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About the Penny Arcade Job Posting

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    OverloadedOverloaded Registered User regular
    Nogs wrote: »
    Overloaded wrote: »
    Butters wrote: »
    I am a professional in this field, and I would apply for it if I were in a place in my life where I could move to Seattle. If I were, then I have various ideas (and in some case functional prototypes) of ways PA could expand some of it's brands and increase their value and presence on the web, and it would be rad to actually be ablt to talk to them about it and show them what I already built in my free time.

    Really, internet outrage is just exhausting. There were no specific figures dicussed, but because they were honest that people at this company tend to spend a lot of time at work and don't necessarily get paid top dollar they think they have the right to complain endlessly despite knowing no specifics.

    So just out of curiosity: How old are you? How long have you been in the field? Are you married? Do you have kids? Medical expenses? A mortgage? A car?

    Also I'll point out that you're interested in the job, but not willing to move for it. Would that change if they were offering, say, $200,000/year plus moving expenses?

    There are no figures mentioned, but we know that it doesn't pay enough to put away any kind of significant savings while living in the area. It's certainly possible that this is all just an elaborate ruse meant to weed out people who wouldn't want to work at PA for free, then pay them well anyway. But assuming that everyone is being honest, this post makes that seem a lot less likely.

    are you fucking kidding me? $200k? you officially dont know what the hell you are talking about. stop trolling

    $200k is absolutely not unreasonable for that position. I'd consider $100k to be the minimum reasonable, anything below that and you're drifting into "taken advantage of" territory.

    This very much feels like a small business that had a "tech guy" who was willing to do whatever was needed, but has realized that he's being underpaid for his skill set. They're certainly free to go about replacing him however they want, but I just feel they could be doing it a lot better.


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    AthenorAthenor Battle Hardened Optimist The Skies of HiigaraRegistered User regular
    Avraham wrote: »
    Kethenn wrote: »
    Because I've been learning as I go, I've had to constantly triage out tasks and rely heavily on outside help - Rackspace's Managed Cloud support is an incredible (albeit costly) resource, Icyliquid has saved my ass more times than I can count, and the support of the shadowy PAX Engineering team, made up of Enforcers who are also IT or development professionals that I informally manage, has also been a huge boon. It seems like a herculean task for just one person.

    I'm curious is this like using unpaid volunteer labor, or simply drawing on advice from a peer network?

    IT is way too complicated a field to not have vendor support, either in the form of warranties or outright service contracts.

    He/Him | "We who believe in freedom cannot rest." - Dr. Johnetta Cole, 7/22/2024
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    courtneyjcourtneyj Newcastle, WARegistered User regular
    Jasconius wrote: »
    i think the value assessment that people are making on the desired skills of this job are way way way way overboard.

    they are looking for someone just one notch over Junior level as far as I can tell

    If my livelihood began and ended with my website, I'd want someone more than just over Junior to take the reigns and go forth with it. I think that's my issue. I agree with your point and wish they were trying to go big. They have so many people that are masters at what they do, I want them to have that at every possible level because I know these people who would be great at it and fit the description 100%.

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    NogsNogs Crap, crap, mega crap. Crap, crap, mega crap.Registered User regular
    GhostDan wrote: »
    JayKaos wrote: »
    Yeah they're not looking for someone with decades of experience in each category, they're looking for someone with like three years total in the field who's worked on / somewhat capable of working on a variety of areas.

    So they are looking for a guy with limited experience to run a 1 person IT department? That will work out well.


    ...it has so far? what are you trying to say here?

    guys fucking penny-arcade is not daddy warbucks here. it is a SMALL FUCKING COMPANY

    rotate.jpg
    PARKER, YOU'RE FIRED! <-- My comic book podcast! Satan look here!
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    TubeTube Registered User admin
    GhostDan wrote: »
    JayKaos wrote: »
    Yeah they're not looking for someone with decades of experience in each category, they're looking for someone with like three years total in the field who's worked on / somewhat capable of working on a variety of areas.

    So they are looking for a guy with limited experience to run a 1 person IT department? That will work out well.

    It's worked out pretty well for the last ten years.

