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[Black Panther] The revolution will be live

Harry DresdenHarry Dresden Registered User regular
edited February 2018 in Debate and/or Discourse


It finally happened, Black Panther hit the silver screen.

Crushing the box office already, I will not be surprised if this breaks a billion.

http://money.cnn.com/2018/02/14/media/black-panther-opening-weekend-projections/index.html
Industry analysts are projecting that the film could bring in about $145 million domestically in its opening weekend, which starts Thursday. "Black Panther" could rake in more than $160 million during the four day President's Day weekend, analysts say.
Disney anticipates an opening in the $150 million range for the four day holiday weekend.

"Black Panther" could easily become the biggest February opening in history, toppling "Deadpool," the R-rated superhero film from 20th Century Fox that brought in $132 million when it opened in 2016.("Deadpool" also holds the four day President's Day opening record at $152 million).

"Black Panther's" three day projections would also put it in the top openings for a Marvel Studios film and in the top ten opening for the superhero genre overall.

Batman? He's old news - Hollywood is T'Challa's playground now.

Harry Dresden on
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Posts

  • Jam WarriorJam Warrior Registered User regular
    Well deserved. An excellent and super stylish film.

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  • EddyEddy Gengar the Bittersweet Registered User regular
    edited February 2018
    In the SE++ thread there was some discussion on the political messaging in/of the movie. I think the themes of the movie are striking and I found Killmonger deeply sympathetic. Here's an edited x-post of what I've been thinking about:
    There have been some comparisons to a MLK / Malcolm X dialectic in this movie, but I think it's actually straight-up more just isolationist/separatist strains of thought and more retributive/militant strains of thought, all of which can be found in the history of the Nation of Islam as well as Malcolm X. I think that this core of intra-black philosophical conflict is, well, incredibly pertinent right now and a good thing to feature prominently. It could be seen as disappointing, then, what the movie then synthesizes as a lesson, because I think what comes out of this dialectic is MLK-lite: T'Challa concludes that isolationism is merely another name for acceptance of worldwide injustice, but that violence cannot be the answer due to the cyclical nature of hatred and the hypocritical injustice inherently created in violent revolutions (he tells Killmonger something like "then we'll be just as bad as them" during the ending fight scene). It might be seen as a bit of a cop-out to politically correct (read: acceptable to whites) messaging, the same cop-out of 'non-violent resistance' that got young Malcolm X incensed.

    However: although peaceful outreach does feel like an imperfect solution, I don't think there really is any better general philosophical solution given the complexities of the African diaspora and the history of injustice, because we cannot erase those things, and I consider it self-evident that violent retribution is truly hypocritical, even if viscerally desired. The next-best solution, especially given Wakanda's considerable power, may be the inculcation of Black Excellence and empowerment through cultural outreach of the most technologically advanced and wealthy nation in the world. That outreach - of knowing what blacks have achieved and can achieve, free from colonialism and exploitation - cannot be taken lightly, both symbolically and logistically. MLK's racial message in our world can seem at times like an ineffectual cop-out, just another way for white people to keep non-whites beneath them in an unspoken hierarchy, but in The Avengers Universe, with Wakanda behind it, it really feels like it could effect real change.

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  • BogartBogart Because I hate you Registered User, Moderator mod
    I repeat my stated opinion that this was very good indeed and Okoye is the best.

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  • EddyEddy Gengar the Bittersweet Registered User regular
    edited February 2018
    Also that one scene near the end
    "Bury me in the ocean with my ancestors, who jumped from ships because they knew death was better than bondage."

    The tears they came and the fire in my heart was briefly extinguished

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  • Dark Raven XDark Raven X Laugh hard, run fast, be kindRegistered User regular
    M'baku was surprising great
    probably one of the more heavily abstracted adaptations of these characters, took me a minute to realise he's Man Ape, but it worked real well IMO. Did an excellent job contrasting the Jabari tribe with the rest of Wakanda, and his throne room was fucking cooooool

    Plus he has some excellent comic relief moments.

    Also add one more dollop of tension to Infinity War cause
    now I'm suddenly attached to a whole huge supporting cast of cool guys who're gonna be front and centre of a massive battle there. No way they're all surviving that. D:

    Was pretty cruel to release these back to back. Here's Wakanda! Cool! Now here's Wakanda on fire! Great.

    Oh brilliant
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  • HappylilElfHappylilElf Registered User regular
    Loved this movie. I think. Gonna have to see it a few more times in theaters just to be sure.

    Yeah... that's the reason...
    >.>
    <.<
    >.>

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  • KyouguKyougu Registered User regular
    I'm not familiar with Black Panther's rogues, so I was thinking of who would be a good antagonist for the sequel.

