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It's also been interesting to see my follower count ebb and flow.
It used to be that every time I'd start going into social justice rage mode, I'd lose more than I'd gain.
But, one thing that stuck out.
Was involved in a conversation with someone who was basically saying 'dudes, stop saying 'not all men' and listen, please'. Someone started in on her, I made a comment, they replied and so I called them a 'waste of space and a useless turd'.' Their response was to fling a little abuse my way and then stop.
However, they kept going after this women over and over and over. For fucking saying 'guys, think before you talk' while ignoring my 'you are literally a waste of space and a useless fucking turd'.
Just.. fuck.
WATCH THIS SPACE.
0
BeastehTHAT WOULD NOTKILL DRACULARegistered Userregular
you cant really 'stop' a meme it just goes away by itself usually
0
UnbrokenEvaHIGH ON THE WIREBUT I WON'T TRIP ITRegistered Userregular
Not only is she a kickass cartoonist in her own right, she organizes a regular Ladies' Night at my local comic shop, to encourage women to try comics, and to give them a guaranteed safe space where they can browse and ask questions without fear of being called "fake geek girls" or any other bullshit (not that such behaviour would fly the rest of the time at the shop, the owner and staff have no patience for that nonsense). She's also organized a group (http://bewarethevalkyries.com/) for women who work in comic shop to hang out and talk.
It's also been interesting to see my follower count ebb and flow.
It used to be that every time I'd start going into social justice rage mode, I'd lose more than I'd gain.
But, one thing that stuck out.
Was involved in a conversation with someone who was basically saying 'dudes, stop saying 'not all men' and listen, please'. Someone started in on her, I made a comment, they replied and so I called them a 'waste of space and a useless turd'.' Their response was to fling a little abuse my way and then stop.
However, they kept going after this women over and over and over. For fucking saying 'guys, think before you talk' while ignoring my 'you are literally a waste of space and a useless fucking turd'.
Just.. fuck.
Man in that scenario you aren't considered the enemy
That's terrible to say but it's the truth
There are some dudes who see this as an us vs. them thing, as if women are going to storm the god damn castle and then make men into slaves, and not in the sexy way
They think they're being defensive against a real threat
It's also been interesting to see my follower count ebb and flow.
It used to be that every time I'd start going into social justice rage mode, I'd lose more than I'd gain.
But, one thing that stuck out.
Was involved in a conversation with someone who was basically saying 'dudes, stop saying 'not all men' and listen, please'. Someone started in on her, I made a comment, they replied and so I called them a 'waste of space and a useless turd'.' Their response was to fling a little abuse my way and then stop.
However, they kept going after this women over and over and over. For fucking saying 'guys, think before you talk' while ignoring my 'you are literally a waste of space and a useless fucking turd'.
this is some of the straight best, hardest, most athletic performance work you'll see and they tear themselves apart to put on a great match, and are treated with almost categorical respect
Probably because women have been systematically written out of history.
What astrophysicist Edward Charles Pickering did , assembling a team of female scientists, such as Annie Jump Cannon, Henrietta Swan Leavitt and Cecilia Payne-Gaposchkin, to do the work for him, is known as the harem effect and is a common phenomenon in science history.
I know it's in jest but can we stop with the not all men memes?
Could you run me through your issue with the meme?
For me it's amusing to a point, but then it reminds me that oh yeah, I do have to constantly defend myself and my viewpoint because things I say make people uncomfortable and butthurt
I get really tired of being reminded my pain is not as important as some dude's, even in jest
0
DragkoniasThat Guy Who Does StuffYou Know, There. Registered Userregular
edited May 2014
Speaking for a moment, in light of recent events which I would hope people already know about, I do worry about one thing.
Like this whole issue, I would more or less classify it as a hate crime.