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    bowenbowen How you doin'? Registered User regular
    Nogs wrote: »
    GhostDan wrote: »
    Nogs wrote: »
    are you fucking kidding me? $200k? you officially dont know what the hell you are talking about. stop trolling

    I make 6 figures for doing 2 of those functions. $200k might be a little overboard, but given the titles:

    Helpdesk
    Developer
    Sys Engineer/Sys Admin

    A systems engineer in Seattle alone goes for $90-100k. With being a developer and doing helpdesk stuff, expected to be on call 24/7/365 he should be looking at at least $130k, maybe closer to $150k. Also remember cost of living changes. That $150k position would probably go for under $100k in say North Carolina, because cost of living is so much lower there.

    yeah if you are a dedicated expert with years and years of experience in that one field.

    the guy leaving is 27 years old

    they are looking for a suitable jack-of-all-trades junior-ish replacement

    for a company that is not a billion dollar fortune 500 company

    That's 7+ years of experience. You think someone with a PhD equivalent knowledge should be making nothing?

    not a doctor, not a lawyer, examples I use may not be fully researched so don't take out of context plz, don't @ me
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    AthenorAthenor Battle Hardened Optimist The Skies of HiigaraRegistered User regular
    Nogs wrote: »
    GhostDan wrote: »
    JayKaos wrote: »
    Yeah they're not looking for someone with decades of experience in each category, they're looking for someone with like three years total in the field who's worked on / somewhat capable of working on a variety of areas.

    So they are looking for a guy with limited experience to run a 1 person IT department? That will work out well.


    ...it has so far? what are you trying to say here?

    guys fucking penny-arcade is not daddy warbucks here. it is a SMALL FUCKING COMPANY

    It's funny watching this come up time and time again. Like, Fantasy Flight Games is small potatoes compared to WotC/Hasbro, and yet people expect them to have these massive support networks. I think it is just that people's perceptions of companies on the internet are skewed.

    He/Him | "We who believe in freedom cannot rest." - Dr. Johnetta Cole, 7/22/2024
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    DoobhDoobh She/Her, Ace Pan/Bisexual 8-) What's up, bootlickers?Registered User regular
    GhostDan wrote: »
    JayKaos wrote: »
    Yeah they're not looking for someone with decades of experience in each category, they're looking for someone with like three years total in the field who's worked on / somewhat capable of working on a variety of areas.

    So they are looking for a guy with limited experience to run a 1 person IT department? That will work out well.

    So far, it seems to work

    I don't see what's the problem

    Miss me? Find me on:

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    TubeTube Registered User admin
    bowen wrote: »
    That's 7+ years of experience. You think someone with a PhD equivalent knowledge should be making nothing?

    Do you think he was the same age 4 years ago that he is now, or is it possible that Kenneth ages as the rest of us do? Also, please show me where he said he was "making nothing".

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    JasconiusJasconius sword criminal mad onlineRegistered User regular
    courtneyj wrote: »
    Jasconius wrote: »
    i think the value assessment that people are making on the desired skills of this job are way way way way overboard.

    they are looking for someone just one notch over Junior level as far as I can tell

    If my livelihood began and ended with my website, I'd want someone more than just over Junior to take the reigns and go forth with it.

    websites are a lot simpler than you think they are

    Penny-Arcade.com has been obscenely reliable and stable for the better part of a decade using more or less the same skeleton crew formula

    for a site that serves as much traffic as they do, that is something

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    NogsNogs Crap, crap, mega crap. Crap, crap, mega crap.Registered User regular
    edited November 2013
    derp im done

    Nogs on
    rotate.jpg
    PARKER, YOU'RE FIRED! <-- My comic book podcast! Satan look here!
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    HunterHunter Chemist with a heart of Au Registered User regular
    Kwoaru wrote: »
    the list of things I would not do for 200k a year is incredibly short

    So we know you're a whore, we just need to negotiate price ;)

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    LanglyLangly Registered User regular
    Kwoaru wrote: »
    the list of things I would not do for 200k a year is incredibly short

    like

    really short

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    CorporateLogoCorporateLogo The toilet knows how I feelRegistered User regular
    Athenor wrote: »
    It's funny watching this come up time and time again. Like, Fantasy Flight Games is small potatoes compared to WotC/Hasbro, and yet people expect them to have these massive support networks. I think it is just that people's perceptions of companies on the internet are skewed.

    I'm going to go out on a limb and say that PA isn't supporting several board/tabletop games with new expansions/errata on a regular basis like FF has to

    Do not have a cow, mortal.

    c9PXgFo.jpg
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    KadithKadith Registered User regular
    Athenor wrote: »
    Could be worse.

