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[Destiny 2] D2 Year 2 Reveal Stream Today - Tidal Wave of New Info! Come Get Hyped!

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  • Zombie GandhiZombie Gandhi Registered User regular
    Vagabond wrote: »
    Here's what I think people aren't understanding about the frustration Obi and I are expressing regarding this power level thing. Every time in the past (EVERY TIME) our group has been able to meet or be very close to meeting the power level recommendation for the raids on the day they have released. We achieved this through a good deal of planning and smart grinding. We did the same thing this time and we're FAR off. So yeah, while *you* may have not been ready for weeks for past raids, *we* have been. They turned this one from a "Top 10% get to finish this when it launches" to a Top 1%. So those of us who did put it a reasonable amount of time to get ready for the raid but didn't take time off work to no-life it are in the same boat as people who didn't play more than a few hours, who may not have even finished the Warmind story, who weren't efficiently using their Milestones. And it just feels bad. And unnecessary.

    I'm sympathetic to that. I've tried to be in that position before, grinding the hell out of the first few days in order to be Raid viable. In my experience, we never succeeded. I've never been in a group that cleared a whole raid fully blind in the first week. And while I somewhat enjoyed the drive to hit recommended level, even with smart usage of Powerful rewards or exotic timing, it never was enough. And that became a source of stress. Hell, it's the reason I gave up on finding a fully blind group for Leviathan, since I missed the first two days of Destiny 2, and knew it'd be impossible to hit that point.

    And I get how having something that drove your gameplay, that drove your excitement, feel like it was taken away can suck. But I'm not sure it fully has? Unless the sense of accomplishment came more from doing it Week 1 than from doing it Blind?

    You guys have a rock solid group that is reliable and the envy of folks like myself. If the concern is beat it week one as a source of pride and accomplishment, yes, you're probably screwed - like you said it's now for the uber tier not just the high tier.

    But if it's about staying blind, I'd expect your crew would be able to do that? Not seek out guides or spoilers? Traditionally this thread had been good on spoiler-free impressions at least for a few weeks.

    Ultimately like I said, this could suck, it could be a bad decision, but I like that it's different, and at least for me, diminishes stress. But I say that acknowledging that my fireteam of real-life friends gave up on Destiny, and I don't have a blind crew, so I've also taken that stress out of the picture. If I'm going to go in my first run without it being blind, then the delay isn't killer, and I can meander my way to 370 or whatever over the course of a few weeks.

    For real though, I get that this is a change, I just wonder how much of the pain point is because of feeling like you can't do what you always do (win week 1), versus you can still do what you always do, just in a different way (go blind for first playthrough).

  • HardtargetHardtarget There Are Four Lights VancouverRegistered User regular
    I don't get why you guys fucking care, it's insane bungie did this. If people want to hoard all their engrams and max shit out 1 minute after the expansion comes out before playing any new content WHO CARES! it doesn't effect you if they want to "ruin" the game for themselves.

    Why bungie should be catering to a small vocal minority is beyond me. all these power level changes and gear drop changes suck ass

    (also it's not a MMO, if people want to play for 2 weeks and then stop and wait for the next expansion and start playing again for another 2 weeks that's fine and is no mark on the game!)

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  • VagabondVagabond Sans Gravitas Registered User regular
    Vagabond wrote: »
    Here's what I think people aren't understanding about the frustration Obi and I are expressing regarding this power level thing. Every time in the past (EVERY TIME) our group has been able to meet or be very close to meeting the power level recommendation for the raids on the day they have released. We achieved this through a good deal of planning and smart grinding. We did the same thing this time and we're FAR off. So yeah, while *you* may have not been ready for weeks for past raids, *we* have been. They turned this one from a "Top 10% get to finish this when it launches" to a Top 1%. So those of us who did put it a reasonable amount of time to get ready for the raid but didn't take time off work to no-life it are in the same boat as people who didn't play more than a few hours, who may not have even finished the Warmind story, who weren't efficiently using their Milestones. And it just feels bad. And unnecessary.

    I'm sympathetic to that. I've tried to be in that position before, grinding the hell out of the first few days in order to be Raid viable. In my experience, we never succeeded. I've never been in a group that cleared a whole raid fully blind in the first week. And while I somewhat enjoyed the drive to hit recommended level, even with smart usage of Powerful rewards or exotic timing, it never was enough. And that became a source of stress. Hell, it's the reason I gave up on finding a fully blind group for Leviathan, since I missed the first two days of Destiny 2, and knew it'd be impossible to hit that point.

    And I get how having something that drove your gameplay, that drove your excitement, feel like it was taken away can suck. But I'm not sure it fully has? Unless the sense of accomplishment came more from doing it Week 1 than from doing it Blind?

    You guys have a rock solid group that is reliable and the envy of folks like myself. If the concern is beat it week one as a source of pride and accomplishment, yes, you're probably screwed - like you said it's now for the uber tier not just the high tier.

    But if it's about staying blind, I'd expect your crew would be able to do that? Not seek out guides or spoilers? Traditionally this thread had been good on spoiler-free impressions at least for a few weeks.

