The reality is we're all flawed humans who may or may not see the error of their ways and either correct them or carry on being bigoted blowhards.
Cherry clearly did not see any error in his ways and is ergo without work.
I encourage us to see the error of continuing this line of discussion and focus on Mr. Trudeau slapping Mr. Sheer in the face with his 'nuh uh, we're starting December 5th not November 25th like you are going to demand later this morning...' because this is a Canadian politics thread.
So yeah, awful people can do some good things. It doesn't mean they weren't awful, it doesn't excuse what they did, and it doesn't "balance out"
Nobody said this. You can all stop trying to prove a point that nobody here disagrees with.
Bringing it up is clearly an attempt to mitigate or "balance out" what he's said.
Not really. It's just an attempt to ad some nuance to the picture. He wasn't a fucking supervillain who did only stupid racist things all day every day. These things aren't balanced one against the other like a ledger, they are just part of a whole. He's done some good things, he's done a lot of shitty things, he deserved to be fired ages ago for the shitty things. One does not need to sum this all up into a single integer and see if he comes out positive or negative.
So yeah, awful people can do some good things. It doesn't mean they weren't awful, it doesn't excuse what they did, and it doesn't "balance out"
Nobody said this. You can all stop trying to prove a point that nobody here disagrees with.
Bringing it up is clearly an attempt to mitigate or "balance out" what he's said.
Not really. It's just an attempt to ad some nuance to the picture. He wasn't a fucking supervillain who did only stupid racist things all day every day. These things aren't balanced one against the other like a ledger, they are just part of a whole. He's done some good things, he's done a lot of shitty things, he deserved to be fired ages ago for the shitty things. One does not need to sum this all up into a single integer and see if he comes out positive or negative.
Why, exactly, does "Don Cherry is a xenophobic bigot whose sell by date is several decades old at this point" need nuance?
So yeah, awful people can do some good things. It doesn't mean they weren't awful, it doesn't excuse what they did, and it doesn't "balance out"
Nobody said this. You can all stop trying to prove a point that nobody here disagrees with.
Bringing it up is clearly an attempt to mitigate or "balance out" what he's said.
I think its probably more of an attempt to balance out the statements that are more along the lines of "he's an unredeemable piece of shit" rather than balance out what he said. Yeah, he has some shitty opinions. But he's also not some gremlin that only lives of the tears of suffering. Treating people you strongly disagree with as inhuman tends to make things worse, not better.
So yeah, awful people can do some good things. It doesn't mean they weren't awful, it doesn't excuse what they did, and it doesn't "balance out"
Nobody said this. You can all stop trying to prove a point that nobody here disagrees with.
Bringing it up is clearly an attempt to mitigate or "balance out" what he's said.
Not really. It's just an attempt to ad some nuance to the picture. He wasn't a fucking supervillain who did only stupid racist things all day every day. These things aren't balanced one against the other like a ledger, they are just part of a whole. He's done some good things, he's done a lot of shitty things, he deserved to be fired ages ago for the shitty things. One does not need to sum this all up into a single integer and see if he comes out positive or negative.
Why, exactly, does "Don Cherry is a xenophobic bigot whose sell by date is several decades old at this point" need nuance?
It's not something needed, it's just something that is. It exists. These are the things he has done.
So yeah, awful people can do some good things. It doesn't mean they weren't awful, it doesn't excuse what they did, and it doesn't "balance out"
Nobody said this. You can all stop trying to prove a point that nobody here disagrees with.
Bringing it up is clearly an attempt to mitigate or "balance out" what he's said.
I think its probably more of an attempt to balance out the statements that are more along the lines of "he's an unredeemable piece of shit" rather than balance out what he said. Yeah, he has some shitty opinions. But he's also not some gremlin that only lives of the tears of suffering. Treating people you strongly disagree with as inhuman tends to make things worse, not better.
