Computer Audio / USB Mic / Echo question

Basar

Hi,

I have been working from home since the start of the pandemic and been using Apple Airpods Pro the whole time. My employer has no return to office guidance (I am not in the US) at least until next year and I figured I would invest in a USB mic as my ears/head was hurting after several hours on video calls every day. So I went ahead and bought he Rode NT-USB Mini due to positive reviews but I am having lots of echo complaints from coworkers. I know these mics are ideally used with headphones but that kind of beats my purpose. I am using them with my bookshelf speakers (Audionengine HD6) and the speakers are connected to the aux slot at the back of the mic.

Is this a hopeless pursuit? If so, I'll most likely return the mic as I can get a regular over the ears headset from my employer.

Thanks.

Naphtali

When you say there's echo what do you mean? Are the coworkers hearing themselves through your mic (because of the speakers), and/or is it your voice echoing through your setup? Have you tried adjusting the noise gate on the mic (a quick glance at its product page says it has one) to see if that helps?

There's an audiophile thread over in the Moe's Tech Tavern subforum that might have some solutions for you.

Hahnsoo1

Basar wrote: »

Hi,

I have been working from home since the start of the pandemic and been using Apple Airpods Pro the whole time. My employer has no return to office guidance (I am not in the US) at least until next year and I figured I would invest in a USB mic as my ears/head was hurting after several hours on video calls every day. So I went ahead and bought he Rode NT-USB Mini due to positive reviews but I am having lots of echo complaints from coworkers. I know these mics are ideally used with headphones but that kind of beats my purpose. I am using them with my bookshelf speakers (Audionengine HD6) and the speakers are connected to the aux slot at the back of the mic.

Is this a hopeless pursuit? If so, I'll most likely return the mic as I can get a regular over the ears headset from my employer.

Thanks.

Most USB condensers are stupidly sensitive, and they don't work well when tracking audio with speakers, especially consumer speakers (which aren't concerned with directionally outputting audio like monitors and just blast sound everywhere). The Rode NT USB should probably be used with headphones. Barring that, you need to tamp down the gain and have it close miked (no more than 3 fingers away from your lips). Microphone technique is important, and most people who use any sort of prosumer or professional mic have it close miked on a boom arm.

In theory, if you have proper positioning of the speakers and the microphone you are using, you can avoid off-axis sound coming into the capsule. You can also adjust the sensitivity threshold of your microphone in software, so that it only responds to closer, louder sources, although this takes a lot of fiddling and may result in having speakers that sound quiet during meetings. Finally, the pickup pattern of the microphone matters... I believe the Rode NT USB is cardioid, which has some off-axis rejection, but you'd get better off-axis rejection from a supercardioid or hypercardioid pickup pattern (I believe the cheapest supercardioid desk USB microphone is the Razer Seiren Mini, and that comes with threads to screw into a standard boom arm for close-miking).

For Zoom meetings and teleconferencing, I think a headset microphone is probably the way to go, although depending on what kind of speakers you have and how loud they are, you may still run into the same echo problems. You will want a headset that has a unidirectional pickup pattern (which means cardioid or super/hypercardioid instead of omnidirectional... read the description of the product carefully and don't get omnidirectional capsules).

I want to emphasize that because of physics, there isn't a one-size-fits-all solution to sound problems. Every room has different acoustics, and what works well in one home office may be horrible in another. You won't be able to buy gear that "just works" because sound is inherently tied to the room that it's in and how you have your output/input sources positioned.

SanderJK

As someone with ear troubles (adviced to not wear headphones for too long, and never earbuds) I ended up with a dynamic microphone for this reason. Those are weaker and more directional.
The price you pay is two-fold: First is that you need to be way closer to the mic for people to pick you up. This means you need a setup where the mic is preferably hovering near your head, without obstructing your work. This is where the booms come in)
The second is that many dynamic microphones need outside amplification. So now you're on the hook for a mic+arm+amp.
It does work though, and it's been great between online gaming, online d&d and work calls.

There may still be a way to rescue your setup, which is by setting up a virtual microphone through something like VoiceMeeter, and spending time tuning the gate, and how much volume your speakers can put out. Just keep testing by recording 10 seconds clips of talking into the windows voice recorder.
The reason to use the virtual mic is because otherwise you are at the mercy of whatever program is used to communicate. You don't want to be setting gates in Teams, Zoom, Discord, Google Talk etcet if you can help it, because all of those will work differently, update randomly etcet. By placing a virtual mic the work gets done before windows sends the signal to other programs.
I've only done a tiny bit of this, no idea if you are able to find the balance where your incoming mic is sufficiently louder than the background. A small tuning could be making sure none of the speakers point directly towards the mic.

Basar

Naphtali wrote: »

When you say there's echo what do you mean? Are the coworkers hearing themselves through your mic (because of the speakers), and/or is it your voice echoing through your setup? Have you tried adjusting the noise gate on the mic (a quick glance at its product page says it has one) to see if that helps?

