Double posting because key presses on this forum are so laggy.
Good luck getting everything to work TSR, what you are experiencing is the reason why I haven't been able to get into the Amiga: The hardware is a total chore. Ideally I would like to have an Amiga CD32 and SX32 but that's never going to happen on my budget. Some good times were had back in the day at least!
Alright, after reading around all day, I've figured out the problem. The way these pal->ntsc converters work is that they take an interlaced image and convert it to the correct format, then pop it back out to the screen. The problem is that the Amiga CD32 displays a non-interlaced picture, only the splash screen is interlaced. Thats why the splash screen works, and the rest of the console does not. The Wii displays an interlaced image, which is why my pal mode test worked.
That said, I realize I have two options available to me now. My first option, which is the easiest, is to buy a VGA box, one of those small boxes which lets you plug in RCA inputs and display them on a VGA monitor. Almost all VGA monitors can support 50 hz, and the odd resolution wouldn't be a problem. This solution can be had for about $50.
The reason that solution isn't desirable is because I could only play my CD32 on an HDTV. I have a classic game room set up in my place which has a bitching, prestine, 32" SD CRT TV. It's in excellent condition, I've taken great care of it, and playing classic games on the thing is perfect, far better than playing on an HDTV. Classic games were made with CRT tvs in mind, and the Amiga is no different. Some effects flat out don't work on HDTVs.
Thus, my second solution, which is far more difficult, is to build my own pal->ntsc converter. This isn't as hard as it sounds, and I actually have everything I need with me, but it will still be a chore. I have a happauge WinTV-PVR 250, and an old nvidia TNT2 video card with TV out. What I can do is build a small PC with both the Happauge PVR, which accepts both NTSC and PAL input, and then run the game on a fullscreen TV window on that PC, but output the video of the computer to the TV. I've done similar setups like this in the past, although not for PAL->NTSC conversion. The problem with doing this is that the PVR 250 has a hardware based mpeg2 encoder which introduces a slight delay, making playing games with the thing impossible. But I've read about a way to bypass the mpeg 2 encoding with a registry edit.
I'm gonna try building the converter first, and if that doesn't work I'll cave and buy the VGA box. Lots of work ahead.
At this point, the hilarity of the situation hits me. I'm building a full computer, to work solely as a video converter for a 7 mhz PC. Amiga Forever is actually legal amiga emulation, they bought the rights to all the amiga shit and can sell legal emulation software. This is so round about, haha. None the less, the collector in me strives for accuracy, and the allure of using real hardware, on real CRT screens, is too much to resist. I'm building the pal->NTSC pc out of spare parts, but I'll probably laugh every time I use it because of how crazy it is, and how much easier it'd be to just buy Amiga forever and run it on the thing.
My Amiga Mouse and Keyboard arrived today, I'm gonna test both out when I get home. Word is that the NTSC mode on the Cd32 is actually pal60, but we'll see.
Oh, I haven't really had time to mess with the CD32 in a while. I have the mouse and keyboard next to the console itself right now, but they're still untested. I've ordered an atlona converter that someone else who went through the same pains I did recommended to me. He guaranteed me this one would work, and actually had tried every single converter I'd tried before, with the exact same results on all of them.
That won't arrive for a few days though and my supernova will likely arrive well before then, so I'll probably turn my attention towards that for a while. But I'll get back to this topic when more hardware rolls in. I'm holding off on the pics just until I can get a nice shot of it running on the TV in color.
I came home today and found an unexpected package waiting for me at the front door - it was my Atlona CD-660! It arrived a good week before it was supposed to! I tore the box open, hooked that shit up to my CD32, turned the thing on and...
nothing.
I was crushed. Another several hundred dollars down the drain. Or so I thought... turns out the switch on my power strip that I plugged my CD32 into had moved to "off" by accident when I plugged it in. So I turned it back on, the CD32 whirred to life, the splash screen came up in color and then...
nothing
I turned it off and turned it on again and still nothing. What the fuck? I opened the CD and, in my haste, I had thrown in the Sega CD version of Microcosm in by accident, not the CD32 version. So, once again, I popped in a correct game (this time Skeleton krew so I'd be sure it was a CD32 game). The CD32 whirred to life, I got a color splash screen then...
FUCKING SUCCESS. Glorious, NTSC color image on my screen! In-game!! I fucking did it! I have a functional CD32 which can play the complete library here in the US! I'm setting this shit up nicely so I can snap some pictures, but I am so excited that I needed to post ASAP.
Unfortunately, it's always something, and in this case, I just found out my competition pro joypad does not, in fact, work. But, luckily, a Sega Genesis pad DOES. So I'm playing with a gimped controller ATM. I just ordered a new competition pro joypad, but not even that can piss me off right now. It might not seem like a lot, but holy shit. I have a console, which never released in the US, playing in full color on my TV. This is awe
So here are the pictures. I think I need a better 220V->110V converter because the one I bought (for like $5) gets EXTREMELY hot to the touch within minutes. Like, hotter than a stove. Definitely a fire hazard. I walked away for 10 minutes and came back and my entire room smelled like melting plastic. Scary scary.
Anyways, here's the pics:
The system hooked up and placed inside my cabinet under my CRT TV. I only ever have 1 system connected to this TV at one time. I need to drill a hole in the back of the cabinet for wires to be fed through, but in the mean time I just let them sit out front. I made a make shift all-in-one cable from the power brick and the AV cables which are fed into the converter, since it's like 4 cables which need to work together to get this working.
