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AthenorBattle Hardened OptimistThe Skies of HiigaraRegistered Userregular
Tested's future is certainly a question, although it sounds like part of the problem is the original website isn't working entirely right just yet. Will and Norm are going to continue producing a ton of content - nearly a page worth today, looking at it.
As for Giant Bomb... their first two post-buyout videos are hilarious. Yeah, maybe, someday they'll be assimilated. But by the sounds of it, GB is going to be its own entity and provide content in a different light than Gamespot. And Gamespot's editors are going to fight to protect that, if these early interviews are to be believed.
And hey, if Jeff feels this wasn't the case, then he'd walk. Again. And GB would walk with him. Again. It really feels like this buyout was made to get away from Whiskey Media/the new owners, who make content for MSN and "social" marketing.
He/Him | "We who believe in freedom cannot rest." - Dr. Johnetta Cole, 7/22/2024
Cautious and not really optimistic about this, but we will see! Whoever posted about Idle thumbs kickstarter I fucking love you, and I just donated to it. Those guys are amazing and I hope they show up at pax east at the GB show.
I just hope I will be able to buy a Giant Bomb hoodie
I just saw recently that they made them available but it was nearly mid-February, so cold weather is almost over until December again. Now I feel bad for waiting.
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GnomeTankWhat the what?Portland, OregonRegistered Userregular
The Binary Domain quick look is one of their best yet.
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"Did ya hear the one about the mussel that wanted to purchase Valve? Seems like the bivalve had a juicy offer on the table but the company flat-out refused and decided to immediately clam up!"
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AthenorBattle Hardened OptimistThe Skies of HiigaraRegistered Userregular
Yeah.. I think the stress of the buyout shows, looking back. And then we hit Binary Domain, complete with off-screen yell-ins and a minute plus of Jeff saying Fuck as loud as he can.
Welcome home.
He/Him | "We who believe in freedom cannot rest." - Dr. Johnetta Cole, 7/22/2024
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MaddocI'm Bobbin Threadbare, are you my mother?Registered Userregular
Incredibly skeptical and worried about this
Giant Bomb is one of only two gaming news sites I read anymore, and the only one that covers console related news
Here's a timeline for people to help make sense of all this:
Vince Brody starts Gamespot. Gamespot is independent. Guys like Greg Kasavin and Jeff Gerstmann build Gamespot into what was, at the time, the most trusted editorial voice in internet video game coverage. See, e.g., this comic: http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2002/01/21 The gamespotting feature pioneered by Greg and Jeff was one of the earliest attempts to bring a serious, magazine-style editorial voice to games coverage on the internet.
At some point during this time period Gamespot is bought out by ZDnet, who is later bought out by Cnet. None of this really causes any problems.
At some point Cnet brings on new management for Gamespot. These guys are morons, and fire Jeff because they "can't trust him" - i.e., he gives games low scores even if they are advertising on the site.
Cnet is bought out by CBS interactive. They replace the moron management team. They hire quality guys like John Davison.
Giant Bomb is bought by CBS interactive.
So it's not really that Gerstmann is rejoining the company that fired him. He's rejoining the editorial team that he spent over a decade molding into what was the most trusted voice in games journalism. He is able to do that because the new corporate overlords fired the idiots who were responsible for tarnishing the brand.
I'm impressed by all the optimism in this thread, but its been pointed out by several other posters that there are plenty of reasons to be worried if you were a GB fan.
A few people here have asked why Gerstmann and crew would make this change if it posed any threat to the integrity of their site. Like everything else, it all comes down to the bottom line. Hosting a popular website is expensive. On top of working hard just generating content, Whiskey has to try to keep the site running in the black. When things look grim, there may be very little or even nothing left to compensate contributors. They may even be out of pocket in a bad month, despite (or, in fact, because of) the site's huge success.
Now here comes CBSi. They're offering to make you relatively wealthy, and you still keep creative control of the site. You've got a contract that says you'll stay for a year or two and that you can basically say and do whatever you want on the website. They'll bring in their people and help keep it profitable. All you have to do is sell.
