Options

[Mueller Investigation] Where there's smock, there's liar.

19091939596100

Posts

  • Options
    SyphonBlueSyphonBlue The studying beaver That beaver sure loves studying!Registered User regular
    Couscous wrote: »
    https://www.thedailybeast.com/how-jared-kushner-replaced-michael-cohen-as-trumps-national-enquirer-connection?ref=home
    “Nobody got killed, nobody got robbed… This was not a big crime,” Giuliani told The Daily Beast on Wednesday. He added, sardonically, “I think in two weeks they’ll start with parking tickets that haven’t been paid.”
    I wish this is how it worked for all crimes for everybody.

    "Sure, I may have committed a few felonies, but nobody got killed."

    Next week's headline: "AMI Secret Files Indicate Trump May Have Robbed, Killed People"

    On Fifth Avenue

    LxX6eco.jpg
    PSN/Steam/NNID: SyphonBlue | BNet: SyphonBlue#1126
  • Options
    AbsalonAbsalon Lands of Always WinterRegistered User regular
    Oh boy is it ever a massive minuscule detail whether he said "It was not a big crime" or "It was not a big crime".

  • Options
    ViskodViskod Registered User regular
    I read elsewhere that the fact that AMI cut a deal isn't getting the attention it probably should, because it wasn't just Pecker that got immunity, it was the corporation of AMI itself which implies that they were going to indict the corporation otherwise, which implies that the corporation not only acted in its official capacity which it did through Pecker as CEO, but it also did so for the benefit of the corporation and benefit is the key word there, because a tabloid doing catch and kill on damaging stories on Trump, and then Trump paying them back for it wouldn't count as a benefit. It would count as a reimbursement. So there is an unknown benefit to AMI from the Trumps personally or the Trump Organization out there, that would be worthy enough for an indictment.

    Can any of our more adept legal peoples tell me if this is on point?

  • Options
    I ZimbraI Zimbra Worst song, played on ugliest guitar Registered User regular
    Couscous wrote: »
    https://www.thedailybeast.com/how-jared-kushner-replaced-michael-cohen-as-trumps-national-enquirer-connection?ref=home
    “Nobody got killed, nobody got robbed… This was not a big crime,” Giuliani told The Daily Beast on Wednesday. He added, sardonically, “I think in two weeks they’ll start with parking tickets that haven’t been paid.”
    I wish this is how it worked for all crimes for everybody.

    "Sure, I may have committed a few felonies, but nobody got killed."

    Rudy "Broken Windows" Giuliani, everybody.

    There's a closed hearing for a sealed grand jury case going on today that is probably Mueller-related. They're being very secretive about it and have sealed not just the courtroom but the whole floor. Buzzfeed reporter:

  • Options
    DrezDrez Registered User regular
    edited December 2018
    Couscous wrote: »
    https://www.thedailybeast.com/how-jared-kushner-replaced-michael-cohen-as-trumps-national-enquirer-connection?ref=home
    “Nobody got killed, nobody got robbed… This was not a big crime,” Giuliani told The Daily Beast on Wednesday. He added, sardonically, “I think in two weeks they’ll start with parking tickets that haven’t been paid.”
    I wish this is how it worked for all crimes for everybody.

    "Sure, I may have committed a few felonies, but nobody got killed."

    This is particularly disgusting to me because I know that many districts across America will (racistly) imply that you cannot vote if you have unpaid parking tickets as a way to dissuade voter turnout. Which is, in fact, a lie.

    It’s the GOP all over: Use some stupid crap as a weapon against your political opponents and then turn around and hypocritically trivialize it when it hits close to home. I find this example particularly vile because he’s using it as throwaway example while others in his political party have tried to use it to depreciate the rights of legitimate citizens from voting.

    God I fucking hate these people.

    (My source is Al Franken’s Lying Liars book from many years ago. His book was sourcing fliers from many districts during Bush’s presidential campaign, which the book dissected.)

    Drez on
    Switch: SW-7690-2320-9238Steam/PSN/Xbox: Drezdar
  • Options
    ViskodViskod Registered User regular
    There is apparently quite the gathering crowd there trying to find out who this person is. But if they sealed off the whole damn floor? Today could be quite the day.