Calling someone a bigot is not calling them inhuman - it's pointing out that they think that other people are. And let's stop with the euphemistic language, too - people don't "strongly disagree" with Cherry - they think he's a xenophobic bigot, because he's behaved as such.
So yeah, awful people can do some good things. It doesn't mean they weren't awful, it doesn't excuse what they did, and it doesn't "balance out"
Nobody said this. You can all stop trying to prove a point that nobody here disagrees with.
Bringing it up is clearly an attempt to mitigate or "balance out" what he's said.
I think its probably more of an attempt to balance out the statements that are more along the lines of "he's an unredeemable piece of shit" rather than balance out what he said. Yeah, he has some shitty opinions. But he's also not some gremlin that only lives of the tears of suffering. Treating people you strongly disagree with as inhuman tends to make things worse, not better.
Calling someone a bigot is not calling them inhuman - it's pointing out that they think that other people are. And let's stop with the euphemistic language, too - people don't "strongly disagree" with Cherry - they think he's a xenophobic bigot, because he's behaved as such.
Unless you're saying he's a xenophobic bigot with approval, then I highly suggest that you actually do strongly disagree with him. Its not a euphemism.
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HardtargetThere Are Four LightsVancouverRegistered Userregular
So yeah, awful people can do some good things. It doesn't mean they weren't awful, it doesn't excuse what they did, and it doesn't "balance out"
Nobody said this. You can all stop trying to prove a point that nobody here disagrees with.
Bringing it up is clearly an attempt to mitigate or "balance out" what he's said.
I think its probably more of an attempt to balance out the statements that are more along the lines of "he's an unredeemable piece of shit" rather than balance out what he said. Yeah, he has some shitty opinions. But he's also not some gremlin that only lives of the tears of suffering. Treating people you strongly disagree with as inhuman tends to make things worse, not better.
Calling someone a bigot is not calling them inhuman - it's pointing out that they think that other people are. And let's stop with the euphemistic language, too - people don't "strongly disagree" with Cherry - they think he's a xenophobic bigot, because he's behaved as such.
Unless you're saying he's a xenophobic bigot with approval, then I highly suggest that you actually do strongly disagree with him. Its not a euphemism.
I'm not directly refering to the Cherie comments, since I have no idea who that is, but the term "disagreement" is used a lot by the alt-rightlight etc to re-define their bigotry as just another side of an argument, and therefore valid, as if the right for other people to exist should be up for debate.
You see it a lot when there's pushback on alt-right/light public speaking events. Lots of "why don't you want to debate?"/"just because you disagree..." stuff etc. to try and paint it as a "both sides" or "the left are the real bigots" situation.
I encourage us to see the error of continuing this line of discussion and focus on Mr. Trudeau slapping Mr. Sheer in the face with his 'nuh uh, we're starting December 5th not November 25th like you are going to demand later this morning...' because this is a Canadian politics thread.
Of course they're declaring the Liberals hostile - they're harming the CPC with the fact that they exist.
They're just looking for something to start complaining about right out the gate, and going by their "see? see?!!" reaction to something this mundane it seems like they aren't going to be picky about what they nail themselves to the nearest cross over.
And you know what, Shame on Cherry for his comments, and most of all for distracting from honouring our veterans by making Remembrance Day all about himself.
And you know what, Shame on Cherry for his comments, and most of all for distracting from honouring our veterans by making Remembrance Day all about himself.
I don't really think he was trying that. He was doing the opposite really if you parse through his statement. It's all "Why aren't these foreigners honouring our veterans?".
Cherry has always been just like a dumb thoughtless racist. He's like the epitome of a certain kind of person I'm sure we're all aware of, that sort of person with a lot of vague prejudices who just kinda thinks of themselves as a "honest straight talker" who "just likes good old fashioned Canadian things". And that's a big source of his connection to the audience that has kept him from getting thrown out on his ass for years now.
It's nice some comment finally landed him in hot enough water he's been thrown out but I really think this would have gone nowhere if Rogers hadn't been looking for a reason to can his ass.
