A Song of Ice and Fire, BOOK AND TV AND ESPECIALLY BOOK SPOILERS INSIDE

Quid

The old thread was long in the tooth so here is a new one to continue the discussion. I liked Yar's rules for the last one so I'll just copy them in to here:

Yar wrote: »

#1 rule is no crying about something being spoiled, assuming it's already published material. If you haven't read all the books AND seen every aired show, then you are forbidden from accusing someone else of spoiling something for you. If you're posting an interview with GRRM where he talks about stuff that will happen in Book 6, yeah, that is the very epitome of a spoiler and must be tagged.

#2 rule, less important than #1, is to use your own best judgment and put tags around some things, like maybe details of TRW, or R-L-J theories, or major stuff from Book 5. Definitely anything about a show that hasn't aired (besides what we know from the books), or confirmed plot facts in books not yet published. Someone could very well click this thread by accident instead of the TV one, and they sure has hell don't want to see this in non-tagged form:
(major spoilers from books 3 - 5)

Hey, remember when Robb and Catelyn were killed by the Freys, and Sansa married Tyrion, but then Catelyn came back as an evil zombie and Joff chokes to death and Tyrion murders his father, and Jamie sort of becomes a good guy? That was awesome.

#3 rule is to try to do what I did above and preface your spoiler tags with a very brief description of what kind of spoiler it is and about when it occurs in the series.

Like so. Seriously, if you don't want spoilers, don't read this thread. Stop right now cause below this sentence? Thar be spoilers.



































So this is the thread wherein we all talk about how great it'll be when Theon Greyjoy cleverly becomes king of Westeros, shortly preceding Asha's conquest of the world because they are the best ever.

Jubal77

Winter is coming.

CowShark

Would they do the Kingsmoot again if Theon can get his dumb butt back to Pyke?

Jubal77

Spoilerd for a big picture

Sotextli

CowShark wrote: »

Would they do the Kingsmoot again if Theon can get his dumb butt back to Pyke?

I dont think theres much chance of the Ironborn electing a maimed eunuch King of the Iron Islands...

Fakefaux

So, this is interesting. Mainly this part:

Aidan plays the part of Lord Petyr ‘Littlefinger’ Baelish in the hit HBO series and Gillen says he’s looking forward to filming. “It should be a good one — I have a ship in this series which is cool.”

I can think of only one notable scene where Littlefinger has a boat. Looks like that confirms Joffrey's wedding for the fourth season. Lot of people expected that, but still.

Domhnall

CowShark wrote: »

Would they do the Kingsmoot again if Theon can get his dumb butt back to Pyke?

I believe that's Asha's plan. Unfortunately that was before she saw Theon..

CowShark

Domhnall wrote: »

CowShark wrote: »

Would they do the Kingsmoot again if Theon can get his dumb butt back to Pyke?

I believe that's Asha's plan. Unfortunately that was before she saw Theon..

Well, if the people got tired of Euron in a hurry, it could be an excuse to redo, even if they're not actually going to crown the dude.

Quid

Domhnall wrote: »

CowShark wrote: »

Would they do the Kingsmoot again if Theon can get his dumb butt back to Pyke?

I believe that's Asha's plan. Unfortunately that was before she saw Theon..

Then she had an even BETTER plan that shall see the Iron Islands rise again!

Tamin

repost from last thread

because apparently a handful of us didn't realize a new thread had been created

Fakefaux wrote: »

Bunch of new character photos released today.

What's really interesting is if you mouse over the pictures, or view them, their names appear to be production codes, indicating what episode and scene number they're from.

Tamin wrote: »

Jojen and Meera look awesome

edit: weirdly, those pictures don't have the EP tag.

Also, those Tully statues. mmm

Quid

Who is that supposed to be and where? I'm on my phone and can't mouse over stuff.

Quid

I don't... I don't know why Geth agreed with that.

Tamin

I'm not really sure. I don't recognize the guy from that angle. Maybe it's on Dragonstone?

Bobble

Quid wrote: »

Who is that supposed to be and where? I'm on my phone and can't mouse over stuff.

It's Stannis, probably Dragonstone. There's a picture of Melisandre that is actually just the other half of this picture.

Also, that's the third time today I've seen someone mention Geth agreeing with a post. Does it do something different when Geth agrees/awesome? I've seen no mention of it before today.

