New girlfriend has very (very) attached best friend.
Elimination
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I've never really had this kind of problem before, and I assume someone out here in the forums probably has, so I'd like to see maybe how they dealt with the same problem...soo here goes...
I recently met someone after about a year and a half of avoiding relationships. Technically I still wasn't really looking for one, but as they say...when you aren't looking is probably when it will happen. In any case I really like this girl, and she admitted that she is very into me as well. We started out as just kind of friends, hanging out and such, with her and her circle of friends (We share a few friends in common, it's how we met.). Her best friend is another girl, and they hang out with each other A LOT, so much so, that me and said new girlfriend can't seem to get any time alone, we can't even seem to chat on facebook without this best friend getting offended in some manner.
Now to be clear, I actually like the best friend most of the time, and would never ask her to ditch her best friend, and I do my best to not make this best friend feel like a third wheel so I generally do a "hands off" approach when we are with other her, or other people as I know how much it sucks for anyone to feel like a third wheel. Now this new girlfriend and I started becoming a lot closer over the past couple weeks, and started trying to have our own alone time, our own private conversations ect and ever since this started happening the best friend has started turning into a real pain in the ass. Every time my girlfriend and I start talking or hanging out without her she gets real bitchy, sends bitchy text messages and lays on the guilt trip on my girlfriend about how we are ditching her and how we are going to leave her behind or something. We can't seem to get a single day alone. We even all went out to the bar once and the best friend had a big freakout after about how all the guys like my girlfriend and don't like her and asked me why I like my girlfriend and put me in this huge awkward situation. I think the worst part is is all the guilt tripping she pulls on not only my girlfriend, but she's started doing it to me too now. It makes me feel bad and its making my girlfriend feel bad for the two of us wanting to be together.
Now my girlfriend is VERY VERY picky with guys, she has never really even had a real boyfriend, and is still a virgin. She's 25. It isn't because she is ugly or unattractive or something (Far from it, shes very pleasant and very attractive personality and looks wise.) and I'm the first guy she's ever really been interested in seriously. Now this situation is already really hard on me, as I am not a virgin, and this is not my first time to the ball game, so to speak. But I really like her and as I wasn't looking for a relationship when this all came about, I am totally cool with taking things really slow, in fact I prefer it right now.
Now my girlfriend has gone to visit family for 2 months in Australia (where she is from, but she lives where I live the other 90% of the time.) and so she's been skyping me a lot and keeping in touch, she actually didn't even want to go to australia, because our relationship is still fairly fresh and she didn't want to leave me for 2 months. I pushed her to go as I think family is important and she doesn't get this opportunity very often. I mean I can live 2 months with just skype dates, I'm ok with that. So off she went. Now her best friend is getting pissy because she is skyping with me a lot and keeping in touch, and is complaining that my girlfriend "doesn't need her best friend anymore" because she has me now and all this. Is really laying on the guilt tripping. She is also doing it to me, asking me to come hang out with her and stuff, and asked me to spend the night at her house (Which i did when my girlfriend did a couple times.) but I told her I wasn't comfortable with that but i'd be happy to hang out some time. Now comes today, she asks me to hang out, I tell her I can't I have homework to do (My final is in August.) so she goes off on me "Oh now beacuse (my girlfriend.) isn't around now we aren't friends." Once again putting me in a really awkward situation.
I just don't know how to deal with it, this best friend was fine at first, but it seems like the closer my girlfriend and I get the worse she gets. This isn't fair to me, or my girlfriend, especially since my girlfriend is so picky with men. I mean it I don't think it's fair at all that she finally found a guy she really likes (me) and her best friend decides its a good opportunity to act like this, I dont want this best friend to drive us apart with this crap and I am really worried that's what will happen. My girlfriend does not seem to be interested in the least in splitting up, but that doesn't mean this isn't going to cause problems for us...
So any advice would be awesome.