And you know what, Shame on Cherry for his comments, and most of all for distracting from honouring our veterans by making Remembrance Day all about himself.
I don't really think he was trying that. He was doing the opposite really if you parse through his statement. It's all "Why aren't these foreigners honouring our veterans?".
Cherry has always been just like a dumb thoughtless racist. He's like the epitome of a certain kind of person I'm sure we're all aware of, that sort of person with a lot of vague prejudices who just kinda thinks of themselves as a "honest straight talker" who "just likes good old fashioned Canadian things". And that's a big source of his connection to the audience that has kept him from getting thrown out on his ass for years now.
It's nice some comment finally landed him in hot enough water he's been thrown out but I really think this would have gone nowhere if Rogers hadn't been looking for a reason to can his ass.
From what I read, his rant about how immigrants don't respect veterans was followed by a video montage of him "respecting veterans" by taking a stroll through a war cemetary (presumably not reading the names of the immigrants on the toombstones). So it was both racism and an attempt to make Rememberance Day about himself, by making us bask in amazement at how much better he is at honouring veterans than you people.
I’ve interviewed Cherry a handful of times. I’ve hung out in airport lounges with him a handful of times. When he sees me, he tells me I’m a good Irishman. I don’t know if he actually remembers me, or is just that good at making the people around him feel welcome. They’re kind of the same thing, really.
I think he sees the world in this way, which is the same way my parents see the world. Before they can really form an opinion on someone, they need to know someone’s race, age, ethnicity, gender, sexual orientation, place of birth etc... If they don’t have that initial info they then don’t know how to properly “judge” people they meet. Note that most of these things cannot be controlled by you in any way. However, they rely on those stereotypes to gauge how people they meet “should” act or compose themselves. They need those stereotypes to box people in before they get to know them.
The author of this story can’t just be a newspaper author who you form an opinion on based on how he reports stories. He’s a “good Irishman” and then people who think like Don use the stereotypes associated with that to view him and evaluate him as a person. The guy you pass on the street isn’t just some dude you judge based on what he or she says or does, they are “some Mexican” that you have preconceived notions about and you judge them on whether or not they fulfill or fail to live up to them.
So people who have “good stereotypes” are already positioned to be treated better by him compared to people with “bad stereotypes”. Without having that initial frame of reference to box people in, people like Don can’t comprehend how you can even begin to analyze the other people around him. It probably is harder and more challenging to have to honestly evaluate other people, but I think society is realizing that we have to do that if we really want to actually live by the values we have been claiming we live by for all these years.
So he is going to continue to think we all just got mad at him for talking about poppies because he can’t see the world in any other way.
And you know what, Shame on Cherry for his comments, and most of all for distracting from honouring our veterans by making Remembrance Day all about himself.
I don't really think he was trying that. He was doing the opposite really if you parse through his statement. It's all "Why aren't these foreigners honouring our veterans?".
Cherry has always been just like a dumb thoughtless racist. He's like the epitome of a certain kind of person I'm sure we're all aware of, that sort of person with a lot of vague prejudices who just kinda thinks of themselves as a "honest straight talker" who "just likes good old fashioned Canadian things". And that's a big source of his connection to the audience that has kept him from getting thrown out on his ass for years now.
It's nice some comment finally landed him in hot enough water he's been thrown out but I really think this would have gone nowhere if Rogers hadn't been looking for a reason to can his ass.
It's kind of amazing - and depressing - how much traction someone can get out of "everything that's changed or appeared since the early 1980s is Bad And Wrong."
The country's long had this weird rose-tinted-glasses image of the Canadian Good Old Days that is different in the details from, say, the 1950s nostalgia so glamorized to the south, but it isn't any less gross once you poke at the implications of it. (If you hang around discussions of how Canadian history is or should be taught it is very obnoxiously difficult to shake that. Granatstein feels like Cherry with a doctorate, sometimes, and wow did we miss a bullet under Harper when he was talking about federal history curricula standards..)
