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[BATTLETECH/MechWarrior] Sea Fox merchants buy PGI lostech using Terra-based shell company

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Posts

  • HenroidHenroid Affiliate Streamer Centrism is Racism :3Registered User regular
    I did finally noticed some difference in weapons / grades thereof today. I never looked at 20-grade AC weapons because they're so heavy but when testing them today I finally realized they have low range on the optimal end, and it also got me to notice that LBX has better range than regular and Ultra AC. It seems a bit counter intuitive in my head.

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  • KayKay What we need... Is a little bit of PANIC.Registered User regular
    I'd say that my most useful long range mech is my 6x LB2X Rifleman.

    Super tight grouping, fast fire rates, incredible range. LBX having longer range than Ultras is counterintuitive when you consider that you only have shotgun spread ammo in MWO. In the boardgame, you pick solid or scattershot, and it has the range edge on Ultras, but Ultras do more damage.

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  • NipsNips Luxuriating in existential crisis.Registered User regular
    Henroid wrote: »
    I did finally noticed some difference in weapons / grades thereof today. I never looked at 20-grade AC weapons because they're so heavy but when testing them today I finally realized they have low range on the optimal end, and it also got me to notice that LBX has better range than regular and Ultra AC. It seems a bit counter intuitive in my head.

    Welcome to the "The original designers had no idea how actual ballistic weapons functioned" club!

    Here's your tinfoil hat, and the schematics to make more pancake-shaped munitions.

    JXUBxMxP0QndjQUEnTwTxOkfKmx8kWNvuc-FUtbSz_23_DAhGKe7W9spFKLXAtkpTBqM8Dt6kQrv-rS69Hi3FheL3fays2xTeVUvWR7g5UyLHnFA0frGk1BC12GYdOSRn9lbaJB-uH0htiLPJMrc9cSRsIgk5Dx7jg9K8rJVfG43lkeAWxTgcolNscW9KO2UZjKT8GMbYAFgFvu2TaMoLH8LBA5p2pm6VNYRsQK3QGjCsze1TOv2yIbCazmDwCHmjiQxNDf6LHP35msyiXo3CxuWs9Y8DQvJjvj10kWaspRNlWHKjS5w9Y0KLuIkhQKOxgaDziG290v4zBmTi-i7OfDz-foqIqKzC9wTbn9i_uU87GRitmrNAJdzRRsaTW5VQu_XX_5gCN8XCoNyu5RWWVGTsjJuyezz1_NpFa903Uj2TnFqnL1wJ-RZiFAAd2Bdut-G1pdQtdQihsq2dx_BjtmtGC3KZRyylO1t2c12dhfb0rStq4v8pg46ciOcdtT_1qm85IgUmGd7AmgLxCFPb0xnxWZvr26G-oXSqrQdjKA1zNIInSowiHcbUO2O8S5LRJVR6vQiEg0fbGXw4vqJYEn917tnzHMh8r0xom8BLKMvoFDelk6wbEeNq8w8Eyu2ouGjEMIvvJcb2az2AKQ1uE_7gdatfKG2QdvfdSBRSc35MQ=w498-h80-no
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  • HenroidHenroid Affiliate Streamer Centrism is Racism :3Registered User regular
    Nips wrote: »
    Henroid wrote: »
    I did finally noticed some difference in weapons / grades thereof today. I never looked at 20-grade AC weapons because they're so heavy but when testing them today I finally realized they have low range on the optimal end, and it also got me to notice that LBX has better range than regular and Ultra AC. It seems a bit counter intuitive in my head.

    Welcome to the "The original designers had no idea how actual ballistic weapons functioned" club!

    Here's your tinfoil hat, and the schematics to make more pancake-shaped munitions.
    ... What the hell this is amazing.

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  • NobodyNobody Registered User regular
    IS Assaults for QP:

    Cyclops Sleipner is a staple if you have the MC for it. I have two but I know people who have a lot more.

    Fafnir 5 or 5B. It’s a giant CT but ECM keeps you alive a lot longer.

    Corsair 7A. Like RACs? Hate missiles? This is the mech for you.

    Most of the other assaults are slow enough where you will get out-nascared, but that can be survivable with good positioning.

  • HenroidHenroid Affiliate Streamer Centrism is Racism :3Registered User regular
    What's the base time for NARC beacons and does a +15 on increased duration traits mean 15 seconds?