Yet, as always in these cases I feel a lot of the mainstream media will quickly jump on some mental illness angle. Not to say that maybe there wasn't some kind of psychosis involved. But I feel like if we look at this crime without examination of the power dynamics involved it is a very much a missed opportunity to understand why even if most people don't act in the way this guy did, his kind of attitude isn't rare.
But knowing the media it'll probably just end up "LOLCRAZY" and then some shots of people crying, maybe some celebrities here and there and we'll quickly sweep it under the rug.
I know it's in jest but can we stop with the not all men memes?
Could you run me through your issue with the meme?
The problem is that it's an in joke. From the outside, people just see ludicrous situations with "not all men" captions that are really hard to understand if you haven't been following along. Especially if you're a guy it just adds that small layer of inaacessibility to an already confusing issue.
I experience the world as a woman and a person of color, which means I usually get my sexism with a dash of racism. Good times.
Bits you make an excellent point, and something I super struggle with, because so often I see feminists focused on the success of white ciswomen, which is...still bigotry
Representation is important, y'all
Usagi on
+11
BeastehTHAT WOULD NOTKILL DRACULARegistered Userregular
edited May 2014
my time on and off the forums since like... 2004 at least have been a pretty big learning curve re: how i was made aware of the privilege that shields me on a daily basis
being white, cisgendered, heterosexual and male i am several huge fucking orders of magnitude less likely to be attacked, threatened or targeted for who i am
this is a thing i remind myself near-constantly, and the events of the past few days make it more thuddingly evident that the patriarchy is a hideous fucked up thing that needs to die asap
Speaking for a moment, in light of recent events which I would hope people already know about, I do worry about one thing.
Like this whole issue, I would more or less classify it as a hate crime.
Yet, as always in these cases I feel a lot of the mainstream media will quickly jump on some mental illness angle. Not to say that maybe there wasn't some kind of psychosis involved. But I feel like if we look at this crime without examination of the power dynamics involved it is a very much a missed opportunity to understand why even if most people don't act in the way this guy did, his kind of attitude isn't rare.
But knowing the media it'll probably just end up "LOLCRAZY" and then some shots of people crying, maybe some celebrities here and there and we'll quickly sweep it under the rug.
It's not just a Hate Crime, it's an act of Terrorism.
I'm not going to be silent about this, I'll continue to correct people everywhere I go on this matter. I don't care of he was a delusional narcissist with aspergers, are you going to suggest to me that those are the only kinds of people that would commit such a heinous act?
EDIT: "You" as in News Media.
Hey Gumpy while you're in this thread I wanted to say I think your uni is very lucky to have you represent them because I know how much you care about this sort of thing and want to have all types of people represented at your uni and I'm glad we're mates.
Speaking for a moment, in light of recent events which I would hope people already know about, I do worry about one thing.
Like this whole issue, I would more or less classify it as a hate crime.
Yet, as always in these cases I feel a lot of the mainstream media will quickly jump on some mental illness angle. Not to say that maybe there wasn't some kind of psychosis involved. But I feel like if we look at this crime without examination of the power dynamics involved it is a very much a missed opportunity to understand why even if most people don't act in the way this guy did, his kind of attitude isn't rare.
But knowing the media it'll probably just end up "LOLCRAZY" and then some shots of people crying, maybe some celebrities here and there and we'll quickly sweep it under the rug.
what is rare is actually following through and killing people, and if you substitute, say, racism in there (there was already racism in there but whatever), you'll be missing the qualifiers deemed legally necessary for a hate crime.
Marty: The future, it's where you're going? Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
0
DragkoniasThat Guy Who Does StuffYou Know, There. Registered Userregular
I experience the world as a woman and a person of color, which means I usually get my sexism with a dash of racism. Good times.
Bits you make an excellent point, and something I super struggle with, because so often I see feminists focused on the success of white ciswomen, which is...still bigotry
Representation is important, y'all
Yeah, why I really shy away from any mainstream feminism talk.
Far too often I see people willing to throw another marginalized group under the bus to gain more leverage themselves.
