I had a whole long thing written up about Alberta, but it's hard to approach the issue tactfully.
I generally approve of the idea of staying on fossil fuels until we can wean ourselves off of them and onto renewable energy sources, but it seems like everyone's so hyperfocused on the first part of that equation that no one's giving a shit about step two.
Like we don't have 30 or 40 or 50 years to gradually make the shift anymore. Shit we've been talking about renewable energy since I was in grade school and I'm almost 40 now. We're switching off of fossil fuels TOO FUCKING SLOWLY AS IT IS.
I had a whole long thing written up about Alberta, but it's hard to approach the issue tactfully.
I generally approve of the idea of staying on fossil fuels until we can wean ourselves off of them and onto renewable energy sources, but it seems like everyone's so hyperfocused on the first part of that equation that no one's giving a shit about step two.
Like we don't have 30 or 40 or 50 years to gradually make the shift anymore. Shit we've been talking about renewable energy since I was in grade school and I'm almost 40 now. We're switching off of fossil fuels TOO FUCKING SLOWLY AS IT IS.
I don't think people realize how much of a cult oil is here.
Hell, the UCP and our magnificent premier Kenny just announced cut's to retraining programs, tech grants and has doubled the amount of grants for trades such as electrician and gas fitters.... That are super saturated as it is. Both trades cannot find work and the outlook for the next few years is even more dire but OIL OIL OIL will be back any day I'm sure
PSN: Canadian_llama
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Nova_CI have the needThe need for speedRegistered Userregular
That's not just on Alberta, though.
The federal government needs to invest in converting to sustainable power gen. The government needs to invest in electric car infrastructure.
Like, from what everyone is saying, it seems to me that the plant closures in Ottawa are what we actually want. What good does it do to stop oil production in Alberta if everyone is still driving ICE cars or burning heating oil/natural gas in their homes, or power is generated using fossil fuels.
Like, Alberta needs to move away from coal power, but are they the only ones? Why is the solution for Alberta to destroy it's primary economic pillar while everyone else just...what? What is the responsibility here?
I would own an electric car if I could, but the nearest charging station is a 9 hour drive away from me.
The federal government needs to invest in converting to sustainable power gen. The government needs to invest in electric car infrastructure.
Like, from what everyone is saying, it seems to me that the plant closures in Ottawa are what we actually want. What good does it do to stop oil production in Alberta if everyone is still driving ICE cars or burning heating oil/natural gas in their homes, or power is generated using fossil fuels.
Like, Alberta needs to move away from coal power, but are they the only ones? Why is the solution for Alberta to destroy it's primary economic pillar while everyone else just...what? What is the responsibility here?
I would own an electric car if I could, but the nearest charging station is a 9 hour drive away from me.
Almost, yeah
Coal makes up 8.6% of Canada’s electricity generation.
Share of provincial electricity supply from coal:
Nova Scotia: 47.9%
Saskatchewan: 46.6%
Alberta: 44.9%
New Brunswick: 15.8%
Manitoba: 0.1%
Natural gas makes up 8.6% of Canada’s electricity generation.
Share of provincial electricity supply from nuclear power:
Alberta: 42.2%
Saskatchewan: 35.7%
Nova Scotia: 14.3%
New Brunswick: 9.9%
Ontario: 5.2%
Northwest Territories: 4.0%
Yukon: 2.0%
British Columbia: 1.1%
Newfoundland and Labrador: 0.7%
The federal government needs to invest in converting to sustainable power gen. The government needs to invest in electric car infrastructure.
Like, from what everyone is saying, it seems to me that the plant closures in Ottawa are what we actually want. What good does it do to stop oil production in Alberta if everyone is still driving ICE cars or burning heating oil/natural gas in their homes, or power is generated using fossil fuels.
Like, Alberta needs to move away from coal power, but are they the only ones? Why is the solution for Alberta to destroy it's primary economic pillar while everyone else just...what? What is the responsibility here?
I would own an electric car if I could, but the nearest charging station is a 9 hour drive away from me.
Almost, yeah
Coal makes up 8.6% of Canada’s electricity generation.
Share of provincial electricity supply from coal:
Nova Scotia: 47.9%
Saskatchewan: 46.6%
Alberta: 44.9%
New Brunswick: 15.8%
Manitoba: 0.1%
Natural gas makes up 8.6% of Canada’s electricity generation.
Share of provincial electricity supply from nuclear power:
Alberta: 42.2%
Saskatchewan: 35.7%
Nova Scotia: 14.3%
New Brunswick: 9.9%
Ontario: 5.2%
Northwest Territories: 4.0%
Yukon: 2.0%
British Columbia: 1.1%
Newfoundland and Labrador: 0.7%
It's Alberta, Saskatchewan and Nova Scotia
That's not really fair. We don't have the options for Hydro out here in flatland.
That being said i wish they would go hard on Nuclear.
The federal government needs to invest in converting to sustainable power gen. The government needs to invest in electric car infrastructure.