    Carrie Johnson of NPR: 15+ reporters are milling around outside DC federal appeals courtroom trying to determine who’s involved in a mystery case that somehow relates to the Mueller Russia probe.

  • Options
    XaquinXaquin Right behind you!Registered User regular
    are they unsealing the arguments now?

    if not that we're not going to learn anything =p

  • Options
    HenroidHenroid Mexican kicked from Immigration Thread Centrism is Racism :3Registered User regular
    This is definitely one of those moments where the press needs to know to back off to protect the case at hand.

  • Options
    ViskodViskod Registered User regular
    Xaquin wrote: »
    are they unsealing the arguments now?

    if not that we're not going to learn anything =p

    maybe one lucky reporter will get a peak at a notable person or person(s) coming or going from the building.

  • Options
    SyphonBlueSyphonBlue The studying beaver That beaver sure loves studying!Registered User regular
    Viskod wrote: »
    There is apparently quite the gathering crowd there trying to find out who this person is. But if they sealed off the whole damn floor? Today could be quite the day.

    Carrie Johnson of NPR: 15+ reporters are milling around outside DC federal appeals courtroom trying to determine who’s involved in a mystery case that somehow relates to the Mueller Russia probe.

    Whoa this is big



    They've closed off an entire floor!

    LxX6eco.jpg
    PSN/Steam/NNID: SyphonBlue | BNet: SyphonBlue#1126
  • Options
    XaquinXaquin Right behind you!Registered User regular
    The only ones left are Kushner, Trump, Trump, and Trump Jr.

  • Options
    Drake ChambersDrake Chambers Lay out my formal shorts. Registered User regular
    Yeah, as fun as this is, it's absolutely correct. Grand jury proceedings are supposed to be secret. Having the media subvert that rule by conducting surveillance on a courtroom is not cool.

  • Options
    I ZimbraI Zimbra Worst song, played on ugliest guitar Registered User regular
    Henroid wrote: »
    This is definitely one of those moments where the press needs to know to back off to protect the case at hand.

    It's not the press' job to keep the government's secrets for them.

  • Options
    XaquinXaquin Right behind you!Registered User regular
    I Zimbra wrote: »
    Henroid wrote: »
    This is definitely one of those moments where the press needs to know to back off to protect the case at hand.

    It's not the press' job to keep the government's secrets for them.

    but it is their job to not screw up investigations because they crave ratings

  • Options
    BroloBrolo Broseidon Lord of the BroceanRegistered User regular
    edited December 2018
    SyphonBlue wrote: »
    Viskod wrote: »
    There is apparently quite the gathering crowd there trying to find out who this person is. But if they sealed off the whole damn floor? Today could be quite the day.

    Carrie Johnson of NPR: 15+ reporters are milling around outside DC federal appeals courtroom trying to determine who’s involved in a mystery case that somehow relates to the Mueller Russia probe.

    Whoa this is big



    They've closed off an entire floor!

    OvsHZE3l.jpg
    Turns out it's the holiday party for Mueller and his team. There's gonna be cake and a gift swap and everything.

    Brolo on
  • Options
    Drake ChambersDrake Chambers Lay out my formal shorts. Registered User regular
    I Zimbra wrote: »
    Henroid wrote: »
    This is definitely one of those moments where the press needs to know to back off to protect the case at hand.

    It's not the press' job to keep the government's secrets for them.

    I am 100% in support of freedom of the press.

    There are very good reasons that certain parts of the criminal justice process are done in secret. Exploiting a logistical loophole to destroy that secrecy can compromise the integrity of the process and derail an investigation.

    Just because a journalist can access and publish secret information doesn't mean that they should.

  • Options
    I ZimbraI Zimbra Worst song, played on ugliest guitar Registered User regular
    Xaquin wrote: »
    I Zimbra wrote: »
    Henroid wrote: »
    This is definitely one of those moments where the press needs to know to back off to protect the case at hand.