I recently met someone after about a year and a half of avoiding relationships. Technically I still wasn't really looking for one, but as they say...when you aren't looking is probably when it will happen. In any case I really like this girl, and she admitted that she is very into me as well. We started out as just kind of friends, hanging out and such, with her and her circle of friends (We share a few friends in common, it's how we met.). Her best friend is another girl, and they hang out with each other A LOT, so much so, that me and said new girlfriend can't seem to get any time alone, we can't even seem to chat on facebook without this best friend getting offended in some manner.
Now to be clear, I actually like the best friend most of the time, and would never ask her to ditch her best friend, and I do my best to not make this best friend feel like a third wheel so I generally do a "hands off" approach when we are with other her, or other people as I know how much it sucks for anyone to feel like a third wheel. Now this new girlfriend and I started becoming a lot closer over the past couple weeks, and started trying to have our own alone time, our own private conversations ect and ever since this started happening the best friend has started turning into a real pain in the ass. Every time my girlfriend and I start talking or hanging out without her she gets real bitchy, sends bitchy text messages and lays on the guilt trip on my girlfriend about how we are ditching her and how we are going to leave her behind or something. We can't seem to get a single day alone. We even all went out to the bar once and the best friend had a big freakout after about how all the guys like my girlfriend and don't like her and asked me why I like my girlfriend and put me in this huge awkward situation. I think the worst part is is all the guilt tripping she pulls on not only my girlfriend, but she's started doing it to me too now. It makes me feel bad and its making my girlfriend feel bad for the two of us wanting to be together.
Now my girlfriend is VERY VERY picky with guys, she has never really even had a real boyfriend, and is still a virgin. She's 25. It isn't because she is ugly or unattractive or something (Far from it, shes very pleasant and very attractive personality and looks wise.) and I'm the first guy she's ever really been interested in seriously. Now this situation is already really hard on me, as I am not a virgin, and this is not my first time to the ball game, so to speak. But I really like her and as I wasn't looking for a relationship when this all came about, I am totally cool with taking things really slow, in fact I prefer it right now.
Now my girlfriend has gone to visit family for 2 months in Australia (where she is from, but she lives where I live the other 90% of the time.) and so she's been skyping me a lot and keeping in touch, she actually didn't even want to go to australia, because our relationship is still fairly fresh and she didn't want to leave me for 2 months. I pushed her to go as I think family is important and she doesn't get this opportunity very often. I mean I can live 2 months with just skype dates, I'm ok with that. So off she went. Now her best friend is getting pissy because she is skyping with me a lot and keeping in touch, and is complaining that my girlfriend "doesn't need her best friend anymore" because she has me now and all this. Is really laying on the guilt tripping. She is also doing it to me, asking me to come hang out with her and stuff, and asked me to spend the night at her house (Which i did when my girlfriend did a couple times.) but I told her I wasn't comfortable with that but i'd be happy to hang out some time. Now comes today, she asks me to hang out, I tell her I can't I have homework to do (My final is in August.) so she goes off on me "Oh now beacuse (my girlfriend.) isn't around now we aren't friends." Once again putting me in a really awkward situation.
I just don't know how to deal with it, this best friend was fine at first, but it seems like the closer my girlfriend and I get the worse she gets. This isn't fair to me, or my girlfriend, especially since my girlfriend is so picky with men. I mean it I don't think it's fair at all that she finally found a guy she really likes (me) and her best friend decides its a good opportunity to act like this, I dont want this best friend to drive us apart with this crap and I am really worried that's what will happen. My girlfriend does not seem to be interested in the least in splitting up, but that doesn't mean this isn't going to cause problems for us...
So any advice would be awesome.
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Your girlfriend's best friend has some major boundary issues and needs to be talked to. Hearing it from you isn't going to do any good; it has to come from your girlfriend.
Oh my girlfriend knows, we've actually talked about it a little. But it's a touchy subject and it's hard to approach for both of us. I don't hate the best friend, but I also don't want the best friend to stand in the way of either of us, I just think shes' being incredibly self-centered right now. Some days she's ok, but any days that my girlfriend and I spend any length of time together without said best friend being involved in some way it's becoming an issue. It wasn't when we first got together, but it is now that we're growing closer. I can tell it isn't just bothering me, it's bothering my girlfriend too, and it's making her feel bad which isn't fair, she shouldn't have to feel bad for meeting someone she likes.