CBSi is using one of the standard plays out of the modern corporate playbook: when you're up against a smaller competitor, just buy them out. It doesn't matter if the sites are redundant, because you own the alternative. If you close your old gaming news site a few years down the road as a result, that's fine. Or, if GB's loyal fans hit the road and GB eventually folds, that's fine too. The important thing is that you increased your traffic and by extension, your profitability.
That sounds sinister, but its not really. CBSi made a smart play, and in all likelihood, so did Whiskey. I anticipate that the changes will be minor and superficial at first, and gradually the site will have lost the indie edge that made it popular to begin with. Some fans will stay and declare that everything is fine, and others will leave and declare that CBSi ruined it and Whiskey sold out. Whiskey will tow the line until their contract is up, then probably move on to something else and give us all the dirty details of how CBSi tried to make changes to the site to turn a profit.
So, what was the big revelation regarding what happened to Gerstmann and GameSpot? I haven't really had time to sit down and sift through everything...
Like Mega Man Legends? Then check out my story, Legends of the Halcyon Era - An Adventure in the World of Mega Man Legends on TMMN and AO3!
So, what was the big revelation regarding what happened to Gerstmann and GameSpot? I haven't really had time to sit down and sift through everything...
It was what everyone thought happened. A publisher threatened to pull its ads over a negative review, and the new Gamespot management panicked over the potential loss of revenue, caved, and fired him.
Dashui on
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If things go wrong it's not like they can't leave and do something new all over again. Giant Bomb is the people that work there, there's nothing intrinsically valuable about the website itself besides them.
So, what was the big revelation regarding what happened to Gerstmann and GameSpot? I haven't really had time to sit down and sift through everything...
It was what everyone thought happened. A publisher threatened to pull its ads over a negative review, and the new Gamespot management panicked over the potential loss of revenue, caved, and fired him.
Ah, okay. Thanks for letting me know; I was under the impression that with the way they were hyping it, there was something else that really happened.
Like Mega Man Legends? Then check out my story, Legends of the Halcyon Era - An Adventure in the World of Mega Man Legends on TMMN and AO3!
So, what was the big revelation regarding what happened to Gerstmann and GameSpot? I haven't really had time to sit down and sift through everything...
It was what everyone thought happened. A publisher threatened to pull its ads over a negative review, and the new Gamespot management panicked over the potential loss of revenue, caved, and fired him.
Ah, okay. Thanks for letting me know; I was under the impression that with the way they were hyping it, there was something else that really happened.
The thing that we didn't know about that Jeff revealed in the interview is that the new Gamespot management didn't know that Publishers threatening to pull ad money happened all the time and it was nothing to really worry about. And that they freaked out over the Ratchet and Clank: Tools of destruction review one month prior.
So, what was the big revelation regarding what happened to Gerstmann and GameSpot? I haven't really had time to sit down and sift through everything...
It was what everyone thought happened. A publisher threatened to pull its ads over a negative review, and the new Gamespot management panicked over the potential loss of revenue, caved, and fired him.
Ah, okay. Thanks for letting me know; I was under the impression that with the way they were hyping it, there was something else that really happened.
The thing that we didn't know about that Jeff revealed in the interview is that the new Gamespot management didn't know that Publishers threatening to pull ad money happened all the time and it was nothing to really worry about. And that they freaked out over the Ratchet and Clank: Tools of destruction review one month prior.
Also, those management guys are no longer employed at Gamespot.
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Linespider5ALL HAIL KING KILLMONGERRegistered Userregular
So, what was the big revelation regarding what happened to Gerstmann and GameSpot? I haven't really had time to sit down and sift through everything...
It was what everyone thought happened. A publisher threatened to pull its ads over a negative review, and the new Gamespot management panicked over the potential loss of revenue, caved, and fired him.
See, I don't know about this. I know it happened and everything, and the score was justified...but couldn't Gamespot cough up someone else to do a more favorable review? Or are the workings of game journalism such that it was Gerstmann's review and they had to post whatever he wrote?
I mean, games journalism is so...nebulous, for lack of a more favorable word. Did Gamespot really have no choice but to post a review they were afraid of? Just devil-advocating because I don't know how this stuff is supposed to work.