    Could be a sysadmin/help desk professional making 30k a year... *cough*

    Or the exact same as the job description making less than that...

    zkHcp.jpg
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    bowenbowen How you doin'? Registered User regular
    Tube wrote: »
    bowen wrote: »
    That's 7+ years of experience. You think someone with a PhD equivalent knowledge should be making nothing?

    Do you think he was the same age 4 years ago that he is now, or is it possible that Kenneth ages as the rest of us do? Also, please show me where he said he was "making nothing".

    So what you're saying is the PA team has access to a time machine.

    Interesting.

    not a doctor, not a lawyer, examples I use may not be fully researched so don't take out of context plz, don't @ me
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    JackdawGinJackdawGin Engineer New YorkRegistered User regular
    Why is nobody pressing Kenneth for what Warmachine faction he plays? Clearly there is a cover up!

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    OverloadedOverloaded Registered User regular
    JayKaos wrote: »
    Yeah they're not looking for someone with decades of experience in each category, they're looking for someone with like three years total in the field who's worked on / somewhat capable of working on a variety of areas.

    And *that* is a starry-eyed 20-something, who the OP claims not to be looking for. Also, looking for a junior person to be solely responsible for all the tech across their sites is shortsighted at best. They should be aiming higher.

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    CorporateLogoCorporateLogo The toilet knows how I feelRegistered User regular
    Warmachine stinks is why

    Play Infinity

    Do not have a cow, mortal.

    c9PXgFo.jpg
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    TubeTube Registered User admin
    bowen wrote: »
    Tube wrote: »
    bowen wrote: »
    That's 7+ years of experience. You think someone with a PhD equivalent knowledge should be making nothing?

    Do you think he was the same age 4 years ago that he is now, or is it possible that Kenneth ages as the rest of us do? Also, please show me where he said he was "making nothing".

    So what you're saying is the PA team has access to a time machine.

    Interesting.

    I'm saying that you're kind of an idiot.

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    JackdawGinJackdawGin Engineer New YorkRegistered User regular
    Overloaded wrote: »
    JayKaos wrote: »
    Yeah they're not looking for someone with decades of experience in each category, they're looking for someone with like three years total in the field who's worked on / somewhat capable of working on a variety of areas.

    And *that* is a starry-eyed 20-something, who the OP claims not to be looking for. Also, looking for a junior person to be solely responsible for all the tech across their sites is shortsighted at best. They should be aiming higher.

    Clearly they should be paying you a consulting fee for this brilliance.

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    AthenorAthenor Battle Hardened Optimist The Skies of HiigaraRegistered User regular
    Athenor wrote: »
    It's funny watching this come up time and time again. Like, Fantasy Flight Games is small potatoes compared to WotC/Hasbro, and yet people expect them to have these massive support networks. I think it is just that people's perceptions of companies on the internet are skewed.

    I'm going to go out on a limb and say that PA isn't supporting several board/tabletop games with new expansions/errata on a regular basis like FF has to

    Yeah. PA's job is much more involved than that, what with managing 3 conventions, 4-5 websites, weekly content, merchandise sales, advertising and PR for major video game publishers, and one of the larger gaming forums out there.

    PA's a small company. They are also very realistic about their needs, and what they can offer.

    He/Him | "We who believe in freedom cannot rest." - Dr. Johnetta Cole, 7/22/2024
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    KadithKadith Registered User regular
    ITT everyone who has gotten lucky with the well paying IT position looks down upon everyone else in the field.

    zkHcp.jpg
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    HunterHunter Chemist with a heart of Au Registered User regular
    bowen wrote: »
    Tube wrote: »
    bowen wrote: »
    That's 7+ years of experience. You think someone with a PhD equivalent knowledge should be making nothing?

    Do you think he was the same age 4 years ago that he is now, or is it possible that Kenneth ages as the rest of us do? Also, please show me where he said he was "making nothing".

    So what you're saying is the PA team has access to a time machine.

    Interesting.

    Time travel, even if only in reverse, is one hell of an ancillary benefit of employment.