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  • ErlkönigErlkönig Registered User regular
    edited January 9
    Henroid wrote: »
    What's the base time for NARC beacons and does a +15 on increased duration traits mean 15 seconds?

    I want to say 45 seconds is the base time. But do note that the NARC will also be knocked off when sufficient damage is dealt.

    Erlkönig on
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  • HenroidHenroid Affiliate Streamer Centrism is Racism :3Registered User regular
    Erlkönig wrote: »
    Henroid wrote: »
    What's the base time for NARC beacons and does a +15 on increased duration traits mean 15 seconds?

    I want to say 45 seconds is the base time. But do note that the NARC will also be knocked off when sufficient damage is dealt.
    Sufficient damage by missiles or any weapons?

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  • NobodyNobody Registered User regular
    edited January 9
    Just tested in testing grounds

    Base Narc is 30 seconds (both Clan and IS).

    Raven 3L (with the +15 quirk) and both narc skill nodes is 58-59 seconds (quick napkin math: (30+15)*1.3 is 58.5), so yeah, it looks like that is indeed 15 seconds.

    Sidenote, I've seen Narced assaults get absolutely dumpstered by multiple missile boats in faction play, and the beacons always seem to stay on the full duration so not sure if the damage = duration reduction is still valid.

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  • ErlkönigErlkönig Registered User regular
    By missiles.

    And looks like I may have been mistaken. Not sure if this was changed in an update...but I'm seeing that NARC beacons only last 20 seconds normally.

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  • NobodyNobody Registered User regular
    edited January 9
    Looking around I think Narc was 15 seconds initially in the beta, which was then upgraded to 20 seconds, and then stealth increased at some point to 30 seconds. https://mwo.smurfy-net.de/equipment lists it at 30 seconds (hover over the "i" for NARCs).

    The MWO wiki lists 20 seconds in one spot, and 30 in another.

    EDIT: Found it! https://mwomercs.com/forums/topic/118563-patch-notes-12223-21-may-2013/

    Looks like it was 20 at one point and then buffed to 30 before MWO left beta.

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  • NobodyNobody Registered User regular
    Summoners are incredibly tanky:
    jfgmd42eazic.jpg

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  • HenroidHenroid Affiliate Streamer Centrism is Racism :3Registered User regular
    Looks like you were close to getting that achievement and title based on surviving a match with x% health remaining.

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  • NobodyNobody Registered User regular
    Couldn't, this was a faction play match. The game had just ended when I took this screenshot.

  • HenroidHenroid Affiliate Streamer Centrism is Racism :3Registered User regular
    Alright. Let's talk MRMs.

    Question 1: Why?
    Question 2: Why wouldn't I just use SRMs?

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  • ErlkönigErlkönig Registered User regular
    Henroid wrote: »
    Alright. Let's talk MRMs.

    Question 1: Why?
    Question 2: Why wouldn't I just use SRMs?

    Answer 1: All the missiles
    Answer 2: SRM60 or SRM80 aren't a thing

    Real answer, though, they're pretty scary when you've got a mass of them and get inside a range where you're going to hit every missile in a volley.

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  • monkeykinsmonkeykins Registered User regular
    Henroid wrote: »
    Alright. Let's talk MRMs.

    Question 1: Why?
    Question 2: Why wouldn't I just use SRMs?

    I have like 80 on my Marauder. It is lots of fun to shoot.

    Hit a tad over 500 damage in the bad Firestarter Hero on Polar Highlands. Enemy did not seem to have LRM, and the enemy team made the poor decision to send a Kodiac, then a Stalker, over toward the Theta capture point. Staggered enough that neither could hit us while we dismantled the other. Was a very good match.

    BetsuniH3Knuckles
  • ErlkönigErlkönig Registered User regular
    Even though it hits my trypophobia something fierce when I look at it in the mechbay, I have a Marauder who's side torso is a big ol' MRM60 launcher. It's been a whiles since I took it out for a spin, but I think this is close to what it was:

    https://mech.nav-alpha.com/#934bd665_MAD-5D

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  • HenroidHenroid Affiliate Streamer Centrism is Racism :3Registered User regular
    I'm guess that technically speaking MRMs provide a lot of crit chance threat? They're heavy as hell though as far as missile systems go.

