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[Chronic Loneliness]: Causes and Solutions
Hexmage-PA
Registered User regular
Registered User regular
Wikipedia: Loneliness wrote:Loneliness typically includes anxious feelings about a lack of connection or communication with other beings, both in the present and extending into the future. As such, loneliness can be felt even when surrounded by other people. The causes of loneliness are varied and include social, mental, emotional and physical factors.
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There are several estimates and indicators of loneliness. It has been estimated that approximately 60 million people in the United States, or 20% of the total population, feel lonely. Another study found that 12% of Americans have no one with whom to spend free time or to discuss important matters. Other research suggests that this rate has been increasing over time.
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Whether a correlation exists between Internet usage and loneliness is a subject of controversy, with some findings showing that Internet users are lonelier and others showing that lonely people who use the Internet to keep in touch with loved ones (especially seniors) report less loneliness, but that those trying to make friends online became lonelier.
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Loneliness has been linked with depression, and is thus a risk factor for suicide. Chronic loneliness can be a serious, life-threatening health condition. It has been found to be associated with an increased risk of stroke and cardiovascular disease. Loneliness shows an increased incidence of high blood pressure, high cholesterol, and obesity. Loneliness is shown to increase the concentration of cortisol levels in the body. Prolonged, high cortisol levels can cause anxiety, depression, digestive problems, heart disease, sleep problems, and weight gain.
The Atlantic wrote:Does the Internet make people lonely, or are lonely people more attracted to the Internet? The question has intensified in the Facebook era. A recent study out of Australia (where close to half the population is active on Facebook), titled “Who Uses Facebook?,” found a complex and sometimes confounding relationship between loneliness and social networking. Facebook users had slightly lower levels of “social loneliness”—the sense of not feeling bonded with friends—but “significantly higher levels of family loneliness”—the sense of not feeling bonded with family. The researchers also found that lonely people are inclined to spend more time on Facebook: “One of the most noteworthy findings,” they wrote, “was the tendency for neurotic and lonely individuals to spend greater amounts of time on Facebook per day than non-lonely individuals.”
In relation, criminologist James Alan Fox contends that mass murderers are "enabled by social isolation" and typically experience "years of disappointment and failure that produce a mix of profound hopelessness and deep-seated resentment." Jillian Peterson, an assistant professor of criminology at Hamline University who is participating in the construction of a database on mass shooters, noted that two phenomena surface repeatedly in the statistics: hopelessness and a need for notoriety in life or in death.
I personally have been very, very lonely for at least the last six years. I'm an agnostic, liberal nerd with social anxiety who, due to financial difficulty, has so far been unable to move to a city where I could associate with more people like myself. Nearly all my friends live at least an hour away, and I often only have one day a week off work, making it difficult to schedule anything. As a result I very rarely see any of my friends anymore. I am also an only child, so I don't have any siblings to talk to, and I have very little in common with the rest of my family.
In the past few years I've felt myself become more anxious, less motivated, quicker to anger, and more bitter. As I near my thirtieth birthday I've become increasingly desperate to find someone to spend time with. I'm looking on Facebook far more and trying to communicate using Messenger to keep in contact with people, but I feel continually disappointed because most people don't often reply, and they hardly ever send me messages unprompted. I try to find social events to attend, but most of the people there are already with a group or a significant other, making me feel like I'm the only one by myself. I want to find a girlfriend, too, but there are very few women I see where I live that I think I'd be the least bit compatible with, and every dating app I've tried has had few users near where I live.
I had been thinking of starting a thread like this for a while, and since presently I'm sitting at home and feeling particularly isolated I figured I might as well do it now. The intent of this thread is both to share personal experiences and ways to alleviate loneliness.
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Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
I'm also very introverted and getting more so as I get older.
I don't feel loneliness very often. It's been years. Sometimes I feel an instrumental kind of loneliness, where I wish somebody would do something specific to help me. Like, I'll be doing a project and I'll wish there was somebody who could hand me tools, or lift something heavy. Or the project will be mental and I'll wish there was somebody who could help me solve a problem or double-check my answers. But I don't ever feel a generic desire to be around people.