And the whole 'best friend is jealous of time spent with boyfriend' is very much a first relationship type problem. Before you came along, the best friend had your girlfriend all to herself. Now she has to adjust. Assuming she's not insane, she will, given time. When she tries to guilt you just clearly say things like 'so-and-so still cares about you... but we like each other very much and enjoy our time together.'
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Yeah I don't think it helps much that the best friend has no boyfriend and has no "prospects" for one. As I said, I actually like the best friend most of the time, and have no problem hanging out with her or involving her in some of the things we do. But I do have a problem with the guilt trips and crap. The best friend obviously wants to be good friends with me as well, she asks me to hang out even though my girlfriend is gone to Australia. So I don't want to give her a reason to not like me or something and cause some kind of void that would damage my relationship with my girlfriend.
The internet advice is: You need to set up the clingy friend with one of your friends so she has someone else to spend time on.
OP should note that "internet advice" means "sarcasm." :P
Yeah. It's not going to go well, but your options are you passively accept it, in which case it will definitely stay the same or get worse, or talk to her, in which case it might get worse or it might get better.
I'd avoid making too big a thing of it. When your girlfriend has to pick between pleasing someone who is clearly calm, rational and understanding and someone who has clearly gone a bit batshit loopy, then if she's a keeper she'll make the right decision. Much as you have been the spark of the problems, it's really an issue between the two of them to which you are merely a side player. You can't be a big part of sortting it out, you can only really be supportive of your girlfriend while she sorts it.
In the meantime don't stop pursuing alone time togther as that is perfectly reasonable, but also don't avoid, confront or otherwise give ammunition to the best friend to fuel her crazy. Make it clear through your actions that your desire is a good friend time/boyfriend time balance, not total monopoly.
person a few times. Perhaps after few goes you will both suddenly not be able to make it to an arranged meeting with the 'best friend' and the fourth person. Or find someone with a common interest with the 'best friend' that neither yourself or you girl do. Or try to get her involved in a new social group/hobby, then back out of it yourselves.
Actually, your girlfriend being away is a good opportunity. Turn up to meeting the 'best friend' with a third person (doesn't have to be a hookup, just someone you think she will get along with/someone from the circle) and work the angles.
Sounds incredibly unhealthy for the both of them.
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Is it possible she liked you before you and your girlfriend got together? Like I said, I may be wrong, but I got that vibe from your OP.
That second piece of advice actually isn't terrible. While the first thing you should do is have your girlfriend have a talk with her, finding the clingy friend another friend (could be girl or guy) may be a good idea because from everything you've said it sounds like she may not have any other friends. I'm not saying dump her off on one of your guy friends, I'm saying if you have a guy friend or a girl friend who you think she would like and might like her, why not introduce the two and see if she can't find someone else to talk to when your girlfriend and you are spending time together.
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Not much, though. She needs to grow past this, and she's not going to do that unless your girlfriend (read: not you) sits down with her and has a girls' night complete with heart-to-heart.
She's not going to be pleased. In fact, she's going to be pissed, and hurt, and lonely, and that's going to happen no matter what is said to her. It's just as important for her as it is for you and your girlfriend, though, because she isn't going to grow as a person until she learns how to trust other people to have relationships without her, and that's what it is: a trust issue. The really sad thing is that unless she develops some self-awareness here, she is probably going to lose your girlfriend as a friend before she realizes that, whether or not your girlfriend has managed to stay with you through all this, and I do speak from some experience here.
In the mean time, try to be patient. You've said you want to take things slow anyway... maybe letting your girlfriend figure out how to handle her friendship can be part of that. You shouldn't interfere in that friendship. The one thing you CAN do is let the friend know that even though she says you're friends, guilt trips and emotional blackmail don't seem very friendly to you. You want to be friends, but you need some personal space and time with other friends too. If she says something to you that hurts your feelings, tell her so - literally just "That hurts my feelings" or "That's not very nice"... something that tells her that you don't find what she said an appropriate way to speak to you.