    Ultimately like I said, this could suck, it could be a bad decision, but I like that it's different, and at least for me, diminishes stress. But I say that acknowledging that my fireteam of real-life friends gave up on Destiny, and I don't have a blind crew, so I've also taken that stress out of the picture. If I'm going to go in my first run without it being blind, then the delay isn't killer, and I can meander my way to 370 or whatever over the course of a few weeks.

    For real though, I get that this is a change, I just wonder how much of the pain point is because of feeling like you can't do what you always do (win week 1), versus you can still do what you always do, just in a different way (go blind for first playthrough).

    It's a combination of both. We like doing it blind because it's super fun that way. We like finishing in week 1 because of a sense of pride and accomplishment.

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  • SniperGuySniperGuy Also known as Dohaeris Registered User regular
    Vagabond wrote: »
    Not gonna lie, I'd kind of enjoy it if the clear rate in week 1 is 0% even among poopsock pro hard tier players.

    What's the point of releasing it then? This is goosery.

    Take a look, complete part of it, get some gear, devise strategies, etc.

    MMOs like WoW have been doing this stuff for ages. WoW had raids that took people months to beat. Destiny taking more than one week after the thing comes out doesn't seem unreasonable to me. I like that destiny is giving me a reason to keep coming back and keep playing. When Destiny 2 launched I beat the leviathan raid and said "Okay, now why would I ever do that again?" and that's a problem! I want to have long term goals and things I can continuously work towards. Gearing up to do higher level content is one satisfying way to progress.

    Sure, people can play through the story content, see the raid, be done until the next expansion, but I don't think that's really a good long term goal for a game like this. It isn't an MMO, but it's about as close as you can get without having world servers. You want players to be on constantly and engaging with your systems.

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  • VagabondVagabond Sans Gravitas Registered User regular
    SniperGuy wrote: »
    Vagabond wrote: »
    Not gonna lie, I'd kind of enjoy it if the clear rate in week 1 is 0% even among poopsock pro hard tier players.

    What's the point of releasing it then? This is goosery.

    Take a look, complete part of it, get some gear, devise strategies, etc.

    MMOs like WoW have been doing this stuff for ages. WoW had raids that took people months to beat. Destiny taking more than one week after the thing comes out doesn't seem unreasonable to me. I like that destiny is giving me a reason to keep coming back and keep playing. When Destiny 2 launched I beat the leviathan raid and said "Okay, now why would I ever do that again?" and that's a problem! I want to have long term goals and things I can continuously work towards. Gearing up to do higher level content is one satisfying way to progress.

    Sure, people can play through the story content, see the raid, be done until the next expansion, but I don't think that's really a good long term goal for a game like this. It isn't an MMO, but it's about as close as you can get without having world servers. You want players to be on constantly and engaging with your systems.

    I think it IS unreasonable to now, after 4 years, decide that the Raids (always lauded as the very best part of Destiny) should work more like WoW.

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  • HardtargetHardtarget There Are Four Lights VancouverRegistered User regular
    edited May 2018
    SniperGuy wrote: »
    It isn't an MMO, but it's about as close as you can get without having world servers. You want players to be on constantly and engaging with your systems.
    no, no it's really not. Aside from the fact that there is no monthly fee there's also no new content every month.

    also aside from terms like "raid" it has nothing in common with WoW at all. My colleague at work is a huge WoW guy, has played it in his same guild on PC for YEARS. They were so psyched about Destiny 2 hitting pc, they all bough it. 1 week later they were done and have never touched it again and he is super disappointed with it. He doesn't get how there was no in game chat and now no clan chat, he completely can't see why people feel like it's a MMO as it's plainly not.

    Destiny 1 and Destiny 2 are fun shooter games you play for a month and then put down for 4 months until there is new content to play, then you repeat. You certainly don't have to play it that way but that is how it was designed to be played.

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  • squall99xsquall99x Registered User regular
    Hardtarget wrote: »
    I don't get why you guys fucking care, it's insane bungie did this. If people want to hoard all their engrams and max shit out 1 minute after the expansion comes out before playing any new content WHO CARES! it doesn't effect you if they want to "ruin" the game for themselves.

    Why bungie should be catering to a small vocal minority is beyond me. all these power level changes and gear drop changes suck ass

    (also it's not a MMO, if people want to play for 2 weeks and then stop and wait for the next expansion and start playing again for another 2 weeks that's fine and is no mark on the game!)

    It isn't a MMO but the mmo lite aspects of it are what keep a lot of people playing for a longer period of time. Which keeps the game healthy for the vast majority of players who do not play only solo. I would argue also that the cutting of the mmo like qualities are one thing that helped D2 bleed players so fast.

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  • DodgeBlanDodgeBlan PSN: dodgeblanRegistered User regular
    Destiny 1 and Destiny 2 are fun shooter games you play for a month and then put down for 4 months until there is new content to play, then you repeat.