Like, from what everyone is saying, it seems to me that the plant closures in Ottawa are what we actually want. What good does it do to stop oil production in Alberta if everyone is still driving ICE cars or burning heating oil/natural gas in their homes, or power is generated using fossil fuels.
Like, Alberta needs to move away from coal power, but are they the only ones? Why is the solution for Alberta to destroy it's primary economic pillar while everyone else just...what? What is the responsibility here?
I would own an electric car if I could, but the nearest charging station is a 9 hour drive away from me.
Almost, yeah
Coal makes up 8.6% of Canada’s electricity generation.
Share of provincial electricity supply from coal:
Nova Scotia: 47.9%
Saskatchewan: 46.6%
Alberta: 44.9%
New Brunswick: 15.8%
Manitoba: 0.1%
Natural gas makes up 8.6% of Canada’s electricity generation.
Share of provincial electricity supply from nuclear power:
Alberta: 42.2%
Saskatchewan: 35.7%
Nova Scotia: 14.3%
New Brunswick: 9.9%
Ontario: 5.2%
Northwest Territories: 4.0%
Yukon: 2.0%
British Columbia: 1.1%
Newfoundland and Labrador: 0.7%
It's Alberta, Saskatchewan and Nova Scotia
That's not really fair. We don't have the options for Hydro out here in flatland.
That being said i wish they would go hard on Nuclear.
I was talking with my wife's family over thanksgiving and it was somewhat interesting but I'm wondering if you guys could maybe weigh in for me since even the Liberal voters here don't appear to be hardcore Trudeau fans. My Father-in-Law got pretty heated when stating that what Trudeau did with the whole SNC-Lavallin thing was illegal? Was that the conclusion or was it considered a minor ethics violation?
The other point the family seemed to get stuck on was saying that Trudeau was going to bankrupt this country. Now so far the pipeline thing seems to be a very possible lost cause/waste of money but other than that, is the Trudeau government doing that bad financially?
My Father-in-Law was a fairly high up public sector employee until he retired recently and apparently he hated Harper for what Harper did to the public sector but this is pretty much the most worked up I've ever seen him get and I was curious if there was any truth to it.
The federal government needs to invest in converting to sustainable power gen. The government needs to invest in electric car infrastructure.
Like, from what everyone is saying, it seems to me that the plant closures in Ottawa are what we actually want. What good does it do to stop oil production in Alberta if everyone is still driving ICE cars or burning heating oil/natural gas in their homes, or power is generated using fossil fuels.
Like, Alberta needs to move away from coal power, but are they the only ones? Why is the solution for Alberta to destroy it's primary economic pillar while everyone else just...what? What is the responsibility here?
I would own an electric car if I could, but the nearest charging station is a 9 hour drive away from me.
Almost, yeah
Coal makes up 8.6% of Canada’s electricity generation.
Share of provincial electricity supply from coal:
Nova Scotia: 47.9%
Saskatchewan: 46.6%
Alberta: 44.9%
New Brunswick: 15.8%
Manitoba: 0.1%
Natural gas makes up 8.6% of Canada’s electricity generation.
Share of provincial electricity supply from nuclear power:
Alberta: 42.2%
Saskatchewan: 35.7%
Nova Scotia: 14.3%
New Brunswick: 9.9%
Ontario: 5.2%
Northwest Territories: 4.0%
Yukon: 2.0%
British Columbia: 1.1%
Newfoundland and Labrador: 0.7%
It's Alberta, Saskatchewan and Nova Scotia
That's not really fair. We don't have the options for Hydro out here in flatland.
That being said i wish they would go hard on Nuclear.
Probably pretty good potential for wind and solar though. Also, the Site C dam we're building in BC is pretty close to Alberta. I'm sure we could sell some power east.
The federal government needs to invest in converting to sustainable power gen. The government needs to invest in electric car infrastructure.
Like, from what everyone is saying, it seems to me that the plant closures in Ottawa are what we actually want. What good does it do to stop oil production in Alberta if everyone is still driving ICE cars or burning heating oil/natural gas in their homes, or power is generated using fossil fuels.
Like, Alberta needs to move away from coal power, but are they the only ones? Why is the solution for Alberta to destroy it's primary economic pillar while everyone else just...what? What is the responsibility here?
I would own an electric car if I could, but the nearest charging station is a 9 hour drive away from me.
Almost, yeah
Coal makes up 8.6% of Canada’s electricity generation.
Share of provincial electricity supply from coal:
Nova Scotia: 47.9%
Saskatchewan: 46.6%
Alberta: 44.9%
New Brunswick: 15.8%
Manitoba: 0.1%
Natural gas makes up 8.6% of Canada’s electricity generation.
Share of provincial electricity supply from nuclear power:
Alberta: 42.2%
Saskatchewan: 35.7%
Nova Scotia: 14.3%
New Brunswick: 9.9%
Ontario: 5.2%
Northwest Territories: 4.0%
Yukon: 2.0%
British Columbia: 1.1%
Newfoundland and Labrador: 0.7%
It's Alberta, Saskatchewan and Nova Scotia
That's not really fair. We don't have the options for Hydro out here in flatland.
