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Kerbal Space Progam: Rocket science is harder than it looks!
Supposedly the stage with the command pod will automatically pull a crew report if you haven't done one already. The larger antennas use more electricity per tick, but also send proportionally even more data per tick. So you use less electricity overall.
I just read on the KSP forum from a board moderator that the pod staging is left over from testing science parts as staged parts, but it was stupid so they took it out. But the pods' "include in staging queue" attribute was left in by accident, meaning they do nothing. Regardless, they don't do anything important - good to know!
right now transmitting data just seems like a waste, like the science jr. only can transmit 20% of its science worth, and if you keep hoovering up the same test 5 times, you start to see it diminish.
I'd rather launch 5 ships and bring them down to get the full bonus, because I feel like I am wasting potential science by just sending reports right now
I guess what I want to see if the potential to bring in X amount of science from each area before seeing diminishing returns, so you are guaranteed 50 science to be transmitted/landed before you see diminishing returns, just so you have a reason to leave a ship in orbit and transmit data
I thought this at first, but then I realized its incentive for bringing the ship back. Also anytime you run an experiment, the next time you run it whether its from another craft or the same one, it'll have less total science.
That's the thing - sitting in place and transmitting an experiment over and over will eventually get you the same science as bringing the data home. Plus, you're not saddled with a full goo container and all the fuel/rockets to get you back in the first place.
I think there should be a max percentage of the total science you can collect at all via transmission, and the rest is collected by bringing back samples. 400 pictures of a Duna rock should not equal the value of landing said rock back on Kerbin.
I kind of thought it was appropriate to have manned flights first. That's the Kerbal way. If you read the part descriptions the starting pack is all either model rocket parts or stuff they've found lying on the side of the road. Jeb doesn't care about saftey, he cares about SCIENCE!
life's a game that you're bound to lose / like using a hammer to pound in screws
fuck up once and you break your thumb / if you're happy at all then you're god damn dumb
that's right we're on a fucked up cruise / God is dead but at least we have booze
bad things happen, no one knows why / the sun burns out and everyone dies
My first manned Mun mission netted me 350+ science!
I was going to take a bunch of pictures because my ship is pretty different from what I normally build, (still pretty early on the tech tree) but I got so wrapped up in finishing the mission I forgot.
It's kinda ridiculous how much this whole "do science to unlock parts" thing adds to the game. For one, starting from the basics makes you appreciate the ENORMOUS strides the game has made in playability without having to resort to Mechjeb. Second, having some constructive limitations makes achieving goals infinitely more enjoyable; the whole "science" thing is a hilariously powerful motivator in building craft that can be recovered, as well as providing something to do beyond ridiculous, pointless constructions.
Overall, one helluva a kickass update.
The biggest thing for me is how it's suddenly worthwhile to do the intermediate steps in space exploration. Before, it was crashcrashcrashcrash -> orbit -> Munar impact -> Munar landing, but now I'm doing multiple flybys and experimenting.
I was a bit disappointed that Goo/crew don't seem to care about high Gs, but then again I haven't gotten all the science bits yet.
I'm a little disappointed in their decision to make Kerbal space exploration start manned, rather than unmanned, but hey, I can live with that.
You could just pretend that they already did the easy unmanned stuff to get the KSP to where it is at the start.
Bullshit.
This Space Programme doesn't EXIST without me? You hear me? NEVER!
That's the thing - sitting in place and transmitting an experiment over and over will eventually get you the same science as bringing the data home. Plus, you're not saddled with a full goo container and all the fuel/rockets to get you back in the first place.
I think there should be a max percentage of the total science you can collect at all via transmission, and the rest is collected by bringing back samples. 400 pictures of a Duna rock should not equal the value of landing said rock back on Kerbin.
Methinks that ultimetily the problem lies in that there isn't really that much...involvement in experiments. They're performed instantly and the results are ready to be beamed down or retrieved, and due to the way experiments work they thus become a matter of just spamming the same experiment until you extract every nugget of science you can. Now if you had to maintain an experiment in a specific set of conditions and earned science over time while doing so, like exposing material bay critters to microgravity and getting 1 science every 6 minutes of sustained experimentation until you effectively learn all there is to know about it, that'd probably work out better overall since you can then design missions around completily performing specific experiments instead of just mashing Observe over and over and beaming the results down.
