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[D&D 5E] Xanathar's Guide to Striking a Nerve

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    Dronus86Dronus86 Now with cheese!Registered User regular
    edited April 2017
    Abbalah wrote: »
    Why does it randomly have shitty scaling? Every other spell in 5th adds more dice of the same type as the original spell, this one rolls d8s initially and then scales with d6s for no apparent reason

    It's not like scaling with d8s is too powerful, there are first-level damage spells that start at 2d10 and add d10s. Thunderwave is 2d8 + d8s for scaling and is also more likely to target multiple enemies than Chaos Bolt is.

    Cause Fear is unreasonably good - disadvantage on all attacks and limited movement control for the whole combat, no round-to-round saves, and low level enemies make the save with disadvantage? Sold.

    Really practical reason for this: So you know what dice need to double to make it bounce.

    You know, this makes a lot of sense, but I think I'd like the spell more if its chance to bounce and its chance to have a damage type you wanted grew with spell level. I mean, would it really be stronger than a spell of higher level? I suspect that as levels went up its average damage would be lower than same level spells, but adding bounce/resistance-piercing could make it still a useful way to spend spell slots.

    EDIT: This would happen if the spell used +1d8 per spell level and the 'element/piercing' was based off all/any of the d8's is what I meant.

    Dronus86 on
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    JoshmviiJoshmvii Registered User regular
    Steelhawk wrote: »
    50% chance to jump on the D20 roll is boring though, IMO. And it also might lead to the spell being a bit overpowered for a first level spell.

    Using the damage roll to determine the damage type and hoping for doubles to have the spell jump just seems more fun, and fitting the chaotic source of the spell.

    I am not considering the balance of the thing, just my preference on how I'd have it work. I like using the natural d20 roll for extra effects like this. Nat even, nat odd, nat even hit, nat even miss, nat odd hit, nat odd miss, nat 16+, nat 20 only, etc. There are tons of options you can use. And they're all built off the attack roll, which makes it easy.

    The damage type determination means barely anything in 5E so that doesn't excite me, because there are very very few enemies that are resistant/weak to a specific type anyway. A 1/8th chance on a 1st level spell is pretty weak which is probably why I don't care for it. A 12.5% chance for a jump to happen when I only have a couple 1st level spell slots doesn't excite me, it's just too low. I'd just prepare/learn a better 1st level spell.

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    GoumindongGoumindong Registered User regular
    Destrokk9 wrote: »
    I fear for on of the Tuesday DMs at my LGS mainly because right off the bat, he has a very charismatic table and the sorcerer is wanting to change up how some of the wild surge table rolls work. For example, if he rolled the percent where his skin turns a different color, he wanted to roll an additional die to see what color it would turn into.

    I fear that he (the player) might get a bit overboard with wanting to change up the abilities.
    Wild magic table is pretty generous with anyway. There are only like one or two really bad effects on it. My wild Mage intentionally procs in on every spell they can by burning their tides of chaos.

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    GaddezGaddez Registered User regular
    Destrokk9 wrote: »
    I fear for on of the Tuesday DMs at my LGS mainly because right off the bat, he has a very charismatic table and the sorcerer is wanting to change up how some of the wild surge table rolls work. For example, if he rolled the percent where his skin turns a different color, he wanted to roll an additional die to see what color it would turn into.

    I fear that he (the player) might get a bit overboard with wanting to change up the abilities.

    My biggest concern for him is that a combination of over complicating the existing chart and surging at every opportunity will lead to the player's turns taking much longer then they really ought to.

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    GaddezGaddez Registered User regular
    Goumindong wrote: »
    Destrokk9 wrote: »
    I fear for on of the Tuesday DMs at my LGS mainly because right off the bat, he has a very charismatic table and the sorcerer is wanting to change up how some of the wild surge table rolls work. For example, if he rolled the percent where his skin turns a different color, he wanted to roll an additional die to see what color it would turn into.

    I fear that he (the player) might get a bit overboard with wanting to change up the abilities.
    Wild magic table is pretty generous with anyway. There are only like one or two really bad effects on it. My wild Mage intentionally procs in on every spell they can by burning their tides of chaos.

    We had a player come perilously close to expieriencing unbirth.

