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The other side of the barricade- please help me get myself off the ground
Mayday
Cutting edge goblin techRegistered User regular
Cutting edge goblin techRegistered User regular
Please excuse this wall of text, I couldn't do it otherwise, also sorry for my English.
A lot of the H/A stories I see which involve people problems are stories of trying to walk away from failed relationships, cutting yourself off from abuse etc, generally- how to deal with terrible people. I come here from the other side... how to stop being terrible people?
I am a failure.
Ever since I was a kid, I've had MASSIVE problems getting shit done. I have literally spent my entire youth behind my desk, trying desperately to study/do homework, and failing. What I did instead was drawing cartoons, reading books, playing video games when no one was looking etc. I was a smart kid, so I got by, managed to finish primary school with good grades and get to the best highschool in the capital. However, my constant failure to properly study left me with absolutely no self esteem, so I've had no friends, every girl I fell in love with I was too ashamed to even approach etc.
Highschool was an educational nightmare, "being smart" was no longer enough obviously, and with my continuing failures to study I barely managed to pass every semester. Halfway through I chose to study architecture and started attending preparation courses but being incredibly intimidated by all the talented people who attended, I continued my pattern of not doing anything. At that time, my self esteem and general energy was so low, I basically no longer cared about anything, only decided to try for college to satisfy the expectations of my parents etc.
I managed to make some good friends at that time, also met a girl who accepted me somehow. So when I finished highschool and failed to get to college, I felt even more ashamed, because this time there were people I cared about, whose opinion mattered to me.
I spent a year in community college and then got accepted to college in another city. I moved out and began to study architecture. The first semester was surprisingly okay, but I quickly reverted to my old patterns. It turned out architecture isn't really for me, but I continued to try and study out of shame, not wanting my parents' already spent money to go to waste and so on. A year after I started my girlfriend moved in with me. She got a master's, then another bachelor's, then moved back to the capital to start working in civil service. We even got married in the meantime. Shortly after moving back to the capital, she said she's losing patience and she can no longer tolerate my failures and waiting for me and she gave me a choice- I was supposed to either quit college and start working or finish the college.
I chose to continue trying to finish college for the reasons mentioned before. All this time I was battling the urge to just disappear from the life of everyone I know- run away, hide, commit suicide, whatever. I've been going to (pretty intense group) therapy for the past few months hoping it would help. The only result was that my therapist told me I need to stop trying to meet my environment's and family's expectations and focus on what I want to do in life.
It's been eight goddamn years since I've started college and today I've pretty much had a total breakdown, I am unable to continue. I've told my wife I want to quit, move in with her and start working (I'm a beginning graphic designer and illustrator but I have enough connections to let me at least pay my part of the bills and mortgage for the apartment we've bought). She is mad at my failure to complete college and she's lost all hope in me. Se said she would have accepted this three years ago when she gave me the choice, but now all she sees in me is a total loser and she can't imagine a happy marriage with me. She's as much ashamed of me before her parents as I am.
She's not 100% clear on whether she'll let me move in with her, but at this point I'm not even sure if it will work, if I'll be able to work and make proper money. I feel like I've stopped developing somewhere in primary school and there's no hope for me anymore.
I certainly won't be able to continue living if she leaves me- this is not just how I feel now, this is how I've been feeling for years and no amount of medication or therapy has changed it. It is not something I could tell her (she's a pretty harsh person and all suicides are idiots in her eyes and besides even if it did have any meaning to her I wouldn't want her to be with me just to prevent my suicide).
I've had enough therapy with pretty much no practical improvement to know that this will not help me now. I can't even bring myself to call my family or friends to tell them what's going on because of how ashamed I am. I don't want to keep hurting my wife anymore. I'm lost and scared and I don't know what to do or to say to her to help.
If anyone here has had a similar situation or has dealt with a person like me, please, anything helpful will be a lifesaving treasure to me right now. Sorry for the chaotic post and lots of text.
A lot of the H/A stories I see which involve people problems are stories of trying to walk away from failed relationships, cutting yourself off from abuse etc, generally- how to deal with terrible people. I come here from the other side... how to stop being terrible people?
I am a failure.
Ever since I was a kid, I've had MASSIVE problems getting shit done. I have literally spent my entire youth behind my desk, trying desperately to study/do homework, and failing. What I did instead was drawing cartoons, reading books, playing video games when no one was looking etc. I was a smart kid, so I got by, managed to finish primary school with good grades and get to the best highschool in the capital. However, my constant failure to properly study left me with absolutely no self esteem, so I've had no friends, every girl I fell in love with I was too ashamed to even approach etc.