It's possible that I'm just saturated. I get enough social engagement from my job & living situation that my appetite is sated; perhaps if my circumstances were different I'd experience loneliness.
the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
Most of the studies are correlative; but some research suggests that it is causal. Social isolation causes poor physical health. (I can dig up citations later if anybody wants them.)
The good news is that it seems like you don't need a lot of social interaction to prevent that decline. All you really need are one or two close friends, preferably not your spouse/partner/girlfriend, with whom you share emotional intimacy. (It also seems to help if these friends aren't blood relatives. I can't recall where I saw it, but spending time with a non-relative friend seems to be better for mental health than a relative.)
Even owning a pet is partially protective against the ill effects of loneliness. It's not a complete substitute for a human friend, but it's a solid harm reduction strategy.
the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
In contrast, earlier this year I had briefly dated and developed feelings for someone who lived nearby but surprisingly had a lot in common with me. I felt better in every way: I was more positive, I started exercising, I kept my house tidy, etc. I miss feeling that good.
Loneliness is a near-guaranteed way to trigger anxiety, a depressive episode, or both for me.
My case may be a bit different, though, since I work from home. When I'm isolated, I'm really really isolated.
I then went and set up a weekly meeting with a friend in town, where we set up weekly goals towards getting a job and just talked.
This definitely helped, and I became gainfully employed shortly after.
I however had loneliness spike halfway through my first year of that job, which was basically 'you have a job, but you're still going to die alone'.
So I started actively looking for a partner, and have just married my wife.
I think I was very lucky in this regard, as I was only 'looking' for a matter of weeks before I found her.
I'm not sure what I would have done if my immediate pool of contacts hadn't yielded her, but I would have had to expand my social circles from just 'work and D&D at local store' somehow.
It's consistent with my general understanding of the now-hot-topic of "the social determinants of health" that it would work that way, but always nice to see the refs
to be honest, there is a certain amount horror attached to the idea of another 36 years being lonely and pretty much without physical and emotional intimacy, or even close connections to people of any sort. I simply can't go through that again. again and worse. again and with less support.
so, i started see i therapist a couple weeks ago. and am sort of started seeing i person romantically is a stretch... but whatever... about the same time. and have been putting in a bunch of effort building a effigy for a stupid party in the woods with some pretty good people.
it's been not as bad most of the time, but this i think is going to be a lot of work.
Do you play any tabletop games? I've found that's a really good (relatively, depending on the game) low cost way to hang out and meet new people. Game stores will usually have a play space and game nights.
As it stands I only get to hang out with any of my friends maybe once every two or three months. I worry sometimes if this means they don't really like me that much, but it's probably just because most of them have siblings and live in urban areas with plenty of people to associate with.
There's a gaming bar in a city about an hour away, but people mostly go there in pre-established groups. There aren't many people going there by themselves hoping to start a game with some other random people.
There might be some other gaming establishment around there, though. I'll have to see.
I did go to a paint and sip in that same city a few times hoping to meet people, but so far it's mostly been college students that are a good bit younger than me or couples on dates.
I checked Meet-Up.com, but there's not much at all that appeals to me on there.
Has anyone ever had success finding online some kind of regular social event to attend?
I'm glad to hear you are seeing some progress. If it's not too much to ask, is there any factor in your life that you feel majorly contributed to your isolation? For me it was a combination of anxiety, a lack of social interaction with other children as a child, and a love of hobbies and subjects that weren't popular in my area.
Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
You can always do roleplay games (aka DND, pathfinder, whitewolf, starwars, etc.) online. Fantasy Grounds 2 and Roll20 are both virtual table tops and almost always have people looking for people to join their games. I'm only familiar with Fantasy Grounds really but they have forums where GMs post looking for people to join their games. I met a group of friends that way and I've been gaming with them for over 10 years now.
Online gaming is never going to be the same as in person but it has the advantages of having a lower bar to entry and generally easier to get rolling.