    Well this is what Luke smith wanted the game to be until the community had a shit fit, so now it’s not that any more

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  • AuburnTigerAuburnTiger Registered User regular
    D2 has this weird divide between fans who want the Luke Smith version and fans who want the no life version. And honestly a lot of fans probably just fall somewhere in the middle.

    If I had to summarize what I want out of destiny, it would be this. When I'm in the mood to play hardcore, I want lots of things to chase and keep me occupied. But I definitely don't want a job of it and to feel like I have to play every week.

    D1 seemed to accomplish this better than D2 does.

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  • Zombie GandhiZombie Gandhi Registered User regular
    Hardtarget wrote: »
    I don't get why you guys fucking care, it's insane bungie did this. If people want to hoard all their engrams and max shit out 1 minute after the expansion comes out before playing any new content WHO CARES! it doesn't effect you if they want to "ruin" the game for themselves.

    Why bungie should be catering to a small vocal minority is beyond me. all these power level changes and gear drop changes suck ass

    (also it's not a MMO, if people want to play for 2 weeks and then stop and wait for the next expansion and start playing again for another 2 weeks that's fine and is no mark on the game!)

    It unfortunately does affect us (as evidenced by how this swing so significantly seems to have fucked your personal experience). In a persistent online game like this, no audience segment is immune to the targeting of the other audience segments.

    The hardcore/streamers/pro players have a community audience. That community audience listens to them, and echo chambers the hell out of their complaints. And when Bungie looks at what players are saying, they see those complaints, and the headlines/news stories on gaming sites (tangent - Forbes fucking talks about gaming as well, what the hell) are about how "players are unhappy."

    Which players?
    The loudest players.

    The playerbase isn't a monolith, as evidenced in this thread. But signal amplification is a hell of a lot easier when you have twitch subs or youtube follows that Bungie can believe translates into less people playing, less CCU, less sales.

    Did they pivot to hard to please that audience? Probably? But since they literally cannot develop enough content to drip feed the player base (actual mission/strike/adventure content takes a hell of a lot of manpower on a game this size/fidelity), they can help inflate playtime by slowing the progression curve, since their gameplay loop feels so good as is.

    Whether or not you are a player who cares about that comes down to personal preference. I'm big into grind games at this point in my life, so I enjoy that I won't have hit 375 or whatever on the third day of release, or potentially the third week of release. But it can also suck for folks like you, who feel like you can't even play through the story because of weird difficulty gating (they really could have smoothed out at least campaign content).

    But since you literally cannot please everyone as a developer, and they see prominent voices upset, trying to please those prominent voices and the audience who agrees with them (when it seemed like initial D2 was anything but targeting those voices), may be what they think they need to do in order to survive to Taken Queen / D3.

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  • squall99xsquall99x Registered User regular
    edited May 2018
    Hardtarget wrote: »
    SniperGuy wrote: »
    It isn't an MMO, but it's about as close as you can get without having world servers. You want players to be on constantly and engaging with your systems.
    no, no it's really not. Aside from the fact that there is no monthly fee there's also no new content every month.

    also aside from terms like "raid" it has nothing in common with WoW at all. My colleague at work is a huge WoW guy, has played it in his same guild on PC for YEARS. They were so psyched about Destiny 2 hitting pc, they all bough it. 1 week later they were done and have never touched it again and he is super disappointed with it. He doesn't get how there was no in game chat and now no clan chat, he completely can't see why people feel like it's a MMO as it's plainly not.

    Destiny 1 and Destiny 2 are fun shooter games you play for a month and then put down for 4 months until there is new content to play, then you repeat. You certainly don't have to play it that way but that is how it was designed to be played.

    I'll give you that as being true for how D2 was released. I have to say that it was categorically untrue for how the vast, vast majority of people
    I knew and played with wanted to engage with and play the original Destiny.

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  • SniperGuySniperGuy Also known as Dohaeris Registered User regular
    Hardtarget wrote: »
    SniperGuy wrote: »
    It isn't an MMO, but it's about as close as you can get without having world servers. You want players to be on constantly and engaging with your systems.
    no, no it's really not. Aside from the fact that there is no monthly fee there's also no new content every month.
    Right, but there should be, to keep players on and engaging in the systems.
    also aside from terms like "raid" it has nothing in common with WoW at all. My colleague at work is a huge WoW guy, has played it in his same guild on PC for YEARS. They were so psyched about Destiny 2 hitting pc, they all bough it. 1 week later they were done and have never touched it again and he is super disappointed with it. He doesn't get how there was no in game chat and now no clan chat, he completely can't see why people feel like it's a MMO as it's plainly not.
    Social spaces, persistent character, levelling up, raids, dungeons (strikes), pvp areas, etc. It has a shitload in common with an MMO but is missing some key features like chat, yes.
    Destiny 1 and Destiny 2 are fun shooter games you play for a month and then put down for 4 months until there is new content to play, then you repeat. You certainly don't have to play it that way but that is how it was designed to be played.
    I don't think their design goal is to have everyone play it for a bit and then leave, but I don't think they're doing a great job at keeping people around long term. I want them to shift the game more towards that, give me a reason to keep logging on and playing this fun game. One of the key complaints when the game came out was that people played through it and then had nothing else to work towards. Giving us more goals to work towards seems great. I understand people are miffed they changed something that typically hasn't worked that way, but the change seems more in line with other similar games.

