ESL! Whose Korea is it anyway?

lesserbeing

So I am on the cusp of going to Korea to teach English. I was wondering if anyone here has any experience doing this. Currently, I have procured an F-4 Visa, a TEFL certification, and a College degree. I am also thinking about heading over to South Korea without a job and doing a job search on the other side of the pond. Any advice from anyone who has done any kind of ESL teaching work would be well appreciated.

krapst78

Having an F-4 Visa will make it much easier to move here without a job lined up. Although I don't teach English, I had a bitch of a time procuring the proper work Visa when I first moved out to Korea. I've since "upgraded" to an F-4 Visa and it makes life here much more comfortable. You should have an easier time opening a bank account, getting a credit card, and a cell phone with your F-4 Visa. You might want to check out http://www.eslcafe.com/ for more details on actually teaching in Korea. From what I've heard, be prepared to get discriminated as an ESL teacher because you are ethnic Korean. A lot of Korean parents here seem to think that you must be Caucasian to teach English properly.

ceres

I thought about doing this a number of years ago and ultimately decided not to for a lot of reasons. Up there on the list was that from everything I've read, if you aren't a citizen you have very little in the way of protection if the school you're working with decides to dick you over. The best advice I can give you is to research the institutions you intend to apply to very carefully, and if possible see if you can track down English teachers who have worked there before. If you can find them (often possible through something like ESLCafe) they are often happy to share their experiences. If you get a good school it can be a great experience... or you can end up at a terrible cram school and it could be the worst time of your life during which you're worked to death and never really paid properly, and there's nothing you can do about it.

lesserbeing

Cool, thanks for the advice. I have an account at Dave's at the moment and am knee deep in that forum. Thanks for the recommendation. Luckily with an F-4 it's easier to leave jobs if the principal turns out to be a total scumbag asshole. I was wondering if either of you knew anything about putting together the proper paperwork for job searching overseas. Do I need an apostille? Just how necessary is an FBI background when looking for a Hakwon job?

Bloodfart

I recommend teaching in China because everything is better.

Look into it.

JNighthawk

ceres wrote:

I thought about doing this a number of years ago and ultimately decided not to for a lot of reasons. Up there on the list was that from everything I've read, if you aren't a citizen you have very little in the way of protection if the school you're working with decides to dick you over. The best advice I can give you is to research the institutions you intend to apply to very carefully, and if possible see if you can track down English teachers who have worked there before. If you can find them (often possible through something like ESLCafe) they are often happy to share their experiences. If you get a good school it can be a great experience... or you can end up at a terrible cram school and it could be the worst time of your life during which you're worked to death and never really paid properly, and there's nothing you can do about it.

My friend ended up at a bad school when teaching English in Korea. The school attempted to steal his passport, threatened to turn him into the police claiming they didn't employ him (to get him jailed for being an illegal immigrant), and told him that his contract was meaningless, because "contracts aren't how business is done in Korea."

YMMV, but remember: you're pretty much alone in a foreign country, having little money and not speaking the language.

Esh

JNighthawk wrote:

ceres wrote:

I thought about doing this a number of years ago and ultimately decided not to for a lot of reasons. Up there on the list was that from everything I've read, if you aren't a citizen you have very little in the way of protection if the school you're working with decides to dick you over. The best advice I can give you is to research the institutions you intend to apply to very carefully, and if possible see if you can track down English teachers who have worked there before. If you can find them (often possible through something like ESLCafe) they are often happy to share their experiences. If you get a good school it can be a great experience... or you can end up at a terrible cram school and it could be the worst time of your life during which you're worked to death and never really paid properly, and there's nothing you can do about it.

My friend ended up at a bad school when teaching English in Korea. The school attempted to steal his passport, threatened to turn him into the police claiming they didn't employ him (to get him jailed for being an illegal immigrant), and told him that his contract was meaningless, because "contracts aren't how business is done in Korea."

YMMV, but remember: you're pretty much alone in a foreign country, having little money and not speaking the language.

He might speak Korean seeing as his family is Korean (not that that guarantees anything).

taliosfalcon

Bloodfart wrote:

I recommend teaching in China because everything is better.

Look into it.

except the pay and housing

ceres

JNighthawk wrote:

ceres wrote:

I thought about doing this a number of years ago and ultimately decided not to for a lot of reasons. Up there on the list was that from everything I've read, if you aren't a citizen you have very little in the way of protection if the school you're working with decides to dick you over. The best advice I can give you is to research the institutions you intend to apply to very carefully, and if possible see if you can track down English teachers who have worked there before. If you can find them (often possible through something like ESLCafe) they are often happy to share their experiences. If you get a good school it can be a great experience... or you can end up at a terrible cram school and it could be the worst time of your life during which you're worked to death and never really paid properly, and there's nothing you can do about it.

