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Waking Up To A Bad Back: Need Advice

Lately I've been waking up to back pain, usually concentrated right in the middle but also the lower portion.

This seems to happen whenever I exceed a certain number of hours of sleep, around 7 or more since I'm mostly unaffected during the work weekdays. The level of pain varies, but in a couple of occasions it hurt so much I needed help getting out of bed. The pain also passes after an hour or two of getting up and walking around/stretching.

At first I thought my shitty mattress was the cause. It was recommended that for someone my size (6'4), a firm mattress would be my best option. After some recommendations I settled on this model from Mattress One. Got a real good deal and a memory foam pillow to boot. Comfort wise it's much better than my previous cheap bed.

But the pain still persists. I thought changing mattresses would do the trick, as I had a friend who had a similar situation, and claimed his back problems went away overnight when he got his hybrid bed.

Another suggestion is that I need to exercise more, which is indeed something I want to work on as someone who has largely avoided any exercise activity for the past few months. If you concur with that, then I could use some effective exercises that can also improve my back.

Either way, help a broken back brother out.

«13

Posts

  • bowenbowen How you doin'? Registered User regular
    Is it every day? Or just when you "sleep in" ?

    Exercise will absolutely help with posture and general "oh god everything hurts until I stretch and move around pain" but, this is probably because you're getting older.

    not a doctor, not a lawyer, examples I use may not be fully researched so don't take out of context plz, don't @ me
  • Professor SnugglesworthProfessor Snugglesworth Registered User regular
    bowen wrote: »
    Is it every day? Or just when you "sleep in" ?

    Exercise will absolutely help with posture and general "oh god everything hurts until I stretch and move around pain" but, this is probably because you're getting older.

    Every time I sleep in, basically. So the weekend.

    I'm in my mid 30's, so...don't want to think I'm at rickety bones levels yet.

    But yeah, I'll need to do more exercise, but what's especially useful?

  • LostNinjaLostNinja Registered User regular
    Try implementing a morning stretching routine. I used to work in a physical therapy clinic where we saw a lot of patients come in with low back pain. The very first thing we would do with them is stretch out their hamstrings and hip flexors, both of which have attachments to the lumbar vertebra of the spine (lower back). That and working on strengthening your core and abs should help immensely.

  • Professor SnugglesworthProfessor Snugglesworth Registered User regular
    LostNinja wrote: »
    Try implementing a morning stretching routine. I used to work in a physical therapy clinic where we saw a lot of patients come in with low back pain. The very first thing we would do with them is stretch out their hamstrings and hip flexors, both of which have attachments to the lumbar vertebra of the spine (lower back). That and working on strengthening your core and abs should help immensely.

    Wouldn't it make more sense to stretch out before going to bed? At least that's what I had assumed.

    Didn't know abs factored into the lower back either. This is why I made this thread, so I could educate myself on this stuff more.

  • LostNinjaLostNinja Registered User regular
    LostNinja wrote: »
    Try implementing a morning stretching routine. I used to work in a physical therapy clinic where we saw a lot of patients come in with low back pain. The very first thing we would do with them is stretch out their hamstrings and hip flexors, both of which have attachments to the lumbar vertebra of the spine (lower back). That and working on strengthening your core and abs should help immensely.

    Wouldn't it make more sense to stretch out before going to bed? At least that's what I had assumed.

    Didn't know abs factored into the lower back either. This is why I made this thread, so I could educate myself on this stuff more.

    I just think morning because that will help with the rest of your day. Before bed is good too. Both would be even better. And general core strength tends to help with the back as well, but that's less the muscle tightness and more just that it can take some of the load off of your back some while doing certain activities.

  • dispatch.odispatch.o Registered User regular
    edited February 2017
    Ibuprofen for inflammation, movement and warmth to loosen things up, ice to reduce pain.

    It's also a consequence of aging and general wear and tear that things start to hurt in the morning. Lots of the injuries you sustain when you're 10-25 seem like they healed completely, the damage is still there waiting until you get over 30. This is especially true of the lower back and the Psoas and Adductor muscles where the muscle tissue is like a weave of stretched ropes with minimal blood supply. All that scarring from life adds up. You may also need a new firmer mattress as without proper support you're stretching things in an unnatural way over an extended period of time.

    IANAD, just someone with a ruined lumbar spine due to working in healthcare.