Highschool was an educational nightmare, "being smart" was no longer enough obviously, and with my continuing failures to study I barely managed to pass every semester. Halfway through I chose to study architecture and started attending preparation courses but being incredibly intimidated by all the talented people who attended, I continued my pattern of not doing anything. At that time, my self esteem and general energy was so low, I basically no longer cared about anything, only decided to try for college to satisfy the expectations of my parents etc.
I managed to make some good friends at that time, also met a girl who accepted me somehow. So when I finished highschool and failed to get to college, I felt even more ashamed, because this time there were people I cared about, whose opinion mattered to me.
I spent a year in community college and then got accepted to college in another city. I moved out and began to study architecture. The first semester was surprisingly okay, but I quickly reverted to my old patterns. It turned out architecture isn't really for me, but I continued to try and study out of shame, not wanting my parents' already spent money to go to waste and so on. A year after I started my girlfriend moved in with me. She got a master's, then another bachelor's, then moved back to the capital to start working in civil service. We even got married in the meantime. Shortly after moving back to the capital, she said she's losing patience and she can no longer tolerate my failures and waiting for me and she gave me a choice- I was supposed to either quit college and start working or finish the college.
I chose to continue trying to finish college for the reasons mentioned before. All this time I was battling the urge to just disappear from the life of everyone I know- run away, hide, commit suicide, whatever. I've been going to (pretty intense group) therapy for the past few months hoping it would help. The only result was that my therapist told me I need to stop trying to meet my environment's and family's expectations and focus on what I want to do in life.
It's been eight goddamn years since I've started college and today I've pretty much had a total breakdown, I am unable to continue. I've told my wife I want to quit, move in with her and start working (I'm a beginning graphic designer and illustrator but I have enough connections to let me at least pay my part of the bills and mortgage for the apartment we've bought). She is mad at my failure to complete college and she's lost all hope in me. Se said she would have accepted this three years ago when she gave me the choice, but now all she sees in me is a total loser and she can't imagine a happy marriage with me. She's as much ashamed of me before her parents as I am.
She's not 100% clear on whether she'll let me move in with her, but at this point I'm not even sure if it will work, if I'll be able to work and make proper money. I feel like I've stopped developing somewhere in primary school and there's no hope for me anymore.
I certainly won't be able to continue living if she leaves me- this is not just how I feel now, this is how I've been feeling for years and no amount of medication or therapy has changed it. It is not something I could tell her (she's a pretty harsh person and all suicides are idiots in her eyes and besides even if it did have any meaning to her I wouldn't want her to be with me just to prevent my suicide).
I've had enough therapy with pretty much no practical improvement to know that this will not help me now. I can't even bring myself to call my family or friends to tell them what's going on because of how ashamed I am. I don't want to keep hurting my wife anymore. I'm lost and scared and I don't know what to do or to say to her to help.
If anyone here has had a similar situation or has dealt with a person like me, please, anything helpful will be a lifesaving treasure to me right now. Sorry for the chaotic post and lots of text.
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First of all, thanks for the DF tileset. You've taken that game from incomprehensible to engrossing for thousands of gamers, myself included. That's an accomplishment you can take great pride in.
(also you don't need to apologize for your English, it's top notch
Second, I know some of these feels, bro. I can't claim to be in the same boat regarding your relationship with your wife, but I'm right with you on the procrastination and inability to study properly, the futility of school.
When I finally dropped out of college it was a brand new life for me. Even though I was just working a shit retail job it was glorious. It was real work, with a real purpose. And when I had to do some bureaucratic bullshit it didn't matter, 'cause at least I was getting paid to do it.
I'm at work right now but I'm going to be off and back with more thoughts in three hours or so.
fuck up once and you break your thumb / if you're happy at all then you're god damn dumb
that's right we're on a fucked up cruise / God is dead but at least we have booze
bad things happen, no one knows why / the sun burns out and everyone dies
You are not a 'failure'. Never start a conversation about yourself with that word. If you didn't want to study, well, you didn't want to study: there's nothing inherently wrong with that (although, obviously, there are certainly consequences for it).