As for retrieval vs. transmission, the capability to research stuff through one or the other should really hinge on the specific type of experiment you're doing, more specifically in whether it's something that has to be studied right there (condition-dependent, like goo microgravity studies) or if it can be hauled back to Kerbin for analysis (resource-dependent, soil samples and the like). Stuff linked to specific conditions need to be done over time in said conditions and then have the results of such beamed down, just like whatever experiments they're doing in the ISS right now - you can't really replicate those conditions on Kerbin and would lose the sample if you brought it back, so transmitting's the only way to go. Meanwhile, taking a picture of a moon rock will give you a little bit of basic information about it (local environmental conditions, guesses as to its material composition, etc) but of course bringing the damn thing back would give you much more to work with, so while you could transmit the soil report for 25% of the science, to get any more than that you'll need to bring it home (or get a fully-capable research laboratory to the soil sample, which could be an interesting high-level workaround.
I am pleased that you can recover samples independent of any sort of control module (they just need to survive their landing--so, toggle between them to ensure parachutes deploy). Dropped a separate module with four goo tanks that landed a kilometers away from my actual command module--zero science from the kerbanaut, but lots from the science section.
A couple of notes on EVA reports:
You don't actually have to get off the ladder and fly free; just step outside, click the button, and climb back in.
You can get and store one EVA report per biome that you fly over - if you try to make another for the same biome, it'll ask you if you want to toss the duplicate when you try to reboard. Your first equatorial orbit over Kerbin should take you over five, at least. (You'll need a polar orbit for the ice and/or tundra.) I kind of wish you could do this just by looking out the hatch window, but I guess that was too hard to code or something, so you have to actually go out there.
EVA reports are stored in the capsule, and can store any number of them, just not more than one of each. So that is all you have to recover.
There are also EVA reports for the upper atmosphere and low atmosphere. Do not attempt to collect these unless you are a certified Thrillmaster. (Actually, the second isn't too hard, if you just wait until the chute(s) has opened and you're drifting gently down.)
0
Ninja Snarl PMy helmet is my burden.Ninja Snarl: Gone, but not forgotten.Registered Userregular
EXCEPT FOR THE LAST 11.3 M/S OF DELTA V THAT WOULD HAVE TAKEN ME FROM A PERIAPSIS OF 153 KILOMETERS FOR KERBIN AND DOWN INTO THE ATMOSPHERE FOR BRAKING.
All that science, lost, like tears in the rain.
You get out and you push that bitch. You push her, and you push her again, and you keep pushin' her lazy ass until she finally gets in the atmosphere.
That's such a dumb idea.
PUSH, SLAVE!
No way.
NO WAY.
Well fuck a duck. It worked.
FOR THE SCIENCE.
Ninja Snarl P on
+11
Nova_CI have the needThe need for speedRegistered Userregular
No shit. The purist in me is dragging my feet--no orbital missions until I orbit a satellite--but I'm getting pissed off by the lack of actual structural parts in the meantime, har har.
EDIT: Also, a basic probe is totally useless for science gathering purposes, which kind of seems like a sour middle finger raised at Sputnik, but eh, you make do. I'm happy that the research chart is there and all, but right now, the dwindling returns are ridiculous fast--you basically need to start doing Muna orbit missions with less than ten parts unlocked, which frankly ruins all immersion value the system might have for me. That, or edit your way though.
No shit. The purist in me is dragging my feet--no orbital missions until I orbit a satellite--but I'm getting pissed off by the lack of actual structural parts in the meantime, har har.
EDIT: Also, a basic probe is totally useless for science gathering purposes, which kind of seems like a sour middle finger raised at Sputnik, but eh, you make do. I'm happy that the research chart is there and all, but right now, the dwindling returns are ridiculous fast--you basically need to start doing Muna orbit missions with less than ten parts unlocked, which frankly ruins all immersion value the system might have for me. That, or edit your way though.