Jeff was editor wasn't he? All reviews went through him. I can't imagine that the new management would have been approving the content of every review so it probably went up before they knew anything about it.
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reVerseAttack and Dethrone GodRegistered Userregular
They did put up another review after Jeff was sacked, didn't they? I seem to recall that it was also fairly negative.
Jeff was editor wasn't he? All reviews went through him. I can't imagine that the new management would have been approving the content of every review so it probably went up before they knew anything about it.
Yeah, management doesn't give a rats-ass about review scores until Sony then Eidos started threatening to pull advertising money. Even then you cant just redo a review when someone doesn't like it your editorial team would tell you to fuck off most likely.
Jeff and John both said number one rule is you stand by your man.
That's the funny thing about the whole incident. It would kind of make sense if Gerstamann had trashed Halo or Zelda or some other big game. It would still be wrong buy you could kind of see it. That he got fired for panning a game that got bad reviews all around makes it just insane.
(Please do not gift. My game bank is already full.)
So, what was the big revelation regarding what happened to Gerstmann and GameSpot? I haven't really had time to sit down and sift through everything...
It was what everyone thought happened. A publisher threatened to pull its ads over a negative review, and the new Gamespot management panicked over the potential loss of revenue, caved, and fired him.
Ah, okay. Thanks for letting me know; I was under the impression that with the way they were hyping it, there was something else that really happened.
The thing that we didn't know about that Jeff revealed in the interview is that the new Gamespot management didn't know that Publishers threatening to pull ad money happened all the time and it was nothing to really worry about. And that they freaked out over the Ratchet and Clank: Tools of destruction review one month prior.
Also, those management guys are no longer employed at Gamespot.
Having watched the interview, Jeff also kept coming back to Gamespot employees being raked over the coals by the court of internet opinion and not being able to say anything to defend them. It was apparently not some huge Gamespot conspiracy but merely a few people in charge being pretty stupid.
I watched the beginning of the episode of On the Spot that aired right after Gerstmann was fired. There were some grim faces there! You could really tell they weren't taking it well. I'd link to it, but I'm at work and I don't have the time to seek it out at the moment.
GnomeTankWhat the what?Portland, OregonRegistered Userregular
I'm telling you, anyone who is worried about Giant Bomb, just watch the Binary Domain quick look. You can feel the relief in the room, and the jokes reflect it.
So, what was the big revelation regarding what happened to Gerstmann and GameSpot? I haven't really had time to sit down and sift through everything...
It was what everyone thought happened. A publisher threatened to pull its ads over a negative review, and the new Gamespot management panicked over the potential loss of revenue, caved, and fired him.
See, I don't know about this. I know it happened and everything, and the score was justified...but couldn't Gamespot cough up someone else to do a more favorable review? Or are the workings of game journalism such that it was Gerstmann's review and they had to post whatever he wrote?
I mean, games journalism is so...nebulous, for lack of a more favorable word. Did Gamespot really have no choice but to post a review they were afraid of? Just devil-advocating because I don't know how this stuff is supposed to work.
Jeff mentioned that it was more that the management didn't trust him for future reviews. It had happened before with Ratchet and Clank, they saw it with K&L, and then they realized that he wasn't going to, in their estimation, play along with management and give favorable reviews for potential advertisers in the future.
So, what was the big revelation regarding what happened to Gerstmann and GameSpot? I haven't really had time to sit down and sift through everything...
It was what everyone thought happened. A publisher threatened to pull its ads over a negative review, and the new Gamespot management panicked over the potential loss of revenue, caved, and fired him.
See, I don't know about this. I know it happened and everything, and the score was justified...but couldn't Gamespot cough up someone else to do a more favorable review? Or are the workings of game journalism such that it was Gerstmann's review and they had to post whatever he wrote?
I mean, games journalism is so...nebulous, for lack of a more favorable word. Did Gamespot really have no choice but to post a review they were afraid of? Just devil-advocating because I don't know how this stuff is supposed to work.
Jeff mentioned that it was more that the management didn't trust him for future reviews. It had happened before with Ratchet and Clank, they saw it with K&L, and then they realized that he wasn't going to, in their estimation, play along with management and give favorable reviews for potential advertisers in the future.
