I dread choosing a major.

Jskrip

I posed here earlier looking for advice as to what I should do when I’m a civilian again and a couple of people suggested majoring in Computer Science. I’ve always had an interest in biology so Bioinformatics seemed like a logical choice. I have a huge boner for microbiology and molecular genetics too, but the job prospects seem really grim.

Would majoring in something like Microbiology be a terrible idea? Should I just go with something safe like Computer Science? How necessary is a PhD?

I’m also pretty passionate about getting involved in public health, something along the lines of epidemiology but that seems like an unobtainable goal.

I love the subject matter, but I’m afraid I’d be wasting my time.

zepherin

Here is the thing colleges will try to make you choose a major, and give you a shit load of grief for not choosing one. It is really rediculous how they try to pressure you into a major. So don't. Take your time. Honestly you can go for a year and a half before not choosing a major effects you. Don't let your college pressure you into an action your not comfortable with.

Skeith

Microbiology would give you a better chance to work anywhere near medicine/health than comp sci, but you'd need to be in school longer before doors really start opening compared to computers.

schuss

Honestly - take a variety of classes your freshman year, just make sure you go to a school that has decent programs in everything you *think* you may want to do. If biology+genetics are what you want to do, go for it, as there will always be good positions available at the high end, but note that you need a PHD to even get entry into the top level. Note that those are generally subsidized post-undergrad, but you will be in school for 10 years and in the lab 6 days a week.
However, don't just do something because job prospects are good. Shitty CS people are useless, whereas good ones are invaluable.

Scooter

zepherin wrote: »

Here is the thing colleges will try to make you choose a major, and give you a shit load of grief for not choosing one. It is really rediculous how they try to pressure you into a major. So don't. Take your time. Honestly you can go for a year and a half before not choosing a major effects you. Don't let your college pressure you into an action your not comfortable with.

This might be pushing it. Maybe it's true for liberal arts majors where it's a thin line between general electives and core classes anyways, but for a serious science/engineering degree I wouldn't go more than a semester without setting one. You're going to need to start on your math and science pre-requisites and you're not going to be able to cram 3 calc classes in one semester once you decide. Or at least, start taking the classes for the given majors even if you haven't picked one yet so you don't lose on time, and you can try them out a bit.

I can't speak for biology but as a CS grad myself I can say it's definitely a safe major, lots of job openings when I look around.

zepherin

I dunno most of the colleges I've seen had the same set of core classes. 2 years of English 1 year of general science/w lab 2 years linguistics 1 year of ethics. 2 years of upper level math. 1 year of technical writing. 2 years of history and 1 year of philosophy. Maybe your school was different but the schools I looked at and the ones I went too and one I graduated from required all students to take the same classes. Core curriculum as they say.

Jam Warrior

Biological research is frankly very grim job-wise currently. The economy downturn hit research grant budgets big time and things have yet to recover.

That said it was always going to be a job you did for the love, not the money.

finral

Speaking as an environmental biologist, having a general focus on a variety of classes as a base can give you a good solid foundation you might not get if you charge ahead into a hard science major. As Scooter said, there are a lot prerequisites you may need to get done, but I feel that my broad foundation has been very useful both in life and in work, when compared with my engineering colleagues who have less of a breadth. Take at least a semester (quarter?) or two to get in the groove of school and think about it.

ceres

So I got my degree in Cell and Molecular Bio. It is very, very different from Microbiology. Whether or not there will be a job for you depends entirely on where you are looking (as in, what area of the country), and the kind of lab experience you can get while you're in school. C&M tends to focus more on eukaryotic systems, and is definitely my one true biology love. Micro bores the crap out of me, and I can't tell you why because it doesn't make sense that it should. I just don't care about what happens in bacteria, but they are so varied that it seems like they should be interesting to me. I can chat your ear off about the differences between the two if it comes down to them. Keep in mind that compsci is horrendously oversaturated in some parts of the country. Compsci has been the degree to get for so long, and in some areas you have 16 state and local universities pumping out compsci grads. There just aren't as many jobs as there used to be, and entry-level no longer means the same thing. Epidemiology is definitely not out of reach, and I'd say it's maybe even a good choice as far as jobs go.

I think the best way to approach it is to figure out what job you want to do, and do what you need to get that. You may end up changing your mind along the way, but nothing is set in stone. If you decide on Bio, don't wait to declare general bio. You can pick a specialty later, but there are classes you can get out of the way your first semester that will be required no matter what, and not taking them right away can hold you up for three semesters... I know. >>

ASimPerson

As a CS major, I would say that you probably shouldn't major in CS if you don't want to. As ceres said, there's a CS grads in the market now and if you don't care it will show one or the other. Also your chances at a CS job will have a lot to do with where you're going to school. (To get an idea of what companies think of your school, find a list of company that were at the most recent career fairs.)