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    LanglyLangly Registered User regular
    Kadith wrote: »
    ITT everyone who has gotten lucky with the well paying IT position looks down upon everyone else in the field.

    yep

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    bowenbowen How you doin'? Registered User regular
    Tube wrote: »
    bowen wrote: »
    Tube wrote: »
    bowen wrote: »
    That's 7+ years of experience. You think someone with a PhD equivalent knowledge should be making nothing?

    Do you think he was the same age 4 years ago that he is now, or is it possible that Kenneth ages as the rest of us do? Also, please show me where he said he was "making nothing".

    So what you're saying is the PA team has access to a time machine.

    Interesting.

    I'm saying that you're kind of an idiot.

    I'm just a little taken back.

    He's not saying he's "making nothing" but he's heavily implying through his choice wording and commentary that he's really not in a good position.

    Maybe he is.

    I don't know. But an alarming amount of people from my field seem to be agreeing with me. Either way, I don't really care, just cautioning against the wind that you get what you pay for. Even though no one really cares.

    And then, tomorrow, I will eat some food. Probably too much food.

    not a doctor, not a lawyer, examples I use may not be fully researched so don't take out of context plz, don't @ me
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    TubeTube Registered User admin
    I feel like the idea that a website like Penny Arcade could not operate on such a system can be refuted by simply gesturing vaguely at the site as it has existed for fifteen years.

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    GhostDanGhostDan Registered User regular
    Tube wrote: »
    GhostDan wrote: »
    JayKaos wrote: »
    Yeah they're not looking for someone with decades of experience in each category, they're looking for someone with like three years total in the field who's worked on / somewhat capable of working on a variety of areas.

    So they are looking for a guy with limited experience to run a 1 person IT department? That will work out well.

    It's worked out pretty well for the last ten years.

    You guys do a great job maintaining everything as it's grown over the years (with the possible exception of PAX ticket time). But you've had a guy working for you for x years, you've grown over x years and he's grown into that position as well. He's learned as more things have come in and he's no longer a junior level person. Replacing him with the equivalent of what you were looking for ~10 years ago might be a bad idea. I'm not the same IT Professional I was 10 years ago. I'm not arguing, just discussing, and giving insight based on my knowledge and experience.

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    LanglyLangly Registered User regular
    for instance when I said the list was very small, "Killing a person" is written down and then scratched out and then written down again and then I put a question mark by it.

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    OverloadedOverloaded Registered User regular
    Tube wrote: »
    bowen wrote: »
    That's 7+ years of experience. You think someone with a PhD equivalent knowledge should be making nothing?

    Do you think he was the same age 4 years ago that he is now, or is it possible that Kenneth ages as the rest of us do? Also, please show me where he said he was "making nothing".
    But they're not looking to replace Kenneth from four years ago, they're looking to replace the guy who has built and maintained all these systems over those years. And presumably to help make them even better.

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    AvrahamAvraham Registered User regular
    Dubh wrote: »
    GhostDan wrote: »
    JayKaos wrote: »
    Yeah they're not looking for someone with decades of experience in each category, they're looking for someone with like three years total in the field who's worked on / somewhat capable of working on a variety of areas.

    So they are looking for a guy with limited experience to run a 1 person IT department? That will work out well.

    So far, it seems to work

    I don't see what's the problem
    Except it doesn't quite work.
    I popped a lung and spent a week in the hospital, right before a scheduled launch. They pushed out the launch, came and visited me in the hospital, brought me delicious Asian snacks and lent me a Vita to help pass the time. Last December, I was dealing with a lot of unrelated anxiety and depression issues. It screwed over the project I was working on at the time...
    I'm armchair quarterbacking, but if you have two guys wearing two hats instead of one guy wearing four, maybe they have some downtime to waste an hour on reddit each day, but also projects won't come to a halt when one guy is sick.

    I think an issue broader than this particular PA job is that perpetual crunch time, overwork and underpay is a Missing Stair in the gaming and tech industry

    :bz: :bz: :bzz:
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    JasconiusJasconius sword criminal mad onlineRegistered User regular
    GhostDan wrote: »
    Tube wrote: »
    GhostDan wrote: »
    JayKaos wrote: »
    Yeah they're not looking for someone with decades of experience in each category, they're looking for someone with like three years total in the field who's worked on / somewhat capable of working on a variety of areas.

    So they are looking for a guy with limited experience to run a 1 person IT department? That will work out well.

    It's worked out pretty well for the last ten years.

