Vega actually looks like people who play femshep's characterization of maleshep
Eh? I don't think I've ever characterized maleshep like that. I just thought that Jennifer Hale gave the better performance. Though I do agree with those who say that Mark Meer did a better job in ME2 - but I still think Jennifer Hale's performance was superior.
Cambiata on
Peace to fashion police, I wear my heart
On my sleeve, let the runway start
0
DragkoniasThat Guy Who Does StuffYou Know, There. Registered Userregular
edited November 2011
The fact that Vega is more buff than my Shep annoys me.
I better be able to hit the gym before stopping the Reapers.
Edit: I didn't mean to double post. I thought the forum ate my last post and it didn't appear until I posted this.
I said pretty clearly I'm sad, and that implies disappointment, yes, but not wrath. My style of dealing with it, will mirror how I've been dealing with bioware since dragon age 2, not funneling parts of my stacks of money dollars into their content platforms, and occasionally posting on the internet like, hey bioware, plz make with the baldurs gate style again, check it out, I'll pay you money dollars(that this is increasingly frequently met with hurf durf u mad bro, is disheartening, but hey, lolopinions).
I hope old school RPG systems go the way of classic adventure games - dead like the dinosaurs. At the very least that may cut down on people whining and kvetching that their favorite genre is no longer as popular as it once was. It was popular because that's all that was around due to the limitations of the technology. Now that games can actually take your skill and control into account to determine success, maybe we don't need games with role playing elements to get bogged down by stat sheets and dice rolls.
I think the Baldur's Gate series is one of the greatest PC games of all time. I've played Wizardry, Ultima, NWN, IWD and most of the 16 bit Final Fantasy games. But it's been plainly obvious over the last several years that the "old school" RPG is an endangered species. It's stale and there's not large market for it anymore. Maybe as gamers we're poorer for that, but there's nothing as pointless or aggravating as listening to the same voices complain in thread upon thread about what these new games SHOULD have been. Skyrim, Fallout, The Witcher, Mass Effect are all different approaches to the new style of Action RPG. Complaining that these games don't meet my expectations of what an RPG should be doesn't make me an insightful torch-bearer for a beloved genre, it makes me an entitled douche.
Support games that do keep the old RPG spirit alive, promote them in message boards and blogs. Talk up the aspects of action RPGs that harken back to the days of D20 rolls. Don't continue to play the wounded victim card because all that line of thought proves is that the "demographic" of classic RPG fans is ignored because it is inconsequential at best, irrelevant at worst.
Vega actually looks like people who play femshep's characterization of maleshep
Eh? I don't think I've ever characterized maleshep like that. I just thought that Jennifer Hale gave the better performance. Though I do agree with those who say that Mark Meer did a better job in ME2 - but I still think Jennifer Hale's performance was superior.
Sorry, I actually meant defaultmaleshep. Vandershep. Got my -sheps confused! And I guess I don't mean all people, just a vocal bunch and Tycho from what I recall.
Question! I didn't really follow ME2 before it was released..was it ever revealed that Garrus would be back and/or that he was Archangel?
I mean, it was pretty easy to figure out even while playing the mission once someone said that Archangel was a Turian, but if they released some pictures and info before the game was released I guess nobody was surprised.
Add me on Switch: 7795-5541-4699
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CambiataCommander ShepardThe likes of which even GAWD has never seenRegistered Userregular
I played classic RPGs "back in the day." I played the shit out of them - they were almost the only type of game I would play. But that was because I love story above all else in a game. I never liked inventory management, dice rolls for hits, trying to keep track of which pair of boots would be best for me to use, and the best way to utilize str, con, dex, etc. stats. I like where Bioware is going with Mass Effect because getting rid of those tedious elements has made the game much more enjoyable and, dare I say it, rich for me. There are still stats and customization, but they are done in way that makes more sense to me and actually seems like it might be fun.
