Lastly, stop being such a bad mannered fuck. Seriously, it makes everyone hate you. How can you even post that replay and not be ashamed of that?
Meh.
And also, I do the gate/robo/gate build precisely because about 90% of the terrans I face on the ladder will all in at the point this guy did, or sooner. I can't hold a marine / scv all in with a 1 gate fast expand, I don't have the micro. I can't hold a marine marauder all in without immortals, and I can't hold a bunker rush... ever. That stim timing push you mentioned? Yeah, thats like... every other game vs terran. Of course I'm gonna use a build that defends it well. I see a second command centre once in a blue moon. I seriously doubt half of the terrans in the world have ever even considered building one.
then how about fucking practicing that stuff, looking up ways to defend shit, rather than your non-stop ineccesant fucking bitching
seriously
if you do not have the micro to do something successfully, keep fucking practicing it until you do
guess what
you lose in this game
you lose a lot
especially when trying new stuff and trying to improve
but that's neccessary
to actually learn the new stuff
or you could just keep bitching, and when people give you advice you can just go 'NO THAT'S IMPOSSIBLE MIIICROOOOOOOOOOO', because i guess that's productive???
Lastly, stop being such a bad mannered fuck. Seriously, it makes everyone hate you. How can you even post that replay and not be ashamed of that?
Meh.
And also, I do the gate/robo/gate build precisely because about 90% of the terrans I face on the ladder will all in at the point this guy did, or sooner. I can't hold a marine / scv all in with a 1 gate fast expand, I don't have the micro. I can't hold a marine marauder all in without immortals, and I can't hold a bunker rush... ever. That stim timing push you mentioned? Yeah, thats like... every other game vs terran. Of course I'm gonna use a build that defends it well. I see a second command centre once in a blue moon. I seriously doubt half of the terrans in the world have ever even considered building one.
Jaziek, we're telling you what's wrong with your play. Giving you advice that you've asked for. If you're not capable of implementing it, practice until you can, and stop bitching. Having a negative attitude of "I can't do that" will fuck you over at so many more things that just SC2. The only way to fix mechanics is practice them, and until they're at a decent place, everything else is fucked.
So practice, micro maps, play 4s or customs when you're pissed - but coming here to bitch about how you CAN'T do basic micro will earn you no respect whatsoever.
why is it that i see people FFE on antiga from the ramp to the nexus as opposed to the natural's ramp
it seems narrow enough
Cannons at nexus serve double duty. Initial protection + anti muta/runby. Some people wall off at natural, but there's a tradeoff.
That's a very good point!
I figure there's three things to worry about - 6pooling (cannon in mineral line), roach rush and baneling bust (in both cases more cannons at wall?) Is that correct?
why is it that i see people FFE on antiga from the ramp to the nexus as opposed to the natural's ramp
it seems narrow enough
Cannons at nexus serve double duty. Initial protection + anti muta/runby. Some people wall off at natural, but there's a tradeoff.
That's a very good point!
I figure there's three things to worry about - 6pooling (cannon in mineral line), roach rush and baneling bust (in both cases more cannons at wall?) Is that correct?
Uh, I really suck at PvZ so I don't really have an answer. I have seen people get lings in their main and just abandon it for the natural before, which only works if your cannons are there.
Project CHEESE which was inspired from some healthy discussion with Keamien about learning the game via pressure builds.
As of right now, I hold a 28% win rate in ZvZ, a 51% winrate in ZvP and a 68% winrate in ZvT
I probably won't change how I play ZvT, since what I am doing seems to be working (ice fisherish opener, roach/infestor into BROOOOOODLOOOOORDS)
The other two matchups, though, I am going to learn an all-in or two and JUST play those and see how this affects my overall win rate. I am silver playing against high golds and beating them at the moment, but my winrate isn't quite where it needs to be to get promoted.
So this should be interesting.
Any advice, guys?
You should only all-in sometimes in ZvZ - there are a few situations where most cheese is autolose, unless your ling/bling micro is superb (close air metal/shattered, somewhat true on shakuras). You should recognize the cases where it's very hard for them to scout it with the first OL (13/13 is very good on TDA), and cheese there, rather than all the time.
why is it that i see people FFE on antiga from the ramp to the nexus as opposed to the natural's ramp
it seems narrow enough
Cannons at nexus serve double duty. Initial protection + anti muta/runby. Some people wall off at natural, but there's a tradeoff.