Isn't just feminism, I also see it in race politics and LGBTQ advocacy. So I'm also mindful of stuff like that.
For the longest time I really didn't identify as a feminist because almost everything I saw from "feminists" came from batshit TERFs.
Like, I had my beliefs which I now realize were feminist all along, but I was completely unwilling to accept being called feminist.
It was only around 2, maybe two and a half years ago when I came across a legitimately intersectional feminist page on FB that I would be willing to call myself feminist.
Can't express how annoying it is that not only are MRA's, far-rights and various others doing everything they can to turn "Feminist" into something slanderous, but many self-identified feminists are too.
+2
BeastehTHAT WOULD NOTKILL DRACULARegistered Userregular
Speaking for a moment, in light of recent events which I would hope people already know about, I do worry about one thing.
Like this whole issue, I would more or less classify it as a hate crime.
Yet, as always in these cases I feel a lot of the mainstream media will quickly jump on some mental illness angle. Not to say that maybe there wasn't some kind of psychosis involved. But I feel like if we look at this crime without examination of the power dynamics involved it is a very much a missed opportunity to understand why even if most people don't act in the way this guy did, his kind of attitude isn't rare.
But knowing the media it'll probably just end up "LOLCRAZY" and then some shots of people crying, maybe some celebrities here and there and we'll quickly sweep it under the rug.
no but you see this guy who spoke exclusively about hating women and wanting to kill them for not jumping on his dick was totally gay, yep, that makes a lot of sense
Speaking for a moment, in light of recent events which I would hope people already know about, I do worry about one thing.
Like this whole issue, I would more or less classify it as a hate crime.
Yet, as always in these cases I feel a lot of the mainstream media will quickly jump on some mental illness angle. Not to say that maybe there wasn't some kind of psychosis involved. But I feel like if we look at this crime without examination of the power dynamics involved it is a very much a missed opportunity to understand why even if most people don't act in the way this guy did, his kind of attitude isn't rare.
But knowing the media it'll probably just end up "LOLCRAZY" and then some shots of people crying, maybe some celebrities here and there and we'll quickly sweep it under the rug.
what is rare is actually following through and killing people, and if you substitute, say, racism in there (there was already racism in there but whatever), you'll be missing the qualifiers deemed legally necessary for a hate crime.
Well, the thing is I don't like to focus on just the legality to it.
Because the legal world is a world of language and our legal language is affected by perception.
And we live in a world where violence against women generally isn't considered hateful. So I'm not surprised there isn't much legal language for it in that regard.
Back in April, a group of Mormon women were protesting the Priesthood (read: men only) Session of General Conference (twice yearly church-wide meeting), asking for authoritative equality in the Church. You can equate that to women wanting to be priests or bishops or whatever in other religions.
The first talk/speech/whatever of the session had incredibly awful lines; "god made women and men seperate but equal, with different roles" and "women need to worry more about responsibilites, not about rights", the second of which was removed entirely from the widely distributed written version of the speech; you know, the only version that women receive.
I haven't been an active member of the Church in seven years or so, but for the first time I felt like an enemy in there midst. If I, a white male, felt that way, I can't imagine what some women must feel having that attitude directed at them.
That day I decided that instead of being simply apathetic about Mormonism, that I would no longer support or associate with the church. It's small, I know, and does nothing to directly help, but at least when someone asks why I'm "inactive", I can tell them straight out that I am against inequality and what the Church stands for.
I want my little sisters, and any future children or wife I may have, to feel totally safe and comfortable to go about their daily lives, and to have the same opportunities as any one else.
TL,DR; this thread rocks and I support feminism.
+13
BeastehTHAT WOULD NOTKILL DRACULARegistered Userregular
edited May 2014
heres a thing i wrote elsewhere
the terrifying thing is how many niceguys there are just like him, who are unfailingly charming and polite and hide their true nature until the day they twist and start killing, who build women up as imaginary foes who thwart them at every turn
100% of women have to deal with elliot rodgers in some shape or form
I experience the world as a woman and a person of color, which means I usually get my sexism with a dash of racism. Good times.