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    Destrokk9Destrokk9 Registered User regular
    Gaddez wrote: »
    Goumindong wrote: »
    Destrokk9 wrote: »
    I fear for on of the Tuesday DMs at my LGS mainly because right off the bat, he has a very charismatic table and the sorcerer is wanting to change up how some of the wild surge table rolls work. For example, if he rolled the percent where his skin turns a different color, he wanted to roll an additional die to see what color it would turn into.

    I fear that he (the player) might get a bit overboard with wanting to change up the abilities.
    Wild magic table is pretty generous with anyway. There are only like one or two really bad effects on it. My wild Mage intentionally procs in on every spell they can by burning their tides of chaos.

    We had a player come perilously close to expieriencing unbirth.

    And last time I checked, you cant really do anything at the age of 0...unless some form of god intervenes

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    GoumindongGoumindong Registered User regular
    Gaddez wrote: »
    Destrokk9 wrote: »
    I fear for on of the Tuesday DMs at my LGS mainly because right off the bat, he has a very charismatic table and the sorcerer is wanting to change up how some of the wild surge table rolls work. For example, if he rolled the percent where his skin turns a different color, he wanted to roll an additional die to see what color it would turn into.

    I fear that he (the player) might get a bit overboard with wanting to change up the abilities.

    My biggest concern for him is that a combination of over complicating the existing chart and surging at every opportunity will lead to the player's turns taking much longer then they really ought to.

    Its pretty fast so long as you have the table and your d10's out.

    wbBv3fj.png
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    jaredburtonjaredburton Registered User regular
    Dumping Tides of Chaos on Chaos Bolt might actually be pretty neat. Getting a crit lets you roll 4d8, which gives you about a 60% chance of the spell bouncing. Plus, if you get a surge, you can then immediately use it again on the bounce. Certain meta magic really give this a nice little boost, too, as does Spell Bombardment (though, that's so late anyway, who cares?).

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    JoshmviiJoshmvii Registered User regular
    edited April 2017
    For good or bad, it's up to the GM how often the wild mage surges. It's completely up to the GM whether they make the player roll the d20 to see if they get a 1 and trigger a surge when they cast level 1+ spells, and it's completely up to the GM whether they trigger a surge on cast and give back Tides of Chaos.

    And it's only really the ones where you summon modrons and unicorns and what not that it's going to slow things down much if the player is ready to roll and consult the table when the time comes.

    Joshmvii on
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    webguy20webguy20 I spend too much time on the Internet Registered User regular
    We used this list at our table for the wild mage. He had a ton of fun with it and we play fast and loose with this kind of stuff, so it was hilarious more often than not. At one point we were fighting a tough monster and his surge went off and the monster turned into a small stone idol. Another time he ended up with orangutan arms for like a week.

    traykon.com/pdf/The_Net_Libram_of_Random_Magical_Effects.pdf

    Steam ID: Webguy20
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    Destrokk9Destrokk9 Registered User regular
    Goumindong wrote: »
    Gaddez wrote: »
    Destrokk9 wrote: »
    I fear for on of the Tuesday DMs at my LGS mainly because right off the bat, he has a very charismatic table and the sorcerer is wanting to change up how some of the wild surge table rolls work. For example, if he rolled the percent where his skin turns a different color, he wanted to roll an additional die to see what color it would turn into.

    I fear that he (the player) might get a bit overboard with wanting to change up the abilities.

    My biggest concern for him is that a combination of over complicating the existing chart and surging at every opportunity will lead to the player's turns taking much longer then they really ought to.

    Its pretty fast so long as you have the table and your d10's out.

    The thing is, is that a few of the results on the table are changed to then roll on a seperate table with different outcomes (the light blue skin, the feather beard, fireball...stuff like that now has a table with tons of sub-tables with their own results). If there was a sub-table for all of them, good god...

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    Nerdsamwich Nerdsamwich Registered User regular
    Using the d20 also precludes the chance of multiple jumps. I think changing the scaling to d8's all the way provides even more chaotic fun, as it would possibly allow for jumping to one additional target per repeated number. Yahtzee!