That being said i wish they would go hard on Nuclear.
Probably pretty good potential for wind and solar though. Also, the Site C dam we're building in BC is pretty close to Alberta. I'm sure we could sell some power east.
very good potential for solar, of course folks immediately get all Nimby in regards to solar farms.
Switch SW-6182-1526-0041
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Nova_CI have the needThe need for speedRegistered Userregular
I was talking with my wife's family over thanksgiving and it was somewhat interesting but I'm wondering if you guys could maybe weigh in for me since even the Liberal voters here don't appear to be hardcore Trudeau fans. My Father-in-Law got pretty heated when stating that what Trudeau did with the whole SNC-Lavallin thing was illegal? Was that the conclusion or was it considered a minor ethics violation?
The other point the family seemed to get stuck on was saying that Trudeau was going to bankrupt this country. Now so far the pipeline thing seems to be a very possible lost cause/waste of money but other than that, is the Trudeau government doing that bad financially?
My Father-in-Law was a fairly high up public sector employee until he retired recently and apparently he hated Harper for what Harper did to the public sector but this is pretty much the most worked up I've ever seen him get and I was curious if there was any truth to it.
The ethics commissioner concluded that Trudeau violated the Conflict of Interest act. So, yeah, technically he broke the law. I don't think there's any real consequences laid out, though? It's not a criminal violation. More like guidelines. /Barbossa
Anyway, how bad it is, is up to you. I think Trudeau was an idiot in how it was handled, both before and after it was made public, but I don't have a problem with the sentiment behind it. The CPC has pushed a shit ton of propaganda about it, though, which has become the common narrative. The important thing about the propaganda is he was NOT trying to get them 'off' as they say. The executives who did the bribes are facing individual charges and some have been convicted already. The thing Trudeau wanted to do is how every other G7 nation handles corporate corruption, all of whom are better at handling it than Canada is (We have the worst corporate corruption record in the G7). Wilson-Raybould was within her rights to refuse, and Trudeau probably should have dropped it, but, like I said, he's an idiot.
The Liberals should have better controlled the messaging once it broke, but the Liberals are apparently also idiots and they were happy to let the CPC have complete and total control over the media narrative. So it's a huge mess, and will never not be a huge mess because what people think is not the truth, but a version the CPC wants people to think.
Anyway.
Regarding breaking Canada, Trudeau's deficit is a fraction of what Harper's was, so if Trudeau's a threat to Canadian solvency, then Harper was the fucking apocalypse.
The federal government needs to invest in converting to sustainable power gen. The government needs to invest in electric car infrastructure.
Like, from what everyone is saying, it seems to me that the plant closures in Ottawa are what we actually want. What good does it do to stop oil production in Alberta if everyone is still driving ICE cars or burning heating oil/natural gas in their homes, or power is generated using fossil fuels.
Like, Alberta needs to move away from coal power, but are they the only ones? Why is the solution for Alberta to destroy it's primary economic pillar while everyone else just...what? What is the responsibility here?
I would own an electric car if I could, but the nearest charging station is a 9 hour drive away from me.
Almost, yeah
Coal makes up 8.6% of Canada’s electricity generation.
Share of provincial electricity supply from coal:
Nova Scotia: 47.9%
Saskatchewan: 46.6%
Alberta: 44.9%
New Brunswick: 15.8%
Manitoba: 0.1%
Natural gas makes up 8.6% of Canada’s electricity generation.
Share of provincial electricity supply from nuclear power:
Alberta: 42.2%
Saskatchewan: 35.7%
Nova Scotia: 14.3%
New Brunswick: 9.9%
Ontario: 5.2%
Northwest Territories: 4.0%
Yukon: 2.0%
British Columbia: 1.1%
Newfoundland and Labrador: 0.7%
It's Alberta, Saskatchewan and Nova Scotia
That's not really fair. We don't have the options for Hydro out here in flatland.
That being said i wish they would go hard on Nuclear.
Probably pretty good potential for wind and solar though. Also, the Site C dam we're building in BC is pretty close to Alberta. I'm sure we could sell some power east.
very good potential for solar, of course folks immediately get all Nimby in regards to solar farms.
The last gen wind farms in southern Alberta have all been slowly closing as they are generally not viable with the high wear on the towers but some new projects were anounced in the last year.
I think solar/wind farms are pimp. Makes me feel like I'm actually living in the future.
The federal government needs to invest in converting to sustainable power gen. The government needs to invest in electric car infrastructure.
Like, from what everyone is saying, it seems to me that the plant closures in Ottawa are what we actually want. What good does it do to stop oil production in Alberta if everyone is still driving ICE cars or burning heating oil/natural gas in their homes, or power is generated using fossil fuels.