    Also it's like a week or two of difference, it isn't a huge deal.

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  • HardtargetHardtarget There Are Four Lights VancouverRegistered User regular
    DodgeBlan wrote: »
    Destiny 1 and Destiny 2 are fun shooter games you play for a month and then put down for 4 months until there is new content to play, then you repeat.

    Well this is what Luke smith wanted the game to be until the community had a shit fit, so now it’s not that any more

    well that's what I fucking want since that's what destiny 1 was and what destiny 2 literally was sold as.


    ugh

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  • SniperGuySniperGuy Also known as Dohaeris Registered User regular
    Hardtarget wrote: »
    DodgeBlan wrote: »
    Destiny 1 and Destiny 2 are fun shooter games you play for a month and then put down for 4 months until there is new content to play, then you repeat.

    Well this is what Luke smith wanted the game to be until the community had a shit fit, so now it’s not that any more

    well that's what I fucking want since that's what destiny 1 was and what destiny 2 literally was sold as.


    ugh

    But wasn't most of the negative feedback for destiny 2 because it was sold as that? People want to be able to play this fun game for longer. When there's no goals to shoot for anymore, it makes it a lot harder to play the fun shooty game. I'm surprised people are clamoring for the thing the community seemed to cry out against at launch.

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  • Zombie GandhiZombie Gandhi Registered User regular
    Vagabond wrote: »
    Vagabond wrote: »
    Here's what I think people aren't understanding about the frustration Obi and I are expressing regarding this power level thing. Every time in the past (EVERY TIME) our group has been able to meet or be very close to meeting the power level recommendation for the raids on the day they have released. We achieved this through a good deal of planning and smart grinding. We did the same thing this time and we're FAR off. So yeah, while *you* may have not been ready for weeks for past raids, *we* have been. They turned this one from a "Top 10% get to finish this when it launches" to a Top 1%. So those of us who did put it a reasonable amount of time to get ready for the raid but didn't take time off work to no-life it are in the same boat as people who didn't play more than a few hours, who may not have even finished the Warmind story, who weren't efficiently using their Milestones. And it just feels bad. And unnecessary.

    I'm sympathetic to that. I've tried to be in that position before, grinding the hell out of the first few days in order to be Raid viable. In my experience, we never succeeded. I've never been in a group that cleared a whole raid fully blind in the first week. And while I somewhat enjoyed the drive to hit recommended level, even with smart usage of Powerful rewards or exotic timing, it never was enough. And that became a source of stress. Hell, it's the reason I gave up on finding a fully blind group for Leviathan, since I missed the first two days of Destiny 2, and knew it'd be impossible to hit that point.

    And I get how having something that drove your gameplay, that drove your excitement, feel like it was taken away can suck. But I'm not sure it fully has? Unless the sense of accomplishment came more from doing it Week 1 than from doing it Blind?

    You guys have a rock solid group that is reliable and the envy of folks like myself. If the concern is beat it week one as a source of pride and accomplishment, yes, you're probably screwed - like you said it's now for the uber tier not just the high tier.

    But if it's about staying blind, I'd expect your crew would be able to do that? Not seek out guides or spoilers? Traditionally this thread had been good on spoiler-free impressions at least for a few weeks.

    Ultimately like I said, this could suck, it could be a bad decision, but I like that it's different, and at least for me, diminishes stress. But I say that acknowledging that my fireteam of real-life friends gave up on Destiny, and I don't have a blind crew, so I've also taken that stress out of the picture. If I'm going to go in my first run without it being blind, then the delay isn't killer, and I can meander my way to 370 or whatever over the course of a few weeks.

    For real though, I get that this is a change, I just wonder how much of the pain point is because of feeling like you can't do what you always do (win week 1), versus you can still do what you always do, just in a different way (go blind for first playthrough).

    It's a combination of both. We like doing it blind because it's super fun that way. We like finishing in week 1 because of a sense of pride and accomplishment.

    I gotcha. And yeah, if that sense of accomplishment is so significant, you guys are somewhat screwed. Ain't no way around that, and I'm sorry it sucks for you all.
    So hopefully it's a pain that goes away quickly if the raid itself is a compelling experience.

    The fear that I'd have about a crew like yours is trying to go hard in week 1 anyway, getting dunked on by inflated level enemies, and putting a bad taste in your mouth about the quality of the raid that stays even after you hit target level. If the first impression you had of Leviathan was Prestige Baths, for instance, it'd be a fucking awful raid.


    So I'm hoping to get a group eventually at or near expected level so at least I'm fighting to master mechanics, not just dealing with bullshit bullet sponge annoyances. And so I can get the intended experience, even if it takes a bit to build towards.