Upclose shot of the console turned on.
Skeleton Krew... IN COLOR!. If you boot the system like normal, the image is a tad bit smaller than normal for some reason. However, if you boot in PAL60 mode (by holding both mouse buttons on boot up, it's labeled as NTSC mode) then the image fills the entire frame.
the whole set up
I can't wait till I get a better power converter and an actual CD32 control pad that works. This shit is just too cool.
Woo! Glad you've got everything up and running. It's pretty bizarre to see something I shipped from the UK being pictured over there. I love the relatively pointless volume control on the CD32, I don't think I've ever used the headphone socket.
You got any games lined up? Also how's the floppy expansion? Have you given it a go?
When I was younger, my brother and I shared a room, and being the night owl I was, I'd play video games late into the night. The stereo headphone jack on my genesis was a godsend, as I could play games with the TV facing away from him, and still listen to the music. Back in the early 90's, stereo wasn't always a given on a TV, so being able to plug in a headphone was a good feature. Lots of systems had it - the first model Sega Genesis, the Turbo Duo, the 3DO, and, of course, the CD32.
Yeah, I've got a bunch of games already, they're super cheap if you buy from europe. I think I bought a bootleg the other day - I ordered something called "R-Types" for the CD32, but the disc that arrived looks like a lightscribe CDR with a custom label, and looking up info on the game yields nothing. I can find R-type 1 and R-type 2 for the amiga 500 on floppy disc, but no release of both as a package on the CD32. It has a professional looking menu, so I dunno if it's a bootleg, but it was cheap and I can't find any info on it. Plays really well, though - it's cool comparing the CD32 version of R-Type 2 to the SNES version (called Super R-Type)
The Floppy expansion indeed works, I've been playing Super Stardust on it. I haven't touched my A500 since I got the CD32, it's more of an oddity now, and I think I'll be doing all my Amiga gaming on this machine.
BTW, the mouse works, and so does the keyboard adapter. If I boot into NTSC mode (which is actually PAL 60) I can get the image to fill the entire screen on my TV, which is cool.
All in all, this is a pretty cool system. I've been going through and noting differences in versions - the Jaguar port of Zool 2 is the exact same thing as the CD32 version, only the CD32 version has better music (I assume the jag version is using music from the disc version of Zool 2). Chuck rock 2 on the sega cd is better than the CD32 version - there are a bunch of graphical effects missing in the CD32 version. I have classic lotus trilogy for the CD32, but it has a different soundtrack from the youtube videos of the A500 versions I've been seeing, so I might pick up the disc versions later.
I ordered Super Street Fighter 2 turbo, I hear it's a train wreck. I can't wait to find out.
Oh, I also found this site which has a bunch of Amiga demos you can burn to a Dr so I've been going through those. State of the art is impressive as hell.
So, the vast majority of Amiga titles prior to the release of the CD32 were made with 1-button joysticks in mind. Amigas didn't get an official controller until 1993, a year before they shut down, and games started rolling out in 1985. Now, later in the Amiga's life, as the Sega Master System and Sega Megadrive became popular in europe, 2 button controls began to creep into Amiga games, and the Sega controllers became the unofficial amiga controller. A few amiga games, like R-type, take advantage of this setup and let you use the 2nd button, but these are far from norm. In short, there are tons and tons of 1-button games.
The problem with such games, however, is that they often times have to take unique liberties with controls. For the most part, in old games, the up button isn't used very often, so amiga developers would often map jump to up. Given that the majority of games from the day only ever used 1 button in combination with a jump button, this was a common work around to the general 1-button layout.
I'm sure in europe that retro gamers have no problem with this up-to-jump set up as they probably grew up with it (all the major european computers used the same 1-button joypads, as did the C64), being that I grew up in the US on japanese developed consoles with 2 buttons or more, I just cannot get used to it. Games which should be fun to play, with generally good control, are unplayable to me this way.
So I decided to rectify this design error. Taking a spare Sega Master System controller I had, I opened up a section of it's wire, and rerouted the 2 button wire to the up pin. I also kept the up button wire routed on the up pin.
I tied the controller cord into two knots surrounding the work area, so that if you yank on the cord, the force won't be applied to this sensitive area, then I wrapped it in duct tape, turning it into this little dongle near the end of the cord.
It works great. So many games are now way more fun to play, particularly Fire and Ice. I've been having a lot of fun putting together a consolidated hodge-podge amiga 1200. What I have under my TV now feels like a lost 16-bit console, with a big library of games to play. Modded controllers make the games feel familiar and in line with other console's controls, and the form factor is much less bulky than the gigantic Amiga 500.
Not to mention that I'm still pretty proud that I've gotten a PAL console running on my NTSC tv without error. It's difficult to do, and converting from pal to NTSC is traditionally the biggest stumbling block for people who try to get into CD32 gaming, basically where most give up. In addition to the CDM-660 which is converting the video, I went out and bought a nice, professional step-up converter to power the thing. The step up converter was $50, but it's sturdy and, most importantly, it's safe.
I was telling grinchy that I've decided to document my experience with the Amiga 1200 and CD32 library in this thread as I collect games, and I intend to do just that. I ordered Chuck Rock 2 a few days ago, so when it arrives, I'll do a breakdown comparison of it and the Sega CD version.
So while my moddified SMS pad works well enough, I'm in the process of creating the ultimate Amiga controller. I've ordered a 3-button classic Genesis controller to mod out, and I have a laundry list of modifications I plan on doing to it.