That's a very good point!
I figure there's three things to worry about - 6pooling (cannon in mineral line), roach rush and baneling bust (in both cases more cannons at wall?) Is that correct?
Uh, I really suck at PvZ so I don't really have an answer. I have seen people get lings in their main and just abandon it for the natural before, which only works if your cannons are there.
As a zerg, I prefer Toss wall from their first ramp to nexus. It leaves them more open to early pressure, guaranteeing I can take my third with little worry.
I've taken games by doing either early roach pressure (where they skimp on cannons and only get 1) or just sending in a lot of slow lings (hits before cannon is done) since they usually have one zealot and some sentries.
Also allows for easier scouting of unit composition into mid game than not being able to poke up a fully walled ramp.
why is it that i see people FFE on antiga from the ramp to the nexus as opposed to the natural's ramp
it seems narrow enough
Cannons at nexus serve double duty. Initial protection + anti muta/runby. Some people wall off at natural, but there's a tradeoff.
That's a very good point!
I figure there's three things to worry about - 6pooling (cannon in mineral line), roach rush and baneling bust (in both cases more cannons at wall?) Is that correct?
Uh, I really suck at PvZ so I don't really have an answer. I have seen people get lings in their main and just abandon it for the natural before, which only works if your cannons are there.
As a zerg, I prefer Toss wall from their first ramp to nexus. It leaves them more open to early pressure, guaranteeing I can take my third with little worry.
I've taken games by doing either early roach pressure (where they skimp on cannons and only get 1) or just sending in a lot of slow lings (hits before cannon is done) since they usually have one zealot and some sentries.
Also allows for easier scouting of unit composition into mid game than not being able to poke up a fully walled ramp.
I love it when toss does nexus before forge, you can punish that so hard w/o taking an economic hit
B.net: Kusanku
0
Euphemonitsudemo sagashiteiruyodokka ni kimi no sugata woRegistered Userregular
Please get me your lineups as soon as you can for Feb 24 - March 2! MMMig, you're playing Vari, and Kedinik and the Professional Photon Cyclists are taking on Meeks' JustCheese League.
Generalísimo de Fuerzas Armadas de la República Argentina
0
VariableMouth CongressStroke Me Lady FameRegistered Userregular
Salvation should be getting those games in today according to our discussion last night. if he wins we have our ace match.
if pants has any faith in tanner he will just throw the series against sal.
also my phone auto corrects tanner to manner which is priceless
Now that my thumb is no longer broke I'm returning to SC2, and I want to learn Zerg(!)
I'm learning 14 pool into expand for ZvP, hatch first for ZvT and ZvZ, with adjustments for what I scout.
A few questions for our resident Z's:
1) What's your hotkey setup? I played a couple games last night to get the basic feel for the race, and I liked having individual hatches hotkeyed and just clicking queens for larva injects. Is there a better scheme for this?
2) How do you handle rally points for your larvae? I kept ending up with drones idling, or overlords in my mineral lines.
3) If your opponent early expands, what time do you tend to throw down your third?
Please get me your lineups as soon as you can for Feb 24 - March 2! MMMig, you're playing Vari, and Kedinik and the Professional Photon Cyclists are taking on Meeks' JustCheese League.
Done!
And I have Vari's team down as "Team Prison Yard"
Is marine-thor a relevant build vs zerg. I went up against a platinum terran yesterday who went marine thor, and my initial impression is that it is not.