    It's not the press' job to keep the government's secrets for them.

    but it is their job to not screw up investigations because they crave ratings

    Also not their job, but we're getting afield of the purpose of the thread here.

  • Options
    ViskodViskod Registered User regular
    Xaquin wrote: »
    The only ones left are Kushner, Trump, Trump, and Trump Jr.

    There's no telling with this case. It could be someone we've never heard of before or it could be a known person that we previously had no idea they were as connected to all of this as they were.
    I Zimbra wrote: »
    Henroid wrote: »
    This is definitely one of those moments where the press needs to know to back off to protect the case at hand.

    It's not the press' job to keep the government's secrets for them.

    Helping criminals sabotage a case that is neck deep in matters of national security and involves the President just so you can have something flashy to put on TV on a Friday night is not what I'd call an aspect of journalistic integrity.

  • Options
    HenroidHenroid Mexican kicked from Immigration Thread Centrism is Racism :3Registered User regular
    I Zimbra wrote: »
    Henroid wrote: »
    This is definitely one of those moments where the press needs to know to back off to protect the case at hand.

    It's not the press' job to keep the government's secrets for them.
    I'm saying to show some discretion. Just because the press learns something doesn't mean it should be published. They're after scoops without considering the damage it could do.

  • Options
    nexuscrawlernexuscrawler Registered User regular
    Henroid wrote: »
    I Zimbra wrote: »
    Henroid wrote: »
    This is definitely one of those moments where the press needs to know to back off to protect the case at hand.

    It's not the press' job to keep the government's secrets for them.
    I'm saying to show some discretion. Just because the press learns something doesn't mean it should be published. They're after scoops without considering the damage it could do.

    Keeping in mind a big part of why we're here in the press sat on the dossier

  • Options
    Desktop HippieDesktop Hippie Registered User regular
    Brolo wrote: »
    SyphonBlue wrote: »
    Viskod wrote: »
    There is apparently quite the gathering crowd there trying to find out who this person is. But if they sealed off the whole damn floor? Today could be quite the day.

    Carrie Johnson of NPR: 15+ reporters are milling around outside DC federal appeals courtroom trying to determine who’s involved in a mystery case that somehow relates to the Mueller Russia probe.

    Whoa this is big



    They've closed off an entire floor!

    OvsHZE3l.jpg
    Turns out it's the holiday party for Mueller and his team. There's gonna be cake and a gift swap and everything.

    :whistle: Mueller baby
    indict Trump’s son and son-in-law too
    please do
    I’ll wait up and then cheer
    Mueller baby
    and hurry to the courtroom tonight! :whistle:

  • Options
    CelestialBadgerCelestialBadger Registered User regular
    Henroid wrote: »
    I Zimbra wrote: »
    Henroid wrote: »
    This is definitely one of those moments where the press needs to know to back off to protect the case at hand.

    It's not the press' job to keep the government's secrets for them.
    I'm saying to show some discretion. Just because the press learns something doesn't mean it should be published. They're after scoops without considering the damage it could do.

    Keeping in mind a big part of why we're here in the press sat on the dossier

    And also we know about it because they reported on the Trump tower meeting.

  • Options
    Santa ClaustrophobiaSanta Claustrophobia Ho Ho Ho Disconnecting from Xbox LIVERegistered User regular
    Absalon wrote: »
    Oh boy is it ever a massive minuscule detail whether he said "It was not a big crime" or "It was not a big crime".

    I'm having difficulty parsing the difference. 'It was not a big crime' and 'It was not a big crime' carry the same weight and/or connotation. And 'It was not a big crime' suggests that it wasn't a crime at all, but the inclusion of the word 'big' contradicts that since it's unnecessary. Or the speaker is a total idiot or Rudy Giuliani.

    What I'm getting is the the head of the Department of Cyber and Shitty Lawyering is admitting to crime and is trying his damnedest to minimise it away as akin to jaywalking or shooting somebody on Fifth Avenue.

  • Options
    AridholAridhol Daddliest Catch Registered User regular
    Democrats and minorities commit crimes.
    Republicans commit mistakes and are really very sorry.