Zibblsnrt on
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BroloBroseidonLord of the BroceanRegistered Userregular
Well my province (NB) has issued an RFP as of this afternoon to take the cannabis industry private. They are essentially licensing out the rights to whom I believe will be a sole provider. Should be interesting.
Edit: NM not a sole provider. They are licensing out the operations of the industry.
Well my province (NB) has issued an RFP as of this afternoon to take the cannabis industry private. They are essentially licensing out the rights to whom I believe will be a sole provider. Should be interesting.
Edit: NM not a sole provider. They are licensing out the operations of the industry.
So, according to my newsfeed since the election:
1. Wexit is not a handful of sore loosers with delusions of revolutionaries but a serious blow to Canadian unity.
2. The problem is not CPC/alt-right resentment mongering but Trudeau's divisive reelection campaign.
3. The solution is not to hold CPC leaders accountable for fermenting western resentment for a generation to lock in easy votes, but for Trudeau to pull off some unspecified miracle of canadian reunification.
So, according to my newsfeed since the election:
1. Wexit is not a handful of sore loosers with delusions of revolutionaries but a serious blow to Canadian unity.
2. The problem is not CPC/alt-right resentment mongering but Trudeau's divisive reelection campaign.
3. The solution is not to hold CPC leaders accountable for fermenting western resentment for a generation to lock in easy votes, but for Trudeau to pull off some unspecified miracle of canadian reunification.
Anyone else seeing this?
Its certainly the UPC/PC/Right Wing talking points and what they try to portray it as. I tend to just catch CBC radio driving to and from work during the day. I haven't listened to call in shows like cross country checkup but have caught some call in stuff and of course it is the most braindead folks calling in parroting all of the above. The rest have been economists and other folks who say yea, Alberta feels alienated but that isn't anything new, Wexit is a bad idea and those who are for it dont realize what it actually would mean. Do hear more wishy washy shit about the UPC and their role in fanning these flames.
The UCP are firing the elections commissioner who has already issued 200 000$ in fines related to Jason Kenney's illegal kamikaze leadership campaign. Because we're apparently going full Trump up here.
Yep. The UCP is, surprising no one, deeply corrupt. But it's okay, because the NDP ruined the province!
I really, really hate provincial politics in Alberta.
Yup, that record is broken as fuck. Diversify the Alberta economy so we dont get fucked over for the millionth time by oil prices ? Haha fuck that, oil is the only game in town.
Yep. The UCP is, surprising no one, deeply corrupt. But it's okay, because the NDP ruined the province!
I really, really hate provincial politics in Alberta.
Yup, that record is broken as fuck. Diversify the Alberta economy so we dont get fucked over for the millionth time by oil prices ? Haha fuck that, oil is the only game in town.
The only reason I'm still here is that I have two young children and their entire support network is here.
But given what the next four years are looking like, I am genuinely looking into options to move elsewhere. Ontario at least seems to have reacted appropriately to Doug Ford. I would be shocked if the UCP's approval ratings are anything but sky high right now.
Posts
Then why bring up Cherry's charity work? If it has no relevance to his being a xenophobic bigot, why even bring it up?
Bringing it up is clearly an attempt to mitigate or "balance out" what he's said.
Still my favorite take on the whole thing.
The reality is we're all flawed humans who may or may not see the error of their ways and either correct them or carry on being bigoted blowhards.
Cherry clearly did not see any error in his ways and is ergo without work.
I encourage us to see the error of continuing this line of discussion and focus on Mr. Trudeau slapping Mr. Sheer in the face with his 'nuh uh, we're starting December 5th not November 25th like you are going to demand later this morning...' because this is a Canadian politics thread.
Not really. It's just an attempt to ad some nuance to the picture. He wasn't a fucking supervillain who did only stupid racist things all day every day. These things aren't balanced one against the other like a ledger, they are just part of a whole. He's done some good things, he's done a lot of shitty things, he deserved to be fired ages ago for the shitty things. One does not need to sum this all up into a single integer and see if he comes out positive or negative.