I absolutely agree with your therapist. Decide want you want to do - not what you think other people want you to do for them or whatever - and work at it. I wasted a lot of my early twenties putting time towards trying to meet other people's expectations; it's just chasing shadows, and I felt so much better after I started spending my time the way I wanted to.
No no no. First, if you ever start thinking that you'll hurt yourself, call the national suicide prevention hotline for your country. Where are you from?
Second, if your wife seriously called you a loser and doesn't care if you or anyone else hurts themselves because they're in a bad place, her head isn't screwed-on right. Anyone can play the, "You're such a LOSER!" card on anyone, because the value attached to it is arbitrary. How many historical monuments has your wife constructed? None? What a loser! How many best-selling novels has she written? Still none!? Wow, what a loser. How many AAA blockbuster movies has she directed? What? Zero? Such a damn loser!
Please, don't hurt yourself over your spouse's negative attitude or because you feel like you're stuck in a rut.
You're not the terrible guy in a relationship thread. You're a pretty normal guy by the sounds of it. You're not a failure. Again, you're probably more famous and well loved than most of us will ever be, just from your DF tileset.
You're at a scary point in your life. You've been trying to do this thing that's against your nature for a longass time. Eight years? I've never done anything for eight years. That alone is a feat. That's not a failure, that's a mountain you climbed. It doesn't matter that you didn't reach the summit, because that mountain had no summit.
You don't need to be ashamed. You learned a lesson, and you know it's true because of the price you paid.
The best decision I ever made was quitting college. Instead of being shoehorned into what society said I needed to do, my life was open before me. It hasn't been the easiest, I'm still paying on the damn loans. It was an expensive lesson for me, too. And it was scary. I thought I *needed* to complete it to be successful, to be part of the middle class. To not be a poor person. For a while after I quit I was also very depressed, I had only my shit retail job, I didn't think I could make anything of my life. Though I've never told anyone this, suicide weighed heavily on my mind in those days.
But like everything else in life I've found, things moved on. I got a better job. I got new friends, since this was also the point in my life when I renounced my religion, and hardly knew anyone outside the church. I waded through that dark place to get where I am today. And things aren't always great, but I know they'll get better. They always do. No problem is permanent, and you don't need a permanent solution.
I've got hope in you Mayday. You're a good man, and deserving of what this life has to offer. It sucks and it hurts sometimes, but it's always worth it.
fuck up once and you break your thumb / if you're happy at all then you're god damn dumb
that's right we're on a fucked up cruise / God is dead but at least we have booze
bad things happen, no one knows why / the sun burns out and everyone dies
If so, call this number, please: 52 70 000
Also I will echo the other sentiments that what you have said so far does not make you a terrible person. There are plenty of legitimately terrible people in the world. If you feel like hurting yourself call a suicide prevention hotline (if they have them in your country) and/or seek medical attention. Here in the US at least if you go to the emergency room of a hospital and tell them you are feeling suicidal they have options for you like voluntary commitment, anti-anxiety medications, etc.
As an aside your graphics pack for DF is the one and only way I will play the game and you should take pride in being able to contribute positively to the world like that. Without your tileset I, and likely who knows how many more, might never have played DF. Or supported it through donations to Tarn. I would say that alone gives at least some evidence to you not being a terrible person.
PSN:Furlion
What you need to do is try to look forward. You're never getting those years back but time spent regretting them is more time wasted. There is so much more ahead of you. You have to see that if you don't let this drag you down, there will be a time in the future when you are much more settled and happy with yourself and you will look back on now as 'that incredibly shitty time I went through but came out the other side'.
Re: Your wife. I strongly advocate couple's counselling.
When I went to college, I finished with a non-ideal GPA (~2.8 out of 4) and by many standards, I did ok or fine, but not good, great or otherwise. While I might not be as good as the other guys and gals in my program, I had a different skillset which enabled me to find a career in a related field to my degree (chemistry) which I enjoy.
As others have mentioned, you might take a little time to figure out what it is you want to do when you grow up! Some folks spend their entire lives trying to figure that out and some get lucky and things fall into place. Perhaps you really do want a college degree, but not in architecture. Talk to the college to find out how much of your completed coursework can transfer to other programs.
Another way to look at it might be using an example like this. I know folks who really don't enjoy their 9-5 jobs at all. However, those jobs not only help pay the bills, but it helps them brew beer, record music, or do whatever hobbies they really enjoy. So to them, the work is simply a means to the real enjoyment they have. A different way of looking at things could always help as well, if you're open to doing it.
