My senior year of high school, my district hired rent-a-cops with trained dogs to go sniff out drugs in people's backpacks. The specific procedure involved was retarded - they'd show up in a classroom, tell everybody to take off their jackets and coats, and leave all their outerwear, backpacks, handbags, purses, etc. in the classroom and then file outside. Even the teacher had to leave. Then the rent-a-cops would take about 10 minutes to circle the desks with the dogs looking for drugs.
I refused to do this. Despite my general sense of outrage at the whole concept, I had a genuine concern about the accuracy of the process. See, if I were a drug user, the first thing I'd do is surreptitiously take my stash out of my backpack and sneak it into somebody else's jacket pocket while they weren't looking. So I refused to let them do that so I left the classroom with my belongings in hand. Their reaction was, "We'll just take you to the principal's office and search you anyway." I said that was fine, at least then I know they won't find anything that's not mine. So they did.
Once I got there, they threatened me with arrest, told me that I'd given them probable cause to call the police, etc. Then the assistant principal said, "And I'm going to recommend you for expulsion." When I asked why, he pulled out of the Code of Conduct and pointed to a rule called "Willful Disruption of School Activities and/or Bomb Threat." This was the rule they used against people who liked to pull the fire alarm. I asked him how I was disrupting school activities, and he said "My time is a school activity. You're disrupting school activities by wasting my time."
I think the real lesson here is fuck Benson. You assholes were way too fucking good at Science Bowl. Additionally, this shit would not have happened at Grant, because it is packed to the brim with litigious, upper-middle-class parents.
Seriously though, while this is bullshit, it sucks, and those kids really need to get some good lawyers to put the smackdown on those admins -- is it surprising? I mean, modern American high school is basically just a big sorting machine. Do you play by the rules? Great! Here's your ticket to a middle class lifestyle. You don't? Oh, sorry -- here's a big burly man that's going to sodomize you with the mop you'll be pushing for the rest of your worthless life, scumbag.
Of course that's an exaggeration, but that is kind of how school administrators try to make it seem, sometimes. Oh, and of course in many parts of the country, school serves as a place to indoctrinate students with nationalism, etc.
Was learning ever a real part of public education? I wonder.
I mean, modern American high school is basically just a big sorting machine. Do you play by the rules? Great! Here's your ticket to a middle class lifestyle.
Yeah, that's kind of how I felt about it at the time, too.
I recognize now that being a high school administrator and dealing with uppity kids is a pain in the ass. They get no respect, from anybody, despite being in a position of authority. So when a kid comes along and flagrantly shits all over the rules, they react by asserting their authority in the most dramatic way possible. It's just that the most dramatic way possible now involves the T-word. They're trying to prove that they deserve respect, but they just come across looking very sad and small.
Feral on
every person who doesn't like an acquired taste always seems to think everyone who likes it is faking it. it should be an official fallacy.
I mean, modern American high school is basically just a big sorting machine. Do you play by the rules? Great! Here's your ticket to a middle class lifestyle.
Yeah, that's kind of how I felt about it at the time, too.
I recognize now that being a high school administrator and dealing with uppity kids is a pain in the ass. They get no respect, from anybody, despite being in a position of authority. So when a kid comes along and flagrantly shits all over the rules, they react by asserting their authority in the most dramatic way possible. It's just that the most dramatic way possible now involves the T-word. They're trying to prove that they deserve respect, but they just come across looking very sad and small.
My mom was a high school teacher, so I got to know a fair bit about the secret, hellish machinations of that Dark Contraption that creaks and churns on the power of innocents' blood. Seriously, administrators really are dicks, almost unfailingly. To teachers, to students, to everyone. Also, they rarely seem to be competant.
I think it's one of those "what kind of person would ever take this job" scenarios. That is to say -- only assholes. It just attracts the wrong kind of person. People actually interested in teaching/getting kids to learn/making a difference/watched Stand and Deliver one too many times/whatever will stay teachers. Only the assholes with no real passion for the job, but who are willing to stay in a place they hate in exchange for more money and authority will become admins.
I think the real lesson here is fuck Benson. You assholes were way too fucking good at Science Bowl. Additionally, this shit would not have happened at Grant, because it is packed to the brim with litigious, upper-middle-class parents.