    Vagabond
  • HardtargetHardtarget There Are Four Lights VancouverRegistered User regular
    SniperGuy wrote: »
    Hardtarget wrote: »
    SniperGuy wrote: »
    It isn't an MMO, but it's about as close as you can get without having world servers. You want players to be on constantly and engaging with your systems.
    no, no it's really not. Aside from the fact that there is no monthly fee there's also no new content every month.
    Right, but there should be, to keep players on and engaging in the systems.
    If they wanted to start charging a monthly fee they would need a lot more manpower which they aren't interested in doing. My tune would be differnet if this was a real MMO, if I bought it and went into it knowing that the progression would be a slow ass grind but there would ALWAYS be fresh content every month I'd be fine with it. But there isn't and the stuff they do do is just flailing. I enjoyed most aspects of Destiny 1 and really just wanted more of that which doesn't seem like that insane of a ask when I'm buying a sequel!

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  • AuburnTigerAuburnTiger Registered User regular
    Vagabond wrote: »
    Vagabond wrote: »
    Here's what I think people aren't understanding about the frustration Obi and I are expressing regarding this power level thing. Every time in the past (EVERY TIME) our group has been able to meet or be very close to meeting the power level recommendation for the raids on the day they have released. We achieved this through a good deal of planning and smart grinding. We did the same thing this time and we're FAR off. So yeah, while *you* may have not been ready for weeks for past raids, *we* have been. They turned this one from a "Top 10% get to finish this when it launches" to a Top 1%. So those of us who did put it a reasonable amount of time to get ready for the raid but didn't take time off work to no-life it are in the same boat as people who didn't play more than a few hours, who may not have even finished the Warmind story, who weren't efficiently using their Milestones. And it just feels bad. And unnecessary.

    I'm sympathetic to that. I've tried to be in that position before, grinding the hell out of the first few days in order to be Raid viable. In my experience, we never succeeded. I've never been in a group that cleared a whole raid fully blind in the first week. And while I somewhat enjoyed the drive to hit recommended level, even with smart usage of Powerful rewards or exotic timing, it never was enough. And that became a source of stress. Hell, it's the reason I gave up on finding a fully blind group for Leviathan, since I missed the first two days of Destiny 2, and knew it'd be impossible to hit that point.

    And I get how having something that drove your gameplay, that drove your excitement, feel like it was taken away can suck. But I'm not sure it fully has? Unless the sense of accomplishment came more from doing it Week 1 than from doing it Blind?

    You guys have a rock solid group that is reliable and the envy of folks like myself. If the concern is beat it week one as a source of pride and accomplishment, yes, you're probably screwed - like you said it's now for the uber tier not just the high tier.

    But if it's about staying blind, I'd expect your crew would be able to do that? Not seek out guides or spoilers? Traditionally this thread had been good on spoiler-free impressions at least for a few weeks.

    Ultimately like I said, this could suck, it could be a bad decision, but I like that it's different, and at least for me, diminishes stress. But I say that acknowledging that my fireteam of real-life friends gave up on Destiny, and I don't have a blind crew, so I've also taken that stress out of the picture. If I'm going to go in my first run without it being blind, then the delay isn't killer, and I can meander my way to 370 or whatever over the course of a few weeks.

    For real though, I get that this is a change, I just wonder how much of the pain point is because of feeling like you can't do what you always do (win week 1), versus you can still do what you always do, just in a different way (go blind for first playthrough).

    It's a combination of both. We like doing it blind because it's super fun that way. We like finishing in week 1 because of a sense of pride and accomplishment.

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  • HardtargetHardtarget There Are Four Lights VancouverRegistered User regular
    SniperGuy wrote: »
    Hardtarget wrote: »
    DodgeBlan wrote: »
    Destiny 1 and Destiny 2 are fun shooter games you play for a month and then put down for 4 months until there is new content to play, then you repeat.

    Well this is what Luke smith wanted the game to be until the community had a shit fit, so now it’s not that any more

    well that's what I fucking want since that's what destiny 1 was and what destiny 2 literally was sold as.


    ugh

    But wasn't most of the negative feedback for destiny 2 because it was sold as that? People want to be able to play this fun game for longer. When there's no goals to shoot for anymore, it makes it a lot harder to play the fun shooty game. I'm surprised people are clamoring for the thing the community seemed to cry out against at launch.

    that was certainly what the vocal minority echo chamber pro streamer audience was giving negative feedback about. Was that what the opinion at large was? I have no idea, but I'd say don't buy a game that is advertised as something you don't want?

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  • Local H JayLocal H Jay Registered User regular
    Welcome to the "not mad, just disappointed" D2 club

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  • HermanoHermano Registered User regular
    Need one more for first Raid Lair if anyone wants some loot drops?


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  • SniperGuySniperGuy Also known as Dohaeris Registered User regular
    Hardtarget wrote: »
    SniperGuy wrote: »
    Hardtarget wrote: »
    DodgeBlan wrote: »
    Destiny 1 and Destiny 2 are fun shooter games you play for a month and then put down for 4 months until there is new content to play, then you repeat.