Gdiguy

Biology isn't a great field to be in now, but it's not completely terrible, it just depends what your long-term goals are. The job market is very tight if you want to do academic research and you're not at the top of your field, but the industry side isn't as bad. Good computational biologists are also still more rare, so there's still a bit more opportunity there if you're good.

In most cases you'll need a PhD eventually if you want to really progress career-wise, but I know people that went to industry first for a few years and then came back for a PhD after a few years, so it's definitely doable that way as well.

However, I do agree that those kinds of fields aren't usually ideal if you aren't really excited about them - to really succeed and get to a position where you can get a good job, you're going to have to put a lot of hours of work in at much lower wages than you should get, and if you aren't loving what you're doing it can be challenging. (The flip side is that if you do, it's awesome - I get paid to basically do what I'd love to do in my free time, so I don't mind getting paid kind of crappily for working 70 hours a week )

JusticeforPluto

My college had a "undecided" category, where you could just knock out your Gen Eds until you knew what you wanted to do.

I've worked okay paying (by my standard) jobs and hated them. So I'm a believer in do what you love.

I'll take making terrible pay and a job I love over slightly better pay and a job I hate.

GenlyAi

Gdiguy wrote: »

I know people that went to industry first for a few years and then came back for a PhD after a few years, so it's definitely doable that way as well.

Yup, I did this, and it worked well for me.

Anyway, I mentioned my thoughts on the bioinformatics job market in your other thread, but if you have any specific questions for someone who is currently in biopharma, who is (mostly) an informatics guy, and who manages informatics people, let me know.

MulysaSempronius

I don't know how it is for all colleges, but at mine, if you didn't start working on a science degree from your first semester, it was very difficult to get into it and complete in 4 years. Be aware of what the requirements are before you decide to just take gen ed classes.
That said, you can always take the pre-reqs and decide to dial down to having the subject as a minor. A minor is CS or bio could always be useful even if you decide to take the other path. Plus, taking the classes could help you decide more easily.

zepherin

GenlyAi wrote: »

Gdiguy wrote: »

I know people that went to industry first for a few years and then came back for a PhD after a few years, so it's definitely doable that way as well.

Yup, I did this, and it worked well for me.

Anyway, I mentioned my thoughts on the bioinformatics job market in your other thread, but if you have any specific questions for someone who is currently in biopharma, who is (mostly) an informatics guy, and who manages informatics people, let me know.

You can do post grad work and work in the industry if you are creative about it. I was pouring concrete while I was working on my masters thesis.

GenlyAi

zepherin wrote: »

GenlyAi wrote: »

Gdiguy wrote: »

I know people that went to industry first for a few years and then came back for a PhD after a few years, so it's definitely doable that way as well.

Yup, I did this, and it worked well for me.

Anyway, I mentioned my thoughts on the bioinformatics job market in your other thread, but if you have any specific questions for someone who is currently in biopharma, who is (mostly) an informatics guy, and who manages informatics people, let me know.

You can do post grad work and work in the industry if you are creative about it. I was pouring concrete while I was working on my masters thesis.

This is true, but how important it is depends on the degree. In bio, a Ph.D. is worth a lot more than a master's (glass ceiling), so I would recommend going the whole way if you're going to do a graduate degree. And the plus side is, those programs are mostly subsidized, to the point where you can expect a stipend while you're in school.

That said, there is a market for non-Ph.D.s, which is why it is a viable approach to work in industry for a few years before you decide whether to make the grad school plunge.

Neaden

Jskrip wrote: »

I’m also pretty passionate about getting involved in public health, something along the lines of epidemiology but that seems like an unobtainable goal.

I love the subject matter, but I’m afraid I’d be wasting my time.

Hey, I'm an epidemiologist and I'm not particularly great so it definitely isn't unobtainable, feel free to shoot me a pm if you have more questions.
I work at a local health department where I am the lone Epi so I do a wide range of things there (working on grants, working with the Emergency Response program, disease surveillance, outbreak investigation etc) at a larger health department or state health department there are people who handle just one of those issues specifically, so it is a pretty diverse field. I also know epidemiologists who work for private industry such as hospitals or pharmaceutical company working in research, quality control, or infection prevention.
If you are interested in being an epidemiologist, as in having that as your job title rather then just working in the field you will need a masters degree. I have a Masters in Public Health (MPH) in Epidemiology, there are also Masters of Science in Public Health and Masters of Science in Public Health which are more research oriented. As an undergrad your major isn't hugely important since what everyone will care about is your masters, make sure you check the requirements of the school you are applying to. I have a biology related undergrad as did most of the people I knew in grad school. In undergrad make sure to take some calculus, some statistics, basic biology and microbiology, and computer programming. Learn a statistics program, SAS is the most common for academic research and government but expensive and might be hard to find a class for, R is a good second choice and free, I am learning that on my own right now to try to broaden my skills.
You could also look into getting an MS in Biostatistics.
As for job prospects it seems like everyone I went to school with in Epi got a job fairly quickly, there are other aspects of public health that have a much harder time finding a job such as Community Health. The schools are competitive to get into but not outrageously so, my undergrad gpa was low but good GREs and a good essay got me in still. Make sure you get a degree is Epidemiology if that is what you want, some of the smaller schools with public health programs offer MPHs where you can take epi courses but you don't actually get a degree in it and from what I can tell employers really want you to have a diploma with the words epidemiology or biostatistics on it.