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    DenadaDenada Registered User regular
    Using the d20 also precludes the chance of multiple jumps. I think changing the scaling to d8's all the way provides even more chaotic fun, as it would possibly allow for jumping to one additional target per repeated number. Yahtzee!

    You make a new attack roll with each new target.

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    JoshmviiJoshmvii Registered User regular
    Using the d20 also precludes the chance of multiple jumps. I think changing the scaling to d8's all the way provides even more chaotic fun, as it would possibly allow for jumping to one additional target per repeated number. Yahtzee!

    No it doesn't. If the spell jump was triggered on say a natural even result on d20, it would trigger again when you rolled the new attack roll against the next target. Every target gets a new attack roll regardless of whether you're using the d20 or the damage dice to determine whether you get to add a new target for the spell.

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    DevoutlyApatheticDevoutlyApathetic Registered User regular
    Using the d20 also precludes the chance of multiple jumps. I think changing the scaling to d8's all the way provides even more chaotic fun, as it would possibly allow for jumping to one additional target per repeated number. Yahtzee!

    Just be ready for a 4th level version to almost always jump (~80% jump rate). A 5th is up to 92% jump rate. An 8th level version can't stop jumping so long as it has targets and could easily wipe most cities.

    Actually I suspect much lower would chew through a huge amount but the average jumps before failure hurts my brain.

    Nod. Get treat. PSN: Quippish
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    DenadaDenada Registered User regular
    edited April 2017
    Using the d20 also precludes the chance of multiple jumps. I think changing the scaling to d8's all the way provides even more chaotic fun, as it would possibly allow for jumping to one additional target per repeated number. Yahtzee!

    Just be ready for a 4th level version to almost always jump (~80% jump rate). A 5th is up to 92% jump rate. An 8th level version can't stop jumping so long as it has targets and could easily wipe most cities.

    Actually I suspect much lower would chew through a huge amount but the average jumps before failure hurts my brain.

    Unless you miss.

    Edit: And since a 1 always misses in 5E, there's always at least a 5% chance of missing regardless of how high-level the caster is or how easy the target is.

    Denada on
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    FryFry Registered User regular
    Starter spells:
    - Ceremony makes me laugh. The "once per character per lifetime" effects are cute.
    - Why are we giving healing spells (Healing Elixir) to wizards and warlocks?
    - Don't have my PH on me, but isn't Puppet a worse version of a spell Bards already have?
    - the value of Virtue seems questionable at best. Temporary HP for one round? I get that it's a cantrip, but ehhh
    - Zephyr Strike seems pretty cool.

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    DevoutlyApatheticDevoutlyApathetic Registered User regular
    Denada wrote: »
    Using the d20 also precludes the chance of multiple jumps. I think changing the scaling to d8's all the way provides even more chaotic fun, as it would possibly allow for jumping to one additional target per repeated number. Yahtzee!

    Just be ready for a 4th level version to almost always jump (~80% jump rate). A 5th is up to 92% jump rate. An 8th level version can't stop jumping so long as it has targets and could easily wipe most cities.

    Actually I suspect much lower would chew through a huge amount but the average jumps before failure hurts my brain.

    Unless you miss.

    Edit: And since a 1 always misses in 5E, there's always at least a 5% chance of missing regardless of how high-level the caster is or how easy the target is.

    Yea, I missed that the jumps require attack rolls. Just start out hidden to push that down to a .25% chance of insta-miss from advantage. Which makes zero sense but D&D.

    Nod. Get treat. PSN: Quippish
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    JoshmviiJoshmvii Registered User regular
    Even if you were hidden to start, you'd only have advantage on the first attack roll.

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    DenadaDenada Registered User regular
    Ooh you know what, they should make the extra damage 2d4 instead of 1d6 or 1d8. Those little caltrops never get enough love.

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    JoshmviiJoshmvii Registered User regular
    Nooooo, I hate d4s. Even picking them up is annoying. What I need to roll more of is always d12s, the best of all ds.

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    GaddezGaddez Registered User regular
    The worst thing about those stupid d4's is when you find one with your foot that fell off the table.

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    GoumindongGoumindong Registered User regular
    Joshmvii wrote: »
    Nooooo, I hate d4s. Even picking them up is annoying. What I need to roll more of is always d12s, the best of all ds.