First up, I've had a homemade IPAC (interface->PC to Arcade Converter) which is nothing more than a chopped up ATX PS/2 keyboard which I can attach 12-gauge wire to and map keypresses to button inputs. Thus, I can open up the genesis pad, solder connects onto the A button and Start button's terminals, and that'll allow me to map those buttons to whatever keypress I choose. I'm gonna map A to the space bar, and start to both the 1 key, and the P key, so it'll act as a dual 1-player select and pause button. Then I'm gonna add a switch which will make the C button either act as up, or button 2.
The new controller will basically plug into both joypad 1 port, and the keyboard port, and it'll let me play virtually any Amiga game completely with a controller. I'll post pics as I go along with the project.
As for your comments about chuck rock - yes, that's the game you're thinking of. I've always had a soft spot for that series. I got Chuck Rock 1 for my game gear not very long after I picked it up for my birthday in 91, and it's always been one of my favorite GG games. I picked up Chuck Rock 2: Son of Chuck late in the Sega CD's life from toys r us back when they were liquidating their stock (which is when I picked up a good 60% of my sega CD library... amazing times, games could be bought for $1.99) and absolutely loved it. It's a great game - not one that is significantly improved to the point where I could recommend it over the standard cart edition (unlike, say, Earthworm Jim SE or Ecco the Dolphin) but still good enough for me to play the shit out of it.
As I understand it, Chuck Rock 1 was actually developed for the Amiga first, while Chuck Rock 2 was developed for the Genesis as it's lead platform. It kinda shows - Chuck Rock 1 has no sound effects and the title screen music plays over the entire game, while Chuck Rock 2 on the Amiga is missing a bunch of effects (like the cave level doesn't have the darkness which makes it unique... which also makes the monsters on stilts joke not make sense, since they're supposed to look like a giant pair of eyes until you get right up on them). Still great games though.
That title screen music for Chuck Rock 1 is incredible. I remember when I was younger, I'd sometimes turn on my game gear with headphones on and just let the title screen play. While the GG version has no in-game music, at least the Amiga version keeps that incredible title screen music playing throughout the game.
Another game I've been playing a lot of on my amiga? Mr. Nutz. I can't get over how different, and flat out better, the Amiga version of Mr. Nutz is compared to the Genesis and SNES versions. It's a 100% completely different game, and it's much, much better. The Genesis and SNES versions play like a standard ho-hum hop n bop platformer, while the Amiga version is one of the best Sonic clones I've played. I've heard rumors that the Amiga version was going to be ported to the Genesis as Mr. Nutz 2, but it never was released. Shame, because the Amiga version is, thus far, one of the top 5 games I've played for the system.
This is only tangentially related, but I wanted to say: this thread is making me want to look into purchasing an Apple IIGS, and either repair my TI99/4A or purchase another.
So a bit of neat amiga news. First, ebay finally resolved my case on my CD32 controller which never arrived and I was refunded in full, which I promptly used to buy another CD32 controller from someone else for the same price. It should be here soon.
In other news, I've got down the process of converting disk games into CD32 bootable games. It's a complex process, but it involves using my real amiga to do part of the work, which is neat.
Basically, every cd32 game contains a file in it called startup-sequence, and it's a script which tells the cd32 version of workbench what to do. You can write your own startup-sequence and it'll basically act as a bootup script for your CD32. You can even load programs this way.
Longtime amiga users are probably familiar with WHDLoad - the program which let you install floppy disks on your harddrive and run them so you never had to change disks, in addition to speeding up loading. Well, it'll run on a CD32 as well, and you can change the startup-sequence file to load a game from it. There is even a special WHDLoad32 version for the CD32.
The problem is, in order for it to work, you have to use WHDLoad to actually install the game on a harddrive first, which is where using a real amiga comes into place. I have to use the amiga to install the games to a harddrive, then I can take the file from the harddrive, and burn it onto a CD, and the game will run.
In addition, you can have programs running in the background thanks to WHDLoad, so you can load a bunch of special programs people have written. There is one, for example, which will map one of the buttons on your CD32 controller to spacebar, another will let you map up to a button, and others do things like letting you play music in the background of silent games.
It's all really cool stuff. The only downside? The CD32 has 2 mb of ram, and all this stuff takes up memory. WHDLoad can be whittled down to about 200 kb, and the above programs are written to be tiny, so, when it's all said and done, you have about 1600 kb to work with. That means that super large games, like ones that span 3 or 4 disks, won't fit into ram.
This can be circumvented if you have an SA-X or a SX-32, both of which expand the CD32's memory by adding 4 mb of fast ram. The SX-32 actually replaces the CPU on the CD32 with a faster one, and can be expanded up to 64 mb of ram. So, eventually, I'm gonna grab me one of these lol.
Beyond just having all my games on easy to use disc without the need for swapping, I can also add a splash screen, so I've been giving each game a similar splash screen to give the CD32 a faux splash screen. Sort of like how Sega used to always begin with the Sega logo. Also, since the floppy drive for my CD32 is bulky and kinda ugly (it's beige while the CD32 is deep grey), putting my games on disc allows me to keep that thing off my cd32.
I made a CD version of Golden Axe the other day - I had received it a few days ago in the mail but hadn't tried it out. It's actually a very good port, roughly on par with the genesis version from my initial quick peek, although it runs in a smaller screen, as per usual with CD32 games. The music is WAY better than the genesis version, though, mainly because the Amiga had a banging soundchip that was ahead of even the SNES at the time.