That raises what is really the big unknown here. Were the few Gamespotters who remained at the company after Jeff's departure expected to play ball and give advertisers nice reviews? Or did management immediately learn their lesson after seeing the internet backlash on Jeff's firing? If the staff was expected to play ball, how long did that continue before (presumably) the old management was sacked and things moved in the right direction?
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GnomeTankWhat the what?Portland, OregonRegistered Userregular
I don't think it took very long. From what Jeff made it sound like in that interview, the reaction was swift and brutal. The internet can be a harsh mistress when you upset it, and your primary business model is based on the internet.
i know we are all brewing a nice cup of doom here, but a few things to keep in mind:
after what jeff went through, i'm sure they are being very thorough with contracts and what content they own the rights to. i bet they had lawyers comb through them to make sure they couldn't get fucked. and even in the DOOOOMsday event that they do get screwed over, so what?
they've shown they know how to build a site, and make content people want. if somehow giantbomb becomes something the main guys don't want to be a part of, they can go start over again (and people will follow). this deal is likely good news for them. they will have more money to cover more events and stories.
because when conan got fired from the tonight show, he was off air FOREVER right?
Some how I think the Giant Bomb guys have a lot less million dollar bills saved up for a rainy day.
I.e. I doubt they can afford to (once again, or for an even longer period of time, who knows) wait out that non-compete period.
I don't know. I kind of remember seeing graphs that showed that Gerstmanngate had basically no effect on GameSpot's traffic.
I always thought it was weird that Jeff Gerstman was made into a martyr, because, prior to his firing, he wasn't exactly a well liked reviewer. He was more like Matt Cassassassammassamaspeia instead, where lots of people disliked his views.
Man, I'm STILL not a huge fan of his as a reviewer. But dude knows his shit, has tons of personality and can talk like a motherfucker. In an industry where I mostly don't care about any one individual, that says a lot, to me.
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Dr Mario KartGames DealerAustin, TXRegistered Userregular
Worst case scenario, they can just kickstarter a hojillion dollars.
I don't know. I kind of remember seeing graphs that showed that Gerstmanngate had basically no effect on GameSpot's traffic.
I always thought it was weird that Jeff Gerstman was made into a martyr, because, prior to his firing, he wasn't exactly a well liked reviewer. He was more like Matt Cassassassammassamaspeia instead, where lots of people disliked his views.
because when conan got fired from the tonight show, he was off air FOREVER right?
Some how I think the Giant Bomb guys have a lot less million dollar bills saved up for a rainy day.
I.e. I doubt they can afford to (once again, or for an even longer period of time, who knows) wait out that non-compete period.
Some people have to work for a living.
This is all in California where non-compete clauses/contracts are pretty much unenforceable.
I don't know. I kind of remember seeing graphs that showed that Gerstmanngate had basically no effect on GameSpot's traffic.
I always thought it was weird that Jeff Gerstman was made into a martyr, because, prior to his firing, he wasn't exactly a well liked reviewer. He was more like Matt Cassassassammassamaspeia instead, where lots of people disliked his views.
Gamespot and IGN were my go to places during Gerstmans time. I have a vague recollection of who was who when writing reviews but I do remember that Gerstman reviews were the worst. Yet when the Kane & Lynch thing happened I totally dropped Gamespot cold turkey just on the principle of the matter. To this day I will not go there and if I accidently click a link that directs me to the site then I close it immediately. I like to think others were the same way just because I heard less and less of Gamespot around the game world and thought it was dying, especially since some of Gerstman's bros left with him. The whole time though it was never a quit of Gamespot for Gerstman but about Gerstman.
On the subject of Gerstman, it took me a long long while to warm up to him. I didn't know about Giantbomb until I saw the NEVER. youtube clip a couple months after it came out. Then I learned what a quicklook was which then taught me about podcasts. Up until maybe last spring I had always loathed when Gerstman would talk about anything. Hated his speech. I hated his mannerisms. I hate his taste in games.