    And I think the clear choice is Namor. It would make for a super interesting movie that wouldn't just devolve into who can punch better.

  • BogartBogart Because I hate you Registered User, Moderator mod
    edited February 2018
    I'm not sure Atlantis is going to work in the MCU. I mean, I dunno, but it feels too goofy.

    Bogart on
  • KyouguKyougu Registered User regular
    I probably would have said the same thing about Wakanda though.

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  • SpawnbrokerSpawnbroker Registered User regular
    Man, this movie was great. Just great.

    I can't think of any real flaws. Letitia Wright and Danai Gurira were the standouts for me, I loved every minute they were on screen.

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  • The Raging PlatypusThe Raging Platypus Registered User regular
    Where does this movie rank in the Marvel pantheon? Based on the comments it already seems like top 5 material.

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  • SpawnbrokerSpawnbroker Registered User regular
    I'll have to think about it some more, but it definitely feels like top 5 in the MCU for me. Everything about the movie works, especially the villain and the supporting cast. The costumes and set design were amazing. The sound design was excellent.

    The movie feels very poignant right now, and it's really neat that it was black people arguing about black things in black spaces and telling the white characters to shut up for once.

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  • Harry DresdenHarry Dresden Registered User regular
    Where does this movie rank in the Marvel pantheon? Based on the comments it already seems like top 5 material.

    Highly, below Winter Soldier maybe equal to Spider-man: Homecoming.

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  • BogartBogart Because I hate you Registered User, Moderator mod
    edited February 2018
    I think it was very good. I dunno how it compares to the best of the other Marvel movies, and I suspect I won't really have a clear idea until I've seen all the ones since Civil War at least once more.

    But sure, top five sounds about right.

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  • NinjeffNinjeff Registered User regular
    I really enjoyed Black Panther. I'd give it an 8/10 solid.

    Spoiler why:
    I give the story line/actors/costume and set design (holy shit so good) an absolute 9 of 10. It was easily one of the best Marvel movies in that regard. However, i found the action generic and kind of "light". I'd give it a 7 or 10 in that category. So, Average em out to an 8/10. On the action note, i blame the Russo's probably as much as Coogler. The Russo's do such a great job of giving the action weight and feeling like hits are hitting and that each movement exists in the physical world. My impression of Black Panther in Civil War was that he was far more of a powerful attacker that was light on his feet....like a Panther. In this movie it just felt like it wasnt quite existing teh the physical realm. Hard to explain but it just felt too.....uhg whats the word.......computer generated.
    That being said, christ almighty did the costume design and set design make up for that. I wanted to pause the movie in a number of spots and just.....look at stuff.

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  • jungleroomxjungleroomx Spicy Rudolph Registered User regular
  • KyouguKyougu Registered User regular
    edited February 2018
    I think it's the best one, just edging Winter Soldier for me.

    The movie mixes popcorn, blockbuster sensibilities while actually having something to say about many relevant issues and on top of that having a fully realized world, fantastic characters, and great visual and sound design.

    The biggest knock is some really sub par cg and green screen use.

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  • NinjeffNinjeff Registered User regular
    I think we'll have to start separating MCU movies into Origin stories (first single character movies) and "Universe" movies (sequels, team ups, universe story building)

    For "Origin" Stories i'd say this is right up there.

    1. Iron Man (started the whole thing so gets to be #1 by default)
    2. Black Panther/Captain America First Avenger
    3. Gaurdians
    4. Spider Man Homecoming
    5. Ant Man
    6. Thor

  • BizazedoBizazedo Registered User regular
    It was pretty good, I think I am finding I liked it a lot.

    T'Challa himself was the least interesting character in the movie, which is a shame, but also points out how awesome the supporting cast / villains were.

    Klaw and Killmonger were both great. The only thing that holds Killmonger back for me is him disappearing from the movie for a bit, but still, great villains.

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  • SpawnbrokerSpawnbroker Registered User regular
    edited February 2018
    Spoiler tagging just in case, villain talk
    I'm kind of sad they killed both of them off because I liked both of them as characters and want to see more of them. Oh well, I'm sure Black Panther has some other interesting people in his rogues' gallery, but I don't know much about the comics.

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  • SadgasmSadgasm Deluded doodler A cold placeRegistered User regular
    Kyougu wrote: »
    I'm not familiar with Black Panther's rogues, so I was thinking of who would be a good antagonist for the sequel.

    And I think the clear choice is Namor. It would make for a super interesting movie that wouldn't just devolve into who can punch better.

    Black Panther doesnt really HAVE that many villains of his own, most of them appeared in this movie. His stories tend to be more about international intrigue than traditional superhero brawling. Not to say there isnt any, it's just not the focus the way it usually is.