  • Options
    NEO|PhyteNEO|Phyte They follow the stars, bound together. Strands in a braid till the end.Registered User regular
    Absalon wrote: »
    Oh boy is it ever a massive minuscule detail whether he said "It was not a big crime" or "It was not a big crime".

    I'm having difficulty parsing the difference. 'It was not a big crime' and 'It was not a big crime' carry the same weight and/or connotation. And 'It was not a big crime' suggests that it wasn't a crime at all, but the inclusion of the word 'big' contradicts that since it's unnecessary. Or the speaker is a total idiot or Rudy Giuliani.

    What I'm getting is the the head of the Department of Cyber and Shitty Lawyering is admitting to crime and is trying his damnedest to minimise it away as akin to jaywalking or shooting somebody on Fifth Avenue.
    The difference is that 'it NOT being a big crime' leaves the possibility of it not being a crime at all, while 'it not being a BIG crime' says yes it is 100% a crime.

    It was that somehow, from within the derelict-horror, they had learned a way to see inside an ugly, broken thing... And take away its pain.
    Warframe/Steam: NFyt
  • Options
    Santa ClaustrophobiaSanta Claustrophobia Ho Ho Ho Disconnecting from Xbox LIVERegistered User regular
    So I guess Flynn's lawyers are claiming the FBI never informed Flynn that lying would put him in legal jeopardy. (Chyron on FOX.)

    Just how stupid do you need to be to not know that lying to police is probably not going to help?

    Oh, by the way, now the claim is that the FBI told him he didn't need a lawyer present.
    The filing also quotes then-Deputy FBI Director Andrew McCabe — a lightning rod for critics of the FBI — saying he told Flynn that getting a lawyer would complicate and prolong the talks and force McCabe to involve the Justice Department.

    The weird thing here is that the usual goto example of police tactics, Law and Order, rarely (if ever) has the cops say anything like this. They just go straight to the interrogation without a lawyer present to speed up the narrative. But, I'm pretty sure cops say this sort of thing for real because lots of people are stupid and it occasionally works. Hence, don't talk to cops without a lawyer!
    Experts, though, say there is almost nothing unusual, illegal or even unethical about how Flynn was treated. There is no requirement that investigators inform subjects who aren’t in custody that they need a lawyer or that lying is illegal. And former federal prosecutor Patrick Cotter said it was the treatment van der Zwaan and Papadopoulos got that was unorthodox — not Flynn’s.

    “In the vast majority of such noncustodial interviews of which I am aware — and there are probably hundreds I’ve encountered in my career — there is no explicit warning at all,” Cotter said. “So Flynn not getting a special warning is not in any sense out of the ordinary.”

    David Moran, a criminal procedure expert at the University of Michigan who runs the Michigan Innocence Clinic, also said Flynn’s treatment is completely par for course. The famous Supreme Court case, Miranda v. Arizona, requires law enforcement to inform those in custody of their rights, but not people such as Flynn who weren’t in custody.

    “The tactic of telling a subject not in custody that he or she doesn’t need an attorney present during an interview may be standard, but whether it is savory is a matter of opinion,” Moran said. “Still, it strikes me as odd for a tactic that is used every day with suspected criminals of every description to come under fire only when used against a highly sophisticated, extremely well-connected defendant.”
    Yup.

    Stupid Watergate.

  • Options
    HiroconHirocon Registered User regular
    edited December 2018
    It was not a big crime.

    It was not a big crime.

    It was not a big crime.

    Hirocon on
  • Options
    Santa ClaustrophobiaSanta Claustrophobia Ho Ho Ho Disconnecting from Xbox LIVERegistered User regular
    NEO|Phyte wrote: »
    Absalon wrote: »
    Oh boy is it ever a massive minuscule detail whether he said "It was not a big crime" or "It was not a big crime".

    I'm having difficulty parsing the difference. 'It was not a big crime' and 'It was not a big crime' carry the same weight and/or connotation. And 'It was not a big crime' suggests that it wasn't a crime at all, but the inclusion of the word 'big' contradicts that since it's unnecessary. Or the speaker is a total idiot or Rudy Giuliani.