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  • ErlkönigErlkönig Registered User regular
    They're not all that heavy. 10t for the MRM30 is the same weight as a LRM20...plus, you get 10 more missiles! The only one that's heavier is the MRM40 at 12t...but, at that point, you're at a weight advantage because it's 8t lighter than packing in a pair of LRM20s.

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  • BetsuniBetsuni UM-R60L Talisker IVRegistered User regular
    Also IS LRMs have a minimum range while MRMs do not. So face tanking/leg humping for the win!

    On another note, I'm not going to be able to do Oosik Nights like I originally planned. Learned my dog has lung cancer this past week so I want to spend as much time with her as we have. I'll try to pop on from time to time, but no real schedule. Sorry for those of you who were waiting for me to announce the start again.

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  • NobodyNobody Registered User regular
    edited January 10
    Hmm, MRMs vs SRMs. usually for me it's a factor of quirks and number of missile hardpoints.

    For example, with Wolverines: the WVR-7K wants to run 3xASRM-6 because it has an increased range quirk and 3 missile hardpoints, but the WVR-7D only has 2 hardpoints with 10% velocity to help the MRMs spray out quicker.

    Betsuni wrote: »
    Also IS LRMs have a minimum range while MRMs do not. So face tanking/leg humping for the win!

    On another note, I'm not going to be able to do Oosik Nights like I originally planned. Learned my dog has lung cancer this past week so I want to spend as much time with her as we have. I'll try to pop on from time to time, but no real schedule. Sorry for those of you who were waiting for me to announce the start again.

    :bro:

    Nobody on
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  • MorninglordMorninglord Registered User regular
    Nobody wrote: »
    Betsuni wrote: »
    Henroid wrote: »
    Betsuni wrote: »
    Henroid wrote: »
    I'm looking around at Assault mechs to buy in MWO, specifically IS mechs since I already have 2 clan designs in that class. The Marauder 4HP is fucking hysterical; do you like rockets? THIS IS THE MECH FOR YOU.

    I found it to be super hilarious when the rockets work. Think I run mine with tons of them and MLs or MPLs I think.
    Don't encourage me to do silly shit. Because I will. <.<

    I took one of the Fafnir variants into the testing ground and holy crap, I didn't know firing double Heavy Gauss Rifles would cause so much recoil. I also didn't know their range was actually really low on the optimal end. Lethal as hell, but closing 200 meters is quite a chore.

    Hahaha, yeah I pre-ordered the Marauder II set because it was a cheap buy for a bunch of assaults. Then I had to do an Oosik build with the rocket launchers. Knowing me I'd be super tempted to buy one just for the laughs. I only have had it work once though, but it was worth it watching that armor of the enemy mech melt.

    That's why you run the ECM Fafnir. You have no idea how a huge mech sometimes will not register on people's screens since they can't target it.

    I’ve watched a stealth Atlas stroll through enemy teams and come out the other side at 100%

    That's pretty weird to me tbh since I was shooting mechs in my first game without even having figured out how to target them quickly (sometimes r wouldn't work? wasn't sure why). They're a big fat shape and my guns go where I point them.

    (PSN: Morninglord) (Steam: Morninglord) (WiiU: Morninglord22) I like to record and toss up a lot of random gaming videos here.
  • NobodyNobody Registered User regular
    Nobody wrote: »
    Betsuni wrote: »
    Henroid wrote: »
    Betsuni wrote: »
    Henroid wrote: »
    I'm looking around at Assault mechs to buy in MWO, specifically IS mechs since I already have 2 clan designs in that class. The Marauder 4HP is fucking hysterical; do you like rockets? THIS IS THE MECH FOR YOU.

    I found it to be super hilarious when the rockets work. Think I run mine with tons of them and MLs or MPLs I think.
    Don't encourage me to do silly shit. Because I will. <.<

    I took one of the Fafnir variants into the testing ground and holy crap, I didn't know firing double Heavy Gauss Rifles would cause so much recoil. I also didn't know their range was actually really low on the optimal end. Lethal as hell, but closing 200 meters is quite a chore.

    Hahaha, yeah I pre-ordered the Marauder II set because it was a cheap buy for a bunch of assaults. Then I had to do an Oosik build with the rocket launchers. Knowing me I'd be super tempted to buy one just for the laughs. I only have had it work once though, but it was worth it watching that armor of the enemy mech melt.