  • KyouguKyougu Registered User regular
    Spoiler tagging just in case, villain talk
    I'm kind of sad they killed both of them off because I liked both of them as characters and want to see more of them. Oh well, I'm sure Black Panther has some other interesting people in his rogues' gallery, but I don't know much about the comics.

    Agree though
    "bury me in the ocean because I rather die free than in bindings" was such a fantastic line and made it worth it to me.

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  • EddyEddy Gengar the Bittersweet Registered User regular
    edited February 2018
    Killmonger
    I kind of wish he stayed alive for the whole Loki semi-redemptive will-he-or-won't-he thing, but his character and thematic arcs were so well done in this one that in some ways Killmonger kind of needed to be a one-movie villain, he just burns so bright and is so magnetic that it seems like there's almost a risk of diluting or cheapening him, making him stale like any number of other secondary/tertiary characters who've already worked through their arcs

    Wow that whole Malcolm X comparison got a little too macabre

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  • SpawnbrokerSpawnbroker Registered User regular
    Anyone else feel like the guy who was playing M'Baku was channelling Tom Hardy there for a bit?

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  • EddyEddy Gengar the Bittersweet Registered User regular
    Anyone else feel like the guy who was playing M'Baku was channelling Tom Hardy there for a bit?

    I got a little Alfie Solomons vibe from him later on. I think that fifth tribe was perhaps a little neglected but you can't fit everything into an origin movie

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  • NinjeffNinjeff Registered User regular
    I'm interested to see what Wakanda has been up to since this movies events. In Infinity War.

    I wonder what the "time gap" is -in universe- between the two movies.

  • Dr. ChaosDr. Chaos Post nuclear nuisance Registered User regular
    A day later and I still can't take my headphones off and stop listening to All The Stars from the soundtrack.

    Send help.

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  • FroThulhuFroThulhu Registered User regular
    The time gap takes us from
    Two weeks after Civil War (stated on the news at the beginning of the movie) to probably when Infinity War actually releases in theaters IRL. Meaning a coupleish years.

    As an aside, and I'm sorry if I'm being a dick here, but I'm not sure how comfortable I am with the Malcolm X comparisons. I think we as a society have, for a very long time, had some pretty inaccurate ideas of Malcom as a person and his actual place in the movement.

    While Magneto is a much more apt comparison, vis a vis his contrast with Xavier, Erik Lensherr is also not really a good representation of Malcolm X.

    Really, when we compare Magneto or Erik Killmonger to Malcolm, what we're thinking of is the mostly-lies picture of the man shown to us by white American press and politics. Remember, MLK was actively painted as a threat and a dissident until he was shown to be physically harmless. The press could not find a way to not use X as a Boogeyman when his ethos was 'By Any Means Necessary.'

    Ironically, this is the same stigma that the Black Panthers were saddled with- Black people who had the nerve to not just let you beat and murder them were obviously terrorists proactively seeking to murder and steal from white folks.

    These were lies.

    These lies are largely founded on the fear that, after getting fucked for a few hundred years, Black folks (men especially) were someday going to turn around and bend whitey over the same trash can.

    This is Erik Killmonger. A Black man with the power and the intent to do to white society (Colonizers as the movie puts it) what it's done to us. It's the power that makes him scary, but it's the intent that makes him a villain. Versus T'challa in the end- so much power, but with the intent to heal everyone.

    Because T'challa's last act in the movie isn't him patrolling the streets of Oakland or telling the world the Black Panther is there to save them by punching and looking tough. The Black Panther is there to lead Wakanda as an example to the world that the whole world can be better.

    .

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  • Dr. ChaosDr. Chaos Post nuclear nuisance Registered User regular
    Was so disappointed Shuri didn't ask for
    the herb and then having everybody laughing at her, not knowing this badass is coming down the line after Boseman retires:

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  • SpawnbrokerSpawnbroker Registered User regular
    I want Shuri and Tony Stark and Bruce Banner to end up in the same room at some point during Infinity War

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  • see317see317 Registered User regular
    I want Shuri and Tony Stark and Bruce Banner to end up in the same room at some point during Infinity War

    Can Rocket be there too?

    Ringo wrote: »
    Well except what see317 said. That guy's always wrong.
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  • a nu starta nu start Registered User regular
    Leave it up Japan to come up with a Black Panther dance.

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  • lunchbox12682lunchbox12682 MinnesotaRegistered User regular
    see317 wrote: »
    I want Shuri and Tony Stark and Bruce Banner to end up in the same room at some point during Infinity War

    Can Rocket be there too?
    Only if they are arguing about being the smartest person on the planet and then he joins in.
    "Aww, the little primates and their baby toys. I have a 3D printing repair gun and I make god destroying bombs with the crap in my toolbox."