Dogs don't do Facebook. Dogs don't have pre-contrived notions of people and dogs that they meet. Dogs don't really know what 'shy' is. You'll end up talking to old people and children, to men and women who otherwise you'd never have considered speaking to. Having a dog makes you go and get exercise by walking it, and being out walking a dog makes you seem more trustworthy to a huge segment of the population. Having a dog gives you something which loves you absolutely, and will always want to be with you.
It's kinda absurd sounding I know, but there have been a lot of studies which show that people who care well for their animals avoid many of the worst issues of loneliness and have more friends.
If you can't or don't want to get a pet, exercise. If you feel lonely, go out and exercise. Don't go online. Don't use your phone. Don't go on these forums. Exercise literally makes you happier. Especially when you do it to exhaustion
Oh, lots of reasons!
- A sense of belonging
- People to share good and bad times with (and receive their own unique takes on those experiences)
- More opportunities for recreation
- Networking opportunities for better advice, more friends, more people to set you up on a date, more intel on where jobs are
As far as I'm concerned being born into an environment that gives you a good social network is a form of privilege, because if nothing else it aids in building social skills and confidence.
Anyway, this isn't meant as a Help and Advice thread, but more as a general support thread like the anxiety one we had before. Anyone is welcome to share their experiences with loneliness or with combating it, either by finding new opportunities or adjusting your (perhaps unrealistic) expectations.
ehh... I'm more or less austic. people have kinda always been hard to deal with, and are kinda like... not that rewarding to be around. there's a thing i think most people and dogs have that they feel safe and happy around people they like. it like rewards them for looking people in face. I'm guessing it's close to the bit that let's them recognize people and read emotions and nonverbal communication.
i didn't really learn how to make friends with people. it was... like hard. in school i had friends because, generally, i was forced to interact with the same people 5 days a week. Mostly, other people did the sort of emotional work or whatever.
and i didn't really ever put in the effort to learn how to do that stuff, so even after like the months it takes for me to be comfortable around someone, becoming more than just acquaintances is... it's not happened much.
and, there's a bunch of anxiety stuff and there's been depression kinda all throughout.
so, i got out of school. pretty quickly ended up working mostly not closely with anyone else all the time. didn't really force myself to go make friends. moved a few times, and now I've been in Austin basically 3 full years, and I don't really have anyone I'd call in a minor emergency or if i needed... really any sort of help, and until pretty recently was looking at spending like the 5th Thanksgiving alone.
oh, and I'm pretty bad at just having a conversation with people. part of that's anxiety, part of it is lack of practice, and no small amount of it is large amounts booze and drugs.
I find social connections with people to be incredibly rewarding. It's hard to do amazing things by yourself. The sense of accomplishment of doing something hard with other people is great. Being around people i feel comfortable enough with that the stupid voice in the back of my head shuts up, and in just enjoy people is freeing. there not really anything that makes me feel as safe and like an ok example of a human than physical intimacy, like even just like decent hugs and closeness.
i want more of those things.
I've been deeply lonely for the past three years, which is when my last relationship ended. The thing is, I have several friends that I meet up with fairly regularly to play tabletop games, and more friends that I met through a dance class... but I don't feel like I "click" with any of them. My only close friends are my parents, and they live two hours away. I'm more comfortable in the company of my parents' friends and my co-workers than I am with my "friends." I know at least some of my friends care much more for me than I do for them, and it makes me feel like a fraud.
When I get a chance to hang out with people I trust, I'm a completely different person: less depressed, less anxious, more optimistic, more creative, more myself.
I feel intimidated by people my own age (31, currently). I'm much more comfortable around people 20-30 years older, all other things being equal. I was lonely in college too, even though I was surrounded by peers and had a handful of friends.
I've been seeing a therapist for a couple years, and she suggests doing activities to meet people; but finding time to socialize is difficult. Life tasks pile up around me. My apartment is a mess and has been for a long time.