    Edit: Stretching the lower back isn't always the best idea, you may want to see a physical therapist about how to go about a morning routine.

    dispatch.o on
  • DarkewolfeDarkewolfe Registered User regular
    Back pain is so often the result of poor posture or rotation impacting, pinching, or pushing against a nerve. The answer is almost always exercise.

    What is this I don't even.
  • firewaterwordfirewaterword Satchitananda Pais Vasco to San FranciscoRegistered User regular
    How do you typically sleep? Sleeping on your stomach can lead to back pain since it flattens the natural curve of the spine.

    Lokah Samastah Sukhino Bhavantu
  • Professor SnugglesworthProfessor Snugglesworth Registered User regular
    How do you typically sleep? Sleeping on your stomach can lead to back pain since it flattens the natural curve of the spine.

    Flat on my back. I probably shift to the side once in a while, but I'll typically shift back as I find flat on my back the most comfortable.

  • firewaterwordfirewaterword Satchitananda Pais Vasco to San FranciscoRegistered User regular
    edited February 2017
    How do you typically sleep? Sleeping on your stomach can lead to back pain since it flattens the natural curve of the spine.

    Flat on my back. I probably shift to the side once in a while, but I'll typically shift back as I find flat on my back the most comfortable.

    Yeah in that case I'd echo the stretching/strengthening advice. The goal is to strengthen other parts of your body to take the load off of your lower back - if you have weak or tight hamstrings or psoas muscles, for example, the muscles in your back will be "recruited" to help, which can lead to strain et cetera. Maybe try some of the things here. I'd also really recommend therapeutic yoga if that's something you think you might be OK with.

    firewaterword on
    Lokah Samastah Sukhino Bhavantu
  • DarkewolfeDarkewolfe Registered User regular
    Honestly, go to a doctor with your back pain, and make sure to steer the doc toward prescribing you some physical therapy. Do the physical therapy, during which the PT doc will probably correct a bunch of your movement, teaching you to engage certain muscles you don't use enough which will lighten the load, then ask the PT doc to give you a list of exercises to do at the gym to keep improving your back support and reducing your pain.

    I have a shit back; I have a slipped disc that pokes a nerve bundle and my scapula doesn't rotate real great. The only answer is exercising with those injuries in mind because it strengthens everything else, takes the pressure off the nerves, and pretty much eliminates the pain. But if I stop exercising for a month, it'll come back. Gotta be healthy and get stronk.

    What is this I don't even.
  • FiendishrabbitFiendishrabbit Registered User regular
    Exercises to strengthen your back.
    Squats (properly done, with shoulders back and a proper back posture.)
    The plank
    Bent-over Row
    Front lateral Pull-downs

    Those should be reasonable exercises for a guy in his mid-30s without spinal injuries.
    Combine it with deadlifts (again, properly done), Bench presses and some gymnastic ring push-ups and you've got yourself a full body workout.

    "The western world sips from a poisonous cocktail: Polarisation, populism, protectionism and post-truth"
    -Antje Jackelén, Archbishop of the Church of Sweden
  • schussschuss Registered User regular
    I wouldn't recommend deadlifts, as I know a number of people that have injured their back while learning to deadlift. As someone with a healing herniated disc, I'd say the following:
    Squats
    Planks
    Opposite stretches on a yoga ball
    Yoga
    Balance work

    The goal is to tighten up your core, so that means lots of non-rigid exercises and items that require stabilization. If you aren't already fit, I'd recommend doing body weight focused stuff first, as adding weight is an easy way to make it worse.

  • WordLustWordLust Fort Wayne, INRegistered User regular
    edited February 2017
    This is really common advice, so I'm sure you've already seen it, but it works for me:

    If you sleep on your side, put a pillow between your knees. Holding a second one between your arms can also help. I recommend getting a large/long pillow like a body pillow for this.

    If you're sleeping on your back, place a pillow under your knees, resting your hamstrings on it. Make sure it is a thick enough pillow that you actually get a little bit of lift out of it. Again, a body pillow can be great for this since the length makes it less likely that your legs will just fall off the side of the pillow.

    It's a very small thing, but both of these make adjustments to straighten your spine while you sleep, putting less stress on it. It makes a huge difference for me. It might help you, if even a little bit.