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  • FroThulhuFroThulhu Registered User regular
    It would appear that Wakanda has at least one of those two technologies.

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    "I'm arresting you for failing to check yourself. You have the right to wreck yourself."
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  • see317see317 Registered User regular
    edited February 2018
    see317 wrote: »
    I want Shuri and Tony Stark and Bruce Banner to end up in the same room at some point during Infinity War

    Can Rocket be there too?
    Only if they are arguing about being the smartest person on the planet and then he joins in.
    "Aww, the little primates and their baby toys. I have a 3D printing repair gun and I make god destroying bombs with the crap in my toolbox."

    I like to picture Rocket sitting in the back quietly giggling to himself while building something.
    The other three are arguing about being the smartest and whose plans and designs they should use to best make the anti-Thanos vibranium weapon (It should be a spear!, It should be a suit!, Guys, you're making me nervous..you won't like me when I'm nervous. But the green guy could maybe use some vibranium knuckles...) and the conversation continues getting more heated with Rocket just getting more and more involved in whatever he's building.
    Eventually one of the humans says "Should we check on what the rat is doing?"
    Then Rocket pulls out the biggest gun we've seen, studded with arc reactors, each pulsing with vibranium light and the thing hums with subsonic power. "Yeah, I think this'll do the job."

    see317 on
    Ringo wrote: »
    Well except what see317 said. That guy's always wrong.
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  • TastyfishTastyfish Registered User regular
    edited February 2018
    Posted in the MCU thread but thought I could go into more detail here, Black Panther for me was alright, pretty solidly alright as a film. Acting was very good, costumes and set design were excellent as people have said - but some of the writing let it down for me.

    Overall plot is solid, but after the first half there seemed to be a lot of points where characters are doing things more because the plot needs them to for the finale than because it makes sense at the time, along with a bunch of call backs to things that happened earlier but were glossed over as not a problem a few minutes earlier.
    I'd completely forgotten that Okeye and W'kabi were married/a couple until the last moment, that your wife is telling you that the guy in the field is still the king whilst being the head of the king's bodyguard seems like it deserved a bit more of a moment. Plus isn't he arguing against involvement in the outside world at the beginning, and is now happy to kill his long time friend because some outsider killed the guy who got his dad? Honestly I didn't like the whole battle at all - think something more close up in and around the palace would have let individuals still show their stuff but without it being a random fight between two small armies - show that things are properly split between doing something, making sure you do the right thing at the cost of not doing things you should have and staying out of everything with there being no easy answer.

    Cheapened the ending a bit - sure Wakanda is a peaceful nation that only fights to defend itself, though we did just suddenly have the army turn on the secret service in hand to hand combat just yesterday because the new head of state wanted to conquer the world. If it had been more something being done by a small group loyal to the new king, knowing that the blowback would force Wakanda to get involved - then fair enough. But if the army/quarter of the tribes as a whole group just decides they're cool with this plan, then you just look naive saying that you can show people the way.

    So much seemed in service of that last battle bit, the M'Baku turning up and then just going away, Shuri seemingly forgetting she designed the suits in the very building they're fighting over, T'challa forgetting to mention that the reason he doesn't have Claue is that Killmonger took him and then later on that he partly agrees with him that he's changed his mind about Wakanda opening up to the world. The rest of the film seemed very tight, which I think is why all the odd things happening during the battle in a green field made things stand out all the more.

    Tastyfish on
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  • milskimilski Their Will comes, at last, to Earth, to the Neath, as a storm crosses the sea. Registered User regular
    Can I point out that the imagery of
    those loyal to killmonger using fucking riot shields was absolutely amazing, 10/10?

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  • BobbleBobble Registered User regular
    Welp, that was fucking rad. This movie just drips with style.

    Biggest disappointment was the lack of an Infinity War trailer in front of it at my theater. That's all I've got.

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  • Moridin889Moridin889 Registered User regular
    I'm in line now

    The movie doesn't start for 30 minutes.

    I think its going to do well

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  • ArbitraryDescriptorArbitraryDescriptor Registered User regular
    edited February 2018
    Bobble wrote: »
    Welp, that was fucking rad. This movie just drips with style.

    Biggest disappointment was the lack of an Infinity War trailer in front of it at my theater. That's all I've got.

    I felt that, but then reconsidered as it seems weird to show a trailer for what is essentially the sequel to the film you're about to see.

    Thus my one gripe was that
    He clearly only threw three EMP magnets and there were more than three stuck to the convoy vehicles.

    Get your shit together Marvel, god.

    Seriously, I loved the shit out this thing.

    ArbitraryDescriptor on
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