1) it's a lot easier to just hotkey all your hatcheries to one thing (4 or 5 or whatever), and hotkey all your queens to 6 or something and then just tab (no idea what this is by default, most people change it to tab, caps lock, space bar or something) through your queens for injects
late game you'll have way too many hatcheries to hotkey them all invidually and/or be able to get to them comfortably and quickly, and you really shouldn't invidiually click on your queens (i do this but i am bad)
2) well you have two rally points, put the drone rally point (orange one) to the minerals, and the unit rally (white one) to where you put your units to go to (note: doesn't apply to queens, they just pop out of the hatchery) - i guess the reason you're having trouble with this is because you are individually hotkeying all your hatcheries, if you have them all on one it's a lot simpler
i've started to ctrl-click eggs and add them to my control groups before they hatch (for lings and mutas) but you really don't need to do that, it's something you can worry about later
3) depends on matchup
vs protoss if they forge fast expand the most common response is to take a quick third anywhere from like 4-6:00, maaaaddd drone, throw down a roach warren, evo chamber, and start teching to lair just before teching to lair, and go roach ling, then make your tech choice from there
if they just go 3gate expand you'll be fine getting your lair tech up off two bases then throwing down your third, 3gate expand is a very middle of the road build for toss so they really don't have an advantage economically or army wise
vs terran there are two general timings for your third base, you either take it before your lair, or you take after your lair as you start your spire (assuming muta)
i'd recommend just doing the second one v terran for now, taking an early third can make it difficult to hold some early 2base timings terran can throw out
vs zerg if they 15 hatch you just need to get speed, put down a baneling nest, and expand to your nat as fast as you possibly can
third bases in zvz are very strange and often depend on what tech and composition you are going for opposed to your opponent, and honestly doesn't even happen that often especially at lower levels, so i wouldn't worry about it too much
@variable@mmmig
Should I confirm that as your team name, Vari?
Team Prison Yard vs Proxy Tossgirl
LWT
Dhal vs Biosys on Daybreak. Biosys vetoes first.
Variable vs Sceptre on Cloud Kingdom. Sceptre vetoes first.
Kambing vs Heartslash / Jeff on Tal'Darim. Jeff vetoes first.
SMC
Loserforhirex / JadeWombat vs Saaruto / Topp on Antiga. Loserforhirex / JadeWombat vetoes first.
theSquid vs Euphemon / VikingKong on Entombed Valley. Euphemon vetoes first.
Kebeh vs MMMig on Daybreak. Kebeh vetoes first.
P&P
Thirtyeighth vs tiballagher / princesscake on Shakuras. tiballagher / princesscake vetoes first.
Seven matches for this one. No ace match will be necessary.
Generalísimo de Fuerzas Armadas de la República Argentina
Is marine-thor a relevant build vs zerg. I went up against a platinum terran yesterday who went marine thor, and my initial impression is that it is not.
Lastly, stop being such a bad mannered fuck. Seriously, it makes everyone hate you. How can you even post that replay and not be ashamed of that?
Meh.
And also, I do the gate/robo/gate build precisely because about 90% of the terrans I face on the ladder will all in at the point this guy did, or sooner. I can't hold a marine / scv all in with a 1 gate fast expand, I don't have the micro. I can't hold a marine marauder all in without immortals, and I can't hold a bunker rush... ever. That stim timing push you mentioned? Yeah, thats like... every other game vs terran. Of course I'm gonna use a build that defends it well. I see a second command centre once in a blue moon. I seriously doubt half of the terrans in the world have ever even considered building one.
Jaziek, we're telling you what's wrong with your play. Giving you advice that you've asked for. If you're not capable of implementing it, practice until you can, and stop bitching. Having a negative attitude of "I can't do that" will fuck you over at so many more things that just SC2. The only way to fix mechanics is practice them, and until they're at a decent place, everything else is fucked.
So practice, micro maps, play 4s or customs when you're pissed - but coming here to bitch about how you CAN'T do basic micro will earn you no respect whatsoever.
I wish the forum still had an ignore feature .
Maybe one of these days you will post something with content, or participate in the community in some way.
Also, Vari you are so fucked.
Sceptre on
0
tuxkamenreally took this picture.Registered Userregular
then how about fucking practicing that stuff, looking up ways to defend shit, rather than your non-stop ineccesant fucking bitching
seriously
if you do not have the micro to do something successfully, keep fucking practicing it until you do
guess what
you lose in this game
you lose a lot
especially when trying new stuff and trying to improve
but that's neccessary
to actually learn the new stuff
or you could just keep bitching, and when people give you advice you can just go 'NO THAT'S IMPOSSIBLE MIIICROOOOOOOOOOO', because i guess that's productive???
@variable@mmmig
Should I confirm that as your team name, Vari?
Team Prison Yard vs Proxy Tossgirl
LWT
Dhal vs Biosys on Daybreak. Biosys vetoes first.