Seriously though, while this is bullshit, it sucks, and those kids really need to get some good lawyers to put the smackdown on those admins -- is it surprising? I mean, modern American high school is basically just a big sorting machine. Do you play by the rules? Great! Here's your ticket to a middle class lifestyle. You don't? Oh, sorry -- here's a big burly man that's going to sodomize you with the mop you'll be pushing for the rest of your worthless life, scumbag.
Of course that's an exaggeration, but that is kind of how school administrators try to make it seem, sometimes. Oh, and of course in many parts of the country, school serves as a place to indoctrinate students with nationalism, etc.
Was learning ever a real part of public education? I wonder.
That is why no one likes assitant principals. Every school I've been to, the principal is awesome. The assitant principal is a dick.
We had like, six. And they were all dicks. My class got live senior-skits banned forever. They now have to tape them and submit them for approval before they can be shown, on penalty of like, drawing and quartering or whatever they put in there to shut parents the fuck up. It was sweet. The kids who did it made fun of the one assistant principal who had previously worked as an underwear model, and really really ripped on the snotty kids pretty explicitly. That was pretty awesome.
Yeah, we were a pretty half-assed team. Surprising how well we did, considering. Heh. That was such an awesome crew of kids. Also, one year, the B team was 4/5 gay. Surprising, huh? Although, not really, considering it was Grant. Seriously, we (gay/bi) are a fucking infestation over there. Must be the theater program?
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MrMisterJesus dying on the cross in pain? Morally better than us. One has to go "all in".Registered Userregular
edited May 2007
Two primary sentiments:
1) Senior pranks are retarded, and often wind up causing a collossal waste of time and money, if not serious injuries. Seriously, cut it out with the pranks.
My senior year of high school, my district hired rent-a-cops with trained dogs to go sniff out drugs in people's backpacks. The specific procedure involved was retarded - they'd show up in a classroom, tell everybody to take off their jackets and coats, and leave all their outerwear, backpacks, handbags, purses, etc. in the classroom and then file outside. Even the teacher had to leave. Then the rent-a-cops would take about 10 minutes to circle the desks with the dogs looking for drugs.
I refused to do this. Despite my general sense of outrage at the whole concept, I had a genuine concern about the accuracy of the process. See, if I were a drug user, the first thing I'd do is surreptitiously take my stash out of my backpack and sneak it into somebody else's jacket pocket while they weren't looking. So I refused to let them do that so I left the classroom with my belongings in hand. Their reaction was, "We'll just take you to the principal's office and search you anyway." I said that was fine, at least then I know they won't find anything that's not mine. So they did.
Once I got there, they threatened me with arrest, told me that I'd given them probable cause to call the police, etc. Then the assistant principal said, "And I'm going to recommend you for expulsion." When I asked why, he pulled out of the Code of Conduct and pointed to a rule called "Willful Disruption of School Activities and/or Bomb Threat." This was the rule they used against people who liked to pull the fire alarm. I asked him how I was disrupting school activities, and he said "My time is a school activity. You're disrupting school activities by wasting my time."
They never did actually search my bag.
That is because legally they couldn't without your permission. They can search the lockers because those are school property. If a dog reacts to your bag or jacket, that might give probable cause for a police search (not sure about school officials or private security), but they are not allowed to search your person or your property. Even if you give your permission, they are in a position of authority over you, and, especially in a situation like yours, a case could be made that permission was only granted under duress.
Knuckle Dragger on
Let not any one pacify his conscience by the delusion that he can do no harm if he takes no part, and forms no opinion.
That is because legally they couldn't without your permission. They can search the lockers because those are school property. If a dog reacts to your bag or jacket, that might give probable cause for a police search (not sure about school officials or private security), but they are not allowed to search your person or your property. Even if you give your permission, they are in a position of authority over you, and, especially in a situation like yours, a case could be made that permission was only granted under duress.
We spoke to an ACLU lawyer about the whole thing. The two salient points that came out of it were:
1) They did have the right to conduct a search of my backpack at any time they wanted, because for all intents and purposes the fourth amendment does not apply on school grounds.
2) It wouldn't matter, because a drug dog doesn't constitute a search.
They did say that they would be willing to lend legal assistance with the issue of expulsion, though. I ended up not getting expelled, either, but not because we lawyered up, mostly because we found a friend in the district supervisor's office who was as pissed about the drug dogs as we were and managed to get me off the hook.
Edit: what the ACLU lawyer said was that they have the right to demand a search, but they do not have the right to use physical force if I refuse. If I refuse a search, they should then call the local police department who have probable cause now to search me and use physical force if necessary. They said that the whole drug dog issue was separate, as it didn't constitute a search. They also said that recommending me for expulsion was probably a misapplication of the rule in question and they'd be willing to assist me in challenging that if necessary. This was all in 1994-95, so the case law may have changed since then.