    That's why you run the ECM Fafnir. You have no idea how a huge mech sometimes will not register on people's screens since they can't target it.

    I’ve watched a stealth Atlas stroll through enemy teams and come out the other side at 100%

    That's pretty weird to me tbh since I was shooting mechs in my first game without even having figured out how to target them quickly (sometimes r wouldn't work? wasn't sure why). They're a big fat shape and my guns go where I point them.

    A lot of people learn "red arrow over mech means I shoot it" A mech lacking that arrow usually either means its dead or possibly a friendly. The fact that it's moving and doesn't have a green or blue arrow over it instead, well...

    Gnome-Interruptus
  • ToxTox I kill threads he/himRegistered User regular
    Nips wrote: »
    Henroid wrote: »
    I did finally noticed some difference in weapons / grades thereof today. I never looked at 20-grade AC weapons because they're so heavy but when testing them today I finally realized they have low range on the optimal end, and it also got me to notice that LBX has better range than regular and Ultra AC. It seems a bit counter intuitive in my head.

    Welcome to the "The original designers had no idea how actual ballistic weapons functioned" club!

    Here's your tinfoil hat, and the schematics to make more pancake-shaped munitions.

    I think they wrote themselves into a corner. With lasers they wanted more weight to mean more damage more heat and more range. So with cannons, they didn't want it to be exactly the same, otherwise assault 'mechs would rule because they'd be able to rock a pair of AC/20s with the long range of LRMs, as well as LLs, and LRMs themselves. Meanwhile that Shadowhawk's AC/5 is doing crap damage and crap range. AC/2s would be worthless simply because medium lasers exist.

    H3Knucklesironsizide
  • SiliconStewSiliconStew Registered User regular
    Tox wrote: »
    Nips wrote: »
    Henroid wrote: »
    I did finally noticed some difference in weapons / grades thereof today. I never looked at 20-grade AC weapons because they're so heavy but when testing them today I finally realized they have low range on the optimal end, and it also got me to notice that LBX has better range than regular and Ultra AC. It seems a bit counter intuitive in my head.

    Welcome to the "The original designers had no idea how actual ballistic weapons functioned" club!

    Here's your tinfoil hat, and the schematics to make more pancake-shaped munitions.

    I think they wrote themselves into a corner. With lasers they wanted more weight to mean more damage more heat and more range. So with cannons, they didn't want it to be exactly the same, otherwise assault 'mechs would rule because they'd be able to rock a pair of AC/20s with the long range of LRMs, as well as LLs, and LRMs themselves. Meanwhile that Shadowhawk's AC/5 is doing crap damage and crap range. AC/2s would be worthless simply because medium lasers exist.

    One way you can reconcile "bigger guns should logically have better range" is just by assuming AC accuracy goes down with increasing size. Which could be justified by saying the increasing mass of the weapon makes it harder to move to track targets. In that case, "an AC20 only goes 270m" isn't because the shell only travels that far, it's because beyond that, the ability to hit is simply too low to even bother wasting the ammo. Though this rather ignores other issues with that idea such as firing against stationary targets. But this problem with BT weapons isn't exactly unique. Lasers having a limited range at all is harder to find a logical excuse for.

    Just remember that half the people you meet are below average intelligence.
  • MechMantisMechMantis Registered User regular
    Tox wrote: »
    Nips wrote: »
    Henroid wrote: »
    I did finally noticed some difference in weapons / grades thereof today. I never looked at 20-grade AC weapons because they're so heavy but when testing them today I finally realized they have low range on the optimal end, and it also got me to notice that LBX has better range than regular and Ultra AC. It seems a bit counter intuitive in my head.

    Welcome to the "The original designers had no idea how actual ballistic weapons functioned" club!

    Here's your tinfoil hat, and the schematics to make more pancake-shaped munitions.

    I think they wrote themselves into a corner. With lasers they wanted more weight to mean more damage more heat and more range. So with cannons, they didn't want it to be exactly the same, otherwise assault 'mechs would rule because they'd be able to rock a pair of AC/20s with the long range of LRMs, as well as LLs, and LRMs themselves. Meanwhile that Shadowhawk's AC/5 is doing crap damage and crap range. AC/2s would be worthless simply because medium lasers exist.