Bottom line - Not talking about it will only make it worse. Your gf needs to talk to her about what she's doing. And yeah, it probably won't be pleasant and it's going to hurt her...but it needs to be done. And honestly, will probably be very helpful for her in the long run. Her friends need to point out that her actions are not good. They are damaging to you and your gf and I would not be surprised at all if she ended up finally meeting a "prospect" and turning them off from the same suffocating behavior
Assuming the above is true: Are there people you could introduce her to? Not as in trying to set her up a date, but just to expand her social circle. The issue might be resolved if she no longer feels that her entire social sphere, limited as it is, is being threatened by you (even if you aren't really threatening it).
Now imagine someone comes along and takes your friend away. It's hard, it's emotional, it feels terrible for everyone. Especially the person who built their life around the platonic relationship mostly because they thought it was kosher (the friend made it seem so).
Your g/f needs to have a sit down talk with her friend. Nothing accusatory or anything like that. She needs to explain that there are boundaries and everyone needs time to themselves. And as such, her and her new boyfriend need time to go to movies, eat dinner, and have sex by themselves without said friend getting angry or trying to join in. No one is replacing anyone, but friend needs to back off for the sake of happiness of your girlfriend and you, and just for her girlfriend's general happiness. Your girlfriend also needs to reiterate that her friend doesn't want to be resented for destroying a relationship, because that ends in the same situation, except now she doesn't get any time with her best friend at all if she keeps it up.
We've been in the sort of friends but more area for a while, but she only became my actual girlfriend in the last month. So not a really long time. So far during this whole thing though my girlfriend has been pretty firmly in the being with me camp when it comes to the best friend situation. The problem is the guilt tripping is making her feel bad for doing so. I'm the first guy she's really liked in basically...ever, so it's a big deal for her and what bothers me the most is the best friend can't seem to understand that, and is acting selfish.
i actually tried the inviting a 4th with us, and it worked for a little while. A friend of mine is a sort of crush of hers (or was.) and so i started inviting him along, and it worked for a while but now she doesn't like him like that anymore so now she doesn't really want to hang out with him, even though he's a nice guy and hasn't actually done anything to her.
Also about her having a thing for me? It's possible. She hasn't known me before this relationship though, so I doubt it's possible she has had a thing for me beforehand. I know my girlfriend was interested in me before she even actually knew me, and we only met because a mutual friend of ours made the decision for her and invited me along to a thing we were both at and sort of played matchmaker which worked out well so far. I mean the best friend has made comments about my looks before, and used to do it a lot when we all first started hanging out. But now she's made it clear she won't do that anymore to me, because I talked to my girlfriend about how it was awkward and my girlfriend i think had a face to face to face talk with her about it. My girlfriend seems to be just the right kind of protective when it comes to that.
I'm supposed to hang out with the best friend tonight, and i've convinced her to go to this sort of get together thing which is mostly other friends of hers that i don't really know very well which probably wont be that fun for me, but it might get her to start spending time with these other friends.
As for her knowing about me and my girlfriend skyping regularly and such, my girlfriend told her not knowing she'd act the way she has been. now it's like every time she catches wind of us having skype chats or something without her its like "Oh I guess you don't need me anymore you can just talk to him" and is very standoffish. It's frustrating my girlfriend to no end because the best friend is just not acting like an adult with this stuff. i mean she's 26 (the best friend.) she shouldn't be acting like a jaded highschool kid.
It sounds like the friend has some self-esteem/maturity issues, and if you and your girlfriend continue to act in a mature and respectful way, it will probably work itself out as she will learn to cope with having to share her friend's time.
She has other friends yeah. But the bestfriend DEFINITELY has some self-esteem issues, i learned that very early on. Not to be mean or anything but the best friend isn't as....physically attractive, as my girlfriend. And i think in a way she might kind of resent my girlfriend a little bit for it, even if my girlfriend has avoided having deep relationships with anyone until me. I think that might be the core of the whole thing though, is that she is simply jealous of my girlfriend. The best friend always talks about how she doesn't want a boyfriend and doesn't want a relationship because it doesn't fit into her plan to travel or whatever, which is fine. But then on the same coin she complains that no guys want to be with her...and that guys (im used as an example every time.) all like my girlfriend. It isn't like my girlfriend can help this, or that her and I can help being interested in each other like we are.