Feral on
every person who doesn't like an acquired taste always seems to think everyone who likes it is faking it. it should be an official fallacy.
Yeah, we were a pretty half-assed team. Surprising how well we did, considering. Heh. That was such an awesome crew of kids. Also, one year, the B team was 4/5 gay. Surprising, huh? Although, not really, considering it was Grant. Seriously, we (gay/bi) are a fucking infestation over there. Must be the theater program?
Man, almost makes me wanna rewind time. There was all of one out-and-out queer in my senior class besides me at Benson, and he had an annoying lisp and bothered me slightly.
Screw you, Grant.
On a side note: We had all of about one or two stabbings this year, and they all occurred outside of Benson to some poor black kid messing with the wrong crowd. Oh well, Holladay Park is right there and if you're messing with the gangs in the area you are bound to be killed.
That is because legally they couldn't without your permission. They can search the lockers because those are school property. If a dog reacts to your bag or jacket, that might give probable cause for a police search (not sure about school officials or private security), but they are not allowed to search your person or your property. Even if you give your permission, they are in a position of authority over you, and, especially in a situation like yours, a case could be made that permission was only granted under duress.
We spoke to an ACLU lawyer about the whole thing. The two salient points that came out of it were:
1) They did have the right to conduct a search of my backpack at any time they wanted, because for all intents and purposes the fourth amendment does not apply on school grounds.
2) It wouldn't matter, because a drug dog doesn't constitute a search.
They did say that they would be willing to lend legal assistance with the issue of expulsion, though. I ended up not getting expelled, either, but not because we lawyered up, mostly because we found a friend in the district supervisor's office who was as pissed about the drug dogs as we were and managed to get me off the hook.
Edit: what the ACLU lawyer said was that they have the right to demand a search, but they do not have the right to use physical force if I refuse. If I refuse a search, they should then call the local police department who have probable cause now to search me and use physical force if necessary. They said that the whole drug dog issue was separate, as it didn't constitute a search. They also said that recommending me for expulsion was probably a misapplication of the rule in question and they'd be willing to assist me in challenging that if necessary. This was all in 1994-95, so the case law may have changed since then.
Nope, that's pretty much still it.
I think it's hilarious that we try to teach kids civics in this country by taking away all of their rights. Is it any wonder that something like 50% of high school students think the government should get to review and censor all news reporting?
"Civics" (aka "Government") at my school was one semester and was taught by one of the worst teachers I've ever had. It seems like something a good teacher could get students fired up about but it seems like it ends up shit detail for the incompetents they can't fire due to tenure.
Feral on
every person who doesn't like an acquired taste always seems to think everyone who likes it is faking it. it should be an official fallacy.
The teacher who responded, like I said in the OP, Mike Ryan, was one of the best teachers I've ever had. Our Civics/Economics class made for a really great year.
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HakkekageSpace Whore Academysumma cum laudeRegistered Userregular
edited May 2007
School administrations really are self-fellating machines. I go to a high school in Jersey with some of the worst offenders and the most bullshit rules.
We're a pretty diverse lot, at my school; mostly Indians and Asians run the elite crowd (that is, the quiet, 4.0 GPA, student council, diligent MUN enthusiast, tennis/track athlete group) while the rest muck around in the middle-to-pothead arena. This tends to generate more then a little resentment from quite a lot of people, especially the administration. They talk to the more ingrained, 'Americanized' kids with hells of more respect than they do with the Asians/Indians if any of them break a rule, or even come down to the nurse.
Also, if one of those smart kids breaks an arbitrary rule (such as missing gym for more than 3 days in a marking period, woop-dee-doo), he gets the same punishment as a repeat offender who skips almost 20 days to smoke pot on school property during school (you stupid fuck, I mean really, at what point did you ever think that was a good idea). For missing one day, they have to spend 60-120 hours of their summer sitting in the hot cafeteria doing paperwork. Ok: what? If you miss gym, shouldn't you be doing gym activities? And why should the person who actually doesn't fall behind in all the work required from school have to do the same amount of make up work as McSnorty Hightard over there?
Also: If you get sent home from school, it's counted as an unexcused absence. It's like landing an administrative job causes important brain functions--like logic and basic human social skills--to drip out the ass.