    What I'm getting is the the head of the Department of Cyber and Shitty Lawyering is admitting to crime and is trying his damnedest to minimise it away as akin to jaywalking or shooting somebody on Fifth Avenue.
    The difference is that 'it NOT being a big crime' leaves the possibility of it not being a crime at all, while 'it not being a BIG crime' says yes it is 100% a crime.

    It's a bit immaterial coming from the man who 'cleaned up' New York City under a broken windows policy.

  • Options
    AstaerethAstaereth In the belly of the beastRegistered User regular
    Hirocon wrote: »
    It was not a big crime.

    It was not a big crime.

    It was not a big crime.

    He’d kill us if he had the chance.

    ACsTqqK.jpg
  • Options
    Captain InertiaCaptain Inertia Registered User regular
    NEO|Phyte wrote: »
    Absalon wrote: »
    Oh boy is it ever a massive minuscule detail whether he said "It was not a big crime" or "It was not a big crime".

    I'm having difficulty parsing the difference. 'It was not a big crime' and 'It was not a big crime' carry the same weight and/or connotation. And 'It was not a big crime' suggests that it wasn't a crime at all, but the inclusion of the word 'big' contradicts that since it's unnecessary. Or the speaker is a total idiot or Rudy Giuliani.

    What I'm getting is the the head of the Department of Cyber and Shitty Lawyering is admitting to crime and is trying his damnedest to minimise it away as akin to jaywalking or shooting somebody on Fifth Avenue.
    The difference is that 'it NOT being a big crime' leaves the possibility of it not being a crime at all, while 'it not being a BIG crime' says yes it is 100% a crime.

    It's a bit immaterial coming from the man who 'cleaned up' New York City under a broken windows policy.

    It’s all still consistent when you realize “broken windows policy” means “terrorize poor and minorities with unnecessary and brutal police tactics while ignoring crime committed by rich people”

  • Options
    Santa ClaustrophobiaSanta Claustrophobia Ho Ho Ho Disconnecting from Xbox LIVERegistered User regular
    NEO|Phyte wrote: »
    Absalon wrote: »
    Oh boy is it ever a massive minuscule detail whether he said "It was not a big crime" or "It was not a big crime".

    I'm having difficulty parsing the difference. 'It was not a big crime' and 'It was not a big crime' carry the same weight and/or connotation. And 'It was not a big crime' suggests that it wasn't a crime at all, but the inclusion of the word 'big' contradicts that since it's unnecessary. Or the speaker is a total idiot or Rudy Giuliani.

    What I'm getting is the the head of the Department of Cyber and Shitty Lawyering is admitting to crime and is trying his damnedest to minimise it away as akin to jaywalking or shooting somebody on Fifth Avenue.
    The difference is that 'it NOT being a big crime' leaves the possibility of it not being a crime at all, while 'it not being a BIG crime' says yes it is 100% a crime.

    It's a bit immaterial coming from the man who 'cleaned up' New York City under a broken windows policy.

    It’s all still consistent when you realize “broken windows policy” means “terrorize poor and minorities with unnecessary and brutal police tactics while ignoring crime committed by rich people”

    I know that. You know that. Most of us here know that.

    But, the publicly reported reason for it was 'no crime is too small'. So you hammer and hammer and hammer with it until he/they admit they're full of shit now, or admit what broken windows really meant.

    And when you say something is not a big thing, you're trying to say that it is a small thing. But it's still a thing. It does not leave the possibility that it isn't a thing at all.

  • Options
    djmitchelladjmitchella Registered User regular
    It’s all still consistent when you realize “broken windows policy” means “terrorize poor and minorities with unnecessary and brutal police tactics while ignoring crime committed by rich people”

    Reply All did a podcast about that recently:

    https://www.gimletmedia.com/reply-all/127-the-crime-machine-part-i#episode-player
    https://www.gimletmedia.com/reply-all/128-the-crime-machine-part-ii#episode-player
    New York City cops are in a fight against their own police department. They say it’s under the control of a broken computer system that punishes cops who refuse to engage in racist, corrupt policing. The story of their fight, and the story of the grouchy idealist who originally built the machine they’re fighting.