Like, Alberta needs to move away from coal power, but are they the only ones? Why is the solution for Alberta to destroy it's primary economic pillar while everyone else just...what? What is the responsibility here?
I would own an electric car if I could, but the nearest charging station is a 9 hour drive away from me.
Almost, yeah
Coal makes up 8.6% of Canada’s electricity generation.
Share of provincial electricity supply from coal:
Nova Scotia: 47.9%
Saskatchewan: 46.6%
Alberta: 44.9%
New Brunswick: 15.8%
Manitoba: 0.1%
Natural gas makes up 8.6% of Canada’s electricity generation.
Share of provincial electricity supply from nuclear power:
Alberta: 42.2%
Saskatchewan: 35.7%
Nova Scotia: 14.3%
New Brunswick: 9.9%
Ontario: 5.2%
Northwest Territories: 4.0%
Yukon: 2.0%
British Columbia: 1.1%
Newfoundland and Labrador: 0.7%
It's Alberta, Saskatchewan and Nova Scotia
That's not really fair. We don't have the options for Hydro out here in flatland.
That being said i wish they would go hard on Nuclear.
Probably pretty good potential for wind and solar though. Also, the Site C dam we're building in BC is pretty close to Alberta. I'm sure we could sell some power east.
That would be great but the politics of it would be a very very hard sell...
It says a lot that left leaning people have no problem criticizing and pointing out flaws in the leaders on the left, and mindset on the right is "our leader good, your leader evil, shut up I'm not listening to you".
The federal government needs to invest in converting to sustainable power gen. The government needs to invest in electric car infrastructure.
Like, from what everyone is saying, it seems to me that the plant closures in Ottawa are what we actually want. What good does it do to stop oil production in Alberta if everyone is still driving ICE cars or burning heating oil/natural gas in their homes, or power is generated using fossil fuels.
Like, Alberta needs to move away from coal power, but are they the only ones? Why is the solution for Alberta to destroy it's primary economic pillar while everyone else just...what? What is the responsibility here?
I would own an electric car if I could, but the nearest charging station is a 9 hour drive away from me.
Almost, yeah
Coal makes up 8.6% of Canada’s electricity generation.
Share of provincial electricity supply from coal:
Nova Scotia: 47.9%
Saskatchewan: 46.6%
Alberta: 44.9%
New Brunswick: 15.8%
Manitoba: 0.1%
Natural gas makes up 8.6% of Canada’s electricity generation.
Share of provincial electricity supply from nuclear power:
Alberta: 42.2%
Saskatchewan: 35.7%
Nova Scotia: 14.3%
New Brunswick: 9.9%
Ontario: 5.2%
Northwest Territories: 4.0%
Yukon: 2.0%
British Columbia: 1.1%
Newfoundland and Labrador: 0.7%
It's Alberta, Saskatchewan and Nova Scotia
That's not really fair. We don't have the options for Hydro out here in flatland.
That being said i wish they would go hard on Nuclear.
Probably pretty good potential for wind and solar though. Also, the Site C dam we're building in BC is pretty close to Alberta. I'm sure we could sell some power east.
That would be great but the politics of it would be a very very hard sell...
We'll put power lines up over the pipeline. What could possibly go wrong?
The federal government needs to invest in converting to sustainable power gen. The government needs to invest in electric car infrastructure.
Like, from what everyone is saying, it seems to me that the plant closures in Ottawa are what we actually want. What good does it do to stop oil production in Alberta if everyone is still driving ICE cars or burning heating oil/natural gas in their homes, or power is generated using fossil fuels.
Like, Alberta needs to move away from coal power, but are they the only ones? Why is the solution for Alberta to destroy it's primary economic pillar while everyone else just...what? What is the responsibility here?
I would own an electric car if I could, but the nearest charging station is a 9 hour drive away from me.
Almost, yeah
Coal makes up 8.6% of Canada’s electricity generation.
Share of provincial electricity supply from coal:
Nova Scotia: 47.9%
Saskatchewan: 46.6%
Alberta: 44.9%
New Brunswick: 15.8%
Manitoba: 0.1%
Natural gas makes up 8.6% of Canada’s electricity generation.
Share of provincial electricity supply from nuclear power:
Alberta: 42.2%
Saskatchewan: 35.7%
Nova Scotia: 14.3%
New Brunswick: 9.9%
Ontario: 5.2%
Northwest Territories: 4.0%
Yukon: 2.0%
British Columbia: 1.1%
Newfoundland and Labrador: 0.7%
It's Alberta, Saskatchewan and Nova Scotia
That's not really fair. We don't have the options for Hydro out here in flatland.
That being said i wish they would go hard on Nuclear.
Probably pretty good potential for wind and solar though. Also, the Site C dam we're building in BC is pretty close to Alberta. I'm sure we could sell some power east.
That would be great but the politics of it would be a very very hard sell...
We'll put power lines up over the pipeline. What could possibly go wrong?
