, it is a pretty dick move. Things happen, but is there any way you can make partial restitution? Obviously you don't have to, but it would be the right thing to do, imo.

spool32

OK, I can see the moral dilemma here, but:

Yes, you're kind of leaving these people in the lurch scrambling for someone to cover July. However, you can only pay for what you can afford. If you have some feeling for the people, I'd kick them a couple hundred to soften the blow but otherwise... this is business. You lived with no lease for x time, basically praying that nothing would happen needing you to be protected by a contract (like, oh, them deciding they need your bedroom for their possibly-illegal-daycare and telling you to GTFO tomorrow). They lived with no legal protection in the event you decide to bail on short notice.

Sometimes you get the bear, and sometimes the bear gets you. This time, you got the bear... take care of your business, and good luck to the other folks.

---

Personally, I would also try to throw them something to soften the blow... if I could afford to do it.

DivideByZero

Your new place doesn't have a lease either, does it? Kinda sounds that way, like the new landlord told his tenant the room was rented starting 8/1 and the guy GTFO post-haste. Now he's got no tenant for July and wants you to move in ASAP and start paying him rent. If there's no lease, and you haven't even given him any money yet, there's probably nothing keeping him from cutting you out of the equation and finding somebody else.

You have to pay someone for your housing for July; that someone should be the person who owns the property you're living in, yes? So if you're ready to move into the new place, move into the new place and pay that guy.

As for your current housemates (do they OWN the house, or are they too just renting?), how much notice did you give them that you had secured new housing, not just that you were looking around? It sounds like this thing with your new place happened very quickly.

bowen

Also, while it's shitty, I wouldn't feel morally bad about kicking them under the proverbial bus here. You let them know ahead of time you were doing this. Shit sucks, you're not their ginko biloba but you also can't fuck over your opportunities when they come up either. Are you going to look like a douche? Maybe. You'll probably look like a douche even if you give them money because you didn't give them a year's notice.

Esh

bowen wrote: »

Also, while it's shitty, I wouldn't feel morally bad about kicking them under the proverbial bus here. You let them know ahead of time you were doing this. Shit sucks, you're not their ginko biloba but you also can't fuck over your opportunities when they come up either. Are you going to look like a douche? Maybe. You'll probably look like a douche even if you give them money because you didn't give them a year's notice.

Yeah, he let them know, but they thought they had an additional month to find someone. I don't understand why you would think anyone would be mad at someone for even "giving a year's notice" either. I know you're exaggerating, but it's just untrue. If given ample amount of time to find a new roommate, no one has any reason to get mad at all. OP told them they until a certain date, and then at the very last instant, he yanked the rug out from under them.

Opportunity or not, the OP has obligations, and it doesn't matter whether they're written down on paper or not. Sure, he can duck out early with no legal ramifications, but it sure does make him a really, really, really silly goose. He should pay.

I'd Fuck Chuck Lidell Up

Esh wrote: »

bowen wrote: »

Also, while it's shitty, I wouldn't feel morally bad about kicking them under the proverbial bus here. You let them know ahead of time you were doing this. Shit sucks, you're not their ginko biloba but you also can't fuck over your opportunities when they come up either. Are you going to look like a douche? Maybe. You'll probably look like a douche even if you give them money because you didn't give them a year's notice.

Yeah, he let them know, but they thought they had an additional month to find someone. I don't understand why you would think anyone would be mad at someone for even "giving a year's notice" either. I know you're exaggerating, but it's just untrue. If given ample amount of time to find a new roommate, no one has any reason to get mad at all. OP told them they until a certain date, and then at the very last instant, he yanked the rug out from under them.

Opportunity or not, the OP has obligations, and it doesn't matter whether they're written down on paper or not. Sure, he can duck out early with no legal ramifications, but it sure does make him a really, really, really silly goose. He should pay.

I disagree pretty strongly with this. Unless the people you rent from are friends of yours or really down on money it's all business. I wouldn't feel bad about leaving a month early after a months notice. I'd rather look like a jerk to someone I owe nothing to than lose a good deal on an apartment just so I can feel I've done right by someone who, from the sound of it, is charging crazy rates considering.

If he can afford an apartment for less than it was to live in the spare room of their house/daycare they weren't exactly cutting him any deals, I'd say fair game. If they were letting you live there for super cheap I'd say it's different

Esh

I'd Fuck Chuck Lidell Up wrote: »

Esh wrote: »

bowen wrote: »

Also, while it's shitty, I wouldn't feel morally bad about kicking them under the proverbial bus here. You let them know ahead of time you were doing this. Shit sucks, you're not their ginko biloba but you also can't fuck over your opportunities when they come up either. Are you going to look like a douche? Maybe. You'll probably look like a douche even if you give them money because you didn't give them a year's notice.

Yeah, he let them know, but they thought they had an additional month to find someone. I don't understand why you would think anyone would be mad at someone for even "giving a year's notice" either. I know you're exaggerating, but it's just untrue. If given ample amount of time to find a new roommate, no one has any reason to get mad at all. OP told them they until a certain date, and then at the very last instant, he yanked the rug out from under them.

Opportunity or not, the OP has obligations, and it doesn't matter whether they're written down on paper or not. Sure, he can duck out early with no legal ramifications, but it sure does make him a really, really, really silly goose. He should pay.