It's very much a self-esteem issue, but it's bubbling up a lot since my girlfriend and i have gotten closer lately. And yes, if the best friend drives us apart (which may very well happen.) my girlfriend will likely not easily forgive her for it.
Dude she is 25, that is way too old for 13 year old style bullshit.
wat
I think you added a few sentences to Chop Logic's post.
And really didn't read the OP...
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I can't agree and then expand upon it? I'll keep that in mind.
I read it, and I stand by my advice. There's clearly some codependency going on there. If the girlfriend was mature, she'd tell her friend that she's a big girl now and doesn't need her anymore. At 25, it's a bit late for that.
So you would tell your best friend you don't need them anymore?
Clearly the best friend has self esteem and co-dependancy issues. But you don't just dump a friend like that.
It's something she can work out with her friend through honest communication. And telling the OP to walk away from the girl is just silly.
Okay, I should have been clearer - I would tell my clingy best friend that HE doesn't need ME anymore. That, at 25, the girlfriend hasn't done that yet is what tells me she's not mature enough for an adult relationship.
The thing you're forgetting is the "co" part of codependency. Continuing an unhealthy relationship isn't doing anyone any favors.
I'm assuming he's an adult. Adults don't date kids. She's emotionally a kid. I don't think my advice is silly at all.
On the note of the best friend, one thing I have noticed about her is she sets the bar REALLY high for men as well. Like unrealistically high. Like when i invited my friend along to hang out with us, they got along really well. Why did she suddenly not like him? Because he isn't in good enough shape, and he likes computers....Now just to set this straight, the best friend weighs more than I do and has self-esteem issues like crazy. She couldn't look past someone else's personal fitness problem to see the nice guy underneath? I'm a computer guy too, but I keep myself in excellent shape. My friend isn't even overweight, he just isn't in great shape. That kind of bothered me a lot to hear that (today) from her. She even acts now like my friend is some kind of jerk or horrible person when i mentioned inviting him out tonight.
How does the best friend know about this?
The reason I ask is, does your girlfriend tell the best friend everything you guys do? In which case she needs to stop.
Or is the friend with your girlfriend so much that the girlfriend can't even get an hour or two to herself to chat/skype with you without the best friend knowing about it? In which case this needs to stop too. For your girlfriend's sake more than anyone else's. There are platonic relationships and then there are borderline crazy stalker friendships which are quite weird and frightening.
Also I'm confused as to how she has low self esteem yet have extremely high standards. Those two kind of sound mutually exclusive to me.
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Really, your girlfriend needs to nut up and set some clear and defined boundaries. The best thing you can do for her is support her when she does this.
Satans..... hints.....
Not necessarily, it's kinda like the fox and the sour grapes. If she has low self esteem she doesn't see herself worthy of being dated. Because of this she then criticizes these other people to feel good about herself.
It's the equivalent of the Internet having arguments over whether or not Scarlett Johanssen is unattractive because her shoulder blades are angled the wrong way. (to be clear, neither of these things are healthy and of course she is attractive)
Satans..... hints.....
Ignore passive-aggressive bullshit. Just ignore it. There is no response you can give that will help. Ignore guilt-tripping. Don't feed it in any way; she's just trying to get a rise out of you in some way or other.
I'm not suggesting she ditch her best friend. But exactly who is dating who? When the three of you figure that out, you will all be better off.
Yeah it's starting to feel like i'm dating 2 people instead of one.
I talked to my girlfriend about it though, and she actually agrees with me. And she said when she gets back she's going to have some one on one time with the best friend. I don't know exactly what she is going to try to do here. I don't know the best friend well enough to really say anything myself without coming off like a jackass and potentially making her hate me which would make dating my girlfriend really awkward with her best friend having a big hate on for me.