I am currently locking antlers with the administration over this bullshit absentee rule. I am not wasting my summer doing that mindless stuff. I'm Iranian, not Indian, but I still get loads of shit.
Also, one of our Assistant Principals has taken to coming on the intercom after the 2-minute-to-homeroom bell rings and reciting his motivational speech to get people to homeroom faster. Sometimes he sings. It's terrible. Case in point:
A.P: "It's that time again! Imagine a world with no iPods, no cell phones, no talking and no complaining...a magical world sitting quietly in your classroom and listening to announcements....go to homeroom...go to that magical place..."
Homeroom teacher: "I know that place, I think it's called 1984."
Man, I'm so glad I'm out of high school. We had lots of retarded crap like that back then too. One thing's for sure: I need to work my ass off so I can home school my kids and help them avoid this bullshit.
Every year, the guy who teaches junior English at my Catholic high school has a Mauritius Day party, celebrating the small island of Mauritius. People bring coconuts, and he brings a machete, and makes with the "KI-AI!" while chopping them on a table (usually damaging the table as much as the coconuts). In the same class, birthday candles have been lit with a blowtorch (by a student who just happened to have one handy for the occasion).
You can't do this shit in a public school!
Oh, and people are allowed to bring in gun and knife catalogs if they feel like it. There isn't a lot of bullshit about joking about violence, etc. etc.
Walri on
Truly Grim and Frost-Bitten Cooking Thread
Walri: I made a sandwich and lemonade today, they were both disgusting. I don't know how I do it, I need my mom to get back from vacation so I can make her prepare my food.
Iconslaughter: That was probably the most metal thing you've ever said.
My entire four years of high school had the same sr. prank. Streaking down the third floor hallway to the back bathroom, where you can quickly get your clothes and out the gymnasium door without getting "caught".
It was pretty much lame, after the first time I heard about it.
EWom on
Whether they find a life there or not, I think Jupiter should be called an enemy planet.
In my final year we just snuck around at 3am putting Vaseline on all the door knobs, egging everything, erecting a mock student on the big crucifix in the courtyard with a condom for a head, putting flour on top of all the ceiling fans and putting a huge fuck-off fish in a wired-up locker that didnt get found until 3 weeks later when it stunk out the entire building.
I guess the flour could have been anthrax or something, but seriously, i know their reaction is totally uncalled for but when you do shit like that, you HAVE to consider your actions and be prepared for consequences. in the twitchy world that we live in, is it unreasonable for someone to consider it could be a bomb? admitedly, a stupid fucking person, but come on. what was the reason you put a buzzer in a locker for?
If I refuse a search, they should then call the local police department who have probable cause now to search me and use physical force if necessary.
I'm pretty sure that's bullshit. I don't know about your physical person, but I know for a fact refusing a search of your car is not, in and of itself, grounds for probable cause. I'd assume the same applies in this case.
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MrMisterJesus dying on the cross in pain? Morally better than us. One has to go "all in".Registered Userregular
In my final year we just snuck around at 3am putting Vaseline on all the door knobs, egging everything, erecting a mock student on the big crucifix in the courtyard with a condom for a head, putting flour on top of all the ceiling fans and putting a huge fuck-off fish in a wired-up locker that didnt get found until 3 weeks later when it stunk out the entire building.
Wow, you created a bunch of problems for the janitorial staff. That's cool.
Senior pranks vary from obnoxious to dangerous: for a particularly poor example, a couple kids at my friend's school thought it would be hilarious to spread oil all over the auditorium floor. End result? Security guard falls and breaks his hip, and the oil eats through the varnish and the entire floor needs to be refinished.
Why is this part of our culture again?
MrMister on
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MrMisterJesus dying on the cross in pain? Morally better than us. One has to go "all in".Registered Userregular
If I refuse a search, they should then call the local police department who have probable cause now to search me and use physical force if necessary.
I'm pretty sure that's bullshit. I don't know about your physical person, but I know for a fact refusing a search of your car is not, in and of itself, grounds for probable cause. I'd assume the same applies in this case.
I'd also be interested in reading the relevant decisions.
In my final year we just snuck around at 3am putting Vaseline on all the door knobs, egging everything, erecting a mock student on the big crucifix in the courtyard with a condom for a head, putting flour on top of all the ceiling fans and putting a huge fuck-off fish in a wired-up locker that didnt get found until 3 weeks later when it stunk out the entire building.