I did show up to a Meetup group that looked promising, but only one other person showed, and he was new to the group too. I wasn't interested in hanging out alone with a dude I'd just met, especially since the group described itself as opinionated women, which is why I wanted to meet them in the first place.
I have a pair of budgies, but I project onto them: I worry that they're not happy, that I'm not giving them enough social or mental stimulation.
I don't Facebook, but I spend an unhealthy amount of time on these forums.
It probably doesn't help that until recently, I was doing a lot of heavy emotional labor for a friend even as we had less and less in common; and then he did something stupid that betrayed my trust. We talked about it like adults; he was very apologetic and agreed to give me space. He still thinks of me as a close friend, but I haven't felt that way about him in a long time.
I'm an introvert, but I need people. I want someone I can just be with without needing to be "on" all the time - sharing space and company, but not necessarily engaged with each other. My parents do that for me and for each other: we can keep company while each doing our own thing.
I think a lot about how in some cultures it's normal for three or four generations of a family to live together, or at least in the same vicinity. I wonder what the point is of my self-imposed exile from my hometown. But also, I think that if I did move into a situation where I could see my parents every day, I'd completely stagnate.
I know they're going to die someday and it terrifies me. I'm torn between making the most of every opportunity to see them, and trying to find/make a home/family for myself while they're still around. (I don't want kids. I want a "family" of other adults, but not in the polyamorous sense. Is that weird?)
I have become more socially active thanks to board game meetups. Board games combine socializing with games. You get to actually see and interact with people in a low stakes environment. In employment I feel the need to take things a bit too seriously because I'm going to be working with these people for a long time, and most subjects that are not banal are off the table because you never know what will offend a co-worker or make them think poorly of you, and make them want to talk bad about you to the rest of the office. I feel like a few good or bad interactions end up shaping co-workers overall impression of me, as most of my time at work is spent actually working. At a board game meetup if you don't hit it off super well with someone it's whatever. You are there to play a board game, and not everyone has to be the person you want to hang out with.
Outside of board games I view most social interactions I have as somewhat high stakes. That is, I'm around people that I'm going to have to deal with for years, and if I say something they don't like they are going to remember it and hold it against me, and they may have the power to negatively influence my life at some point. With my family and work, I keep a ton of secrets. I can't be honest about this or that about myself because I know I'll get a lot of negative judgement for who I am. At the board game meetups I can not care.
The meetup I go to I found out about through meetup.com. However, most of the local comic shops allow people to play board games all day on Saturday, and there are always people there. Some of them don't really advertise this very well, so you have to actually go to the comic shop to find out.
Edit: If you have even one friend who will play games with you consider getting a two player game like Patchwork and just hang out at a place that lets you game until you find more people. Then you can get into something that is better for a group like King of Tokyo or Ticket to Ride.
Those goals are pretty realistic. For a while i thought social interaction would solve all my problems, which meant I was bringing my problems to my interactions with others. That's narcissistic and doomed to failure.
Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
If you don't, or if you haven't been to therapy recently, it would certainly help.
the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
I’m also reading the subtle art of not giving about a fuck at the moment and a particular thing has rung very true and changed my life for the better. I was already on this path but it’s reinforced it... everyone is so focused on what will make them happy. Will social interaction and friends make you happier? That is the wrong question.
Instead consider what PAIN you are willing to endure in your life? Want to be super swole? The pain of constant exercise and eating well. Want deeper relationships? The pain and uncertainty of being vulnerable and trying. Want an amazing career? You might find yourself working 60 hours a week and being driven beyond your peers.
They’re all pain. Effort. Continuous effort.
If you are reading this thread and relationships are what you want, don’t post that people go to a board game place with pre-defined groups. Post on the Facebook board, metafilter meet ups, Craigslist about putting a group together. Only through struggle will you achieve your goal. If it was easy, you’d already have it right now.
Personally, I am making an effort with a few friends who are far away. I’ve reached out and bound us together. One friend with a baby I learned is struggling with relationship pain due to all the stress. I’m able to help him and our bond has never been deeper. I’m tearing up just thinking about a conversation we had yesterday and this is because I took the plunge and was completely vulnerable on what I wanted and hoped our friendship could be.