Variable vs Sceptre on Cloud Kingdom. Sceptre vetoes first.
Kambing vs Heartslash / Jeff on Tal'Darim. Jeff vetoes first.
SMC
Loserforhirex / JadeWombat vs Saaruto / Topp on Antiga. Loserforhirex / JadeWombat vetoes first.
theSquid vs Euphemon / VikingKong on Entombed Valley. Euphemon vetoes first. Kebeh vs MMMig on Daybreak. Kebeh vetoes first.
P&P
Thirtyeighth vs tiballagher / princesscake on Shakuras. tiballagher / princesscake vetoes first.
Seven matches for this one. No ace match will be necessary.
then how about fucking practicing that stuff, looking up ways to defend shit, rather than your non-stop ineccesant fucking bitching
seriously
if you do not have the micro to do something successfully, keep fucking practicing it until you do
guess what
you lose in this game
you lose a lot
especially when trying new stuff and trying to improve
but that's neccessary
to actually learn the new stuff
or you could just keep bitching, and when people give you advice you can just go 'NO THAT'S IMPOSSIBLE MIIICROOOOOOOOOOO', because i guess that's productive???
I think I might love you.
I made a game! Hotline Maui. Requires mouse and keyboard.
@variable@mmmig
Should I confirm that as your team name, Vari?
Team Prison Yard vs Proxy Tossgirl
LWT
Dhal vs Biosys on Daybreak. Biosys vetoes first.
Variable vs Sceptre on Cloud Kingdom. Sceptre vetoes first.
Kambing vs Heartslash / Jeff on Tal'Darim. Jeff vetoes first.
SMC Loserforhirex / JadeWombat vs Saaruto / Topp on Antiga. Loserforhirex / JadeWombat vetoes first.
theSquid vs Euphemon / VikingKong on Entombed Valley. Euphemon vetoes first.
Kebeh vs MMMig on Daybreak. Kebeh vetoes first.
P&P
Thirtyeighth vs tiballagher / princesscake on Shakuras. tiballagher / princesscake vetoes first.
Seven matches for this one. No ace match will be necessary.
Little makes me happier than crushing Protoss. I survive solely on your tears
"The only way to get rid of a temptation is to give into it." - Oscar Wilde
"We believe in the people and their 'wisdom' as if there was some special secret entrance to knowledge that barred to anyone who had ever learned anything." - Friedrich Nietzsche
0
TannerMS "I'm confidence cause I'm zerg!"Registered Userregular
A few questions for our resident Z's:
1) What's your hotkey setup? I played a couple games last night to get the basic feel for the race, and I liked having individual hatches hotkeyed and just clicking queens for larva injects. Is there a better scheme for this?
2) How do you handle rally points for your larvae? I kept ending up with drones idling, or overlords in my mineral lines.
3) If your opponent early expands, what time do you tend to throw down your third?
I do all hatches on 4 with Queens on 5-0, at this point though, I feel like everyone should be doing the backspace inject or whatever it's called.
I set each hatchery to the nearest mineral line and manually move drones around for my first three bases. For Ovies and units, I like to just rally the eggs to wherever they'll be needed rather than trying to collect them after they hatch.
If it's a Terran, you can't take your third until you have Lair tech (unless you can guarantee he's staying on bio). If he's Protoss, take your third as quickly as possible. If he's FFEing you can take your third as early as 21 if you really want to. Just make sure you have some way to watch for cannons or a nexus cancel. Against Zerg, it's a lot more complicated. You can't take a fast third without Roach Speed or Banes, and I still wouldn't unless I have an ovie behind their nat to count drones.
Now that my thumb is no longer broke I'm returning to SC2, and I want to learn Zerg(!)
I'm learning 14 pool into expand for ZvP, hatch first for ZvT and ZvZ, with adjustments for what I scout.
A few questions for our resident Z's:
1) What's your hotkey setup? I played a couple games last night to get the basic feel for the race, and I liked having individual hatches hotkeyed and just clicking queens for larva injects. Is there a better scheme for this?
2) How do you handle rally points for your larvae? I kept ending up with drones idling, or overlords in my mineral lines.
3) If your opponent early expands, what time do you tend to throw down your third?
