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West Coast Travel for an Irish Family
RMS Oceanic
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I am currently hashing out the logistics of a holiday to the US at the end of August/start of September for me, my parents and my eighteen year old sister. The original plan was to make it a straight two-city visit, San Francisco with a stopover in Chicago on the return leg, but consultation with my brother has generated recommendations of a day trip to Los Angeles/Hollywood and a couple of days in Las Vegas, if to see nothing else but the strip and the Hoover Dam. With this in mind I am factoring in a few extra days on the West Coast - original plan was 5 days in San Francisco, 5 days in Chicago with a day's travel time in between - but I'm wondering about the best way to travel between the three cities on the West Coast. My brother on his honeymoon rented a car and drove down Highway 1 for the scenery. Is that best, or would it be simpler to fly SF -> LA -> LV -> CH? Or is it all best done by car? And what about rail travel, how fast/comfortable would it be to do those three cities by train?
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A LOT.
But it's fantastic. So SF->LA would be a good driving one if you guys could handle it. You might even look at breaking the drive up on that leg, perhaps staying in Morrow Bay, or somewhere near there (protip: Hearst Castle is about 30 minutes North of Morrow Bay.)
Last time I checked prices for train travel we're pretty close to flying (re: not cheap). There is no Ryan Air equivalent in the states, so everything is somewhat pricey.
Bus may be feasible? I'm not sure, I haven't really traveled much by bus.
L.A. to Vegas drive gets kind of boring. I grew up in Barstow, which is about the midway point. I think you can do it in about 4 hours, but its dull and brown and desert most of the way. Possibly cheapest option though.
If you can tolerate long drives, SF->LA->LV and then flying to Chicago might be the cheapest option.
Las Vegas is about 3.5 hours from LA by car. Hoover Dam is far enough away from LV to make going there and getting back at least a 3 hour commitment.
I'd honestly say your original plan is better. Adding LA and LV would cut 2+ days out of both your SF and Chicago plans and both of those places are far more interesting.
Highway 1 is sort of amazing. Most people don't complete the drive in a single day however, it might technically be an 8 hour drive, but rushing is sort of missing the point. The drive itself is an experience because the California coast is a natural wonder.
LA can be fun but. Hmmm. I'm not a huge fan. It's not a beautiful place for one thing; smog and urban sprawl. There are lots of beautiful people though. Probably no place on Earth will make a "regular person" feel quite so homely as southern California. Generally people go to LA for Disneyland/other theme parks, and perhaps the Getty museum. There are a ton of insanely good restaurants and clubs and bars and things like that in LA, but frankly that's not the sort of thing you fly across the Atlantic to do they are more of a side effect of travel for other reasons.
Las Vegas is worth seeing. It's a huge spectacle.
I've never seen the Hoover Dam but it's usually pretty worthwhile to construct it in civ games.
Don't drive down from SF to LA unless you plan on taking at least 2 days to do it. That way you can spend an hour or to at specific stops along the way and actually enjoy the drive. Otherwise it's a straight-shot 6-10 hours depending upon how you drive, which highway you take, and how traffic works out. Driving for that period of time is just not enjoyable, period. But, driving a few hours and then stopping at Monterey Bay Aquarium, then driving another few hours to a nice place for dinner and a good night's sleep sounds like a much better vacation and actually gives you time to take things in. If you just want to get from SF to LA, then I would recommend flying.
There's absolutely no reason to drive from LA to Vegas. There is nothing in between worth seeing, and a good portion of it is literally desert.
Look up Southwest and Virgin America if you want cheap flights between those three cities. I think there's a special train that runs from SF to LA, but I'm fairly certain that it doesn't stop for a meaningful period of time (other than to let people on/off). They provide food and sleeping cabins, but the actual experience is basically sitting on the train watching the nice scenery go by, so it really depends on if that's your kind of thing or not.
However paradoxically, there are discussions of hiring a car in LA and driving to Vegas for a few days before returning to fly from LA to Chicago. This is a cost saving exercise, as adding the LA to Vegas flight as well as the SF to LA one somehow causes the prices to spike by £300, so it's cheaper to get there by car, and more comfortable than the bus.
So the rough timetable of the holiday is shaping up as follows:
-Travel to San Francisco (1 day)
-Five days in the Bay area (6)
-Fly to LA, visit stuff like Hollywood (7)
-Next day drive to Vegas (8)
-2 Days in Vegas/Surrounding Area (10)
-Next day return to LA, fly to Chicago (11)
-Five days in Chicago (16)
-Travel home! (18 due to overnight travel)
I should have bought some annual leave from work to cover this.
Booo!
Can go into specific places if you want, but all the museums are good, the Shedd Aquarium is really nice.
Could you? That would be helpful, give more information so we can work out where we want to go.