Bits you make an excellent point, and something I super struggle with, because so often I see feminists focused on the success of white ciswomen, which is...still bigotry
Hey Gumpy while you're in this thread I wanted to say I think your uni is very lucky to have you represent them because I know how much you care about this sort of thing and want to have all types of people represented at your uni and I'm glad we're mates.
I was very lucky to have some exceptional women help me. The progress that our feminist society has made in the last three years its excellent and its membership has exploded. The lady who really put the work in just graduated and I feel like the university is losing one of its best officers.
Think of all the women you know who will not allow themselves to be seen without makeup. I often wonder how they feel about themselves at night when they are climbing into bed with intimate partners. Are they overwhelmed with secret shame that someone sees them as they really are? Or do they sleep with rage that who they really are can be celebrated or cared for only in secret?
Posts
MAN: NO, I DONT THINK YOU ARE ACTUALLY, I CHECKED MY OWN SELF AND IM NOT ON FIRE AT ALL
Damn.
rin nakai is also marketed in an incredibly scummy and sleazy way
http://uproxx.com/sports/2014/05/we-need-to-talk-about-rin-nakai-you-guys/
It used to be that every time I'd start going into social justice rage mode, I'd lose more than I'd gain.
But, one thing that stuck out.
Was involved in a conversation with someone who was basically saying 'dudes, stop saying 'not all men' and listen, please'. Someone started in on her, I made a comment, they replied and so I called them a 'waste of space and a useless turd'.' Their response was to fling a little abuse my way and then stop.
However, they kept going after this women over and over and over. For fucking saying 'guys, think before you talk' while ignoring my 'you are literally a waste of space and a useless fucking turd'.
Just.. fuck.
Not only is she a kickass cartoonist in her own right, she organizes a regular Ladies' Night at my local comic shop, to encourage women to try comics, and to give them a guaranteed safe space where they can browse and ask questions without fear of being called "fake geek girls" or any other bullshit (not that such behaviour would fly the rest of the time at the shop, the owner and staff have no patience for that nonsense). She's also organized a group (http://bewarethevalkyries.com/) for women who work in comic shop to hang out and talk.
oh, and she's totally badass:
Man in that scenario you aren't considered the enemy
That's terrible to say but it's the truth
There are some dudes who see this as an us vs. them thing, as if women are going to storm the god damn castle and then make men into slaves, and not in the sexy way
They think they're being defensive against a real threat
Reminds me of this:
fuuckk thats repugnant
but let's talk about joshi, you guys
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uTUNa0s4yzk
this is some of the straight best, hardest, most athletic performance work you'll see and they tear themselves apart to put on a great match, and are treated with almost categorical respect
edit I have to post bull nakano and manami toyota
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AQdRRAM33b8&feature=kp
she did some amazing work in the 50s (a woman... that took pictures of women being lewd???)
also known as the lady who took that photo of ursula andress in dr. no
you know the one
Could you run me through your issue with the meme?
Timely thread then, let's all get our lewd on
Annie Jump Cannon.
Best name or BEST NAME?
For me it's amusing to a point, but then it reminds me that oh yeah, I do have to constantly defend myself and my viewpoint because things I say make people uncomfortable and butthurt
I get really tired of being reminded my pain is not as important as some dude's, even in jest
Like this whole issue, I would more or less classify it as a hate crime.
Yet, as always in these cases I feel a lot of the mainstream media will quickly jump on some mental illness angle. Not to say that maybe there wasn't some kind of psychosis involved. But I feel like if we look at this crime without examination of the power dynamics involved it is a very much a missed opportunity to understand why even if most people don't act in the way this guy did, his kind of attitude isn't rare.
But knowing the media it'll probably just end up "LOLCRAZY" and then some shots of people crying, maybe some celebrities here and there and we'll quickly sweep it under the rug.