Controls are pretty good. I have one button mapped to the standard button, which attacks in golden axe, then I have another mapped to space bar, which is your magic. Jumping in this game, unfortunately, isn't simply "up," because up is how you move into the screen. In this case, jump is "up+attack" which makes it so I can't map it to a button. It sounds awful, but you get used to it very quickly and it winds up not being a problem at all.
Pretty fun port. golden axe is golden axe, so it's always a fun, short game, but the Amiga port left me impressed considering the hardware. A machine built in 84, released in 85, was able to keep in step with the Sega Genesis, released in 88, and even trump it in music. It's a testament to the foundation the Amiga 500 laid when basically the same hardware was able to be sold in 1994 as an average-power game system. From my experience with the CD32 so far, I'd say that it feels like a system that is somewhere in between the Sega Master System and Sega Genesis in terms of quality and power. Very rough around the edges, but I've really taken to the platform and system because the way things are done, and look, reminds me very much of my two favorite Sega platforms. It helps when the controller looks like this:
So a few days ago, my CD32 died. Yeah, less than a year after I got it, and now it's a paper weight. The CD Drive motor is shot - when I boot the system, the disc refuses to spin even though everything works. I can play a floppy disk game via my floppy drive, but no CD games.
That said, I've ordered myself another unit for $215 USD. It comes with another competition pro gamepad and a few more games. Hopefully this is the last time I have to buy a CD32.
Yeah it was a pretty big bummer, but in the time I had it working I amassed a really large library. CD32 games are really common on ebay, and can be had for anything between $20-$40. I really took to the system and enjoyed it's library, hence why I've already purchased a replacement.
So my new CD32 should be here by the 24th, which is just in time for christmas. To help bust in the new CD32, I picked up the following:
Shadow Fighter (Floppy ver)
Beneath a Steel Sky (CD32 ver)
Chaos Engine (CD32 ver)
Mr. Nutz - Hoppin Mad (Floppies)
Quik the Thunder Rabbit (CD32 ver)
Joe & Mac (Floppies)
Wing Commander (CD32 ver -- well technically CDTV ver)
Deadly Streets (CD32 ver)
that brings my game count up to 48 Amiga 500/1200/CD32 games now. I've been keeping my eye out for an SX of some sort - there is an SX-1 on ebay right now for $500, but I'm holding out for an SX32-pro (I'd easily drop a grand for one).
Haha, I just bought SHAQ FU for the Amiga. the floppy version (I don't think there is a CD version). I paid $30 for it complete in box. A) I'm pretty sure that is more than anybody has ever paid for Shaq Fu since the game was released, I'm actually extremely curious to hear what the game's music sounds like, since even bad amiga games normally have great music, C) Didn't the SNES and Genesis versions use 6 buttons? This version will almost assuredly use only 2 buttons, possibly only 1.
I dunno why I bought this, other than for the ability to say "I have shaq fu. For the Amiga." All the fun of shaq fu, with the added joy of swapping between 5 floppy discs. Yay!
Shaq Fu uses only one button, I'm almost positive of it. I own it, it's upstairs in the attic... I have no idea why I own it. I've also got Street Fighter 2 which looked pretty but I'm pretty sure it ran at about 3 fps.
Also an SX-1 is going for $500? Jesus Christ, I should stop leaving mine half plugged in, balanced on beer mats.
Reading around the english amiga boards, it seems as recently as a year ago, a large warehouse of boxed, unsold CD32s which were intended for the aborted US launch were uncovered in china, and were all sold through ebay. This, similar to the rise of the PC Engine due to Magic engine being released around 2000, has caused Amiga prices to skyrocket. Back in like 2009, you could apparently buy an SX-1 for about $150, and, if you found them, you could buy a SX-32 Pro for about $600.
That said, I'm talking to this dude over at English Amiga who is some sort of hardware guru, who has successfully fitted my analogic floppy expansion with fastram. I'm looking to do my own mod, because if I can get fastram on this thing, then it's just as good as a SX-1 to me. Obviously the SX-32 Pro is the dream find, as you can pop in up to 64 mb of ram and it comes with a faster processor for your CD32, which essentially turns your CD32 into a top-line A1200.
So I still have my new CD32 coming my way in the mail, but today I picked up a brand new, never before opened, MIB Amiga 1200, along with a Blizzard Accelerator, 8 mb of ram, a competition pro joystick (the old style, not the CD32 one), a spare mouse, and a CF Flash kit, all for 135 GBP. I am so incredibly stoked!
Man, your Amiga beats my Amiga. Mine just has 6mb RAM, though it does have a 250mb hard-drive! My amiga makes me think of Christmas. At this time of year I always remember getting my CD32 and my SX1. I mentioned in another thread but my Dad actually took a video of me getting my SX1. I must admit I suspected that's what I was getting as I'd already opened a new mouse and a keyboard and some Amiga 1200 games that I otherwise wouldn't have been able to play.
I'm not sure what's more embarrassing on rewatching this though, the fact my voice is breaking or that I received (and was impressed both by the game and the size of the box) Rise of the Robots - CD32. Because I'm a sucker for embarrassment, here's a very geeky British Christmas (1994 maybe?):
Man, your Amiga beats my Amiga. Mine just has 6mb RAM, though it does have a 250mb hard-drive! My amiga makes me think of Christmas. At this time of year I always remember getting my CD32 and my SX1. I mentioned in another thread but my Dad actually took a video of me getting my SX1. I must admit I suspected that's what I was getting as I'd already opened a new mouse and a keyboard and some Amiga 1200 games that I otherwise wouldn't have been able to play.