    /2 = d6
    /3 = d4
    /4 = d3
    /6 = d2

    They really are the best of d's
    Joshmvii wrote: »
    Even if you were hidden to start, you'd only have advantage on the first attack roll.

    Not sure why. The results are instantaneous. You would have advantage on all of them if you're hidden from the target

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    JoshmviiJoshmvii Registered User regular
    edited April 2017
    Just going by this text from 5E:
    When a creature can’t see you, you have advantage on attack rolls against it. If you are hidden—both unseen and unheard—when you make an attack, you give away your location when the attack hits or misses.

    Because you have to determine whether the attack hits or not before you know if it is going to jump, and then make another attack roll, I'd consider that sequential and so you'd only have advantage on the first. For a similar official ruling, their sage advice said that Scorching Ray attacks are done sequentially despite it being an instantaneous spell, allowing you to pick a new target after each ray if you want.

    In 5E language, making an attack means rolling an attack roll. So you'd only be hidden on the first roll.

    Instantaneous description in 5E doesn't mean all the effects happen super duper fast. It just means the magic only persists for a short time and thus is not eligible to be dispelled.

    From the 5E SRD under instantaneous spell duration:
    Instantaneous
    Many spells are instantaneous. The spell harms,
    heals, creates, or alters a creature or an object in a
    way that can’t be dispelled, because its magic exists
    only for an instant.

    Joshmvii on
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    AistanAistan Tiny Bat Registered User regular
    In tonight's session we find what happens when a Drow, as part of a diplomatic envoy representing the "champions" of a human city, arrives in front of the Elf Princess in the middle of their sacred temple.

    Spoiler alert: she gets thrown in jail immediately and the trial starts next session.

    That plus the magical undead opera house that, if you succeed at a high performance roll, lets whatever you say out loud become reality which culminated in the playwright necromancer and her having a proxy battle involving shadow soldiers and a giant demon tree made this a super interesting session for our Drow Bard. Finally something interesting happened on these adventures! It's been all demon cloak this and crazy wizard that and boo hoo goblins burnt down my inn waaaaah. No, now she's got the playwright's notes and she can work on his final unreleased work. Fame and fortune awaits!

    As long as she's not executed by these elves first.

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    Nerdsamwich Nerdsamwich Registered User regular
    Fry wrote: »
    Starter spells:
    - Ceremony makes me laugh. The "once per character per lifetime" effects are cute.
    - Why are we giving healing spells (Healing Elixir) to wizards and warlocks?
    - Don't have my PH on me, but isn't Puppet a worse version of a spell Bards already have?
    - the value of Virtue seems questionable at best. Temporary HP for one round? I get that it's a cantrip, but ehhh
    - Zephyr Strike seems pretty cool.

    Healing elixir is fair neat, but the rest of them leave me wondering why you'd ever bother when you have cantrips that hit for d10. All in all, not an inspiring list.

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    GaddezGaddez Registered User regular
    So I ran my first session as GM for the TFTYP season and so far it's been great!

    My party, consisting of a barbarian, a rogue, a paladin, a light cleric and a monk were sent off to the sunless citadel with two hooks:
    • Get one of the fancy magic apples goblins from there sell.
    • Get the adventurers who were sent before hand back because one of them is supposed to get married.

    With that done, the party descended into the ravine where the goblin fort was located and proceded to spend most of the session on a side path that led to them fighting giant rats, a smarmy quasit, a decrepit troll, and a pair of mephits (who were super salty that they'd broken into their keg home).

    Now, this does put them behind the other group (who are pretty much beelining towards the end), but because we're running on points that factor in secrets, monsters defeated, treasure found, rooms explored and who gets to the end, my table might come out ahead :)

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    Destrokk9Destrokk9 Registered User regular
    Tonight was a ton of fun in terms of DnD. Our party consists of:

    An Aasimar (Scourge) Barbarian
    An Aasimar (Fallen) Paladin
    A Human light Cleric
    A Human Monk and
    A Kenku Rogue

    The interesting thing about our party is that our Rogue likes to come up with interesting ideas to execute plans and stuff, but with him being a Kenku, it is impossible for him to create new ideas or thoughts and convey them to the party (thanks mimicry!). The way he became a Kenku was because when he was a Human, he took a relic that was related to the Raven Lord. Cursed into a Kenku and there you go.

