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[PATV] Wednesday, March 6, 2013 - Extra Credits Season 2, Ep. 26: Word Choice
Note that I'm not an actual video game developer. Instead, I love to repurpose the lessons shown here for writing my roleplaying plot/scripts which, arguably, is a somewhat similar challenge.
It feels great to notice and udnerstand new aspects about this task with every new show - and also to get confirmation that some of the things I have already been doing instinctively actually served a very logical purpose beyond a mere "it felt right to do".
Keep them coming, and I would LOVE to see more episodes related to exposition/words/wording. (Granted, that might just be me and my special scenario ^^)
Someone definitely needs to go through Quantum Conundrum and just turn the uncle into Cave Johnson. Although I'm not sure whether this would be entirely due to poor characterisation, and not just because no-one likes the uncle because he always talks down at you and makes the player annoyed at him because of it.
Also, book-ending. Why does the Walking Dead game use it? I didn't understand why they used the same action sequence at the beginning and end of the game. It just seemed to me like a gratuitous use of this technique to no purpose, and if someone has an idea why they used that, I'd be interested to know. By then I thought we had confronted all the issues the game wanted to present us with, and then this technique popped in and I couldn't figure out what it was getting at.
Really great episode. I hate to be knitpicking, but was it really necessary show miranda's ass in the end of the video? I mean, i'd be hard pressed to find a scene in ME2 where Miranda appears and the camera is not on her ass, but still, couldn't a different scene be chosen?
EDIT: On a completely diffenrent subject: Why did you change to youtube instead of the previous flash player? Just asking, because youtube is blocked here at work
Great episode, they showed a lot of ME in there which surprises me they did use Mordin Solus as an example.
It would have been very easy to just make him the "scientist who explains the genophage", but they made him debatably the best character in the game.
@franksands I believe it's because too many people were having problems with the Flash Player here, so they moved to Youtube since it has fallbacks that aren't flash based (plus you can easily watch on your mobile devices). Gabe or Robert mentioned it on Twitter I believe.
See, and if BioWare had really thought about their character, then for that last Mass Effect screenshot, "Dat ass" would've totally been an option.
But more seriously, this was an excellent, excellent episode. Not for nothin, but it's episodes like this that got me into EC in the first place. I don't really care about the societal impact of, or social issues in, games. Or, uh, aliens. I care about the craft.
"Also, book-ending. Why does the Walking Dead game use it?"
Wow, until you mentioned it I hadn't even noticed that they had done that, I was so caught up in the scene. I don't really want to tread too closely to spoilers just in case there are some people who played it so far, but I do think that technique was warranted in that particular scenario. Think about what that initial puzzle meant for Lee in terms of his understanding of the world and his place in it, and even where he was in the narrative, then think about what the last puzzle meant for Clem in those same terms. I think it worked well.
One of the interesting bits of research I was reading recently found that whether you phrase crime as a 'beast' or a 'disease' actually changed how people considered solving the problem - in other words what metaphors you use can change how your players play a game, giving them cues for how they should go about solving puzzles for example.
The difference between word choices literal meanings and how they're interpreted @ ~3 min has a (fairly common) technical term: denotation vs. connotation.
It's a pretty simple concept: denotation is the dictionary definition, and connotation is all the extra associations and baggage that people individually and society as a whole attach to that particular word.
Word choice is difficult because, while denotation (the literal meaning of what is meant to be said) is relatively easy to get right (still difficult if you intend to be precise and concise), connotation is extremely tricky. Connotation, as it depends on society and people's perceptions, changes over time and from person to person.
When two people/characters are talking, there's their literal word meanings (denotations), how they *intend* to convey those words (*their* perception of their own connotation) AND how those words are actually recieved (the other person's connotation). That makes for a 6 layer sandwich of meaning in any given conversation, without even including anything like body language.
Sorry for babbling, as a writer this particular subject fires me up.
And the reading aloud thing? Solid gold. Been using and preaching that technique since my dad taught it to me 14 years ago.
I was amused that you never actually featured pictures of bookends in the bookend part of the talk. I instantly assumed when the topic was brought up that you'd show the famous set of Portal bookends, but instead you had a picture of a book with the word end. Weird.
You might have been better served to read Fitz Quadrangle's dialogue instead of playing the actual audio. I heard John de Lancie's voice and watched the validity of your point evaporate before my eyes, because Q.
Diction is fiction's most perilous precipice.
Without it, you've darkness and half-empty promises.
Pluck words like cherries: not "diamonds" but "rhombuses."