I guess the main thing I don't get about classic RPG fans who don't like the evolution of the RPG is: Why not just play tabletop RPGs? There you can roll dice, and pull out damage tables, and make tiny, nearly insignificant modifications to your heart's content, and you'll be able to do that forever. With the added bonus that you do real roleplaying, with other people who are also roleplaying. Dice rolls for hits is something that always seemed incredibly out of place in a video game, and jarringly removed me from the 'roleplay' aspect, since I could clearly see my sword hitting the mook, regardless of what the dice said. At least when you tabletop RPG, you can come up with the visual in your head (and roleplay it!) for what happens when you roll a 1.
Peace to fashion police, I wear my heart
On my sleeve, let the runway start
Question! I didn't really follow ME2 before it was released..was it ever revealed that Garrus would be back and/or that he was Archangel?
I mean, it was pretty easy to figure out even while playing the mission once someone said that Archangel was a Turian, but if they released some pictures and info before the game was released I guess nobody was surprised.
Nah, that was supposed to be a mystery but got leaked a bit before the game came out. Long enough to let me do a runthrough of ME1 with Garrus and Tali. Or I'm misremembering.
They released info on Tali, Grunt, Thane, Jack SUBJECT ZERO for sure and some others I forgot. Legion was sort of 'unofficially' announced, but I'm not sure about the others.
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DragkoniasThat Guy Who Does StuffYou Know, There. Registered Userregular
Question! I didn't really follow ME2 before it was released..was it ever revealed that Garrus would be back and/or that he was Archangel?
I mean, it was pretty easy to figure out even while playing the mission once someone said that Archangel was a Turian, but if they released some pictures and info before the game was released I guess nobody was surprised.
...Yes. It was spoiled so bad that by the time I played ME2 I'd already seen the Garrus intro like 6 different times.
Dragkonias on
0
CambiataCommander ShepardThe likes of which even GAWD has never seenRegistered Userregular
Question! I didn't really follow ME2 before it was released..was it ever revealed that Garrus would be back and/or that he was Archangel?
I mean, it was pretty easy to figure out even while playing the mission once someone said that Archangel was a Turian, but if they released some pictures and info before the game was released I guess nobody was surprised.
...Yes. It was spoiled so bad that by the time I played ME2 I'd already seen the Garrus intro like 6 different times.
I'm really glad I wasn't anticipating ME2 in any respect, so when I finally played it, I played it with no foreknowledge of who would be there or what to expect.
Of course now that I am anticipating ME3, I can't help but spoil myself on everything. Damnit.
Peace to fashion police, I wear my heart
On my sleeve, let the runway start
0
DragkoniasThat Guy Who Does StuffYou Know, There. Registered Userregular
edited November 2011
Well at least knowing Garrus was Archangel wasn't as bad as knowing you could kill Wrex in ME1.
I said pretty clearly I'm sad, and that implies disappointment, yes, but not wrath. My style of dealing with it, will mirror how I've been dealing with bioware since dragon age 2, not funneling parts of my stacks of money dollars into their content platforms, and occasionally posting on the internet like, hey bioware, plz make with the baldurs gate style again, check it out, I'll pay you money dollars(that this is increasingly frequently met with hurf durf u mad bro, is disheartening, but hey, lolopinions).
I hope old school RPG systems go the way of classic adventure games - dead like the dinosaurs. At the very least that may cut down on people whining and kvetching that their favorite genre is no longer as popular as it once was. It was popular because that's all that was around due to the limitations of the technology. Now that games can actually take your skill and control into account to determine success, maybe we don't need games with role playing elements to get bogged down by stat sheets and dice rolls.
I think the Baldur's Gate series is one of the greatest PC games of all time. I've played Wizardry, Ultima, NWN, IWD and most of the 16 bit Final Fantasy games. But it's been plainly obvious over the last several years that the "old school" RPG is an endangered species. It's stale and there's not large market for it anymore. Maybe as gamers we're poorer for that, but there's nothing as pointless or aggravating as listening to the same voices complain in thread upon thread about what these new games SHOULD have been. Skyrim, Fallout, The Witcher, Mass Effect are all different approaches to the new style of Action RPG. Complaining that these games don't meet my expectations of what an RPG should be doesn't make me an insightful torch-bearer for a beloved genre, it makes me an entitled douche.