Wow, you created a bunch of problems for the janitorial staff. That's cool.
Senior pranks vary from obnoxious to dangerous: for a particularly poor example, a couple kids at my friend's school thought it would be hilarious to spread oil all over the auditorium floor. End result? Security guard falls and breaks his hip, and the oil eats through the varnish and the entire floor needs to be refinished.
Why is this part of our culture again?
Because most people don't have any respect for shit that isn't theirs? I've never been one for vandalism, anyway. Violence, yes; not vandalism.
Someone once set off a pepperspray bomb in a locker in my high school. They were caught. They were not punished as harshly as the people in the OP. And what they did was much closer to actual terrorism than putting a buzzer in a locker.
If I refuse a search, they should then call the local police department who have probable cause now to search me and use physical force if necessary.
I'm pretty sure that's bullshit. I don't know about your physical person, but I know for a fact refusing a search of your car is not, in and of itself, grounds for probable cause. I'd assume the same applies in this case.
Well, apparently the situation is a little different for minors on school grounds.
Not that I know the case law, it was over 10 years ago. I was 16, I wasn't asking the lawyer for his sources.
Feral on
every person who doesn't like an acquired taste always seems to think everyone who likes it is faking it. it should be an official fallacy.
I graduated last year and as a senior prank one of my friends went to school at like four in the morning the morning of the last day for seniors, took down the American flag, and replaced it with a pirate flag that said "Surrender the Booty!" on it.
It was funny, everyone got a kick out of it. That is until, because a lapse of judgement I suppose, my friend returned the American flag a few days later by freezing it in a block of ice in a cardboard box, writing "A gift from me to you" on the box, and leaving it in the school parking lot. First police came, then choppers, a bomb squad, and eventually the FBI. My friend went right away to turn himself in, got cuffed and was in jail for a few hours before his parents bailed him out.
He was in and out of court for months, and eventually all charges were dropped. It's a pretty ridiculous story though.
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FalloutGIRL'S DAYWAS PRETTY GOOD WHILE THEY LASTEDRegistered Userregular
The reason it's being treated so harshly, I guess, is because the administration believes it's some sort of underground high school senior terrorist cell
Ahahahahaha.
Ahahaha.
Haha.
Has anyone let the administration know that they're ridiculous jackasses?
My school has a zero-tolerance policy on fighting. There's a fight, it doesn't matter if you only swung back to save yourself, you're getting suspended along with the kid who made you bleed internally. I got suspended a few weeks ago for fighting. Fine, I was in the wrong, I hit back. Fine.
Get back to school three days later. "Wiggin, did you hear? Dave just got a warning!"
What. The kid admitted to hitting first, another student said he hit first, even the teacher saw him get the last hit in (Only three hits in this fight, I got the middle one), and yet, only I got suspended. If it wasn't so late in the year, I'd be raising a stink, but with 10 days left, it's just not worth it.
Re: Senior pranks:
The trick is to find something not particularly harmful, yet still funny. My current plan is to buy a shit-ton of fake flowers, and stick them all over the baseball field.
My school has a zero-tolerance policy on fighting. There's a fight, it doesn't matter if you only swung back to save yourself, you're getting suspended along with the kid who made you bleed internally. I got suspended a few weeks ago for fighting. Fine, I was in the wrong, I hit back. Fine.
Get back to school three days later. "Wiggin, did you hear? Dave just got a warning!"
What. The kid admitted to hitting first, another student said he hit first, even the teacher saw him get the last hit in (Only three hits in this fight, I got the middle one), and yet, only I got suspended. If it wasn't so late in the year, I'd be raising a stink, but with 10 days left, it's just not worth it.
His parents probably called the school and talked about lawyers. The kids whose parents could afford to do that at my high school never got in real trouble for anything (even when the kid himself was willing to take the heat).
My school has a zero-tolerance policy on fighting. There's a fight, it doesn't matter if you only swung back to save yourself, you're getting suspended along with the kid who made you bleed internally. I got suspended a few weeks ago for fighting. Fine, I was in the wrong, I hit back. Fine.
Get back to school three days later. "Wiggin, did you hear? Dave just got a warning!"
What. The kid admitted to hitting first, another student said he hit first, even the teacher saw him get the last hit in (Only three hits in this fight, I got the middle one), and yet, only I got suspended. If it wasn't so late in the year, I'd be raising a stink, but with 10 days left, it's just not worth it.