    One way you can reconcile "bigger guns should logically have better range" is just by assuming AC accuracy goes down with increasing size. Which could be justified by saying the increasing mass of the weapon makes it harder to move to track targets. In that case, "an AC20 only goes 270m" isn't because the shell only travels that far, it's because beyond that, the ability to hit is simply too low to even bother wasting the ammo. Though this rather ignores other issues with that idea such as firing against stationary targets. But this problem with BT weapons isn't exactly unique. Lasers having a limited range at all is harder to find a logical excuse for.

    What? No, lasers having a limited range makes infinite sense. You're dealing with attenuation, diffusion, the inverse-square law...

    dkj3oHf.jpg
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  • SiliconStewSiliconStew Registered User regular
    MechMantis wrote: »
    Tox wrote: »
    Nips wrote: »
    Henroid wrote: »
    I did finally noticed some difference in weapons / grades thereof today. I never looked at 20-grade AC weapons because they're so heavy but when testing them today I finally realized they have low range on the optimal end, and it also got me to notice that LBX has better range than regular and Ultra AC. It seems a bit counter intuitive in my head.

    Welcome to the "The original designers had no idea how actual ballistic weapons functioned" club!

    Here's your tinfoil hat, and the schematics to make more pancake-shaped munitions.

    I think they wrote themselves into a corner. With lasers they wanted more weight to mean more damage more heat and more range. So with cannons, they didn't want it to be exactly the same, otherwise assault 'mechs would rule because they'd be able to rock a pair of AC/20s with the long range of LRMs, as well as LLs, and LRMs themselves. Meanwhile that Shadowhawk's AC/5 is doing crap damage and crap range. AC/2s would be worthless simply because medium lasers exist.

    One way you can reconcile "bigger guns should logically have better range" is just by assuming AC accuracy goes down with increasing size. Which could be justified by saying the increasing mass of the weapon makes it harder to move to track targets. In that case, "an AC20 only goes 270m" isn't because the shell only travels that far, it's because beyond that, the ability to hit is simply too low to even bother wasting the ammo. Though this rather ignores other issues with that idea such as firing against stationary targets. But this problem with BT weapons isn't exactly unique. Lasers having a limited range at all is harder to find a logical excuse for.

    What? No, lasers having a limited range makes infinite sense. You're dealing with attenuation, diffusion, the inverse-square law...

    Not at the incredibly short ranges used in BT.

    Just remember that half the people you meet are below average intelligence.
  • OrcaOrca Registered User regular
    Lasers diverge. It's collimated but it still diverges. Take a laser pointer and look at the spot size 5cm from the emitter. Now look at the spot size 1m from the emitter. It's significantly larger. And that's before we get into atmospheric effects attenuating them.

  • SiliconStewSiliconStew Registered User regular
    Orca wrote: »
    Lasers diverge. It's collimated but it still diverges. Take a laser pointer and look at the spot size 5cm from the emitter. Now look at the spot size 1m from the emitter. It's significantly larger. And that's before we get into atmospheric effects attenuating them.

    Yeah, but a laser pointer is also a worst case example with terrible optics, a short focal length, and tiny beam waist. The size of a mech-scale laser alone is going to significantly reduce the divergence angle.

    And atmospheric attenuation/scattering is highly dependant on distance (and wavelength) and isn't going to have enough impact, even through inclement weather, when we're talking laser ranges that are under 450m for BT.

    The high power BT lasers have also helps there, like trying to see a flashlight vs a lighthouse in a fog. Based on damage vs armor, and using iron as an example, even the humble small laser, assuming a 1 second firing time, would need to be putting out something like 200 Megawatts at a minimum in order to have its ability to at least melt nearly 200 kg of armor in one shot. Or even up to a couple Gigawatts if you want to include some inefficiency in there.

    For real world comparisons, US military airborne lasers were 20 to 100 kilowatts with operational ranges from 20 to 600 kilometers.

    Just remember that half the people you meet are below average intelligence.
  • OrcaOrca Registered User regular
    Yeah, true. Engagement ranges in Battletech are ridiculously short. It's basically small-arms range out to extreme sniper range, and beyond that nothing because *reasons*.

    Which is fine, it's a game, it needs to be fun, not realistic.