For example, you said it's not a good feeling that you've technically been in college for eight years. Why not say you're only X years from finishing your degree? Both are true, but one has a slightly more positive outlook. If you enjoy being a graphic designer, why not consider looking for a certificate program to start with that'll help you with that job or career choice?
It might not mean much coming from a random guy on the internet, but I think when you find something you really enjoy or find that drive, you're going to rock it and be really proud of yourself.
Considering my past experience with college I am 100% sure I won't be able to make it, so at this point it's out of the question. Not only is it a problem with studying, I also miss my wife too much. (We're living six hours away from each other and as a result, only see each other every two weeks).
Switching majors is not an option, especially switching to graphic design (college works differently here). I'd pretty much have to start from scratch at this point, might as well try to do that in the capital where our flat is.
I've had a talk with my wife today and she pretty much told me to move in and we'll see how it works out, but she also said she feels like she doesn't have a choice. It feels like if we didn't have this flat, she wouldn't be interested anymore. I wish there was something I could do or say, but at this point I've failed to keep my promise and my word means little. I'm not even sure if she'll be happy with me even if I start making good money on my own.
fuck up once and you break your thumb / if you're happy at all then you're god damn dumb
that's right we're on a fucked up cruise / God is dead but at least we have booze
bad things happen, no one knows why / the sun burns out and everyone dies
Were I living alone I could probably accept this. However, this not how my wife feels. Both she and I are from an environment of highly successful people, where most of her peers make more money than her parents, everyone's got a degree (well, most of her friends are civil servants from her post-graduate program). My three best friends (also my peers) are- a dude who's already a doctor of philosophy, a very successful businessman (both are married with kids now) and a dude who had similar problems to me but at least managed to get his BA and start his own business.
My wife has said that my failure has killed her hope for a happy marriage and she's just going to focus on work from now on. It sounds like she's made up her mind and isn't going to agree to investing time and money into couples counselling. I still love her very much and want things to work out between us, but I'm afraid without her support I'll have huge problems working. I've talked to my best friend a lot today and he said I have his and his wife's support, whatever I need, so I don't feel completely alone.
:^: Good friends who will stand by you are worth more than any degree.
fuck up once and you break your thumb / if you're happy at all then you're god damn dumb
that's right we're on a fucked up cruise / God is dead but at least we have booze
bad things happen, no one knows why / the sun burns out and everyone dies
It's weird to me that living together as a married couple wouldn't be assumed once there's not a reason for you to be apart.
It's weird to me that she could say that she's not going to be happy with you ever and you want to stay with her.
It's weird to me that your friends are being a hundred times cooler about all of this than your wife.
If she's not happy, you probably aren't going to be happy with her. I'm not sure that moving back in with her is going to help YOU.
Just.. from what I've read you say this is such a different situation from what I think of as two people who want to be together that I'm not sure what to tell you, but I'm definitely worried about you being in it especially if you're depressive to start.
I might have quoted wrong, it's more like she's afraid she's not going to be happy with me. But that's (among other things) because she's afraid I won't be able to work either. I'm hoping if I'm successful with my work, things will be okay.
Well, our relationship has been very strained for the past few years, and it's her life that is being affected much more than my friends'. And my friend DID spend like two hours today trying to persuade me to continue studying.
I share this fear. But at the same time, I am a very lonely person. I know I should try to focus on being emotionally self-reliant in this situation, but I don't think I have the ability, and I'd rather devote my energy to making things work better between us. I love her very much, I'm loyal and while I acknowledge that she is harsh and cold at times, I also acknowledge she's having a much more difficult relationship with me than pretty much anybody she knows.
Yep, right now I am much more invested in this relationship than her (at least that's what it looks like from my perspective). But my friend (who's been talking with her as well today) says she's much less resigned that I'm making her out to be, and apparently from both conversations (with me and with my wife) HE is hopeful about this and her attitude. It might be that she was really angry and upset yesterday.
Well, look at me, I've spent quite some time defending her right now. I just wanted to let you know that I see the danger here.
Also I've managed to talk with my father today and tell him a bit about what's going on, he just said that I'm an adult and whatever I was expecting, he's not angry or disappointed because it's my life. So while of all the family he was the person about whose reaction I cared the least, it's still a small load off my heart.