Support games that do keep the old RPG spirit alive, promote them in message boards and blogs. Talk up the aspects of action RPGs that harken back to the days of D20 rolls. Don't continue to play the wounded victim card because all that line of thought proves is that the "demographic" of classic RPG fans is ignored because it is inconsequential at best, irrelevant at worst.
What I can never figure out is what did ME2 get rid of from ME1 that suddenly made it "not old school RPG"?
I hear this complaint from tons of crazy RPG fans and the only thing I can determine is that the main thing Bioware changed was they ditched the inventory system for a more streamlined one and shifted around the skill system a little.
0
DragkoniasThat Guy Who Does StuffYou Know, There. Registered Userregular
Oh yeah...they were talking about how they made Garrus and Tali romance options. Not sure if it had a picture though.
Oh yeah...they were talking about how they made Garrus and Tali romance options. Not sure if it had a picture though.
Wasn't Tali not confirmed as a romance until after the game launched? I think they announced Jack and Miranda, and Jacob + Garrus, but all they said was '3 romances per gender' and didn't explicitly announce Tali and Thane. I remember there was some contention about it right around launch at least when the Talimancers were going insane.
looking back, ME2's hype was weird because they deliberately tried to mislead us several times
like Legion was painted as an antagonist that stalked Shepard throughout the game
they showed Garrus' mission a lot but muted all mentions of the word "Archangel", and it wasn't even clear if Shepard was recruiting him or if he was just there as a cameo
Jack was always called Subject Zero even though she almost never is in-game
Grunt being an experiment was not mentioned at all even though he is introduced that way in-game
What I can never figure out is what did ME2 get rid of from ME1 that suddenly made it "not old school RPG"?
I hear this complaint from tons of crazy RPG fans and the only thing I can determine is that the main thing Bioware changed was they ditched the inventory system for a more streamlined one and shifted around the skill system a little.
That's essentially it, but you need to include open world exploration in there as well. The important second point is that Bioware chose to streamline (throw out what didn't work) instead of revise (try the same thing in a different way). This makes for an easy argument that they've "dumbed down things for the CoD bro's." You could also say they threw out crap that was needlessly tedious and didn't add anything substantial to the gameplay - but hey, that was a very pretty skybox on barely inhabited planet #23.
I empathize with that argument, but what's ridiculous to the point of insanity is that ME3 is bringing some of those elements back in. Yet we need to try the developers for crimes against humanity because the game still isn't going to be RPG "enough."
MetalMagus on
0
DragkoniasThat Guy Who Does StuffYou Know, There. Registered Userregular
Oh yeah...they were talking about how they made Garrus and Tali romance options. Not sure if it had a picture though.
Wasn't Tali not confirmed as a romance until after the game launched? I think they announced Jack and Miranda, and Jacob + Garrus, but all they said was '3 romances per gender' and didn't explicitly announce Tali and Thane. I remember there was some contention about it right around launch at least when the Talimancers were going insane.
Naw. I distinctly remember Casey Hudson talking about it once.
Basically how like he and his team never expected people to want characters like Tali as romance options because she was "a chick with chicken feet." He was went on to talk about how Garrus and Tali were the two most popular squadmates in the first game.
0
CambiataCommander ShepardThe likes of which even GAWD has never seenRegistered Userregular
Vega actually looks like people who play femshep's characterization of maleshep
Eh? I don't think I've ever characterized maleshep like that. I just thought that Jennifer Hale gave the better performance. Though I do agree with those who say that Mark Meer did a better job in ME2 - but I still think Jennifer Hale's performance was superior.
Sorry, I actually meant defaultmaleshep. Vandershep. Got my -sheps confused! And I guess I don't mean all people, just a vocal bunch and Tycho from what I recall.
People consider Sheploo a meathead? He's (based on) a super-hot male model! Who is not very good at smiling!
My only regret about preferring FemShep is that I can't play a character as hot and beautifully modeled as Sheploo. And I don't understand how or why any one playing MaleShep would ever use the character creator. But everyone has their own likes, I guess.