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  • MorninglordMorninglord Registered User regular
    Real versions of these lasers would be terrifying.

    (PSN: Morninglord) (Steam: Morninglord) (WiiU: Morninglord22) I like to record and toss up a lot of random gaming videos here.
  • OrcaOrca Registered User regular
    Real versions of those lases would be terrifying due to reflections. Anybody in engagement range that can see the battle is probably getting blinded if they don't have eye protection.

  • manwiththemachinegunmanwiththemachinegun METAL GEAR?! Registered User regular
    The war crimes are a feature not a bug.

    Nips
  • InquisitorInquisitor Registered User regular
    The most glaring Battletech combat issue for me has always been "mechs are the kings of the battlefield!!"

    But... what about those aerospace fighters right over there that absolutely dumpster them?

    Shhh, shhh, please ignore them, they have overly fussy rules about drag, please focus on our cool stompy walking tanks please and thank you.

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  • manwiththemachinegunmanwiththemachinegun METAL GEAR?! Registered User regular
    I thought that was the whole point of mechs like the rifleman?

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  • AxenAxen My avatar is Excalibur. Yes, the sword.Registered User regular
    edited January 10
    Inquisitor wrote: »
    The most glaring Battletech combat issue for me has always been "mechs are the kings of the battlefield!!"

    But... what about those aerospace fighters right over there that absolutely dumpster them?

    Shhh, shhh, please ignore them, they have overly fussy rules about drag, please focus on our cool stompy walking tanks please and thank you.

    In universe the Secret Truth is that Mechs aren't the ultimate weapon. Sure a Mech could probably deal with a handful of tanks, but tanks are generally FAR cheaper, easier and faster to build, far easier and cheaper to maintain, requiring significantly less training time and can be transported to and fro in larger numbers. The various factions would, in truth, be far better served spending their resources on armor and aerospace assets instead of Mechs. There have been some in the setting who have struck upon this conclusion.

    However, Mechs are the weapon of choice for the Nobility (or Clanner equivalent) and the Nobility are the ones with the money to buy weapons. It also doesn't help that the companies making all these different weapon systems quite often promote their Mechs over their conventional weapon systems. Their Mechs being the far more expensive weapons system surely doesn't have anything to do with these companies promoting them as the ULTIMATE WEAPON. That'd just be silly!

    Mechs are a good weapons platform, but they are not the end all be all weapons platform.

    The Capellans are accidentally doing it right. They don't have a lot of Mechs and the Mechs they do have tend to be mostly Lights and Mediums with some Heavies and on rare occasion an Assault. So their battle doctrine has their Mechs and tanks working together. A Capellan Lance is actually either four Mechs and two tanks or four tanks and two Mechs. This setup is actually pretty effective. Unfortunately for the Capellans their biggest disadvantage is that they are Capellans.


    As to engagement ranges, well this was largely inspired by WWII tank battles. While the Germans had some tanks that could reach out and touch someone up to 2km (give or take), the vast majority of tank battles however were in the 400m or closer range. There really isn't any sort of in-universe explanation as to why this is for Battletech (AFAIK). It's basically the same category as many, many scfi settings who have their space fighters dogfight each other. That is to say, the "Rule of Cool".

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  • HenroidHenroid Affiliate Streamer Centrism is Racism :3Registered User regular
    I've got my Bushwacker back out to play. I forgot how effective this thing is. 4 MPLs, 2 HMGs, and 2 SRM6s. First match I rolled it out into this morning I landed just shy of 800 damage. Match I played just now, I single handedly kept a lance of enemies trapped on a hill they wanted to 'snipe' my team from, scared that I wasn't the only person hiding in perfect cover to catch them if they stepped down the cliff they were standing on. Let my team fight the others in overwhelming numbers with minimal support from the silly geese I trapped. If they had come down all together to fight me I would've eaten shit.

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    BetsuniNipsH3Knuckles
  • NobodyNobody Registered User regular
    I remember reading somewhere that Mechs have countermeasures that make BVR engagement difficult (if not mostly impossible) as an excuse for the knife fighting range.

  • manwiththemachinegunmanwiththemachinegun METAL GEAR?! Registered User regular
    We call those minovsky particles.

    OrcaSiliconStewNobodyH3KnucklesToxMorninglordHappylilElfSyngyneElvenshaeIceBurner
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