I'm just trying to understand where her attitude stems from to see if there's any other advice we could give. For example, is it not completing college or is the root of it that there is a huge financial strain? Is it more of a social pressure of feeling like you aren't keeping up with the rest of your peers and it's reflecting badly on her? You mentioned inability to complete things, does that extend to other projects and/or promises you made to her?
It sounds from other forumers like you've completed other projects on your own that were very successful, which would indicate that it isn't that you can't finish things, it's just that you have trouble finishing things you aren't interested/engaged in.
On the other hand, if those things you're having trouble finishing extend to things you promised/told your wife that you would do (even mundane stuff like not helping with housechores when you said you would), then that could be a very major factor in her negative attitude.
Yeah, this is what she said. Among other things, it's about the concerns of her parents as well (who believe a college degree is very important).
Hard to tell. We lived together for 5 years. but we've been living apart for 2,5years now. I didn't make any other promises than this. I did have some problems with housechores when we lived together, at least when I was the most depressed. I think I've got that under control now though (except for the last few days which have been a real downer).
But yeah, from our conversation it seemed like she's mostly upset about how I look compared to our peers.
In any case, my latest therapy did help with my procrastination problems not related to college, I was finally able to understand why I'm having them and I'm learning to deal with them so I have much hope. With college it was just getting worse and worse.
We've been talking a bit, things seem to be better emotionally. I'm moving in on Friday, we'll see how it goes.
None of you are in a position to make big decisions now as nobody is at their best when under strain. Small steps toward a better situation. Try to be there for each other and screw your peers.
This big thing that was weighing down on you both will hopefully start to lift now you're taking positive steps to move on from it, but it'll take time and effort to get out from its lasting effects and there will be an initial transition phase.
If strain leads to conflict, that's where a couple's counsellor can do wonderful work in providing a neutral arbitrator to air worries, keep the real problems in perspective and not let the emotions boil over and obscure everything.
Also, we are NOT our jobs, there is much more to us humans. Looks to me like your wife is "in love" with the prestigious job that you do not have. I am with Ceres on the points she has enumerated. I feel weird about it too. I can imagine how she feels, to a certain extent.
But you are not a failure. Everybody here agrees. Hang in there. The dark clouds will pass as it cannot rain all the time...
...Okay. Uh.
Aren't you / your marriage more important to her than what her parents think about your education / social status? I mean, yikes.
If you're lonely, I totally know where you're coming from, but your spouse does not sound like she's going to make things better for you if/when you move in with her. Have you told her any of the things you've said here (aside from the fact that you don't want to pursue architecture anymore)?
I think I can speak to you on both accomplishment level and relationship level. First of all, being married to someone is sticking with them through thick and thin. If you have been college for that long, so what? You found out you may not be cut out for college. Not everyone is and it is NOT a big deal. If she is so concerned with your couples social status in comparison to education, then her priorities in your marriage are completely out of whack. My wife has gone to school for over 5 years, for two completely different things and I completely supported/still support her to finish despite being at least another year or two out. Marriage is all about supporting the other unconditionally and its a two way street. If she isn't doing it, then it sounds she isn't committed to the marriage or rather using your education as an excuse for a way out. If that is the case, you will be better off leaving then staying, despite your willingness to work.
As for accomplishment level, you have done some freelance artwork for me for money in the past. You were professional, courteous and most importantly, timely with the results. You should have no shame in your abilities or capabilities as an artist. You should be proud of what you can do and will do in the future. Perhaps continuing with a passion in freelance artwork could give you some work/money while you decide how you want to proceed.
So you didn't get a degree, so what? Forget it, it was making you miserable and putting all this strain on your relationship!
Here's my advice to you, find a new passion to devote your energy to. Maybe it'll be painting, music, maybe you can give back to you community (volunteering at a homeless shelter, or a crisis hotline, or whatever). Something where you feel like you're making a positive impact in any way, big or small. Give yourself a purpose again. life doesn't revolve around some stupid piece of paper and the success of your life doesn't have to be all about what degree you got or what stupid company you founded or whatever other bullshit everyone else is doing.
You've already got the support of your best friend, stop wasting time and get your act together with a new life where you're focusing your energy on things that make you HAPPY. This seems like a rough time in your life, but there are people who are there for you and who believe in you.