When I say "the surrounding area" I mainly just mean go on a trip to the Hoover Dam.
Park on the south side (The side Hollywood is on) and hike up to the Griffith Observatory
It's a short hike but you see the Hollywood sign pretty close up and the Observatory is fun to tool around in
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Don't make eye contact with anyone
And especially don't go up to costumed characters
Those are homeless people
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Chicago Recommendations:
Chicago isn't huge, it's not like New York where you can visit a unique borough every day. You might find yourself looking for things to do on days 4 and 5. So don't feel bad if you cut a day off your trip to experience more of California. Chicago is one of my favorite cities to live in, but living is a little different than visiting. That said, hit up a pizza tour while you're there and you won't regret it. If you're not looking to eat too much pizza, at least try one and my suggestion is Pizano's on State Street. But always take local's advice into consideration, things might've changed since I've been there.
The Loop and Hyde Park are probably the best two areas for tourism, with the Loop being the better in my opinion. I've heard people talk about crime in Hyde Park, but I never experienced it.
Cali Recommendations:
The Pacific Coast Highway (CA-1) is a great trip, and I'm glad other people have recommended it because without knowing much of California you could miss it. Depending on what you're into, you can go north from the Bay on PCH and see the Redwoods national parks, south if you like the cities. Both are going to be about 5-7 hrs of driving, and I recommend playing it by ear. If you want to spend more time scenic, stopping half way and visiting a motel wouldn't be the worse idea.
Pretty much everything you could want to eat can be found in the Bay, and I highly recommend visiting Haight-Ashbury. If nothing else it has some of the best Thai food I've had in a long time and at good prices. Some of the other stores in the area could be rip offs, playing off the culture of the area, so tread wisely. Castro Street is as weird as you've heard, and if you go to see what it's about expect to see naked people.
What are your passions or interests? There's a lot to do in San Francisco and in California in general, and you can find most anything.
You could also take the ferry to Jack London Square and walk around there a bit.
If you go to LA, you get to drive in traffic that is born of hellspawn. Stay up north. If you really want to drive, go see Half-Dome in Yosemite Park.
The big thing southern California has to offer is weather and beaches, and even then my preference would be San Diego.
LAX is hell on earth.
I also would just skip the LA leg, and fly straight from the Bay Area to Vegas, and spend an extra day in Vegas. While both LA and Vegas are soulless hell pits, at least Vegas has the strip and the spectacle of it all. You can spend two days on the strip easy, just going to the different casinos and shops and stuff.
LA is basically smog, snotty people, traffic and the Hollywood sign. I can show you pictures of the Hollywood sign and give you the same experience. You'll hear people talk about going to Radeo Drive and all that crap, but honestly, then you're just dealing with snotty rich people who look down on tourists anyway. I am not a fan of LA, and I've been there quite a bit. Honestly seems like a wasted leg of your trip.
If it were me I'd drop Chicago completely and hit up NYC/DC for those period you'd be in Chicago + LA + Vegas.
Which are like the reasons to visit the US. I think you'd appreciate all the Smithsonian stuff far more than the Hoover Dam (Which is still fucking awesome).
Smithsonian is awesome as fuck, lots of shit to do, see lots of political places in the US in one stop. Lots of fun, great use of a week if you've got the time.
Chicago is basically some deep dish pizzas and some night life spots. I never really saw the draw to it compared to the other big ticket places. Hell Seattle seems like it has more to do. Probably better food too.
Ah, the woes of compromise...
here is a link to the route I am talking about:
http://maps.google.com/maps?saddr=San+Francisco,+CA&daddr=37.0404369,-122.2288103+to:36.3895748,-121.9014606+to:Los+Angeles,+CA&hl=en&ll=35.915747,-118.520508&spn=8.226459,16.907959&sll=35.939954,-120.330998&sspn=4.113453,8.453979&geocode=FVJmQAIdKAe0-CkhAGkAbZqFgDH_rXbwZxNQSg;FTQxNQIdtu-2-Clt4DubbVqOgDEMVd3vdoTu9g;FcZCKwIdbO67-Ckz9ALMV-uNgDH16DlRNLXLFg;FYqYBwIdm77z-CkT2ifcXcfCgDH0CEYlb98v4g&oq=lo&t=h&mra=dpe&mrsp=2&sz=8&via=1,2&z=7
GIS is evil
/agree
San Francisco, Lake Tahoe, Yosemite, all great places. LA = think London (assuming you have been there) but a fuckton worse. I mean if your family is obsessed with American TV or Disneyland or something.. ok.. but I would never recommend going to LA unless work/wedding/funeral took you there.
GIS is evil
GIS is evil
That should take a good chunk of your day and there are also spots along that route other people have mentioned. Griffith Observatory, Most of the major studios (Warner Bros has a tram tour that's about an hour if you head there), In-N-Out, Santa Monica Beach, etc..