    Our party just finished adventurers college (hardest course is resting 101. They make you study so much about sleep!) when we decided to go out on our first adventure to the Sunless Citadel. We were tasked with finding these goblins that sold amazing apples (for some reason) as well as finding this one woman who was marrying the grandson of this old lady. We head over to a ravine and head down this dangling chain. We are all fairly good at climbing down. Our monk however, is climbing down as if Naruto was real life, because why not?

    As we then make our way down some slippery stairs, our paladin takes a slip and falls down and gets hurt a bit. After almost a minute after his fall, my character noticed (in the Nat 1 way of reacting to attempt to grab him and prevent him from slipping....glorious). We enter the first room with almost nothing being seen aside from the light coming in. Our Cleric casts Light and the Rogue decides to look for traps. After finding and jamming a trap door, he wants to then REOPEN IT...thankfully failing.

    We press further into the next room to find dead goblins and a word in some unknown language written on the wall (none of our characters know what it is), and a split in the road, 2 doors. We agree to take the southern door and then head into the next room only to find a locked door. Kenku unlocks the door (to which we now say "winner, winner, chicken dinner" whenever he succeeds on this sort of stuff) and we then get nearly ambushed by giant rats! A quick amount of fighting (and a javelin getting shattered into the wall with insane force from the Barbarian) takes care of that while our Kenku sneaks into the other room only to find he has a sudden need to race back to the entrance at a sprint. The Barbarian manages to ignore the compelling feeling and stops the Kenku with help from the Paladin. The Cleric the decides to have the same feeling and is stopped quickly by the Monk. Our party then notices a glowing orb making noise and our Barbarian decides to whack it with his Greataxe.

    With that destroyed, we then make way to the next room, only to have our Paladin shot in the chest with an arrow due to a trap (thankfully, no damage was sustained) and our Kenku does his thing yet again. As we then enter a room with a marble statue of a dragon, we are then tasked with a riddle. The first answer is to no avail, but the next answer is correct. A doorway is revealed and we make our way into the next room where massive statues of cultists are put in alcoves in the room and a giant pit is on the other side, with a sarcophagus on the other side. As the Cleric and Paladin are look at the statues, the Monk and Barbarian are investigating the pit. All of a sudden, a fiend fails to scare the Barbarian and make him slip into the spiked pit. After some bantering (and the party thinking the Barbarian is crazy, only to find out he wasn't thanks to the Paladin), the party then tries to jump. The Monk makes it easily, the Paladin almost falls in, the Cleric notices that there is a way to easily climb down and walk to the other side and climb up on the other side, the Barbarian ties rope to a javelin and throws it into the wall, aaaaand the Kenku fails....hard. Like, dies fail. Good game!

    After all that, the party takes a long rest to regain any spent spell slots and hp lost. Afterwards, the party decides to open up the sarcophagus and out comes a troll (and not the internet kind either)! After a quick fight with that and burning the body (thanks to party having knowledge of trolls due to previous encounters in a completely different campaign. Yay sudo-metagaming), the party finds a silver ornate dagger, 2 ornate rings, a silver amulet, 50GP and 4 scrolls (2nd lv cure wounds, inflict wounds, guiding bolt and one more, can't remember). We are all fairly happy about defeating that and we make our way back to the split in the road.

    Taking the only door that is not open, the party then make our way north and find ourselves at a 3 door split (left, straight and right). The party takes the left door and found a small room with a metallic keg in the center. After some caution from the Cleric, the party gets it open only to fight a steam and an ice mephit. The Cleric drops before the fight begins and shortly after the first round, the Monk drops as well. We then make quick work of the fight and decided to call it there.

    It was a ton of fun for the first adventuring session of this season and I can't wait for more. And I know that I called every class respectively aside from the Kenku, but that is because we have 2 Aasimars and 2 humans, also respectively. I can't thank @Gaddez enough for being a fun GM and making this a fun session.

    This is gonna be a fun thing!

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    EinzelEinzel Registered User regular
    I found a D&D thread! Yay!