Peace to fashion police, I wear my heart
On my sleeve, let the runway start
if somebody starts out in one mode and decides they want to start affecting the story or want more challenge in combat, they can just go into the menu and change it
Drakensang river of time. Avernum 6? Xenoblade chronicles? Divinity 2. These games aren't a decade old, and all of them have a decent degree of customization.
You don't need to take a hacksaw to RPG elements to improve and polish them. Xenoblade chronicles has one of the most stat heavy rpg systems I've seen in a bit. While it's absolutely adorable you'd apply the special snowflake argument, I, as a fan of classic PC RPGs in general, have been reminded over the last 5 years just how not-special, marginalized, and overall ignored, if not outright mocked my demographic is, so yeah, thanks dude, I noticed, I think we all did?
Needless to say, I saw where bioware was going after awakenings. I won't buy DA2 at any price, won't be buying ME3 despite owning the other two on multiple platforms, and won't be getting the old republic. Instead I'll be tossing cash at Jeff Vogel, Runic games and Pirahna bytes.
Again. That's the thing.
Maybe they aren't trying to fit their game into what you feel an RPG is. Maybe they're trying to create their own kind of game.
Mass Effect has never been a classic RPG. It's always been an action-based one. And since it is for the most part a genre that's only been picking up steam in recent years there have been growing pains.
If you can't accept that games...and hell...everything changes, I can't help you.
As for you not buying Mass Effect 3, well, I mean that's your decision and I'm sure those people you're tossing your cash at will appreciate it. I don't know why you're following a thread for the game though. I mean when I don't want to buy stuff I usually ignore it.
That's nice, then don't call it an RPG.
Call it some other nifty new "genre" they are trying to create. Though I still find the genre argument silly, as it's pretty clear from 1 > 3 it's pandering to more marketable demographics. I don't see it as an artistic decision, but a business decision. So of course there's flack when Bioware is trying to redefine something that's already clearly defined in many gamer minds, and most of the decisions can be boiled down to $$$. So yes, people will be spiteful and wail against Bioware's "new" path. And there will be others who just go with the flow because hey, who cares?
0
DragkoniasThat Guy Who Does StuffYou Know, There. Registered Userregular
edited November 2011
One thing I'm wondering about Action mode is if you'll be able to affect it towards the end. Like will it also default to neutral or will it be something like Paragon-Neutral-Renegade.
Drakensang river of time. Avernum 6? Xenoblade chronicles? Divinity 2. These games aren't a decade old, and all of them have a decent degree of customization.
You don't need to take a hacksaw to RPG elements to improve and polish them. Xenoblade chronicles has one of the most stat heavy rpg systems I've seen in a bit. While it's absolutely adorable you'd apply the special snowflake argument, I, as a fan of classic PC RPGs in general, have been reminded over the last 5 years just how not-special, marginalized, and overall ignored, if not outright mocked my demographic is, so yeah, thanks dude, I noticed, I think we all did?
Needless to say, I saw where bioware was going after awakenings. I won't buy DA2 at any price, won't be buying ME3 despite owning the other two on multiple platforms, and won't be getting the old republic. Instead I'll be tossing cash at Jeff Vogel, Runic games and Pirahna bytes.
Again. That's the thing.
Maybe they aren't trying to fit their game into what you feel an RPG is. Maybe they're trying to create their own kind of game.
Mass Effect has never been a classic RPG. It's always been an action-based one. And since it is for the most part a genre that's only been picking up steam in recent years there have been growing pains.
If you can't accept that games...and hell...everything changes, I can't help you.
As for you not buying Mass Effect 3, well, I mean that's your decision and I'm sure those people you're tossing your cash at will appreciate it. I don't know why you're following a thread for the game though. I mean when I don't want to buy stuff I usually ignore it.
That's nice, then don't call it an RPG.
Call it some other nifty new "genre" they are trying to create. Though I still find the genre argument silly, as it's pretty clear from 1 > 3 it's pandering to more marketable demographics. I don't see it as an artistic decision, but a business decision. So of course there's flack when Bioware is trying to redefine something that's already clearly defined in many gamer minds, and most of the decisions can be boiled down to $$$. So yes, people will be spiteful and wail against Bioware's "new" path. And there will be others who just go with the flow because hey, who cares?
