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Landlord gave my fiancee 15 days notice that they won't be renewing the lease.
noir_blood
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This takes place in Long Island, New York in case it matters.
My fiancee moved up to LI back in May. She ended up signing up what I believe is called a shared tenant lease- in which she moved into a house with three other room mates. From my understanding, she does not have an individual lease, rather all the room mates share one single lease that expires on October 17. In their lease, it says the landlords have to give them 30 day notice if they're not wanting to renew the lease.
On October 2nd, they received a letter from the landlords saying that they would not be renewing anyone's lease. The Fiancee and roommate's guest is that they're either going to try to sell the house, or found a family to rent it to.
In the letter, it states that the landlords tried to send a certified letter on September 17th and it came back unclaimed. Of course, all the roommates say they never got even a notice of a letter. The landlords are also now telling everyone that if they stay later than the 17th, they will be charged 100 dollars extra per day.
What's fucked up about this whole thing is that my Fiancee has texts and emails from the landlords going as far as September 14 saying they were okay with renewing the lease(one of the previous roommates left, so fiancee ended up moving to their larger room and wanted to have that from then on). She's obviously been looking for places, but its proven to be more difficult, as the current plan was that she would take our dog come this winter, so that I could move in with my aunt for the semester I'm doing my student teaching and won't have the time to work. It seems places either have a hard time accepting dogs, or more frustrating, the ones that will don't have openings until November 1st.
So my question is if what the landlords did is legal, and does she have any options? Can the landlords send a certified letter, and even if it returns unclaimed, that's enough to cover the whole "30 day notice" thing?
My fiancee moved up to LI back in May. She ended up signing up what I believe is called a shared tenant lease- in which she moved into a house with three other room mates. From my understanding, she does not have an individual lease, rather all the room mates share one single lease that expires on October 17. In their lease, it says the landlords have to give them 30 day notice if they're not wanting to renew the lease.
On October 2nd, they received a letter from the landlords saying that they would not be renewing anyone's lease. The Fiancee and roommate's guest is that they're either going to try to sell the house, or found a family to rent it to.
In the letter, it states that the landlords tried to send a certified letter on September 17th and it came back unclaimed. Of course, all the roommates say they never got even a notice of a letter. The landlords are also now telling everyone that if they stay later than the 17th, they will be charged 100 dollars extra per day.
What's fucked up about this whole thing is that my Fiancee has texts and emails from the landlords going as far as September 14 saying they were okay with renewing the lease(one of the previous roommates left, so fiancee ended up moving to their larger room and wanted to have that from then on). She's obviously been looking for places, but its proven to be more difficult, as the current plan was that she would take our dog come this winter, so that I could move in with my aunt for the semester I'm doing my student teaching and won't have the time to work. It seems places either have a hard time accepting dogs, or more frustrating, the ones that will don't have openings until November 1st.
So my question is if what the landlords did is legal, and does she have any options? Can the landlords send a certified letter, and even if it returns unclaimed, that's enough to cover the whole "30 day notice" thing?
noir_blood on
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Say they have a receipt stating the letter was unclaimed-or as I believe they word it on the letter the roommates DID receive, that it came back to them unclaimed. Is that enough justification to say "We gave you 30 days?"
I would suggest checking what ever equivalent you have for a rental tribunal. I live in Canada so I can't say what your rules are but in my province the notice period is two months for month to month renters no matter what is written on the lease and I think there are rules concerning what are valid reasons for the landlord to not renew the lease. The $100 dollar per day penalty is likely not a thing that is allowable.
Tenant Right's Guide from the NY Attorney General
It should lay out the minimum required notice period for the termination of leases, etc.
If he's got a receipt that it was sent as a 'Certified Letter' as of a certain date and confirmation that it was delivered by whichever company he / she used - regardless of whether or not it was actually received then it is going to qualify as noticed. If this is the case you may be boned.
Go get a lawyer. Obviously look for apartments too, but your chances of finding residence in 15 days that doesn't rape your ass is slim. I probably wouldn't pay rent while this is going on either, to your old landlord. But obviously the lawyer will tell you what you can and cannot do.
It's crazy but it seems like showing up and delivering the letter by hand to a person that lives there, or a phone call, or something, might have worked out a lot better. Maybe doing it 2-3 months ahead of time.
NY has really good renter laws, so, fuck this guy.