"traditional" gender roles not based on merit but corporate profit
The problem is that it's an in joke. From the outside, people just see ludicrous situations with "not all men" captions that are really hard to understand if you haven't been following along. Especially if you're a guy it just adds that small layer of inaacessibility to an already confusing issue.
Bits you make an excellent point, and something I super struggle with, because so often I see feminists focused on the success of white ciswomen, which is...still bigotry
Representation is important, y'all
being white, cisgendered, heterosexual and male i am several huge fucking orders of magnitude less likely to be attacked, threatened or targeted for who i am
this is a thing i remind myself near-constantly, and the events of the past few days make it more thuddingly evident that the patriarchy is a hideous fucked up thing that needs to die asap
Twitch (I stream most days of the week)
Twitter (mean leftist discourse)
I'm not going to be silent about this, I'll continue to correct people everywhere I go on this matter. I don't care of he was a delusional narcissist with aspergers, are you going to suggest to me that those are the only kinds of people that would commit such a heinous act?
EDIT: "You" as in News Media.
YIISSSSSSSSSSSSS
what is rare is actually following through and killing people, and if you substitute, say, racism in there (there was already racism in there but whatever), you'll be missing the qualifiers deemed legally necessary for a hate crime.
Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
Yeah, why I really shy away from any mainstream feminism talk.
Far too often I see people willing to throw another marginalized group under the bus to gain more leverage themselves.
Isn't just feminism, I also see it in race politics and LGBTQ advocacy. So I'm also mindful of stuff like that.
Like, I had my beliefs which I now realize were feminist all along, but I was completely unwilling to accept being called feminist.
It was only around 2, maybe two and a half years ago when I came across a legitimately intersectional feminist page on FB that I would be willing to call myself feminist.
Can't express how annoying it is that not only are MRA's, far-rights and various others doing everything they can to turn "Feminist" into something slanderous, but many self-identified feminists are too.
http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2014/05/25/fox-news-psychotherapist-california-shootings-were-caused-by-homosexual-impulses/
no but you see this guy who spoke exclusively about hating women and wanting to kill them for not jumping on his dick was totally gay, yep, that makes a lot of sense
Twitch (I stream most days of the week)
Twitter (mean leftist discourse)
Well, the thing is I don't like to focus on just the legality to it.
Because the legal world is a world of language and our legal language is affected by perception.
And we live in a world where violence against women generally isn't considered hateful. So I'm not surprised there isn't much legal language for it in that regard.
The first talk/speech/whatever of the session had incredibly awful lines; "god made women and men seperate but equal, with different roles" and "women need to worry more about responsibilites, not about rights", the second of which was removed entirely from the widely distributed written version of the speech; you know, the only version that women receive.
I haven't been an active member of the Church in seven years or so, but for the first time I felt like an enemy in there midst. If I, a white male, felt that way, I can't imagine what some women must feel having that attitude directed at them.
That day I decided that instead of being simply apathetic about Mormonism, that I would no longer support or associate with the church. It's small, I know, and does nothing to directly help, but at least when someone asks why I'm "inactive", I can tell them straight out that I am against inequality and what the Church stands for.
I want my little sisters, and any future children or wife I may have, to feel totally safe and comfortable to go about their daily lives, and to have the same opportunities as any one else.
TL,DR; this thread rocks and I support feminism.
100% of women have to deal with elliot rodgers in some shape or form
There's a webcomic on white privilege that I wish I could find.
It's about a dude with an umbrella in the rain next to a guy who doesn't have one.
Haven't a clue what the webcomic is called, though.
@usagi
Another book recommendation for the thread - ain't i a woman: black women and feminism by bell hooks. It's so good. So good. And a fast read!
I was very lucky to have some exceptional women help me. The progress that our feminist society has made in the last three years its excellent and its membership has exploded. The lady who really put the work in just graduated and I feel like the university is losing one of its best officers.