    Well this is what Luke smith wanted the game to be until the community had a shit fit, so now it’s not that any more

    well that's what I fucking want since that's what destiny 1 was and what destiny 2 literally was sold as.


    ugh

    But wasn't most of the negative feedback for destiny 2 because it was sold as that? People want to be able to play this fun game for longer. When there's no goals to shoot for anymore, it makes it a lot harder to play the fun shooty game. I'm surprised people are clamoring for the thing the community seemed to cry out against at launch.

    that was certainly what the vocal minority echo chamber pro streamer audience was giving negative feedback about. Was that what the opinion at large was? I have no idea, but I'd say don't buy a game that is advertised as something you don't want?

    I have never watched a destiny streamer. I've streamed it myself a few times, but never watched any of that. All the feedback I get on the game is from this forum. I don't remember the destiny advertisements saying you could finish all the content within the first month or anything like that. I remember them advertising that we could play this fun game with our friends and explore cool areas with neat loot.

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  • HardtargetHardtarget There Are Four Lights VancouverRegistered User regular
    Welcome to the "not mad, just disappointed" D2 club
    lol

    honestly if the grind is slower but there is enough story content for the pace i'd be fine but there isn't! that mixed with the clan benefits no longer being as good and it's just really soured me on a game i've been super invested in as a solo player who still can talk about the experience on the forums since launch.

    Like i've played many many many hours of destiny, I'd like to be more positive about it, and usually am, but what the hell bungie.

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  • HardtargetHardtarget There Are Four Lights VancouverRegistered User regular
    SniperGuy wrote: »
    Hardtarget wrote: »
    SniperGuy wrote: »
    Hardtarget wrote: »
    DodgeBlan wrote: »
    Destiny 1 and Destiny 2 are fun shooter games you play for a month and then put down for 4 months until there is new content to play, then you repeat.

    Well this is what Luke smith wanted the game to be until the community had a shit fit, so now it’s not that any more

    well that's what I fucking want since that's what destiny 1 was and what destiny 2 literally was sold as.


    ugh

    But wasn't most of the negative feedback for destiny 2 because it was sold as that? People want to be able to play this fun game for longer. When there's no goals to shoot for anymore, it makes it a lot harder to play the fun shooty game. I'm surprised people are clamoring for the thing the community seemed to cry out against at launch.

    that was certainly what the vocal minority echo chamber pro streamer audience was giving negative feedback about. Was that what the opinion at large was? I have no idea, but I'd say don't buy a game that is advertised as something you don't want?

    I have never watched a destiny streamer. I've streamed it myself a few times, but never watched any of that. All the feedback I get on the game is from this forum. I don't remember the destiny advertisements saying you could finish all the content within the first month or anything like that. I remember them advertising that we could play this fun game with our friends and explore cool areas with neat loot.

    The Devs constantly talked about Destiny 1 and then even more so with the lead up to 2 being "hey, pick up this game, play it a bunch, have fun, explore all the content, and then feel free to put it down and when you come back a few months later we'll have new content for you so you can keep going". sure, an Ad won't say that, but the people making the game repeated it many times, and for somebody with tiny children it's great!

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  • SniperGuySniperGuy Also known as Dohaeris Registered User regular
    Hardtarget wrote: »
    SniperGuy wrote: »
    Hardtarget wrote: »
    SniperGuy wrote: »
    Hardtarget wrote: »
    DodgeBlan wrote: »
    Destiny 1 and Destiny 2 are fun shooter games you play for a month and then put down for 4 months until there is new content to play, then you repeat.

    Well this is what Luke smith wanted the game to be until the community had a shit fit, so now it’s not that any more

    well that's what I fucking want since that's what destiny 1 was and what destiny 2 literally was sold as.


    ugh

    But wasn't most of the negative feedback for destiny 2 because it was sold as that? People want to be able to play this fun game for longer. When there's no goals to shoot for anymore, it makes it a lot harder to play the fun shooty game. I'm surprised people are clamoring for the thing the community seemed to cry out against at launch.

    that was certainly what the vocal minority echo chamber pro streamer audience was giving negative feedback about. Was that what the opinion at large was? I have no idea, but I'd say don't buy a game that is advertised as something you don't want?

    I have never watched a destiny streamer. I've streamed it myself a few times, but never watched any of that. All the feedback I get on the game is from this forum. I don't remember the destiny advertisements saying you could finish all the content within the first month or anything like that. I remember them advertising that we could play this fun game with our friends and explore cool areas with neat loot.

    The Devs constantly talked about Destiny 1 and then even more so with the lead up to 2 being "hey, pick up this game, play it a bunch, have fun, explore all the content, and then feel free to put it down and when you come back a few months later we'll have new content for you so you can keep going". sure, an Ad won't say that, but the people making the game repeated it many times, and for somebody with tiny children it's great!

    Well I mean that's basically what I've been doing and haven't had many problems so I'm not sure why the campaign stuff isn't leveling you properly, but that is certainly something they need to smooth out. I never saw them saying that meant there wouldn't be stuff for people to do who wanted to keep playing, just that you'd be able to hop back in without feeling incredibly left behind.