His parents probably called the school and talked about lawyers. The kids whose parents could afford to do that at my high school never got in real trouble for anything (even when the kid himself was willing to take the heat).
Let me rephrase: He did get in trouble. That trouble was, he missed science, because he was sitting in In School Planning. That means, you sit there, write down what you did wrong, why you did it, and how you'll change that behavior in the future. For me, it's at the point where I detest it not as punishment, but because you can be sent there for the most arbitrary shit. I've been sent, this year, for loudly telling someone to leave me alone, and then "talking back to the teacher" when he yelled at me for being loud (This really consisted of me trying to tell him what had happened, so he would have a little context, and then he accused me of riling up the class. Yeah, asshole. I have nothing better to do than get made fun because of shit that happened 4 years ago.), and I've been written up before for not shaking a kids hand. Not making that one up.
So, yeah. The kid who started the fight got a slap on the wrist. His parents weren't even notified right away, as the school doesn't have to unless you're suspended. He was back in class half an hour later, and I got a three day vacation.
Seriously, my rant about the bullshit that is ISP could be it's own fucking topic, and the handshake story could be its own post. That plan is still in my folder, with no signature on it.
My school has a zero-tolerance policy on fighting. There's a fight, it doesn't matter if you only swung back to save yourself, you're getting suspended along with the kid who made you bleed internally. I got suspended a few weeks ago for fighting. Fine, I was in the wrong, I hit back. Fine.
Get back to school three days later. "Wiggin, did you hear? Dave just got a warning!"
What. The kid admitted to hitting first, another student said he hit first, even the teacher saw him get the last hit in (Only three hits in this fight, I got the middle one), and yet, only I got suspended. If it wasn't so late in the year, I'd be raising a stink, but with 10 days left, it's just not worth it.
His parents probably called the school and talked about lawyers. The kids whose parents could afford to do that at my high school never got in real trouble for anything (even when the kid himself was willing to take the heat).
Whenever one of my boss' sons gets less than a B in anything, he calls the school and just yells at people -- the secretary, the teacher, the principal, anyone who'll listen -- until he gets that C or whatever turned into a B.
His words, literally: "My son is a good student. If he's getting a C then clearly the teacher is the problem."
It is truly amazing to watch this man literally get whatever he wants by yelling. If I'd known about that trick I would be halfway through university already, instead of working for that douchebag for two years on account of my 74 grade average.
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What a dick.
Seriously though, while this is bullshit, it sucks, and those kids really need to get some good lawyers to put the smackdown on those admins -- is it surprising? I mean, modern American high school is basically just a big sorting machine. Do you play by the rules? Great! Here's your ticket to a middle class lifestyle. You don't? Oh, sorry -- here's a big burly man that's going to sodomize you with the mop you'll be pushing for the rest of your worthless life, scumbag.
Of course that's an exaggeration, but that is kind of how school administrators try to make it seem, sometimes. Oh, and of course in many parts of the country, school serves as a place to indoctrinate students with nationalism, etc.
Was learning ever a real part of public education? I wonder.
Yeah, that's kind of how I felt about it at the time, too.
I recognize now that being a high school administrator and dealing with uppity kids is a pain in the ass. They get no respect, from anybody, despite being in a position of authority. So when a kid comes along and flagrantly shits all over the rules, they react by asserting their authority in the most dramatic way possible. It's just that the most dramatic way possible now involves the T-word. They're trying to prove that they deserve respect, but they just come across looking very sad and small.
the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
My mom was a high school teacher, so I got to know a fair bit about the secret, hellish machinations of that Dark Contraption that creaks and churns on the power of innocents' blood. Seriously, administrators really are dicks, almost unfailingly. To teachers, to students, to everyone. Also, they rarely seem to be competant.
I think it's one of those "what kind of person would ever take this job" scenarios. That is to say -- only assholes. It just attracts the wrong kind of person. People actually interested in teaching/getting kids to learn/making a difference/watched Stand and Deliver one too many times/whatever will stay teachers. Only the assholes with no real passion for the job, but who are willing to stay in a place they hate in exchange for more money and authority will become admins.
We're sorry.
Not really.
We had like, six. And they were all dicks. My class got live senior-skits banned forever. They now have to tape them and submit them for approval before they can be shown, on penalty of like, drawing and quartering or whatever they put in there to shut parents the fuck up. It was sweet. The kids who did it made fun of the one assistant principal who had previously worked as an underwear model, and really really ripped on the snotty kids pretty explicitly. That was pretty awesome.