If you told us what you liked when you visited the East Coast, I'm sure people here could give you similar things to that in Chicago and California.
There are certainly interesting little places around if you're willing to meet the city halfway and not bring in a lot of baggage about what it "should be like"
The Getty is indeed worth a trip as it has many beautiful Impressionist paintings on permanent display
There's also the LACMA with many Picassos as well as original Warhols (this museum also has the benefit of being right next to La Brea Tar Pits)
It is also only a few blocks from The Grove a tourist trap of a mall connected to a rather neat permanent Farmer's Market with all sorts of odd food stands
There is also The Museum of Jurassic Technology http://mjt.org/ which is a one of a kind experience of what museums were like at the turn of the Century
barely any labels. an assortment of odd displays, a good deal of apocrypha and no order whatsoever
If you really want to see a celebrity they are mysterious and you really have no guarantee of where they might be but the places I have had the best success have been
at The SaddleRanch Chop House in Hollywood which rather hilariously used to be a sleazy Sunset Strip bar in the 80's and is now an almost family friendly theme restaurant where the theme is sleazy, 80's Sunset Strip bar
A lot of it's 80's clientele still frequent it, even with all the tourist families
Forget Rodeo Drive and visit Fred Segal in either Santa Monica or West Hollywood
The clothes are ridiculously expensive but with all the windows blocked out they are favorites of those who want to shop incognito
Lastly, something Chicago and Los Angeles have in common is that they are home to the absolute best Improvisational troupes in the world
In Los Angeles it's The Groundlings, in Chicago, The Second City
I guarantee if you watch a show at either of those venues, not only will you get a good show but at least one of the people you see performing will eventually be a star
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On top of the places listed above, you could also hit up the Scientology museum if you want something wacky (highlights, in my opinion, Brea Tar Pits, Getty Art Museum, LA City Art Museum, Griffith Observatory at night gets you a really nice view of downtown).
As for Vegas, there's a range where you can rent and shoot basically every kind of gun if you're into that sort of thing.
Also, just driving around between these places is quite something, even if you are stressed out trying to get from SF to LA in order to make your flight on time (I didn't, makes an excellent story). I recall we ended up in some cave turned cold war bomb shelter in the middle of nowhere on the historic route 66 on the way back from the Grand Canyon as well.
Obviously this is totally up to your family, but for me half the fun of traveling is experiencing what most people actually eat regularly, including the fast food. You'll have plenty of options as you drive down the PCH. The drive from LA to Vegas will give you the options of sand and dirt.
The Counter http://www.thecounterburger.com/santamonica/
This burger restaurant has exploded in the last few years however most of the franchises are merely adequate
If you are near the original in Santa Monica however I would highly recommend it as this location is the reason for its popularity (Try the sweet potato fries)
Interested in Mexican fare but want to compromise between tasteless Americanized fare and authentic spices that may hurt your stomach an not even be that appetizing?
El Cholo is the perfect blend of authenticity and comfort http://www.elcholo.com
If you want to try Mexican fast food I would recommend Poquito Mas, they make their own tortillas and the food is of a higher freshness than most Mexican grills
Lastly I want to give a recommendation not entirely based on food but rather because it is the most stereotypically American restaurant I can possibly imagine
Claim Jumper restaurants are ridiculous. The decor is oppressively Frontier cowboy style, the portions are gigantic and the variety of food they offer is enormous
http://www.claimjumper.com/default.aspx
If you do go there try their Chocolate Cake though you may want to only get a half slice unless you're splitting with a large party
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As far as I know they haven't booked the flights yet. Maybe I can make another appeal for at least part of the PCH...
I don't blame 'em for not wanting to drive, though. It's quite a trek. The drive from LA to Vegas is a bit mind-boggling but understandable of the price is an issue. Depending upon the weekend, flights to Vegas can go anywhere from $75 to $350 round trip from SF/LA... It's always a product of what's going on that weekend.
http://www.yelp.com/biz/mandalay-san-francisco
and here for awesome Mexican food with some Yucatan peninsula recipes unlike anything else I've had. Also tequila, holy shit all of the tequila:
http://www.yelp.com/biz/tommys-mexican-restaurant-san-francisco-2
and here for liquid nitrogen ice cream made to order from seasonal locally sourced ingredients:
http://www.yelp.com/biz/smitten-san-francisco
and this is a good French Bakery but I don't know if the appeal holds for someone coming over from Europe:
http://www.yelp.com/biz/fillmore-bakeshop-san-francisco#query:filmore bakery
and I like this taqueria better than any of the others in San Francisco, although my favorite is in San Jose now:
http://www.yelp.com/biz/taqueria-la-cumbre-san-francisco
and this place has amazing tortas (think burrito sandwich):
http://www.yelp.com/biz/thats-it-market-san-francisco
and this place is a hell of a lot better than The Counter, I don't care what @BusterK says:
http://www.yelp.com/biz/pearls-deluxe-burgers-san-francisco
There's a Sonic in Hayward out in the East Bay, and a Five Guys in San Jose, I would say hit also hit up Orginal Tommy's Hamburgers in LA too if you need all the fast food.