Tamin

Bobble wrote: »

Quid wrote: »

Who is that supposed to be and where? I'm on my phone and can't mouse over stuff.

It's Stannis, probably Dragonstone. There's a picture of Melisandre that is actually just the other half of this picture.

Also, that's the third time today I've seen someone mention Geth agreeing with a post. Does it do something different when Geth agrees/awesome? I've seen no mention of it before today.

It's been happening for a day or so now. It just means what it sounds like: our benevolent robot overlord, Geth, is listed among the users who have agreed with or awesomed your post.

Beyond that, it doesn't really mean anything. IcyLiquid claims that even he can't predict whether Geth will react to a given post.

Vesty

I'm disappointed Tyrion isn't all that disfigured. The scar isn't even really that big

Fireflash

I guess TV shows really have a thing against changing a character's appeareance; it almost never happens. It's the same thing with Jaime. Once he leaves the Starks with Brienne he has a beard and shaves his head as to not be so easily recognized by whoever he may encounter on his travels. In the TV show he still looks the same as he did in the first episode. Also no change to Ned's looks despite spending a reasonable amount of time alone in a dark dungeon cell.

Well Jaime did grow a bit of a beard, but still, I wanted a badass bald Jaime with a big beard!

Tamin

Fireflash wrote: »

I guess TV shows really have a thing against changing a character's appeareance; it almost never happens. It's the same thing with Jaime. Once he leaves the Starks with Brienne he has a beard and shaves his head as to not be so easily recognized by whoever he may encounter on his travels. In the TV show he still looks the same as he did in the first episode. Also no change to Ned's looks despite spending a reasonable amount of time alone in a dark dungeon cell.

Well Jaime did grow a bit of a beard, but still, I wanted a badass bald Jaime with a big beard!

That picture is from episode 3, though. So if it's practical (and doesn't look dumb), they have plenty of time to do more.

That's one of the concessions of live action, though. The actor might not be able to grow a big beard.

Quid

That and it's a lot easier to distinguish characters in books, especially when a chapter starts out as CHARACTER'S NAME, than it is on a show of thin pretty white people. Once you get a character's look down I could understand the desire not to deviate.

Tamin

who's the guy with the eyepatch?

Orell?

Vesty

Tamin wrote: »

who's the guy with the eyepatch?

Orell?

It's Beric Dondarrion

Tamin

Vesty wrote: »

Tamin wrote: »

who's the guy with the eyepatch?

Orell?

It's Beric Dondarrion

hmm

not sure I like his look, but we shall see.

Vesty

I don't like Thoros's look either. Not at all how they described him in the book.

http://www.slashfilm.com/wp/wp-content/images/Game-of-Thrones-Thoros.jpg

-e-

and while I'm critiquing...

I like the rugged look of Mance, even if he isn't as handsome as described.

The Unsullied are a little different than I expected as well. I thought they had gold/bronze armor. I also pictured their helmets similar to WW1 German "spike" helmets, and less clothing almost 300 like... but I suppose these are more realistic.

Tamin

I would go with "practical" over realistic.

Kana

Season 1 there's actually a couple guardsmen in ep 1 who pretty much look like straight from the book's description of unsullied.

But this version has some obvious advantages for TV, mostly the covered faces making it easy for them to do shots with lots of extras.

Fakefaux

These Unsullied don't really seem to be wearing much armor anyway.



That appears to be a simple leather tunic. The only armor they have are the shields and helmets.

Fakefaux

Also, this is rather interesting. I pointed out in the last thread that most of these pictures are tagged with production codes. This picture of Dany is listed as being from Episode 304, IE episode four, season three:



Given the nature of the picture, this seems to suggest Dany gets her army of Unsullied really, really early in the season. What will she be doing for the rest of it?

Tamin

Fakefaux wrote: »

Also, this is rather interesting. I pointed out in the last thread that most of these pictures are tagged with production codes. This picture of Dany is listed as being from Episode 304, IE episode four, season three:

[img]http://winteriscoming.net/wp-content/upload s/2013/01/749726_GOT_KB_10.28.12_EP304_6890-1359137405258-A.jpg[/img]

Given the nature of the picture, this seems to suggest Dany gets her army of Unsullied really, really early in the season. What will she be doing for the rest of it?

She has (in the book) at least two meetings in front of the army. The one where she pretends she doesn't understand the slaver, and then the one with the burning and the screaming. This could be the first one.