Work for it. No one is more scared by this than I am, I promise. You can do it.
I don't know... I sort of fucking hate thanksgiving, because it used to mean a lot to me. Like, I spend it mostly drunk eating all day with different groups of people. And now I'm maybe helping someone paint their house mostly just to not be alone.
there was sort of this art thing on saturday, and there were kinda too many people there. And, like, I knew a bunch of them well enough to talk to, but just couldn't get comfortable. Left after, like, 30 minutes. Which, is.... like... pretty sure if I'd stayed I'd have ended up at what seems to have been a pretty good after party with people I already am pretty good with or ones a want to get to know better. There's just this annoying, like FOMO but more jealous and shitty, and a fair amount of new being pissed at myself for not sticking around, though at the time I was pretty glad I had at least made myself get out the door and go check it out.
and I was sort of forced to eat lunch with my co-workers today, and really... the whole thing just drove home how just how little I relate to them, and I got to hear about all their holiday plans. Which, not really doing a whole lot for the whole shitty and jealous thing.
yeah, I don't know...
not really an edit(but several hours later due to the magic of saved drafts):
Apparently the thing I was worried about was thanksgiving. Like, not painting person's house, which wouldn't have been fun. They actually are doing a thing with there family, which is good. And after figuring that out, I am going and doing boardgames and turkey with burners, and am going to be bring yummie homemade soup.
actually doing things about the stuff you are worried about sometimes makes stuff better. Who knew?
Glad it worked out in the end!
Also, I really relate to, well, not being able to relate to people. Most of my co-workers are married and have kids, so they'll talk about stuff they've done with their families recently. Either that or sports, which I also don't care about at all.
It's getting to the point that I personally think my only halfway decent option is to try to move to the city but keep working at the same place I do now, which means my total commute each week would increase from 3 1/2 hours to 10. That would be a lot more gas money and more wear and tear on my car, but I don't know if I could find a place to work in the city that would pay well enough to make ends meet. Even then I'd have to look to make sure if I could afford to both pay more in gas money and about $100 more in rent.
LIke, I don't care about sports at all really, but I don't mind and even sometimes enjoy listening to people talk about their interest in it and asking them questions. I've found that you can get to know them, in part, by how they talk about stuff they like. I just enjoy seeing people articulate themselves in body and speech when they're getting into something they like. Sometimes, being actively interested can accentuate that, which makes it even more engaging and enjoyable.
I have never dated, and don't expect I will, but part of me thinks maybe this is the right thing to do, for any potential partner's sake. Both my parents' fathers died young; my father's father when my father was young, and my mother's father when I was young. My own father also died when I was extremely young. All were due to hereditary diseases. Would it be cruel to pursue a relationship with long term marriage in mind, when it's highly likely I will widow my partner and orphan any children?
Is this a legitimate concern, or am I justifying my loneliness to myself?
Have you tried genetics counseling
Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
This -- it depends on the hereditary diseases, but medical science is getting better and better, and nowadays there are tests for many of them that will tell you your risks.
You might not want to know, and so prefer to avoid testing. If so, I still think you can responsibly pursue a relationship with someone so long as you're open about your status. They can make a decision for themselves then.
It is, in general, up to others to determine what parts of the world are worth exploring. Don't make that decision for them.
You know, I'd never have thought of that by myself. It wouldn't fix everything, so I don't know if I will try it, but it's good that it's now rattling around in my head.
Thank you!
If you decide you want it, talk to your primary first. I mean, that'll probably happen regardless, but there might be some health care coordination needed. Open enrollment ends December 15th btw
Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
I may reactivate it one day, but before that I want to find a psychiatrist to talk to. If anyone lurking on this thread has similar issues as myself I encourage you to do the same.
What do you want from this thread? A real connection with another human being? Validation that your state of mind isn't hopelessly unique? An outlet for thoughts ringing in your head?