And you will embark upon genius's genesis.
Well I like the episode, one thing about it raises an ire with me. That's the "to be or not to be" part.
The reason why it gets my Ire is that in of itself means nothing. It's not a pivotal point in the play or the character, the line after is the pivotal point.
"Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer
the slings and arrows of outrageous fortune,
or to take up arms against a sea of troubles,
and by opposing end them."
This is the core about the main character and the play. It's Hamlet's point where he questions his own moral compass and is the pivotal point where he puts his plans into motion without repercussions. "To be or not to be" is simply the lead in that has become as much of a catchphrase as Coltrain's "WOOO!!!" and it's a little depressing.
On the topic of bookends, anybody else hate them?
I mean I realise what they're for and I recognise that they can be helpful, but most of the time they feel like some convention that is adhered to out of tradition. And they generally have the subtle grace of a greenhouse falling down a mountain of pianos.
Can't really think of many examples right now, but GTAIV springs to mind as a big one.
GlaDos has an annoying (but not as annoying as Wheatly) voice & the other guy sounds like Q from Star Trek.
Um, John de Lancie did the voice for the Uncle. So it WAS the guy who did Q.
+1
ShadowenSnores in the morningLoserdomRegistered Userregular
Playing a lot of TOR recently, and word choice conveys a lot, and not just in the obvious ways, like a quest-giver continually addressing Sith as "my lord" while showing distaste for bounty hunters. In the Sith Inquisitor storyline, notice how many people call you "slave", and the first time someone calls you something other than that. Notice how even when you have progressed to the point where no one should be calling you slave, some characters still do. Notice how one of these characters has extremely distinct speech patterns, and also a very distinct character design...
problem with with human culture cannibalizing a line or concept (just got through explaining Atlas Shrugged and Ayn Rand to my mother) into something different in the popular lexicon.
About reading out loud your texts : I remember hearing about some classical authors that *shouted* their texts. Because it strains one's reading ability, and make even more apparent problems in writing.
Nice to see EC being on topic for more than a few episodes in a row. Keep up the great episodes about games.
I agree whole heartedly about prioritizing the character in the dialog and word choices. If you've ever played many paper & pen RPGs it's akin to "staying in character". Sometimes I make a list of words that are in a character's vocabulary in order to to keep their dialog consistent.
Also, in my experience, the more emotion you put into the out-loud readings the more humor you'll discover than anything else!
Bookending: The first and last line the Arbiter in Halo 3 says to a human were both "Were it so easy" In the beginning of the game it was something of a snark at the Chief. At the end it was the Arbiter making it clear his belief that the Chief isn't dead, that from what he'd seen of John-117, he doubted the Chief was actually dead.
When I played Bioshock: HOLY SHIT
When I look back on Bioshock: Hmm... I see now that that word choice was carefully chosen to make these scenes play out the way they did.
And yet, still, holy shit.
Also, Bastion's dialogue is not only beautifully delivered but also wonderfully written, and I'm really glad you guys had a shoutout to it. It's another one of those things where, when playing, you only feel the effect of the lines they say to you, but when looking back you see the myriad reasons why they delivered that effect.
As much as I'm learning and trying to play as a designer and be extra cognizant of what's being communicated and how, I really like actually feeling what they're going for. I think that's gotta be a part of a designer's arsenal: switching between "player" mode and "designer" mode. Afterall, Journey wouldn't have been nearly as fun if instead of being awed and amazed I just thought "Wow, they're really doing a great job evoking a sense of awe and amazement here".
A bit rambling, I know. But this was a great episode and I couldn't help but add my thoughts.
Posts
Note that I'm not an actual video game developer. Instead, I love to repurpose the lessons shown here for writing my roleplaying plot/scripts which, arguably, is a somewhat similar challenge.
It feels great to notice and udnerstand new aspects about this task with every new show - and also to get confirmation that some of the things I have already been doing instinctively actually served a very logical purpose beyond a mere "it felt right to do".
Keep them coming, and I would LOVE to see more episodes related to exposition/words/wording. (Granted, that might just be me and my special scenario ^^)
Also, book-ending. Why does the Walking Dead game use it? I didn't understand why they used the same action sequence at the beginning and end of the game. It just seemed to me like a gratuitous use of this technique to no purpose, and if someone has an idea why they used that, I'd be interested to know. By then I thought we had confronted all the issues the game wanted to present us with, and then this technique popped in and I couldn't figure out what it was getting at.
EDIT: On a completely diffenrent subject: Why did you change to youtube instead of the previous flash player? Just asking, because youtube is blocked here at work
I'm not even exaggerating.