I'm not sure what's more embarrassing on rewatching this though, the fact my voice is breaking or that I received (and was impressed both by the game and the size of the box) Rise of the Robots - CD32. Because I'm a sucker for embarrassment, here's a very geeky British Christmas (1994 maybe?):
Haha, that's great. There is video out there of me opening just about every christmas present I got between 1990 until about 1998, including the one where I got my Genesis and Sonic, but I'd never put it online. You're braver than I.
My CF Kit is only 4 mb, but other than that I'm stoked about the A1200. With the blizzard accelerator, I'm supposed to be able to play Alien Breed 3D II at full speed, so we'll see how that goes. Screenshots make it seem just like quake.
I might have the hindsight of 20 years of gaming refinement to alter my opinion of the games, but I see no redeeming value in the SotB series.
Blasphemy! That's like saying Quake 1 and 2 are bad games... (let that sink in for a bit... but for its time, Shadow of the Beast 1 and 2 where the exact same equivalent in technical marvel, nothing came close for quite a while).
PS. A few years ago I managed to find a factory sealed copy of IK+ for the CD32, which I since opened and played and I don't have any pics of it unopened, but I'll leave the thread with this image:
PPS. Not sure if Supercars 2 has been mentioned, but I play it to this day and it's still an amazing game. I would recommend that and Speedball 2 (I've searched for a sealed copy of Speedball 2 for the CD32 for a long while, but never managed to find one).
eobet on
Heard the proposition that RIAA and MPAA should join forces and form "Music And Film Industry Association"?
Blasphemy! That's like saying Quake 1 and 2 are bad games... (let that sink in for a bit... but for its time, Shadow of the Beast 1 and 2 where the exact same equivalent in technical marvel, nothing came close for quite a while).
No, I didn't say that age makes games bad, I said that age makes the things which made us overlook the negative aspects of a game disappear. SotB was a bad game back in the late 80's which was masked by pretty graphics. Those graphics aren't so pretty now, so all we're left with is a bad game.
Quake is a good game with great graphics at the time. The graphical shine is gone, but the good game remains.
There are so many better Amiga games for Amiga owners to hang their hats on besides SotB - give me Lionheart or even Fire and Ice any day of the week over SotB.
Also, I got speedball 2 this morning from my dad, the CD32 version. Awesome!
Awwww fuck yeah, I just won a sealed in box Gravis gamepad, Amiga edition. Gravis made, of course, awesome gamepads for the PC, but the Amiga version is special - in addition to a switch which enables left handed mode like the PC version, there is another switch. Normally, the gamepad, which has 4 buttons, acts as a 2 button controller, with the other 2 buttons being auto-fire mirriors of the first 2 buttons. But flip this switch, and those other 2 buttons get mapped to up and down, giving you a proper, Sega Genesis-style 3 button setup with a dedicated jump button.
I've been looking for one of these since I first got my Amiga 500, and I'm very excited that I not only found one, but an unopened one too!
This is going to fucking rule, I have always loved the Gravis gamepad.
Posts
Good luck getting everything to work TSR, what you are experiencing is the reason why I haven't been able to get into the Amiga: The hardware is a total chore. Ideally I would like to have an Amiga CD32 and SX32 but that's never going to happen on my budget. Some good times were had back in the day at least!
That said, I realize I have two options available to me now. My first option, which is the easiest, is to buy a VGA box, one of those small boxes which lets you plug in RCA inputs and display them on a VGA monitor. Almost all VGA monitors can support 50 hz, and the odd resolution wouldn't be a problem. This solution can be had for about $50.
The reason that solution isn't desirable is because I could only play my CD32 on an HDTV. I have a classic game room set up in my place which has a bitching, prestine, 32" SD CRT TV. It's in excellent condition, I've taken great care of it, and playing classic games on the thing is perfect, far better than playing on an HDTV. Classic games were made with CRT tvs in mind, and the Amiga is no different. Some effects flat out don't work on HDTVs.
Thus, my second solution, which is far more difficult, is to build my own pal->ntsc converter. This isn't as hard as it sounds, and I actually have everything I need with me, but it will still be a chore. I have a happauge WinTV-PVR 250, and an old nvidia TNT2 video card with TV out. What I can do is build a small PC with both the Happauge PVR, which accepts both NTSC and PAL input, and then run the game on a fullscreen TV window on that PC, but output the video of the computer to the TV. I've done similar setups like this in the past, although not for PAL->NTSC conversion. The problem with doing this is that the PVR 250 has a hardware based mpeg2 encoder which introduces a slight delay, making playing games with the thing impossible. But I've read about a way to bypass the mpeg 2 encoding with a registry edit.
I'm gonna try building the converter first, and if that doesn't work I'll cave and buy the VGA box. Lots of work ahead.
Seriously though, good luck, it's my most treasured of 'consoles' (I always see it as more a computer) which was why I was so keen to help you.
PSN: SirGrinchX
Oculus Rift: Sir_Grinch
PSN: SirGrinchX
Oculus Rift: Sir_Grinch
That won't arrive for a few days though and my supernova will likely arrive well before then, so I'll probably turn my attention towards that for a while. But I'll get back to this topic when more hardware rolls in. I'm holding off on the pics just until I can get a nice shot of it running on the TV in color.
nothing.