I disagree pretty strongly with this. Unless the people you rent from are friends of yours or really down on money it's all business. I wouldn't feel bad about leaving a month early after a months notice. I'd rather look like a jerk to someone I owe nothing to than lose a good deal on an apartment just so I can feel I've done right by someone who, from the sound of it, is charging crazy rates considering.

If he can afford an apartment for less than it was to live in the spare room of their house/daycare they weren't exactly cutting him any deals, I'd say fair game. If they were letting you live there for super cheap I'd say it's different

"a month early after a month's notice" = No notice. I'm not sure how that's ok in any sense.

I'm not going to argue morals though. I'm off to get coffee.

EDIT: And "started looking" doesn't equal giving notice.

I'd Fuck Chuck Lidell Up

Esh wrote: »

I'd Fuck Chuck Lidell Up wrote: »

Esh wrote: »

bowen wrote: »

Also, while it's shitty, I wouldn't feel morally bad about kicking them under the proverbial bus here. You let them know ahead of time you were doing this. Shit sucks, you're not their ginko biloba but you also can't fuck over your opportunities when they come up either. Are you going to look like a douche? Maybe. You'll probably look like a douche even if you give them money because you didn't give them a year's notice.

Yeah, he let them know, but they thought they had an additional month to find someone. I don't understand why you would think anyone would be mad at someone for even "giving a year's notice" either. I know you're exaggerating, but it's just untrue. If given ample amount of time to find a new roommate, no one has any reason to get mad at all. OP told them they until a certain date, and then at the very last instant, he yanked the rug out from under them.

Opportunity or not, the OP has obligations, and it doesn't matter whether they're written down on paper or not. Sure, he can duck out early with no legal ramifications, but it sure does make him a really, really, really silly goose. He should pay.

I disagree pretty strongly with this. Unless the people you rent from are friends of yours or really down on money it's all business. I wouldn't feel bad about leaving a month early after a months notice. I'd rather look like a jerk to someone I owe nothing to than lose a good deal on an apartment just so I can feel I've done right by someone who, from the sound of it, is charging crazy rates considering.

If he can afford an apartment for less than it was to live in the spare room of their house/daycare they weren't exactly cutting him any deals, I'd say fair game. If they were letting you live there for super cheap I'd say it's different

"a month early after a month's notice" = No notice. I'm not sure how that's ok in any sense.

I'm not going to argue morals though. I'm off to get coffee.

"I started looking for rooms almost a month ago (informed her of this although it would seem she didn't get the message)"

bowen

That is ample notice for a subtenant. He could just up and vanish the next day if he wanted because that's the risk you take for not signing a lease or adding someone to the lease.

I agree with the "it's all business" at that point.

I mean if we want to point fingers and look at what's reasonable we could look at issues if this is a rental unit. Like running a business out of it, daycare businesses are usually forbidden outright by local law and almost all leases just say no businesses flat out in them. He could turn her in. Or he could let bygones be bygones and move out and everyone wins.

This is the downside to both parties not getting anything in writing. Would I give them money? If I could afford to yes. Should you? Only if you want.

Eat it You Nasty Pig.

It's not a dick move to leave early. You told them you were leaving, circumstances are just forcing you to leave a month earlier. Happens, doesn't make you a jerk.

edit: and no, you don't have some vacuous "moral" obligation to pay. The relationship you have with your landlord is a business relationship and it's governed by the terms you mutually set out (in this case, none.)

ihmmy

Personally, I would probably try and work out some partial payment but that's me... I'd feel bad about leaving them in the lurch (but I've rented out the second bedroom in a place I was leasing a few times, so I'm sort of on the other viewpoint here). If they're being grade a jerks about it, it's not worth the effort, but if you've made friends with them or want to keep the relationship up and running some sort of partial payment might make sense

SkyGheNe

"Business is Business" is another way of saying I want to be a jerk without feeling bad because I'm not legally bound to do the reasonable thing.

MY advice is avoid messes like this by signing legal documents - and to be clear - I also think your new landlord is sort of being a jerk.

bowen

Well they are kind of a dick not to hold it for the dude. But then again, it's a business and a business makes money by not giving shit away for free, which includes losing out on 1 month of rent, or, a half a month of pro-rated rent.

Landlord doesn't want to wait when he's probably got someone else willing to move in tomorrow. Apartments are pretty much always like this. Especially in the summer.

In summation, "Business is business." Alternatively, "Should've gotten me to sign a lease to protect us both you asshole."

SkyGheNe

bowen wrote: »

Well they are kind of a dick not to hold it for the dude. But then again, it's a business and a business makes money by not giving shit away for free, which includes losing out on 1 month of rent, or, a half a month of pro-rated rent.

Landlord doesn't want to wait when he's probably got someone else willing to move in tomorrow. Apartments are pretty much always like this. Especially in the summer.

In summation, "Business is business." Alternatively, "Should've gotten me to sign a lease to protect us both you asshole."

Yes, I agree.

bowen

It is also apparently very interesting to read things about rent and subletting. Just thought I'd throw that out there. Like if there's a 3 bedroom house and the lessee is getting for $800 a month, he can't charge the two other people $400 each in rent. Never knew that, figured if you were stupid enough to get into that situation it was your own dumb fault.