    (Also make sure you rule out other possible sources. If you work a desk job and sit all day in a chair that is not very ergonomic, you might be waking up to a bad back for reasons that have more to do with your chair/posture.)

    WordLust on
  • FiendishrabbitFiendishrabbit Registered User regular
    schuss wrote: »
    I wouldn't recommend deadlifts, as I know a number of people that have injured their back while learning to deadlift. As someone with a healing herniated disc, I'd say the following:
    Squats
    Planks
    Opposite stretches on a yoga ball
    Yoga
    Balance work

    The goal is to tighten up your core, so that means lots of non-rigid exercises and items that require stabilization. If you aren't already fit, I'd recommend doing body weight focused stuff first, as adding weight is an easy way to make it worse.

    Well. You need to get your deadlifts right at the very beginning when you're lifting no more than the bar+2x3kg. Like the squat technique is everything. They're skippable though.
    Now Squats on the other hand, it's not a workout without squats.

    "The western world sips from a poisonous cocktail: Polarisation, populism, protectionism and post-truth"
    -Antje Jackelén, Archbishop of the Church of Sweden
  • schussschuss Registered User regular
    schuss wrote: »
    I wouldn't recommend deadlifts, as I know a number of people that have injured their back while learning to deadlift. As someone with a healing herniated disc, I'd say the following:
    Squats
    Planks
    Opposite stretches on a yoga ball
    Yoga
    Balance work

    The goal is to tighten up your core, so that means lots of non-rigid exercises and items that require stabilization. If you aren't already fit, I'd recommend doing body weight focused stuff first, as adding weight is an easy way to make it worse.

    Well. You need to get your deadlifts right at the very beginning when you're lifting no more than the bar+2x3kg. Like the squat technique is everything. They're skippable though.
    Now Squats on the other hand, it's not a workout without squats.

    Deadlifts just aren't a great idea given the potential for screwing it up. If bad technique will hurt your back, it's best not to do them until you're in a stronger place.

    Agreed on squats though.

  • DjeetDjeet Registered User regular
    You don't need to use weights to address back pain. Actually you probably shouldn't jump towards weight training to do so, loaded poor form will cause more harm.

    You can address with bodyweight exercises. Variants on planks, leg raises, air squats, forward bends will strengthen the core, which will help your back. Form and consistency are more important than exertion or reps. Properly executed dragonflies/flags will murder your core, though I wouldn't recommend trying them until you've been training a bit.

    If exercising just isn't your thing then you can get a lot just from practicing the abdominal lock which you can do just sitting at your desk. It's called uddiyana bandha in yoga, and if you google it then you may see a crapload of jargon, but it's very simple. Sit up straight, square your shoulders, pull in your belly and try to make your belly button scratch your spine. Hold as long as you can. Repeat.

    Whatever you try, make it a habit. Before work, after work, during lunch break, doesn't matter. Find the time that works for you and make it a habit. Start easy. Abs DOMS is the worst.

  • JusticeJustice Registered User regular
    Exercise is great but pretty aspirational.

    Do you work a desk job? And then go home and sit to play video games or whatever? Try to not sit so much. Go for walks at work if you can--the longer the better. Go for multiple short walks or just stand outside. Do some yardwork and walk on the weekends. Basically, just try to work in non-sitting activities whenever possible.

  • jungleroomxjungleroomx It's never too many graves, it's always not enough shovels Registered User regular
    edited February 2017
    Elevate the head of your mattress. They have specialized pads for this (usually for GERD, which is how I found out about it).

    I don't know if anyone's suggested it yet, but apparently changing the angle at which gravity pulls down on your spine a little does wonders. Did for me. You'll notice a lot less of the pressure on your lower back pretty much instantly.

    jungleroomx on
  • Fuzzy Cumulonimbus CloudFuzzy Cumulonimbus Cloud Registered User regular
    Stretch your hamstrings every night before you go to bed and every morning after you wake up.

  • WordLustWordLust Fort Wayne, INRegistered User regular
    Stretch your hamstrings every night before you go to bed and every morning after you wake up.

    ...? For back pain...?

  • DarkewolfeDarkewolfe Registered User regular
    WordLust wrote: »
    Stretch your hamstrings every night before you go to bed and every morning after you wake up.

    ...? For back pain...?