There's an audiophile thread over in the Moe's Tech Tavern subforum that might have some solutions for you.

Yes, coworkers are hearing themselves. Strangely enough, some complain about it, some don't. I have tested it on multiple occasions and it's always split. Yes, the noise gate (on Rode Connect app) is turned on but I think that mostly blocks taps on the desk or keyboard sounds, etc. Thanks for the tip on audiophile thread.

Hahnsoo1 wrote: »

Basar wrote: »

Hi,

I have been working from home since the start of the pandemic and been using Apple Airpods Pro the whole time. My employer has no return to office guidance (I am not in the US) at least until next year and I figured I would invest in a USB mic as my ears/head was hurting after several hours on video calls every day. So I went ahead and bought he Rode NT-USB Mini due to positive reviews but I am having lots of echo complaints from coworkers. I know these mics are ideally used with headphones but that kind of beats my purpose. I am using them with my bookshelf speakers (Audionengine HD6) and the speakers are connected to the aux slot at the back of the mic.

Is this a hopeless pursuit? If so, I'll most likely return the mic as I can get a regular over the ears headset from my employer.

Thanks.

Most USB condensers are stupidly sensitive, and they don't work well when tracking audio with speakers, especially consumer speakers (which aren't concerned with directionally outputting audio like monitors and just blast sound everywhere). The Rode NT USB should probably be used with headphones. Barring that, you need to tamp down the gain and have it close miked (no more than 3 fingers away from your lips). Microphone technique is important, and most people who use any sort of prosumer or professional mic have it close miked on a boom arm.

In theory, if you have proper positioning of the speakers and the microphone you are using, you can avoid off-axis sound coming into the capsule. You can also adjust the sensitivity threshold of your microphone in software, so that it only responds to closer, louder sources, although this takes a lot of fiddling and may result in having speakers that sound quiet during meetings. Finally, the pickup pattern of the microphone matters... I believe the Rode NT USB is cardioid, which has some off-axis rejection, but you'd get better off-axis rejection from a supercardioid or hypercardioid pickup pattern (I believe the cheapest supercardioid desk USB microphone is the Razer Seiren Mini, and that comes with threads to screw into a standard boom arm for close-miking).

For Zoom meetings and teleconferencing, I think a headset microphone is probably the way to go, although depending on what kind of speakers you have and how loud they are, you may still run into the same echo problems. You will want a headset that has a unidirectional pickup pattern (which means cardioid or super/hypercardioid instead of omnidirectional... read the description of the product carefully and don't get omnidirectional capsules).

I want to emphasize that because of physics, there isn't a one-size-fits-all solution to sound problems. Every room has different acoustics, and what works well in one home office may be horrible in another. You won't be able to buy gear that "just works" because sound is inherently tied to the room that it's in and how you have your output/input sources positioned.

Thanks Hahnsoo1, lots of great info. I am an audio noob, so all useful to me even if I can't get this to work!

I am not using it on a boom arm as I didn't want to look like Joe Rogan or using the mic with headphones as I would look like a DJ. I'll try to find a way to get the mic as close as to me and out of the camera view, I guess people will have to get used to my head taking over the entire camera view

SanderJK wrote: »

As someone with ear troubles (adviced to not wear headphones for too long, and never earbuds) I ended up with a dynamic microphone for this reason. Those are weaker and more directional.
The price you pay is two-fold: First is that you need to be way closer to the mic for people to pick you up. This means you need a setup where the mic is preferably hovering near your head, without obstructing your work. This is where the booms come in)
The second is that many dynamic microphones need outside amplification. So now you're on the hook for a mic+arm+amp.
It does work though, and it's been great between online gaming, online d&d and work calls.

There may still be a way to rescue your setup, which is by setting up a virtual microphone through something like VoiceMeeter, and spending time tuning the gate, and how much volume your speakers can put out. Just keep testing by recording 10 seconds clips of talking into the windows voice recorder.
The reason to use the virtual mic is because otherwise you are at the mercy of whatever program is used to communicate. You don't want to be setting gates in Teams, Zoom, Discord, Google Talk etcet if you can help it, because all of those will work differently, update randomly etcet. By placing a virtual mic the work gets done before windows sends the signal to other programs.
I've only done a tiny bit of this, no idea if you are able to find the balance where your incoming mic is sufficiently louder than the background. A small tuning could be making sure none of the speakers point directly towards the mic.

Thanks SanderJK, good stuff. I am playing with the Rode Connect app, I think it is exactly what you have described. I am trying to find the perfect balance on the app, and then choose Rode Connect Virtual as my input/output on all communication apps.

I'll keep on playing with this for the next couple of weeks and see if I can figure out a way to get it to work. If not, I'll return it before the return period ends and try a dynamic and directional one like you have. Do you have any recommendations?