Please. RPG is such a loose term these days that the only people who make a big deal out of it are people trying to prove some kind of point.
That being said, I know it stings people's ears to hear this, but yes Mass Effect has enough RPG tropes that it can be classified within that genre.
One thing I'm wondering about Action mode is if you'll be able to affect it towards the end. Like will it also default to neutral or will it be something like Paragon-Neutral-Renegade.
It would be cool this was affected by your background, like in ME1 where it affected your starting paragon/renegade points
Posts
What matters is Batarians and whether or not they will be killed.
Or...in ME3...possible love interests.
Eh? I don't think I've ever characterized maleshep like that. I just thought that Jennifer Hale gave the better performance. Though I do agree with those who say that Mark Meer did a better job in ME2 - but I still think Jennifer Hale's performance was superior.
On my sleeve, let the runway start
I better be able to hit the gym before stopping the Reapers.
Edit: I didn't mean to double post. I thought the forum ate my last post and it didn't appear until I posted this.
Edit2: Now my first post disappeared. Weird.
Likewise, this is not the place to be a smug cock to those who disagree with your criticisms of where Bioware is taking things.
Be civil or don't post.
He looks more like a cyborg than Shepard does though.
Why does he have a borg eye?
Screaming "I was the generic token human on board damn you!"
Vega can't be the generic token human...Kaiden's back.
I hope old school RPG systems go the way of classic adventure games - dead like the dinosaurs. At the very least that may cut down on people whining and kvetching that their favorite genre is no longer as popular as it once was. It was popular because that's all that was around due to the limitations of the technology. Now that games can actually take your skill and control into account to determine success, maybe we don't need games with role playing elements to get bogged down by stat sheets and dice rolls.
I think the Baldur's Gate series is one of the greatest PC games of all time. I've played Wizardry, Ultima, NWN, IWD and most of the 16 bit Final Fantasy games. But it's been plainly obvious over the last several years that the "old school" RPG is an endangered species. It's stale and there's not large market for it anymore. Maybe as gamers we're poorer for that, but there's nothing as pointless or aggravating as listening to the same voices complain in thread upon thread about what these new games SHOULD have been. Skyrim, Fallout, The Witcher, Mass Effect are all different approaches to the new style of Action RPG. Complaining that these games don't meet my expectations of what an RPG should be doesn't make me an insightful torch-bearer for a beloved genre, it makes me an entitled douche.
Support games that do keep the old RPG spirit alive, promote them in message boards and blogs. Talk up the aspects of action RPGs that harken back to the days of D20 rolls. Don't continue to play the wounded victim card because all that line of thought proves is that the "demographic" of classic RPG fans is ignored because it is inconsequential at best, irrelevant at worst.
Sorry, I actually meant defaultmaleshep. Vandershep. Got my -sheps confused! And I guess I don't mean all people, just a vocal bunch and Tycho from what I recall.
It isn't? Now I'm confused
Question! I didn't really follow ME2 before it was released..was it ever revealed that Garrus would be back and/or that he was Archangel?
I mean, it was pretty easy to figure out even while playing the mission once someone said that Archangel was a Turian, but if they released some pictures and info before the game was released I guess nobody was surprised.
I guess the main thing I don't get about classic RPG fans who don't like the evolution of the RPG is: Why not just play tabletop RPGs? There you can roll dice, and pull out damage tables, and make tiny, nearly insignificant modifications to your heart's content, and you'll be able to do that forever. With the added bonus that you do real roleplaying, with other people who are also roleplaying. Dice rolls for hits is something that always seemed incredibly out of place in a video game, and jarringly removed me from the 'roleplay' aspect, since I could clearly see my sword hitting the mook, regardless of what the dice said. At least when you tabletop RPG, you can come up with the visual in your head (and roleplay it!) for what happens when you roll a 1.