    Hamstrings shorten due to too much sitting, which pulls on the hips and in turn causes back pain. It's a really common thing. Also why everyone needs to exercise. All that sitting completely destroys the way the musculo skeletal system is supposed to work.

    What is this I don't even.
  • FiendishrabbitFiendishrabbit Registered User regular
    WordLust wrote: »
    Stretch your hamstrings every night before you go to bed and every morning after you wake up.

    ...? For back pain...?

    Tight hamstrings can cause bad posture (specificly tight hamstrings can cause pelvic tilt, tight abdominals can do the same), which in turn puts extra strain on the muscles in the lower back.
    However, I don't think it's that in this case.

    "The western world sips from a poisonous cocktail: Polarisation, populism, protectionism and post-truth"
    -Antje Jackelén, Archbishop of the Church of Sweden
  • LostNinjaLostNinja Registered User regular
    edited February 2017
    WordLust wrote: »
    Stretch your hamstrings every night before you go to bed and every morning after you wake up.

    ...? For back pain...?
    LostNinja wrote: »
    Try implementing a morning stretching routine. I used to work in a physical therapy clinic where we saw a lot of patients come in with low back pain. The very first thing we would do with them is stretch out their hamstrings and hip flexors, both of which have attachments to the lumbar vertebra of the spine (lower back). That and working on strengthening your core and abs should help immensely.

    LostNinja on
  • schussschuss Registered User regular
    Justice wrote: »
    Exercise is great but pretty aspirational.

    Do you work a desk job? And then go home and sit to play video games or whatever? Try to not sit so much. Go for walks at work if you can--the longer the better. Go for multiple short walks or just stand outside. Do some yardwork and walk on the weekends. Basically, just try to work in non-sitting activities whenever possible.

    Good bodyweight workouts to strengthen your core take maybe 15 minutes a day from anywhere.

  • Fuzzy Cumulonimbus CloudFuzzy Cumulonimbus Cloud Registered User regular
    The majority of routine lower back pain is muscle related and stretching will always help alleviate it.
    :)

  • Professor SnugglesworthProfessor Snugglesworth Registered User regular
    So squats, sit-ups, planks and similar motions (push-ups too?) are things I can squeeze in every day.

    The question is how many of each should I do for it to be effective?

    On the subject of abs, I was given an ab-roller as a christmas gift. Just doing three or four of those leaves my abs tight and sore the whole week. Not sure if that's me being super out of shape or that thing being super effective, but the question of quantity remains.

  • FiendishrabbitFiendishrabbit Registered User regular
    Don't do sit-ups. Just don't. They're bad for your spine.

    So no gymming?

    If you're doing squats. 3 sets of 5 to 12 reps (lower number of reps with heavier weight increases strength faster. Higher number gives more endurance).
    If this isn't tough enough a kettlebell can make it more demanding. An 8 and a 16kg weight are always nice to have. If you want to increase your core strength more than that you need a barbell and weights.
    As an added benefit a 1 minute kettlebell swing (do check out how you do a proper kettlebell swing before doing it. Again proper back and shoulder posture is key)->1 minute step-up->repeat is a really good exercise that combines strengthening your core and legs with good cardio.

    When it comes to the plank. Hold as long as you can. Then rest for a minute. Then do 1-3 minutes of The Dead Bug. Then plank until failure again. Repeat 3-5 times.
    The plank really benefits your central back and abs while the Dead bug exercises primarily your obliques. The dead bug can be made tougher with low level weights (such as a medicine ball or a small hand-weight).

    Maybe add the Bridge exercise. It's another spine friendly core exercise that can be made a lot tougher with basically any weight available (held at lower ab/crotch height). It has a different focus than the Squat, so if you feel that the squat isn't doing much for your glutes...try it out.

    "The western world sips from a poisonous cocktail: Polarisation, populism, protectionism and post-truth"
    -Antje Jackelén, Archbishop of the Church of Sweden
  • DarkewolfeDarkewolfe Registered User regular
    Get a physical therapist/doctor to identify your actual injury, rather than our internet speculation, and provide you with exercises to do. Do them, then as your doc/PT says it's ok add a full workout.

    What is this I don't even.
  • WordLustWordLust Fort Wayne, INRegistered User regular
    edited February 2017
    Don't do sit-ups. Just don't. They're bad for your spine.