My dad is another left-leaning centrist who was really riled up about the Trudeau SNC-Lavalin thing. As a former chem eng, he'd had dealings with SNC-Lavalin back into the 70s, and repeatedly cited instances of them being corrupt, so for him it was a really bad look trying to go to bat for them in any capacity over more corruption charges.
Personally as someone who is a dedicated leftist that held my nose and voted for the Liberals (fruitlessly, since I live in a rural nightmare riding), even I thought it was handled in a completely incompetent fashion. Interestingly I do think it makes a case for having an Attorney General separate from the government role to avoid these sorts of conflicts of interest.
I'm not sure I am on board Canada playing by the lawful good Playbook while everyone else doesn't.
Maybe someone should run on "we'll do the least corrupt stuff possible while still helping the most Canadians"
Obviously it's a personal worldview but I legitimately don't think it's possible to survive / run a government without the flexibility of doing shady shit. Not in our world, not in 2019.
I'm not sure I am on board Canada playing by the lawful good Playbook while everyone else doesn't.
Maybe someone should run on "we'll do the least corrupt stuff possible while still helping the most Canadians"
Obviously it's a personal worldview but I legitimately don't think it's possible to survive / run a government without the flexibility of doing shady shit. Not in our world, not in 2019.
Thing is, once you normalize corruption, you don't really get to pick and choose what ends up adapting to the culture of corruption.
Nobody wins when you have no idea when the bridges collapse or whatever.
I'm not sure I am on board Canada playing by the lawful good Playbook while everyone else doesn't.
Maybe someone should run on "we'll do the least corrupt stuff possible while still helping the most Canadians"
Obviously it's a personal worldview but I legitimately don't think it's possible to survive / run a government without the flexibility of doing shady shit. Not in our world, not in 2019.
Considering that Trudeau didn’t actually intervene or even attempt to do so, and simply kept pressure on Justice that they consider all possible options and him apprised of the case, I have a hard time calling that corruption at all.
It definitely has the appearance of possible corruption, which is what the ethnic laws attempt to prevent. So I am okay with Trudeau taking a hit in public opinion for breaching them, but to call it corruption and law breaking and act like its the worst thing ever requires either some willful misdirection or being influenced by those that are attempting to willfully represent the issue in the worst possible light.
Wilson-Rose was legally in the right but morally in the wrong in trying to screw over thousands of innocent Quebec employees of SNC Lavalin over the leaders' corruption.
Trudeau was legally in the wrong but morally in the right to pressure her to not be an idiot and to instead use the much more reasonable legal tools available to all G7 nations.
Wilson-Rose was again legally in the right but morally in the wrong to blow up publically and smear the Liberals and very nearly succeed in handing the nation over to Scheer's alt-right fanatics out of pure spite.
Scheer and the CPC were legally in the right but morally in the wrong to misreprensent completely the SNC Lavalin issue to the media and voters in order to score points on the back of Quebec.
The MSM were legally in the right but morally in the wrong not to investigate and report the facts and instead report the CPC propaganda unchallenged.
So, if you want to argue about who was right legally, Trudeau is the only bad guy. If you want to argue about who was right morally and actually acted for the benefit of our nation, Trudeau is the only good guy.
Yeah what's the harm of a little corruption, as long as it's our kind of corruption?
really
When you consider what actually happened, it's probably the least corrupt any government's been in a while. I'd say probably at least as far back as Joe Clark's, and that's only because they weren't in power for very long.
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ArcticLancerBest served chilled.Registered Userregular
I may be wrong, but I took that comment as response to the suggestion Canada shouldn't "lose" the prisoner's dilemma, not in response to the SNC handling?
Trudeau handled it pretty incompetently and it definitely annoyed me on how chummy the liberals are with respect to the big corporations, so I definitely don't like how he handled it. He definitely deserved being bumped down to a minority over it. It was less about the details (there is an argument to be made that maybe Trudeau was just over-zealous in protecting Quebec jobs, which I think it believable), and more about how it just revealed Trudeau to just be another politician that, if not in the pockets of a big corporation, was far more willing to go to bat for them than he is over more progressive policies. Don't get me wrong, I'm not voting for the Conservatives, who are outright bought and paid for, but it still disappointed me.
Trudeau handled it pretty incompetently and it definitely annoyed me on how chummy the liberals are with respect to the big corporations, so I definitely don't like how he handled it. He definitely deserved being bumped down to a minority over it. It was less about the details (there is an argument to be made that maybe Trudeau was just over-zealous in protecting Quebec jobs, which I think it believable), and more about how it just revealed Trudeau to just be another politician that, if not in the pockets of a big corporation, was far more willing to go to bat for them than he is over more progressive policies. Don't get me wrong, I'm not voting for the Conservatives, who are outright bought and paid for, but it still disappointed me.
Eh. The whole affair strikes me as being less about getting chummy with big business and more about doing anything to keep jobs in the country.
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daveNYCWhy universe hate Waspinator?Registered Userregular
Seems like SNC Lavalin is the construction industry equivalent of Too Big To Fail. Seems like they know it too. Good luck with that.