On my sleeve, let the runway start
Nah, that was supposed to be a mystery but got leaked a bit before the game came out. Long enough to let me do a runthrough of ME1 with Garrus and Tali. Or I'm misremembering.
They released info on Tali, Grunt, Thane, Jack SUBJECT ZERO for sure and some others I forgot. Legion was sort of 'unofficially' announced, but I'm not sure about the others.
...Yes. It was spoiled so bad that by the time I played ME2 I'd already seen the Garrus intro like 6 different times.
I'm really glad I wasn't anticipating ME2 in any respect, so when I finally played it, I played it with no foreknowledge of who would be there or what to expect.
Of course now that I am anticipating ME3, I can't help but spoil myself on everything. Damnit.
On my sleeve, let the runway start
What I can never figure out is what did ME2 get rid of from ME1 that suddenly made it "not old school RPG"?
I hear this complaint from tons of crazy RPG fans and the only thing I can determine is that the main thing Bioware changed was they ditched the inventory system for a more streamlined one and shifted around the skill system a little.
Wasn't Tali not confirmed as a romance until after the game launched? I think they announced Jack and Miranda, and Jacob + Garrus, but all they said was '3 romances per gender' and didn't explicitly announce Tali and Thane. I remember there was some contention about it right around launch at least when the Talimancers were going insane.
like Legion was painted as an antagonist that stalked Shepard throughout the game
they showed Garrus' mission a lot but muted all mentions of the word "Archangel", and it wasn't even clear if Shepard was recruiting him or if he was just there as a cameo
Jack was always called Subject Zero even though she almost never is in-game
Grunt being an experiment was not mentioned at all even though he is introduced that way in-game
That's essentially it, but you need to include open world exploration in there as well. The important second point is that Bioware chose to streamline (throw out what didn't work) instead of revise (try the same thing in a different way). This makes for an easy argument that they've "dumbed down things for the CoD bro's." You could also say they threw out crap that was needlessly tedious and didn't add anything substantial to the gameplay - but hey, that was a very pretty skybox on barely inhabited planet #23.
I empathize with that argument, but what's ridiculous to the point of insanity is that ME3 is bringing some of those elements back in. Yet we need to try the developers for crimes against humanity because the game still isn't going to be RPG "enough."
Naw. I distinctly remember Casey Hudson talking about it once.
Basically how like he and his team never expected people to want characters like Tali as romance options because she was "a chick with chicken feet." He was went on to talk about how Garrus and Tali were the two most popular squadmates in the first game.
People consider Sheploo a meathead? He's (based on) a super-hot male model! Who is not very good at smiling!
My only regret about preferring FemShep is that I can't play a character as hot and beautifully modeled as Sheploo. And I don't understand how or why any one playing MaleShep would ever use the character creator. But everyone has their own likes, I guess.
On my sleeve, let the runway start
Not gonna lie, I'm totally gonna do Story Mode
if somebody starts out in one mode and decides they want to start affecting the story or want more challenge in combat, they can just go into the menu and change it
Nothing but conversations and QTEs
Bioware is ran by the Goodfellas.
Battlenet ID: MildC#11186 - If I'm in the game, send me an invite at anytime and I'll play.
And action mode starts you off on normal difficulty.
Puh-leaze.
it
christ
it literally changes nothing about gameplay except that dialogue choices are predetermined
That's nice, then don't call it an RPG.
Call it some other nifty new "genre" they are trying to create. Though I still find the genre argument silly, as it's pretty clear from 1 > 3 it's pandering to more marketable demographics. I don't see it as an artistic decision, but a business decision. So of course there's flack when Bioware is trying to redefine something that's already clearly defined in many gamer minds, and most of the decisions can be boiled down to $$$. So yes, people will be spiteful and wail against Bioware's "new" path. And there will be others who just go with the flow because hey, who cares?
Please. RPG is such a loose term these days that the only people who make a big deal out of it are people trying to prove some kind of point.
That being said, I know it stings people's ears to hear this, but yes Mass Effect has enough RPG tropes that it can be classified within that genre.
It would be cool this was affected by your background, like in ME1 where it affected your starting paragon/renegade points