Also please stop calling everything a "failure"!!! Its not true and you're just making things worse for yourself by perpetuating this idea that you're a failure (which you aren't)
Take it from someone who was hardcore on the college track for his entire life, who did all the prep work, leg work, and extra work, got into a great school, and then found out "hey, this is making me miserable, maybe this isn't for me?" I spent 5 years of my life trying to get a degree, and one of the most mature decisions I've ever made was "it's time to stop wasting time and money on something I'm never going to get, just to fulfill someone else's idea of what is best for me."
I still managed to get a reasonable job that feeds me and puts a roof over my head.
I still have people who tell me on a occasional/frequent/weekly/daily basis "oh, you're so smart, why can't you just complete college. It's so important!" It sounds like you do too. Here is the trick: Do not listen to these people. They may well have what they think are your best interests at heart, and you should appreciate that they care about you, but they do not know what makes you happy, and continuing to pursue something that makes you unhappy and depressed to the point of suicide is not a responsible or adult thing to do. You have an obligation to yourself to provide for your own safety, happiness, and well being.
I struggle with a lot of these issues myself, so you should know that you are not alone in feeling the way you, but, also you are not alone, period, so please don't forget that.
It sounds like the Mayday's wife is having to come to terms with some incredibly disappointing news that she has gotten possibly mostly out of the blue, after putting up with some pretty extreme hardship for two and a half years. I don't know if you've just been sitting on this, letting it fester quietly Mayday, but if you have finding out suddenly that she's put up with being in a long distance relationship for an extended period of time for what seems like nothing right now must be hard. If you guys are the type to talk about long term ambitions, having enough money you don't have to worry about it, being able to provide a better life than the two of you had, being able to have enough money to do things your families weren't able to afford, while it's not a guarantee she's having to look at giving up these sorts of hopes all of a sudden. It doesn't mean that she isn't in love with you anymore but that sort of thing is a shock to the system.
I went through a similar thing with my girlfriend recently. We aren't married, but we've been in a relationship and living together for almost four years now, talk frequently about the types of dreams above, when we talk about our future it's in decades not years, share a car loan, etc. When we got together she was talking about studying medicine, and that was great that meant she'd be a good earner, I'd be a good earner, we'd be able to provide a real stable life for our kids. Then she decided she wasn't really into medicine aside from the earnings potential and she didn't really have a fallback she was interested in besides History...which isn't super practical right now, so she started studying Computer Science because she's a technically savvy gal.
A while back I had an opportunity through a client/friend I developed back when I was an unemployed freelance tech support dude to work on a killer idea for an iOS application that a large corporation interested in marketing it for free, an artist with a record contract that we could piggyback off the label's media push, a bunch of really good stuff but no real money until after launch. I tried to make enough time for it and I failed because I was too busy with the career I'd lucked into since I worked on this guy's computers. Quitting to work on this thing that seemed like it could work out great but might not wasn't an option because of the economy and because I was working my ass off so we could move out of her parent's place, so I roped her into it. It was a rocky start because nobody involved had much programming experience, the functionality we needed to implement was massively more advanced than anyone realized, but she's smart as a button and has a natural aptitude for it and it progressed. Dude we're working on this with made some contacts at Apple, and Youtube, and Facebook through the store he owns who helped out with some of the trickier parts. He met a recruiter for iOS developers through his store and I met another through a recruiter I used to work with. They both tell us that proficient iOS devs are making ridiculous money right now because of out of whack supply/demand. The program will make an impressive demo for her if it doesn't make us money by itself, and it's an ideal place to launch a career even if it is a bubble.
It's almost ready for release and she starts to express reservations about working as a programmer. She doesn't really enjoy it. She doesn't have a passion for it. Even though she's come so far, she has such a knack for it, fuck she's probably going to be making close to double what I am without a degree. I ask her if she knows what she wants to do instead and she says no.
So I ask her if she thinks working food service or retail is really going to be more enjoyable?
She tells me no and I tell her that's why I'm working the job I work. I enjoy aspects of it tremendously, but 90% of it is incredibly mentally taxing, skull crushingly boring, and if I fuck up on accident the consequences can be pretty catastrophic. But I'm pretty good at it, I make good money now and I'll probably make lots of money later if I stick with it, I work from home and I can work from anywhere, the job security and mobility is amazing because of how few people are good at what I do. It allows us to buy a shitton of happiness when I'm not working and has allowed me to support her endeavors for over a year. At the same time, I don't have the passion for it that drives the people I know that are great at it to think about it 24/7. I have way too many other interests, several of which I would much rather work at if I could figure out a way to do so. I want to be solving big problems that make the world a better place even if it's in small incremental ways. What I'm doing right now mostly just makes people money, keeps people from robbing money, and usually I'm helping out giant banking institutions that I kind of hate. But until I have a good exit strategy this is a path that provides us a large amount of security, and will provide an awesome life for our family when we have one.