Shut up, Mr. Burton! You were not brought upon this world to get it!
Seems like SNC Lavalin is the construction industry equivalent of Too Big To Fail. Seems like they know it too. Good luck with that.
It's the construction equivalent of the oil industry, only less corrupt and destructive, and more accountable.
I can't find the list of the other two Canadian companies that the World Bank won't deal with because they're too dirty, they could be oil companies, but Lavalin seems to be miles ahead in the dirt game.
Seems like SNC Lavalin is the construction industry equivalent of Too Big To Fail. Seems like they know it too. Good luck with that.
It's the construction equivalent of the oil industry, only less corrupt and destructive, and more accountable.
I can't find the list of the other two Canadian companies that the World Bank won't deal with because they're too dirty, they could be oil companies, but Lavalin seems to be miles ahead in the dirt game.
Of the more than 600 companies now listed as barred from doing business with the World Bank over corruption, 117 are Canadian, the most of any one country. And of those, 115 represent SNC-Lavalin and its subsidiaries, the Financial Post reports.
Actually, pretty much all of those companies ARE SNC, not oil companies. The list is basically SNC all the way down...
Id like to congratulate the Alberta UCP party for pissing off a huge chunk of Alberta Public Servants, Unions, Students, Cities etc etc. Not that it will change how this province votes...
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DaimarA Million Feet Tall of AwesomeRegistered Userregular
Hey, Quebec found a way to get the values test back in for new citizens, or was it never gone and it just got hushed up until after the Federal election?
Hey, Quebec found a way to get the values test back in for new citizens, or was it never gone and it just got hushed up until after the Federal election?
The CAQ never stopped, it just took them a while to find where they could be xenophobic. That, or they were hoping for a Conservative government who would happily add that test as a requirement for permanent residency.
Since the Liberals are unlikely to do that, the CAQ is moving the test to the part of the process they control.
Hopefully, they will forget to use the notwithstanding clause this time.
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HerrCronIt that wickedly supports taxationRegistered Userregular
So fuckin' glad i got my PR before this shit kicked in, and so fuckin' livid on behalf of anyone coming after me who has to deal with this shit.
It already takes forever and a day for the CSQ process to finish as it stands, heaping this kind of horseshit on top isn't helping.
Corporate corruption should target management, not the company itself. The janitor didn't do anything wrong, but they'll be just as unemployed.
And honestly, in most cases, the janitors are the only ones that end up unemployed, which is a huge problem.
Western society has a massive problem figuring out how to hold corporations accountable. In law school we spent a bit of time studying and discussing corporate criminal liability. The problem with making top level management personally accountable criminally for the acts of the corporation is that there's a good chance they don't really know what's going on under them. OK so we say that it doesn't matter, and that they should still be responsible, but the end result is that corporations will just hire someone to literally be the fall guy in case corruption happens, and nothing changes.
Once corporations become big enough (and it doesn't even have to be that big to be honest), they will start doing everything possible to maximize value for shareholders, legal, corrupt or not. Hell look at Volkswagen. One of the biggest car companies in the world, huge reputation, spent years illegally putting carbon cheat devices in their vehicles. And it turns out other auto-manufacturers are doing it too. At some point the businesses figure that maximizing value for shareholders is more important than legalities and ethics, and they'll even figure out how corrupt/illegal they can act before it becomes unprofitable.
I think none of this will change as long as we're happy letting the shareholders and stock markets exist the way they do. Personally I think the way to do this is to remove the incentive to maximize profits. I don't know enough about economics to figure out how to do that. Maybe a dividend cap? I don't know, but right now the drive of every for-profit corporation is to show they were more profitable this quarter than they were last quarter, no matter what they had to do to get there. Until that changes, nothing else will.
I think none of this will change as long as we're happy letting the shareholders and stock markets exist the way they do. Personally I think the way to do this is to remove the incentive to maximize profits. I don't know enough about economics to figure out how to do that. Maybe a dividend cap? I don't know, but right now the drive of every for-profit corporation is to show they were more profitable this quarter than they were last quarter, no matter what they had to do to get there. Until that changes, nothing else will.
Realistically one part of the solution is regulations and penalties that have enough consequence to actually deter a company from behaving badly. If the fine is so low that it is seen as a cost of doing business then the activities won't stop. But corporations have spent piles of money lobbying all over the world for less regulation and at this point anyone trying to put some regulations in place, or back in place is going to be fighting a tremendous uphill battle that really needs the support of the majority of the public to have any hope of getting through and staying in place. With how polarized people are between the parties you can bet that anyone who backs the conservatives will not support this unless there is some really blatant corporate crimes that affect them personally before they tell the cons to F off with their platform of less and less regulation.
+1
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daveNYCWhy universe hate Waspinator?Registered Userregular
You need the ability to lay on a variety of penalties, including jail time and financial penalties heavy enough to actually make an impact. Fines large enough to effectively nationalize the company would also be useful because sometimes you might need to go in and completely clean house. Shareholders get zeroed out, the government cleans house and caretakers the company for a year or two, then takes it public. You also need serious whistleblower protections, including fat cash payouts for whistleblowers.