I was crushed. Another several hundred dollars down the drain. Or so I thought... turns out the switch on my power strip that I plugged my CD32 into had moved to "off" by accident when I plugged it in. So I turned it back on, the CD32 whirred to life, the splash screen came up in color and then...
nothing
I turned it off and turned it on again and still nothing. What the fuck? I opened the CD and, in my haste, I had thrown in the Sega CD version of Microcosm in by accident, not the CD32 version. So, once again, I popped in a correct game (this time Skeleton krew so I'd be sure it was a CD32 game). The CD32 whirred to life, I got a color splash screen then...
FUCKING SUCCESS. Glorious, NTSC color image on my screen! In-game!! I fucking did it! I have a functional CD32 which can play the complete library here in the US! I'm setting this shit up nicely so I can snap some pictures, but I am so excited that I needed to post ASAP.
Unfortunately, it's always something, and in this case, I just found out my competition pro joypad does not, in fact, work. But, luckily, a Sega Genesis pad DOES. So I'm playing with a gimped controller ATM. I just ordered a new competition pro joypad, but not even that can piss me off right now. It might not seem like a lot, but holy shit. I have a console, which never released in the US, playing in full color on my TV. This is awe
Anyways, here's the pics:
The system hooked up and placed inside my cabinet under my CRT TV. I only ever have 1 system connected to this TV at one time. I need to drill a hole in the back of the cabinet for wires to be fed through, but in the mean time I just let them sit out front. I made a make shift all-in-one cable from the power brick and the AV cables which are fed into the converter, since it's like 4 cables which need to work together to get this working.
Upclose shot of the console turned on.
Skeleton Krew... IN COLOR!. If you boot the system like normal, the image is a tad bit smaller than normal for some reason. However, if you boot in PAL60 mode (by holding both mouse buttons on boot up, it's labeled as NTSC mode) then the image fills the entire frame.
the whole set up
I can't wait till I get a better power converter and an actual CD32 control pad that works. This shit is just too cool.
You got any games lined up? Also how's the floppy expansion? Have you given it a go?
PSN: SirGrinchX
Oculus Rift: Sir_Grinch
Yeah, I've got a bunch of games already, they're super cheap if you buy from europe. I think I bought a bootleg the other day - I ordered something called "R-Types" for the CD32, but the disc that arrived looks like a lightscribe CDR with a custom label, and looking up info on the game yields nothing. I can find R-type 1 and R-type 2 for the amiga 500 on floppy disc, but no release of both as a package on the CD32. It has a professional looking menu, so I dunno if it's a bootleg, but it was cheap and I can't find any info on it. Plays really well, though - it's cool comparing the CD32 version of R-Type 2 to the SNES version (called Super R-Type)
The Floppy expansion indeed works, I've been playing Super Stardust on it. I haven't touched my A500 since I got the CD32, it's more of an oddity now, and I think I'll be doing all my Amiga gaming on this machine.
BTW, the mouse works, and so does the keyboard adapter. If I boot into NTSC mode (which is actually PAL 60) I can get the image to fill the entire screen on my TV, which is cool.
All in all, this is a pretty cool system. I've been going through and noting differences in versions - the Jaguar port of Zool 2 is the exact same thing as the CD32 version, only the CD32 version has better music (I assume the jag version is using music from the disc version of Zool 2). Chuck rock 2 on the sega cd is better than the CD32 version - there are a bunch of graphical effects missing in the CD32 version. I have classic lotus trilogy for the CD32, but it has a different soundtrack from the youtube videos of the A500 versions I've been seeing, so I might pick up the disc versions later.
I ordered Super Street Fighter 2 turbo, I hear it's a train wreck. I can't wait to find out.
The problem with such games, however, is that they often times have to take unique liberties with controls. For the most part, in old games, the up button isn't used very often, so amiga developers would often map jump to up. Given that the majority of games from the day only ever used 1 button in combination with a jump button, this was a common work around to the general 1-button layout.
I'm sure in europe that retro gamers have no problem with this up-to-jump set up as they probably grew up with it (all the major european computers used the same 1-button joypads, as did the C64), being that I grew up in the US on japanese developed consoles with 2 buttons or more, I just cannot get used to it. Games which should be fun to play, with generally good control, are unplayable to me this way.
So I decided to rectify this design error. Taking a spare Sega Master System controller I had, I opened up a section of it's wire, and rerouted the 2 button wire to the up pin. I also kept the up button wire routed on the up pin.
I tied the controller cord into two knots surrounding the work area, so that if you yank on the cord, the force won't be applied to this sensitive area, then I wrapped it in duct tape, turning it into this little dongle near the end of the cord.
It works great. So many games are now way more fun to play, particularly Fire and Ice. I've been having a lot of fun putting together a consolidated hodge-podge amiga 1200. What I have under my TV now feels like a lost 16-bit console, with a big library of games to play. Modded controllers make the games feel familiar and in line with other console's controls, and the form factor is much less bulky than the gigantic Amiga 500.
Not to mention that I'm still pretty proud that I've gotten a PAL console running on my NTSC tv without error. It's difficult to do, and converting from pal to NTSC is traditionally the biggest stumbling block for people who try to get into CD32 gaming, basically where most give up. In addition to the CDM-660 which is converting the video, I went out and bought a nice, professional step-up converter to power the thing. The step up converter was $50, but it's sturdy and, most importantly, it's safe.