And yeah, like Bowen pointed out, it's not so much that the fiancee wants to extend the lease at this point, it's just become a bitch finding a suitable apartment, and it would have worked out better if she'd actually gotten a full 30 days, or given to the start of the next month.
It looks like she's hopefully found one, but their move in date won't be until this Friday, 2 days after the landlord's are telling her she needs to move. It's not the worst case scenario, but what I have a feeling they're going to do is deduct 200 dollars from her deposit because of it.
He's trying to make a quick buck and/or found someone willing to pay more. Honestly if I were your girlfriend, and this new place was higher cost than acceptable, I'd dig my heels in a fuck over the landlord for being a giant douche about the notice.
I'd call him up and go "so uh, why didn't I get appropriate notice as per my lease?"
If he said, "well I tried sending a certified letter."
I'd counter with "and what? You think trying once absolves you of reasonable cause? You need to do more than send a letter. Like, maybe, deliver it in person. So no I don't think this is a long enough time, and you're technically in violation of the lease."
If I were a dick I'd make them extend me another year long lease. If I weren't, I'd move out and make him give me a month's notice and have him prorate, based off my old rent, my time there based on how much longer it took me. Get a lawyer that deals with rental law, pronto, though. Because I bet you that new place will fall through and you'll be in even worse condition.
Dude is being even a mega dicker by charging you $100 a day on top of it (wtf, what is this a hotel?) He's trying to force your hand to get out because he doesn't think you'll fight back, or are clueless kids about rental laws.
Yes, you can litigate that, and you would win. See if the lease has an attorney fees provision.
While I agree about the 30 days delivery thing the bit about a certified letter not being sufficient notice is off base. That is quite often exactly the notice legally required for quite a few things.
They should absolutely be able to produce the receipt and how exactly they failed to deliver to an address they own is certain to be an interesting story. Certified mailers don't look like they require signatures either.
It certainly sounds like the landlords done screwed things up royally. Getting a lawyer to draft a nice letter or make a phone call should result in them being much more agreeable about unexpected costs if they don't want to tie the property up for a few months to a year.
Certified Mail is something that most definitely requires a signature. "Certified mailer" is a separate term. The landlord should have a Certified Mail receipt with the Certified label number that can be used to check its status at usps.com; ie, it will tell you when delivery was attempted and the city+ZIP. I'm not a lawyer but from what I learned while working at the Post Office, a Certified item is the only definitively legal-binding "we sent this to you"/"we tried to send this to you" mail the Post Office has. If they do have a Certified receipt with your fiancee's address and the online tracking says that delivery was attempted in your city+ZIP then that is probably legally enough for them to say "hey we tried to notify you."
My guess is they're lying about the certified letter, though.
Well sending it on the 30th day would pretty much mean even if they sent it they fucked up and violated the lease agreement since transit times for mail is usually greater than instantaneous.
Because sometimes one person may work/go to school a distance that isn't a viable daily commute from the other?
Wow, not all engaged couples live together. :-/ There's any number of reasons why they might not, from the logistical/practical concerns @iRevert mentioned to moral/religious views about shacking up before marriage. I'm not sure how this is relevant to the OP's problem, however "strange" it may seem to some.
BECAUSE THERE'S NO FIANCEE. You have tumbled my house of lies.
Actually, we're (unfortunately) currently doing the long distance relationship thing. I'm finishing up my degree in Texas, and she's working a new job in New York.
Again, thanks for all the advise. The apt I mentioned on my last update fell through- which apparently is something that happens quite a bit as she/I are finding out, but she found a better deal and is getting the keys, today, so wooo.
She's still staying at her current apt till Sunday, and sent the landlords an email basically telling them that, and saying she's ameneable to paying a prorated rate for the extra days, but not their stupid demands. Told them if they have any questions to contact her. Guess we'll see their response.
PSN: astronautcowboy 3DS: 5343-8146-1833
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IANAM, but I don't think this is a rabbit trail we really wanna go down. :?
I really want to go off on this goosey statement.
Instead, I'll let you guys know that the fiancee got keys to her new apartment, and the landlords are giving her and the other two room mates till Sunday to move out, so after two weeks of stressing, it looks like things are resolved.
This can now be closed. Thanks guys! (Except astronautcowboy3. Screw that guy)
Awesome, glad to hear it.