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  • KhraulKhraul Registered User regular
    If I recall correctly, NF is like that because of the trophy/achievement. Making the normal one higher would lock out the trophy for the person who didn't buy any DLC, making it unobtainable.

    With all the scaling going on for power levels in the game, I'm really surprised that they haven't built adjustable power ranges into the nightfall. It doesn't seem like it should be all that crazy to have difficulties that scale from vanilla only prestige achievement level up to current max light

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  • HardtargetHardtarget There Are Four Lights VancouverRegistered User regular
    SniperGuy wrote: »
    I never saw them saying that meant there wouldn't be stuff for people to do who wanted to keep playing, just that you'd be able to hop back in without feeling incredibly left behind.
    Turns out unless you Raid that's not really a thing! I don't recall ever feeling that way with Destiny 1, I was just jealous of all the people who had time to do it, but i was still able to chain every expansion together and never feel underleveled.

    I distinctly remember getting jack squat for good gear from Curse of Osiris and conceivably I just got super unlucky but my number barely ticked up.

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  • SurfpossumSurfpossum A nonentity trying to preserve the anonymity he so richly deserves.Registered User regular
    This item may safely be discarded, you say.

    *carefully stores in vault*

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  • Sir LandsharkSir Landshark resting shark face Registered User regular
    Hardtarget wrote: »
    SniperGuy wrote: »
    I never saw them saying that meant there wouldn't be stuff for people to do who wanted to keep playing, just that you'd be able to hop back in without feeling incredibly left behind.
    Turns out unless you Raid that's not really a thing! I don't recall ever feeling that way with Destiny 1, I was just jealous of all the people who had time to do it, but i was still able to chain every expansion together and never feel underleveled.

    I distinctly remember getting jack squat for good gear from Curse of Osiris and conceivably I just got super unlucky but my number barely ticked up.

    You don't need to raid, there's powerful engrams from just about every type of activity in the game.

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  • VagabondVagabond Sans Gravitas Registered User regular
    Hardtarget wrote: »
    SniperGuy wrote: »
    I never saw them saying that meant there wouldn't be stuff for people to do who wanted to keep playing, just that you'd be able to hop back in without feeling incredibly left behind.
    Turns out unless you Raid that's not really a thing! I don't recall ever feeling that way with Destiny 1, I was just jealous of all the people who had time to do it, but i was still able to chain every expansion together and never feel underleveled.

    I distinctly remember getting jack squat for good gear from Curse of Osiris and conceivably I just got super unlucky but my number barely ticked up.

    You don't need to raid, there's powerful engrams from just about every type of activity in the game.

    There aren't that many. There are what, 5?

    - 3x Heroic Strikes
    - Nightfall
    - Call to Arms
    - Flashpoint
    - Clan XP (bugged currently)

    Even if you got super lucky and got the highest upgrade from each of those and they were for different slots every time you're looking at somewhere between a 5- and 7-point increase in overall power level (since it builds on itself as you decrypt more powerful engrams). That would get you from the soft cap to the raid recommended level in... 6 weeks. In reality, you wouldn't even be that lucky.

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  • Sir LandsharkSir Landshark resting shark face Registered User regular
    Vagabond wrote: »
    Hardtarget wrote: »
    SniperGuy wrote: »
    I never saw them saying that meant there wouldn't be stuff for people to do who wanted to keep playing, just that you'd be able to hop back in without feeling incredibly left behind.
    Turns out unless you Raid that's not really a thing! I don't recall ever feeling that way with Destiny 1, I was just jealous of all the people who had time to do it, but i was still able to chain every expansion together and never feel underleveled.

    I distinctly remember getting jack squat for good gear from Curse of Osiris and conceivably I just got super unlucky but my number barely ticked up.

    You don't need to raid, there's powerful engrams from just about every type of activity in the game.

    There aren't that many. There are what, 5?

    - 3x Heroic Strikes
    - Nightfall
    - Call to Arms
    - Flashpoint
    - Clan XP (bugged currently)

    Even if you got super lucky and got the highest upgrade from each of those and they were for different slots every time you're looking at somewhere between a 5- and 7-point increase in overall power level (since it builds on itself as you decrypt more powerful engrams). That would get you from the soft cap to the raid recommended level in... 6 weeks. In reality, you wouldn't even be that lucky.

    I'm responding to someone talking about going from the end of the CoO story missions to the level needed for the current story missions.

    Please consider the environment before printing this post.
  • HardtargetHardtarget There Are Four Lights VancouverRegistered User regular
    Also all of that stuff is basically post campaign and has no new interesting story things to do. Like how many public quests can i keep doing in the same area over and over again for flashpoints? What if I don't want to play crucible, call to arms does nothing for me. what if mthe rando team I'm with can't handle the nightfall?

    there are so many small things that impede progress in destiny. like I still did them all post destiny 2 but post curse of osiris my desire to do them was diminished. I just want more fun story shit :\

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  • HardtargetHardtarget There Are Four Lights VancouverRegistered User regular
    also, as much as I've been complaining i did just pay 12 bucks yesterday to rebuy destiny 2 on PC to see what it's like there, so I mean I still like the fucking game. With that said, boy did I forget how slow of a start the campaign has.