So she stuck with programming. There's been ups and downs. She seems happier with it than she was before. I don't know if it's the different perspective or if it's because it's getting easier as she learns more. I hope that if she ends up getting a job in an office with other programmers she can learn from it will be a lot better. Internet programmers that offer advice are not always the most socially skilled or easy people to work with. They are frequently dicks. I think a lot of the problem was she'd never really done anything that she didn't like, or that was hard. I'd been in a similar mindset when I was younger but the rubber hit the road when I got older because my family was a lot poorer than hers and couldn't afford to let me be a dedicated student with no job while I figured out what I wanted to do with my life. I told her she was old enough the rubber needed to hit the road, especially in light of the opportunity she'd been presented with that may or may not be available later. Things like this are all timing and luck.
I'm not saying that all her problems are your problems. For one you've been putting a tremendous amount of effort towards school, and presumably towards maintaining your marriage when it went long distance. Maybe finishing out your degree isn't the best option but you need to think about things long term, and the impact your potential lack of employability is going to have on your wife. Are you good at architecting? Will it provide the both of you with a good income that you can use to do things you actually enjoy? Maybe the answer is that you hate it so much now that no matter how good the money is it isn't worth it to your mental well-being. Even if this is the case, how likely is it that the degree will be an asset in securing another type of employment that you will be able to tolerate, if not enjoy? Would it severely hurt your chances without it? I don't know what it's like in your country, but my French professor related that when he wanted to work in France as a restaurant manager even though he had years of experience in the States, he couldn't secure employment there because the way the bureaucracy of it all worked he needed some type of restaurant management degree everywhere he tried. Forget about having a career as an Information Security Researcher like me without a BS over there, or a programmer like my girlfriend without any degree, no matter how much experience and examples of your work you're able to show.
You need to do what is going to make you happy, but it's got to be within reason.
From the way you've laid the situation out, I'm honestly of the opinion you'd both be having a better go at it if you weren't long distance. It's easy to underestimate how important chemistry is to maintaining fondness in a relationship, and that is almost impossible long distance. Your announcement probably would have been less of a shock to her, the isolation probably wouldn't have allowed her to nurture her own doubts about you in silence. I think moving back in with her could be really good for you if you're both willing to work at your relationship. Couples therapy will be invaluable for this, I could see one on one therapy and possibly some sort of medication could be great for you personally as well. You remind me a lot of me when I was trying to white knuckle my ADHD. Do you have problems focusing on stuff that you know you need to and want to as well, or was it just a true disinterest with a disregard for consequences that led to you poor scholastic performance when you were younger? It can be hard to tell if you have to do something you're disinterested in. After struggling with and dropping out of highschool, forcing myself through an AAS (technical) degree, I finally realized that I was a dumbfuck for going off the meds they gave me when I was a teenager when I was 25 and couldn't for the life of me get through reading I needed for my current job, even though I wanted to desperately. Amphetamines have changed my life immeasurably for the better.
I've wrote way too much already but I've been lots of the places you are and felt lots of the things you've felt. When I was a kid they thought I was a prodigy. Taught myself how to read adult novels and do math all the way up to long division by the time I was five. I had parents traumatized by some pretty horrendous childhood abuse and as a result my father was emotionally abusive in his own small ways and my mother was negligent. I shouldered a lot of the burden of taking care of my younger siblings as early as when I was five. I had a mental break of sorts and started acting out in covert ways when I was a little bit older that hurt my entire family tremendously. Things were bad for a long time, I spent some time in a school for troubled boys, I dropped out of highschool, my mom had a crippling stroke on my 16th birthday, died a couple weeks before Christmas when I was 17, went back to highschool through an independent studies program and was a few units shy of completion when I aged out of the program, I fucked up some shit jobs, fucked up some community college, did a degree at an overpriced waste of a (accredited) college and tried to enter the job market in the heat of the recession, my father didn't understand why I couldn't find work, my stepmother is a wretched bitch who wanted my dad but not his kids and I ended up homeless as a result, I got fired from my big career break because they needed a scapegoat after a year of employment after two years with none and I thought everything was over but things turned out okay in the end. Sometimes the only way to learn is by fucking shit up but it doesn't mean you can't pick up the pieces and come out even more of a badass even though it's most assuredly going to be painful for a while.