Why, exactly, does "Don Cherry is a xenophobic bigot whose sell by date is several decades old at this point" need nuance?
I think its probably more of an attempt to balance out the statements that are more along the lines of "he's an unredeemable piece of shit" rather than balance out what he said. Yeah, he has some shitty opinions. But he's also not some gremlin that only lives of the tears of suffering. Treating people you strongly disagree with as inhuman tends to make things worse, not better.
It's not something needed, it's just something that is. It exists. These are the things he has done.
Calling someone a bigot is not calling them inhuman - it's pointing out that they think that other people are. And let's stop with the euphemistic language, too - people don't "strongly disagree" with Cherry - they think he's a xenophobic bigot, because he's behaved as such.
Unless you're saying he's a xenophobic bigot with approval, then I highly suggest that you actually do strongly disagree with him. Its not a euphemism.
oh man that's good.
also
https://www.thebeaverton.com/2019/11/scheer-if-you-wanted-to-know-my-real-views-on-homosexuality-you-shouldve-made-me-prime-minister/
Beaverton has been firing on all cylinders for months now
I'm not directly refering to the Cherie comments, since I have no idea who that is, but the term "disagreement" is used a lot by the alt-rightlight etc to re-define their bigotry as just another side of an argument, and therefore valid, as if the right for other people to exist should be up for debate.
You see it a lot when there's pushback on alt-right/light public speaking events. Lots of "why don't you want to debate?"/"just because you disagree..." stuff etc. to try and paint it as a "both sides" or "the left are the real bigots" situation.
It’s not a very important country most of the time
http://steamcommunity.com/id/mortious
What Phisti was referring to
Scheers Call to have Parliament reconvene on Nov 25th
https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/scheer-parliament-recall-november-25-1.5355681
Trudeau said the later date was chosen because it falls after the NATO summit Dec. 3-4 in London.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/parliament-liberal-minority-government-1.5356244
Of course the Cons aren't happy with that and declare the Liberals hostile.
New Liberal Cabinet is sworn in on November 20th.
They're just looking for something to start complaining about right out the gate, and going by their "see? see?!!" reaction to something this mundane it seems like they aren't going to be picky about what they nail themselves to the nearest cross over.
I don't really think he was trying that. He was doing the opposite really if you parse through his statement. It's all "Why aren't these foreigners honouring our veterans?".
Cherry has always been just like a dumb thoughtless racist. He's like the epitome of a certain kind of person I'm sure we're all aware of, that sort of person with a lot of vague prejudices who just kinda thinks of themselves as a "honest straight talker" who "just likes good old fashioned Canadian things". And that's a big source of his connection to the audience that has kept him from getting thrown out on his ass for years now.
It's nice some comment finally landed him in hot enough water he's been thrown out but I really think this would have gone nowhere if Rogers hadn't been looking for a reason to can his ass.
From what I read, his rant about how immigrants don't respect veterans was followed by a video montage of him "respecting veterans" by taking a stroll through a war cemetary (presumably not reading the names of the immigrants on the toombstones). So it was both racism and an attempt to make Rememberance Day about himself, by making us bask in amazement at how much better he is at honouring veterans than you people.
I think he sees the world in this way, which is the same way my parents see the world. Before they can really form an opinion on someone, they need to know someone’s race, age, ethnicity, gender, sexual orientation, place of birth etc... If they don’t have that initial info they then don’t know how to properly “judge” people they meet. Note that most of these things cannot be controlled by you in any way. However, they rely on those stereotypes to gauge how people they meet “should” act or compose themselves. They need those stereotypes to box people in before they get to know them.
The author of this story can’t just be a newspaper author who you form an opinion on based on how he reports stories. He’s a “good Irishman” and then people who think like Don use the stereotypes associated with that to view him and evaluate him as a person. The guy you pass on the street isn’t just some dude you judge based on what he or she says or does, they are “some Mexican” that you have preconceived notions about and you judge them on whether or not they fulfill or fail to live up to them.