Shut up, Mr. Burton! You were not brought upon this world to get it!
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I generally approve of the idea of staying on fossil fuels until we can wean ourselves off of them and onto renewable energy sources, but it seems like everyone's so hyperfocused on the first part of that equation that no one's giving a shit about step two.
Like we don't have 30 or 40 or 50 years to gradually make the shift anymore. Shit we've been talking about renewable energy since I was in grade school and I'm almost 40 now. We're switching off of fossil fuels TOO FUCKING SLOWLY AS IT IS.
I don't think people realize how much of a cult oil is here.
Hell, the UCP and our magnificent premier Kenny just announced cut's to retraining programs, tech grants and has doubled the amount of grants for trades such as electrician and gas fitters.... That are super saturated as it is. Both trades cannot find work and the outlook for the next few years is even more dire but OIL OIL OIL will be back any day I'm sure
The federal government needs to invest in converting to sustainable power gen. The government needs to invest in electric car infrastructure.
Like, from what everyone is saying, it seems to me that the plant closures in Ottawa are what we actually want. What good does it do to stop oil production in Alberta if everyone is still driving ICE cars or burning heating oil/natural gas in their homes, or power is generated using fossil fuels.
Like, Alberta needs to move away from coal power, but are they the only ones? Why is the solution for Alberta to destroy it's primary economic pillar while everyone else just...what? What is the responsibility here?
I would own an electric car if I could, but the nearest charging station is a 9 hour drive away from me.
Almost, yeah
It's Alberta, Saskatchewan and Nova Scotia
That's not really fair. We don't have the options for Hydro out here in flatland.
That being said i wish they would go hard on Nuclear.
Saskatchewan might have that excuse, Alberta doesn't, they estimate 11.5GW of untapped hydro power (http://www.history.alberta.ca/energyheritage/energy/hydro-power/hydroelectricity-in-alberta-today.aspx) which would cover about 80% of the province's electricity needs
The other point the family seemed to get stuck on was saying that Trudeau was going to bankrupt this country. Now so far the pipeline thing seems to be a very possible lost cause/waste of money but other than that, is the Trudeau government doing that bad financially?
My Father-in-Law was a fairly high up public sector employee until he retired recently and apparently he hated Harper for what Harper did to the public sector but this is pretty much the most worked up I've ever seen him get and I was curious if there was any truth to it.
SteamID: edgruberman GOG Galaxy: EdGruberman
Probably pretty good potential for wind and solar though. Also, the Site C dam we're building in BC is pretty close to Alberta. I'm sure we could sell some power east.
very good potential for solar, of course folks immediately get all Nimby in regards to solar farms.
The ethics commissioner concluded that Trudeau violated the Conflict of Interest act. So, yeah, technically he broke the law. I don't think there's any real consequences laid out, though? It's not a criminal violation. More like guidelines. /Barbossa
Anyway, how bad it is, is up to you. I think Trudeau was an idiot in how it was handled, both before and after it was made public, but I don't have a problem with the sentiment behind it. The CPC has pushed a shit ton of propaganda about it, though, which has become the common narrative. The important thing about the propaganda is he was NOT trying to get them 'off' as they say. The executives who did the bribes are facing individual charges and some have been convicted already. The thing Trudeau wanted to do is how every other G7 nation handles corporate corruption, all of whom are better at handling it than Canada is (We have the worst corporate corruption record in the G7). Wilson-Raybould was within her rights to refuse, and Trudeau probably should have dropped it, but, like I said, he's an idiot.
The Liberals should have better controlled the messaging once it broke, but the Liberals are apparently also idiots and they were happy to let the CPC have complete and total control over the media narrative. So it's a huge mess, and will never not be a huge mess because what people think is not the truth, but a version the CPC wants people to think.
Anyway.
Regarding breaking Canada, Trudeau's deficit is a fraction of what Harper's was, so if Trudeau's a threat to Canadian solvency, then Harper was the fucking apocalypse.
The last gen wind farms in southern Alberta have all been slowly closing as they are generally not viable with the high wear on the towers but some new projects were anounced in the last year.
I think solar/wind farms are pimp. Makes me feel like I'm actually living in the future.
That would be great but the politics of it would be a very very hard sell...
We'll put power lines up over the pipeline. What could possibly go wrong?
Stop fighting the pipeline and it's a deal
Personally as someone who is a dedicated leftist that held my nose and voted for the Liberals (fruitlessly, since I live in a rural nightmare riding), even I thought it was handled in a completely incompetent fashion. Interestingly I do think it makes a case for having an Attorney General separate from the government role to avoid these sorts of conflicts of interest.
Maybe someone should run on "we'll do the least corrupt stuff possible while still helping the most Canadians"
Obviously it's a personal worldview but I legitimately don't think it's possible to survive / run a government without the flexibility of doing shady shit. Not in our world, not in 2019.