Mayday, people in this thread that know you better than me are saying you are awesome and it sounds like you are. If your wife is unable to see that anymore then that's okay and it's not your fault you couldn't live up to her expectations. If programming doesn't work out for my girlfriend I'll be disappointed at what could have been but I'll support her at whatever she needs. I just needed her to make an honest go at it before calling it quits and I think that's some of what your wife is feeling right now. If it isn't then fuck her, go be awesomer without her, but you definitely need to weigh the outcome of all your potential decisions carefully right now either way, you are at a turning point.
I know you said that because of the way the schools work over there you can't roll any of the units from architecture up in to a graphic design degree, but you said that you could study graphic design at a school in the capital with your wife. Would it be possible to transfer to there and finish out your architecture degree there close to her? Something to think about. It kills me how close I was to graduating highschool at the end and I didn't spend nearly the time and effort you have on that. Try to think about how things will be years from now instead of how you feel now. Now doesn't matter, it's all about what you do and how you position yourself for the future.
As I said before, anybody suggesting such should be ignored. You've both been through tough times and you both have a good opportunity to work together on rebuilding the damage now you're moving back in together. She's upset and that's understandable right now, but the important thing is she wants you back with her.
Hm. Mayday wrote that she did want him to move in with her, but she didn't feel like she had a choice.
I'm travelling tomorrow and she seems excited to spend the Saturday skiing together (she was pushing me to get my shit together and come as soon as possible). Overall her mood seems to have changed a lot since Monday. At this point I'm getting paranoid and afraid she wants me to come over quickly so she could tell me she's dumping me, but I'm trying not to hold on to those thoughts.
Once again, many thanks for all your support, guys. Some of the things you wrote are things I KNEW but didn't FEEL, which might have been a big part of the problem.
@Giggles- a big part of the problem is that I'm not only not enjoying architecture, I've also never been very good at it. The case is pretty complex in that it meshed with my procrastination and anxiety problems, but at this point I don't feel like wondering what could have been. It would take me two years of very hard work and living alone (watching my marriage get even worse) to get a BA, something I'm pretty sure I wouldn't be able to accomplish now. Not to mention in order to become an actual architect (with the ability to sign projects) I'd still need an MBA and two years of work, then another (very difficult) exam which many people take years to pass. Architecture college in the capital is kind of an elite thing, there's pretty much no credit transferred and the exams are hard as hell. I've considered all my options really and I couldn't find any way to continue.
Definitely be open to and seek out a diagnosis for why you procrastinate the way you do. Sounds bang on with what I was experiencing when I was unmedicated. ADHD is a thing and no amount of willpower will get you on the level of someone without it and it's incredibly draining to try.
It's most likely a case of self-sabotage, has to do with extreme fear of being dissatisfied with my work, failure and being criticized. When faced with a task that I'm comfortable with, I can work 10 hours a day with maximum focus. When it's out of my comfort zone, I procrastinate and get extremely tired very quickly. All progress I've managed to make before therapy was by learning stuff on my own in my own pace in my own free time. Whenever it was forced in any way (which is pretty much all of the college work) it was a disaster. However, in my work as a graphic designer and illustrator, finally breaking through the procrastination resulted in a pretty good flow. In college, breaking procrastination still meant I had big trouble focusing and almost never enjoyed what I did.
I've been working on it and employing new methods and I've already seen quite some success. I definitely feel I'm on the right track, which is a great relief because my whole life I had no idea what was going on. If you guys are open to talk about these problems, I'd be very happy to, just not right now.
My advice is to learn how to fail gloriously and just start doing stuff. It's easier said than done though.
As expected, my wife's initial harsh words resulted from shock and being very upset. There's more to it but I don't think it requires explaining now.
I've moved in, we've talked a lot, we're going to try and make things work, I'll keep doing freelance jobs for now and look for some part-time job later on. I've got some additional activities planned to help keep myself sane, so if I don't have any depression problems and I manage to work consistently, everything should be okay. Neither of us are happy with this situation (other than finally living together) but we're both hopeful.
Many thanks for all your advice and support, it's helped me make it through what was one of the hardest weeks of my life.