Posts
Blizz fixed the patch now though.
I knew about the EPM APM switch but holy shit.
Meh.
And also, I do the gate/robo/gate build precisely because about 90% of the terrans I face on the ladder will all in at the point this guy did, or sooner. I can't hold a marine / scv all in with a 1 gate fast expand, I don't have the micro. I can't hold a marine marauder all in without immortals, and I can't hold a bunker rush... ever. That stim timing push you mentioned? Yeah, thats like... every other game vs terran. Of course I'm gonna use a build that defends it well. I see a second command centre once in a blue moon. I seriously doubt half of the terrans in the world have ever even considered building one.
seriously
if you do not have the micro to do something successfully, keep fucking practicing it until you do
guess what
you lose in this game
you lose a lot
especially when trying new stuff and trying to improve
but that's neccessary
to actually learn the new stuff
or you could just keep bitching, and when people give you advice you can just go 'NO THAT'S IMPOSSIBLE MIIICROOOOOOOOOOO', because i guess that's productive???
Jaziek, we're telling you what's wrong with your play. Giving you advice that you've asked for. If you're not capable of implementing it, practice until you can, and stop bitching. Having a negative attitude of "I can't do that" will fuck you over at so many more things that just SC2. The only way to fix mechanics is practice them, and until they're at a decent place, everything else is fucked.
So practice, micro maps, play 4s or customs when you're pissed - but coming here to bitch about how you CAN'T do basic micro will earn you no respect whatsoever.
it seems narrow enough
Cannons at nexus serve double duty. Initial protection + anti muta/runby. Some people wall off at natural, but there's a tradeoff.
That's a very good point!
I figure there's three things to worry about - 6pooling (cannon in mineral line), roach rush and baneling bust (in both cases more cannons at wall?) Is that correct?
Uh, I really suck at PvZ so I don't really have an answer. I have seen people get lings in their main and just abandon it for the natural before, which only works if your cannons are there.
You should only all-in sometimes in ZvZ - there are a few situations where most cheese is autolose, unless your ling/bling micro is superb (close air metal/shattered, somewhat true on shakuras). You should recognize the cases where it's very hard for them to scout it with the first OL (13/13 is very good on TDA), and cheese there, rather than all the time.
B.net: Kusanku
As a zerg, I prefer Toss wall from their first ramp to nexus. It leaves them more open to early pressure, guaranteeing I can take my third with little worry.
I've taken games by doing either early roach pressure (where they skimp on cannons and only get 1) or just sending in a lot of slow lings (hits before cannon is done) since they usually have one zealot and some sentries.
Also allows for easier scouting of unit composition into mid game than not being able to poke up a fully walled ramp.
Witty signature comment goes here...
wra
I love it when toss does nexus before forge, you can punish that so hard w/o taking an economic hit
B.net: Kusanku
aw yiiiissss
i am also happy for zenio winning cause why not, maru because he is a tiny little person, and killer because he's cool
Please get me your lineups as soon as you can for Feb 24 - March 2! MMMig, you're playing Vari, and Kedinik and the Professional Photon Cyclists are taking on Meeks' JustCheese League.
if pants has any faith in tanner he will just throw the series against sal.
also my phone auto corrects tanner to manner which is priceless
QEDMF xbl: PantsB G+
I'm learning 14 pool into expand for ZvP, hatch first for ZvT and ZvZ, with adjustments for what I scout.
A few questions for our resident Z's:
1) What's your hotkey setup? I played a couple games last night to get the basic feel for the race, and I liked having individual hatches hotkeyed and just clicking queens for larva injects. Is there a better scheme for this?
2) How do you handle rally points for your larvae? I kept ending up with drones idling, or overlords in my mineral lines.
3) If your opponent early expands, what time do you tend to throw down your third?
Path of Exile: snowcrash7
MTG Arena: Snow_Crash#34179
Battle.net: Snowcrash#1873
Done!