Yeah, we were a pretty half-assed team. Surprising how well we did, considering. Heh. That was such an awesome crew of kids. Also, one year, the B team was 4/5 gay. Surprising, huh? Although, not really, considering it was Grant. Seriously, we (gay/bi) are a fucking infestation over there. Must be the theater program?
1) Senior pranks are retarded, and often wind up causing a collossal waste of time and money, if not serious injuries. Seriously, cut it out with the pranks.
2) Terrorism? What? No.
That is because legally they couldn't without your permission. They can search the lockers because those are school property. If a dog reacts to your bag or jacket, that might give probable cause for a police search (not sure about school officials or private security), but they are not allowed to search your person or your property. Even if you give your permission, they are in a position of authority over you, and, especially in a situation like yours, a case could be made that permission was only granted under duress.
- John Stuart Mill
Seriously, how many stabbings are there a year at that school?
We spoke to an ACLU lawyer about the whole thing. The two salient points that came out of it were:
1) They did have the right to conduct a search of my backpack at any time they wanted, because for all intents and purposes the fourth amendment does not apply on school grounds.
2) It wouldn't matter, because a drug dog doesn't constitute a search.
They did say that they would be willing to lend legal assistance with the issue of expulsion, though. I ended up not getting expelled, either, but not because we lawyered up, mostly because we found a friend in the district supervisor's office who was as pissed about the drug dogs as we were and managed to get me off the hook.
Edit: what the ACLU lawyer said was that they have the right to demand a search, but they do not have the right to use physical force if I refuse. If I refuse a search, they should then call the local police department who have probable cause now to search me and use physical force if necessary. They said that the whole drug dog issue was separate, as it didn't constitute a search. They also said that recommending me for expulsion was probably a misapplication of the rule in question and they'd be willing to assist me in challenging that if necessary. This was all in 1994-95, so the case law may have changed since then.
the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
Man, almost makes me wanna rewind time. There was all of one out-and-out queer in my senior class besides me at Benson, and he had an annoying lisp and bothered me slightly.
Screw you, Grant.
On a side note: We had all of about one or two stabbings this year, and they all occurred outside of Benson to some poor black kid messing with the wrong crowd. Oh well, Holladay Park is right there and if you're messing with the gangs in the area you are bound to be killed.
I think it's hilarious that we try to teach kids civics in this country by taking away all of their rights. Is it any wonder that something like 50% of high school students think the government should get to review and censor all news reporting?
:!:
Link?
the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
We're a pretty diverse lot, at my school; mostly Indians and Asians run the elite crowd (that is, the quiet, 4.0 GPA, student council, diligent MUN enthusiast, tennis/track athlete group) while the rest muck around in the middle-to-pothead arena. This tends to generate more then a little resentment from quite a lot of people, especially the administration. They talk to the more ingrained, 'Americanized' kids with hells of more respect than they do with the Asians/Indians if any of them break a rule, or even come down to the nurse.
Also, if one of those smart kids breaks an arbitrary rule (such as missing gym for more than 3 days in a marking period, woop-dee-doo), he gets the same punishment as a repeat offender who skips almost 20 days to smoke pot on school property during school (you stupid fuck, I mean really, at what point did you ever think that was a good idea). For missing one day, they have to spend 60-120 hours of their summer sitting in the hot cafeteria doing paperwork. Ok: what? If you miss gym, shouldn't you be doing gym activities? And why should the person who actually doesn't fall behind in all the work required from school have to do the same amount of make up work as McSnorty Hightard over there?
Also: If you get sent home from school, it's counted as an unexcused absence. It's like landing an administrative job causes important brain functions--like logic and basic human social skills--to drip out the ass.
Also, one of our Assistant Principals has taken to coming on the intercom after the 2-minute-to-homeroom bell rings and reciting his motivational speech to get people to homeroom faster. Sometimes he sings. It's terrible. Case in point:
A.P: "It's that time again! Imagine a world with no iPods, no cell phones, no talking and no complaining...a magical world sitting quietly in your classroom and listening to announcements....go to homeroom...go to that magical place..."
Homeroom teacher: "I know that place, I think it's called 1984."
Fuck this school.
NNID: Hakkekage
You can't do this shit in a public school!
Oh, and people are allowed to bring in gun and knife catalogs if they feel like it. There isn't a lot of bullshit about joking about violence, etc. etc.