    (I'm a supernoob and am learning how to play so I can find a group after I move.)

    (Also was kinda bummed that a gnome paladin doesn't really work out

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    captainkcaptaink TexasRegistered User regular
    In 5e? It's not optimal but it's a pretty slight difference.

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    EinzelEinzel Registered User regular
    I wanted him to be a polearm sentinel oath of ancients but he gets penalized on heavy weapons, right?

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    iguanacusiguanacus Desert PlanetRegistered User regular
    Ignore it or make some special gnomish polearms that are identical. It's purely a verisimilitude thing, safe to ignore it.

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    GoumindongGoumindong Registered User regular
    Einzel wrote: »
    I wanted him to be a polearm sentinel oath of ancients but he gets penalized on heavy weapons, right?

    Gnomes straight up can't use heavy weapons... But your DM probably doesn't care.

    Additionally Paladins have a lot of bonus damage and so don't really need to go heavy weapons.

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    AistanAistan Tiny Bat Registered User regular
    OTOH a paladin with a polearm is an awesome whirling blender of destruction against a single target and being a tiny one of those makes it even better.

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    GoumindongGoumindong Registered User regular
    Eh. You can TWF just fine as a non-pole arm and get the same advantages essentially.

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    EinzelEinzel Registered User regular
    What happens after you max a character and/or finish a campaign? Do you put them away and make another?

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    GoumindongGoumindong Registered User regular
    Einzel wrote: »
    What happens after you max a character and/or finish a campaign? Do you put them away and make another?

    Well yes but I mean. My character just hit 5 and we have been playing for 6 months ish? Not worried about calling out really.

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    MrVyngaardMrVyngaard Live From New Etoile Straight Outta SosariaRegistered User regular
    Einzel wrote: »
    What happens after you max a character and/or finish a campaign? Do you put them away and make another?

    You can retire them and have the new characters be the next generation of adventurers. Some D&D gaming groups' campaign worlds have been going on for decades by doing just this, over and over.

    "now I've got this mental image of caucuses as cafeteria tables in prison, and new congressmen having to beat someone up on inauguration day." - Raiden333
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    ArdentArdent Down UpsideRegistered User regular
    Einzel wrote: »
    What happens after you max a character and/or finish a campaign? Do you put them away and make another?
    Generally characters will retire. Sometimes they come back as acquaintances of the new heroes. Or set up as the villains. Or simply are never mentioned again.

    Steam ID | Origin ID: ArdentX | Uplay ID: theardent | Battle.net: Ardent#11476
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    SmrtnikSmrtnik job boli zub Registered User regular
    Ardent wrote: »
    Einzel wrote: »
    What happens after you max a character and/or finish a campaign? Do you put them away and make another?
    Generally characters will retire. Sometimes they come back as acquaintances of the new heroes. Or set up as the villains. Or simply are never mentioned again.

    I have been playing with same group of folks since Dragon Queen's Hoard. That game we were
    Holy Cleric of Lathandet (me)
    Fire Cleric of Lathander
    Paladin of Lathander
    Monk
    Conman Sorcerer that made us all think he's into Lathander
    Wizard
    Bard

    Next game (elemental evil)
    Rogue (me), runaway son of the Holy Cleric and the Wizard
    Different Bard
    Different Wizard, genasi
    Dwarf polearm warrior
    Sewer flavored druid (warerat form)
    Regular druid
    Barbarian
    My rogue died, i rerolled Warlock
    The regular druid died, rerolled rogue


    Next game (underdark)
    Ranged fighter battlemaster (me)
    Eldritch fighter svirfneblin gnome (our tank)
    Champion fighter gwf orc
    Different paladin
    Dark elf sorceress
    Different bard, aasari

    Next game (giants)
    Dwarf paladin
    Dwarf swashbuckler rogue, his brother
    Fire cleric, daughter of paladin and an npc from first game
    Monk, used to work for elemental evil Temple on second game
    Different wizard
    Runemaster cleric
    Monk died, rerolled to a different warlock

    Next game the plan is to play a bunch of monster races who are the escaped menagerie of the wizard from the second game (who turned evil from obtaining one of the elemental weapons on that game).

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