Then the NintendoWare bit, which I used to always end the podcasts on, played one day and I was laughing like crazy. Now I await every one of his Open Jar talks and quicklooks just to hear him shit on things. He became a man I loved to despise.
The dude hates Retro and Metroid prime vehemently. I hate him but I love him.
Posts
As for Giant Bomb... their first two post-buyout videos are hilarious. Yeah, maybe, someday they'll be assimilated. But by the sounds of it, GB is going to be its own entity and provide content in a different light than Gamespot. And Gamespot's editors are going to fight to protect that, if these early interviews are to be believed.
And hey, if Jeff feels this wasn't the case, then he'd walk. Again. And GB would walk with him. Again. It really feels like this buyout was made to get away from Whiskey Media/the new owners, who make content for MSN and "social" marketing.
I just saw recently that they made them available but it was nearly mid-February, so cold weather is almost over until December again. Now I feel bad for waiting.
"My Big Bo indicator is always at max".
Yeah, and considering it's the first one from the "new era", I think they're gonna be fine.
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Pokemon White Friend Code: 0046-2121-0723/White 2 Friend Code: 0519-5126-2990
"Did ya hear the one about the mussel that wanted to purchase Valve? Seems like the bivalve had a juicy offer on the table but the company flat-out refused and decided to immediately clam up!"
Welcome home.
Giant Bomb is one of only two gaming news sites I read anymore, and the only one that covers console related news
Vince Brody starts Gamespot. Gamespot is independent. Guys like Greg Kasavin and Jeff Gerstmann build Gamespot into what was, at the time, the most trusted editorial voice in internet video game coverage. See, e.g., this comic: http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2002/01/21 The gamespotting feature pioneered by Greg and Jeff was one of the earliest attempts to bring a serious, magazine-style editorial voice to games coverage on the internet.
At some point during this time period Gamespot is bought out by ZDnet, who is later bought out by Cnet. None of this really causes any problems.
At some point Cnet brings on new management for Gamespot. These guys are morons, and fire Jeff because they "can't trust him" - i.e., he gives games low scores even if they are advertising on the site.
Cnet is bought out by CBS interactive. They replace the moron management team. They hire quality guys like John Davison.
Giant Bomb is bought by CBS interactive.
So it's not really that Gerstmann is rejoining the company that fired him. He's rejoining the editorial team that he spent over a decade molding into what was the most trusted voice in games journalism. He is able to do that because the new corporate overlords fired the idiots who were responsible for tarnishing the brand.
A few people here have asked why Gerstmann and crew would make this change if it posed any threat to the integrity of their site. Like everything else, it all comes down to the bottom line. Hosting a popular website is expensive. On top of working hard just generating content, Whiskey has to try to keep the site running in the black. When things look grim, there may be very little or even nothing left to compensate contributors. They may even be out of pocket in a bad month, despite (or, in fact, because of) the site's huge success.
Now here comes CBSi. They're offering to make you relatively wealthy, and you still keep creative control of the site. You've got a contract that says you'll stay for a year or two and that you can basically say and do whatever you want on the website. They'll bring in their people and help keep it profitable. All you have to do is sell.
CBSi is using one of the standard plays out of the modern corporate playbook: when you're up against a smaller competitor, just buy them out. It doesn't matter if the sites are redundant, because you own the alternative. If you close your old gaming news site a few years down the road as a result, that's fine. Or, if GB's loyal fans hit the road and GB eventually folds, that's fine too. The important thing is that you increased your traffic and by extension, your profitability.
That sounds sinister, but its not really. CBSi made a smart play, and in all likelihood, so did Whiskey. I anticipate that the changes will be minor and superficial at first, and gradually the site will have lost the indie edge that made it popular to begin with. Some fans will stay and declare that everything is fine, and others will leave and declare that CBSi ruined it and Whiskey sold out. Whiskey will tow the line until their contract is up, then probably move on to something else and give us all the dirty details of how CBSi tried to make changes to the site to turn a profit.
Like Mega Man Legends? Then check out my story, Legends of the Halcyon Era - An Adventure in the World of Mega Man Legends on TMMN and AO3!