Fakefaux

Tamin wrote: »

She has (in the book) at least two meetings in front of the army. The one where she pretends she doesn't understand the slaver, and then the one with the burning and the screaming. This could be the first one.

Ah, that makes sense. So, first half of season three she gets her army, second half she probably conquers Yunkai. Which means season four is just her conquering Mereen, which sounds a little lackluster. Then again, they'll probably want to save the bulk of the season four budget/screentime for Jon's adventures on The Wall.

Bobble

Fakefaux wrote: »

Tamin wrote: »

She has (in the book) at least two meetings in front of the army. The one where she pretends she doesn't understand the slaver, and then the one with the burning and the screaming. This could be the first one.

Ah, that makes sense. So, first half of season three she gets her army, second half she probably conquers Yunkai. Which means season four is just her conquering Mereen, which sounds a little lackluster. Then again, they'll probably want to save the bulk of the season four budget/screentime for Jon's adventures on The Wall.

Dany's season four appearances will largely consist of a quick shot showing her, sitting in Mereen, and someone saying "Are we leaving yet?" and she replies "I am just a young girl and know little of such things. A queen belongs to her people. If I look back, I am lost."
"My queen, you did not answer my question. When are we leaving Mereen to conquer Westeros?"
"I dunno. Just not feelin' it yet."

and then we cut back to Jon on The Wall.

RT800

I've been thinking I should re-read A Feast for Crows, since I don't remember any of it.

But it was so hard to get through the first time.

All I remember is Cercei finally getting her comeuppance, Jamie being awesome, and way too many Brienne chapters.

More like A Feast for BORES.

Maybe just a synopsis then.

As for A Dance With Dragons, I just wish they hadn't gone there with Theon. Graphic depictions of torture and the psychological impact of that torture are not things I enjoy reading about. I need righteous justice (cathartic revenge) brought down upon Ramsay.

enlightenedbum

Dude, AFFC is the second best book. Easily. Such a thematically strong novel.

Kana

Brienne's chapters are pretty amazing on reread. I do get the initial dislike for them, since she's fairly removed from big plot movers, but the stuff in them is actually pretty darn important to explaining asoiaf's whole thing

enlightenedbum

I mean...

AFFC wrote:

Back on the road, the septon said, “We would do well to keep a watch tonight, my friends. The villagers say they’ve seen three broken men skulking round the dunes, west of the old watchtower.”

“Only three?” Ser Hyle smiled. “Three is honey to our swordswench. They’re not like to trouble armed men.”

“Unless they’re starving,” the septon said. “There is food in these marshes, but only for those with the eyes to find it, and these men are strangers here, survivors from some battle. If they should accost us, ser, I beg you, leave them to me.”

“What will you do with them?”

“Feed them. Ask them to confess their sins, so that I might forgive them. Invite them to come with us to the Quiet Isle.”

“That’s as good as inviting them to slit our throats as we sleep,” Hyle Hunt replied. “Lord Randyll has better ways to deal with broken men—steel and hempen rope.”

“Ser? My lady?” said Podrick. “Is a broken man an outlaw?”

“More or less,” Brienne answered.

Septon Meribald disagreed. “More less than more. There are many sorts of outlaws, just as there are many sorts of birds. A sandpiper and a sea eagle both have wings, but they are not the same. The singers love to sing of good men forced to go outside the law to fight some wicked lord, but most outlaws are more like this ravening Hound than they are the lightning lord. They are evil men, driven by greed, soured by malice, despising the gods and caring only for themselves. Broken men are more deserving of our pity, though they may be just as dangerous. Almost all are common-born, simple folk who had never been more than a mile from the house where they were born until the day some lord came round to take them off to war. Poorly shod and poorly clad, they march away beneath his banners, ofttimes with no better arms than a sickle or a sharpened hoe, or a maul they made themselves by lashing a stone to a stick with strips of hide. Brothers march with brothers, sons with fathers, friends with friends. They’ve heard the songs and stories, so they go off with eager hearts, dreaming of the wonders they will see, of the wealth and glory they will win. War seems a fine adventure, the greatest most of them will ever know.

“Then they get a taste of battle.

“For some, that one taste is enough to break them. Others go on for years, until they lose count of all the battles they have fought in, but even a man who has survived a hundred fights can break in his hundred-and-first. Brothers watch their brothers die, fathers lose their sons, friends see their friends trying to hold their entrails in after they’ve been gutted by an axe.