  • Options
    CelestialBadgerCelestialBadger Registered User regular
    edited December 2018
    New York City cops are in a fight against their own police department. They say it’s under the control of a broken computer system that punishes cops who refuse to engage in racist, corrupt policing. The story of their fight, and the story of the grouchy idealist who originally built the machine they’re fighting.

    This sounds like a Judge Dredd plotline.

    CelestialBadger on
  • Options
    shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    Couscous wrote: »
    https://www.thedailybeast.com/how-jared-kushner-replaced-michael-cohen-as-trumps-national-enquirer-connection?ref=home
    “Nobody got killed, nobody got robbed… This was not a big crime,” Giuliani told The Daily Beast on Wednesday. He added, sardonically, “I think in two weeks they’ll start with parking tickets that haven’t been paid.”
    I wish this is how it worked for all crimes for everybody.

    "Sure, I may have committed a few felonies, but nobody got killed."

    This invites the easiest follow up.
    "You were a prosecuted. Are you saying you never prosecuted anyone for non-violent offences or that you shouldn't have prosecuted anyone for non-violent offences?"
    I assume it was not asked though.

  • Options
    Captain InertiaCaptain Inertia Registered User regular
    I mean this is the guy who said “truth isn’t truth” among other whizbangers

  • Options
    HevachHevach Registered User regular
    New York City cops are in a fight against their own police department. They say it’s under the control of a broken computer system that punishes cops who refuse to engage in racist, corrupt policing. The story of their fight, and the story of the grouchy idealist who originally built the machine they’re fighting.

    This sounds like a Judge Dredd plotline.

    Sounds like one of Kevin J Anderson's ill advised Dune prequels.

  • Options
    ViskodViskod Registered User regular
    I forget, is Vox considered reliable? Because they have a hell of an article up basically attesting that everything Trump has done since before Comey was even fired to attack the Russia Investigation in general, and then later the FBI, witnesses, Clinton, the DNC, Steele, Mueller. That all of this was done at the urging of guess who our crime loving super star, Paul Manafort. That Manafort since the beginning has been the one advising and urging Trump in ways he can undermine the investigation and undermine potential witnesses against him.

  • Options
    shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    Viskod wrote: »
    I forget, is Vox considered reliable? Because they have a hell of an article up basically attesting that everything Trump has done since before Comey was even fired to attack the Russia Investigation in general, and then later the FBI, witnesses, Clinton, the DNC, Steele, Mueller. That all of this was done at the urging of guess who our crime loving super star, Paul Manafort. That Manafort since the beginning has been the one advising and urging Trump in ways he can undermine the investigation and undermine potential witnesses against him.

    Vox is reliable, yes. But at the same time that sounds like an opinion piece.

  • Options
    CouscousCouscous Registered User regular
    New York City cops are in a fight against their own police department. They say it’s under the control of a broken computer system that punishes cops who refuse to engage in racist, corrupt policing. The story of their fight, and the story of the grouchy idealist who originally built the machine they’re fighting.

    This sounds like a Judge Dredd plotline.

    Judge Dredd would just shoot the machine.

  • Options
    ViskodViskod Registered User regular
    shryke wrote: »
    Viskod wrote: »
    I forget, is Vox considered reliable? Because they have a hell of an article up basically attesting that everything Trump has done since before Comey was even fired to attack the Russia Investigation in general, and then later the FBI, witnesses, Clinton, the DNC, Steele, Mueller. That all of this was done at the urging of guess who our crime loving super star, Paul Manafort. That Manafort since the beginning has been the one advising and urging Trump in ways he can undermine the investigation and undermine potential witnesses against him.

    Vox is reliable, yes. But at the same time that sounds like an opinion piece.

    Well it definitely does not read like one. They are pretty definitive on the matter.

    Exclusive: Paul Manafort advised White House on how to attack and discredit investigation of President Trump
    We now have details as to how the indicted former campaign manager worked with the president to undermine federal law enforcement.

This discussion has been closed.