This guy has taken up residence in the Sutro Bath ruins, which are cool even if you don't see him:
http://baynature.org/articles/sutro-sam-river-otter-getting-too-much-attention/
Fisherman's Wharf is good, the boat museum is good, the Musee Mechanique is pretty cool, but don't eat at the In-N-Out here. It is more expensive than other locations and there is better food to be had if you just look around. Ghirardelli Square is also in that general area and I really like Kennedy's but since the place is apparently a fairly British concept transplanted here so it might not be to your standards.
http://www.yelp.com/biz/kennedys-irish-pub-and-curry-house-san-francisco
For Thai food hole in the walls are preferred, King of Thai Noodle and Osha Thai are also acceptable.
Depends what you're looking to see - Chicago downtown has a great mix of architecture, and very walkable.
Shedd Aquarium is nice
Botanic Gardens is really nice, you'd need a car or a long train ride (about an hour) coming from downtown.
Some architecture tours, also via boat can be interesting
Avoid Navy Pier. It's not bad or anything, just didn't turn out quite like they planned.
There's lots of food options, of course. Pizza is popular, but a lot of other great choices.
Be sure to get the Trip Advisor apps - let's you browse cities offline, so no worries about roaming.
Through various occurances, my (youngest) sister has decided not to go, but my two other sisters (older than her, younger than me) are now going. Also due to flight price shenanigans we are dropping Chicago and driving SF -> LA -> LV. Chicago may possibly be part of an East Coast excursion sometime next year. So the timetable looks like:
- Seven days in SF/Surrounding Area
- Two days driving to LA, in order not to spend the entire day driving
- Two days in LA, drive to LV
- Three Days in LV/Surrounding Area
- Due to flight times, we have roughly twelve hours to spend in New York
So new questions:
- For SF at least, we are considering an apartment, Ideally in the northern part of the city. The prices we're seeing for a week is around $2000. Is that a good price for five people?
- If we're doing the Pacific Coastal Highway over two days, where's the best place to stop for the night?
- Quick and Dirty LA sightseeing guide
- Would we bother with apartments for LA and LV, or just get hotel rooms?
- For the youngest sister going on this holiday, she's the only one who has never been in New York. What to see in twelve hours?
La Brea Tar Pits
California Science Center (it has a space shuttle)
The Getty
Griffith Observatory (it doesnt take too long to run through it and really Id go after going to the Getty just for the view of the city at night)
As for Vegas? Id get a hotel, Vegas is all about hotels.
Airport to the city is an hour, so 10 hours left. Customs/security will take even more. Realistically, you're looking at... 8? It really depends on what time you will be in the city.
If you're getting In-N-Out on the West Coast, and don't get me wrong, they make a hellishly good Double-Double Animal Style, but you will have to give Five Guys on the East Coast a go.
Turn two of those days into a Grand Canyon trip. There is nothing you can see in Cali over those two days that will match the GC and it is not that far from Vegas, particularly if you are already wanting to drive to the Boulder Dam.
If don't feel like driving all the way to the GC, then I would shave a night off of SF and spend one day doing Zion National Park in Utah. It's only about 3 hours from Vegas.
Seriously, you can't get on a transcontinental flight from Ireland and spend two weeks in the American Southwest without seeing the GC.
Agreed so much.
On the driving SF/LA. Take the PCH/California 1. Always! ALWAYS! It's such a great drive! It inspired The Decemberists to write a song about it, in the California One/Youth and Beauty Brigade (
Stop at Morrow Bay or Big Sur! It's about the mid point, San Simeon is gorgous. Hearst Castle is pretty amazing to look at. Dude definetly pillaged the hell out of Europe and made his own private museum. Note: Taking the 1 over the I-5 down adds about 2 hours to your trip, but it's well worth it.
For reference, the Interstates are like the M roads, at least as far as my understanding of your guys's highway system (I was just there last week, the Cliffs of Moher are amazing!).
Long Beach is pretty great.
Vegas, I haven't been in about 10 years, but so much to do.
Shit, now I'm actually looking forward to going back to Cali, after seeing some of this. One more month!
Just to clarify: It's not JFK we're using, it's Newark. Plane lands at 7am and leaves at 9:30pm, so I was deducting 2.5 hours already, and my research shows it's about half an hour from that airport to Penn Station on NJ Transit.