    You guys do a great job maintaining everything as it's grown over the years (with the possible exception of PAX ticket time). But you've had a guy working for you for x years, you've grown over x years and he's grown into that position as well. He's learned as more things have come in and he's no longer a junior level person. Replacing him with the equivalent of what you were looking for ~10 years ago might be a bad idea. I'm not the same IT Professional I was 10 years ago. I'm not arguing, just discussing, and giving insight based on my knowledge and experience.

    You're correct. IT is way different than it was 10 years ago.

    It's insanely easier.

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    bowenbowen How you doin'? Registered User regular
    Jasconius wrote: »
    GhostDan wrote: »
    Tube wrote: »
    GhostDan wrote: »
    JayKaos wrote: »
    Yeah they're not looking for someone with decades of experience in each category, they're looking for someone with like three years total in the field who's worked on / somewhat capable of working on a variety of areas.

    So they are looking for a guy with limited experience to run a 1 person IT department? That will work out well.

    It's worked out pretty well for the last ten years.

    You guys do a great job maintaining everything as it's grown over the years (with the possible exception of PAX ticket time). But you've had a guy working for you for x years, you've grown over x years and he's grown into that position as well. He's learned as more things have come in and he's no longer a junior level person. Replacing him with the equivalent of what you were looking for ~10 years ago might be a bad idea. I'm not the same IT Professional I was 10 years ago. I'm not arguing, just discussing, and giving insight based on my knowledge and experience.

    You're correct. IT is way different than it was 10 years ago.

    It's insanely easier.

    If google didn't exist, 8 people would probably have to do my job.

    not a doctor, not a lawyer, examples I use may not be fully researched so don't take out of context plz, don't @ me
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    GhostDanGhostDan Registered User regular
    Jasconius wrote: »
    You're correct. IT is way different than it was 10 years ago.

    It's insanely easier.

    You missed my point, but that's fine. :)

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    KalTorakKalTorak One way or another, they all end up in the Undercity.Registered User regular
    Langly wrote: »
    for instance when I said the list was very small, "Killing a person" is written down and then scratched out and then written down again and then I put a question mark by it.

    but it's a yearly salary

    so like, would you kill a single person over a 12 month period? 1 person per year?

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    LanglyLangly Registered User regular
    GhostDan wrote: »
    Tube wrote: »
    GhostDan wrote: »
    JayKaos wrote: »
    Yeah they're not looking for someone with decades of experience in each category, they're looking for someone with like three years total in the field who's worked on / somewhat capable of working on a variety of areas.

    So they are looking for a guy with limited experience to run a 1 person IT department? That will work out well.

    It's worked out pretty well for the last ten years.

    You guys do a great job maintaining everything as it's grown over the years (with the possible exception of PAX ticket time). But you've had a guy working for you for x years, you've grown over x years and he's grown into that position as well. He's learned as more things have come in and he's no longer a junior level person. Replacing him with the equivalent of what you were looking for ~10 years ago might be a bad idea. I'm not the same IT Professional I was 10 years ago. I'm not arguing, just discussing, and giving insight based on my knowledge and experience.

    It is difficult for me to properly describe the extreme level of sheer prideful ignorance these sorts of posts convey.

    You don't work at the company
    You have no idea how the company is run
    You have no idea how much it pays
    You have no idea what their system looks like
    You have no idea about anything relevant to the job posting other than you also work in IT
    You do not know anyone who works at the company.

    And yet. And yet, you find the situation well within your wheelhouse to analyse to the people who have all those things

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    AvrahamAvraham Registered User regular
    And, do you accept bitcoins

    :bz: :bz: :bzz:
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    DoobhDoobh She/Her, Ace Pan/Bisexual 8-) What's up, bootlickers?Registered User regular
    So a hiccup every now and then constitutes being broken?

    Miss me? Find me on:

    Twitch (I stream most days of the week)
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    LanglyLangly Registered User regular
    KalTorak wrote: »
    Langly wrote: »
    for instance when I said the list was very small, "Killing a person" is written down and then scratched out and then written down again and then I put a question mark by it.

    but it's a yearly salary

    so like, would you kill a single person over a 12 month period? 1 person per year?

    well the ideal is that one murder will net me a sustained payout of 200k a year.

    but

    maybe.

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    StaleStale Registered User regular
    God this entire discourse is just fucking precious

    easysig2.jpg
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