Thing is, once you normalize corruption, you don't really get to pick and choose what ends up adapting to the culture of corruption.
Nobody wins when you have no idea when the bridges collapse or whatever.
Considering that Trudeau didn’t actually intervene or even attempt to do so, and simply kept pressure on Justice that they consider all possible options and him apprised of the case, I have a hard time calling that corruption at all.
It definitely has the appearance of possible corruption, which is what the ethnic laws attempt to prevent. So I am okay with Trudeau taking a hit in public opinion for breaching them, but to call it corruption and law breaking and act like its the worst thing ever requires either some willful misdirection or being influenced by those that are attempting to willfully represent the issue in the worst possible light.
MWO: Adamski
Trudeau was legally in the wrong but morally in the right to pressure her to not be an idiot and to instead use the much more reasonable legal tools available to all G7 nations.
Wilson-Rose was again legally in the right but morally in the wrong to blow up publically and smear the Liberals and very nearly succeed in handing the nation over to Scheer's alt-right fanatics out of pure spite.
Scheer and the CPC were legally in the right but morally in the wrong to misreprensent completely the SNC Lavalin issue to the media and voters in order to score points on the back of Quebec.
The MSM were legally in the right but morally in the wrong not to investigate and report the facts and instead report the CPC propaganda unchallenged.
So, if you want to argue about who was right legally, Trudeau is the only bad guy. If you want to argue about who was right morally and actually acted for the benefit of our nation, Trudeau is the only good guy.
really
When you consider what actually happened, it's probably the least corrupt any government's been in a while. I'd say probably at least as far back as Joe Clark's, and that's only because they weren't in power for very long.
Perhaps I can interest you in my meager selection of pins?
Eh. The whole affair strikes me as being less about getting chummy with big business and more about doing anything to keep jobs in the country.
It's the construction equivalent of the oil industry, only less corrupt and destructive, and more accountable.
I can't find the list of the other two Canadian companies that the World Bank won't deal with because they're too dirty, they could be oil companies, but Lavalin seems to be miles ahead in the dirt game.
https://www.globalresearch.ca/canadas-corrupt-corporations-world-banks-corrupt-companies-blacklist-dominated-by-canada/5422924
Actually, pretty much all of those companies ARE SNC, not oil companies. The list is basically SNC all the way down...
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/quebec-values-test-immigration-1.5340652
The CAQ never stopped, it just took them a while to find where they could be xenophobic. That, or they were hoping for a Conservative government who would happily add that test as a requirement for permanent residency.
Since the Liberals are unlikely to do that, the CAQ is moving the test to the part of the process they control.
Hopefully, they will forget to use the notwithstanding clause this time.
It already takes forever and a day for the CSQ process to finish as it stands, heaping this kind of horseshit on top isn't helping.
And honestly, in most cases, the janitors are the only ones that end up unemployed, which is a huge problem.
Western society has a massive problem figuring out how to hold corporations accountable. In law school we spent a bit of time studying and discussing corporate criminal liability. The problem with making top level management personally accountable criminally for the acts of the corporation is that there's a good chance they don't really know what's going on under them. OK so we say that it doesn't matter, and that they should still be responsible, but the end result is that corporations will just hire someone to literally be the fall guy in case corruption happens, and nothing changes.
Once corporations become big enough (and it doesn't even have to be that big to be honest), they will start doing everything possible to maximize value for shareholders, legal, corrupt or not. Hell look at Volkswagen. One of the biggest car companies in the world, huge reputation, spent years illegally putting carbon cheat devices in their vehicles. And it turns out other auto-manufacturers are doing it too. At some point the businesses figure that maximizing value for shareholders is more important than legalities and ethics, and they'll even figure out how corrupt/illegal they can act before it becomes unprofitable.
I think none of this will change as long as we're happy letting the shareholders and stock markets exist the way they do. Personally I think the way to do this is to remove the incentive to maximize profits. I don't know enough about economics to figure out how to do that. Maybe a dividend cap? I don't know, but right now the drive of every for-profit corporation is to show they were more profitable this quarter than they were last quarter, no matter what they had to do to get there. Until that changes, nothing else will.
And thinking Sheer would not have bent himself in a pretzel to save the equivalent jobs at let's say..... Suncor is so hypocritical of the CPC.
Realistically one part of the solution is regulations and penalties that have enough consequence to actually deter a company from behaving badly. If the fine is so low that it is seen as a cost of doing business then the activities won't stop. But corporations have spent piles of money lobbying all over the world for less regulation and at this point anyone trying to put some regulations in place, or back in place is going to be fighting a tremendous uphill battle that really needs the support of the majority of the public to have any hope of getting through and staying in place. With how polarized people are between the parties you can bet that anyone who backs the conservatives will not support this unless there is some really blatant corporate crimes that affect them personally before they tell the cons to F off with their platform of less and less regulation.