    I'm not an expert on these subjects so this is a genuine question:

    I seem to recall reading or being told at some point that situps are mostly bad for your spine if you are doing the kind of situp where you lay completely flat and then sit all the way up, as close to 90 degrees as you can, or touching your elbows to your knees etc. It actually does more to kill your lower back than it does to workout your ab muscles.

    But if you do the kind of sit up where you basically just lift only your shoulders, but your back doesn't come off the floor at all, then it's not so bad for your spine and is actually a much better workout for your abs.

    The latter part about the abs seems to be true. The part about the back, though? yay or nay?

    WordLust on
  • bowenbowen How you doin'? Registered User regular
    sit ups are falling out of style for planks, which are much more comfortable and actually do a bit more work, obviously if you have shoulder or elbow problems planks are still going to be hard to do

    not a doctor, not a lawyer, examples I use may not be fully researched so don't take out of context plz, don't @ me
  • FiendishrabbitFiendishrabbit Registered User regular
    WordLust wrote: »
    Don't do sit-ups. Just don't. They're bad for your spine.

    I'm not an expert on these subjects so this is a genuine question:

    I seem to recall reading or being told at some point that situps are mostly bad for your spine if you are doing the kind of situp where you lay completely flat and then sit all the way up, as close to 90 degrees as you can, or touching your elbows to your knees etc. It actually does more to kill your lower back than it does to workout your ab muscles.

    But if you do the kind of sit up where you basically just lift only your shoulders, but your back doesn't come off the floor at all, then it's not so bad for your spine and is actually a much better workout for your abs.

    The latter part about the abs seems to be true. The part about the back, though? yay or nay?

    There are two occasions where you should avoid flexing your spine at all cost. Lifting and during exercise. Generally sit ups is a dangerous exercise that's an express road to a disc hernia. It's worse if you curve your spine while you do it, but it's overall bad.

    If you have bad knees/elbows and can't do a plank do a McGill Curl-up.

    McGill Curl-up
    1. Lie flat on the ground.
    2. Draw one leg towards you until the knee is bent 90%, keep the other straight. This isolates the abs from the hip flexors.
    3. Put your hands under your lower back (palms down). That will keep a health curve to your spine while further isolating the abs.
    4. Then just raise the head and shoulders so that they lift from the ground and no more than that.

    The McGill Curl-up will have to be combined with more back oriented exercises like The Aquaman.

    "The western world sips from a poisonous cocktail: Polarisation, populism, protectionism and post-truth"
    -Antje Jackelén, Archbishop of the Church of Sweden
  • Professor SnugglesworthProfessor Snugglesworth Registered User regular
    My sister, who is fairly knowledgeable with health and fitness, recommended I get a foam roller, which I ordered yesterday.

    I feel like the pain is getting worse, so I'm considering seeing a chiropractor next week (or am I better off seeing a physical therapist?).

    Coincidentally, my father is also suffering from neck pain, and appears to have it worse then me (it seems to be a 24/7 thing with him).

  • So It GoesSo It Goes We keep moving...Registered User regular
    My sister, who is fairly knowledgeable with health and fitness, recommended I get a foam roller, which I ordered yesterday.

    I feel like the pain is getting worse, so I'm considering seeing a chiropractor next week (or am I better off seeing a physical therapist?).

    Coincidentally, my father is also suffering from neck pain, and appears to have it worse then me (it seems to be a 24/7 thing with him).

    You should see a physical therapist, not a chiropractor.

  • dispatch.odispatch.o Registered User regular
    So It Goes wrote: »
    My sister, who is fairly knowledgeable with health and fitness, recommended I get a foam roller, which I ordered yesterday.

    I feel like the pain is getting worse, so I'm considering seeing a chiropractor next week (or am I better off seeing a physical therapist?).

    Coincidentally, my father is also suffering from neck pain, and appears to have it worse then me (it seems to be a 24/7 thing with him).

    You should see a physical therapist, not a chiropractor.

    Bonus is that it's usually very easy to get a referral to a physical therapist. Chiropractors are basically alternative medicine and insurance can be picky about that stuff.

  • Donovan PuppyfuckerDonovan Puppyfucker A dagger in the dark is worth a thousand swords in the morningRegistered User regular
    My sister, who is fairly knowledgeable with health and fitness, recommended I get a foam roller, which I ordered yesterday.