It was what everyone thought happened. A publisher threatened to pull its ads over a negative review, and the new Gamespot management panicked over the potential loss of revenue, caved, and fired him.
Ah, okay. Thanks for letting me know; I was under the impression that with the way they were hyping it, there was something else that really happened.
Like Mega Man Legends? Then check out my story, Legends of the Halcyon Era - An Adventure in the World of Mega Man Legends on TMMN and AO3!
The thing that we didn't know about that Jeff revealed in the interview is that the new Gamespot management didn't know that Publishers threatening to pull ad money happened all the time and it was nothing to really worry about. And that they freaked out over the Ratchet and Clank: Tools of destruction review one month prior.
NNID: Glenn565
Also, those management guys are no longer employed at Gamespot.
See, I don't know about this. I know it happened and everything, and the score was justified...but couldn't Gamespot cough up someone else to do a more favorable review? Or are the workings of game journalism such that it was Gerstmann's review and they had to post whatever he wrote?
I mean, games journalism is so...nebulous, for lack of a more favorable word. Did Gamespot really have no choice but to post a review they were afraid of? Just devil-advocating because I don't know how this stuff is supposed to work.
3DS friend code: 4811-7214-5053
Yeah, management doesn't give a rats-ass about review scores until Sony then Eidos started threatening to pull advertising money. Even then you cant just redo a review when someone doesn't like it your editorial team would tell you to fuck off most likely.
Jeff and John both said number one rule is you stand by your man.
(Please do not gift. My game bank is already full.)
Having watched the interview, Jeff also kept coming back to Gamespot employees being raked over the coals by the court of internet opinion and not being able to say anything to defend them. It was apparently not some huge Gamespot conspiracy but merely a few people in charge being pretty stupid.
My Backloggery
Jeff mentioned that it was more that the management didn't trust him for future reviews. It had happened before with Ratchet and Clank, they saw it with K&L, and then they realized that he wasn't going to, in their estimation, play along with management and give favorable reviews for potential advertisers in the future.
That raises what is really the big unknown here. Were the few Gamespotters who remained at the company after Jeff's departure expected to play ball and give advertisers nice reviews? Or did management immediately learn their lesson after seeing the internet backlash on Jeff's firing? If the staff was expected to play ball, how long did that continue before (presumably) the old management was sacked and things moved in the right direction?
(Please do not gift. My game bank is already full.)
Not if they've signed a non-compete!
Some how I think the Giant Bomb guys have a lot less million dollar bills saved up for a rainy day.
I.e. I doubt they can afford to (once again, or for an even longer period of time, who knows) wait out that non-compete period.
Some people have to work for a living.
I always thought it was weird that Jeff Gerstman was made into a martyr, because, prior to his firing, he wasn't exactly a well liked reviewer. He was more like Matt Cassassassammassamaspeia instead, where lots of people disliked his views.
He was funny on the podcast, though
Being charismatic and likable counts for a lot
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This is all in California where non-compete clauses/contracts are pretty much unenforceable.
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Gamespot and IGN were my go to places during Gerstmans time. I have a vague recollection of who was who when writing reviews but I do remember that Gerstman reviews were the worst. Yet when the Kane & Lynch thing happened I totally dropped Gamespot cold turkey just on the principle of the matter. To this day I will not go there and if I accidently click a link that directs me to the site then I close it immediately. I like to think others were the same way just because I heard less and less of Gamespot around the game world and thought it was dying, especially since some of Gerstman's bros left with him. The whole time though it was never a quit of Gamespot for Gerstman but about Gerstman.
On the subject of Gerstman, it took me a long long while to warm up to him. I didn't know about Giantbomb until I saw the NEVER. youtube clip a couple months after it came out. Then I learned what a quicklook was which then taught me about podcasts. Up until maybe last spring I had always loathed when Gerstman would talk about anything. Hated his speech. I hated his mannerisms. I hate his taste in games.
Then the NintendoWare bit, which I used to always end the podcasts on, played one day and I was laughing like crazy. Now I await every one of his Open Jar talks and quicklooks just to hear him shit on things. He became a man I loved to despise.
The dude hates Retro and Metroid prime vehemently. I hate him but I love him.