Walri: I made a sandwich and lemonade today, they were both disgusting. I don't know how I do it, I need my mom to get back from vacation so I can make her prepare my food.
Iconslaughter: That was probably the most metal thing you've ever said.
It was pretty much lame, after the first time I heard about it.
I guess the flour could have been anthrax or something, but seriously, i know their reaction is totally uncalled for but when you do shit like that, you HAVE to consider your actions and be prepared for consequences. in the twitchy world that we live in, is it unreasonable for someone to consider it could be a bomb? admitedly, a stupid fucking person, but come on. what was the reason you put a buzzer in a locker for?
I'm pretty sure that's bullshit. I don't know about your physical person, but I know for a fact refusing a search of your car is not, in and of itself, grounds for probable cause. I'd assume the same applies in this case.
Wow, you created a bunch of problems for the janitorial staff. That's cool.
Senior pranks vary from obnoxious to dangerous: for a particularly poor example, a couple kids at my friend's school thought it would be hilarious to spread oil all over the auditorium floor. End result? Security guard falls and breaks his hip, and the oil eats through the varnish and the entire floor needs to be refinished.
Why is this part of our culture again?
I'd also be interested in reading the relevant decisions.
Because most people don't have any respect for shit that isn't theirs? I've never been one for vandalism, anyway. Violence, yes; not vandalism.
XBL : lJesse Custerl | MWO: Jesse Custer | Best vid ever. | 2nd best vid ever.
I'll be damned. The Timecube guy was right.
We ARE educating our children retarded.
Well, apparently the situation is a little different for minors on school grounds.
Not that I know the case law, it was over 10 years ago. I was 16, I wasn't asking the lawyer for his sources.
the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
It was funny, everyone got a kick out of it. That is until, because a lapse of judgement I suppose, my friend returned the American flag a few days later by freezing it in a block of ice in a cardboard box, writing "A gift from me to you" on the box, and leaving it in the school parking lot. First police came, then choppers, a bomb squad, and eventually the FBI. My friend went right away to turn himself in, got cuffed and was in jail for a few hours before his parents bailed him out.
He was in and out of court for months, and eventually all charges were dropped. It's a pretty ridiculous story though.
Ahahahahaha.
Ahahaha.
Haha.
Has anyone let the administration know that they're ridiculous jackasses?
My school has a zero-tolerance policy on fighting. There's a fight, it doesn't matter if you only swung back to save yourself, you're getting suspended along with the kid who made you bleed internally. I got suspended a few weeks ago for fighting. Fine, I was in the wrong, I hit back. Fine.
Get back to school three days later. "Wiggin, did you hear? Dave just got a warning!"
What. The kid admitted to hitting first, another student said he hit first, even the teacher saw him get the last hit in (Only three hits in this fight, I got the middle one), and yet, only I got suspended. If it wasn't so late in the year, I'd be raising a stink, but with 10 days left, it's just not worth it.
Re: Senior pranks:
The trick is to find something not particularly harmful, yet still funny. My current plan is to buy a shit-ton of fake flowers, and stick them all over the baseball field.
His parents probably called the school and talked about lawyers. The kids whose parents could afford to do that at my high school never got in real trouble for anything (even when the kid himself was willing to take the heat).
Let me rephrase: He did get in trouble. That trouble was, he missed science, because he was sitting in In School Planning. That means, you sit there, write down what you did wrong, why you did it, and how you'll change that behavior in the future. For me, it's at the point where I detest it not as punishment, but because you can be sent there for the most arbitrary shit. I've been sent, this year, for loudly telling someone to leave me alone, and then "talking back to the teacher" when he yelled at me for being loud (This really consisted of me trying to tell him what had happened, so he would have a little context, and then he accused me of riling up the class. Yeah, asshole. I have nothing better to do than get made fun because of shit that happened 4 years ago.), and I've been written up before for not shaking a kids hand. Not making that one up.
So, yeah. The kid who started the fight got a slap on the wrist. His parents weren't even notified right away, as the school doesn't have to unless you're suspended. He was back in class half an hour later, and I got a three day vacation.
Seriously, my rant about the bullshit that is ISP could be it's own fucking topic, and the handshake story could be its own post. That plan is still in my folder, with no signature on it.
His words, literally: "My son is a good student. If he's getting a C then clearly the teacher is the problem."
It is truly amazing to watch this man literally get whatever he wants by yelling. If I'd known about that trick I would be halfway through university already, instead of working for that douchebag for two years on account of my 74 grade average.