    I feel like the pain is getting worse, so I'm considering seeing a chiropractor next week (or am I better off seeing a physical therapist?).

    Coincidentally, my father is also suffering from neck pain, and appears to have it worse then me (it seems to be a 24/7 thing with him).

    Chiropractors are fucking charlatans and snake oil salesmen, avoid them like the plague.

    One thing nobody has mentioned yet, what type of mattress do you have, how old is it, what condition is it in?

  • bowenbowen How you doin'? Registered User regular
    I don't see any mentioning of weight, that's also something to look into if snuggles is overweight or obese.

    What I think we have here is a combination of 4-5 things that are exacerbating the condition, and they probably all need to be addressed. It's not going to get any easier with age, if anything it'll be harder (and hurt a lot more), so changing them now is a good idea.

    not a doctor, not a lawyer, examples I use may not be fully researched so don't take out of context plz, don't @ me
  • Professor SnugglesworthProfessor Snugglesworth Registered User regular
    Went to see a PCP yesterday, as it was suggested that I see a primary care doctor first before seeing a specialist.

    Even though he reviewed well in Zocdoc, I didn't like him: he diagnosed my condition way too quickly without asking any follow-up questions or even feeling around back there. He insisted that the pain was the result of my height (6'4) and not because of inactivity or weight (though he did say losing weight would help). He strongly suggested I see a specialist for an MRI as well as an X-ray, and prescribed two types of pain meds that I'm currently taking.

    As weight goes, I'm not obese and on the minor side of overweight, but I do feel I've put on a few extra pounds lately, so I'm taking steps to try and shave that off. It's a tough thing to do considering the feasts my family puts out on a daily basis, but my sister (again, health nut) insists that I can get by with portion control, rather than give up certain foods entirely: have one soda a day instead of two, have half the amount of sides I have with meals, things like that.

    Hopefully that and the pills will do it, in addition to the suggested excercises. The pain has been getting worse, sometimes lasting the whole day when previously I could stretch it off after waking up.
    My sister, who is fairly knowledgeable with health and fitness, recommended I get a foam roller, which I ordered yesterday.

    I feel like the pain is getting worse, so I'm considering seeing a chiropractor next week (or am I better off seeing a physical therapist?).

    Coincidentally, my father is also suffering from neck pain, and appears to have it worse then me (it seems to be a 24/7 thing with him).

    Chiropractors are fucking charlatans and snake oil salesmen, avoid them like the plague.

    One thing nobody has mentioned yet, what type of mattress do you have, how old is it, what condition is it in?

    Bed's linked in the OP.

  • [Michael][Michael] Registered User regular
    Went to see a PCP yesterday, as it was suggested that I see a primary care doctor first before seeing a specialist.
    ...my sister (again, health nut) insists that I can get by with portion control, rather than give up certain foods entirely: have one soda a day instead of two, have half the amount of sides I have with meals, things like that.

    She's right. I've done cuts with staples like cheesy gordita crunches from Taco Bell and ice cream. Soo so terrible for you, but with the right portion sizes, you can lose weight with any food. If you aren't too sure how much you should be eating, you might try explicitly counting every calorie you eat for a few weeks until you get an idea. MyFitnessPal has worked well for me, but there are lots of options.

    For me, diet soda is a godsend. You don't have to drop the habit, but you get to drop all the calories. I avoided them for years because they taste terrible until you are used to the artificial sweeteners, but after a few weeks they're nearly indistinguishable from non-diet.

  • Professor SnugglesworthProfessor Snugglesworth Registered User regular
    Funny enough it was Diet Pepsi I was having twice a day. She still insists I cut it down to one, and I was planning on doing so anyway as going through two cans a day was getting costly.

    I've taken some steps since the last post, including cutting down on portions, exercising more, stretching more, etc. Unfortunately the pain has not improved, and also feels like it's getting worse. I'm trying to book an appointment with the specialist I was referred to in order to get an MRI.

    On a slight tangent, as I was going to make a separate thread about this anyway, does anyone have any recommendations on good (preferably reasonably priced) desk chairs? My current chair is wearing out and is leaving me uncomfortable to the point that I rarely want to sit and play any KB/M games on PC.

    For reference I'm 6'4 and heavy set. Also I would prefer a chair that lets me rest my neck; I don't want any of those chairs that lack a head rest.

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