If you are unhappy with being lonely, then your brain has started to mane plans to get you out of that situation, provided you aren't also depressed. Something spurred you to make this thread, delete your Facebook, just change things around. What is it you are trying to do? I ask this as if you are not totally aware of the answer, though you might be. People often start doing things before they realize what it is they're actually trying to accomplish.
Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
Well the reason I didn't just make a Help and Advice thread is because I thought other people might be going through similar situations, and I think I remember there once being a similar thread for anxiety here, but it hasn't really taken off like I thought. I thought it could serve as both validation and an outlet for myself and other people like me, but either other people aren't comfortable talking about such things here or I'm the most pathetic guy on these forums.
I personally have been trying for at least four years to find a way to change my situation. It's become increasingly frustrating because I feel like I'm putting in a lot of effort with little return, and the only people who care at all to help me are people who are powerless to do so (and the people who maybe could help me are unsympathetic). The only person who really keeps in touch with me is a friend that I had grown up with and known for years but who now lives in New Jersey, which is a good bit away from rural Georgia.
I've tried to make new friends, but it ultimately feels unsatisfying because I live in the country and can't just casually visit them for dinner after work or whatever (also they may go a long time without answering your texts, if they ever do). I've tried to figure out a way to move to the city but my student loans are an enormous financial hardship, and any job I get with my degree isn't going to immediately pay anywhere near as well as the factory job I have now (if I could find a job at all). I tried just finding a girlfriend where I live but there is almost no one here that is anything at all like me. I tried just focusing on improving my drawing ability (with the hope that I could maybe use my skills as an extra source of income somehow), but turns out that framing your improvement as an artist as the only possible way out of a situation you hate puts a ton of pressure on you to improve quickly and strips any enjoyment out of the process, paradoxically making you less likely to want to draw in the first place.
I don't even have any family I could talk to about my situation except my mother, and I'm reluctant to talk to her about my problems at all because she already has a number of stress-related cardiovascular problems as it is. Whenever I tried to talk to my dad about it he's been extremely unsympathetic, saying things like "life is just shitty and the best days of your life are behind you, sorry".
I at least bought a Dungeons and Dragons starter set yesterday. Maybe I can at least get my step-cousin and her boyfriend to play.
I'm hoping qutting Facebook and Messenger cold turkey will help my psyche in that I won't be repeatedly checking them hoping for validation only to be almost always disappointed.
I know this isn't HA but are you already on REPAYE or something
Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
I think most people deal with loneliness to some extent or another, throughout life. That's why it's known as part of the human condition. It's just part of the way adult life is, people tend to segregate themselves within familiar circles, which once they get past youth, or like post college, is the families they build and maybe a few friends. So they have less room for new people. Some people are good at building networks of friendly acquaintances, and if they're particularly social people they can rely on that to stave it off a little, but many if not most people deal with loneliness to varying degrees. I feel lonely from time to time, even though I have at least a half dozen friends I talk to or see every so often. Loneliness is something I think many people sort of get used to, to an extent. Something you can feel pretty intensely at times, but you learn over the years that it's a feeling that comes and goes. I think an important part of it becoming like that, a feeling that you can deal with in that way, is to learn to appreciate your own company, even love yourself. When I read what you've been saying in this thread, I get the impression that you may find it difficult to think of yourself in a positive light, at least in some regards. I went through a period of intense isolation in my twenties, and it wasn't until I was able to see myself with the love and respect that I'm willing to give and expect from others that I really felt that being alone was something I was able to cope with in a way that was more at peace.
I feel that for me, it wasn't so much 'trying to change my situation' in regards to loneliness that brought me to a less solitary place, it was just trying to work on the things I wanted from life outside of companionship, like I'm an writer and artist, a counsellor and other things, and it was more by focusing on those things and what they were to me, and how they allowed me to be engaged with other people, that allowed me to see companionship from a less urgent perspective. It gave me room to grow confidence and with that confidence, even when I feel lonely, I also feel that there are a lot of years in my life ahead and a lot of people out there, so there's always opportunities to meet new people.