I was telling grinchy that I've decided to document my experience with the Amiga 1200 and CD32 library in this thread as I collect games, and I intend to do just that. I ordered Chuck Rock 2 a few days ago, so when it arrives, I'll do a breakdown comparison of it and the Sega CD version.
which broke every couple of months. After three I moved on to this:
Which is still with me today! I always found the way you held these joysticks in particular made pushing UP to jump less of a trial.
I LOVED Chuck Rock and Chuck Rock 2 (that's Son of Chuck, right?).
Grab Bubba 'n Stix if you can, imagine you've played it on the megadrive but still worth a go!
ALso, might be worth changing the thread title to something more apt
PSN: SirGrinchX
Oculus Rift: Sir_Grinch
So while my moddified SMS pad works well enough, I'm in the process of creating the ultimate Amiga controller. I've ordered a 3-button classic Genesis controller to mod out, and I have a laundry list of modifications I plan on doing to it.
First up, I've had a homemade IPAC (interface->PC to Arcade Converter) which is nothing more than a chopped up ATX PS/2 keyboard which I can attach 12-gauge wire to and map keypresses to button inputs. Thus, I can open up the genesis pad, solder connects onto the A button and Start button's terminals, and that'll allow me to map those buttons to whatever keypress I choose. I'm gonna map A to the space bar, and start to both the 1 key, and the P key, so it'll act as a dual 1-player select and pause button. Then I'm gonna add a switch which will make the C button either act as up, or button 2.
The new controller will basically plug into both joypad 1 port, and the keyboard port, and it'll let me play virtually any Amiga game completely with a controller. I'll post pics as I go along with the project.
As for your comments about chuck rock - yes, that's the game you're thinking of. I've always had a soft spot for that series. I got Chuck Rock 1 for my game gear not very long after I picked it up for my birthday in 91, and it's always been one of my favorite GG games. I picked up Chuck Rock 2: Son of Chuck late in the Sega CD's life from toys r us back when they were liquidating their stock (which is when I picked up a good 60% of my sega CD library... amazing times, games could be bought for $1.99) and absolutely loved it. It's a great game - not one that is significantly improved to the point where I could recommend it over the standard cart edition (unlike, say, Earthworm Jim SE or Ecco the Dolphin) but still good enough for me to play the shit out of it.
As I understand it, Chuck Rock 1 was actually developed for the Amiga first, while Chuck Rock 2 was developed for the Genesis as it's lead platform. It kinda shows - Chuck Rock 1 has no sound effects and the title screen music plays over the entire game, while Chuck Rock 2 on the Amiga is missing a bunch of effects (like the cave level doesn't have the darkness which makes it unique... which also makes the monsters on stilts joke not make sense, since they're supposed to look like a giant pair of eyes until you get right up on them). Still great games though.
That title screen music for Chuck Rock 1 is incredible. I remember when I was younger, I'd sometimes turn on my game gear with headphones on and just let the title screen play. While the GG version has no in-game music, at least the Amiga version keeps that incredible title screen music playing throughout the game.
Another game I've been playing a lot of on my amiga? Mr. Nutz. I can't get over how different, and flat out better, the Amiga version of Mr. Nutz is compared to the Genesis and SNES versions. It's a 100% completely different game, and it's much, much better. The Genesis and SNES versions play like a standard ho-hum hop n bop platformer, while the Amiga version is one of the best Sonic clones I've played. I've heard rumors that the Amiga version was going to be ported to the Genesis as Mr. Nutz 2, but it never was released. Shame, because the Amiga version is, thus far, one of the top 5 games I've played for the system.
In other news, I've got down the process of converting disk games into CD32 bootable games. It's a complex process, but it involves using my real amiga to do part of the work, which is neat.
Basically, every cd32 game contains a file in it called startup-sequence, and it's a script which tells the cd32 version of workbench what to do. You can write your own startup-sequence and it'll basically act as a bootup script for your CD32. You can even load programs this way.
Longtime amiga users are probably familiar with WHDLoad - the program which let you install floppy disks on your harddrive and run them so you never had to change disks, in addition to speeding up loading. Well, it'll run on a CD32 as well, and you can change the startup-sequence file to load a game from it. There is even a special WHDLoad32 version for the CD32.
The problem is, in order for it to work, you have to use WHDLoad to actually install the game on a harddrive first, which is where using a real amiga comes into place. I have to use the amiga to install the games to a harddrive, then I can take the file from the harddrive, and burn it onto a CD, and the game will run.
In addition, you can have programs running in the background thanks to WHDLoad, so you can load a bunch of special programs people have written. There is one, for example, which will map one of the buttons on your CD32 controller to spacebar, another will let you map up to a button, and others do things like letting you play music in the background of silent games.
It's all really cool stuff. The only downside? The CD32 has 2 mb of ram, and all this stuff takes up memory. WHDLoad can be whittled down to about 200 kb, and the above programs are written to be tiny, so, when it's all said and done, you have about 1600 kb to work with. That means that super large games, like ones that span 3 or 4 disks, won't fit into ram.
This can be circumvented if you have an SA-X or a SX-32, both of which expand the CD32's memory by adding 4 mb of fast ram. The SX-32 actually replaces the CPU on the CD32 with a faster one, and can be expanded up to 64 mb of ram. So, eventually, I'm gonna grab me one of these lol.
Beyond just having all my games on easy to use disc without the need for swapping, I can also add a splash screen, so I've been giving each game a similar splash screen to give the CD32 a faux splash screen. Sort of like how Sega used to always begin with the Sega logo. Also, since the floppy drive for my CD32 is bulky and kinda ugly (it's beige while the CD32 is deep grey), putting my games on disc allows me to keep that thing off my cd32.