Saammiel

From what I understand, microbiology doesn't suffer the same dismal job market as a generalist biology degree. I have a relative who has an undergraduate bio degree and makes a very decent living doing compliance for a medical device firm. Granted, they have a lot of experience under their belt, but they could quit tomorrow and have another job lined up within probably a week or two. This person also doesn't have a graduate degree in micro either. However this is just an anecdote, it would be best to talk to someone at an entry level in the field if you can.

Comp Sci is a good degree choice, but if you don't like applied logic, doing it as a career choice might be dismal.

Skypoint

Jskrip wrote: »

I posed here earlier looking for advice as to what I should do when I’m a civilian again and a couple of people suggested majoring in Computer Science.

Should I just go with something safe like Computer Science?

I wouldn't consider Computer Science to be safe anymore. With the continuing march of outsourcing there aren't as many opportunities as there used to be and it's only going to get worse in future. It will become an increasingly competitive field with a large pool of people chasing a smaller pool of jobs.

My philosophy is that to be be successful, you need to be doing work you enjoy. If you have a passion or interest in biological sciences, and you think that you can find a career in that field that pays what you are looking for, then I would say the better choice is to pursue that interest.

k-maps

Skypoint wrote: »

Jskrip wrote: »

I posed here earlier looking for advice as to what I should do when I’m a civilian again and a couple of people suggested majoring in Computer Science.

Should I just go with something safe like Computer Science?

I wouldn't consider Computer Science to be safe anymore. With the continuing march of outsourcing there aren't as many opportunities as there used to be and it's only going to get worse in future. It will become an increasingly competitive field with a large pool of people chasing a smaller pool of jobs.

My philosophy is that to be be successful, you need to be doing work you enjoy. If you have a passion or interest in biological sciences, and you think that you can find a career in that field that pays what you are looking for, then I would say the better choice is to pursue that interest.

I assure you that even if all of that is true, your time spent learning computer science will not be wasted. If you can grok it and get a degree from a decent department, you will learn: (1) to think logically under extremely rigorous environments; (2) intermediate-level to advanced level of math that is applicable to many other fields (diff eqs, linear alg., discrete math, calculus); (3) how to design good experiments and analyze results (i.e., how to do science). As an added benefit you might end up being decent in a few general programming languages, and have no trouble picking up new ones as you go along. If you're keen on CS, I'd say go for it while minoring in Bio or whatever other science you might be interested in.

I assure you those classes will be easier for you after taking some more advanced CS, and you can always stay for longer to get a double-major, which will help you stick out if you go the graduate degree path. This is assuming you go to a good program that actually forces you to have the equivalent of an undergraduate thesis in order to graduate.

azith28

Look into the qualifications you would need to work on medical technologies. you DONT need to choose right now, but what you want to do is take several courses that are typically going to be usable for whatever major you eventually do choose. Take Computer science 101, take biology (which typically can replace a required science course that just about every major wants so you arent wasting time/money). See how you enjoy them. Even if you do choose one, the classes you take will be up to you to register for, you can change your major anytime and retain your credits.

CelestialBadger

Skypoint wrote: »

I wouldn't consider Computer Science to be safe anymore. With the continuing march of outsourcing there aren't as many opportunities as there used to be and it's only going to get worse in future. It will become an increasingly competitive field with a large pool of people chasing a smaller pool of jobs.

My philosophy is that to be be successful, you need to be doing work you enjoy. If you have a passion or interest in biological sciences, and you think that you can find a career in that field that pays what you are looking for, then I would say the better choice is to pursue that interest.

Very, very true.

You can only pick a degree with "employability" in mind in very broad terms. If you are considering two subjects wildly divergent in employability (say Literature vs Engineering) then you can let the employability factor lead you. But when picking between two solid subjects like Biology and CS, you cannot know which of them will be the better bet when you graduate. So in that case, study what you are most interested in, because you will be better at it.