There are a lot of science bits to grab without orbiting. You can do suborbital hops and gather ground EVAs & soil samples for the different biomes, as well as EVAs in the atmo and in space above those biomes.
At any rate, the tech tree at this point isn't really about presenting a realistic progression of technology, it's more of a tutorial. Start people with 5 parts and Jeb's grinning face and they're bound to go somewhere
life's a game that you're bound to lose / like using a hammer to pound in screws
fuck up once and you break your thumb / if you're happy at all then you're god damn dumb
that's right we're on a fucked up cruise / God is dead but at least we have booze
bad things happen, no one knows why / the sun burns out and everyone dies
Holy fuck I did it. I saved Jebediah with a drone, and was so fucking close to not doing it. Jeb had 19% EVA fuel left when he boarded, the ship had to make about 7 orbits around kerbin before atmo pulled it down because I ran out of fuel to get back to kerbin.
that was fucking epic.
oh yes and when i touched down my ship fell over exploding almost all the bits, but the pod survived!
No shit. The purist in me is dragging my feet--no orbital missions until I orbit a satellite--but I'm getting pissed off by the lack of actual structural parts in the meantime, har har.
EDIT: Also, a basic probe is totally useless for science gathering purposes, which kind of seems like a sour middle finger raised at Sputnik, but eh, you make do. I'm happy that the research chart is there and all, but right now, the dwindling returns are ridiculous fast--you basically need to start doing Muna orbit missions with less than ten parts unlocked, which frankly ruins all immersion value the system might have for me. That, or edit your way though.
There are a lot of science bits to grab without orbiting. You can do suborbital hops and gather ground EVAs & soil samples for the different biomes, as well as EVAs in the atmo and in space above those biomes.
At any rate, the tech tree at this point isn't really about presenting a realistic progression of technology, it's more of a tutorial. Start people with 5 parts and Jeb's grinning face and they're bound to go somewhere
Did not know about the biomes! Very informative, thanks--I pretty much missed all the trailers about the science options after the initial.
If it is a tutorial, it's pretty disappointing then. I haven't used a tutorial in KSP since the one back in 0.13. Kind of...defeats the purpose, really!
[If it is a tutorial, it's pretty disappointing then. I haven't used a tutorial in KSP since the one back in 0.13. Kind of...defeats the purpose, really!
Yeeeeeees and no, really. On the one hand, the part restriction does act as a sort of tutorial in that it starts players off with the absolute basics and then breaks them into the more powerful stuff as they go about doing things, but on the same token the part restriction is also a nice way to pull experienced players back and make them think about how best to use the limited resources they've got at that point instead of just making dozen-stage mainsail-and-nuke-powered monstrosities. Likewise once the economic bits start getting integrated and you'll have to start budgeting yourself in order to come out with cash to spare.
Sorenson on
+1
Nova_CI have the needThe need for speedRegistered Userregular
I just managed to barely get Jebediah home after successfully landing on the Mun. I was so sure I was going to run out of fuel, but I had a sliver of it left with a return path that brought me down to 20,000 meters, plenty close enough for re-entry.
Posts
I just read on the KSP forum from a board moderator that the pod staging is left over from testing science parts as staged parts, but it was stupid so they took it out. But the pods' "include in staging queue" attribute was left in by accident, meaning they do nothing. Regardless, they don't do anything important - good to know!
That's the thing - sitting in place and transmitting an experiment over and over will eventually get you the same science as bringing the data home. Plus, you're not saddled with a full goo container and all the fuel/rockets to get you back in the first place.
I think there should be a max percentage of the total science you can collect at all via transmission, and the rest is collected by bringing back samples. 400 pictures of a Duna rock should not equal the value of landing said rock back on Kerbin.
fuck up once and you break your thumb / if you're happy at all then you're god damn dumb
that's right we're on a fucked up cruise / God is dead but at least we have booze
bad things happen, no one knows why / the sun burns out and everyone dies
I was going to take a bunch of pictures because my ship is pretty different from what I normally build, (still pretty early on the tech tree) but I got so wrapped up in finishing the mission I forgot.