I made a CD version of Golden Axe the other day - I had received it a few days ago in the mail but hadn't tried it out. It's actually a very good port, roughly on par with the genesis version from my initial quick peek, although it runs in a smaller screen, as per usual with CD32 games. The music is WAY better than the genesis version, though, mainly because the Amiga had a banging soundchip that was ahead of even the SNES at the time.
Controls are pretty good. I have one button mapped to the standard button, which attacks in golden axe, then I have another mapped to space bar, which is your magic. Jumping in this game, unfortunately, isn't simply "up," because up is how you move into the screen. In this case, jump is "up+attack" which makes it so I can't map it to a button. It sounds awful, but you get used to it very quickly and it winds up not being a problem at all.
Pretty fun port. golden axe is golden axe, so it's always a fun, short game, but the Amiga port left me impressed considering the hardware. A machine built in 84, released in 85, was able to keep in step with the Sega Genesis, released in 88, and even trump it in music. It's a testament to the foundation the Amiga 500 laid when basically the same hardware was able to be sold in 1994 as an average-power game system. From my experience with the CD32 so far, I'd say that it feels like a system that is somewhere in between the Sega Master System and Sega Genesis in terms of quality and power. Very rough around the edges, but I've really taken to the platform and system because the way things are done, and look, reminds me very much of my two favorite Sega platforms. It helps when the controller looks like this:
That said, I've ordered myself another unit for $215 USD. It comes with another competition pro gamepad and a few more games. Hopefully this is the last time I have to buy a CD32.
PSN: SirGrinchX
Oculus Rift: Sir_Grinch
Luckily I have some holiday money.
Shadow Fighter (Floppy ver)
Beneath a Steel Sky (CD32 ver)
Chaos Engine (CD32 ver)
Mr. Nutz - Hoppin Mad (Floppies)
Quik the Thunder Rabbit (CD32 ver)
Joe & Mac (Floppies)
Wing Commander (CD32 ver -- well technically CDTV ver)
Deadly Streets (CD32 ver)
that brings my game count up to 48 Amiga 500/1200/CD32 games now. I've been keeping my eye out for an SX of some sort - there is an SX-1 on ebay right now for $500, but I'm holding out for an SX32-pro (I'd easily drop a grand for one).
I dunno why I bought this, other than for the ability to say "I have shaq fu. For the Amiga." All the fun of shaq fu, with the added joy of swapping between 5 floppy discs. Yay!
Also an SX-1 is going for $500? Jesus Christ, I should stop leaving mine half plugged in, balanced on beer mats.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Commodore-Amiga-CD32-SX1-Paravision-CD32-A1200-/120828083456?pt=UK_VintageComputing_RL&hash=item1c21ea3d00#ht_3997wt_947
Eep!
PSN: SirGrinchX
Oculus Rift: Sir_Grinch
That said, I'm talking to this dude over at English Amiga who is some sort of hardware guru, who has successfully fitted my analogic floppy expansion with fastram. I'm looking to do my own mod, because if I can get fastram on this thing, then it's just as good as a SX-1 to me. Obviously the SX-32 Pro is the dream find, as you can pop in up to 64 mb of ram and it comes with a faster processor for your CD32, which essentially turns your CD32 into a top-line A1200.
I'm not sure what's more embarrassing on rewatching this though, the fact my voice is breaking or that I received (and was impressed both by the game and the size of the box) Rise of the Robots - CD32. Because I'm a sucker for embarrassment, here's a very geeky British Christmas (1994 maybe?):
PSN: SirGrinchX
Oculus Rift: Sir_Grinch
Haha, that's great. There is video out there of me opening just about every christmas present I got between 1990 until about 1998, including the one where I got my Genesis and Sonic, but I'd never put it online. You're braver than I.
My CF Kit is only 4 mb, but other than that I'm stoked about the A1200. With the blizzard accelerator, I'm supposed to be able to play Alien Breed 3D II at full speed, so we'll see how that goes. Screenshots make it seem just like quake.
Blasphemy! That's like saying Quake 1 and 2 are bad games... (let that sink in for a bit... but for its time, Shadow of the Beast 1 and 2 where the exact same equivalent in technical marvel, nothing came close for quite a while).
PS. A few years ago I managed to find a factory sealed copy of IK+ for the CD32, which I since opened and played and I don't have any pics of it unopened, but I'll leave the thread with this image:
PPS. Not sure if Supercars 2 has been mentioned, but I play it to this day and it's still an amazing game. I would recommend that and Speedball 2 (I've searched for a sealed copy of Speedball 2 for the CD32 for a long while, but never managed to find one).
No, I didn't say that age makes games bad, I said that age makes the things which made us overlook the negative aspects of a game disappear. SotB was a bad game back in the late 80's which was masked by pretty graphics. Those graphics aren't so pretty now, so all we're left with is a bad game.
Quake is a good game with great graphics at the time. The graphical shine is gone, but the good game remains.
There are so many better Amiga games for Amiga owners to hang their hats on besides SotB - give me Lionheart or even Fire and Ice any day of the week over SotB.
Also, I got speedball 2 this morning from my dad, the CD32 version. Awesome!
I've been looking for one of these since I first got my Amiga 500, and I'm very excited that I not only found one, but an unopened one too!
This is going to fucking rule, I have always loved the Gravis gamepad.