So people who have “good stereotypes” are already positioned to be treated better by him compared to people with “bad stereotypes”. Without having that initial frame of reference to box people in, people like Don can’t comprehend how you can even begin to analyze the other people around him. It probably is harder and more challenging to have to honestly evaluate other people, but I think society is realizing that we have to do that if we really want to actually live by the values we have been claiming we live by for all these years.
So he is going to continue to think we all just got mad at him for talking about poppies because he can’t see the world in any other way.
I have 549 Rock Band Drum and 305 Pro Drum FC's
REFS REFS REFS REFS REFS REFS REFS REFS
It's kind of amazing - and depressing - how much traction someone can get out of "everything that's changed or appeared since the early 1980s is Bad And Wrong."
The country's long had this weird rose-tinted-glasses image of the Canadian Good Old Days that is different in the details from, say, the 1950s nostalgia so glamorized to the south, but it isn't any less gross once you poke at the implications of it. (If you hang around discussions of how Canadian history is or should be taught it is very obnoxiously difficult to shake that. Granatstein feels like Cherry with a doctorate, sometimes, and wow did we miss a bullet under Harper when he was talking about federal history curricula standards..)
WoW
Dear Satan.....
WoW
Dear Satan.....
This won me 20$ !!!
I bet my very conservative friend that he would appear on either fox or the Rebel inside of 5 days.
Thanks for proving what I always thought about you Don!
Don Cherry passes Fox News job interview
I never finish anyth
Does that mean that Fabricland is hiring their workers back?
https://www.vancourier.com/pass-it-to-bulis/millennials-killed-coach-s-corner-1.24004135
They used to say cockroaches would survive a nuclear winter, we better get millenials on that.
Edit: NM not a sole provider. They are licensing out the operations of the industry.
All I hear in my head is the Irvings:
1. Wexit is not a handful of sore loosers with delusions of revolutionaries but a serious blow to Canadian unity.
2. The problem is not CPC/alt-right resentment mongering but Trudeau's divisive reelection campaign.
3. The solution is not to hold CPC leaders accountable for fermenting western resentment for a generation to lock in easy votes, but for Trudeau to pull off some unspecified miracle of canadian reunification.
Anyone else seeing this?
Its certainly the UPC/PC/Right Wing talking points and what they try to portray it as. I tend to just catch CBC radio driving to and from work during the day. I haven't listened to call in shows like cross country checkup but have caught some call in stuff and of course it is the most braindead folks calling in parroting all of the above. The rest have been economists and other folks who say yea, Alberta feels alienated but that isn't anything new, Wexit is a bad idea and those who are for it dont realize what it actually would mean. Do hear more wishy washy shit about the UPC and their role in fanning these flames.
Oh. Oh no.
The UCP are firing the elections commissioner who has already issued 200 000$ in fines related to Jason Kenney's illegal kamikaze leadership campaign. Because we're apparently going full Trump up here.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/edmonton/inquiry-commissioner-steve-allan-handed-905k-sole-source-contract-to-son-s-law-firm-1.5358866
which led to this
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/edmonton/alberta-ethics-commissioner-sole-source-contract-1.5361924
and now this
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/edmonton/alberta-government-won-t-investigate-controversial-905k-sole-source-contract-1.5363861
We have investigated ourselves and found no wrong doing.
I really, really hate provincial politics in Alberta.
Yup, that record is broken as fuck. Diversify the Alberta economy so we dont get fucked over for the millionth time by oil prices ? Haha fuck that, oil is the only game in town.
The only reason I'm still here is that I have two young children and their entire support network is here.
But given what the next four years are looking like, I am genuinely looking into options to move elsewhere. Ontario at least seems to have reacted appropriately to Doug Ford. I would be shocked if the UCP's approval ratings are anything but sky high right now.