My friend ended up at a bad school when teaching English in Korea. The school attempted to steal his passport, threatened to turn him into the police claiming they didn't employ him (to get him jailed for being an illegal immigrant), and told him that his contract was meaningless, because "contracts aren't how business is done in Korea."

YMMV, but remember: you're pretty much alone in a foreign country, having little money and not speaking the language.

I've heard an unfortunate number of stories like this with Korea. There will be horror stories from any program like this, but the ones from people who have worked in Korea really seem to take the cake.

Do your research really carefully before choosing a school.

L|ama

the somethingawful forums thread about korea in the travel subforum has a decent bit of information if you've got an account there (and I think you can get to it without an account atm)

Bloodfart

taliosfalcon wrote:

Bloodfart wrote:

I recommend teaching in China because everything is better.

Look into it.

except the pay and housing

I'm sorry but you are poorly informed.

The pay is excellent, even more so when you factor in the low expenses. Living in China is a breeze compared to the west. Most teaching English jobs start around 12,000rmb per month (near 2,000USD).

Many schools offer accommodations but renting a place of your own or with room-mates is simple and easily affordable.

edit: the best part is how the majority of Chinese schools don't have a clue about things like 'skill', 'experience', or 'qualifications'. Allowing a lot of foreigners to get jobs just by being white (unfortunately easier), and speaking English.

Yaitsaj

Hey! I've been teaching English in Korea for 2 years now and it's truly hit or miss here.

My first school actually closed down 3 months into my first contract. Instead of paying me the money the owed me, they attempted to wait me out until my visa expired (two weeks after your contract end, for whatever reason). I managed to snag a quick desperate job so I could stay in the country. I had to go to Japan for a visa run, but when I came back the look on their face (Oh man, he's still in the country) was pretty priceless. I had to threaten to sue them to finally get my money.

The second job was a little less shady. I found out near the end that I was actually being paid under the table (nothing on the books/taxes), and they never put anything in my pension (as required by law and such). Instead of threatening to sue, I ended up cutting them a deal taking off about 5% of what they owed me (about 400 dollars) to actually get my money.

FINALLY this job that i'm at now is amazing, but the difference is this is a proper school, not a hagwon (private academy) those other two were.

Basically moral of the story is IF you're going to teach, don't work at a hagwon. If you look on Dave's ESL or any other of the sites, they're almost all hagwons. There is a reason for that.

ALSO, if you have an f-4, and your wife has connections, you should just private tutor. rate's run from 35-50 an hour on average. I just referred a friend to a 60 per hour.

If you have any questions, you should pm me or email me.

Yaitsaj

Apologies, I forgot to mention. Almost all government teaching job (Epik and such) pay about 2m won, or $1800 a month, plus free housing and other perks. At the end of the year you get a paycheck, pension ($2000 dollars) and severance ($2000), which sort of makes up for that 1800 dollars a month thing.

Living cost depends on what you do.

Taya

I worked in Korea for nearly two years and I had a great experience. It's true that you can end with a terrible school but they aren't going to kidnap you for slave labour or anything. If your school tries to screw you over, just quit and try again. EPIK deals with public schools and most people will consider that your best option. Personally, I loved the hagwon where I worked in my first year much better than public school but I'm in the minority.

I would avoid Dave's ESL Cafe unless you have a specific question you need answered. That forum is poison.

zrikz

Shoot me a PM or email. I live in korea, I'm in the Army, but I've made friends with quite a few ESL teachers who have been here for years and just love it.

kaliyama

Taya wrote:

I worked in Korea for nearly two years and I had a great experience. It's true that you can end with a terrible school but they aren't going to kidnap you for slave labour or anything. If your school tries to screw you over, just quit and try again. EPIK deals with public schools and most people will consider that your best option. Personally, I loved the hagwon where I worked in my first year much better than public school but I'm in the minority.

I would avoid Dave's ESL Cafe unless you have a specific question you need answered. That forum is poison.

not knowing anything on the topic, why is Dave's poison?

Yaitsaj

The site has a strong reputation amongst esl teachers here for being full of negativity. Basically people who are angry post there and give the wrong perception as to what it's like living and teaching here (fuckin great).