It would have been very easy to just make him the "scientist who explains the genophage", but they made him debatably the best character in the game.
@franksands I believe it's because too many people were having problems with the Flash Player here, so they moved to Youtube since it has fallbacks that aren't flash based (plus you can easily watch on your mobile devices). Gabe or Robert mentioned it on Twitter I believe.
And you know, SE likes to do the book end thing a lot in general. Look at Kingdom Hearts 1.
But more seriously, this was an excellent, excellent episode. Not for nothin, but it's episodes like this that got me into EC in the first place. I don't really care about the societal impact of, or social issues in, games. Or, uh, aliens. I care about the craft.
So thanks guys!
Wow, until you mentioned it I hadn't even noticed that they had done that, I was so caught up in the scene. I don't really want to tread too closely to spoilers just in case there are some people who played it so far, but I do think that technique was warranted in that particular scenario. Think about what that initial puzzle meant for Lee in terms of his understanding of the world and his place in it, and even where he was in the narrative, then think about what the last puzzle meant for Clem in those same terms. I think it worked well.
Ah yes, that does make sense. I think I was too wrapped up in being Lee to see that similarity.
http://www.plosone.org/article/info:doi/10.1371/journal.pone.0052961
It's a pretty simple concept: denotation is the dictionary definition, and connotation is all the extra associations and baggage that people individually and society as a whole attach to that particular word.
Word choice is difficult because, while denotation (the literal meaning of what is meant to be said) is relatively easy to get right (still difficult if you intend to be precise and concise), connotation is extremely tricky. Connotation, as it depends on society and people's perceptions, changes over time and from person to person.
When two people/characters are talking, there's their literal word meanings (denotations), how they *intend* to convey those words (*their* perception of their own connotation) AND how those words are actually recieved (the other person's connotation). That makes for a 6 layer sandwich of meaning in any given conversation, without even including anything like body language.
Sorry for babbling, as a writer this particular subject fires me up.
And the reading aloud thing? Solid gold. Been using and preaching that technique since my dad taught it to me 14 years ago.
Without it, you've darkness and half-empty promises.
Pluck words like cherries: not "diamonds" but "rhombuses."
And you will embark upon genius's genesis.
The reason why it gets my Ire is that in of itself means nothing. It's not a pivotal point in the play or the character, the line after is the pivotal point.
"Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer
the slings and arrows of outrageous fortune,
or to take up arms against a sea of troubles,
and by opposing end them."
This is the core about the main character and the play. It's Hamlet's point where he questions his own moral compass and is the pivotal point where he puts his plans into motion without repercussions. "To be or not to be" is simply the lead in that has become as much of a catchphrase as Coltrain's "WOOO!!!" and it's a little depressing.
I mean I realise what they're for and I recognise that they can be helpful, but most of the time they feel like some convention that is adhered to out of tradition. And they generally have the subtle grace of a greenhouse falling down a mountain of pianos.
Can't really think of many examples right now, but GTAIV springs to mind as a big one.
Um, John de Lancie did the voice for the Uncle. So it WAS the guy who did Q.
Bioware's generally pretty good with word choice.
He's right, he's so f***ing right, its not even funny.
Sounds like your
but this episode ... is another example of just that!!!
keep it up and thanks for all the knowledge!!
A non-troll commenting guy
I agree whole heartedly about prioritizing the character in the dialog and word choices. If you've ever played many paper & pen RPGs it's akin to "staying in character". Sometimes I make a list of words that are in a character's vocabulary in order to to keep their dialog consistent.
Also, in my experience, the more emotion you put into the out-loud readings the more humor you'll discover than anything else!
When I look back on Bioshock: Hmm... I see now that that word choice was carefully chosen to make these scenes play out the way they did.
And yet, still, holy shit.
Also, Bastion's dialogue is not only beautifully delivered but also wonderfully written, and I'm really glad you guys had a shoutout to it. It's another one of those things where, when playing, you only feel the effect of the lines they say to you, but when looking back you see the myriad reasons why they delivered that effect.
As much as I'm learning and trying to play as a designer and be extra cognizant of what's being communicated and how, I really like actually feeling what they're going for. I think that's gotta be a part of a designer's arsenal: switching between "player" mode and "designer" mode. Afterall, Journey wouldn't have been nearly as fun if instead of being awed and amazed I just thought "Wow, they're really doing a great job evoking a sense of awe and amazement here".
A bit rambling, I know. But this was a great episode and I couldn't help but add my thoughts.