    It sucks SO HARD that I can't just play my xbox character on PC *sigh*

    If they made that 1 change I would forgive bungie for anything else.

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  • Zombie GandhiZombie Gandhi Registered User regular
    Hardtarget wrote: »
    SniperGuy wrote: »
    Hardtarget wrote: »
    SniperGuy wrote: »
    Hardtarget wrote: »
    DodgeBlan wrote: »
    Destiny 1 and Destiny 2 are fun shooter games you play for a month and then put down for 4 months until there is new content to play, then you repeat.

    Well this is what Luke smith wanted the game to be until the community had a shit fit, so now it’s not that any more

    well that's what I fucking want since that's what destiny 1 was and what destiny 2 literally was sold as.


    ugh

    But wasn't most of the negative feedback for destiny 2 because it was sold as that? People want to be able to play this fun game for longer. When there's no goals to shoot for anymore, it makes it a lot harder to play the fun shooty game. I'm surprised people are clamoring for the thing the community seemed to cry out against at launch.

    that was certainly what the vocal minority echo chamber pro streamer audience was giving negative feedback about. Was that what the opinion at large was? I have no idea, but I'd say don't buy a game that is advertised as something you don't want?

    I have never watched a destiny streamer. I've streamed it myself a few times, but never watched any of that. All the feedback I get on the game is from this forum. I don't remember the destiny advertisements saying you could finish all the content within the first month or anything like that. I remember them advertising that we could play this fun game with our friends and explore cool areas with neat loot.

    The Devs constantly talked about Destiny 1 and then even more so with the lead up to 2 being "hey, pick up this game, play it a bunch, have fun, explore all the content, and then feel free to put it down and when you come back a few months later we'll have new content for you so you can keep going". sure, an Ad won't say that, but the people making the game repeated it many times, and for somebody with tiny children it's great!

    What Bungie thought Destiny was, and what their user base decided Destiny was became two very different things over the course of 4 years. D1 may have started that way (and D2 also), but the game on the whole has grown and it's audience has expected something beyond just fun looter-shooter.
    Like someone mentioned, that may have been the game Luke Smith wanted to make, but it's not the game that their progression team, or the Eververse team, or the PVP team, or Activision, or the Twitch Crowd, or many of us here wanted the game to be.

    And there was probably a pretty damn significant fulcrum shift once the tone shifted with D2, when the userbase dropped off a cliff (lol Trials weekly reports) and the community/media narrative shifted from "flawed but fun" with D1 to "violently terrible" with D2.

    DodgeBlan
  • Forever ZefiroForever Zefiro Jack is back Time to let 'er ripRegistered User regular
    I feel like they just should have released SotS next Friday

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  • DodgeBlanDodgeBlan PSN: dodgeblanRegistered User regular
    edited May 2018
    ‘Make destiny 2 more of a game and less of an obligation’ is an understandable goal but there was a big side effect to this that I don’t think anyone predicted.

    One of the things that made Destiny 1 so good for casualish players (who had a community) was that you could log on at any time and have people to play with.

    You could hop in for a couple of hours for iron banner knowing that it would be a blast because there was always that core group grinding the school bus.

    You could log on for a couple of hours to do strikes because someone was probably grinding a god roll.

    It turns out that if there’s nothing to keep the hardcores going it greatly decreases the enjoyment of the more casual players because now they can’t find a group at the irregular times that they play. And that has a much more negative impact on their enjoyment than all the cool shit that the hardcores have that they don’t.

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  • VagabondVagabond Sans Gravitas Registered User regular
    I feel like they should have focused on making it difficult in a meaningful way instead of just bumping up the enemy's HP and damage. It's also not a new feeling.

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  • ArteenArteen Adept ValeRegistered User regular
    I am starting to believe in the three of coins trick for Eververse engrams.

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  • Forever ZefiroForever Zefiro Jack is back Time to let 'er ripRegistered User regular
    Vagabond wrote: »
    I feel like they should have focused on making it difficult in a meaningful way instead of just bumping up the enemy's HP and damage. It's also not a new feeling.

    But then what's the point of the new 385 max LL if it's not used for anything?

    Or do you think it shouldn't have been increased to that much, or at all?

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  • SniperGuySniperGuy Also known as Dohaeris Registered User regular
    Raid lair/Trials PC people I'll be around in 3-4 hours on discord so hopefully we can scrounge up some groups!

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  • ArteenArteen Adept ValeRegistered User regular
    Vagabond wrote: »
    I feel like they should have focused on making it difficult in a meaningful way instead of just bumping up the enemy's HP and damage. It's also not a new feeling.

    But then what's the point of the new 385 max LL if it's not used for anything?

    Or do you think it shouldn't have been increased to that much, or at all?

    Prestige difficulty should be 380. Normal should be much lower.

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