Bullshit.
This Space Programme doesn't EXIST without me? You hear me? NEVER!
As for retrieval vs. transmission, the capability to research stuff through one or the other should really hinge on the specific type of experiment you're doing, more specifically in whether it's something that has to be studied right there (condition-dependent, like goo microgravity studies) or if it can be hauled back to Kerbin for analysis (resource-dependent, soil samples and the like). Stuff linked to specific conditions need to be done over time in said conditions and then have the results of such beamed down, just like whatever experiments they're doing in the ISS right now - you can't really replicate those conditions on Kerbin and would lose the sample if you brought it back, so transmitting's the only way to go. Meanwhile, taking a picture of a moon rock will give you a little bit of basic information about it (local environmental conditions, guesses as to its material composition, etc) but of course bringing the damn thing back would give you much more to work with, so while you could transmit the soil report for 25% of the science, to get any more than that you'll need to bring it home (or get a fully-capable research laboratory to the soil sample, which could be an interesting high-level workaround.
I could throw together a new OP if no one minds, and maybe we'll even spell the game title right this time!
Putting the SCIENCE in Rocket Science since 0.22.
My two cents.
PSN: ShogunGunshow
Origin: ShogunGunshow
Steam profile - Twitch - YouTube
Switch: SM-6352-8553-6516
You don't actually have to get off the ladder and fly free; just step outside, click the button, and climb back in.
You can get and store one EVA report per biome that you fly over - if you try to make another for the same biome, it'll ask you if you want to toss the duplicate when you try to reboard. Your first equatorial orbit over Kerbin should take you over five, at least. (You'll need a polar orbit for the ice and/or tundra.) I kind of wish you could do this just by looking out the hatch window, but I guess that was too hard to code or something, so you have to actually go out there.
EVA reports are stored in the capsule, and can store any number of them, just not more than one of each. So that is all you have to recover.
There are also EVA reports for the upper atmosphere and low atmosphere. Do not attempt to collect these unless you are a certified Thrillmaster. (Actually, the second isn't too hard, if you just wait until the chute(s) has opened and you're drifting gently down.)
That's such a dumb idea.
EDIT: Also, a basic probe is totally useless for science gathering purposes, which kind of seems like a sour middle finger raised at Sputnik, but eh, you make do. I'm happy that the research chart is there and all, but right now, the dwindling returns are ridiculous fast--you basically need to start doing Muna orbit missions with less than ten parts unlocked, which frankly ruins all immersion value the system might have for me. That, or edit your way though.
Steam: Elvenshae // PSN: Elvenshae // WotC: Elvenshae
Wilds of Aladrion: [https://forums.penny-arcade.com/discussion/comment/43159014/#Comment_43159014]Ellandryn[/url]
There are a lot of science bits to grab without orbiting. You can do suborbital hops and gather ground EVAs & soil samples for the different biomes, as well as EVAs in the atmo and in space above those biomes.
At any rate, the tech tree at this point isn't really about presenting a realistic progression of technology, it's more of a tutorial. Start people with 5 parts and Jeb's grinning face and they're bound to go somewhere
fuck up once and you break your thumb / if you're happy at all then you're god damn dumb
that's right we're on a fucked up cruise / God is dead but at least we have booze
bad things happen, no one knows why / the sun burns out and everyone dies
that was fucking epic.
oh yes and when i touched down my ship fell over exploding almost all the bits, but the pod survived!
due to @Kashaar being awesome you can now watch me attempt to rescue Bill with an EVA before he and the rescue pod crash into kerbin!
Use OBS! It's free and likes it. --> http://obsproject.com/
Unreal Engine 4 Developers Community.
I'm working on a cute little video game! Here's a link for you.
Did not know about the biomes! Very informative, thanks--I pretty much missed all the trailers about the science options after the initial.
If it is a tutorial, it's pretty disappointing then. I haven't used a tutorial in KSP since the one back in 0.13. Kind of...defeats the purpose, really!
And I pulled 440 science off that mission.
Oh, right, make that 440 SCIENCE
Bright, shiny new one: http://forums.penny-arcade.com/discussion/183851/