And I have Vari's team down as "Team Prison Yard"
Witty signature comment goes here...
wra
B.net: Kusanku
1) it's a lot easier to just hotkey all your hatcheries to one thing (4 or 5 or whatever), and hotkey all your queens to 6 or something and then just tab (no idea what this is by default, most people change it to tab, caps lock, space bar or something) through your queens for injects
late game you'll have way too many hatcheries to hotkey them all invidually and/or be able to get to them comfortably and quickly, and you really shouldn't invidiually click on your queens (i do this but i am bad)
2) well you have two rally points, put the drone rally point (orange one) to the minerals, and the unit rally (white one) to where you put your units to go to (note: doesn't apply to queens, they just pop out of the hatchery) - i guess the reason you're having trouble with this is because you are individually hotkeying all your hatcheries, if you have them all on one it's a lot simpler
i've started to ctrl-click eggs and add them to my control groups before they hatch (for lings and mutas) but you really don't need to do that, it's something you can worry about later
3) depends on matchup
vs protoss if they forge fast expand the most common response is to take a quick third anywhere from like 4-6:00, maaaaddd drone, throw down a roach warren, evo chamber, and start teching to lair just before teching to lair, and go roach ling, then make your tech choice from there
if they just go 3gate expand you'll be fine getting your lair tech up off two bases then throwing down your third, 3gate expand is a very middle of the road build for toss so they really don't have an advantage economically or army wise
vs terran there are two general timings for your third base, you either take it before your lair, or you take after your lair as you start your spire (assuming muta)
i'd recommend just doing the second one v terran for now, taking an early third can make it difficult to hold some early 2base timings terran can throw out
vs zerg if they 15 hatch you just need to get speed, put down a baneling nest, and expand to your nat as fast as you possibly can
third bases in zvz are very strange and often depend on what tech and composition you are going for opposed to your opponent, and honestly doesn't even happen that often especially at lower levels, so i wouldn't worry about it too much
wall of text
*flex*
Should I confirm that as your team name, Vari?
Team Prison Yard vs Proxy Tossgirl
LWT
Dhal vs Biosys on Daybreak. Biosys vetoes first.
Variable vs Sceptre on Cloud Kingdom. Sceptre vetoes first.
Kambing vs Heartslash / Jeff on Tal'Darim. Jeff vetoes first.
SMC
Loserforhirex / JadeWombat vs Saaruto / Topp on Antiga. Loserforhirex / JadeWombat vetoes first.
theSquid vs Euphemon / VikingKong on Entombed Valley. Euphemon vetoes first.
Kebeh vs MMMig on Daybreak. Kebeh vetoes first.
P&P
Thirtyeighth vs tiballagher / princesscake on Shakuras. tiballagher / princesscake vetoes first.
Seven matches for this one. No ace match will be necessary.
http://i.imgur.com/wIKNl.jpg
esports™ portraits™
I don't see it working against pure roaches either.
Witty signature comment goes here...
wra
Yeah, I'm actually looking forward to it.
two gms in a row
i am
the best
I wish the forum still had an ignore feature .
Maybe one of these days you will post something with content, or participate in the community in some way.
Also, Vari you are so fucked.
The phoenix upgrade is absolutely on the fleet beacon on NA. I used it last night.
Side note:
fofofofofofofof.
It is really fantastic, assuming you have the luck to survive until it finishes.
Games: Ad Astra Per Phalla | Choose Your Own Phalla
Dhal, did you hack Biosys' account?
Joe's Stream.
edit: trying to channel my inner tanner
i feel so free now
Good luck mig, you're going to need it
I think I might love you.
Little makes me happier than crushing Protoss. I survive solely on your tears
"We believe in the people and their 'wisdom' as if there was some special secret entrance to knowledge that barred to anyone who had ever learned anything." - Friedrich Nietzsche
I do all hatches on 4 with Queens on 5-0, at this point though, I feel like everyone should be doing the backspace inject or whatever it's called.
I set each hatchery to the nearest mineral line and manually move drones around for my first three bases. For Ovies and units, I like to just rally the eggs to wherever they'll be needed rather than trying to collect them after they hatch.
If it's a Terran, you can't take your third until you have Lair tech (unless you can guarantee he's staying on bio). If he's Protoss, take your third as quickly as possible. If he's FFEing you can take your third as early as 21 if you really want to. Just make sure you have some way to watch for cannons or a nexus cancel. Against Zerg, it's a lot more complicated. You can't take a fast third without Roach Speed or Banes, and I still wouldn't unless I have an ovie behind their nat to count drones.
TRAITOR!