“They see the lord who led them there cut down, and some other lord shouts that they are his now. They take a wound, and when that’s still half-healed they take another. There is never enough to eat, their shoes fall to pieces from the marching, their clothes are torn and rotting, and half of them are shitting in their breeches from drinking bad water.

“If they want new boots or a warmer cloak or maybe a rusted iron halfhelm, they need to take them from a corpse, and before long they are stealing from the living too, from the smallfolk whose lands they’re fighting in, men very like the men they used to be. They slaughter their sheep and steal their chickens, and from there it’s just a short step to carrying off their daughters too. And one day they look around and realize all their friends and kin are gone, that they are fighting beside strangers beneath a banner that they hardly recognize. They don’t know where they are or how to get back home and the lord they’re fighting for does not know their names, yet here he comes, shouting for them to form up, to make a line with their spears and scythes and sharpened hoes, to stand their ground. And the knights come down on them, faceless men clad all in steel, and the iron thunder of their charge seems to fill the world…

“And the man breaks.

“He turns and runs, or crawls off afterward over the corpses of the slain, or steals away in the black of night, and he finds someplace to hide. All thought of home is gone by then, and kings and lords and gods mean less to him than a haunch of spoiled meat that will let him live another day, or a skin of bad wine that might drown his fear for a few hours. The broken man lives from day to day, from meal to meal, more beast than man. Lady Brienne is not wrong. In times like these, the traveler must beware of broken men, and fear them…but he should pity them as well.”

When Meribald was finished a profound silence fell upon their little band. Brienne could hear the wind rustling through a clump of pussywillows, and farther off the faint cry of a loon. She could hear Dog panting softly as he loped along beside the septon and his donkey, tongue lolling from his mouth. The quiet stretched and stretched, until finally she said, “How old were you when they marched you off to war?”

“Why, no older than your boy,” Meribald replied. “Too young for such, in truth, but my brothers were all going, and I would not be left behind. Willam said I could be his squire, though Will was no knight, only a potboy armed with a kitchen knife he’d stolen from the inn. He died upon the Stepstones, and never struck a blow. It was fever did for him, and for my brother Robin. Owen died from a mace that split his head apart, and his friend Jon Pox was hanged for rape.”

“The War of the Ninepenny Kings?” asked Hyle Hunt.

“So they called it, though I never saw a king, nor earned a penny. It was a war, though. That it was.”

The best single passage in the whole series.

Quid

I love that passage.

Kyoka Suigetsu

Vesty wrote: »

I'm disappointed Tyrion isn't all that disfigured. The scar isn't even really that big

Much like the purple contacts the Targaryens origanally had, a bigger more disfiguring scar would probably be both dumb looking and uncomfortable for Dinklage to wear.

I was hoping they would make Dondarrion look a bit more corpsey though

Shadowhope

One thing about that passage for me: even though it never mentions the Night Watch, even though we see first hand just how dysfunctional the Night Watch can be, it still manages to paint the Night Watch in a better light. It's filled with the scum of the earth, not just honest farmers carted off unwillingly to war or in the wrong place at the wrong time, but actual rapists and murderers as well. But they do manage discipline, and they do have an institutional pride that the armies of the south don't have.

cj iwakura

I had no idea that was the Queen of Thorns, I was like 'why is Septa Mordane alive'?

Fakefaux

cj iwakura wrote: »

I had no idea that was the Queen of Thorns, I was like 'why is Septa Mordane alive'?

Her belt is the giveaway.

cj iwakura

Fakefaux wrote: »

cj iwakura wrote: »

I had no idea that was the Queen of Thorns, I was like 'why is Septa Mordane alive'?

Her belt is the giveaway.

I guess I just pictured her more like a kindly little old lady, with that fire.

Blendtec

Fakefaux wrote: »

Also, this is rather interesting. I pointed out in the last thread that most of these pictures are tagged with production codes. This picture of Dany is listed as being from Episode 304, IE episode four, season three:

<snip>

Given the nature of the picture, this seems to suggest Dany gets her army of Unsullied really, really early in the season. What will she be doing for the rest of it?

Nothing, just like the book. Hundreds of pages scenes of her being wishy-washy with occasional action nearby that she never actually sees.